# "After Being Violently Assaulted In Front of My 9 Year-Old at Northstar, Vail..."



## shitty shredder (Feb 6, 2016)

*"After Being Violently Assaulted In Front of My 9 Year-Old at Northstar, Vail..."*

After Being Violently Assaulted In Front of My 9 Year-Old at Northstar - a Vail Resorts Property - Northstar/Vail Resorts Protected The Man Who Attacked Me and Punished Me For "Causing" His Behavior - Shred Mom

Quite a story, not sure what I think.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

Typical bullshit. Northstar has a big douchebag contingent. Dude probably works there and his buddies covered for him. I have seen it happen at other places.


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## Alkasquawlik (Jul 13, 2010)

Way to generalize Argo.

I'm calling bullshit. I ride at Northstar regularly and I have a lot of friends that work/ride there daily. She was in the Vista line and I have serious doubts that no one in that line said/did anything if what she said happen is the truth, especially if a man hit a mother for no reason. Additionally, Vail doesn't pull passes like that, let alone ban people for threatening to call the police. You can have your thoughts on Vail, but they stress customer satisfaction as a priority to every employee. I've talked to some friends and the 'other side' of the story is that SHE was the aggressor and hit him. He did curse her out, obviously, but he did not get physical with her. Waiting to see Vail's side of the story, whenever that comes out. They're at a 'no comment' as of right now, according to my friends.

Also, the blog reeks like an ad for her son. Why the need to post the video in there?


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## DaftDeft (Mar 7, 2016)

She said this happened in the lift line?

I cannot believe that people witnessing this go down wouldn't say anything to back her up? I mean I can't imagine watching what she wrote and not back her up to security. Hell, I would be on the phone to the cops almost immediately. Let 911 hear his crazy ranting. 

I dunno, if this isn't a gross exaggeration I have a really hard time seeing how this could happen in a public place without her having a zillion people witnessing for her.


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## scotty100 (Apr 3, 2012)

Northstar is probably the most family-oriented resort in Tahoe. There's a lot of money there and the "service" aspect of the whole place is thru the roof (think highly organized "experience"...load and unload your boards for you when you get in the very nice gondola to take you up to the base of mountain etc etc ...). Plus, there's a ton of ski patrol dudes all over. I've probably ridden there more than anywhere else this season and have never seen anything like that...if anything the knock on the place is that it's a sterile yuppie version of disney in the (fake) snow. But the mountain is decent for boarders, especially the back side of it. So when I read that I'm left wondering...hmm. Really? You're in a lift line in a family packed resort with ski patrol everywhere, a woman is suddenly being physically assaulted by some psycho dude and no one stepped in to help her? Really? Hmm.


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## Noreaster (Oct 7, 2012)

I don't know, my spidey senses are tingling. First, in a time when everyone films everything I can't believe that at least 10 people around these two didn't immediately whip out their phones and recorded the incident at least partially. There should have been videos posted online the very same day if not the same minute. Second, I can't believe that none of bystanders intervened. If the exchange happened exactly as she described it I don't think for a second that no one came to her aid when she was punched in the face. Seriously, a man screaming obscenities at a woman and hitting her? Even I would have tried to pull him off, and I'm 5'4 and weigh buck-nothing. And for that matter there should have been witnesses who would confirm her story. But most of all I just don't get why she'd post this whole thing on her blog. This is a straightforward lawsuit. The first thing you do after filing a police report is call your lawyer. And any lawyer worth his salt would tell you to stay away from interwebz and social media. 

I've seen my share of fights at resorts the world over and they just don't go down this way. I'm sure something happened and she did get into some skirmish with the guy. Just don't think necessarily that what she says is the real story.


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## shitty shredder (Feb 6, 2016)

I too would like another side of the story or something to corroborate the incident. It's unlikely that Vail or any large corporation retaining legal counsel or PR would respond to the allegations, so I don't think we'll hear anything through official channels. 

I try to avoid dismissing reports of victimization based on reasoning to the effect of "that would be so bad that it must be untrue," for hopefully obvious reasons.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

Pretty good conversation on this reddit thread. You can always count on reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoXChromo...oarding_mother_assaulted_by_man_in_lift_line/



> [–]destiny_manifest [score hidden] an hour ago
> 
> As the story (her story) is circulating on local Tahoe forums, the community members are 80% pitchforking. While it's understandable, given the nature of her account, there's also a ton of people saying, wait, this doesn't sound like something our community would stand by and watch happen. However, a lot of the threads are turning into witch hunts and being deleted by admins. As far as I know, no locals know who the alledged man is yet.
> 
> ...


and in response



> [–]Sunbrewed 18 points 3 hours ago
> 
> I grew up in the area (though no longer live there) and I might be able to help elaborate at least generically.
> 
> Tahoe is fairly small in terms of locals - There's one high school in North Lake and one in South Lake. The kids who grow up boarding and skiing there tend to also be the kids who end up working for the resorts (my brothers did). It's very likely that that particular boarder was buddies with guys working at Northstar. News gets around. If someone knew him or he bragged, others have very likely heard about it. If he's a local, he's probably at one or some of the resorts pretty regularly; locating people isn't too difficult in the area.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

I just don't understand how this could go unnoticed or, nobody intervened at one of the most highly trafficked areas on the mountain. Like what was said before, the pipe is under the vista lift which funnels down to the common area, which I have to imagine has significant congestion. If I saw this going down, no matter how far away I was, I would quickly get involved. There's a lot missing here in this story and I'm sure we'll know soon enough because it's everywhere on the snow forums. The thread on newschoolers got deleted.


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## jae (Nov 27, 2015)

Lots of missing pieces, but I've experienced big corporation security not wanting to help out during a confrontation in hopes that it'll work itself out, less paperwork for them. Veil did pull her pass, so there definitely is more to the story. This angry mom is raising hell 1 month later then the date of incident... waiting for the security feed to be erased?


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

Fuck, why does any of this shit even happen, regardless of who started it?????

Why don't people just ride?????


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## shitty shredder (Feb 6, 2016)

You know, even if she is spinning it horribly and freaked out on the guy like a lunatic, it's hard to imagine a lifetime ban being warranted.

Anybody with kids probably recalls a time when they perceived a threat to their child and were prepared to get aggressive. We like to think we can keep our cool all the time, but like a bear protecting her cubs, sometimes those animal instincts come out.

It would still be inappropriate, and I could see banning her for the rest of the afternoon, but pulling a pass and giving a lifetime ban over a one time thing is pretty extreme. The guy would have been inconvenienced but probably back riding the next day, joking about the crazy lady with his friends, and everyone goes on with their lives.


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## ekb18c (Mar 11, 2013)

This is just one side of the story. I can't imagine bystanders just watching and do nothing if this occurred on the lift line. I'm not calling bullshit just yet but I would love to hear the other side of the story.

Stories are always one sided, I'm not going to make any judgements before the other side comes out. Everyone has a cell phone so why is there no video of this?


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

I will say that chances are if someone asked me if I knew this woman and I did I would probably roll my eyes and say don't even get me started.

She comes across as the epitome of soccer mom helicopter parent. I suspect the event happened, and then she turned it up to 11 in her story telling which gave her to perfect opportunity to post pictures and a video of her darling little angel for all the internet to see.

Of course the guy still should have been beat down if any of it is remotely true. I just tire of articles like this that in the end are simply self promotion.


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## snowangel99 (Mar 11, 2016)

Lots of good points. I always believe people are good natured at heart....however loads of people have difficulties in life that follow them where ever they go....

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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

shitty shredder said:


> .... We like to think we can keep our cool all the time, but like a bear protecting her cubs, sometimes those animal instincts come out......


I don't know what happened here either, but one thing that is supposed to separate us humans from other animals is that we are able to override our instincts with rational and logical thought. Of course many people and certain entire cultures can't or do not do this...


Edit: if that altercation really happened the way she described it (her totally calm, him complete psycho with no provocation) then that guy sounds like a walking time bomb.. something seems missing.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

*best move since switching to shells*

I wouldnt worry too much about the lifetime ban, 2 years ago I permanently banned Vail resorts from me.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

I don't know how a month has passed without a video showing up either. #worldstar


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

Not buying it.
I don't think guy was innocent but she's fabricating and advertising her son.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

Alkasquawlik said:


> Way to generalize Argo.
> 
> I'm calling bullshit. I ride at Northstar regularly and I have a lot of friends that work/ride there daily. She was in the Vista line and I have serious doubts that no one in that line said/did anything if what she said happen is the truth, especially if a man hit a mother for no reason. Additionally, Vail doesn't pull passes like that, let alone ban people for threatening to call the police. You can have your thoughts on Vail, but they stress customer satisfaction as a priority to every employee. I've talked to some friends and the 'other side' of the story is that SHE was the aggressor and hit him. He did curse her out, obviously, but he did not get physical with her. Waiting to see Vail's side of the story, whenever that comes out. They're at a 'no comment' as of right now, according to my friends.
> 
> Also, the blog reeks like an ad for her son. Why the need to post the video in there?


I don't see a generalization at all, just an observation. Most resorts have a group or two that are in the douche column. I have had plenty of friends get passes pulled for the season for pretty much nothing. I know 2 people who have life bans, one is just from a patroller with a hard on to fuck with the dude.

I agree that it's a little suspect and also looks like advertising.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

*where are the unicorns?*



Argo said:


> I don't see a generalization at all, just an observation. Most resorts have a group or two that are in the douche column. I have had plenty of friends get passes pulled for the season for pretty much nothing. I know 2 people who have life bans, one is just from a patroller with a hard on to fuck with the dude.
> 
> I agree that it's a little suspect and also looks like advertising.


there are for sure an elevated % of douchebag powertripping ski nerds in management of resorts around the country. Every resort has them. Its some weird combined fantasy of cop + bro brah nonsense.

By the same token, I've had ski patrol let me off for doing stupid shit just because we were both respectful and cool.

I would pretty much expect any disrespect toward management anywhere to end up in a ban of some sort regardless of who is right and wrong, they don't have to let u ride their lifts. (not defending dude or attacking lady, but you have to be able to tiptoe thru the tulips and seem like a reasonable adult, we've pretty well established this was at teh minimum a wild incident).

If he did hit her, I hope a bunch of ppl are around when he gets bitch slapped by karma, like the little bitch that he is.

From the start I'm imagining an "almost" collision worth no excitement, dumb guy says "watch the fuck out" cuz her kid is standing somewhere retarded, and she goes apeshit not because of the actual physical danger (indeed the lack thereof, "almost" doesnt count in knife cuts, car accidents, or ski hill accidents; almost is already there when u decided to leave the house), but because someone dare to say shit to her kid in front of her. In the old days all old people were responsible to tell any dumbfuck kid they were a dumbfuck. These days dumbfuck parents don't want their kids finding out they've been raised in a whole family of dumbfucks (yes the millenials are reproducing, making copies of their fuckery), and when it happens they freak out WORSE than if something else may have happened (may or may not be the case here, but its a popular modern story).

This is just a theory, but there is a shitload of story because this guy "almost" hit her kid. Why is there a story at all? He didn't hit her kid? Why are we talking about this?

I have good friends with whom you cannot reason with vis a vis their kids, I'm just glad I was raised with germs and bleeding and the older kids being tough on us.

IMO if you are a dude and u hit a girl you are the lowest piece of shit unless she had a weapon and you were gonna get hospitalized. I bleed and get bruised and banged up all the time in my daily life, short of her being a fucking ninja, I'm not hitting back. Brutality and abuse against women is an age old problem that is being shown in a real light for teh first time in history because of social media. Because of social media there are also gonna be opportunists. I got a real issue with the violence against women, I am super anti-NFL for example because of this.

These problems are not just bad individuals, they are systemic.


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## snowangel99 (Mar 11, 2016)

I have friends whose kids are perfect angels too. I don't even bother anymore.

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## david_z (Dec 14, 2009)

nutmegchoi said:


> Not buying it.
> I don't think guy was innocent but she's fabricating and advertising her son.


I'm not exactly buying the story either; there's absolutely got to be some (significant) pieces missing. Of course it's all speculation, but I think it's far more likely that this is a case of someone who may bear a larger part of the blame than she readily admits, completely overreacting (butthurt dialed up to 11) and trying to rationalize her actions, than it is an intentionally deceitful PR stunt. 

Surveying what's out there, she doesn't seem overboard on the self-promotion, like she has only published 4 articles on her blog in the last year, and her FB page has nothing since like September. 

The story is so fucking over the top that I feel like you couldn't really make this up, and if you did, you'd have to be certifiably insane to think you could *publish it as fact* and not face serious consequences! If it's bullshit, or even partly bullshit, that's going to come out and the lady (and by extension, her kid) are going to be pretty much ruined. Vail could pursue a slander/libel suit against her, etc. They probably wouldn't, but they could.


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

If I really got punch (by a full grown man) in my eye, there's noway I'll close my eye to take the proof photo.
My sclera will bloodshot and it'll be more than some purple on my eyelid to show.


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## psklt (Jan 5, 2016)

Definitely parts missing or overly exaggerated.. I agree that if this all happened in a lift line you'd have cell phones out and people intervening more. If there were people yelling "dude you just hit a girl" why didn't they do anything to help unless she started hitting him first? I can't speak for everyone out there as there are some real nut cases, but I really can't imagine a guy just going ape shit and getting super physical in a likely crowded public lift line from a small verbal confrontation. 

Sounds like she's trying to get a viral story out similar to the Aspen chairlift pusher


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## AgingPunk (Feb 18, 2014)

snowangel99 said:


> I have friends whose kids are perfect angels too. I don't even bother anymore.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk


Just another one of the reasons I love teaching where I do vs traditional suburbs.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

Where's @Fielding when you need him?


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## Trabi75 (Dec 12, 2014)

Really seems to be a lot missing from this story. I can't believe the comments on her blog. I just scanned them,but none seems to be curious that there is no cell phone footage. You know multiple people would've had their phones out taking pics and what not before this started,so it's pretty amazing none of these phones(let alone none of the other phones in pockets) were then turned to film this and posted straight to FB or YouTube. 
Weird. I can't believe anyone who isn't questioning at least part of her account

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

Trabi75 said:


> Really seems to be a lot missing from this story. I can't believe the comments on her blog. I just scanned them,but none seems to be curious that there is no cell phone footage. You know multiple people would've had their phones out taking pics and what not before this started,so it's pretty amazing none of these phones(let alone none of the other phones in pockets) were then turned to film this and posted straight to FB or YouTube.
> Weird. I can't believe anyone who isn't questioning at least part of her account
> 
> Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk


She probably deleted responses she didn't like.
It's her blog after all.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

snowklinger said:


> I wouldnt worry too much about the lifetime ban, 2 years ago I permanently banned Vail resorts from me.


I permanently banned your ass over three years ago and you're still here...


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Argo said:


> I don't see a generalization at all, just an observation. Most resorts have a group or two that are in the douche column. I have had plenty of friends get passes pulled for the season for pretty much nothing. I know 2 people who have life bans, one is just from a patroller with a hard on to fuck with the dude.
> 
> I agree that it's a little suspect and also looks like advertising.


It also seems Alkasquawlik has a little more inside info than most. I think he's probably dead on. Unfortunately California has a bunch of entitled douchebag personalities and I suspect this mom is one of them. She threw a bunch of crap out there, that anywhere else would have resulted in arrests. I have to go with Alka's observation that her report is bullshit.


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

ridinbend said:


> Where's @Fielding when you need him?


Statistically the odds are that he's either given up snowboarding, or he's had an accident!!!!!


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

Mizu Kuma said:


> Statistically the odds are that he's either given up snowboarding, or he's had an accident!!!!!


Please site your sources. I think he statistically had a heart attack or something along those lines.


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## shitty shredder (Feb 6, 2016)

https://www.reddit.com/r/snowboarding/comments/4bppra/woman_assaulted_in_line_northstar/d1bvtcd



> My comments keep getting deleted in TwoX... I hope that I can help spread the truth somewhere.
> I was there that spring like day of Feburary 25, 2016. I was in the lift line, waiting for a friend to meet up with me when this woman slammed into the guy she is accusing of hitting her. She came into the lift line extremely fast and out of control. She hit him and fell, and he actually tried to help her up! He was certainly a little pissed off, but anyone would be. The only contact at his point was him trying to help her up with her huge backpack and camera. She started to immediately yell and scream at him, getting in his face for "cutting her son off". He told her to back off and to chill out. This is when she closed fist punched him in the jaw! I couldn't believe my eyes. His next movement was taking his headphones off. I could tell he was so angry, he flung off his headphones in a furry, and they looked like like hit her a little in the head. The Northstar staff was on this situation like flies on shit. Before I knew it, ski patrol and the guys in yellow were there separating both parties and trying to figure it all out.
> In her blog post she mentions that only the men of security were there and taking advantage of her (basically..) Which is a lie. I distinctly remember a woman employee coming up to her FIRST to take her story.
> I don't know much after that because my friend arrived and we peaced out. She is being overly dramatic and straight up lying to everyone. I am ashamed of this behavior as I am a woman my self. Her actions were not cool, and down right nasty. I hope the truth can be exposed by more people and shine a light on this horrible, lying woman who is playing the fake victim card!
> ...


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

First google for her name comes up with ...

"I will be boycotting PetSmart and I would encourage others to do the same. They won't let my neighbor put up a lost dog flier in their store! ...."

So ya, a bit of a pattern of using the internet as her personal soap box and thinking she can influence the world with her tantrums.

Thank you facebook for all the monsters you've created...


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

That's it.
We have an angry lawyer, active online investigators and local connections.
She can't fool us!


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## WasabiCanuck (Apr 29, 2015)

Weird. There are alot of douche bags in terrain parks that's for sure. But I don't know...her story is too one sided.

How could this not be filmed? Everyone has a camera on their head at a ski hill! Or a phone at least. Even the victim had a camera in her hand! Why didn't she start filming the crazy guy?

I'm sure there is some truth in her story but I don't think it is the whole truth. I feel bad for the kid. They have been posting videos on YouTube of him for years trying to get him sponsored. I just hope all that attention and pressure doesn't eff him up. He's a little kid, just let him ride and have fun. 

Why are so many parents trying to take their kids pro in sports? Just relax and let the kids have fun.


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

nutmegchoi said:


> That's it.
> We have an angry lawyer, active online investigators and local connections.
> She can't fool us!


Let's get her!!!!!


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

What Would Honey Boo Boo Do?

This shit is clickbait. I'm not even going to bother clicking that link in post 1. By posting this here, the OP is doing exavtly what the trash blog creator wanted.


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

Mizu Kuma said:


> Let's get her!!!!!


She punched me in the eye!
In front of my 16 year old cat!!
My cat is traumatized!!!
She's never gonna be able to snowboard again.


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## WestshoreLoc (Mar 24, 2016)

Sunbrewed - I am with you as someone that went to Rideout and North Tahoe High BUT you are incorrect about there being only 2 high schools. There 3 when you include Incline which is not too far from Northstar.


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## friscogal (Mar 24, 2016)

first time poster.

we spent about 18 days at northstar this season and spend most of our time on vista as my husband and kids like the terrain park and husband likes the half-pipe.

my boys are just learning and 6 & 8 and I have never had any aggression or rudeness from boarders except for the 2 that tried to cut in front of us in the lift line but when I said something they apologized.

There are a couple douchy boarders but I think they are just typical teenage locals...i am sure my boys will be the same way in 10 years.

Also, the resort is full of families and I do not see it going down like she says without someone coming to her aid.


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## WestshoreLoc (Mar 24, 2016)

Entitled douche-bag personalities are not exclusive to any place. Even Iowa where she is from.


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## Noreaster (Oct 7, 2012)

By the way her son is pretty damn fantastic for his age. Hopefully mom's antiques aren't going to derail his future in the sport.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Noreaster said:


> By the way her son is pretty damn fantastic for his age. Hopefully mom's antiques aren't going to derail his future in the sport.


Seems like te mom's doing anything she can to get him noticed......


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## snowangel99 (Mar 11, 2016)

F1EA said:


> Seems like te mom's doing anything she can to get him noticed......


:iagree: 

I do believe in humans in general. There is NO way this would have gone down and wouldn`t have caused HAVOC everywhere...if a guy punched a woman in the face in a lift line there is NO way he would get away with it, no way no day!

The recount about him pulling off his (edited to say) headphones (not goggles) and accidentally hitting her as he was doing that is completely plausible. I am sure she felt he did it intentionally so to her it was a punch to the face.


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## BoardWalk (Mar 22, 2011)

snowangel99 said:


> if a guy punched a woman in the face in a lift line there is no way he would get away with it, no way no day!


^^^^^^^^^^ +1


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## dave785 (Jan 21, 2016)

I just feel bad for the son. This rings of something that will blow up in the crazy mom's face (a la UVA rape scandal) and it sounds like his crazy mom is just making her lifetime ban that much worse... plus, Vail will be able to sue for defamation / libel. 

Hope the son isn't too adversely affected by this. I hope his sponsors and film deals don't pull out once the mom is exposed (I'm sure there's video). Hope the dad can still take the son snowboarding while the mom is forced to stay at home.


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## Trabi75 (Dec 12, 2014)

Please see Northstar GM Beth Howard’s letter on this matter: http://www.northstarcalifornia.com/guestletter

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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

Trabi75 said:


> Please see Northstar GM Beth Howard’s letter on this matter: Guest Letter | March 24th, 2016 | northstarcalifornia.com
> 
> Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk


Sounds like it's matching with the witness from reddit.
If there's any truth to heli-mom's story, she shouldn't have a problem finding a witness who can back her up.
Thing is, she won't be able to find it since it's mostly made up from her side.

Though, it's a little strange GM never mentioned "the other guest"'s name.


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## friscogal (Mar 24, 2016)

Noreaster said:


> By the way her son is pretty damn fantastic for his age. Hopefully mom's antiques aren't going to derail his future in the sport.


he is awesome. I am going to show my 8 and 6 year old when they get home.


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

They say there's an open investigation now.
It'll be interesting to see how it ends.

Tahoe detectives probing alleged Northstar assault detailed in viral post | SierraSun.com


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## Trabi75 (Dec 12, 2014)

Yeah the kids good but he might just be getting pushed a little bit to become a pro. I want my 4 year old to try next season, but I will not force it down his throat. 
Kids need to choose their life not just the one their parents want. This may not be the case here but this lady is really putting alot on him

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## WasabiCanuck (Apr 29, 2015)

nutmegchoi said:


> Sounds like it's matching with the witness from reddit.
> If there's any truth to heli-mom's story, she shouldn't have a problem finding a witness who can back her up.
> Thing is, she won't be able to find it since it's mostly made up from her side.
> 
> Though, it's a little strange GM never mentioned "the other guest"'s name.


Oh she will just say the witness was one of the DB's bros. I guess she shouldn't have admitted to hitting the guy.

Now she is trying to make lemonade out of lemons. Trying to get her son more sponsors. Any bets on how long it takes for her to start a go-fund-me page?


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

WasabiCanuck said:


> Oh she will just say the witness was one of the DB's bros. I guess she shouldn't have admitted to hitting the guy.
> 
> Now she is trying to make lemonade out of lemons. Trying to get her son more sponsors. Any bets on how long it takes for her to start a go-fund-me page?


She might need that for her legal fee.

Seems like she was the one who slap the guy and guy punched her back.
Funny how she never mentioned she started physical contact.


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## Alkasquawlik (Jul 13, 2010)

nutmegchoi said:


> Though, it's a little strange GM never mentioned "the other guest"'s name.




There is NO reason for the GM to release the name of the other participant in the altercation. Why? So people can find him on social media/online and harass him when SHE was clearly in the wrong.

I hope Vail black lists her from all of their resorts.


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## Alkasquawlik (Jul 13, 2010)

nutmegchoi said:


> Seems like she was the one who slap the guy and guy punched her back.
> Funny how she never mentioned she started physical contact.


There are no witnesses that say he touched her, even after she instigated the incident. It's only her word, and based on everything else she's written about the incident, I'm not giving her any benefit of the doubt.


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## Trabi75 (Dec 12, 2014)

WasabiCanuck said:


> Oh she will just say the witness was one of the DB's bros. I guess she shouldn't have admitted to hitting the guy.
> 
> Now she is trying to make lemonade out of lemons. Trying to get her son more sponsors. Any bets on how long it takes for her to start a go-fund-me page?


You know I saw someone suggest it to her. Like really! I can't believe people wanna send her money based on her word with no evidence. They had someone in Utah put jars or to collect for a child with cancer. Turned out to be fraud. 
people with money burning a hole in their pocket should send it to a known established aid organization. If they wanna feel they are helping her,then send to an organizing against violence against women. But don't go find her sons pro career 

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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

Alkasquawlik said:


> There are no witnesses that say he touched her, even after she instigated the incident. It's only her word, and based on everything else she's written about the incident, I'm not giving her any benefit of the doubt.


I got that from Sierra Sun?



> On Thursday, while reading from the incident report filed Feb. 25 with PCSO, department spokeswoman Dena Erwin said in a phone interview with the Sun that the suspect allegedly “yelled at her and bumped her with his chest. She said she tried to get away, he followed her, yelling at her … she then turned around and slapped him in the face, and the man then punched her in the left eye.”


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

hopefully the truth will come out as it did with the Aspen chairlift incident. Until then, it's all hearsay.


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## Trabi75 (Dec 12, 2014)

Alkasquawlik said:


> There is NO reason for the GM to release the name of the other participant in the altercation. Why? So people can find him on social media/online and harass him when SHE was clearly in the wrong.
> 
> I hope Vail black lists her from all of their resorts.


I hope they don't release his name. 
If it does turn out the guy didn't do what she says, he will still get tons of hate mail and threats. Thanks to social media all those people already made their minds up. 
If he did do it, he will get punished but it shouldn't be vigilante justice

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk


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## Alkasquawlik (Jul 13, 2010)

nutmegchoi said:


> I got that from Sierra Sun?


Key word "allegedly".


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

*&quot;After Being Violently Assaulted In Front of My 9 Year-Old at Northstar, Vail...*



Alkasquawlik said:


> Key word "allegedly".



At this point, isn't everything "allegedly"?
Until the investigation ends, everything is about he said she said.

I'm not saying she's the victim.
I even think she's making up most the story.
I just don't think the other party isn't 100% innocent, either.

Wait, are you that "the other guy"???!!! lol


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## Alkasquawlik (Jul 13, 2010)

Ya, you caught me. :rollseyes


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## gmore10 (Dec 23, 2011)

I highly doubt it happened this way and shes fabricating. However on the comments that people would see it and do nothing doesn't surprise me. We live in a day and age of bystanders. For example I was at a bar last summer and watched a guy hit his gf outside of a bar. I was the only one to react and went after the guy and it finally got broken up. But there were at least 15 people standing there just watching.


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## shitty shredder (Feb 6, 2016)

I am fairly certain that the witness referred to in the guest letter is the "Always2sides" poster on reddit.

I don't believe the Vail letter either though. I suspect it's closer to the truth, but of course it would not include anything less than a completely favorable outcome for Vail to justify her banning. It's also written by the person that the mother called out on her blog as the uncooperative COO, who she has been fighting with and getting the cold shoulder from, so she is obviously annoyed at this woman on a personal level too.

It's a little odd that the letter says that the guy didn't hit her at all, yet they repeatedly offered to call the police. My guess is there was some mutual exchanging of contact, even if she was the instigator, and even if the other guy was doing so defensively. They wouldn't have offered to call the police if the dude was merely swearing at her.

Also I don't know why everyone insists it must have been on video. Everyone agrees that something crazy happened and there is no video either way. Most people don't run their gopros in the lift line, and their phones are in their pockets. Plus you'd look like a douche holding up your phone to a fight happening right beside you.

And nobody ever steps into fights, especially if there is security or ski patrol whose job is to deal with that, so I'm not sure why that is surprising. People don't want to be involved.

Most importantly, damn, that kid can shred! :eyetwitch2:
You almost don't want to admit it, because then you feel like you only saw it due to a publicity stunt that you don't want to give into...but it's not the kid's fault I guess.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

shitty shredder said:


> Also I don't know why everyone insists it must have been on video. Everyone agrees that something crazy happened and there is no video either way. Most people don't run their gopros in the lift line, and their phones are in their pockets. Plus you'd look like a douche holding up your phone to a fight happening right beside you.
> 
> And nobody ever steps into fights, especially if there is security or ski patrol whose job is to deal with that, so I'm not sure why that is surprising. People don't want to be involved.


We as humans in entirety have perfected the art of getting the cell phone camera out in less than two seconds. Your argument is invalid in this modern day tmz bystander gawking video taking society. Youtube, vimeo, instagram, Jerry of the day, kook of the day, #WORLDSTAR sorry but 100% guarantee there's a video. If not, I'll eat my phone


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

ridinbend said:


> We as humans in entirety have perfected the art of getting the cell phone camera out in less than two seconds. Your argument is invalid in this modern day tmz bystander gawking video taking society. Youtube, vimeo, instagram, Jerry of the day, kook of the day, #WORLDSTAR sorry but 100% guarantee there's a video. If not, I'll eat my phone



I'll be the one shooting that video you eating the phone.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

ridinbend said:


> We as humans in entirety have perfected the art of getting the cell phone camera out in less than two seconds. Your argument is invalid in this modern day tmz bystander gawking video taking society. Youtube, vimeo, instagram, Jerry of the day, kook of the day, #WORLDSTAR sorry but 100% guarantee there's a video. If not, I'll eat my phone


Well it has been picked up by tgr now too. It's in many publications around mountain towns too. Tahoe detectives probing alleged Northstar assault detailed in viral post (updated with Northstar re | VailDaily.com


Whoever is not telling the truth is digging a huge hole now....


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## Noreaster (Oct 7, 2012)

Here's the hard cold truth of all the circus: if she had a legitimate legal case none of this would have seen the light of day and we'd still be happily bitching over the butthurt of having to use I-70 right now.


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Noreaster said:


> Here's the hard cold truth of all the circus: if she had a legitimate legal case none of this would have seen the light of day and we'd still be happily bitching over the butthurt of having to use I-70 right now.


This. If VR didn't feel very strongly that they would come out of this looking very favorable, they would've probably cut her a hush money check attached to a gag order and went on about their business.


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## mojo maestro (Jan 6, 2009)

deagol said:


> hopefully the truth will come out as it did with the Aspen chairlift incident. Until then, it's all hearsay.


Soo.....what happened.....the truth.......


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

nutmegchoi said:


> I'll be the one shooting that video you eating the phone.


I like you. Maybe in another life when we're both cats we can be friends.



mojo maestro said:


> Soo.....what happened.....the truth.......


Dude had just been released from a the week stint in the looney bin. Was also not supposed to be out of sight of his dad but somehow got separated. He shoved the snowboarder off for no reason.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

mojo maestro said:


> Soo.....what happened.....the truth.......


I mixed up a couple of desserts at a buffet in Vegas one time. It was so fn good that I called it "the truth".


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

ridinbend said:


> I like you. Maybe in another life when we're both cats we can be friends.



Aweeee.... That's so sweet.
We'll sniff catnip together.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

Argo said:


> I mixed up a couple of desserts at a buffet in Vegas one time. It was so fn good that I called it "the truth".


So good most people couldn't handle it?


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## Kenai (Dec 15, 2013)

ridinbend said:


> Dude had just been released from a the week stint in the looney bin. Was also not supposed to be out of sight of his dad but somehow got separated. He shoved the snowboarder off for no reason.


Had to check. Wow. Chairlift pusher to plead not guilty by insanity | AspenTimes.com

"A 32-year-old Aspen man who threw a snowboarder off a chairlift at Aspen Highlands in January will plead not guilty by reason of insanity to charges related to the incident, his lawyer said Monday."

Wheee....:skibanana:


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

Oh wow, that's crazy.


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

linvillegorge said:


> This. If VR didn't feel very strongly that they would come out of this looking very favorable, they would've probably cut her a hush money check attached to a gag order and went on about their business.


I'm not so sure about this. We like to think these places have it all figured out but real life circumstances seldom fall completely into their guide lines and training and in the end people end up winging it. Often assuming they have a stronger hand than they do and over play things so to speak.

From Gawker, to Chipotle, GM to whatever the list of fuckups where these places should have done better managing a situation goes on.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

f00bar said:


> I'm not so sure about this. We like to think these places have it all figured out but real life circumstances seldom fall completely into their guide lines and training and in the end people end up winging it. Often assuming they have a stronger hand than they do and over play things so to speak.
> 
> From Gawker, to Chipotle, GM to whatever the list of fuckups where these places should have done better managing a situation goes on.


I'd like to add powdrcorp to your list. Their loss of park city is unfathomable.


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## avery (Nov 4, 2012)

This is such bullshit its fake as fuck. I work at north star and ride that park everyday. The story is cringe worthy


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

f00bar said:


> I'm not so sure about this. We like to think these places have it all figured out but real life circumstances seldom fall completely into their guide lines and training and in the end people end up winging it. Often assuming they have a stronger hand than they do and over play things so to speak.
> 
> From Gawker, to Chipotle, GM to whatever the list of fuckups where these places should have done better managing a situation goes on.





ridinbend said:


> I'd like to add powdrcorp to your list. Their loss of park city is unfathomable.


you forgot to mention the police in general. everywhere.


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## bksdds (Jul 2, 2015)




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## mojo maestro (Jan 6, 2009)

Argo said:


> I mixed up a couple of desserts at a buffet in Vegas one time. It was so fn good that I called it "the truth".


Had a couple drinks in town.......mixed up Mrs maestro with a petite little blonde.........shit happens........


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

mojo maestro said:


> Had a couple drinks in town.......mixed up Mrs maestro with a petite little blonde.........shit happens........


I see you conveniently left out what the petite little blonde was packin :surprise:


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

Kenai said:


> Had to check. Wow. Chairlift pusher to plead not guilty by insanity | AspenTimes.com
> 
> "A 32-year-old Aspen man who threw a snowboarder off a chairlift at Aspen Highlands in January will plead not guilty by reason of insanity to charges related to the incident, his lawyer said Monday."
> 
> Wheee....:skibanana:


I've never understood the insanity plea!!!!!

I mean, if you've been charged with committing a crime that's worthy of playing the insanity card, I woulda thought that it was already pretty obvious that you're not really someone that thinks things through in a rational way?????


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

f00bar said:


> I see you conveniently left out what the petite little blonde was packin :surprise:


A big arse camera and a penchant to blog?????


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## nutmegchoi (Feb 10, 2016)

Mizu Kuma said:


> I've never understood the insanity plea!!!!!
> 
> I mean, if you've been charged with committing a crime that's worthy of playing the insanity card, I woulda thought that it was already pretty obvious that you're not really someone that thinks things through in a rational way?????


Insanity?
Affluenza is the new thing!


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

Mizu Kuma said:


> I've never understood the insanity plea!!!!!
> 
> I mean, if you've been charged with committing a crime that's worthy of playing the insanity card, I woulda thought that it was already pretty obvious that you're not really someone that thinks things through in a rational way?????


Temporary insanity has its place. It's meant to be applied to a situation where things have gone full retard and the person who commits the crime was under a duress that no reasonable person ever is. For example, a father that goes vigilante after finding out his daughter was raped.

In this case perhaps he'll claim he was on a POW high and no reasonable person can be expected to be thinking rationally? Given some of the threads on here is it really so far fetched???? :surprise:


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Mizu Kuma said:


> I've never understood the insanity plea!!!!!
> 
> I mean, if you've been charged with committing a crime that's worthy of playing the insanity card, I woulda thought that it was already pretty obvious that you're not really someone that thinks things through in a rational way?????


That's a _way_ too rational/sane common sense approach to think abt law constructs


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

nutmegchoi said:


> Insanity?
> Affluenza is the new thing!


Maybe they can bring out an Insanity Shot and start an immunisation program?????


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## BoardWalk (Mar 22, 2011)

Mizu Kuma said:


> I've never understood the insanity plea!!!!!


First we need to define sanity.......:crazy1:


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## friscogal (Mar 24, 2016)

avery said:


> This is such bullshit its fake as fuck. I work at north star and ride that park everyday. The story is cringe worthy


You have probably seen us. we are the pumpkin head family (all the boys have orange helmets)


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## snowangel99 (Mar 11, 2016)

Welcome to all the new people to the board who joined just for this thread. Introduce yourself and stay!:dance:


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## mojo maestro (Jan 6, 2009)

f00bar said:


> I see you conveniently left out what the petite little blonde was packin :surprise:


Sweet ass is sweet ass..........I ain't complaining.....


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## matthew203 (Feb 23, 2016)

shes hot!!!!!!


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## sabatoa (Jan 18, 2011)

matthew203 said:


> shes hot!!!!!!


She also seems crazy. I wouldn't recommend sticking things in crazy.


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## dave785 (Jan 21, 2016)

sabatoa said:


> She also seems crazy. I wouldn't recommend sticking things in crazy.


That's how babies are made


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

sabatoa said:


> She also seems crazy. I wouldn't recommend sticking things in crazy.


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## BoardWalk (Mar 22, 2011)

matthew203 said:


> shes hot!!!!!!


cute != hot


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## sabatoa (Jan 18, 2011)

dave785 said:


> That's how babies are made


More like that's how baby mommas are made.


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## Trabi75 (Dec 12, 2014)

sabatoa said:


> More like that's how baby mommas are made.


[emoji23] 

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

Trabi75 said:


> [emoji23]
> 
> Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk


Not worth getting butt hurt on tgr, they're all bitter old men.


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## Trabi75 (Dec 12, 2014)

ridinbend said:


> Not worth getting butt hurt on tgr, they're all bitter old men.


Sure seems like it. I didn't know the g stood for geriatric

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk


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## XxGoGirlxX (Jan 15, 2016)

Gah, quote/reply no worky. I probably clicked too many multiquotes ... So many funny posts :grin: I'm with F1EA not clicking the original link... @ snowklinger is that sarcasm? I thought u are a cop  
@ Nutmegchoi : affluenza! Lol @ mental image of immunization against affluenza syndrome - ya it's called go spend a week in the inner city. Honestly don't you think a cultural exchange program swapping fortunate for unfortunate for even 1 week would do us all a world of good Haha


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## shitty shredder (Feb 6, 2016)

sabatoa said:


> She also seems crazy. I wouldn't recommend sticking things in crazy.


Man, this is so inappropriate.


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

shitty shredder said:


> Man, this is so inappropriate.


Seems like an appropriate response to "she's hot!!!"...

:dunno:


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## shitty shredder (Feb 6, 2016)

Deacon said:


> Seems like an appropriate response to "she's hot!!!"...
> 
> :dunno:


Yeah, to you it probably would be. 

We can't even talk about an incident with this kids mom in a lift line without dudes reducing the conversation to discussing sticking their dick into her? Seriously? Apparently, whoever stuck it in your mom did a piss poor job teaching you about respect.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

shitty shredder said:


> Yeah, to you it probably would be.
> 
> We can't even talk about an incident with this kids mom in a lift line without dudes reducing the conversation to discussing sticking their dick into her? Seriously? Apparently, whoever stuck it in your mom did a piss poor job teaching you about respect.


Guess your part of the Northstar douche squad after all. 

First you come in talking shit about her and now your defending her honor. Lol. Scratch that, it was avery talking smack.... you may not even belong to Northstar


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## shitty shredder (Feb 6, 2016)

Argo said:


> Guess your part of the Northstar douche squad after all.
> 
> First you come in talking shit about her and now your defending her honor. Lol


Jesus, no wonder snowboarders have the stereotype that they do. I think it's inappropriate to reduce every woman to something to stick your dick into, and that makes _me_ the douche?

It ain't about her. I've never been to Northstar or Iowa or wherever the hell she is from. When you take the conversation there, you're no longer disrespecting her, you're disrespecting women. It's just unnecessary. Do you think the few women left participating in our community enjoy hearing that low class bullshit all the time? Here's a secret: they don't get super stoked about it.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

Butthurt much? 

I'm guessing that the chicks that have been on this board for a while and that stick around probably a bigger set of testicles than you do. 

I have been married for almost 20 years so I don't think I will be out sticking my dick in anything foreign, at least until my wife kicks the bucket. I think the dude that said it is in the same type of scenario that I am. I also am pretty sure that the people that post here regularly get that. Quit trying to be an Internet hero.


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## jae (Nov 27, 2015)

So i guess both your seasons ended? mines ending soon, unless I want to travel up north.. maybe to northstar? lol

Things are not a issue unless you make it one. If one of the ladies says something I would imagine argo would respect their wishes, but there's no need to white knight a purple dragon. This aint facebook yo


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## Rogue (Nov 29, 2014)

Damn so I shouldn't talk about @Mizu Kuma 's pole anymore? Or how this forum is a sausage fest and how much I love the free range organic type? 

Honestly your post is way way too dramatic for this thread and that's saying something for the comments everyone has added. You're acting like this crazy chick is your mama, Shitty.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

Nah but I'm at work and have to be awake. I rode this morning and have more than 2 months of Season left.


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## Rogue (Nov 29, 2014)

Argo said:


> Nah but I'm at work and have to be awake. I rode this morning and have more than 2 months of Season left.



That makes two of us


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## jae (Nov 27, 2015)

I hate you both.


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## matthew203 (Feb 23, 2016)

I meant hot headed....oops


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

matthew203 said:


> shes hot!!!!!!





sabatoa said:


> She also seems crazy. I wouldn't recommend sticking things in crazy.





shitty shredder said:


> Man, this is so inappropriate.





Deacon said:


> Seems like an appropriate response to "she's hot!!!"...
> 
> :dunno:


Try reading the series of comments again you kook. What I said was Sab's response _was_ appropriate to somebody commenting "she's hot".



shitty shredder said:


> Yeah, to you it probably would be.
> 
> We can't even talk about an incident with this kids mom in a lift line without dudes reducing the conversation to discussing sticking their dick into her? Seriously? Apparently, whoever stuck it in your mom did a piss poor job teaching you about respect.


Speaking of inappropriate. You want to talk about my parents off of one post that _you misunderstood_. Cool. Thanks for stopping by.


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## XxGoGirlxX (Jan 15, 2016)

I kinda chuckled at deac, it was not as explicit and offensive as SS's following comments about genitals. Crappyshredder, where were you when I got told in someone's humble opinion a lady's best way to shred is to stay in the kitchen?? Lol that was directed right at a lady on your forum, not at some crazy female stranger. Lmao SMH


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## snowangel99 (Mar 11, 2016)

sabatoa said:


> She also seems crazy. I wouldn't recommend sticking things in crazy.


Oh my husband did that and now he has to deal with me every single day of his life.[emoji14] [emoji14] [emoji14] [emoji14] [emoji14] [emoji14] [emoji14] [emoji14] [emoji14] 

Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk


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## taco tuesday (Jul 26, 2014)

Easily offended? Here's a secret. Get over yourself. 

Try not taking things out of context also.

Have a nice day.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

things are going according to plan here.....carry on....


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## bksdds (Jul 2, 2015)

*Gonna kick it up a little bit....*

BAM!! ~ emeril lagasse


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

The community opted to no longer end threads with yoga pants a year or two ago out of respect to our female members. It's worked well, let's not go backwards.


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## Trabi75 (Dec 12, 2014)

Deacon said:


> The community opted to no longer end threads with yoga pants a year or two ago.


Lol. I had no clue what that was about. I thought someone was trying to make me feel worse.

I'm laying on the couch with the flu watching the Webcam at my resort. :cabin fever:

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk


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## XxGoGirlxX (Jan 15, 2016)

Deacon said:


> The community opted to no longer end threads with yoga pants a year or two ago out of respect to our female members. It's worked well, let's not go backwards.


Yeah... +1 please. 

My 7 yr old daughter is right next to me in the room and thank GOD didn't happen to be looking at the screen before I scrolled down fast. Close call...

:no2:


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

snowangel99 said:


> Oh my husband did that and now he has to deal with me every single day of his life.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk


This is awesome. You win


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

Luckily anything worth saying on this thread occurred in the first 8 or so pages before it turned into this. Might as well close it down at this point, its way off point.


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## bksdds (Jul 2, 2015)

f00bar said:


> Luckily anything worth saying on this thread occurred in the first 8 or so pages before it turned into this. Might as well close it down at this point, its way off point.


More like somewhere in the area of page 6-7.


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## snowangel99 (Mar 11, 2016)

Well at least I finally understand the yoga pants references! I always wondered and now I know.

Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

*Join me in the Fight Against Literacy!*



XxGoGirlxX said:


> Yeah... +1 please.
> 
> My 7 yr old daughter is right next to me in the room and thank GOD didn't happen to be looking at the screen before I scrolled down fast. Close call...
> 
> :no2:





snowangel99 said:


> Well at least I finally understand the yoga pants references! I always wondered and now I know.
> 
> Sent from my SM-N910W8 using Tapatalk


Education always has a price.


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## XxGoGirlxX (Jan 15, 2016)

snowklinger said:


> snowangel99 said:
> 
> 
> > Well at least I finally understand the yoga pants references! I always wondered and now I know.
> ...


Lol! Fight against "yoga pant" literacy :laugh at: Ya, this was no iPhone sized easy to hide webbrowser I was on at the time. Those pics were pretty much life sized - on my massive iMac screen and my scroll button on my mouse is broken so sheesh was I screwed lol live n learn next time I won't get caught with my ... Oh wait... Nvm


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

XxGoGirlxX said:


> Lol! Ya, this was no iPhone sized easy to hide webbrowser I was on at the time. Those pics were pretty much life sized dude - on my massive iMac screen and my scroll is set way too slow to get past those fast... That makes a difference for sure. Gah! Lol live n learn


So we shouldn't fight for equality by posting pictures of guys in yoga pants too then...?

How about this (clickable and hopefully unoffensive thumbnail) video prank :wink:


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

*my wife is yelling at me to stfu...*



Phedder said:


> So we shouldn't fight for equality by posting pictures of guys in yoga pants too then...?
> 
> How about this (clickable and hopefully unoffensive thumbnail) video prank :wink:


thread closed.

Phedder won.

Thanks for playing.


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

I'm just glad that you girls haven't started a Jock Strap Thread!!!!! 

Me : Opening Web Browser; "WTF"?????
My Wife: Looking over at why I said WTF; "WTF"?????
Me: ..... ; "I'm going to the Pub for a while"!!!!!
My Wife: ; "Yes, I think you should"!!!!!
Me: Now absolutely bewildered; "WTF"?????


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## XxGoGirlxX (Jan 15, 2016)

Phedder said:


> XxGoGirlxX said:
> 
> 
> > Lol! Ya, this was no iPhone sized easy to hide webbrowser I was on at the time. Those pics were pretty much life sized dude - on my massive iMac screen and my scroll is set way too slow to get past those fast... That makes a difference for sure. Gah! Lol live n learn
> ...


Lmfao! Awesomeeeee


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

:hellno:


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