# Good jump to start practicing wildcats?



## dave785 (Jan 21, 2016)

I saw the title of the thread as "good jump to start practicing on..." and I thought I could be helpful since this is my first season doing jumps...

Then i saw the word "wildcat" (that's a nollie flip right?) and my balls shriveled up.


----------



## basser (Sep 18, 2015)

dave785 said:


> I saw the title of the thread as "good jump to start practicing on..." and I thought I could be helpful since this is my first season doing jumps...
> 
> Then i saw the word "wildcat" (that's a nollie flip right?) and my balls shriveled up.


The nollie flip is called a tamedog. A wildcat is the opposite of a tamedog, pretty much a backflip while in snowboarding position.

Edit: I think I read your post wrong...


----------



## Tuan209 (Dec 26, 2008)

tokyo_dom said:


> What sort of jump in the park would be recommended to try my first wildcats on? As in what size, and does the knuckle style matter much?
> 
> I'm looking at possibly one more trip to the snow this season, and the resort i will go to has a hikeable 5-10ft jump with a nice drop off (rounded knuckle); i used that a few weeks ago for tamedogs, fs and bs 3s etc. Its small, but also quite painless. It also faces the sun so gets nice and soft in the afternoon.
> 
> Would that be doable? Or should i wait for something with more of a steep kick (i've heard spines are good)


Ideally, you want something kicky. It may be scarier to hit a bigger size jump and do a wildcat, but a bigger size kicker will give you more time. Just remember to commit! 

I did my first wildcats this year but it was a jump built to land into a powderish landing.


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

Tuan209 said:


> Ideally, you want something kicky. It may be scarier to hit a bigger size jump and do a wildcat, but a bigger size kicker will give you more time. Just remember to commit!
> 
> I did my first wildcats this year but it was a jump built to land into a powderish landing.


Thanks yeah i wish i had the luxury of a jump like that. Last time i went out I actually found a natural windlip/quarter pipe type jump that landed into choppy snow (softish) on the other side. It was perfect and i was starting to get close to landing them; just the choppy/angled landing made it hard to stick it after landing.

I dont think that will be there next time i go, and it was the *only* interesting thing on a boring green run, so it was a waste of lift time just for that one hit (it was quite tall with a really long run-in so it wasnt really hikeable).

The jump i am looking at trying on is pretty small though, and not particularly lippy :-( Just that it drops off quickly so i guess not much chance of knuckling it.


----------



## SickTrickz96 (Jan 1, 2015)

your going to want a poppy jump to practice wildcats on, it doesn't necessarily need to be big jump


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

Thanks, yeah unfortunately i dont often get the chance to choose the type of jump i get. And the jumps at the resorts i went to after making this post were not poppy enough. Or at least thats the excuse i am sticking with because one of my ribs is still a bit sore 2 months later 

I also cracked my snowboard practicing tamedogs, because again, not much pop = not enough height to get the board around.

I'm still keen to get these sorted though. Another friend suggested just shoveling out my own tiny steep jump on a small hill and that i would have it in no time.


----------



## basser (Sep 18, 2015)

SnowboardProCamp released a video called "How to Tamedog Frontflip" I would recommend watching that, super helpful--for next year anyway.


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

basser said:


> SnowboardProCamp released a video called "How to Tamedog Frontflip" I would recommend watching that, super helpful--for next year anyway.


Thanks... I wasnt clear in my last email but just like my profile pic, i do have tamedogs down to about a 70% success rate, given the right size jump. I definitely could get better at them, and would love to be able to do them on a roller at speed or off a small drop off, but that is all just practice i guess?

Its the wildcats which i am trying to learn now. It might seem like just the reverse of the tamedog, but the motions are completely different and i just couldnt get it down. I did get it on this one natural wind lip with a big steep wall, just sort of leant back as i left the lip and the board came all the way around - but i wasnt sticking the landing. On a jump like that you are already almost vertical as you leave the lip so leaning back does the rest of it for you... on a kicker you need to initiate the spin, and so far i havent been successful....


----------



## Gregory (Jun 18, 2017)

@tokyo_dom tell me do you have this particular flip locked consistently on a trampoline? If I don't warm up on a trampoline then I'm bound to crash my first flips (with some exceptions). What I'm implying it's really easy to get rusty.
If we're talking about park jumps - steep tabletops are best because the angle between takeoff and landing is much smaller so you need less rotation. It's almost like you're only doing 2/3 of a wildcat, but it's also very easy to over-rotate for the same reason. 
So the recipe here is to warm up on a trampoline or airbag (make sure you have full control and you know how to under-rotate or over-rotate), and then find yourself a tabletop with really steep takeoff. It's very important to really work with your legs, pushing off with a lot of power and more off back foot towards the end of a push so the board "flicks". From there a simple movement with the back arm will send you into the flip.
You can check 00:43 of this video for the type of jump I was talking about and the trick itself. And airbag footage is somewhere there too. 
System won't let me post links yet as I'm a new user, you can add /watch?v=xHFoyGKH2-g in the end of youtube.com and paste it in the browser to see the mentioned video.

Maybe I can even make a tutorial if someone needs it.
P.S. if you have access to steep roller with powder landing - it's even better than an airbag, because you can't learn to land with an airbag.


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

Gregory said:


> @tokyo_dom tell me do you have this particular flip locked consistently on a trampoline? If I don't warm up on a trampoline then I'm bound to crash my first flips (with some exceptions). What I'm implying it's really easy to get rusty.
> If we're talking about park jumps - steep tabletops are best because the angle between takeoff and landing is much smaller so you need less rotation. It's almost like you're only doing 2/3 of a wildcat, but it's also very easy to over-rotate for the same reason.
> So the recipe here is to warm up on a trampoline or airbag (make sure you have full control and you know how to under-rotate or over-rotate), and then find yourself a tabletop with really steep takeoff. It's very important to really work with your legs, pushing off with a lot of power and more off back foot towards the end of a push so the board "flicks". From there a simple movement with the back arm will send you into the flip.
> You can check 00:43 of this video for the type of jump I was talking about and the trick itself. And airbag footage is somewhere there too.
> ...


Thanks for the awesome info! Yes i would love a tutorial. Youtube has plenty of tutorials for Tamedogs, but surprisingly few/none for wildcats. There is a Snowboarding addiction one, and another one that only really helps if you live near a massive snowboard training facility with foam pits and all sorts of props. Watching people do them i see that the arms must play a big part, but just havent got the timing or the 'huck' right.

As for trampolines, sadly no i havent had much practice on them. Tame dogs are easy to practice in a pool (though painful as you often land on your side), but i think the wildcat motion is a lot harder. Would love to get a chance to try trampolines this summer though!


----------



## Gregory (Jun 18, 2017)

Happy to help.
Not sure when I will get to this tutorial, probably at some point during upcoming month.
Arms do help, but they are not 100 percent required - it is enough to push in this direction (picture attached) and tuck your legs afterwards, the rotation will be quite strong.
It's ok to try flips into powder and then bring them to a park jump on the same day, but if there is no powder, no trampoline (especially since you never even tried one) and no airbag - I wouldn't do it. A lot of bad stuff can happen, even on a small jump. 
Of course is the snow on the landing is very soft you can try, very little airtime is necessary actually if you're doing it right, but then again you might hit your head into lip of the jump simply because you were not pushing off strong enough or start the rotation too early.
P.S. SA tutorial is good as far as I remember.


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

Thanks again and no hurry on the tutorial, since we are in summer now. Your video is pretty cool too. Honestly thats pretty much what my goal is for snowboarding capabilities. Smooth style on medium sized jumps, wildcats, tamedogs, spins and some stylish rails/boxes. It all looks so effortless and steezy!


----------



## Gregory (Jun 18, 2017)

Thank you! The style is always result of a lot of work, but good thing is - even if it's summer it is still possible to ride. I heard you have snowdomes too, although they are usually much better for jibbing than for jumps. 
onboardmag.com/videos/crew-edits/dirty-pimp-productions-indoor-1.html
Anyways I will post the tutorial here when it's done.


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

So, to answer the question I posed, a small jump is fine, as long as it has a bit of pop. But the most important thing to for me was to have someone there helping me/showing . I say this because i finally got a chance to try them again last weekend (had been holding off, hard snow, no confidence etc). And now i can land them better than my 360s or tamedogs (or at least i did on that day).

The jump i did them on was only about 6-7 feet from lip to landing i guess. Was in a hike park, and meant for beginners. Tiny little thing, most people were barely rolling off the lip. But if you straightlined it and popped off the lip you could get a bit of hang time.

The most important factor was that there was a guy there throwing wildcats and corked spins off it. I asked him for advice (since its a hike park, you end up talking to each other at the top while lining up). And although the advice he gave me was similar to what you get in the (few) tutorials out there, seeing him do it gave me confidence, and a visual example of what to do. He then gave further advice when the first couple of attempts landed me on my belly (keep my shoulders parallel to the board when initiating the flip, add more upwards jumping motion and instead of just using my shoulders, imagine you are trying to uppercut someone with your hip), and then around she came!

I managed 5 in a row but each attempt was getting lower and lower because my legs were just dead tired from having hiked the jump 20-30 times that morning. I think the last one i probably landed in a nosepress, but still rode away


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

CBF uploading to youtube but here is a pic mid wildcat.

I am now going to work on getting better/more confident with these on other jumps, as well as the spins and tamedogs that i was doing last season (I have seemed to go backwards with them)

So the new goal is to string together all 4 rotations - fs360, bs360, tamedog, wildcat in one run and get a video of that. Suppose the first step is to find a park that has 4 small-medium jumps in a row!


----------



## TooNice (Feb 7, 2014)

Great job!

Where do you ride?

This season, I decided to not think about inverted tricks. It's still on top of my wishlist of tricks I'd like to be able to do, but I decided that I would save that until I get some practice on an airbag.


----------



## SlvrDragon50 (Mar 25, 2017)

Awesome! I wanna be able to just do straight airs :laugh2:


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

TooNice said:


> Great job!
> 
> Where do you ride?
> 
> This season, I decided to not think about inverted tricks. It's still on top of my wishlist of tricks I'd like to be able to do, but I decided that I would save that until I get some practice on an airbag.


Are you still in Japan?
I ride in the Yuzawa area - i have an apartment out there. There are a bunch of mountains and resorts to go to in that area, but i mostly ride at Kagura, Gala, and Kandatsu (they have the cheapest early-bird lift tickets lol). Joetsu Kokusai is another fav, but Gala and Kandatsu are so easy to get to... 

Slvrdragon - its a surprisingly easy trick actually. I would now say easier than a 360 in either direction. Last weekend some kids had built a little lippy jump on the edge of a run into the ungroomed week old soft snow. You know the type of jump you hit but it sends you up a bit too quick and you end up off balance and you end up flapping your arms like a chicken and looking stupid? Well instead i get cheers and clapping from the lifts because i'm flipping it. They probably all thought i am really good or something - good thing they didnt see me trying 360s in the park.....


----------



## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

tokyo_dom said:


> CBF uploading to youtube but here is a pic mid wildcat.
> 
> I am now going to work on getting better/more confident with these on other jumps, as well as the spins and tamedogs that i was doing last season (I have seemed to go backwards with them)
> 
> So the new goal is to string together all 4 rotations - fs360, bs360, tamedog, wildcat in one run and get a video of that. Suppose the first step is to find a park that has 4 small-medium jumps in a row!


:thumbsup:

Here's a Snowboard Addition tutorial on Tame Dogs. Apologies If you've seen it already. But if not, it might provide a tip or two to help you progress with them.


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

Yeah i had those videos on repeat before i started trying tamedogs. He now has a tutorial for wildcats too. 

But looking at the wildcat one now that i have that trick pretty good, the advice given there is not really the way *i* do them. Might be because i was doing them on smaller jumps where i couldnt just roll off the lip, but i really had to pop up or i wouldnt have the height. Either way the biggest thing for me was the fact i had to commit to losing sight of the ground and having the board come up over me, and not to freak out when that happens. And no matter what, do not try to bail midway... it will only make things worse.


----------



## SnowMotion (Oct 8, 2010)

*The simple answer*

An easy place to find poppy jumps is the bottom of a halfpipe. As the wall tapers down on the end you can get serious pop exiting to the flat. A great place to learn wildcats.


----------



## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

tokyo_dom said:


> Yeah i had those videos on repeat before i started trying tamedogs. He now has a tutorial for wildcats too.
> 
> But looking at the wildcat one now that i have that trick pretty good, the advice given there is not really the way *i* do them. Might be because i was doing them on smaller jumps where i couldnt just roll off the lip, but i really had to pop up or i wouldnt have the height. Either way the biggest thing for me was the fact i had to commit to losing sight of the ground and having the board come up over me, and not to freak out when that happens. And no matter what, do not try to bail midway... it will only make things worse.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7KUpodSrZqI


I think I am too old to try that on groomer. I need like a foot or two powder to try that.
Sometimes, I wish I was young and no responsibility.


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

speedjason said:


> I think I am too old to try that on groomer. I need like a foot or two powder to try that.
> Sometimes, I wish I was young and no responsibility.


I was a few days away from my 39th birthday, with a 9 month old baby waiting with my wife at the lodge  I had seen the advice ("dont try to bail, no matter what") and it was a warm slushy spring day though. I guess the chances of landing on your back/neck are nowhere near as high as people think they are.

The next time i went out i started throwing them off larger 3-5m park jumps, and i am now quite comfortable with them

I gotta admit, it took a bit of courage the first time i tried it again this season though, on a very icy park jump, but even when i failed the first attempt, i landed 3/4 the way around and just slid on my side. Since its a flat base run-in, no set up carves required etc, i find them easier and less intimidating than a 360; the only varying factor is how much pop you give it


----------



## SlvrDragon50 (Mar 25, 2017)

tokyo_dom said:


> I was a few days away from my 39th birthday, with a 9 month old baby waiting with my wife at the lodge  I had seen the advice ("dont try to bail, no matter what") and it was a warm slushy spring day though. I guess the chances of landing on your back/neck are nowhere near as high as people think they are.
> 
> The next time i went out i started throwing them off larger 3-5m park jumps, and i am now quite comfortable with them
> 
> I gotta admit, it took a bit of courage the first time i tried it again this season though, on a very icy park jump, but even when i failed the first attempt, i landed 3/4 the way around and just slid on my side. Since its a flat base run-in, no set up carves required etc, i find them easier and less intimidating than a 360; the only varying factor is how much pop you give it


Hah, first time my friend tried to throw a barrel roll back flip, he landed straight on his head/neck. I need more trampoline time before I even considering throwing any inverted tricks on the snow.


----------



## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

SlvrDragon50 said:


> Hah, first time my friend tried to throw a barrel roll back flip, he landed straight on his head/neck. I need more trampoline time before I even considering throwing any inverted tricks on the snow.


I think the barrel roll backflip is a far more dangerous trick, Because the first part of doing it would be to throw your head/neck back in the prone position and you need to keep it there to spot your landing. You need a fair bit of core strength to bring your knees up in a regular backflip in order to give you the 'spin' rotation and i imagine it would need a bunch more with boots/board attached. On a wildcat you look up (so i suppose the head is prone), but the jump angle/leaning back gives you most of the 'spin' you need. Once you have left the lip all you do is crouch down into a ball.

Tamedogs require much more effort to get the spin, i am still working on those ones but even then you are tucking in almost from the start. Worst case scenario is you land flat on your back if the spin were to stop half way... Actually i lie, the worst bails i have had with those is landing on your side after 3/4 spin, slamming on your hips, that hurts


----------

