# Please Help Me Initiate Heel Carves



## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

There's a deep carving thread that's long and dense, but there's some good videos and discussions pertaining to this if you skim through it. 

I think a big part of initiating a good heelside carve is getting your weight forward over the nose. The idea is to get the edge at the front contact point to engage, and then you drag the rest of the edge through that initial trench. Most of the problems I've encountered with heelside carves are related to having my weight too far in the back seat. 

For me, carving isn't really about foot steering. I probably think about what my feet are doing last. On a good carve, your board follows your body movements like a trailer follows a car. I think about driving the car more than I think about driving the trailer.


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

CyberOprah said:


> After years of turning, I FINALLY learned to toe-side carve. I’ve lurked the forums, I’ve watched the YT vids, but some dude just said “flick both your toes on the edge at the exact same time” and it just clicked for me.
> BUT I can’t figure out heel-side carves. Sometimes I can get up on an edge after I’m already doing a turn, but I think I’m initiating it wrong. Can you guys please just describe what you do with your feet to start a heel-carve? I’m hoping something will just click.


When i was still learning, a good advice i heard was to curl your toes down to go toe side and pull them up(like trying to touch the top of your boot)for heelside. These days I mostly start to engage the turn by driving through the knees/legs


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## SushiLover (Sep 17, 2020)

Exactly what @WigMar said, you need to get your weight over the nose as you initiate and drive with your front foot and hold it a bit until the sidecut is fully engaged and then you shift your weight back to the middle of the board and let your back foot push towards the middle of the board.


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## CyberOprah (Jan 8, 2022)

Thanks dudes! I really appreciate your replies. I’ll try all your tips and report back!
After finally carving on my toes yesterday, I’m more stoked on riding than ever before. 
It’s like learning that I’ve been riding a bike incorrectly.


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## t21 (Dec 29, 2010)

CyberOprah said:


> Thanks dudes! I really appreciate your replies. I’ll try all your tips and report back!
> After finally carving on my toes yesterday, I’m more stoked on riding than ever before.
> It’s like learning that I’ve been riding a bike incorrectly.


you could also turn or point out your front knee towards your direction of turn and that would give you a sharper carve turn.


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

t21 said:


> you could also turn or point out your front knee towards your direction of turn and that would give you a sharper carve turn.


I am FAR from a great carver, so hesitate to even post on here, but that's my thought I use. Point my front knee as far as I can heelside as I can while squatting into the front of my board. Biggest thing is not rushing it for me and just letting it happen. 

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk


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## CyberOprah (Jan 8, 2022)

I can’t wait to try these tips out. Thanks again!


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## StuPac (Jan 5, 2022)

I position myself as if reaching for an indy grab. That'll get you crouched with your shoulders pointing straight / just into the turn. Sometimes I do grab for a bit of steez!


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

CyberOprah said:


> After years of turning, I FINALLY learned to toe-side carve. I’ve lurked the forums, I’ve watched the YT vids, but some dude just said “flick both your toes on the edge at the exact same time” and it just clicked for me.
> BUT I can’t figure out heel-side carves. Sometimes I can get up on an edge after I’m already doing a turn, but I think I’m initiating it wrong. Can you guys please just describe what you do with your feet to start a heel-carve? I’m hoping something will just click.


Don't bother with the deep carving threads. Watch youtube videos about basic carving. Do the exercises where you go across the piste. 

Coming from a toe side carve into a heel side carve I personally often initiate the turn too late because it's too easy closing the toe side turn. You hang in there too long and you will end up going perpendicular to the fall line or even back up hill. It takes a lot to get proper heel side carve going when you finish the toe side turn too late. So you will end up initiating the turn doing a skidded turn because your board cant handle the abrupt change you're trying to force on it. 

Go on a mellow slope. Get some decent speed up. Do the toe side carve. Way before you are going perpendicular to the fall line you initiate the heel side turn and keep going in the trajectory you are already going. That means you will be aiming at the same side you were heading towards. Regular - the right hand of the pist. Make sure you have space to initiate the turn so you can get the arc going. Bend your knees, sit down a bit and get your toes up. Then follow the board as it turns down the fall line and over towards the other side.

A large part of geting the carve going is timing.

Check out the part at 4:11









How To Carve On A Snowboard


Everyone loves carving like a madman and destroying the perfectly groomed corduroy. Now you can too! Check out this tutorial and improve your carving on a snowboard today! Remember, get even more tutorials with the Snowboard Addiction Snowboard Tutorial Membership! (Rider/Narrating: Nev Lapwood)...




snowboardaddiction.com


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

How much fwd lean are you running on your bindings?


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## CyberOprah (Jan 8, 2022)

Snowdaddy said:


> Don't bother with the deep carving threads. Watch youtube videos about basic carving. Do the exercises where you go across the piste.
> 
> Coming from a toe side carve into a heel side carve I personally often initiate the turn too late because it's too easy closing the toe side turn. You hang in there too long and you will end up going perpendicular to the fall line or even back up hill. It takes a lot to get proper heel side carve going when you finish the toe side turn too late. So you will end up initiating the turn doing a skidded turn because your board cant handle the abrupt change you're trying to force on it.
> 
> ...


Awesome! Thank you for the detailed response. The way you explained it totally makes sense - I can’t wait to try it out!


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## CyberOprah (Jan 8, 2022)

ridethecliche said:


> How much fwd lean are you running on your bindings?


I’m not sure what the exact angle is, but it looks about 75 degrees (if 90 degrees is zero fwd lean). I’d guess it’s like 15 or 20% of my Flows’ max fwd lean capacity. I can take a pic, if that’s helpful. But basically I set them forward enough to remind myself to bend my knees, but they’re not set super aggressive. I’m guessing I should probably move em forward more?


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

Couldn't hurt to try!


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## Spid (Jan 4, 2022)

CyberOprah said:


> After years of turning, I FINALLY learned to toe-side carve. I’ve lurked the forums, I’ve watched the YT vids, but some dude just said “flick both your toes on the edge at the exact same time” and it just clicked for me.
> BUT I can’t figure out heel-side carves. Sometimes I can get up on an edge after I’m already doing a turn, but I think I’m initiating it wrong. Can you guys please just describe what you do with your feet to start a heel-carve? I’m hoping something will just click.



A few thoughts on heelside carves:

You have much less range of motion from standing flat when lifting your toes (flexing ankle joint) than when pushing with them (extending ankle joint). You also have much less strength and feel for the snow and it is harder to balance on the heels than on the forefoot. By bending the knees when you initiate the turn, you can then straighten/extend them to apply pressure to the board, pushing it into the snow. You don't want to run out of range of motion because you will skid or chatter. Don't push the board away from you - balance and push into the snow.

Keep your wrists in front of your hips and don't rotate your torso toward your heelside as this tends to push the tail of the board away from you, and makes it hard to apply pressure along the length of the board to keep it carving.

Turn your HEAD, not entire torso, in the direction of the turn and bend the front leg first. Front leg first twists the board along its length, flattening the nose of the board causing it to head back downhill and hooks up the nose of the board earlier as flattening it moves it closer to the snow. It also causes your hip to drop and rotate in the direction of the turn. Leave the ankles relaxed at the end of each turn to keep more range of motion for the next. Head - front knee - back knee - extend legs and use ankles. 

Finish your toe turn! You should pressure the tail of the snowboard with the leg at the end of the turn. this keeps the tail locked in at the end of the turn and helps create a forward hip motion along the length of the board into the next turn (pressuring the nose after initiating the turn moves it back). Increasing the edge angle of the tail using the ankle also helps here.

Except for the limited range if motion in the ankle, ALL OF THIS APPLIES TO TOESIDE AS WELL.

Try not to be static and park on the edge. If you are doing something with your legs, It makes it easier to balance (whole other subject)

Hope this helps


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## CyberOprah (Jan 8, 2022)

Spid said:


> A few thoughts on heelside carves:
> 
> You have much less range of motion from standing flat when lifting your toes (flexing ankle joint) than when pushing with them (extending ankle joint). You also have much less strength and feel for the snow and it is harder to balance on the heels than on the forefoot. By bending the knees when you initiate the turn, you can then straighten/extend them to apply pressure to the board, pushing it into the snow. You don't want to run out of range of motion because you will skid or chatter. Don't push the board away from you - balance and push into the snow.
> 
> ...


I love it! Thank you so much for the detailed response - you made it easy for me to visualize. Can’t wait to try it!


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## bob2356 (Jul 13, 2012)

CyberOprah said:


> I love it! Thank you so much for the detailed response - you made it easy for me to visualize. Can’t wait to try it!


Spid hit on some very good points. I find the key is the hips. Posters are saying press your front leg, but your front leg can't do much unless you are dropping your hip into the turn and leading your front leg along. Both toe and heel side. 

Initiating the turn promptly coming off toe side is also a great point. People are afraid to throw their weight down the hill to some degree or another. Being on toe side and looking up the hill is much more comfortable. than heel side looking down the hill. So people hang on toe side too long.

Check that you aren't counter rotating to some degree which is having your front shoulder further up the fall line than the board. It's super common even for people who are pretty good riders. You need to be leading the board through the fall line, not be behind it. Again it's more comfortable to lean your shoulders into the uphill. I actually teach beginners to swing their front arm around and point to where they want to go. The shoulders have to follow the hand/arm and the hips have to follow the shoulders. Once your hips drop into the turn the board is on edge, it has other choice. Viola as they say in France. Yes it's a crutch and I encourage them to drop it quickly once they are up to speed but I had people advance amazingly quickly doing it since they never fall into the counter rotation trap. . 

A good excercise that I have people practice is making super short turns super quickly in a relatively flat area. Really dig the edge in doing it. It lets you feel the edges working and the movement of the board very intensely. Doing it right you look like a dolphin popping up and down. Work up to it because you can also really bust your butt doing it. Does give you something to do in boring run outs though.


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