# Bryan iguchi Pro Camber or Ultra Jones Twin?



## Hg8783 (May 4, 2017)

What's up, new here been boarding for one season and I'm addicted now...

So I'm agonizing over buying a new board. Im currently riding an Arbor Foundation 161 and I'm sure I'm mostly responsible but it just doesn't seem stable at all...I just hopped on it and I've been able to board Blue terrain and work my way down blacks...

I think I narrowed it down to the Guch camber or the jones ultra mountain twin. I've also considered the NS West and 25.

I'm more interested in carving around, going through trees, variable terrain and steep terrain and powder...

What do you guys think? I've got about 10 trips mostly to Bear mountain/Snow summit and Mammoth Mountain.


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## MVNY (Apr 18, 2011)

The standard (and correct  ) response is to just keep riding and get better before looking at a new board. 10 days is really not much at all, and your Arbor Foundation is still essentially brand new.

That said... I can certainly understand the need / want to buy more stuff  !

If you're really jonesing to spend some cash... consider your boots & bindings first. Are you happy with what you have now? Do your boots fit well? How do you like your bindings? Too soft? Too stiff? Have you played with settings and adjustments yet?

All these bits will effect how your board handles... along with, of course, your skills increasing as you continue to clock days on the hill.

Maybe get another season under your belt before picking up any new gear. The more you wait... the better you'll get... and you'll have a MUCH better idea of what you want in a board 


- Matty


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## Hg8783 (May 4, 2017)

I have Adidas superstar boots size 11. I think the fit is correct my big toe barely touches the front all the time. 

My binds I think are crap. I have flow bindings entry level. I was thinking of getting Union Atlas bindings and keeping the board a bit more.


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## Nolefan2011 (Mar 12, 2011)

Keep the board, get better, and then demo and figure out what you want. Nobody here is going to be able to tell you what you want when you don't know yet yourself.


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## kriegs13 (Nov 28, 2016)

Nolefan2011 said:


> Keep the board, get better, and then demo and figure out what you want. Nobody here is going to be able to tell you what you want when you don't know yet yourself.


yeah do that thing that this person just said...put that money in to a lesson or more lift tickets...


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## dave785 (Jan 21, 2016)

if you want i have an arbor board with a similar profile to the iguchi that you can try (the sin nombre). Hit me up if you're interested in going to mammoth. I have a few other boards you could try also, like the rossignol jibsaw or a burton custom. I'll prob be there July 4th. (i live in pasadena)


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## milutinho (Jan 10, 2011)

I have both the ultra in a 157 and the gooch in a 159...very similar ride and feel. the ultra is a little stiffer...I'm selling the gooch if you are interested. its a 2017, 6 days on it. let me know.


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## CauseNAffect (Feb 1, 2016)

dave785 said:


> if you want i have an arbor board with a similar profile to the iguchi that you can try (the sin nombre). Hit me up if you're interested in going to mammoth. I have a few other boards you could try also, like the rossignol jibsaw or a burton custom. I'll prob be there July 4th. (i live in pasadena)


How do you like the sin nombre, angry gave it glowing reviews. Was looking at the ultra or berzerker or nombre for a possible heli freestyle board.


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

It's a bit suspicious to me how many gently used Iguchis I've seen for sale. That's usually not a good sign
Seems like that board is getting flipped an inordinate amount, but I'm not sure that's actually accurate. Just seems that way.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

linvillegorge said:


> It's a bit suspicious to me how many gently used Iguchis I've seen for sale. That's usually not a good sign
> Seems like that board is getting flipped an inordinate amount, but I'm not sure that's actually accurate. Just seems that way.


I think that less because it is a bad board (it isnt) and more because it was mis-marketed. Based on the all the hype/promotion, people expected either pow floater (it isn't) or big mountain charger (closer but it isn't really that either). In reality it is just a fairly traditional all-mountain directional (near) twin that likes to go fast.


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## dave785 (Jan 21, 2016)

SGboarder said:


> I think that less because it is a bad board (it isnt) and more because it was mis-marketed. Based on the all the hype/promotion, people expected either pow floater (it isn't) or big mountain charger (closer but it isn't really that either). In reality it is just a fairly traditional all-mountain directional (near) twin that likes to go fast.


Yeah this is accurate. I haven't ridden it but I went to the arbor shop and played around with one. The sidecut radius is long but it isn't nearly as stiff as I thought it was going to be.


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## dave785 (Jan 21, 2016)

CauseNAffect said:


> How do you like the sin nombre, angry gave it glowing reviews. Was looking at the ultra or berzerker or nombre for a possible heli freestyle board.


It's definitely a different board. I think it's a love-it-or-hate-it board.

Its float is absolutely terrible, but what's interesting is how well it keeps speed in powder. In most boards you'll slow down in flatter powder pretty quickly, and even if you're "on top" eventually you'll stop. With the sin nombre, you don't slow down nearly as fast... so as long as you want to go fast and can keep your speed, it's amazing. 

The tip/tail is interesting. I took it on some really steep lines on a pow day and I had the tail "wash out" and I did a backflip... think of the exact opposite of a tomahawk.. the tail didn't have enough surface area to hold me on a really steep line (and I was used to other boards so I had more weight back there) but once i got used to it it was easy to fix and actually kinda nice that it wasn't such a chore to lean back on steep terrain. 

Board isn't very damp. Not very catchy but it can still catch. My biggest complaint is with arbors system camber turning radii... I wish they had more than two radii. The difference in turn sharpness is too significant and too noticeable when you're going from the outside radius to the inside radius... they really need a more blended sidecut. I like the raised fenders though I think it helps a lot in pow and in trees... but I don't think I would consider the sin nombre a tree board unless your trees are pretty spaced out and you want to keep speed in a pow day. It's more of a free ride / all mountain board... Hard to explain. But I'd ride it on pow days (or day after pow days) doing tougher runs in a resort where getting stuck wouldn't require too much walking. 

you probably won't get stuck if you keep your speed... any snowboard will float well in powder if it's going fast enough.. butthis board is designed to help you keep your speed so you never slow down in pow or day-after-dump pow (it's glorious to watch that dagger tip just cut through mostly-tracked-out lines)... but everyone makes mistakes, and if you don't have any speed then this board has the worst float of any board I've ever been on. 

I hope that makes sense. It's hard to describe.

Edit: let me put it like this.. on a pow day, you know how you'll see a tree run or a glade run and you'll want to hit it, but then you don't because you know that no matter how much speed you carry into the trees, you know that your board will come to a stop in that flat or nearly flat section at the bottom? Well with the sin nombre you can hit those. Maybe not all of them, but it'll put the runs that are just out of reach back into your reach... which is especially great at a crowded resort. Just don't mess up and make sure you have tons of speed when you commit!

And I own a dupraz as my go-to pow board, just to put things in perspective. I also use a fluro wax.

Edit2: I wouldn't really consider it for heli freestyle unless the terrain is really steep. The board's tail is not as substantial as most other boards and doesn't provide as much surface area to land on... it'll still land but the tail will sink in much further if you don't land flat... Plus the board just needs speed and momentum to float. 

I haven't ridden it setup as a twin so I can't comment fully. My riding was with the bindings slammed all the way back. It's good on groomers but with my terrible knees it's not damp enough for me to use as a daily driver and I'm not a fan of the abrupt sidecut transitions either.


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## CauseNAffect (Feb 1, 2016)

that's some solid ass beta right there. Doesn't sound like it has the versatility that I would require in a board. Interesting review tho in regards to the powder performance, I know exactly what you're talking about.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

dave785 said:


> Yeah this is accurate. I haven't ridden it but I went to the arbor shop and played around with one. The sidecut radius is long but it isn't nearly as stiff as I thought it was going to be.





dave785 said:


> It's definitely a different board. I think it's a love-it-or-hate-it board.
> 
> Its float is absolutely terrible, but what's interesting is how well it keeps speed in powder. In most boards you'll slow down in flatter powder pretty quickly, and even if you're "on top" eventually you'll stop. With the sin nombre, you don't slow down nearly as fast... so as long as you want to go fast and can keep your speed, it's amazing.
> 
> [...]


Please do us all (incl yourself) a favor and stop posting about stuff that you have no idea about.


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## BunnySlope (Mar 27, 2017)

SGboarder said:


> Please do us all (incl yourself) a favor and stop posting about stuff that you have no idea about.


Do you have a counterpoint? I hope you do because I just ordered this board and his post had me a little worried :grin:

I'm planning to use it for powder, jumps, laying down hard and fast turns...


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## ekb18c (Mar 11, 2013)

Honestly I wouldn't put too much weight on Dave's advice. If I remember correctly, I think he just started snowboarding. Also based on his feed back on posts about other boards, he was talking about the board and it was completely wrong.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

BunnySlope said:


> Do you have a counterpoint? I hope you do because I just ordered this board and his post had me a little worried :grin:
> 
> I'm planning to use it for powder, jumps, laying down hard and fast turns...


I have lots of counterpoints but my comment was about his reviews/advice in general, not on about a particular board.

Don't know nearly enough about you and your riding to say whether the Sin Nombre is for you. Generally, it is very good for jumps and definitely can do some nice and fast turns for sure, but is not great in serious powder.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

dave785 said:


> It's definitely a different board. I think it's a love-it-or-hate-it board.
> 
> Its float is absolutely terrible, but what's interesting is how well it keeps speed in powder. In most boards you'll slow down in flatter powder pretty quickly, and even if you're "on top" eventually you'll stop. With the sin nombre, you don't slow down nearly as fast... so as long as you want to go fast and can keep your speed, it's amazing.
> 
> ...


And the award for weirdest review ever goes to....


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## BunnySlope (Mar 27, 2017)

SGboarder said:


> I have lots of counterpoints but my comment was about his reviews/advice in general, not on about a particular board.
> 
> Don't know nearly enough about you and your riding to say whether the Sin Nombre is for you. Generally, it is very good for jumps and definitely can do some nice and fast turns for sure, but is not great in serious powder.


I've been boarding for a long time but just started really getting into it a few years ago. I bought a Bataleon Goliath and it has served me well, but it's just a little too soft and wishy-washy for the type of riding I've grown to love. 

I used to spend a lot of time in the park, but now I'll just hit the occasional jump. I spend more time charging down steep lines and powder hunting. The sin nombre seems to fit the bill well (and I got a killer deal), and I figured anything would be better in powder than my Goliath which just nosedives if I don't watch it.


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## dave785 (Jan 21, 2016)

OP my offer still stands - if you want to demo my sin nombre up in mammoth before the season ends just PM me.


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## Tantin (Apr 17, 2017)

BunnySlope said:


> ... and I figured anything would be better in powder than my Goliath which just nosedives if I don't watch it.


I'm pretty noob here, but that kind of things are fairly obvios just by looking at the specs. So why do you expect a good float in powder from the camber board with no setback, no taper and even no rocker at the nose?


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## BunnySlope (Mar 27, 2017)

Tantin said:


> I'm pretty noob here, but that kind of things are fairly obvios just by looking at the specs. So why do you expect a good float in powder from the camber board with no setback, no taper and even no rocker at the nose?


I don't, but I expect something halfway decent with the longer nose and the fact that I can set the bindings back myself.


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## dave785 (Jan 21, 2016)

BunnySlope said:


> I don't, but I expect something halfway decent with the longer nose and the fact that I can set the bindings back myself.


Nose is narrow. They call then "dagger tips" because they cut through the snow, not because they float on top.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

BunnySlope said:


> I've been boarding for a long time but just started really getting into it a few years ago. I bought a Bataleon Goliath and it has served me well, but it's just a little too soft and wishy-washy for the type of riding I've grown to love.
> 
> I used to spend a lot of time in the park, but now I'll just hit the occasional jump. I spend more time charging down steep lines and powder hunting. The sin nombre seems to fit the bill well (and I got a killer deal), and I figured anything would be better in powder than my Goliath which just nosedives if I don't watch it.


If you spend more time charging down steep lines and powder hunting............... why did you get a camber freestyle twin?

The bevel tips should help a little bit for float in powder, but they are probably there just to make it a bit less catchy than full camber.


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## BunnySlope (Mar 27, 2017)

F1EA said:


> If you spend more time charging down steep lines and powder hunting............... why did you get a camber freestyle twin?
> 
> The bevel tips should help a little bit for float in powder, but they are probably there just to make it a bit less catchy than full camber.


Well I do spend a non-trivial amount of time hitting jumps and natural features as well so a directional twin (that I can setback myself) seemed like a nice compromise. Nevertheless every review (including Angry) characterizes it as more freeride than freestyle.

As for the camber, I've demo'd a few technologies and always prefer camber at the end of the day for the response and pop.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

BunnySlope said:


> Well I do spend a non-trivial amount of time hitting jumps and natural features as well so a directional twin (that I can setback myself) seemed like a nice compromise. Nevertheless every review (including Angry) characterizes it as more freeride than freestyle.
> 
> As for the camber, I've demo'd a few technologies and always prefer camber at the end of the day for the response and pop.


https://whitelines.com/snowboard-ge...sin-nombre-2016-2017.html#kYMuLxzRRPUeOB5T.97

https://thegoodride.com/snowboard-reviews/arbor-sin-nombre-snowboard-review-and-buying-advice/

2017 Arbor Sin Nombré Snowboard Review - The Angry Snowboarder

I guess maybe you're referring to freeride as in charging...... but none of those reviews hail it's powder characteristics. They are all commenting on it as a groomer freestyle board. But yeah... if you set it all the way back.... you will get some float with the bevel edges. But it's no powder-friendly board.

But if you already have it, might as well ride it and see if it works for you.

In any case..... yeah you can get a lot of awesome camber boards that charge, pop and charge pretty well.
Surprise surprise: Burton Flight Attendant, Yes Pick your Line, Ride Berzerker, Ride Alter Ego, etc etc.

More freestyle camber-dominant twins that can also charge and get some decent pow: Yes Greats, Endeavor Live, Burton Trick Pony, Salomon Assassin, Capita (forgot which one), Ride Machete GT, Rossi Jibsaw, etc etc


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## marv (May 6, 2016)

I suppose you meant Capita Mercury - slight (0.5 inch) setback on almost full camber deck with mid-stiff flex. Great carver, versatile and pow friendly.

Sent from my SGP621 using Tapatalk


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## BunnySlope (Mar 27, 2017)

Ah yes the Capita Mercury. That one sounded awesome and was actually my first choice, but it's out of stock everywhere and retails for more than double what I nabbed the Arbor SN at.

I think I convinced myself about the SN's powder ability by latching onto specific statements:
"The shaped nose and tail offer extra maneuverability in the serious steep and deep, too." -Whitelines
"Overall I can see it’s appeal for backcountry freestyle over being a resort board." -Angry

and ignoring contrary statements....


Oh well, if it turns out it's unacceptably terrible in powder then I have an excuse to buy another board :grin:


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

BunnySlope said:


> Ah yes the Capita Mercury. That one sounded awesome and was actually my first choice, but it's out of stock everywhere and retails for more than double what I nabbed the Arbor SN at.
> 
> I think I convinced myself about the SN's powder ability by latching onto specific statements:
> "The shaped nose and tail offer extra maneuverability in the serious steep and deep, too." -Whitelines
> ...


Yeah you'll be "fine". And if you got the board for a good price then it's worth it. Lots of manufacturers are going with a similar profile for kind of powder freestyle twins so who knows maybe it serves you well.

In the case of Dave up there, if he's used to a Dupraz nothing will float the same. I feel like I'm going to tomahawk on almost anything I ride after the Dupraz..........

Ah well, doesn't hurt to try. And new boards are always fun.


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## dave785 (Jan 21, 2016)

F1EA said:


> In the case of Dave up there, if he's used to a Dupraz nothing will float the same. I feel like I'm going to tomahawk on almost anything I ride after the Dupraz..........


i need to stop writing long essays on my cellphone when im at work because nobody ever bothers to read the whole thing...

dupraz float > all. The sin nombre has worse float than my rossignol one... but the sin nombre has very little "drag" or "plow" (what skiers refer to as friction). That's its advantage. 

there's a reason they call the snow here in SoCal the "Sierra Cement." Friction is just too high down here compared to say Utah, colorado, the PNW, or the northeast ice. Arbor is a SoCal company (albeit with a lot of emphasis on NorCal / Tahoe) and I like to think they built the sin nombre with that in mind. 

I just don't understand why BunnySlope would think that going from a twin, camber with lifted contact points, medium flex board like the goliath to a twin, camber with lifted contact points, medium stiff flex board would increase his/her float


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

dave785 said:


> i need to stop writing long essays on my cellphone when im at work because nobody ever bothers to read the whole thing...
> 
> dupraz float > all. The sin nombre has worse float than my rossignol one... but the sin nombre has very little "drag" or "plow" (what skiers refer to as friction). That's its advantage.
> 
> ...


For the Dupraz I think it's also the way that board is ridden..... you charge the nose very heavily and it still floats. Whenever you get on almost any other board, you can't send that much weight forward. Always takes me a run or two to get used to other boards.

The drag you mention is more to do with waxing, the base or even the base structure rather than the board itself.


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## dave785 (Jan 21, 2016)

F1EA said:


> The drag you mention is more to do with waxing, the base or even the base structure rather than the board itself.


I thought that too until I hopped on the sin nombre. The tips really do cut through the snow rather than plowing over it. If you were to hold the board up and stare down the tip you see that its profile is very small. Not a lot of nose to plow the snow slowing the board down. I highly recommend you ride it it's pretty cool. Tracked out pow isn't as bumpy either because the tips go through the bumps instead of over them


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## Hg8783 (May 4, 2017)

Wow, no idea this blew up been away a couple days. 

Well, I couldn't help it and bought a Arbor Cosa Nostra....I really want to hit the back country next season, and all the guys that ride it say it's great on groomers. I love the wood on this thing. 200 dollars off. 

Im going to mammoth one more time then it's over till Nov  and yes I'll invest in a season pass as my next big thing...I get better every time I ride.


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