# Suggestions to quit locking knees



## dECIBEL7 (Nov 6, 2011)

I'm a great snowboarder in powder. I think almost everyone is though. Unfortunately, my regular resort doesn't get a lot of good snow. Bogus Basin in Idaho.

I've developed this bad habit. When I get to an uncomfortable speed on ice or packed snow I lock my knees from the fear of catching the toe edge and losing some teeth. I don't know how to go slow on ice. I've been taught to get low and go as straight as possible to stay stable... but you pick up some speed when a good portion of the trailed is iced over.

What do you do to keep from locking your knees when you accidentally catch yourself going to fast?


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

I don't know what you mean. I thought you lock your knees by straightening them and locking your knees.


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## Milo303 (Apr 6, 2009)

You move to Utah?

Really though, can't help... I'm mostly a CO rider and when it's icy, I go home or find powder


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## dECIBEL7 (Nov 6, 2011)

ThunderChunky said:


> I don't know what you mean. I thought you lock your knees by straightening them and locking your knees.


That's exactly what I do. My friends suggest that I get low, but I don't. I panic and lock my knees standing straight up.


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## dECIBEL7 (Nov 6, 2011)

Milo303 said:


> You move to Utah?
> 
> Really though, can't help... I'm mostly a CO rider and when it's icy, I go home or find powder


Haha. Nice. I actually moved AWAY from Utah before I got into boarding. Not sure boarding is enough to make me ever want to live there again... and Snowbird was my worst experience ever when I went to visit last year. I'll be back to other area resorts this year though. Going to CO in Feb too for Monarch.


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## Milo303 (Apr 6, 2009)

So use your head and don't stand up and panic?

Confidence and the experience of making it over some crap and not wiping out

If you know how to ride and you're just freaking out on ice, then stop it.... You can still slow down on ice, just gotta be careful with it


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

Wow, no offense, but that is horribly dangerous. Don't ever stand up while you are snowboarding. NO MATTER WHAT. Just stay low, not olny is it more comfortable; it gives you better balance, control and quicker reaction.


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## The Donohoe (Oct 30, 2011)

ThunderChunky said:


> Wow, no offense, but that is horribly dangerous. Don't ever stand up while you are snowboarding. NO MATTER WHAT. Just stay low, not olny is it more comfortable; it gives you better balance, control and quicker reaction.


This, maybe just don't go fast on ice too.... I usually just turn as much as i can on ice if i'm uncomfortable with the situation.

Now i don't think we get the same type of ice. even though we're only like a 100 miles away....... but anyway, i can always dig my edge in if its just shit, then i pack up and go home, i enjoy keeping my face.


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## DaToast (Mar 1, 2010)

dECIBEL7 said:


> I've developed this bad habit. When I get to an uncomfortable speed on ice or packed snow I lock my knees from the fear of catching the toe edge and losing some teeth. I don't know how to go slow on ice. I've been taught to get low and go as straight as possible to stay stable... but you pick up some speed when a good portion of the trailed is iced over.


Standing up and going straight seems like a bad way to control your speed. I remember a couple of years ago Bogus Basin did not get any snow for a while and it was really ice in the shade and packed snow in the sun, that was an interesting experience.

Anyway having sharp edges is your best friend.


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## SnowBum (Sep 27, 2011)

Give your bindings more forward lean, it will work your quads more but will force you to bend your knees...just do this until you get more comfortable bombing an icy hill though, because it kinda sucks. Also sharpen your edges to the point that they will nearly cut paper. Near Tahoe we get 'sierra cement' when it hasn't snowed for, say, a month. Slowing down on that is like trying to slow down on a sheet of glass, but it can be done.


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

This^ I just forgot to say that because I couldn't believe you would actually stand up.


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## IdahoFreshies (Jul 9, 2011)

dECIBEL7 said:


> I'm a great snowboarder in powder. I think almost everyone is though. Unfortunately, my regular resort doesn't get a lot of good snow. Bogus Basin in Idaho.
> 
> I've developed this bad habit. When I get to an uncomfortable speed on ice or packed snow I lock my knees from the fear of catching the toe edge and losing some teeth. I don't know how to go slow on ice. I've been taught to get low and go as straight as possible to stay stable... but you pick up some speed when a good portion of the trailed is iced over.
> 
> What do you do to keep from locking your knees when you accidentally catch yourself going to fast?


herp derp i dont know what you are smoking but i beg to differ, bogus gets some pretty decent snow, not brundage quality at all but still pretty good. You must be hanging out on the front side the entire time because i am often riding good snow on the deer creek side, and the superior side before it gets chewed up. Welcome fellow 208 rider btw

and ya, locking your legs, bad, do the opposite. Crouch down low and keep your center of gravity and balance low. If its hard pack and you are afraid of catching toe side, stay on your edges instead of being flat base. Even if you are only carving constantly a little bit you cant catch your toe edge if you are actually carving your heel edge. You will feel much more confident if you are initiating your own turns instead of just sitting there waiting and anticipating for an edge to catch for you. and it appears that your ice question got an in depth answer in the other thread.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

IdahoFreshies said:


> and ya, locking your legs, bad, do the opposite. Crouch down low and keep your center of gravity and balance low.


This is a good exercise to exaggerate to get the feeling down. It helps develope your lower half; hips, legs, knees and ankles loose, moving and committed. Problems often occurs when you are transitioning from edge to edge and you are too stiff...i.e., hesitant and you don't commit because you are afraid. Also if your upper half is twitching...i.e., not quiet and committed you, and you twitch the upper half at the time you are hesitant on the lower half....you eat shit hard. One thing about what Snowolf said on the other thread of doing shallow skidded turns on a narrow moderate sloped cattrack...is this transition from edge to edge is done quickly and assuredly...back and forth. And if you are thinking about it...it is too slow. You just got to develop the experience and confidence to "just do it". After you get it down you won't crouch and you can actually ride tall and just work the edges with your feet and ankles...and your knees will be loose. On a steeper cattrack sort of the same thing but you lower and rise more in the transitions to really engage each edge more and perhaps hold each edge a split second longer. Just my 2 cents.


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## dECIBEL7 (Nov 6, 2011)

IdahoFreshies said:


> herp derp i dont know what you are smoking but i beg to differ, bogus gets some pretty decent snow, not brundage quality at all but still pretty good. You must be hanging out on the front side the entire time because i am often riding good snow on the deer creek side, and the superior side before it gets chewed up. Welcome fellow 208 rider btw
> 
> and ya, locking your legs, bad, do the opposite. Crouch down low and keep your center of gravity and balance low. If its hard pack and you are afraid of catching toe side, stay on your edges instead of being flat base. Even if you are only carving constantly a little bit you cant catch your toe edge if you are actually carving your heel edge. You will feel much more confident if you are initiating your own turns instead of just sitting there waiting and anticipating for an edge to catch for you. and it appears that your ice question got an in depth answer in the other thread.


I hit Tamarack a lot last year. That snow was incredible every time I went. I do the backside more than the frontside at Bog for the longer runs. I guess I can't really define bad conditions until I've been to more than a few resorts though. Haha. New chairlift should be sweet. Just hope it doesn't get too crowded back there now.

Anyway, thanks for the advice. Hope this season starts as early as last year. Not looking too promising though.


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## dECIBEL7 (Nov 6, 2011)

Thanks, everyone. Good advice.


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## IdahoFreshies (Jul 9, 2011)

dECIBEL7 said:


> I do the backside more than the frontside at Bog for the longer runs. I guess I can't really define bad conditions until I've been to more than a few resorts though. Haha. New chairlift should be sweet. Just hope it doesn't get too crowded back there now.
> 
> Anyway, thanks for the advice. Hope this season starts as early as last year. Not looking too promising though.


we try not to really do "runs", we go on runs to get around, but most of out time is spent off trail in the trees

and ya, opening thanksgiving was amazing last year, but its not looking to hopeful this year. There is a pretty dam big storm brewing off the west coast that should be here by the weekend so hopefully that will give bogus the good snow fall it needs.


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## HoboMaster (May 16, 2010)

IdahoFreshies said:


> we try not to really do "runs", we go on runs to get around, but most of out time is spent off trail in the trees
> 
> and ya, opening thanksgiving was amazing last year, but its not looking to hopeful this year. There is a pretty dam big storm brewing off the west coast that should be here by the weekend so hopefully that will give bogus the good snow fall it needs.


Dude, I'm praying! N. Idaho has gotten nil for snow so far, like maybe 4-5 inches at the high elevations. It sure as hell is cold enough though, just need the precip to kick in. They've got the snow guns rocking at Schweitzer, but they probably won't have a Thanksgiving opening unless we get a decent dump first.


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## IdahoFreshies (Jul 9, 2011)

this should lift your spirits...a little

http://www.weather.gov/sat_tab.php?image=ir


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## HoboMaster (May 16, 2010)

Snowolf said:


> Think sneaky! Anytime you encounter ice go into your stealth mode. Imagine yourself on a pane of glass that can shatter from any sudden move ore jolt. Imagine yourself tippy toeing across it as light as a feather. Standing up and locking the knees is not being quiet and stealthy. Always sneak across ice.


:laugh: That's a good way of putting it, it's a surface that requires due caution and minor precise movements.


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## borborygmii (Feb 2, 2011)

Years ago I used to ride straight legged on toeside turns because I was afraid that if I fell my knees would get seriouslyy hurt on hardpack/ice. Keeping my legs straight was a subconscious way to keep my knees further from the ground and from potentially getting injured. Eventually I got really good at confident toeside turns and carves, and no longer had fear of running my knees into the ground. Now it's only natural to keep my knees bent and bend even deeper for hard carves. 

If I had worn kneepads earlier on I think I would have progressed faster because I imagine it would have taken some of the fear away.

Try kneepads, maybe some padded impact shorts, wrist guards. The extra protection might make you feel more comfortable taking the risks needed to progress your skills.


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## Matt166 (Oct 19, 2011)

As the Wolf advises, its all mental. Somehow you have to overcome your minds natural instinct of straightening out when you are frightened. It IS possible - and it gets easier the more ice riding you do.

I taught east coast for 2 years, so I know a little about a run that looks like a bowling alley with a few mounds of sugar snow on it. The advice given to me - keep low, keep a low edge, keep your body over your board a little more, glide across the ice until you find the nearest area of better snow to turn and slow down on, then repeat!

Oh and very importantly, make sure your edges are SHARP, razor sharp. That dirty little jibstick with detuned contact points aint gonna cut it.


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## jyuen (Dec 16, 2007)

never lock your knees... you should never be standing up straight and locking your knees when riding.

i must admit i'm at fault of doing this when I get lazy on green runs... but then again... some of my most epic bails are on green runs when i'm standing up straight and not paying attention..

riding from ice coast (toronto) my advice
1) do not buy polarized lenses (you can't see patches of ice with polarized lenses)
2) avoid the ice patches if possible (if you say the entire mountain is frozen over, i'd say you're lying) there's a difference between shitty icey but groomed conditions and actual patches of ice
3) if you really come up to a large patch of ice that's unavoidable... stay low, keep your legs bent knees relax so you can react with the bumps on the slopes and ride over that patch flat (because if its a real patch of ice.. no matter how hard you dig, your board is not gonna do anything)
4) once u ride over the patch of ice find an edge right away and ride away like a stud


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## Matt166 (Oct 19, 2011)

jyuen said:


> (if you say the entire mountain is frozen over, i'd say you're lying)


Clearly you have never ridden at Killington on a Saturday! haha


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## hikeswithdogs (Sep 23, 2011)

mpdsnowman said:


> :laugh: Here we go. I took this 4 years ago. Now if you really want to learn how to ride ice, man up and do it at night time..:laugh: Cause thats when its fucking hard, nasty and very dangerous....
> 
> Ive always said if u can ride east you can ride anywhere....toughens you up too....:thumbsup:
> 
> ...


Try coming to Minnesota where we commonly have 10+ strait days of -10F air temps with -30F wind chills and far less snow that you east coasters, so f'ing glad I'm spending this winter in Utah those stretches of days with -10F f'ing suck to do anything drive , ride, wait for the bus, heat the house\car , GTFO.


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## lo0p (Feb 26, 2011)

dECIBEL7 said:


> I'm a great snowboarder in powder. I think almost everyone is though. Unfortunately, my regular resort doesn't get a lot of good snow. Bogus Basin in Idaho.
> 
> I've developed this bad habit. When I get to an uncomfortable speed on ice or packed snow I lock my knees from the fear of catching the toe edge and losing some teeth. I don't know how to go slow on ice. I've been taught to get low and go as straight as possible to stay stable... but you pick up some speed when a good portion of the trailed is iced over.
> 
> What do you do to keep from locking your knees when you accidentally catch yourself going to fast?


I can't really help you with the technical part, but I'd like to share a few thoughts anyway.
First off, as someone mentioned, confidence is a big thing. It's when you're not confident in your ability and start second guessing yourself, that's when you're the most likely to make mistakes. I'm not telling you to be reckless, far from it, but too much hesitation is bad. Do it or don't, but going at things in a half-assed way usually ends poorly.
Also, wear a helmet / pads. It helps with the confidence.

And if the conditions are really shitty, just pack up and come back tomorrow. Sometimes it's just not worth it.

One last thing: Boards with magnatraction (or a similar tech) are nice for icy conditions.


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## jyuen (Dec 16, 2007)

Matt166 said:


> Clearly you have never ridden at Killington on a Saturday! haha


thanks for the heads up.. won't be planning any weekend trips there lol

actually I have been to the slopes once when the entire resort was frozen over but that's because we had some freezing rain and i thought it would be a great idea to go cause the resort would be empty....


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