# Arbor Grip Tech vs Lib Tech Magne Traction?



## bamadc (Feb 21, 2017)

I'm in the market for a new board primarily for the east coast, Snowshoe Mountain, WV. I spent the weekend demoing Lib Tech Skate Banana, Gnu Metal Gnuru, NS Snowtrooper, but was unable to demo anything Arbor (Westmark Camber is what I'm circling). The magne traction was awesome, it lets you shred the mountain with confidence, however, it seemed a little too grippy at times. The NS was nice and surfy like my current Ride, but I'm looking for something with a little more grip than what I already have in the quiver. Arbor Grip Tech has 5 less contact points than Mervin's Magne Traction and 2 more than NS and Ride. Does Arbor's Grip Tech make a difference? Is Arbor grippy enough for some of the east coast hard conditions?


----------



## quebecrider (Dec 10, 2014)

I have a westmark rocker and for a rocker, it holds an edge and brakes really well on icy terrain. I ride in southern Quebec so we get a lot of rain and thaw/freeze especially those 2 last winters, so I know my ice well and grip-tech works well on it hahah. Out of curiosity, what board are you looking at?


----------



## SnowDragon (Apr 23, 2012)

quebecrider said:


> Out of curiosity, what board are you looking at?


He said Westmark Camber in his post.


----------



## bamadc (Feb 21, 2017)

I'm trying to decide between Lib Tech T. Rice or Skate Banana and the Arbor Westmark Camber.


----------



## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Griptech and Mag are two different techs. Mag follows a traditional sidecut with chunks scooped out. The virtual sidecut follows the bump peaks. Griptech is actually at a naturally occurring junction between the different radii of a tri-radial sidecut. So Griptech functions much in the same way the contact points out at your tips do since they're true terminations of a sidecut radius. 

Overall I just think the Westmark is a better board and one on my list as a quiver killer for someone riding 50/50 park/all mountain or someone just looking for a little bit more playful all mountain freestyle deck.


----------



## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

bamadc said:


> I'm trying to decide between overpriced meh or a dayglow kids toy and a proper snowboard.


Fixed that for you.


----------



## bamadc (Feb 21, 2017)

Snow Hound said:


> Fixed that for you.


hahahah...so what's your recommendation for a playful all-mountain board in hard snow? This will be my second board purchase, so I'm all ears.


----------



## bamadc (Feb 21, 2017)

Nivek said:


> Griptech and Mag are two different techs. Mag follows a traditional sidecut with chunks scooped out. The virtual sidecut follows the bump peaks. Griptech is actually at a naturally occurring junction between the different radii of a tri-radial sidecut. So Griptech functions much in the same way the contact points out at your tips do since they're true terminations of a sidecut radius.
> 
> Overall I just think the Westmark is a better board and one on my list as a quiver killer for someone riding 50/50 park/all mountain or someone just looking for a little bit more playful all mountain freestyle deck.


awesome. Thanks makes a ton of sense after riding Mervin boards all weekend.


----------



## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

bamadc said:


> hahahah...so what's your recommendation for a playful all-mountain board in hard snow? This will be my second board purchase, so I'm all ears.


No the Westmark Camber sounds perfect (the proper snowboard) but I have no firsthand experience of it. I have a Lago Double Barrel which seems to hold a decent edge despite having no edge tech - great board for what you're looking at. I have a Burton Custom Camber that would also be good. I like Yes so a Basic, Standard or Greats. Too many to mention, all of which make the Skate Banana look like a kids toy and all Libs look over priced.


----------



## Fergatron2000 (Jun 6, 2012)

*Grip Tech is radness*

Been riding Gnu boards for decades. Loved magnatraction when came out. Still think it makes shitty days fun days and helps significantly in layers of variable terrain with steep exposures like you see here in the PNW. 

Picked up a Coda Camber this year and was really impressed with the GripTech. Nivek's technical description is spot on. Functionally it means the grip points (bumps) are right at your feet. This makes them immediately usable with less risk of catchiness out at the tips. Although I've never been in the BTX is too catchy camp, I can see how it would be to some. To me GripTech shines in steep bumpy terrain. Feels like it rips into the bump and chop like a saw and really increases your command when making turns. 

I rode a Coda Rocker for a half season 2 years ago and didn't think much of the GripTech. Maybe it works best on camber decks. The Mervin C2 profiles need magnatraction IMHO. And they are also rad IMHO. If you're looking at the Westmark from Arbor, then look at the Riders Choice for Gnu. The asym heelside cut on that board is another technical design feature that actually enhances your ride.


----------



## Kenai (Dec 15, 2013)

Earlier this season I picked up a Westmark camber; then a few weeks ago I got a Gnu Billy Goat. I don't have a ton of days on either - maybe 7 on the Westmark and 3 on the BG. I ride eastern man-made snow in New England. 

My opinion is that the BG has a lot more edgehold, but magnetraction is only part of that story as the profile is a bit different and the flex is very different. I feel much more comfortable charging on ice or crud on the BG as it is much stiffer and eats it all up. For my riding style it carves a lot better, though the Westmark carves well if the conditions are slightly softer and at a bit slower speeds. 

As Nivek said, the Westmark is a good-great all-around board with a significant focus on freestyle. A stiffer magnetraction board may be better if you want to ride and carve harder with less of a focus on freestyle performance.

When you say you want "playful" what does that mean? Are you hitting the park?


----------



## bamadc (Feb 21, 2017)

Fergatron2000 said:


> Been riding Gnu boards for decades. Loved magnatraction when came out. Still think it makes shitty days fun days and helps significantly in layers of variable terrain with steep exposures like you see here in the PNW.
> 
> Picked up a Coda Camber this year and was really impressed with the GripTech.
> 
> I rode a Coda Rocker for a half season 2 years ago and didn't think much of the GripTech. Maybe it works best on camber decks.


So if you were looking to add a second board and you already had a traditional stiff camber would you go Arbor Camber or Mervin C2?


----------



## bamadc (Feb 21, 2017)

Kenai said:


> When you say you want "playful" what does that mean? Are you hitting the park?


I just started hitting jumps in the park, but would not say I'm 50/50 park/mountain. I mean more all-moiuntain playfulness with butters/presses, switch, ollies, etc. I would say my style is starting to lean aggressive all-mountain freestyle, but my current Ride is as stiff as a 2x4.


----------



## Kenai (Dec 15, 2013)

If you already have a stiff board and want something more playful, the Westmark will be great. On true icy days it would not be my first choice because I don't think it has pure edge hold on eastern ice as good as a magnetraction board, but it is not bad and it's a very versatile board.


----------



## Fergatron2000 (Jun 6, 2012)

bamadc said:


> So if you were looking to add a second board and you already had a traditional stiff camber would you go Arbor Camber or Mervin C2?


Tough one. I like to take a couple boards to the hill and swap out profiles. So I'd probably get a midflex Mervin C2 (ala Riders Choice) just for the variation. Eventually I'd get both because I have a gear problem.


----------



## zc1 (Feb 20, 2017)

Kenai said:


> Earlier this season I picked up a Westmark camber; then a few weeks ago I got a Gnu Billy Goat. I don't have a ton of days on either - maybe 7 on the Westmark and 3 on the BG. I ride eastern man-made snow in New England.
> 
> My opinion is that the BG has a lot more edgehold, but magnetraction is only part of that story as the profile is a bit different and the flex is very different. I feel much more comfortable charging on ice or crud on the BG as it is much stiffer and eats it all up. For my riding style it carves a lot better, though the Westmark carves well if the conditions are slightly softer and at a bit slower speeds.
> 
> ...


I agree with this. Although I haven't ridden the Billy Goat, I do own a Lib-Tech Hot Knife (C3 profile as well). It holds like nothing else I've ridden. It's my go-to board if conditions are very icy; recently that's a lot of the time, today being no exception. The board never ceases to amaze me with how easy it is to get it to hook up and hold when you want it to, but also mellow out and be playful when you want it to do that. It was my first Mervin board, bought for 50% off as a leftover from the previous season, and has exceeded my expectations in a big way.


----------



## NYSKYHI (Dec 18, 2015)

bamadc said:


> I'm in the market for a new board primarily for the east coast, Snowshoe Mountain, WV. I spent the weekend demoing Lib Tech Skate Banana, Gnu Metal Gnuru, NS Snowtrooper, but was unable to demo anything Arbor (Westmark Camber is what I'm circling). The magne traction was awesome, it lets you shred the mountain with confidence, however, it seemed a little too grippy at times. The NS was nice and surfy like my current Ride, but I'm looking for something with a little more grip than what I already have in the quiver. Arbor Grip Tech has 5 less contact points than Mervin's Magne Traction and 2 more than NS and Ride. Does Arbor's Grip Tech make a difference? Is Arbor grippy enough for some of the east coast hard conditions?


I started off with two Lib Techs (Hot KNife and Attack Banana) this season and then an Arbor Iguchi Pro Camber. Utilizing Union Atlas bindings 

1) LIb Tech Hot knife- I found this board way too catchy. It trenched out the hard packed surfaces but I never felt confident bombing hills because of the constant catching of the contact points. 

2)Lib Tech Attack banana- More forgiving than the hot knife with regards to the catching issue, but I still was not loving how it felt unstable bombing hills. Maybe it's my lack of experience (3 years) but I've heard several people complain about the instability feeling. The heel to toe transfer time was not very speedy either. 

3) Bryan Iguchi Pro Camber- I really really like this board! Handles the North East conditions surprisingly well. IT has the capacity to 'grip' the hard pack and slick conditions that the North East is accustomed to. This board is also very responsive, making moguls and trees much more manageable. I also feel much more stable at high speeds versus the Lib Techs.


----------



## bamadc (Feb 21, 2017)

NYSKYHI said:


> I started off with two Lib Techs (Hot KNife and Attack Banana) this season and then an Arbor Iguchi Pro Camber. Utilizing Union Atlas bindings
> 
> 1) LIb Tech Hot knife- I found this board way too catchy. It trenched out the hard packed surfaces but I never felt confident bombing hills because of the constant catching of the contact points.
> 
> ...


I had similar feelings when bombing the mountain, just waiting for one of the 14 contact points to catch. I wasn't sure if this was just in my head or experience level, but it's good to have some validation. I too preferred the Banana (skate) over the the stiffer Mervin profile. Super fun as long as you're not trying to catch up with friends down mountain. I've hear the Grip Tech takes some getting used to - BS? or is it a different feel to engage with your edge?


----------



## jerry gnarcia (Feb 11, 2017)

Anything Mervin makes that is not C3 is terrible on hardpack. That goes for any board that has reverse camber between the inserts. You can ride it, sure, but I think after riding something like a C3 or the Iguchi or Westmark (camber), you'll wonder why so many people are buying C2 or BTX boards for firm snow days. As you bomb past them with your eyes closed, you'll feel like you're in on a secret that they all don't know about yet. 

As you can see though this thread already has sharply differing opinions, so the only way to find out is to try it yourself.


----------



## Fergatron2000 (Jun 6, 2012)

Flat basing and hauling ass on hard snow is going to feel squirrely on just about any board with center rocker like a Mervin C2. With C2 you gotta really get to know when you need to be on edge. There's a learning curve there for sure when the center pivot wants the board to turn and the magnatraction feels like its waiting to hook you into a nasty crash. Once you get used to it though it's not an issue. 

Mervin decks make a lot of sense in the PNW where heavy chunder and unexpected icy exposures abound. Once you get the feel for the C2 profile it can really rip up this type of variable terrain. I buy no board for riding on ice. But for predictable consistently hard conditions I'd go with full camber. The bonus on the GripTech is that it works so well with a traditional full camber profile and lifted contact points to reduce the hook of traditional camber. And yes you have to adjust to where the contact points are, but that takes like 2 runs.


----------



## NYSKYHI (Dec 18, 2015)

Fergatron2000 said:


> Flat basing and hauling ass on hard snow is going to feel squirrely on just about any board with center rocker like a Mervin C2. With C2 you gotta really get to know when you need to be on edge. There's a learning curve there for sure when the center pivot wants the board to turn and the magnatraction feels like its waiting to hook you into a nasty crash. Once you get used to it though it's not an issue.
> 
> Mervin decks make a lot of sense in the PNW where heavy chunder and unexpected icy exposures abound. Once you get the feel for the C2 profile it can really rip up this type of variable terrain. I buy no board for riding on ice. But for predictable consistently hard conditions I'd go with full camber. The bonus on the GripTech is that it works so well with a traditional full camber profile and lifted contact points to reduce the hook of traditional camber. And yes you have to adjust to where the contact points are, but that takes like 2 runs.


Thanks for clarification regarding the Mervin and the learning curve. I was second guessing myself about why I was feeling squirrely. 

I'm having such a blast with the grip tech full camber system. The full camber was the standard back in the day from what I learned recently.


----------



## Fergatron2000 (Jun 6, 2012)

NYSKYHI said:


> Thanks for clarification regarding the Mervin and the learning curve. I was second guessing myself about why I was feeling squirrely.
> 
> I'm having such a blast with the grip tech full camber system. The full camber was the standard back in the day from what I learned recently.


Rad! The lifted contact points on the Arbor camber profile really eliminated the sometimes shitty part of true camber. No free lunch though, there is a a point when during long drawn out hard carves on groomers that you just don't have that last 10% of drive out on the tips. I'd take that trade off any day for the benefits of the griptech and lifted tips. Hope you get a chance to ride some steeps in soft snow. The sidecut just saws into the terrain and turns as quick as you could want without sacrificing control. Coda will probably edge out the Westmark here due to flex, but still should have some similarity.


----------



## NYSKYHI (Dec 18, 2015)

Fergatron2000 said:


> Rad! The lifted contact points on the Arbor camber profile really eliminated the sometimes shitty part of true camber. No free lunch though, there is a a point when during long drawn out hard carves on groomers that you just don't have that last 10% of drive out on the tips. I'd take that trade off any day for the benefits of the griptech and lifted tips. Hope you get a chance to ride some steeps in soft snow. The sidecut just saws into the terrain and turns as quick as you could want without sacrificing control. Coda will probably edge out the Westmark here due to flex, but still should have some similarity.


how do you think the Iguchi pro camber will handle that pow? I am thinking about a west coast trip in the next week or two. Not sure if this is the board for Jackson Hole.


----------



## Fergatron2000 (Jun 6, 2012)

NYSKYHI said:


> how do you think the Iguchi pro camber will handle that pow? I am thinking about a west coast trip in the next week or two. Not sure if this is the board for Jackson Hole.


Haven't ridden the Guch, but a lot of peeps here seem to love it for big mtn/pow. It's directional with modest taper so it should be nice in pow. Lifted contact points but no rocker to the nose. I personally like some rise on the nose for a surfy feel in pow without back legging it. Coda is a twin so it has a limit in terms of deeper pow. When it's heavy and stacked up over 5-6" I have found I have to get back too far or the nose just gets tugged under. At that point I grab the Barracuda. The Guch could address this with the setback and taper. Might be a review or 2 on the Guch in the forums.


----------

