# Burton Step On™ - Research & Development Process



## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Cool concept.

I've seen it, and it works pretty well. Basically, you don't need the straps because the boots clip to the heel cup on the back. So with these, instead of pulling the heel side with the straps on a toeside turn, you pull it from the heel cup. So yeah... no need for straps.

My only "concern" would be the clips on the toe. Will that wear out? looks like that will be the first thing to wear out and lose clip...


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)

F1EA said:


> Cool concept.
> 
> I've seen it, and it works pretty well. Basically, you don't need the straps because the boots clip to the heel cup on the back. So with these, instead of pulling the heel side with the straps on a toeside turn, you pull it from the heel cup. So yeah... no need for straps.
> 
> My only "concern" would be the clips on the toe. Will that wear out? looks like that will be the first thing to wear out and lose clip...


some more videos that might address your concern.


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Biggest downside IMO is limited boot selection. Hopefully if this catches on like the EST channel system other makers will offer compatibility.


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)

linvillegorge said:


> Biggest downside IMO is limited boot selection. Hopefully if this catches on like the EST channel system other makers will offer compatibility.


I would expect come next season, competitors will make boots for this system.


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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

linvillegorge said:


> Biggest downside IMO is limited boot selection. Hopefully if this catches on like the EST channel system other makers will offer compatibility.


+1 on that i will see how this plays out... i love the concept. gives me an alternative to flows


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Oh nice. Lots of questions hehehe

Well... his 1st question/answer is what I said up there. Definitely the mechanical lock is pretty good and solid. You pull from the heel cup and bypass the strap. It's a solid connection and provides more response than a regular strap. 

They did answer my 'concern'.... but not really. All they said is they've subjected the part to tons of in/out cycles, QC and that the part is replaceable. That's all fine. I'm not looking for "an answer" though. I'm asking for proof through real riding and use. So let's see how it handles time and real riding. But still.... doesn't look bad.

I'm not buying yet though.

WHEN they do the Hinge and completely eliminate the baseplate (like EST bindings) and do steppy Ions. I'm in. 
And not in the sense like... hurry up and buy some. More like... ah ok. I would consider it.

Maybe in ~3yrs or so? It's not even a question of 'if' they'll do it.... I'm 100% that (est and hinge) will be the next step once they cover any reliability hiccups on the first 1 or 2 yrs.

My son was hyped about them though. He was like... "Whooooa you can just click in and out. Awesome."


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)

My set arrived in the mail about 30 min!


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

N-Y said:


> I would expect come next season, competitors will make boots for this system.


It'll all depend on how well they're accepted in the marketplace - meaning how well the sell. Companies aren't going to invest the R&D resources into it if it won't pay off for them. I'll be surprised if these sell well enough to see companies rolling out compatible boots for next season.


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## PlanB (Nov 21, 2014)

N-Y said:


> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KU7q-Ighhhc[/quote]
> I'm happy to learn that B... with the sport because you have to strap in?">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KU7q-Ighhhc[/quote]
> I'm happy to learn that B... with the sport because you have to strap in?" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="640" height="385">


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

Depends how you define revolutionize. If 10 years from now 50% of riders have them I would say they revolutionized it whether or not total riders has gone up or down.

I think the system looks pretty intriguing. I'm not 100% convinced on their 3 ratchet steps in the back overcoming issues with snow build up. I think it saves them from liability issues as as long as you can get one down you're not getting ejected, but I think the assumption that it'll clean itself out and you'll go down further is a big assumption and riding with your heel not all the way down sounds kind of crappy.

This is an issue regardless of binding


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

PlanB said:


> I'm happy to learn that Burton took this re-introduction (and yes, it's a re-introduction because this basic principal already existed) seriously and did their homework so to speak to do it right this time. That said however, it's as if they want credit for doing what every single company that makes a consumer product should already be doing anyway which is proper R&D and Testing, testing, then more testing so the consumers don't get stuck with a garbage product.
> 
> As for revolutionizing the sport as they are implying at the end of this video - I think they are really playing up (almost unbelievably so) that bending down to strap in a conventional snowboard binding is a 'barrier' to entering/continuing with the sport of snowboarding. Let's be realistic, if bending down to do up a strap every now and then is a barrier for someone to enter this sport then this sport probably isn't for them - I mean seriously, you can bend to turn, get up from a fall, do a trick, pick up your glove, ect....but you won't enter/stick with the sport because you have to strap in?


Totally disagree with you....

1) yeah it's R&D everyone SHOULD be doing it.... but not everyone is. In fact, I think almost no one does. Most snowboard brands test and develop prototypes... shapes and dimensions. But very few do materials or just revolutionary stuff. I would say the only thing out there I see as real R&D would be the Yes Powder Hull and the Springbreak foam cores. Everyone else is (or at least appears to) just following along and coming up with new products based on existing stuff.

2) it is not a problem for YOU. Or for me. 
But it probably is the #1 individual and first pushback from new riders...... strapping in is annoying as hell. Compared to skiing? miiiiiiiiiiiiles away.
Also... I don't think anyone making and selling/marketing a product is going to say 'maybe this sport isn't for you' 
Seriously?

They are making a big deal out of it though. I don't get it hahah why all the fuss?


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)

linvillegorge said:


> It'll all depend on how well they're accepted in the marketplace - meaning how well the sell. Companies aren't going to invest the R&D resources into it if it won't pay off for them. I'll be surprised if these sell well enough to see companies rolling out compatible boots for next season.


considering they seem sold out on Burton site, thats a good start. I've watched a lot of videos on this product and even though I'm new to the sport, I haven't seen any indication that this could be a gimmick... this is a product that is here to stay and will represent Burton Flagship line.


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

N-Y said:


> considering they seem sold out on Burton site, thats a good start. I've watched a lot of videos on this product and even though I'm new to the sport, I haven't seen any indication that this could be a gimmick... this is a product that is here to stay and will represent Burton Flagship line.


Let's get a few more seasons under your belt before you start making such industry statements.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

N-Y said:


> considering they seem sold out on Burton site, thats a good start. I've watched a lot of videos on this product and even though I'm new to the sport, I haven't seen any indication that this could be a gimmick... this is a product that is here to stay and will represent Burton Flagship line.


Of course it's going to sell. Pretty sure it's going to replace conventional bindings. Just you wait....

Personally, I don't see it as such a breakthrough because I don't care for it. But a lot of people do.


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## robotfood99 (Mar 19, 2016)

If this is regarded a success by B’s competitors, they will probably scramble to release similar but incompatible systems. I can’t see B giving away their IP for the sake of compatibility. One more reason to sit back and wait for the dust to settle.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

Nivek and I have some coming to us for review after the 20th of this month once I'm cleared to ride again.


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## MrEgg (Mar 31, 2015)

I think a lot depends on where Burton go with it.
For it to succeed then they have to licence the technology to other boot manufacturers in my opinion.

The potential for it is there & will prob. be more popular with new riders & maybe at learners/rental level.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

BurtonAvenger said:


> Nivek and I have some coming to us for review after the 20th of this month once I'm cleared to ride again.


dang u hurt still from last year?


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## lab49232 (Sep 13, 2011)

Ok few things EVERYONE seems to be missing. New riders will LOVE this technology, and so will riders who haven't ridden in the last 10 years. You still have those people going in to shops going I need some of those step in bindings, and then shop people go "actually they don't exist but here's some flows or Gnu or K2 clickers, they're the closest." Only thing is Burton's setup at that price......... Holy hell, way too exclusive and a huge barrier to entry for that customer. They wanna get a whole setup for $600, not just boots and bindings. This pricepoint is for the well off who may buy, and the seasoned rider willing to spend $600 but those people are comfortable strapping in to bindings.

Burton also aren't idiots. They didn't produce a million pairs. These are limited run small batch and will sell out because that's what Burton wants to happen. It's easy to sell one or two pair per shop with the hype. There's always that one customer. Without insider knowledge there will be no way to tell how good sales are. You'll see sold out and assume they're flying off the shelf. That's called marketing 101.

They aren't gonna go anywhere any time soon. They're here to stay for a few years. Dont expect other boot companies to jump on them any time soon. WAY too expensive and Burton likes people buying Burton product, same as Apple or Microsoft. You may see more Burton boot options but if you're expecting to find your favorite DC compatible boot in the next 3 years.... keep dreaming. 

In the end functionality won't win for these, other brands won't win for these, it will strictly be can Burton and the industry find a niche they can monetarily exploit long enough to make them viable and sustainable. If so, they stick around. If not, they go the way of previous step ins when experienced riders realize strapping in isn't an issue and a change for a higher cost isn't worth it. Unless they release a $300 combo boot and binding (they won't any time soon, trust me) these will be a small very select market benefiting from the popularity of threads like this among gear whores. But here's to hoping it does work because any money in the snowboard industry is good money!

In more upbeat news it's HAMMERING in the PNW, should be a great first weekend of November shredding for those who can get it!


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

lab49232 said:


> Only thing is Burton's setup at that price......... Holy hell, way too exclusive and a huge barrier to entry for that customer. They wanna get a whole setup for $600, not just boots and bindings. This pricepoint is for the well off who may buy, and the seasoned rider willing to spend $600 but those people are comfortable strapping in to bindings.


Erm, the Ruler Step on combo is _less expensive_ than a regular Ruler +Vita or Genesis, nearly the same as a Ruler + Cartel and only slightly more expensive than even a Ruler + Mission combo. Looks like a pretty good deal to me...


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

Maybe I'm over thinking things, but straps do seem to have the advantage of pulling the entire binding around the boot. The anchor certainly works for lateral heel lifting, but what about some of the more intricate movements you might influence more with your calf? For example flat basing? I think I work above my ankles more in those situations.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

It will come as no surprise that my concern is fit. 

This system secures only the lower boot to the binding (the function and rigidity of that connection is another topic). Any rider motion that _pulls_ upwards is resisted by the structures of the boot only. That puts a much higher requirement on the boot to resist that motion to achieve the same level of transfer. The single ankle strap on the Photon Step On boot is secured only to the relatively soft and relatively flexible materials of the boot itself. This should not be considered equivalent to a binding strap which roots to rigid structure. The Ruler Step On boot has no such straps.

This puts an extraordinary burden on accuracy of fit. Riding this system in an accurate performance fit may be entirely pleasant for many riders. But, a comfort fit will be a sloppy affair that will only get worse as the boot breaks in. There is no mechanism to correct for this after the fact.


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

I think what Wired said is a much better explanation of what I was trying to imply. The snugness of the straps seems to me to give a much more encompassing approach to putting pressure exactly where you want it. A proper strap really makes you part of the entire binding, not just the 3 leverage points.

The bad thing about straps is I think many people have them way tighter than they should be and it causes foot pain/cold feet.


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## Psi-Man (Aug 31, 2009)

Wiredsport said:


> It will come as no surprise that my concern is fit.
> 
> This system secures only the lower boot to the binding (the function and rigidity of that connection is another topic). Any rider motion that _pulls_ upwards is resisted by the structures of the boot only. That puts a much higher requirement on the boot to resist that motion to achieve the same level of transfer. The single ankle strap on the Photon Step On boot is secured only to the relatively soft and relatively flexible materials of the boot itself. This should not be considered equivalent to a binding strap which roots to rigid structure. The Ruler Step On boot has no such straps.
> 
> This puts an extraordinary burden on accuracy of fit. Riding this system in an accurate performance fit may be entirely pleasant for many riders. But, a comfort fit will be a sloppy affair that will only get worse as the boot breaks in. There is no mechanism to correct for this after the fact.


Same issue as Burton's previous step-in system, along with Clicker, Switch, etc.. The boots will be the main issue. If this can get older riders either back on a board or get them interested in trying it then it should be a win for Burton. For me personally, I don't sit on my ass to strap in, so if I can't bend over to strap in then it's time to retire.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Psi-Man said:


> Same issue as Burton's previous step-in system, along with Clicker, Switch, etc.. The boots will be the main issue. If this can get older riders either back on a board or get them interested in trying it then it should be a win for Burton. For me personally, I don't sit on my ass to strap in, so if I can't bend over to strap in then it's time to retire.


Hi Psi,

It is a little different than the older systems. Those systems used metal to metal boot/binding connections with a lot of structure built into the boots. This included significant metal inclusions in the sole, highbacks and elsewhere in the boot itself. The boots were beasts! 
Essentially the structure of the bindings was ingloriously hidden within the boot. Far from perfect. But, it did lessen the problem I mentioned above. This is by no means an endorsement of the older design, just recognition that most designs have shortcomings and benefits.

Burton was very conscious of that perception of the older boots and came up with a light and flexible boot. That too will have benefits and shortcomings. 

One thing is certain. Extra room in the boots in the new step on system (when new or after break in) will lead to slop and reduced performance. My post is to avoid very costly mistakes.

STOKED!


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

snowklinger said:


> dang u hurt still from last year?


No, got a concussion again and then I have eye surgery on the 15th. Should be good to ride right around Thanksgiving, but with the shit show that it is up here I might wait and ride the week after that.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

First off..... on my way to work cars were covered with about 1in of snow. In the city. :snowplow:

About the fit.... same as the current strap or any system. Poor fit = reduced performance. 

That still doesn't stop newcomers, veterans, freeriders, park rats and pretty much 99% of the snowboard public to still be wearing or using improperly sized gear even after "we all know better".


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

F1EA said:


> First off..... on my way to work cars were covered with about 1in of snow. In the city. :snowplow:
> 
> About the fit.... same as the current strap or any system. Poor fit = reduced performance.
> 
> That still doesn't stop newcomers, veterans, freeriders, park rats and pretty much 99% of the snowboard public to still be wearing or using improperly sized gear even after "we all know better".


Hah! Yes, bad fit is bad fit. But...it is way more of an issue when you remove the binding straps mounted to the rigid structure of the bindings. Relying on these straps to make up for substandard fit is in no way advised but it is how _most_ riders ride in conventional setups. Clamp 'em down . With the same substandard fit and no binding straps to (poorly) ameliorate we are left with unpleasant options.


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

BurtonAvenger said:


> No, got a concussion again and then I have eye surgery on the 15th. Should be good to ride right around Thanksgiving, but with the shit show that it is up here I might wait and ride the week after that.


Surgery won't fix beer goggles.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

f00bar said:


> Surgery won't fix beer goggles.


I can't drink, so don't know what to tell you there guy.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Wiredsport said:


> Hah! Yes, bad fit is bad fit. But...it is way more of an issue when you remove the binding straps mounted to the rigid structure of the bindings. Relying on these straps to make up for substandard fit is in no way advised but it is how _most_ riders ride in conventional setups. Clamp 'em down . With the same substandard fit and no binding straps to (poorly) ameliorate we are left with unpleasant options.


Well I bet they'll do what everyone else already does: compensate with more responsive gear or over tightening stuff......

The step-on bindings are already preeeeeetty stiff and seemingly responsive. Also, the general notion is that having the contact point on the rear of the boot (heelcup) makes the binding more responsive. So.... slightly stiffer + slight added response from the system itself. And that's only the bindings, are the steppy version of the boots slightly stiffer too? 

If you're used to sloppy-fitting Flex 5 gear.... you can now go with sloppy-fitting Flex 6 gear. That is... assuming the person cares about the difference in response between Flex 5 and Flex 6.


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi Psi,
> 
> It is a little different than the older systems. Those systems used metal to metal boot/binding connections with a lot of structure built into the boots. This included significant metal inclusions in the sole, highbacks and elsewhere in the boot itself. The boots were beasts!
> Essentially the structure of the bindings was ingloriously hidden within the boot. Far from perfect. But, it did lessen the problem I mentioned above. This is by no means an endorsement of the older design, just recognition that most designs have shortcomings and benefits.
> ...


.
Yes fit is key, buy them on the snug side. I rode the Clickers for a couple seasons in the late 90's. The heel lift was horrible. I did get to try the Kwicker system a few years ago and have to admit their new boots were way better, too bad they had a binding recall, should have stuck with Shimano. 
The Burton boots with the rear attach point being above or level with the top of the heal should help avoid heal lift along with the fact that boots are just way better than they were 20 years ago. The boot/binding combo feels on par weight wise with a regular strap set-up.
I think the two attach points on the side along with the highback with allow for good heel side turns, wondering alittle about toe side turns. I really doubt Burton would put this out there if it wasn't solid. Pretty big gamble on their part.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Hi guys,

This is easy to test for any rider. Try one size above your Mondo size (1 cm) in either (or both) of the new Step On boot models. You will notice significant foot movement and heel lift that cannot be solved by the BOA systems, even with overtightening to the extreme. I use one size too large as this is a very common error (actually, one size too large is better than what we often find) when a rider buys their shoe size rather than their Mondo size. Also 1 cm is typical for boot pack out.

STOKED!


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> This is easy to test for any rider. Try one size above your Mondo size (1 cm) in either (or both) of the new Step On boot models. You will notice significant foot movement and heel lift that cannot be solved by the BOA systems, even with overtightening to the extreme. I use one size too large as this is a very common error (actually, one size too large is better than what we often find) when a rider buys their shoe size rather than their Mondo size. Also 1 cm is typical for boot pack out.
> 
> STOKED!


This is actually a good thing. People will have to get their correct size instead of the typical crank it down, because the heel lift will be much more obvious and noticeable (to those who are adamant about a specific performance). I'm pretty sure a huge number of people are riding with massive heel lift and not even caring about it.

Why do people wear 1-2 sizes bigger?
Because they can.

This will hurt the "internet shoppers" though. Which again, is a good thing.


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi guys,
> 
> This is easy to test for any rider. Try one size above your Mondo size (1 cm) in either (or both) of the new Step On boot models. You will notice significant foot movement and heel lift that cannot be solved by the BOA systems, even with overtightening to the extreme. I use one size too large as this is a very common error (actually, one size too large is better than what we often find) when a rider buys their shoe size rather than their Mondo size. Also 1 cm is typical for boot pack out.
> 
> STOKED!


.
Barefoot my feet measure about 11.3" just shy of 29 cm. I bought size 10 mens 28 mondo.
Finally got the bindings mounted to a board, carpet test wise the system flexes the board pretty easy. This should be pretty responsive. Pretty easy in and out.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

70'sskater said:


> .
> Barefoot my feet measure about 11.3" just shy of 29 cm. I bought size 10 mens 28 mondo.
> Finally got the bindings mounted to a board, carpet test wise the system flexes the board pretty easy. This should be pretty responsive. Pretty easy in and out.


Hi 70's,

Buying a smaller than Mondo size would also not be suggested. Careful Mondo sizing will be best here. That will allow riders to get the best performance out of this product. 

I hope that helps.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi 70's,
> 
> Buying a smaller than Mondo size would also not be suggested. Careful Mondo sizing will be best here. That will allow riders to get the best performance out of this product.
> 
> I hope that helps.


Agree.
But he probably just measured his feet wrong 

1 size too small is going to be pretty uncomfortable...


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

F1EA said:


> Agree.
> But he probably just measured his feet wrong
> 
> 1 size too small is going to be pretty uncomfortable...


.
Perhaps I measured it wrong but I've worn size 10's for years and they have always worked fine, maybe I just can't feel my toes anymore. I really hate heel lift.


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## ek9max (Apr 8, 2013)

I personally can’t wait to try my set. I would have been able today had my wife not wanted to go on vacation.... 2 local mountains opened this weekend with the other 2 this coming week. 

I’ll have some feedback then.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

70'sskater said:


> .
> Perhaps I measured it wrong but I've worn size 10's for years and they have always worked fine, maybe I just can't feel my toes anymore. I really hate heel lift.


Yeah if size 10 work.... that's the most important measurement.

If you see all the foot measuring threads, it is very easy to make mistakes in the foot measurements.
So..... let's say you get a measurement wrong, buy the wrong boots and think you "should" be a certain size, continue to try and make your feet fit all while spending money and being uncomfortable on the mountain. 

Versus.... trying the boots on and confirming you don't get heel lift and the fit is comfortable.

I've seen ppl considering buying 2 different sized boots. Going through 2-3 seasons of "I am size 9 but size X feels better maybe I should just ask the internet which boot fits my shape foot better and measure my feet again some more". "Oh.. now my bindings can't get centered, but the size chart says..."

Maybe I'm just old fashioned; but that ^ all sounds crazy to me. Especially when the solution is as simple as.... going to a shop and trying the damn thing. Or just buying a couple and returning.


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

F1EA said:


> Yeah if size 10 work.... that's the most important measurement.
> 
> If you see all the foot measuring threads, it is very easy to make mistakes in the foot measurements.
> So..... let's say you get a measurement wrong, buy the wrong boots and think you "should" be a certain size, continue to try and make your feet fit all while spending money and being uncomfortable on the mountain.
> ...


.
I've always gone by the method of having the toes slightly graze the front of the boot, bend down a few times and if the toes pull away then I should be fine. I also pulled the liner out and put my foot in with the toes against the front of the boot and I can get my fingers in between my heel and the back of the boot. I also bought my boots from a shop that has great boot fitters in case i need tweaks. They are actually more of a ski shop.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

70'sskater said:


> .
> I've always gone by the method of having the toes slightly graze the front of the boot, bend down a few times and if the toes pull away then I should be fine. I also pulled the liner out and put my foot in with the toes against the front of the boot and I can get my fingers in between my heel and the back of the boot. I also bought my boots from a shop that has great boot fitters in case i need tweaks. They are actually more of a ski shop.


That sounds too large.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

70'sskater said:


> .
> I've always gone by the method of having the toes slightly graze the front of the boot


Hi 70's, just grazing would be too large. In your correct Mondo size we would expect firm pressure into the compliant materials of the liner (both toe and heel), especially when new. 

I saw that you wrote that you hate heel lift. I am with you. Our goal is to get everyone into the best fitting boots possible. One boot size is a mere 1 cm. A half size is .5 cm. Both can have an extraordinary impact on heel lift (and other unwanted foot motion). If you want to post up your barefoot measurements (length and width) with some images of your feet being measured in any of the boot sizing threads I will be happy to see if there is room for improvement. 

STOKED!


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

70'sskater said:


> .
> I've always gone by the method of having the toes slightly graze the front of the boot, bend down a few times and if the toes pull away then I should be fine. I also pulled the liner out and put my foot in with the toes against the front of the boot and I can get my fingers in between my heel and the back of the boot. I also bought my boots from a shop that has great boot fitters in case i need tweaks. They are actually more of a ski shop.


Yeah, that's definitely not a full size smaller. But if they are comfortable and you get no heel lift, you're good to go.


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi 70's, just grazing would be too large. In your correct Mondo size we would expect firm pressure into the compliant materials of the liner (both toe and heel), especially when new.
> 
> I saw that you wrote that you hate heel lift. I am with you. Our goal is to get everyone into the best fitting boots possible. One boot size is a mere 1 cm. A half size is .5 cm. Both can have an extraordinary impact on heel lift (and other unwanted foot motion). If you want to post up your barefoot measurements (length and width) with some images of your feet being measured in any of the boot sizing threads I will be happy to see if there is room for improvement.
> 
> STOKED!


.
I measured my feet with no socks, I won't post images cause I dont want to make anyone sick. My foot length is 27.8 cm and width is about 10 cm give or take a mm or two.
Thanks for taking the time to help. And I just put the boots back on I guess the toes aren't just grazing the front of the boot its alittle tighter than that, but the toes aren't crunched.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

70'sskater said:


> .
> I measured my feet with no socks, I won't post images cause I dont want to make anyone sick. My foot length is 27.8 cm and width is about 10 cm give or take a mm or two.


You're bang on with a US10 then.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

70'sskater said:


> .
> I measured my feet with no socks, I won't post images cause I dont want to make anyone sick. My foot length is 27.8 cm and width is about 10 cm give or take a mm or two.
> Thanks for taking the time to help. And I just put the boots back on I guess the toes aren't just grazing the front of the boot its alittle tighter than that, but the toes aren't crunched.


Nice. At 27.8 cm you are a mid-range Mondo 280 (the range is 276 to 280 mm) and your width of 10.0 cm is mid-range for a "standard" D width (range for size 10 is 98 to 102 mm). It sounds like you have a great fit in Mondo 280/size 10 in this boot.

STOKED!


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

Wiredsport said:


> Nice. At 27.8 cm you are a mid-range Mondo 280 (the range is 276 to 280 mm) and your width of 10.0 cm is mid-range for a "standard" D width (range for size 10 is 98 to 102 mm). It sounds like you have a great fit in Mondo 280/size 10 in this boot.
> 
> STOKED!


.
Thanks guys. yeah they feel pretty good, hopefully this new tech works as advertised.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

70'sskater said:


> .
> Thanks guys. yeah they feel pretty good, hopefully this new tech works as advertised.


So it went from 1 size smaller, to too big, to just right. k:


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

F1EA said:


> So it went from 1 size smaller, to too big, to just right. k:


.
The 1st time I measured I had socks on. I didn't think it made a difference but it really did.:surprise:


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)

Update on the Step On's.... Burton released a noticed today on their website.

https://www.burton.com/ca/en/steponupdate


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## ek9max (Apr 8, 2013)

It looks like the opening in the middle of the cleat is wider, so alignment for stage 1 is less important but doesn't affect stage 2. I always make sure i'm always in stage 2 so my bindings have been great for me. 

I already ordered the replacements though since they are free, and the 2 single runs after 20 days on snow I did get stuck in stage one. So they will give me more confidence.


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)

ek9max said:


> It looks like the opening in the middle of the cleat is wider, so alignment for stage 1 is less important but doesn't affect stage 2. I always make sure i'm always in stage 2 so my bindings have been great for me.
> 
> I already ordered the replacements though since they are free, and the 2 single runs after 20 days on snow I did get stuck in stage one. So they will give me more confidence.


I noticed it was also wider..

alignment is less important? stuck in snow?

we just got our first dump of snow today, looking forward to hitting the hills.

I also ordered the replacement, but hopefully local shop gets it before, I'll go replace it there, it will make sure I have 1 extra set at home in case anything happens.


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## Petrichor (Oct 5, 2017)

I wondered why i just received a UPS delivery notification E-COM (EU distributors for Burton). Must be this replacement part mentioned. 

Thanks for the heads up N_Y.


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)

Preview of next year photon?... looks nicer with the Burton logo on corner toe of boot and white sole.

https://imgur.com/a/i17yV


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## ek9max (Apr 8, 2013)

N-Y said:


> Preview of next year photon?... looks nicer with the Burton logo on corner toe of boot and white sole.
> 
> https://imgur.com/a/i17yV


A buddy of mine got notice from Burton that size 8.5 ONLY had an issue and they sent him a new pair. He got lucky and got the 2019 I think


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)

ek9max said:


> A buddy of mine got notice from Burton that size 8.5 ONLY had an issue and they sent him a new pair. He got lucky and got the 2019 I think
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I got my replacement part and did it myself. wearing a 10.5


got pictures of your friends new boot?


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## jerendra (Feb 29, 2016)

I also have the version with the white sole but I think it is still the 2018 model that was primarily distributed for rental shops.


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## ek9max (Apr 8, 2013)

N-Y said:


> I got my replacement part and did it myself. wearing a 10.5
> 
> 
> got pictures of your friends new boot?


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## ek9max (Apr 8, 2013)

I do like my Photon SO. But I'm actually interested in seeing other boots. There's been an SLX model seen in the wild too.


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)

ek9max said:


>


thats one beautiful boot.... I love the Burton mountain logo


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

How's the new heal cleat working for people? I finally got mine and I get a better engagement in the 1st click, on the carpet test. Haven't had time to ride too busy last week and a half.


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## ek9max (Apr 8, 2013)

70'sskater said:


> How's the new heal cleat working for people? I finally got mine and I get a better engagement in the 1st click, on the carpet test. Haven't had time to ride too busy last week and a half.


I never had the issue before. So it’s the same for me.


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## Andyawb (Jan 1, 2018)

PlanB said:


> I'm happy to learn that Burton took this re-introduction (and yes, it's a re-introduction because this basic principal already existed) seriously and did their homework so to speak to do it right this time. That said however, it's as if they want credit for doing what every single company that makes a consumer product should already be doing anyway which is proper R&D and Testing, testing, then more testing so the consumers don't get stuck with a garbage product.
> 
> As for revolutionizing the sport as they are implying at the end of this video - I think they are really playing up (almost unbelievably so) that bending down to strap in a conventional snowboard binding is a 'barrier' to entering/continuing with the sport of snowboarding. Let's be realistic, if bending down to do up a strap every now and then is a barrier for someone to enter this sport then this sport probably isn't for them - I mean seriously, you can bend to turn, get up from a fall, do a trick, pick up your glove, ect....but you won't enter/stick with the sport because you have to strap in?


So, I am one of the riders that the bending/sitting/strapping is presenting more and more of a challenge, and these bindings will keep the sport open to me for the foreseeable future. I'm very athletic, skied for 20+ years, and switched to riding 3 years ago. But I have a hip joint that is wearing out on me and will eventually need replacement. (Believe me, there's a sh*t-ton of us out there!). I have one leg that just doesn't compact up as close as it used to, and reaching down to latch in while sitting is getting very tough to do. In addition to giving me a closer, more responsive connection to the board, edge, and hill, I look forward to getting these next year.


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)

So finally got on the hill for first time this season... from a beginners perspective, step on makes snowboarding a lot more enjoyable, not wasting too much time to get into the biding is great.... as far as performance, again from beginners perspective, I thought the system worked great and as advertised. Great response, very comfortable, I don't have any complaints about this system.

I paired the bidding with Endeavor live series.


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## N-Y (Jan 15, 2017)




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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

sorry to revive such an old thread, but I've been out about 5 times this season (2018-2019 season) so far and I have not seen a single one of these setups on the hill. I am not in the market, but just curious what is happening with these new bindings... are they taking off or failing ??

any opinions after they have been out for about a year now ?


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

deagol said:


> sorry to revive such an old thread, but I've been out about 5 times this season (2018-2019 season) so far and I have not seen a single one of these setups on the hill. I am not in the market, but just curious what is happening with these new bindings... are they taking off or failing ??
> 
> any opinions after they have been out for about a year now ?


I've seen quite a few on the mountain this season.

Last weekend saw one guy getting off the lift and strapping in... it is FAST. They guy skated off the lift, stopped to wait for someone and before taking off he just put his foot in and went. Just like that, put your foot in and go.

Other than that, zero hype haha not sure what's Burton trying to sell this season....


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## MMSlasher (Mar 18, 2016)

deagol said:


> sorry to revive such an old thread, but I've been out about 5 times this season (2018-2019 season) so far and I have not seen a single one of these setups on the hill. I am not in the market, but just curious what is happening with these new bindings... are they taking off or failing ??


It's funny to me that you ask this. A local shop seems to be trying to push these. As I do my usual window shopping of new boards for the year, I have noticed that on a few separate occasions, what seems like the employees are steering guys into this step on setup. Could just be a coincidence or maybe a commission based employee trying to sell two items vs one. Idk, just found it interesting.



deagol said:


> any opinions after they have been out for about a year now ?


I would love to get a pair, but I worry this set up could be one of those planned obsolescence type scenarios. Where right now, everyone is still a beta tester and in a few years, they will 'improve' the binding to boot attachment points, so the new boots wouldn't work with the old system. Then we would have to buy another whole set, when we only needed new boots. Plus, I already have 3 boards with bindings on them so that I don't have to switch bindings around when I want to ride a different board. Having said that, if they are still around in 4-5 years, I'll pick up a set.


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

It's a cool option. I don't think I'll be using it in it's current form, and with the boots available. Dunno when and if it will be ready for licensing, it's a fine tuned setup. Shops going for it will have to push it if they want to sell their stock.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Ryan Knapton review:
https://youtu.be/iRZ4f-_wT8Q


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

F1EA said:


> Ryan Knapton review:
> https://youtu.be/iRZ4f-_wT8Q


Ultra dry bluebird was never a challenge for step ins. Step in systems are tested by wet snow or ice-up conditions. That is when it becomes hard to engage (or fully engage similar to the issue Ryan had in the vid for another reason). Icy conditions also test the ease of entry because the rider is slipping while trying to engage.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Wiredsport said:


> Ultra dry bluebird was never a challenge for step ins. Step in systems are tested by wet snow or ice-up conditions. That is when it becomes hard to engage (or fully engage similar to the issue Ryan had in the vid for another reason). Icy conditions also test the ease of entry because the rider is slipping while trying to engage.


Have you tried them on those conditions?


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

Est Step-On and new boots, now I'm interested.


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## DapperROMESDS (Nov 24, 2018)

Really interested in these myself. save time on the hill just locking in right away. however my fear is how long will they last or durability over time.
Never have issues with my Cartels buy very interested in this but aging like said above the limited boot selection


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