# how soon to tweak stance again? intermediate



## XxGoGirlxX (Jan 15, 2016)

How many days should I keep with a particular stance tweak before moving on to another tweak? Shifts in foot direction (1-2 tick marks per day) I feel like I adjust to right away so far but today widened my stance 2 screw patterns on forward foot and did not ride well... not necessarily due to stance change thou so how long should I stick with it before changing?

Edit: I am new to changing my stance around, first time changing width. Thanks !


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## Psicko (Dec 26, 2015)

In my opinion, if the change feels off to you, change the stance. You could also try and figure out why you weren't riding that well. Since you adjusted it two marks forward, maybe try to take it back one mark. The key is to not change too many things at once, so you can narrow down what works and what doesn't work better.

Was there something wrong with your previous width that made you want to move your front foot forward two marks?

Im usually the type that once I find a good stance/degree setup, I leave it.


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

Personally I know better when my stance is NOT in the right position. I will have a nagging feeling of I wish my foot were over there kind of feeling, then after a few days I'll get the motivation to move it.
Another good rule of thumb I never even knew I used until someone here pointed it out is the sum of your stance angles should not be over 45, omit the - if your duck. Mine feel right at +21 -15 (39) for example.

As far as width goes your board might have felt weird because you only moved the front binding and were not centered anymore. Maybe try moving the back binding back one and the front up one screw from your original position, that is assuming you were centered before. If I were to move one binding it would always be the back. At any rate once you get the right feeling in width bust out a measuring tape and measure from the center of each baseplate and use that number to center your stance in the future. If you have reference points by the inserts use those otherwise just center symmetrically. Basically feet closer together you can initiate turns faster, feet farther apart means more stability. There is a happy medium in there somewhere.

Then again even moving your feet from a position that your used to but is not your ideal position to the ideal position will feel weird at first but you'll know it's right withing a few runs or at least on that day.

So to answer your question, a day should be sufficient to test out that tweak and see if you like it. You might need a few days to do the fine tuning tho, but at that point you should be tweaking one notch.

But once you get your feet angled right and the width dialed it should all just feel natural like peeing outside...Oh wait.


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

freshy said:


> Personally I know better when my stance is NOT in the right position….
> 
> *….As far as width goes your board might have felt weird because you only moved the front binding and were not centered anymore.* Maybe try moving the back binding back one and the front up one screw from your original position, that is assuming you were centered before.


_This_ was the first thing that came to my mind also upon reading your post! 

If you only moved one binder to change your stance width, you are now riding with your feet no longer centered in the sidecut of the board. _THAT_ could feel really wonky!!!

I agree with Freshy also in that you are probably more likely to notice it immediately when any particular change is *NOT* working out. It will usually just feel,… _wrong_ :blink: right from the git-go!! In those instances, change it back right away! (…sometimes a bad {_or even a good_} change will feel only a _"little"_ wierd.) Like changing to a tad _too_ much or _too_ little fwd lean, etc! In those cases it perfectly OK to take a bit more time riding with the change to determine if it's something you find ultimately helps, or hinders your performance!

In any case, when making changes and adjustments to one's set-up. It's generally best to change things in small(ish) increments *and* only one type of adjustment at a time. (i.e. binding angles, fwd lean, stance, etc!) If you go and change several of those adjustments all at once? You won't know which of those changes has made things better or worse! :shrug: 

BTW,.. not sure if you're aware of this, but _most_ (…not all, but most) decks have a "reference mark" between the inserts that lets you know where the boards center point for stance is!! It's usually something like a small symbol. A star, diamond, company logo, etc. Occasionally it's just some text.

This is the starting point for changing your stance width and keeping it centered within the boards sidecut! Put that mark so it is visible right in the middle of the bindings baseplate and adjust Both binders in or out by an equal numbers of inserts when mounting them! 

Good luck and Happy Shredding!! :hairy:


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

some great advice here, but I would say if a specific stance feels really wrong and if you have a pocket tool, then one run is all I would do if I knew that the stance was bad.


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## XxGoGirlxX (Jan 15, 2016)

freshy said:


> Basically feet closer together you can initiate turns faster, feet farther apart means more stability. There is a happy medium in there somewhere.


This is the question I did not ask but needed to know so thanks  
I Went 2 notches forward with front foot only because default stance has a long nose and short tail so I figured better to widen forward than back. 

I decided to try wider because I need to be able to be more aware of my alignment, I saw my first ever pic of myself riding and it was ugggggly 100% out of alignment lol prob just a fluke pic at the wrong second (telling myself that anyhow). I felt great at narrower with faster turns but making myself adapt and use different muscles. Wider = more stability = needed for...what? besides if you feel unstable? Thanks 
Edit: everything is so natural and habit based or happens so fast that I am having trouble feeling whether I initiate carves with my front leg for example, or have good body positioning or not.


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

XxGoGirlxX said:


> This is the question I did not ask but needed to know so thanks
> I Went 2 notches forward with front foot only because default stance has a long nose and short tail so I figured better to widen forward than back.
> 
> I decided to try wider because I need to be able to be more aware of my alignment, I saw my first ever pic of myself riding and it was ugggggly 100% out of alignment lol prob just a fluke pic at the wrong second (telling myself that anyhow). I felt great at narrower with faster turns but making myself adapt and use different muscles. Wider = more stability = needed for...what? besides if you feel unstable? Thanks
> Edit: everything is so natural and habit based or happens so fast that I am having trouble feeling whether I initiate carves with my front leg for example, or have good body positioning or not.


In a nutshell wider stance for more stability for taking off and landing jumps, easier to butter pretty much wide is good for freestyle stuff, think park rats. Where as euro carvers would be closer together because all they do is make turns and never take any jumps. At least that's my take on it. Most people fit somewhere in the middle, you just need to decide what your riding style is going to be and adjust accordingly, or whatever is comfortable. Little over shoulder width apart would be a good starting point.

What kind of board do you have anyway? By the sounds of it you have a directional freeride board. And where are your bindings set? Your stance should be centered and symmetrical with your inserts so would look something like this where ^ is your bindings
:::^::____::^::: 2 inserts from mid board to each binding

If you need to widen do like this
::^:::____:::^:: 3 inserts from mid board to each binding

If the first one is too close and the second too wide I would say do this
::^:::____::^:::> (nose) Little more set back on the rear binding as opposed to set forward on the front binding.

Basically setting it up like that will center you on your side cut which is where you want to be, but it won't necessarily be the center of the board unless your board is a true twin. 

And yeah I hear you on the it happens so fast or habit based stuff. You really need to consciously think about your body position and if your feet feel like they want to angle out more or go wider whatever your body is telling you to get a little more comfortable. 
Like anything else practice makes perfect. One day you'll be like sweet I got it and the next you won't have it anymore. Eventually you will rock all over the mountain so just keep at it.

I came across this vid and thought it might be helpful to you. Was trying to find that thread where you and some other guy were talking about eurocarving to post it there but I dunno where I saw it. It was mainly for you anyway, this should help a lot with body position and get you carving proper.


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

*This is only about 1/4 of the "Full" carving tut but,...*

This is only a small part of the SA carving tut I wanted you to see. I think this clip is good because it shows you how to create the proper body positioning to get the edging necessary for a good carve! 






-edit-
This is another short free sample from SA that I think might help you. You have mentioned you aren't really sure how good your form & technique is. This tut is for riders that are probably doing pretty good at getting around the resort, but who's technique might be limiting them in their progression!

I thought it might be worth checking out,..


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## ekb18c (Mar 11, 2013)

A wider stance also helps you get in position better for turns. If your stance is too narrow you may not bend your knees as much and tend to stand up straight (straight legs) but if the stance was wider, you are forced to bend your knees a little more. 

It's really personal preference and what feels natural to you. I think my stance is not the norm as I'm 5'6 and my stance is usually around 23 inches.


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## XxGoGirlxX (Jan 15, 2016)

Thank you gents ! It will prob take me some time before I can review thoroughly and respond, much appreciated and I'm working on it  Freshy I ride a Burton Feather will sent pics of setup when I can for clarity, what adorable little diagrams LOL


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

Stance varies for everyone. My wife prefers a really narrow stance. Almost as narrow as the board will allow, 19 inches? Her angles are minimal at 9,-6 and the funny thing ous I've done tons of adkustments to try to help and she always knows. There's no reason to ride the adjustment if it doesn't feel right. Keep changing it and eventually you'll find the happy place that feels right when you ride.


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## CassMT (Mar 14, 2013)

i'd give it 1 or 2 runs , at most. trust your gut.

at some point if it's painfree you just have to settle on something and go with it though, focus on the riding and forget about...everything


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

CassMT said:


> i'd give it 1 or 2 runs , at most. trust your gut.
> 
> at some point if it's painfree you just have to settle on something and go with it though, focus on the riding and forget about...everything


This is a VERY good point! Your total stoke is very obvious!! It's fun to read your posts & relive & remember that awesome feeling you get as your riding skills improve. 

Cass is correct tho,.. Once you get your set up dialed in to where it's feeling pretty pain free? You will definitely benefit from just riding the hell out of it. Once you're reasonably comfortable, getting familiar with your gear & how it rides day to day and as conditions change? This will do more for your skill & confidence that 100 video tuts!!! (...assuming you start from having a decent basic skill set to work up from! Which it would certainly appear you do!)   

Just enjoy the stoke & have fun Girl! 
(...definitely vicariously enjoying your enthusiasm & stokage!!!)>


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## XxGoGirlxX (Jan 15, 2016)

Thank you. Yep I'm taking a break from tutorials for now lol, have a lot of back logged links from all of my "ride advisors" to review slowly.  We had a quick day up there today but wider stance was great now that I knew not to expect the same speedy response so it was my mind, expectations, and acting like a dummy riding with a cold, not the stance that was off. I Definitely felt more stable in the air now. Double stoked watching my daughter going mach 1 down the mountain and doing her first true linked turns / carving today, hand drags, catching edges and having a total blast! 
RidinBend thanks for providing your wife's preference - awesome :grin:


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

XxGoGirlxX said:


> RidinBend thanks for providing your wife's preference - awesome :grin:


Glad that was helpful:smile:


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

Hmnnnn,..!? It would appear that I might have to _eat a little crow_ here after doling out all my sage, "_expert_"  advice!! :laugh:



chomps1211 said:


> *...you are probably more likely to notice it immediately when any particular change is NOT working out….*





chomps1211 said:


> ...You will definitely benefit from just riding the hell out of it. Once you're reasonably comfortable, *getting familiar with your gear & how it rides day to day and as conditions change? This will do more for your skill & confidence that 100 video tuts!!!...*


If by any chance you happened to read any of my thread on Flat Light Vertigo? You know that I have been having some trouble this week with getting my riding back to feeling "consistent" and smooth. Particularly my toe to heel transitions for my turns! 

I have been working on getting my "MoJo" back after my 20 month hiatus, post injury return to the slopes,..! Since getting out this season, I have been riding the _exact_ same board with the EXACT SAME binding settings that I rode and was progressing well on at the end of the '13/'14 season.

This past Fri afternoon, after what for me was a _very_ scary, close call with a high speed bobble going from my toe to the heel side edge on the steep section of (…what passes for anyway) a small Black Diamond run and _JUST_ barely catching myself before biting it BIG TIME!  I decided to dial in a little more forward lean to my Cartels! I added "1" turn to the front and rear highbacks. (…I ride with a little more angle to the front than the rear, so this was a _Symmetrical_ change as far as my regular set up goes!)

I did not notice any particular noticeable change, good or bad with this new adjustment, so I just left it! 

*Yesterday afternoon however,..* I remembered that I have been forgetting that I wanted to dial back the high back _rotation_ for my front binding, just a little!! I had it cranked *all the way to the limit *to get it exactly parallel to the edge of the board, but whenever I went to fold it up or down the high back was catching and sticking in the heel cup!

So I turned it back barely a quarter of an inch. Just enough so that it was no longer sticking in the heel cup! I didn't make this adjustment to gain or change the performance of my ride. I did it solely to eliminate that "sticking" problem.

*...Holy Crap!!!!!* My very first run when I got back to the hill immediately felt _NOTICEABLY_ better! I was making MUCH smoother heel side transitions, with none of the previous wobbly or unbalanced feeling when trying to initiate them! 

I also found myself locking into, and riding out, the faster heel side turns I made thru the chop that _had_ been bouncing me out & throwing me on my ass _all week long!!!_ :blink: (_Thinking about it,… I remembered, *that* was something I was having some difficulty with before my injury, at the end of the '13/'14 season also!!_)

At the time tho, I _really_ felt I had my setup finally dialed in perfectly!!

So,… even tho I still agree that riding the hell out of, and really getting to _know_ a setup that feels "_pretty_" good is great advice!!! (….it's advice "I" lived & rode with for two seasons anyway!!) It doesn't necessarily mean you have found your "Perfect" settings!!

Maybe the advice should be, once you _know_ how your present setting and gear rides,… once in a while, make a small change to something!! Just to "See" what it gets you!!! If it turns out to be a bad choice? Go ahead and change it right back. 

_But every once in a while,.._ it seems you might just discover a much better feeling ride from even a _tiny_ little change!!! ATM, I can't say for certain yet that this is definitely the solution to the trouble I have been having this week! However, if todays session starts out with that _same_ level of improved board feel and smoother, better balanced toe/heel transitions,..? Then I do believe I may have found the trouble and will duly note it for future gear adjustments!!!

I will post an update here later to let you know either way which it is!!!


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## Staff_Sav (Jan 5, 2016)

Yesterday I changed my stance for the first time in 4 years that Ive had my board. This is on my nitro subzero 158 which is true twin. I previously always had the bindings on the furthest fittings apart from each other, but decided to bring each in one screw hole. On my first run i found it noticeably less stable than what i had been used to when riding (admittedly this is only on dry slope because thats what ive got near to me at home in England), but i soon got used to it. Switch got a little bit hairy when i picked up speed, but nothing too major. I did find it a whole lot easier to spin in the air though. I didn't need to do as much of an aggressive carve into the jump in order to spin 360, and when riding switch I found Cab 180's a lot easier as well. Also penguin walking was a lot easier. They didn't have any rails or boxes out when I was down there yesterday, so will be interesting to see how I get on with those.

Basically what I had read before would suggest narrower stance would decrease stability but increase turning seemed to be true. In theory, would presses be harder or easier with a narrower stance? I did a couple of tail presses on the flat when i was waiting, but couldn't really tell if it was harder or not


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

Staff_Sav said:


> Basically what I had read before would suggest narrower stance would decrease stability but increase turning seemed to be true. In theory, would presses be harder or easier with a narrower stance? I did a couple of tail presses on the flat when i was waiting, but couldn't really tell if it was harder or not


I'm talking pure theory here, just think of like a lever and fulcrum. Feet close together would be more of a speed advantage, it would take more work to get your board into a butter position but it would happen faster, but I imagine it would be harder work to keep balanced in the press, and more work to flex the board. Your feet would move less but it would take more force. 
Feet farther apart you would have a force advantage, takes a little less work to get your board in position, and it would take a little longer, but you would have a lot more control over the press, and would be easier to flex and keep the board from returning to it's natural position. Your feet would move a further distance but would use less force.
Wow that hurt my brain trying to put that into words, I confused my self and rewrote it a few times, so I hope it makes sense or is correct even.:embarrased1:

I guess that same shit can transfer over to just riding too, a wide stance would also help with blasting thru chewed up terrain and moguls because you'd be so stable, while closer together you'd be searching for the fresh corduroy so you wouldn't be getting bucked around.


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