# FLUX SF to Union Factory or NOW?



## 24WERD (May 9, 2012)

did you rotate the high backs?

you can also get more mellow response by switching the highbacks depending on yr.


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## gordon (Mar 16, 2014)

Definitely rotated the high backs. I'm not sure I can swap out the high backs as they are 2012/2013 Flux SF45's. Unless someone knows if its possible? It looks like the DS/DL/DM's have a softer high back but not sure if thats just a model year thing I am seeing online.


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## 24WERD (May 9, 2012)

its possible to switch the highbacks. I have the same year high backs from that year.


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## gordon (Mar 16, 2014)

What high backs did you replace them with? Where did you get the replacement high backs? 
Thanks


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

Pretty sure 24WERD means to swap the highbacks over with each other!!!!!

ie Left <> Right!!!!!

This will change the lateral flex pattern, and most likely solve ya issue!!!!!


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

24WERD said:


> did you rotate the high backs?


Does that really make a difference? I used to do it with my old Burton Mission bindings when I was a newbie, but I asked some pro riders and industry folks about it this season when setting up my new Burton Genesis and I got almost laughed out of the room. One guy who claimed he was involved in designing the Genesis asked me whether I also put 'go fast' stripes on my car...


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

SGboarder said:


> One guy who claimed he was involved in designing the Genesis asked me whether I also put 'go fast' stripes on my car...


Should've asked'm if he adjusts the drivers seat in his?????


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

Mizu Kuma said:


> Should've asked'm if he adjusts the drivers seat in his?????


Well, he was pretty insistent that any rotation makes edge-to-edge response worse.
But then he runs a company that makes snowboards in Niseko, so not sure whether he really had anything to do with Burton bindings.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

Can't go wrong trying Burton Malavita or Cartel, great all-mountain bindings. I have about 200 days on my '12 'Vitas (which I bought used on the forum for $125) and I honestly can't imagine riding another binding unless allowed free trials or sponsorship (both incredibly unlikely), for the simple fact they have been invisible since the day I strapped them in. I can't ask anything else of a binding (In this time I have destroyed an NS Proto, 3 pairs of goggles, a helmet, 1 each pants/jacket, a pair of boots, 3 pairs of gloves, 4pairs of speakers, 2 pipes, 2 phones and a couple pounds of weed, oh and aside from a little fray on the heel hammock, they are in 100%working order). Also both options are gonna be noticeably more forgiving than the SF45.


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## SnowDogWax (Nov 8, 2013)

Think go fast strips on bindings would help, SGboarder might agree..


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## 24WERD (May 9, 2012)

switching the high backs only matter if they high backs are asymmetrical in flex and or design.

And on the racing strips. It increases the value of the car (not really)


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## SnowDogWax (Nov 8, 2013)

snowklinger said:


> Can't go wrong trying Burton Malavita or Cartel, great all-mountain bindings. I have about 200 days on my '12 'Vitas (which I bought used on the forum for $125) and I honestly can't imagine riding another binding unless allowed free trials or sponsorship (both incredibly unlikely), for the simple fact they have been invisible since the day I strapped them in. I can't ask anything else of a binding (In this time I have destroyed an NS Proto, 3 pairs of goggles, a helmet, 1 each pants/jacket, a pair of boots, 3 pairs of gloves, 4pairs of speakers, 2 pipes, 2 phones and a couple pounds of weed, oh and aside from a little fray on the heel hammock, they are in 100%working order). Also both options are gonna be noticeably more forgiving than the SF45.



+++100
Cartel bindings, was a Union man but I'm turning in my Union card, Cartel toe strap is much better, bought Cartel bindings because Donek snowboards suggested Cartel for soft boot racing. Hope to destroy some gear as snowklinger, but i'm a tea or coffee guy. Clean living except for Chunky Monkey, and anything Ben & Jerry. Got to go! Think?? a SPONSOR is ringing my iPhone…:yahoo::lowdown::eusa_clap:


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## booron (Mar 22, 2014)

SGboarder said:


> Does that really make a difference? I used to do it with my old Burton Mission bindings when I was a newbie, but I asked some pro riders and industry folks about it this season when setting up my new Burton Genesis and I got almost laughed out of the room. One guy who claimed he was involved in designing the Genesis asked me whether I also put 'go fast' stripes on my car...


Weird, Burtons have -by far- the most rotatable high backs in the business...


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

booron said:


> Weird, Burtons have -by far- the most rotatable high backs in the business...


I tried to ask him about that (as I said, I also used to rotate my highbacks before). He basically said it was a legacy thing but that it was detrimental to performance and that no serious rider should do it.
The guy is a like a minor deity in Niseko so it was not my place to argue with him.
Anyway, I can kind of see why he would be correct. I still tried rotating the highback on my Genesis but it, if anything, the heel response was worse. So now I ride all my bindings straight.


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## gordon (Mar 16, 2014)

snowklinger said:


> Can't go wrong trying Burton Malavita or Cartel, great all-mountain bindings. I have about 200 days on my '12 'Vitas (which I bought used on the forum for $125) and I honestly can't imagine riding another binding unless allowed free trials or sponsorship (both incredibly unlikely), for the simple fact they have been invisible since the day I strapped them in. I can't ask anything else of a binding (In this time I have destroyed an NS Proto, 3 pairs of goggles, a helmet, 1 each pants/jacket, a pair of boots, 3 pairs of gloves, 4pairs of speakers, 2 pipes, 2 phones and a couple pounds of weed, oh and aside from a little fray on the heel hammock, they are in 100%working order). Also both options are gonna be noticeably more forgiving than the SF45.


I like the sound of getting that much time on a pair of bindings. My buddy is going to let me use his Factory's if I can get on the mountain a few more times before seasons end. That being said, I've always had my eyes on some Malavitas so may be worth checking those out as well after hearing your experience. Do they work well with bigger boots? I have size 14 Nike Kaijus.


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## booron (Mar 22, 2014)

SGboarder said:


> Anyway, I can kind of see why he would be correct. I still tried rotating the highback on my Genesis but it, if anything, the heel response was worse.


How can you see that he was correct? It doesn't make sense to me from a simple leverage standpoint.

Having said that, I am pretty disappointed with the response on my Genesiis, and of course I have the high backs jacked to the point that it is difficult to fold them down. Suppose it's worth a shot to try em straight, eh?


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

gordon said:


> I like the sound of getting that much time on a pair of bindings. My buddy is going to let me use his Factory's if I can get on the mountain a few more times before seasons end. That being said, I've always had my eyes on some Malavitas so may be worth checking those out as well after hearing your experience. Do they work well with bigger boots? I have size 14 Nike Kaijus.


No idea, I wear 9s (which is like what mediums in every brand is made for). There is a known issue where due to the fact that they are unibody designs (which is one of my favorite features), some sizes fit more perfectly than others - I believe I have heard it is hard to get 11's centered....


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

My only real complaint about Flux is that don't really have a mid-flex binding. They go from pretty damn soft to pretty damn stiff.


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## gordon (Mar 16, 2014)

Indeed on the Flux comment. I have to say, I love just about everything about them except that they don't seem to offer that good mid range flex binding AND they don't offer that much padding in any model. I just strapped in the Factory's for a comparison and it was crazy how thin the SF45 feels. Nevertheless, the Flux fit and finish is impressive. More so than the Union offerings. On the mountain getting in and out felt great on the Flux as well.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

I like that FLUX is Japanese. Everything they do is awesome (except Pearl Harbor I guess).


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Flux > Union

It's pretty much that simple. That's more of a praise for Flux than a knock on Union.


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

The TT is Flux's Mid Flex binder!!!!! 

It's softer than the SF, and stiffer than an RK!!!!! 

As for rotatin high backs, they'll still perform if ya don't, it's just that it'll change how responsive they are both when usin heel side pressure, and lateral flex!!!!!

Some binders are made to be stiff when heel side pressure is applied for edge response, yet laterally flex from side to side very easily to be able to bone those tricks in the park when needed!!!!!

Changin the way the high back's flex is all down to comfort and personal taste at the end of the day!!!!! 

That's why they have so many little holes to screw in so many different ways!!!!!


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

The TT is what Flux CALLS a mid-flex binding. I have them. They are definitely on the SOFT side of mid-flex. They really don't have anything in their lineup along the lines of a Burton Cartel or Union Force. The TT is a lot softer and the SF is a lot stiffer.


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

Don't forget that as was mentioned earlier, that the SF (along with other models) have Asymmetric Highbacks than can be swapped over to soften the lateral flex, along with dampeners that can be added/removed from the baseplate to also change the flex!!!!!


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Or... Flux could just, ya know... make an actual mid-flex binding!!!!

They have way too many bindings on the soft side. Basically everything not the SF and DM falls somewhere between the RK and TT. Fuck all that shit. Trim some of the fat and make an actual mid-flex binder. Mid-way between the TT and SF. I'd buy the damn thing right now.

People who have been here awhile know that I'm probably the biggest Flux fanboy here, but I'm just speaking the truth on this one.


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## gordon (Mar 16, 2014)

linvillegorge said:


> The TT is what Flux CALLS a mid-flex binding. I have them. They are definitely on the SOFT side of mid-flex. They really don't have anything in their lineup along the lines of a Burton Cartel or Union Force. The TT is a lot softer and the SF is a lot stiffer.


If Flux can give us the Cartel version of their bindings I would definitely buy as well. Again, I love what they do but the SF for me was rigid at times. I know it's meant to be responsive but I got a lot of calf bite and it just felt way too stiff. Anyone like the DS ? Or is that still too stiff?


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## gordon (Mar 16, 2014)

linvillegorge said:


> Or... Flux could just, ya know... make an actual mid-flex binding!!!!
> 
> They have way too many bindings on the soft side. Basically everything not the SF and DM falls somewhere between the RK and TT. Fuck all that shit. Trim some of the fat and make an actual mid-flex binder. Mid-way between the TT and SF. I'd buy the damn thing right now.
> 
> People who have been here awhile know that I'm probably the biggest Flux fanboy here, but I'm just speaking the truth on this one.


Hey linvillegorge, what Flux bindings you settle on then? What are your favorites and why? Have you tried the DS as a mid range flex binding?


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

I have the TTs and I love them for a softer board or mid-flex board but they don't have quite enough stiffness once you get into the mid-stiff boards. I haven't tried the DS but I'm pretty sure Flux rates it about the same as the TT in flex.


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

Pretty sure the highback on the DS has a softer lateral flex than the TT, but coupled with a similar 30% blend base plate!!!!!


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