# Mid Layers?



## Andrew Koranda (Oct 12, 2017)

What does everyone use for mid layers?

I bought a vest down mid layer and I'm just unsure of how it's going to perform with my base layer and jacket and what weather it'll be best for. Just need some outside information.


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

Andrew Koranda said:


> What does everyone use for mid layers?
> 
> I bought a vest down mid layer and I'm just unsure of how it's going to perform with my base layer and jacket and what weather it'll be best for. Just need some outside information.


If needed, I’ll just wear a fleece. Usually between 20 and -10f I’ll wear the base, the fleece and a shell. If it gets colder I’ll add a microdown.


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## Andrew Koranda (Oct 12, 2017)

Deacon said:


> If needed, I’ll just wear a fleece. Usually between 20 and -10f I’ll wear the base, the fleece and a shell. If it gets colder I’ll add a microdown.


Would you say then a down vest would not be needed unless lower than 0?


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

Andrew Koranda said:


> Would you say then a down vest would not be needed unless lower than 0?


That’s all preference. For me, no. I wear impact shorts which keep my rear warm on the chairs, and I run hot anyway. Also, first few really cold days you may need it and then you acclimate and don’t anymore.


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## Andrew Koranda (Oct 12, 2017)

Deacon said:


> That’s all preference. For me, no. I wear impact shorts which keep my rear warm on the chairs, and I run hot anyway. Also, first few really cold days you may need it and then you acclimate and don’t anymore.


Good to know. I've been looking for a fleece jacket in my area but that has been difficult to locate


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Depends on the individual and the conditions. IMO, mid-layers are where you can really save money. Just go with full synthetic fleece layers. Doesn't have to be anything fancy.


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## Andrew Koranda (Oct 12, 2017)

linvillegorge said:


> Depends on the individual and the conditions. IMO, mid-layers are where you can really save money. Just go with full synthetic fleece layers. Doesn't have to be anything fancy.


Any links to the fleece jackets you've used in the past? I'd be happy to save some coin by returning this down vest...


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

mid weight merino wool sweater


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0084AVVOM/ref=zg_bs_2476496011_1?ie=UTF8&refRID=REWXGSEZZZTWE5HVYVH6


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## phillyphan (Sep 22, 2016)

What I do is wear a cold heavywool quarter zip up over that. When I get hot I shed layer and put them in the back pack. First one I shed is the quarter zip. It has to be cold for that.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

I like merino or primaloft. My go to is a thin primaloft vest. If it's colder I add a mid weight merino sweater under the vest. Colder still I swap the vest out for a thicker primaloft jacket.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

What's the purpose of the vest? You gonna keep it in a backpack as layer u put on for breaks or long exposed windy lift rides? Or do you intend to get something to keep you warm while riding? For the first, downs are fine; for the latter, a thin primaloft vest more what you look for.

I only use downs to keep warm during breaks (i.e. not sweating). Downs dont handle humidity as well as synthetics like primaloft. I'd never use downs as a mid layer when riding. Downs clot when wet, loose insulation capacity. Plus washing a funky down item is pita. Thus you don't want down outware to be in contact with sweat :/

That said, my clothing strategy doesn't make use of midlayer vests for resort riding since I wear a backprotector vest then. When it gets very cold (below -15°C), I add a thin primaloft jacket because my shell jacket has no insulation at all, it's just a thin shell, therefore I go for midlayer jacket rather than vest cos if it's cold enough to need that additional layer around the torso, I also need it for the arms .


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## Paul Lower (Oct 1, 2017)

The key is being able to regulate your temp during the day, so breathable outwear with really good vents is good starting place. 

And a pro tip is to always keep a pair of merino liner gloves in a pocket. Makes a big difference if you're getting cold to boost the warmth of your hands (while being less to carry than another layer).

Also when either cold or hot, a thin light compression 1st layer for me does the best job of regulating moisture/temperature against the skin which really helps overall comfort.

My old jacket had a little bit of down in (just a bit of warmth on cold days but roomy enough to let the air flow on warm days) it and most cases I just wore a very thin base layer and a shirt underneath. On cold days added an extra merino base layer. In a 100 days that season I was comfortable pretty much all the time, just regulating with the vents. And that included all conditions while both shredding and a fair bit of standing around during training also.


With a shell jacket I've just tended to layer up extra base layers and a t-shirt/shirt/thin hoody/thick hoody.

I'm also considering getting thin down mid layer though. Mainly because when hiking offpiste you tent to need to shed layers on the way up. Down is the lightest, most packable option and a vest is easy to remove. Will be a very thin one though and probably won't see general use.


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## Fiddsy (Jul 12, 2015)

Conditions depending, either my fleece jumper or down jacket.

Legs i wear light compression skins under my goretex pants and if its really cold i'll put on my icebreaker legless (3/4) thermal pants, they sit just above my boots so no extra material in my boots..

Top i'll wear a light thermal (200) merino wool base layer, either my down or fleece jumper (tho on a few very cold occasions i have worn both) and my goretex shell over the top.
Actually wear the down with the shell the most because its bloody comfortable!


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

Andrew Koranda said:


> Any links to the fleece jackets you've used in the past? I'd be happy to save some coin by returning this down vest...


Best mid layer ever in my opinion. 
https://www.evo.com/outlet/syntheti...RmSXzvPNyaoFcdK-172f7axP8UtFz82RoCxAsQAvD_BwE

I usually wear a very thin short sleeve merino 90 shirt under this and a shell over. Almost always perfect, wicks sweat and keeps my relatively dry.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

^Yes..very thin merino base layer, mid weight merino sweater and good breathable gortex shell with well designed venting. Also use a merino skull cap under the helmet and merino neck gaiter can be the secret sauce. Then mix/match on/off for a ton of options. If I'm too hot or even sweaty damp...open the appropriate vents and wham...dry within 1/2 run.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

wrathfuldeity said:


> ^Yes..very thin merino base layer, mid weight merino sweater and good breathable gortex shell with well designed venting. Also use a merino skull cap under the helmet and merino neck gaiter can be the secret sauce. Then mix/match on/off for a ton of options. If I'm too hot or even sweaty damp...open the appropriate vents and wham...dry within 1/2 run.


The hood on the r1 is fitted and replaces the need for a beanie or skull cap. It also keeps the drafts from going down your neck. Then when I get too hot, pull the hood off and stuff it away. Win/win


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

Andrew Koranda said:


> Would you say then a down vest would not be needed unless lower than 0?


Down vest would be like -10


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## Andrew Koranda (Oct 12, 2017)

neni said:


> What's the purpose of the vest? You gonna keep it in a backpack as layer u put on for breaks or long exposed windy lift rides? Or do you intend to get something to keep you warm while riding? For the first, downs are fine; for the latter, a thin primaloft vest more what you look for.
> 
> I only use downs to keep warm during breaks (i.e. not sweating). Downs dont handle humidity as well as synthetics like primaloft. I'd never use downs as a mid layer when riding. Downs clot when wet, loose insulation capacity. Plus washing a funky down item is pita. Thus you don't want down outware to be in contact with sweat :/
> 
> That said, my clothing strategy doesn't make use of midlayer vests for resort riding since I wear a backprotector vest then. When it gets very cold (below -15°C), I add a thin primaloft jacket because my shell jacket has no insulation at all, it's just a thin shell, therefore I go for midlayer jacket rather than vest cos if it's cold enough to need that additional layer around the torso, I also need it for the arms .





ridinbend said:


> Best mid layer ever in my opinion.
> https://www.evo.com/outlet/syntheti...RmSXzvPNyaoFcdK-172f7axP8UtFz82RoCxAsQAvD_BwE
> 
> I usually wear a very thin short sleeve merino 90 shirt under this and a shell over. Almost always perfect, wicks sweat and keeps my relatively dry.



Damn guys! Awesome response on this! I definitely learned a thing or two. I'll be returning the down vest. I bought it thinking it would keep me warm and still allow movement. The down jackets seemed a little restrictive without going to a huge size but I could be wrong. I'll give some of those other base layers a try. I have a few base layers right now, but I guess I didn't really consider doubling up base layers. I'm going to run through all my gear today and see what works together.


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## sam_crisp (Sep 8, 2017)

I wear a thin merino base layer and then a wool sweater that I've had for ages. I got it at a thrift store and the thing is bullet proof yet warm and breathable. If it's extra cold I'll add a quarter zip synthetic shirt over the merino and under the sweater. 

But I run cold. Everyone's posts are full of useful information.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Andrew Koranda said:


> Damn guys! Awesome response on this! I definitely learned a thing or two. I'll be returning the down vest. I bought it thinking it would keep me warm and still allow movement. The down jackets seemed a little restrictive without going to a huge size but I could be wrong. I'll give some of those other base layers a try. I have a few base layers right now, but I guess I didn't really consider doubling up base layers. I'm going to run through all my gear today and see what works together.


Keep in mind that snowboarding is a sport. Your body will produce a lot of heat. Work with rather thin layers until you worked out how many of them you need.

Also... sweating is one of the major reasons which make for being cold. Buy stuff which wickens/evaporates the sweat. Wearing too many thick insulating layers can make one cold... they're good for breaks or if it's windy AND ice cold, but on days above -15°C, I only wear a thin merino base, a thin fleece, the backprotector vest and the thin gore tex shell. That's it, and I'm a girl who always is rather cold. The shell keeps the wind off and keeps the warmth the body produces from moving. 

If I face long chair lift rides exposed to wind and w/o sunshine? I'll add the thin primaloft. 

Only if it's below that temp, heavily windy and I face long waiting imes in shades I consider wearing a thin down jacket cos the likelyhood of sweating is very low.

If you frequently use a backpack in cold, the BD deployment is one of my favourite pieces http://eu.blackdiamondequipment.com...QD_cfg.html#cgid=mens-jackets-shells&start=17
It has insulation at the front but none at the back. Avoids that you sweat at the back where the backpack makes for insulation already.


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## Andrew Koranda (Oct 12, 2017)

neni said:


> Keep in mind that snowboarding is a sport. Your body will produce a lot of heat. Work with rather thin layers until you worked out how many of them you need.
> 
> Also... sweating is one of the major reasons which make for being cold. Buy stuff which wickens/evaporates the sweat. Wearing too many thick insulating layers can make one cold... they're good for breaks or if it's windy AND ice cold, but on days above -15°C, I only wear a thin merino base, a thin fleece, the backprotector vest and the thin gore tex shell. That's it, and I'm a girl who always is rather cold. The shell keeps the wind off and keeps the warmth the body produces from moving.
> 
> ...



Right, I'm familiar with that part. I just don't have much experience with down vests or jackets. Last year I wore a base layer from under armour which worked well but I used a sweatshirt for a mid layer and was not pleased, thus why I am changing. It was also my first year snowboarding so I didn't want to get super crazy until I knew it was a sport I wanted to pursue more.

It's great to see all this information. Gives a good base line of what to go off of.


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## JohnnyKruick (Aug 30, 2017)

I pretty much just wear a thermal long sleeve and a t shirt under my jacket and it's plenty warm. On really cold days (15F and under) I'll wear one of my real thin long sleeve fleece layers from when I played college baseball with a t shirt or dry fit t shirt under that. Depending how hard you ride you'll produce plenty of body heat.


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## Andrew Koranda (Oct 12, 2017)

JohnnyKruick said:


> I pretty much just wear a thermal long sleeve and a t shirt under my jacket and it's plenty warm. On really cold days (15F and under) I'll wear one of my real thin long sleeve fleece layers from when I played college baseball with a t shirt or dry fit t shirt under that. Depending how hard you ride you'll produce plenty of body heat.


For sure. A buddy and I were at Winter Park last year in Colorado and were riding the backside of the mountain. There was minimal wind block and the lifts were pretty exposed. Probably the coldest I've ever been on the mountain. I want to say it was around 20F that day. I want to avoid freezing my ass off on a lift again. Granted, it wasn't unbearable but it was not pleasant. Lol.


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## JohnnyKruick (Aug 30, 2017)

Andrew Koranda said:


> For sure. A buddy and I were at Winter Park last year in Colorado and were riding the backside of the mountain. There was minimal wind block and the lifts were pretty exposed. Probably the coldest I've ever been on the mountain. I want to say it was around 20F that day. I want to avoid freezing my ass off on a lift again. Granted, it wasn't unbearable but it was not pleasant. Lol.


Ya that makes sense haha. In the Rockies you guys are definitely subject to colder temps and in general more wind so that's understandable. Here at Stevens it's usually between 20-30F and below 20 is considered cold lmao probably why I get away with such skimpy base layers/mid layers.

Of course a couple Rainiers always helps too! :drinking:


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## Andrew Koranda (Oct 12, 2017)

JohnnyKruick said:


> Ya that makes sense haha. In the Rockies you guys are definitely subject to colder temps and in general more wind so that's understandable. Here at Stevens it's usually between 20-30F and below 20 is considered cold lmao probably why I get away with such skimpy base layers/mid layers.
> 
> Of course a couple Rainiers always helps too! :drinking:


Ha yes. Shit was cold! That definitely makes a lot of sense. I picked up a fleece jacket last night from a local sporting goods so I'll give that a whirl. Worse case scenario, I'll double up base layers.

Definitely much happier with the fleece jacket since it was $35 bucks (minus $10 for a coupon I had) verse the down vest was $80...


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

for midlayers i have 

-homeschool cocona puffy

-patagonia nano puff

-a merino sweater


I like the Nano until i got the HomeSchool. The Patagonia is like wearing a garbage bag in breathability comparison, and there is just more puff volume to the cocona when it gets cold.

the merino sweater is king. u can fuck everything else up and not get cold wearing it.

stay breathable unless u dont sweat.


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## Gregor Mahler (Jan 18, 2017)

any of you using Arcteryx Atom LT Hoody as mid? read great things about


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