# Sharing my recent snowboarding experience and frustration still



## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

I went to squaw valley this past weekend, honestly, I don't know why I'm still trying when I still fall on my ass this much, I've already tried it 5 times, most people would've gotten it by now!! But i love it so much I'll keep trying!

So, Squaw is a huge huge resort. I looked at the map, and there were only 2-3 extremely short green runs. Friend and I did night boarding, and I was nearly in tears. We did a few green runs together, and he wanted to take the green run all the way down to the village. He's a skier. Does NOT understand what flat bowl or flat cat track means to a beginner snowboarder. I got stuck because I often speed check myself since I'm still learning and really afraid of speed. He kept yelling at me not to loose my momentum or else I'll get stuck. I did. So did a alot of other snowboarders (they were like monkeys moving their board with their hands on the snow!!). I was so frustrated i had to unstrap and walk till there's a slope. I gave up mid way and went onto a chairlift that I THOUGHT would take me back where I came from. WRONG!! It took us up to a blue run. Friend was asking the lift operator where it was going, turned around and I was on the lift chair, and he yelled at me for getting onto a lift that I didn't know where I was going for the ENTIRE ride. I know i was wrong, but I really was very stressed out at that point. We went down fine.

2nd day: (Seriously, I'm considering dumping him as a friend, i've never been this stressed and pressured). He insist that I should try some blue runs. I did, while I am not so afraid of the steep slopes anymore, but it does nothing to help with my technique. I cannot get myself to do toe side turn when it's steep. But the nice thing about squaw's blue run is that they are REALLY long, and parts of them are gentle enough that allowed me to practice linking my turns. I can do them alot better now, but as soon as it gets steep, or have uneven surface, I get scared. 

Cat tracks: I don't understand why there are so many of them at squaw. I tried really hard to remember what snowolf said about cat tracks but it was just too hard. On my left side, it was a freakn cliff. Unfortunately, since I ride goofy, my week side (toe side) is on my left. I need ALOT of space to make my turn, and if i don't make my turn shallow enough, i'll freakn slip down the slope! Gave up and just falling leaf down. 
At one of those cat tracks, I was actually able to do very shallow turns, but then had a brain lapse and bam, caught a heel edge on my toe side turn. 


So some of my observation about my riding and my frustrations:

I'm definately feeling the toe side ALOT better now. But when i link turns, i feel like it's not a natural thing to me. Every step i do, i have to think. I basically go through what snowolf tells me, the whole sequence. 
However, when the terrain is gentle, i can really feel the torsion of the board when I control my turns with my front foot. I love that feeling.
I felt like my heel side is fast and I generally have no problem transitioning from toe side to heel side. but Toe side is so hard...

How I usually eat shit: 

When i was tired, not paying attention to details, forgot to have my board flat and catch a heel edge while doing a toeside turn, fell on hard packed ice, I cannot bring myself to attempt another turn 

I rarely fall when i'm on my heel edge initiating a toe side turn. It is the process of the turn, either catching an edge trying to complete the turn , or after the turn is completed, I try to initate the heel turn but neglecting to make sure my board is flat. 

Will i ever freakn get this??


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

By the way, I know I'm suppose to lean down towards the slope, while this is quite easy to do on greens, I do not, simply do not have the courage to do that on the blues. The speed is quite intimidating.


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## msl (Jan 31, 2011)

so from what i am reading you are struggling turning from your heel edge onto your toe edge? thats something i struggled with once i started linking my turns as when i did it the board always lifted up and out on me. Best advice i got with turning from heel to toe edge was to always make sure that your front knee is bent and not straight. Trust that even though transitioning and speed increasing that once onto the edge you will be back in control. Another thing when i was learning all my friends told me that it could be quite a frustrating time to learn how to board and i found that out with falls all over the place, probably would have helped had i taken a proper lesson but i got there eventual. Riding a snowboard at first is unnatural, your not going to be one with your board after a couple of times out and you need to think it through until it becomes muscle memory or whatever you want to call it. dont give up


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## VESPADADDY (Dec 9, 2010)

One trick that I was taught is to ride down with both hands on your knees. It's not perfect technique, but it is a work around method of weighting both feet somewhat similarly. Try it when you're aware that you're leaning back on steeps.

Full disclosure: I have been snowboarding just 9 times, all of them between Dec. 2010 and yesterday. Look at my post as an offering of info that has helped me, and not as a coaching tip from an experienced rider.


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

Dump the friend, at least for going riding with. If he's pressuring you to go on runs you aren't comfortable with, he's basically asking you to put yourself in danger for his convenience. That's good for the big ol' one-finger salute as far as I'm concerned.

Second, don't get discouraged by slow progress. "Slow" is only compared to people who are naturals at it or have been doing it all their lives. Strangely, you never end up comparing yourself to other people that have had similar problems. That's human nature, I guess.

My wife, when she was learning to ski (last year) was freaked out by a slope that I swear you couldn't get water to run downhill on. She took a 4-evening lesson package from Seymour and wasn't skiing properly at the end of it. But she kept at it and somehow a couple of weeks later, something clicked. Now I get beaten with a ski pole if we don't go up the moutain often enough, and she's talking blue runs.

It does click eventually. And when it does, it's all worth it.


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## Toecutter (Oct 11, 2009)

Don't go with that skier friend any more. It's too frustrating for both of you. No need for that silliness when you're out there to have fun.


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## firstx1017 (Jan 10, 2011)

Hey Fayewolf - this is Vicki the 50 year old snowboarding beginner that we have posted regarding our experiences as we learn this new fangled thing.

I have posted my most recent runs and I have gotten a little better. So.... I ventured with my Hubby to a blue run to see if I would freak out about the steepness. My plan was just to falling leaf it to get the feel of a blue run. Well, getting off the chairlift nearly gave me a heart attack! I've never seen such a steep slope getting off a chairlift. I was hanging onto the chairlift with dear life before I finally let go. I stayed up but was worried the lift operator would reem me a new one. So, I got strapped in, started down and when I came to the first crest I freaked out and fell backwards. I was too freaked to try to stand up thinking I would head plant it down the mountain. So... with all the people above me on the chairlift watching, I sldd down on my ass half way down that section until I felt confident enough to stand up. Made it down the rest of the way to the last couple of hundred feet and then did my toe side heel side turns at the bottom. That was the extent of my blue run and I must stay I know I'm not ready for blue runs. 

Keep at it but stay on the greens!
Vicki


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## justdust (Jan 27, 2009)

Keep it up everybody...it all clicks in due course and it is definitely worth the effort (and the panic attacks...we've all been there, and most of us return on a regular basis for the adrenaline rush!).:thumbsup:


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

Everyone, thanks for all the replies. 
Yes, that friend needs to be dump. Correction about the first night skiing route we took. It was a 3.5 mile long blue run from high camp down to the village at squaw. Not ever done a green run that long in my life, I just didn't have the courage to do it. Finally when i got the courage to do it the next day, yelled at me for being slow, how he was waiting and making phone calls I wasn't down yet. I was so angry.. i told him to split up and meet up later, he insist on going with me but he wasn't patient. 

Donutz, very interesting. I'm usually a quick learner, so it's very weird for me to not able to click with snowboarding... but I do get it. I lol about your analogy of wife not able to get down the slope that water won't even run down! Brought smile to my face!

Vicki: I saw your video and I'm SUPER jealous! How you linked those turns so smoothly and effortlessly. My turns are really uneven. Sometimes i link them really quickly, sometimes it takes me forever and slowly. Yes, those blue runs are so freakn scary. I cannot for the life of me let the board go flat to initiate a turn, heart attack inducing indeed.I know how you feel on the steep slope. I was on top of one of the peak at emigrant peak and I sat there for the longest time wondering if I should just sit on my ass and slide down. I finally did the world's slowest record of falling leaf to get down....dumping friend and never going out with him again.


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## Toecutter (Oct 11, 2009)

fayewolf said:


> ...yelled at me for being slow, how he was waiting and making phone calls I wasn't down yet. I was so angry.. i told him to split up and meet up later, he insist on going with me but he wasn't patient.


How annoying! You told him to go on his own, he refused, then got upset that he had to wait! Grrrrrr!

Next time if he asks to go with you I hope you tell him "No way, not after last time. Never again, because you were too annoying!"


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

Toecutter said:


> How annoying! You told him to go on his own, he refused, then got upset that he had to wait! Grrrrrr!
> 
> Next time if he asks to go with you I hope you tell him "No way, not after last time. Never again, because you were too annoying!"


I know!! yes, I maybe able to "go down" a blue, but I am not freakn linking my turns, and I basically wasted my whole day not learning a thing, but to perfect falling freakn leaf.


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## gjsnowboarder (Sep 1, 2009)

fayewolf said:


> How I usually eat shit:
> 
> When i was tired, not paying attention to details, forgot to have my board flat and catch a heel edge while doing a toeside turn, fell on hard packed ice, I cannot bring myself to attempt another turn
> 
> ...


 I would like to make the suggestion for you to start trying flat spins in both directions. If you already know how to do this practice them more. If not let us know, and can we can describe how to perform them. A flat spin will help increase your edge awareness and is a tool that I use in many of my lessons.

The other suggestion that I have is when you are practicing to start trying to make your turns withing a certain amount of space. Large turns, medium turns, small turns. For example pick a self set corridor down a green run that is no wider then say 20ft. or what ever size you want. On your next run change how wide the corridor is. Going larger or smaller. Make sure you are attempting to keep both toe and heelside turn symetrical. This task will help you vary when and how long you make your movements which will help you to build verastility in your riding. Plus the next time you hit a catwalk you should be able to adjust the size of your turn to accommadate the width of the catwalk.


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

Snowolf said:


> Please do not let this experience discourage you! I will share something straight out of the AASI teaching manual for instructors about this exact situation. As instructors we sometimes have a tendency to want to "reward" our students by getting them off the bunny slope. This usually is something the student is eager to do. Very often, in a desire to "reward" our student's hard work, we totally sabotage the entire lesson at the end by doing so.
> 
> It is very easy to overwhelm the progressing rider with more challenging terrain and a bad experience from fear, frustration or worse, an injury can become an insurmountable obstacle we just threw in front of our student. For this reason, I am always advising caution and slow, steady progression. The time to move to more difficult terrain is when you, the rider, become bored with what you doing on the terrain you are on.
> 
> ...


Snowolf, thank you thank you for your encouragement. I am not giving up at all. I just cannot believe I'm still falling this often! But honestly, I use to fall getting up, doing falling leaf, doing turns, now I fall because I'm challenging myself and linking turns, so I guess it's progress.

I think I was very frustrated that's why i said I wasted my whole day. Of course I didnt. I enjoyed every moment of it, I love being on the board, I love the experience. And although I was afraid of the steep, I didn't completely freak out. I know it's highly frowned upon, but I know worse come to worse, I can falling leaf down. 

The next day, we went our separate way and met up for lunch. Life was so much better, I am not afraid to link my turns on the green run (okay length, but still tiring to go up and down those slow lift chairs). I remembered you told me to try to make my turns more open ended turns, to make my S more narrow, so I tried practicing those. My toe side turns I can make them quite shallow, but my heel side is always wider. I "think" it is because going toe side is still a mental thing, the longer i spend on heel side, the better i feel (hehehe), it's like omg omg, i have to flatten the board and go toe side!

And OMG. after lunch, my plan was to take the shuttle back to hotel because I was working and at a conference. My hotel is a ski in and out hotel, the the run getting down to my hotel looks kinda scary, it's a blue. He insist that we need to ride on a ski lift together one last time so I let him convinced me again. Luckily, it wasn't too bad, and saved me some time not having to wait for the shuttle 
But yes, he needs to be dumped.


Next time, I will spend the whole day on a longer green run and practice my turns until I'm comfortable.


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

By the way, I was reading an old thread on how to avoid catching an edge, and read this:

Timing is critical and making damn sure the board has no side slip to it when you make the edge change.


I thought that when you're side slipping you're riding on an edge, but just really slowly?? No?
Maybe I don't understand what side slipping mean?

I always catch my heel edge when i'm on my toe side edge, was I side slipping? (this usually is when I'm finishing up my toe side turn or trying to initiate my heel side edge without paying attention, i dnot have the muscle memory yet)


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## Toecutter (Oct 11, 2009)

fayewolf said:


> By the way, I was reading an old thread on how to avoid catching an edge, and read this:
> 
> Timing is critical and making damn sure the board has no side slip to it when you make the edge change.
> 
> ...


I think it means that you want to be moving directly forward without sideslip before you make the edge change. So instead of going directly from a sideslip to the other edge, there should be a moment when you are going straight in line with the length of the board.


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

Snowolf said:


> Yep, this was a post where I was talking about carving and switching onto your downhill edge. The point I was making here was that your snowboard really does not care which edge is uphill or downhill; the only thing that matters is that when you go to make this positive (with both feet simultaneously) edge change in a carved turn, is that the board is tracking straight (tip to tail) and is not skidding or side slipping down the hill.
> 
> Another way to look at your edge in a skid or side slip is that one edge is the leading edge and one is the trailing edge, If you are in a heel side side slip down the hill, your heel edge is the trailing edge and you are on that edge. The toe side edge is the leading edge and if you were to suddenly drop it into the snow.....wham....face plant!
> 
> You are also riding on your edge ANYTIME you are snowboarding (or should be unless on a box or on the takeoff to a jump) The difference is how the board is traveling. In a carve, you are riding on the edge, but the board is not skidding or side slipping.



Aren't you also on an edge when you're carving? Is the difference between a carved turn and a skidded turn speed then? I felt like my toe side turn is always skidding, and my heel side turn leaves a smooth thin line so less skidding i suppose? My heel side turn is usually quite fast starting from me getting out of my toe side edge, all the way till my heel turn is complete. I can see a thinnish line on the snow. But then it gets really slow because i had to take the time to make sure my board is flat for a sec before i start dipping my shoulder to go onto my toe edge! Am i semi carving on heel turn then skid turn on my toe turn then? Is this normal for beginners?


Also on those flatter green runs, i felt like I either have to be pretty flat or use a very small edge angle otherwise i will get stuck. And i tend to fall in this situation. I really have to pay extra attention, and if there are any bumps and I'm my legs are not like noodles,then I'm screwed.


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

Thank you again!! I did do some garlands on my toeside on the green runs to force myself to spend more time on the toeside (really do not like them, but they seriously are less tiring, the first time I went through a long blue run, like 3 miles, imagine bleeding off speed by constantly applying heel pressure with my quads, i literally forced myself to sit down or else my legs will break off!!)
Now that I understand the diff between carved and skidded, basically my toe side turn is very very skidded. 
Yeah, i watched your cat track video before, and because it says intermediate, i didn't pay alot of attention, but i remember bits and pieces of it, I applied some of the technique on the cat track and it worked for a few turns (the carved one) and then when I got happy about it (maybe 15 seconds later), boom, fall down. But I'll re-watch them!


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## jlm1976 (Feb 26, 2009)

Fayewolf, 
I would look into taking another lesson, possibly a private if possible. Intructors are good at more than just technical advice. They can also be very good at figuring out when it's time to move on to a more difficult trail or just be that voice of encouragement as you are going down a blue trail for the first time and helping mitigate fear. And that is something that can't happen from advice on a forum.


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

That is a great idea, I'm thinking about doing one. I am going with a friend who has never been on a snowboard before and she said skiing was very difficult for her and she wants to take a lesson, but she doesn't want to do it alone. I can't sit thru another 2 hours of how to strap your boots and skate... i wonder if a semi private can accomdate both of us?


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## gjsnowboarder (Sep 1, 2009)

It would be pretty hard for the instructor to work with a person that can ride along with a person that can't ride. Maybe after the lesson gets up to the hill. I would recommend just taking a lesson at your level at the same time she does her. The probelm is to really help you the instructor has too see you ride and that will pretty hard to do when you are able to ride already the speed difference is really what makes the difference. By the way it should only take about 20- 45 mins for the skate to glide of bench to be ready to ride the lift for a normal lesson.


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## Toecutter (Oct 11, 2009)

fayewolf said:


> That is a great idea, I'm thinking about doing one. I am going with a friend who has never been on a snowboard before and she said skiing was very difficult for her and she wants to take a lesson, but she doesn't want to do it alone. I can't sit thru another 2 hours of how to strap your boots and skate... i wonder if a semi private can accomdate both of us?


I think you get more out of one-on-one instruction, so even a couple hours of private lesson would be worth it for you. Your friend could start with a group lesson. She would have the support of others beginners. I started with a group lesson and it involved a lot of time sitting and waiting, but it was actually really social and fun being with several adult first-timers. It was a slightly older group so there wasn't a lot of ego bruising going on, but rather a lot of hilarity laughing at ourselves.


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## john doe (Nov 6, 2009)

Send her to a group lesson while you take a private lesson then meet up after to see what she feels like doing.


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## firstx1017 (Jan 10, 2011)

fayewolf said:


> Vicki: I saw your video and I'm SUPER jealous! How you linked those turns so smoothly and effortlessly. My turns are really uneven. Sometimes i link them really quickly, sometimes it takes me forever and slowly. Yes, those blue runs are so freakn scary. I cannot for the life of me let the board go flat to initiate a turn, heart attack inducing indeed.I know how you feel on the steep slope. I was on top of one of the peak at emigrant peak and I sat there for the longest time wondering if I should just sit on my ass and slide down. I finally did the world's slowest record of falling leaf to get down....dumping friend and never going out with him again.


Fayewolf:

It sounds like you are still about where I am. Last weekend I was trying to make my turns more even. As much as I thought I was about the same time on my toe side as my heel side, when I see the video I see that I still don’t stay as long on my toe side as I do my heel side. Funny how what you THINK you are doing is actually different when you see yourself on video. My s-turns are pretty lopsided in the videos. 

I looked at the trail map for Squaw Valley and I see what you mean about the beginner lifts. They are pretty short and at the top of the mountain. I agree with Snowolf that you shouldn’t move to a higher hill until you are ready or bored with your current run you are working on. I got fed up with the bunny hill as you had to buckle up, skate to the lifts, take the slow chair lift, stress getting off the chairlift, strap back in, and go down the bunny hill for 2 minutes while dodging everyone only to go unstrap, skate and repeat the process. I finally decided I wanted a longer run so that I could actually try to link my turns and keep strapped in for awhile. In my mind I was ready to go to the next higher hill, which is considered an green run but is a mile long. And after my falling leafing it down the blue run last weekend, I know I still need to be a lot more comfortable on my current run before I want to tackle that blue with some s-turns. 

What I did find was a resort that has SEVERAL long green runs in Colorado. The longest is 2.8 miles so I booked us a short trip to have some fun there in March. I can’t wait! My original goal when I started the snowboard Thanksgiving 2010 was by the end of the season to just “falling leaf” it down the hill in my videos. I have totally surpassed what I thought I would do. But honestly, just cruising down a long green run at my age is just enough adrenaline rush for me! Ha ha Check out the trail map below for Copper Mountain. 

http://images.search.yahoo.com/imag...defhn&sigi=156lhvahe&sigb=123vr773i&fr=mcafee

We’re heading back up this weekend and I see you are too. Hopefully you’ll have a good weekend. Last weekend was the most fun I’ve had yet on the board!

Keep on shredding!
Vicki


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

Wow Vicki, that mountain looks amazing with alot of green runs, and seems like they are all connected!! As you can see from the squaw trail map, there really isn't much green runs at all. I did the Emmigrant all the way down to the village, i dont' even know how long that was, maybe 5 miles? then took a lift up to where I can ride down to my hotel. I thought I was going to die afterwards, so tired. Long green runs are the way to go for me. What does higher hill mean? Do you mean blue vs green?


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## thugit (Sep 29, 2009)

you should start trying some rails


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## firstx1017 (Jan 10, 2011)

fayewolf said:


> Wow Vicki, that mountain looks amazing with alot of green runs, and seems like they are all connected!! As you can see from the squaw trail map, there really isn't much green runs at all. I did the Emmigrant all the way down to the village, i dont' even know how long that was, maybe 5 miles? then took a lift up to where I can ride down to my hotel. I thought I was going to die afterwards, so tired. Long green runs are the way to go for me. What does higher hill mean? Do you mean blue vs green?


Here is the trail map from where we go each weekend. The bunny hill is the yellow area on the bottom left side. I then ventured to the green run (upper hill) called Summit Run. It is from the top of the mountain under the All Mountain Chair lift with green dashes. The next long run is Miracle Mile which is a blue run from the top of the mountain to the bottom. I have gone down that on skis, but was very uncomfortable with the steepness. Haven't ventured on it with the snowboard yet. The run I tried to falling leaf it last weekend was on the left side of the mountain, chair 10 - Perfect Pitches, that's the one where I just falling leafed down it. It was really steep for me at this point. But I am really looking forward to Copper Mountain and their loads of green runs - and who knows, maybe by March I can try a blue! lol

Snow Summit Trail Map


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## Jas86 (Jan 30, 2011)

Never give up!

When i started snowboarding, I was getting very frustrated. I had problems turning on the toe side, keeping balance and I really sucked, I would fall every ten meters. But then towards the end of the week, it's like the skill hit me all at once. I got the hang of turning, and I started linking turns naturally without even thinking about it (before i had to like plan when to turn and how) and it suddently because awesome. Keep on trying!:thumbsup::thumbsup:


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

Vicky: your mountain is incredible. I gotta try look for one that has these longer green runs. I was at squaw for work, I know that it isn't really a beginner's mountain, well, it got me used to how to survive in larger mountains and not to get lost when there are so many different trails leading down!
(trust me, I get lost getting out of my garage)

Jas86: Thank you! I won't give up, but it is in fact very frustrating. I still remember the first day waiting to take my first beginner lesson, I had an hour before lesson started, so i strap in one foot and try to glide around to see how it feels. CANNOT even do that, I was like holy shit... what did i get myself into. Very frustrated. I've made lots of progress from that point already, so I'm going to keep going. 
I promised myself that I shall be able to link my turns comfortably down the green runs by the end of this season. And not to fall 5 times before getting done with a run!


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## firstx1017 (Jan 10, 2011)

Fayewolf - each time you go I think you will notice some improvement keeping on the greens. Here's an example for me. My first time down Summit run was Xmas day falling leaf the whole way down with about three toe side turns thrown in when I had the courage to try. About in the middle of the run there is a small flat area that dumps into the steepest hill of the run. I usually heelside it most of the way before the hill to get set and work up the going to my toe side. Sunday, with no one around me, I actually heel sided/toe sided thru the whole section up to the hill. It was my first run of the day and as I am starting to feel more comfortable I gave it a try. I was able to do it two more times until the run got too crowded and I had to heelside to make it thru all the people.

YouTube - transition continued

You can hear my hubby on the video even noticed I continued thru - so as I said, I had a great weekend on the board last weekend and can tell I'm starting to feel more comfortable. 

p.s. I know the video is not textbook technique, but I am just happy to do more toeside/heelside and relax a little! lol

Vicki


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

firstx1017 said:


> Fayewolf - each time you go I think you will notice some improvement keeping on the greens. Here's an example for me. My first time down Summit run was Xmas day falling leaf the whole way down with about three toe side turns thrown in when I had the courage to try. About in the middle of the run there is a small flat area that dumps into the steepest hill of the run. I usually heelside it most of the way before the hill to get set and work up the going to my toe side. Sunday, with no one around me, I actually heel sided/toe sided thru the whole section up to the hill. It was my first run of the day and as I am starting to feel more comfortable I gave it a try. I was able to do it two more times until the run got too crowded and I had to heelside to make it thru all the people.
> 
> YouTube - transition continued
> 
> ...



Vicki,

I actually went back and look at your videos from the very first time and saw your really good steady progression, it's amazing!! I'm still stuck at around your 1/3 ish, the difference is mine is alot more inconsistent. Sometimes my toeside turn will come to a complete stop before I will flatten my board and change edge, but sometimes, I'll make my turns super shallow and "carve into my heel side really quickly", but vast majority of the time, my heel side turns are fast and wide. I think all due to my insecurity of the toe side. (not the initiation so much when it's on green, but to stay and get out of it)

Tahoe is quite far from me, i don't get to go as often as you do, but I'm planning to buy a board at the end of the season!


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## Kauila (Jan 7, 2011)

Fayewolf, try Sierra at Tahoe in South Lake. It has long green runs; the Sugar and Spice run is 2.5 miles long, I think, from top of the mountain to the bottom, well-marked with signage. Just avoid the Corkscrew trail (green run) joining Sugar and Spice--flat, narrow and lots of curves--doesn't sound good for where you're at. Only drawback to Sierra is that the parking lot fills up quickly on the weekends and traffic leaving South Lake is horrible going home, so arrive early and leave before the crowds at 4 pm. Go on a weekday if you can.


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## jjermzz (Sep 20, 2010)

Riding with experience people suck, period. They're mad the whole time cuz they dropped $50 on a pass and riding alone. 

What I did to learn. I made mental checklist on what to learn. So I learned, mastered j-turns(heel & toe), Garlands or falling leaf( heel and toe) then I C-Turned and ended with a J-turn. So I'd go on the top of the bunny hill and I would pick a side and do a giant C on my Heel or Toe and J-turn out on the same side I started. At the time I couldn't link yet. Then when I got comfy I linked it. I got most my tips from snowprofessor.com. 

So here the runthru it can take a day of riding/learning on the bunny. 


J-turn
Garland
C-Turn
Then Link it-when confident.

Once you link turns on the bunny go to the lift.

Try to go to a place with good snow. I don't go night riding either because my first riding experience ended with a concussion on a mountain that mainly had man-made snow with icy spot and I was riding at night. 

Riding with experience people suck, period. They're mad the whole time cuz they dropped $50+ on a pass and riding w/a beginner. 

Try this, I did it with my girlfriend. I told her to follow my line and after a whole day of sucking, she ended the day on a good note. She linked every single turn without falling. I think having a path to follow helps out because the pace I was going at. It reassured that she would be going the no faster then I was.

*If you don't want to catch an edge stay on you toes or edge. Never relax your feet thats when you catch it.


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

jjermzz said:


> Riding with experience people suck, period. They're mad the whole time cuz they dropped $50 on a pass and riding alone.
> 
> What I did to learn. I made mental checklist on what to learn. So I learned, mastered j-turns(heel & toe), Garlands or falling leaf( heel and toe) then I C-Turned and ended with a J-turn. So I'd go on the top of the bunny hill and I would pick a side and do a giant C on my Heel or Toe and J-turn out on the same side I started. At the time I couldn't link yet. Then when I got comfy I linked it. I got most my tips from snowprofessor.com.
> 
> ...


Yes, sucks so bad to ride with experience people. He also flew across the country to see me and it was ugly the first day. Some people has patience, he doesn't. 

I liked the idea of following a line, only if i have someone who will do that for me!! 

if i don't relax my feet, how do i get the board to go flat to change edge?? And this is exactly when I catch an edge.


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## kysnowboarder (Oct 28, 2009)

I still remember my first days of snowboarding 4 years ago. I struggled just as you did. The difference is I usually struggle with just about all sports I try to learn. I have never been a natural at anything except maybe struggling. Once you get it it is so worth it, you will fondly look back at these experiences and realize these struggles make the success so satisfying! This especially true with snowboarding. 

First, ditch the friend. When I first started I went with friends. They were patient but I knew they wanted to do green, blues and blacks (I didn't make it off the bunny hill my first time) I ask them to go off on there own while i learned. I found that this allowed me to focus on learning how to board instead of worring about someone waiting. Once I made it to the greens I would do a couple of runs with then ask them to go on there own...we would meet at lodge for lunch than separate again. I tell them this is the plan when inviting them or when I was invited. At the end of the night we do a couple greens together....I would use this as a measuring stick of my progression. 

Once get this it is so worth it and the experience is like none other. Those who never try or who give up don't have the first clue to what they are missing.


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## jjermzz (Sep 20, 2010)

fayewolf said:


> Yes, sucks so bad to ride with experience people. He also flew across the country to see me and it was ugly the first day. Some people has patience, he doesn't.
> 
> I liked the idea of following a line, only if i have someone who will do that for me!!
> 
> if i don't relax my feet, how do i get the board to go flat to change edge?? And this is exactly when I catch an edge.


I don't think the board is flat is actually twisted a bit.

Since im fat I can only standup on my board on my toeside. So my tips always begin toe edge.

When you practice the C-turns heel and toe, you'll learn. Look at the C your going to create on the slope l l.


Start with your toes. your goofy so go to your left side. so the C is backwards.
On the upper part of C you'll be on your toes.
To begin the turn start digging your front heel( not both.) you'll notice some steering. 
Don't wait till you get to the edge to start turning that when people get scared and throw themselves. 
Up until the mid-way point of the C start adding pressure to your back heel.
Then start riding on you heels. 
J-turn out to practice the C again.

Remember keep knees bent, not your body at the waist... You should be able to correct yourself from falling if your knees are bent. 

Don't wait until you get to the endside of the slope to start the turn. Thats when most people crash and burn. They get scared of the edgeline

I ask when you catch your edge how are you faceing on the slope -, \, )

And don't lean. Practice at the bunny slope.


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## fayewolf (Jan 3, 2011)

Snowolf said:


> What he means is to stay on edge except for that very brief split second when the board goes flat between the edge change. For your turns, if you are correctly using the torsional steering, you are not relaxing both feet at the same time. Front foot relaxes while the rear foot maintains uphill edge pressure. As the nose of the board drops down into the fall line, the front foot begins to pressure new edge as rear foot relaxes, then transitions right into pressure on the new edge. Its kind of like letting out the clutch as you are giving more gas.
> 
> Here is an exercise for you on really flat terrain to begin to try using both feet simultaneously:
> 
> ...



Does this work because it is a flat terrain? I initiate all my turns using the method you taught, using torsional steering. I can even feel the board twisting underneath my feet. When I am going straight from nose to tail, very briefly, the board is flat. (when you sliding straight tip to tail, i'm assuming you mean no edge is engage, the board is flat on snow, right?), I then dip my shoulder towards my front foot, and put pressure on my front foot (lean onto bindings, ball of front foot pressure down), and I can feel the board turning, (my rear foot is still in neutral position), then I add my rear foot pressure, hopefully to push my hip forward and at this point, both my heels are lifted with toe edge engaged. 
I do the same for my heel side turn. I let my front foot relax only, rear foot still engage in the toe edge so that I'm not freakn flying off the mountain, then when the board faces down the slope (tip to nose), i relax my rear foot as well so now I have a flat board on snow, safe to engage my heel side edge. 

I guess my question would be, when I relax my front foot while rear foot is still engaged in the up hill edge (toe), does the board has to be completely 90 degrees to the slope before I can relax my rear foot? In another word, do I relax my front foot to turn the board until that point then I release /relax my rear foot for a split second to prepare for edge change?

In your exercise:

When you have drifted to the edge of the trail and the board is turned no more than about 30 degrees across the track, squat down as if your going to sit or take a dump. This will then weight the heel side edge and cause you to enter a heel side drift. Hold this until the board has veered to the edge of the run ans no more than 30 degrees across the trail.

Do you mean I squat down while I'm still on toe side edge? And will this cause both of my heels to engage at the same time? Wouldn't this make me catch an edge or it won't because it is in a flat slope? Why is it that in this exercise, when you go directly to one edge to the other you won't catch edge?


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