# Lining up to hit a rail



## Guest (Feb 18, 2008)

im no rail pro so this is my tips as sort of a park new bish guy.

make sure that you are completely flat on your base when you are about to hit the rail, if you are at all on an edge, you will crash guaranteed. kind of use your legs to sop up the transition differences. kind of like pumping. keep your legs bent throughout the rail so you can hop off if needed. just hold on for the ride. I assume youre talking about ride on rails BTW...

just keep practicing...


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## Phenom (Dec 15, 2007)

This is my first year really concentrating on park so I'm fairly new, but I've got 50-50s on rails down pretty good so hopefully I can help. First thing is, I feel the ramp up to the rail makes a huge difference, more so than the rail itself. If you have a crappy/icy ramp up, staying straight towards the rail while remaining flat based can be really tough. I like to ride up the ramp on an edge, I've played around with both edges, I like going up slight on my toes. I feel like my body is in a better position when I'm leaning slighty toe side (knees bent, shoulders over my board and parallel with the rail). Just as you're about to ride onto the rail gently get flat based. The rest is all about practice. I had the same problem, I kept sliding off the rail as soon as go on. Just make sure you aren't psyching yourself out and keep those shoulders straight. The slightest rotation in your shoulders or hips will cause your board to spin off one way or another. After a while I kept on trying and getting more comfortable riding up to the rail and before I knew it I was able to 50-50 the full length of the rail. Biggest thing is keep trying.


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## snowsam17 (Jan 14, 2008)

i used to have a similar problem. i used to be extremely uncomfortable riding flat based down the fall line and used to need to be on an edge at all times. as you can imagine this posed a huge problem when trying to line myself up for a 50-50. when i figured out what was wrong i just stopped riding rails and went down a couple runs practicing riding flat, ollying while flat based, and ended up getting really comfortable with the feeling. when i went back to try the rails again, i found a huge difference and 50-50s were a piece of cake. 

to me, it sounds like you have a similar problem because you say you cut left or right, which is exactly what happened to me. i think you should get more comfortable riding flat, and also maybe start a little closer to the rail so you can ride flat based all the way on to it without picking up too much speed. hope that helps!


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## Guest (Feb 18, 2008)

Have you tried boxes first? If not you should.


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## Guest (Feb 18, 2008)

xevi89 said:


> Have you tried boxes first? If not you should.


this is true. if you can slide a box straight, and you cant do a rail, its a mental problem...


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## Guest (Feb 18, 2008)

Boxes are easier to learn on, but once you get better, rails will be preferred because it feels better locking into them.

Rails are incredibly simple to ride, most people who are first learning to ride them don't understand this. A lot of people think that you will loose a lot of speed on the rail, but this is not true. You are going to slow down at a negligable rate for the length of time you're on the rail. You will continue sliding, it is cruicial to remember this. Staying on a rail longer is just going to bring balance into effect, whereas momentum has the greatest importance for the most part. The slower you hit the rail, the more difficult it's going to be. Simply go at a little less than normal speed and keep your weight centered over your feet. Bend your knees and get low and you'll ride the rail fine. Just stay flat based and slide it out.


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## Guest (Feb 18, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> .


i like how you used the airplane for comparison :thumbsup:


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## Guest (Feb 18, 2008)

N0NaMe said:


> i like how you used the airplane for comparison :thumbsup:


You definitely don't want to look like an airplane while you're on the rail though. Stay centered with your shoulders over your feet and bend your knees.


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## Guest (Feb 19, 2008)

Thank you all great advice, and yes I tried boxes first and was fine. Well the only box on the mountain.


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## olas38 (Jan 21, 2008)

Im not a pro But i have 14 yrs riding snowboard and 30 yrs surfing ! can I talk ! now ? Breathing deep 5 times ! before you get to boxes or rails. is more mental thing if you are over 2 yrs (SB) rider ! so . your eyes ! your shoulders, hips, board , on this order ! dont over speed , slighlty ollie , land the rail (depends wish side ) with your toes or heels , Font side ( heels ) back side toes, shoulders line up and hips with the rail, when you are on ! this is very important your eyes : they have to be engage to the end of the rail. all the time. go and ride again . tell me later !! check the snow condition before riding softy daYS IS THE BEST.


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## Guest (Feb 19, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> Everyone has given some awesome advice and while I am an advanced free rider, I am very new at rails and park in general also. The one thing that has not been mentioned in the great tips already posted has to do with your approach. This is so important and just like landing an airplane, a good landing is totally dependant upon a good, stabilized approach.
> 
> This relates to your problem in snowboarding as well. It sounds to me like you are not setting yourself up far enough away from the box/rail. So you end up making a lot of directional changes on your "final approach" and you end up hitting the feature ( the runway) in a very unstable attitude. For a 50/50, I would suggest slowing your speed down below what you want to hit the feature at much farther up the hill. Get lined up dead on with it and just keep everything nice and stable and ride onto the rail/box. I would say at first, slow down more than you need untill you get a feel for what your acceleration will be as you ride flat based onto the feature. It is this making direction and edge angle changes right on your "short final" that is causing you to loose control one you are on the feature (runway)...:thumbsup:


snowwolf- 
stupid question, but do you accelerate faster while flat bases or on an edge?


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## Guest (Feb 19, 2008)

I too started moving more into park this year. I practiced on boxes with 50-50 and line of momentum keeping me on box full time. Then started practicing on rails, just riding off early if my momentum or trajectory caused me to, and started to get roughly 75% of 50-50's to stay on the entire rail. But then I started getting gutsy on the other 25% and if I was going to ride off, I'd start rotating to stay on the rail, and before I knew it, I had rotated into a FS noseslide, and was like, "Oh shit! this is awesome". then I hit a bend in the rail, where it get's steeper and had no clue what to do. I ended up landing on my head. thank god I had a helmet. 

lesson> don't try to rotate to stay on the rail until you know how to ride the position you are rotating into, I guess :dunno:


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## Guest (Feb 20, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> I was`nt suggesting that...it was a reference to getting lined up early on in the approach to the rail....read the entire post...:thumbsup:


Yeah, I got that. Some people tend to turn their upper bodies when they're getting ready to hit something, which is bad form. That's what I was referencing.


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## Guest (Feb 20, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> I find that once I am lined up, going flat based on the approach accelerates me much faster than being on edge.


sorry to take this off topic, how about while on a trail? i feel as if i accelerate more while on an edge but some disagree..


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## Guest (Feb 21, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> Yeah, that is very true. it also leads to disaster when jumping. I had a hell of a hard time with this when I first was catching a little air.


i am still working on the whole air thing... i've got the problem of turning a little bit right before lift off.. OR i have the problem of nose diving! :dunno:


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## Guest (Feb 26, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> Being afraid of heights and suffering from mild vertigo does`nt help me with this either.


I don't suffer the vertigo, but dang do the heights scare me. I'm not even really comfortable on a ski lift. 

I just started doing boxes, no rails for me yet. I might have been overly paranoid about catching an edge, but when I hit the box the only thing I focus on is a flat base. My problem comes when I'm not lined up right and end up near the edge of the box and instead of going off the side a bit early, I freak out a bit and try to stay on the box and unconsciously try to turn/lean. Then I do catch an edge and take a nasty spill on the easiest box in the park. I guess at some point I will learn to just go where my board takes me on these things. Until then, I'm looking hard at a set of skeletools pads.


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## NYCboarder (Jan 26, 2008)

ok i can tottaly ride a box the whole length on my flat based i think thats called 50/50.. i can get the rails almost the full distance. however my question is with the rail rides which are like i am stopping heel side on the snow. im not sure what this is called. the first time i got it on a box and after that i keps leaning back and loosing my balance and falling. my question is.. 
is it easier to ride the rail normal then transition to this other grind? or just hop on the box aleady in the sideways grind.


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## Phenom (Dec 15, 2007)

NYCboarder said:


> ok i can tottaly ride a box the whole length on my flat based i think thats called 50/50.. i can get the rails almost the full distance. however my question is with the rail rides which are like i am stopping heel side on the snow. im not sure what this is called. the first time i got it on a box and after that i keps leaning back and loosing my balance and falling. my question is..
> is it easier to ride the rail normal then transition to this other grind? or just hop on the box aleady in the sideways grind.


Sounds like you're talking about a backside boardslide. Falling on your ass while attempting this is such a common problem. Basically, you're flatbased, then you lean onto your heel edge, there is less friction so the board speeds up and you get swept right off your feet which then transitions you into an ass grind. Just gotta tell yourself to keep your base flat. Find a long flat box and ride up and 50-50 it then gradually rotate your board into a boardslide, this will help with the awkward feeling of stay flat while moving with your board perpendicular to the box. Once you get comfortable try hopping onto the box already in a boardslide position.


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## alaric (Aug 28, 2007)

I'm not going to read through this because honestly... i'm lazy. But when doing boardslides, KEEP YOUR BASE FLAT ON THE RAIL. I honestly can't stress that enough. You've got to keep a flat base, with evenly distributed pressure all along the board. Don't lean any which way too much unless you feel stress/sliding/whatever it may be in a direction.



Snowolf said:


> Yeah, I am sketchy on boxes/rails too. One thing I have found out though is NOT to fight it...if the board starts to go off the edge, just go with it and jump clear. Trying to save it will really wreck you bad.



^^^ He speaks the truth.


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## Guest (Mar 4, 2008)

I tried turning off a box about a month and a half ago. There's now wax permanently caked onto my pants, and the bruising on my knees just went away a few days ago. Bad. Experience.


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## Mr. Right (Sep 27, 2007)

megladan said:


> i am still working on the whole air thing... i've got the problem of turning a little bit right before lift off.. OR i have the problem of nose diving! :dunno:


Tailgrabs helped me cure that illness almost instantly. Something about leaning that one arm back a little bit that pulled my nose out of the snow. Intimidating at first (for me it was) but after the first time I tried it I couldn't believe I wasn't doing it every time.


As for rails, I actually just tried my first rail the other day, twice in a row. I kept sliding off the left side of it. I didn't bash my shins at all (so happy) or even fall but I did have a hard time keeping straight on it. We don't have any boxes to practice on so it's what I get. Definitely less intimidating after I hit it once. By the end of the season I think I'll have atleast 50/50's nailed. I think speed is key. The first time I hit the rail (8 inches wide and maybe 12 feet long) I went about 3 feet and slipped off the side of it. The second time I turned and got lined up with it and let myself go a bit faster and made it about 5 or 6 feet. I think next time Im going to blast it kind of hard and see if it helps. :dunno:


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## Guest (Mar 4, 2008)

I found that speed was important on hitting a rail also. Instead of slowly lining up and taking it at the last second, give yourself about 10 feet or so and take it straight on, with a flat board, and centered stance. Don't look off the side of the rail because you go where you're looking. Look straight ahead and spot your landing.


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## Guest (Mar 4, 2008)

Phenom said:


> Sounds like you're talking about a backside boardslide. Falling on your ass while attempting this is such a common problem. Basically, you're flatbased, then you lean onto your heel edge, there is less friction so the board speeds up and you get swept right off your feet which then transitions you into an ass grind. Just gotta tell yourself to keep your base flat. Find a long flat box and ride up and 50-50 it then gradually rotate your board into a boardslide, this will help with the awkward feeling of stay flat while moving with your board perpendicular to the box. Once you get comfortable try hopping onto the box already in a boardslide position.


So once you get the board slide down, how to board slide over a kink in the rail? I can only go over kinks 50/50 and when i try board slides i bail.


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## Mr. Right (Sep 27, 2007)

Josh said:


> I found that speed was important on hitting a rail also. Instead of slowly lining up and taking it at the last second, give yourself about 10 feet or so and take it straight on, with a flat board, and centered stance. Don't look off the side of the rail because you go where you're looking. Look straight ahead and spot your landing.


I'll definitely give that a shot, I'll be trying again a few times tomorrow. We have one rail that is a little bigger (almost a box) probably as wide or a little narrower than my board. I think that one might be easier as it is wider. It does have a little jump you have to hit to get on it though which makes me nervous. I can land jumps on snow but I'm not sure how my board will react to landing on a rail after a jump. Our park sucks at Loveland, it's the only thing I don't like about that mountain.


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## Phenom (Dec 15, 2007)

Augie09 said:


> So once you get the board slide down, how to board slide over a kink in the rail? I can only go over kinks 50/50 and when i try board slides i bail.


Sorry, can't help you there. I can only 50-50 kink rails as well. From watching videos it seems like you really need to use your legs to soften the impact during the switch from the down portion of the rail to the flat portion to avoid catching an edge, especially if you're going fast.


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## alaric (Aug 28, 2007)

If you're going from a flat to a down, just lean with the rail. That's fairly easy.

Going from a down to a flat is harder. It's also hard to explain, but I'll do my best. First, rounded edges are a MUST. If your edges are even semi sharp, don't try this. Right before the flat (and I mean RIGHT before it) you kind of shove your legs, and you ride down the very last part of the down (a couple inches)on your back edge, then "land" on the flat. That's really not a good way of explaining it, but it's the best way I can think of explaining it.


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## NYCboarder (Jan 26, 2008)

what edges do i round? and if i do round them can i re sharpen them? also will it really affect my riding outside of the park


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## alaric (Aug 28, 2007)

Snowolf said:


> Once you round your edges, it takes a lot to resharpen them and you loose a lot of your edge material so the short answer is no, you can`t get them back. A lot of jibbers will round their edges between their bindings, leaving the edges sharp from the bindings to the contact point where they are rounded around the tip and tail.


SnoWolf is right on the dot. There's no really going back once you round your edges. If you still want to do crazy free riding stuff, don't round your edges


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

Just another comment about speed...

Think about riding a bike. What happens when you go really slow? You become unstable, and fall. 

Rails are the same. If you hit them too slow, your going to have a harder time staying "locked in," and a harder time keeping you balance point.


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## Guest (Mar 5, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> Once you round your edges, it takes a lot to resharpen them and you loose a lot of your edge material so the short answer is no, you can`t get them back. A lot of jibbers will round their edges between their bindings, leaving the edges sharp from the bindings to the contact point where they are rounded around the tip and tail.


Snowolf, in your opinion is it better to have separate freeride and park boards or get one board to be a jack of all trades and focus on learning that particular board? I am always hesitant to have too many tools, since I don't often get to spend enough time with any of them to really master them. The saying "beware the man with one rifle, for he probably knows how to use it" comes to mind. Then again, I don't want to severely disadvantage myself in either style of riding if I choose to pursue both with reckless abandon.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

TNT said:


> is it better to have separate freeride and park boards



IMHO, the answer is, "It depends." What does it depend on? Where you ride, how often you ride, what you tend to ride more of, what conditions you ride, your current level of skill, etc. It also depends on what deck(s) your looking at. I'm sure others will have totally different perspectives on this issue. But, unless you ride a ton of different conditions, and get in a tremendous amount of time in on the mountain every season, then there is an argument to be made that one deck might be better than two. But that is a choice you'll have to make yourself. 

*[Below is just a personal realization I had about this very issue over the last week. It may or may not be of help to you.]*

The last five days just radically changed my opinion on this matter. I own two decks. I've been riding for 20-years, and have had multipule decks for a number of seasons. Right now I own two (see my sig file for details). 

I just spent five days at Sunday River. I brought both boards with me. The day before we arrived, the mountain(s) got dumped on. It continued to snow the first day I was there. Hence, I got to ride pure powder, big-ass powder moguls, groomers, glades, double-black steeps, double-black tree runs with moguls everywhere, park, etc. I don't often get to ride these types of conditons. I mostlly ride a much smaller local mountain that is mostlly groomed, man-made snow, and ice. Hence, now there is almost no condition I havn't taken both decks in.

The two friends I was with don't ride park. We split off, and I took out the park deck. The park was real crowded, and I didn't feel like dealing with it. Hence, I met up with my friends, and went off with them. I didn't want to go back to the condo we stayed in order to switch boards. Thus, I ended up with my park board in all of the above listed conditions. This turned out to be an illuminating experience.

Sure, the park board wasn't as stable at speed. Sure, the park board didn't float through powder the way a big mountain deck would. However, I still bombed the fuck out out double-blacks. I took powder lines through trees/glades. I was able to dodge through moguls with ease on shorter, more menvueralable board. My friends on stiffer, longer boards, couldn't keep up with me on any trail (I have been riding a lot longer than they have). 

So what is my point? I realized that I was able to have as much fun, and do everything I normally can, on one board. Moreover, my ability wasn't radically hindered by it. Sure, I couldn't go quite as fast. Sure, I had to be more "on" with technique. But all of this seemed pretty de minimus when looking at the big picture.

If I rode 100+ days a season, and rode in radically different conditions, or rode mostlly in powder, then two decks would be a good idea. But the truth is, I get in about 50 days a season, and mostlly under the same type of conditions (park, and packed powder/ groomed / crunchy/icey). I realized one board is all I really need for that. Based on what I ride, where I ride, and how often, the differences between multiple decks is something I (just) realized that I really don't need...or am really *able* to tap into becuase of the condtions I ride the vast majority of the time. I am able to make the park board perform (almost) the exact way I want a board to handle in almost every condtion I normally ride. Rather than deal with switching back and forth, I've decided to sell the all-mountain deck, and keep the "park" (or now, my "all-mountain") deck. 

So why the park board and not the all-mountain board? I lean *slightlly* towards the freestyle side of riding. Hence, I like a board that will be a little better for freestyle than doom-speed. My park deck is also not one of the super soft park boards (ex: K2 WWW, Rome Artifact, ettc.). I might have come to totally different conclusions about this if I had taken the Artifact down a double-black steep.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

Snowolf said:


> Coming from a guy who is sitting here looking at 4 snowboards lined up along the wall, I would say that there is no such thing as having too many snowboards....



And there, is the totally valid argument for having a big-ass quiver. 

The biggest issue you should consider is how many different conditions your really going to ride, and let that dictate. Wolf does raise a good point about jibbing. If you really want to tap your skill with that, your going to want a board with really detuned edges. Once done, you can't retune them. Hence, you'll be using such a deck for jibs, and not much else.


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## Guest (Mar 5, 2008)

Thanks for the insights, Sedition and Snowolf. Based on what you both have said, I'm leaning towards getting a park board, but I'm hesitant to make it into an all jib board like I had previously thought I would. Right now I run a Forum Recon 158, it's stiff in my opinion, and maybe a tad longer than I'd like. I'm 5'11' 165 lbs. 
I never/rarely ride in pow, this next week will actually be my first experience doing so out west. The "mountains" out here are very timid (so I'm told) and I already feel more than comfortable on the steepest runs they have to offer with my board right now, and I think I could handle them without problem on a 154. I will also spend a fair number of days next year exclusively in the park, learning rails and doing jumps. I want to learn to jib around at will, but I prefer jumps over rails and definitely would love to learn half-pipe skills. Based on these factors, I am looking into a softer board, but I don't think I'm ready for an exclusive jib board to round the edges off.
Any recommendations on the little I have given you all to work with? 
Once I can afford it, I may end up getting a few different boards, all with specific intents to help me learn the different styles of riding, but ultimately I'm hoping that as I improve in each area I will be able to narrow down my board selection and depend almost exclusively on my own ability rather than on what's under my feet.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

TNT said:


> Thanks for the insights, Sedition and Snowolf...I'm 5'11' 165 lbs.
> 
> Any recommendations on the little I have given you all to work with?


No problem. 

I am 5'10, 159lbs. My park board (and now "all mountain" board) is a Rome Graft 151. I'll put in a very strong plug for the 155 version of it.


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## Guest (Mar 6, 2008)

Thanks for the help gents, I'll definitely look into those three boards. I'm really looking at the graft and the agent...hopefully there'll be some good deals come summertime.


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## WolfSnow (Oct 26, 2008)

I just slide horizontal to the hill half way down the drop in (i'm new) then i get it so the front of my board is vertical to the rail, then i do the drop in thing. About the sliding off thing, keep your weight real centered if you got the line up perfect. if you start to slide, go with it and try again.

*-WolfSnow*


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## Guest (Jan 20, 2010)

Snowolf said:


> Yeah, I am sketchy on boxes/rails too. One thing I have found out though is NOT to fight it...if the board starts to go off the edge, just go with it and jump clear. Trying to save it will really wreck you bad.


i bruised my hip bone trying to salvage a 5050 on a flat-down box...i started going off the side. my nose went off the side and dipped down, but my tail was still on. i caught my edge, and basically my nose, along with my whole body, swung down and i landed straight on ice. that was 3 weeks ago and the pain in my hip has JUST gone completely away, like, today. if you're going off one side or the other, JUMP OFF. as far as rails, it's really important to look at the end of the rail. on flat-downs, look at the end of the flat, then when you hit the down, look at the end of the down. looking down at your board will make you drift off in no time. other than this, it's all trial and error.


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