# Beginner Boot Fit Questions



## Fire Rose (Feb 15, 2016)

First off, I am a total beginner (I've had 3 lessons so far) but I am really enjoying snowboarding, so I've decided to invest in my own boots to start with. The rental boots that I got from the mountain for the lessons didn't fit me at all. I was getting awful heel lift and they made my arches ache. Plus they had traditional lacing and I wasn't really strong enough to get them tight enough. (Why do my posts always end up being novels? Sorry. The important stuff is more towards the end.)

My problem is I have seriously hard to fit feet. I wear between a size 8 and 8.5 (womens, and I wear 9 street shoes) and have wide feet, ankles (cankles really), and calves. Plus I'm 5' with proportionally short legs, so boots will go higher up on my leg than an average height lady. I am overly cautious of how boots fit around my ankles and tendons, since I was born with mild club foot and have had the Achilles in both of my ankles surgically extended. Its been more than 5 years since the surgeries, but I don't want to cause any issues in the long run.

I went to REI on Monday to try on some boots. They started me with 7.5 boots, since I measured between a 7.5 and 8, but my toes were seriously curling in the 7.5. They only had one 8 in stock, a Burton Mint, which was way too narrow. The guy had me try on a 8.5 thirtytwo boot that fit great but was well out of my price range (250ish if I remember correctly) and had traditional laces, which I don't really want. I ended up ordering a pair of Salomon Scarlet boots in 8.5. I had tried these boots on in 7.5, and I thought a larger size might fit correctly. I also ordered them in a 8 so I could try both sizes. Well the 8.5 Salomon boots arrived Tuesday (fast shipping!) and were too long, and narrow enough that my left foot started tingling while I was fiddling around with putting on my right boot. Which also pretty much rules out the size 8 boots that I ordered but haven't arrived yet. 

I decided to check for thirtytwo boots my size in a store near me, and found an REI that had the Lashed in an 8.5 and the STW in an 8. I tried on both boots, and was pretty torn between them, but ended up purchasing the Lashed boots. I was told the STW (size 8) were a bit too small, since I could feel the liner pressing on my big toe standing up. When I pushed my knees forward, I could still feel the liner, but it wasn't pressing anymore. I wasn't sure how I felt about the single boa either. With the Lashed boots I could feel the liner standing up, but not really with my knees pushed forward. I also preferred that the FT lacing, since the bottom and upper zones are separate. I did notice that the lashed boots have a large bump of padding on each side of the ankle to help with heel hold, but it didn't really bother me while I was in the store.

When I got home, I tried the boots back on, and I felt like the ankle padding (is there a technical term for this?) was pinching my ankles like crazy. When my knees are bent forward and my ankles driven into the back of the boot this doesn't cause me any issues, but the minute I stand up straight it starts to hurt again. My feet didn't start tingling, but the pain continued after I took the boot off plus it felt like the blood was rushing back to my foot. Also I noticed that the top of the liner wasn't completely closing around my calf.

Now I know all boots will pack out to some extent and both styles are heat moldable as well. Am I right in assuming the fit issues with the Lashed boots are beyond help? I'm tempted to return the Lashed and buy the STW in 8. Will heat molding/packing out help give my big toe a bit more room? The pressing wasn't really painful, just uncomfortable. I'm trying to stick with REI for their amazing return policy. I figure if I find a boot that fits well enough for me to want to try to ride in but it still doesn't work out, I could return it even next season.


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

First off, good show on buying boots first! You must have been reading the forum...

Now, one thing I've heard as an option is going with mens boots. We tend to have wider feet and bigger calfs for a given foot length (I think!), so that may be an option. 

I know some Burton mens models are available in a 6, which would likely be the right length for you.

Now as for the toe issue, when your toes were hitting the front of the boots, were you standing straight up, or in an athletic stance? When you stand in an athletic stance, it'll naturally pull your toes back a bit. If they're still hitting the front, and are really uncomfortable, the boots are too small.

Trust me when I say that with poor fitting boots, 99% of people buy boots too big, and 1% too small. That said, they shouldn't make your feet numb when laced up, shouldn't have bad pressure points, etc. 

Take your time and find the pair that's right for your body, you'll thank yourself in the end!


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Do you have a shop where they actually do fitting of boots? If they don't offer heat molding, probably look for a shop where they also sell ski stuff and do know how to fit boots. Could be that you pay some bucks more than in a big shop where they don't know left from right, but good fitting boots are soooo important... it's worth it.

Does your boot have a liner which can be heat molded? How much room you'll get depends on the liner type. I've a Deeluxe boot with a PF liner, i.e. a thick liner which isn't supposed to be heat molded but rather "adjusts" to the feet while wearing. Their ancle supporting bumps (I've no term for this neither ) were uncomfy pinching the first day when trying them, but already after some days wearing they molded nicely to my ancles - and after 30days, I had to get J bars fitted cos they didn't support the ancles enough anymore . Liners which are supposed to be heat molded however, aren't that thick n soft and won't give so much room after wearing, but they should be correctly molded/fitted in the shop.


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## Fire Rose (Feb 15, 2016)

> Now as for the toe issue, when your toes were hitting the front of the boots, were you standing straight up, or in an athletic stance?


When I was standing in an athletic stance the STW boots (the size 8 boots) were touching, but not really pressing on my big toe.
The Lashed boots (8.5, the ones I bought with the ankle issues) my toes don't touch when I'm in an athletic stance. My toes do touch when I'm standing straight up, but the ankle padding is also pushing forward on my foot.



> Do you have a shop where they actually do fitting of boots?


I've been shopping at REI. They do offer heat molding, and the boots I bought are heat moldable, as are the other style that I was looking at. The first store I went to the guy helping me was pretty useful, but it was a small location and didn't have much selection. The second store the guy helping me was pretty useless, but he was sent on a break part way through helping me and his replacement was helpful. He told me to wear the boots I bought a few times before getting them heat molded.



> Their ancle supporting bumps were uncomfy pinching the first day when trying them, but already after some days wearing they molded nicely to my ancles


Were they just tight pinching or painful? I'm worried that it may cause issues before I'm able to break them in. They are pretty painful after a short period of time unless I am driving my ankles into the back of my boot by bending my knees. On the other hand, I'm worried the other boots I was looking at might give me some heel lift because they have no heel support padding. I'm assuming this is something that could be added in later by a boot fitter as needed?

I've considered mens boots, but I thought I read somewhere that it isn't a good idea. Now I don't remember if there was specific reasoning (other than just women's boots have been specially made for women's feet) and I can't find where I read it. Maybe I'm just imagining things.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Fire Rose said:


> Were they just tight pinching or painful?


Painfu at first. But as said, their liner is specifically thick and meant to "embrace" the foot tightly at first. Dunno how heat moldable liners will break in at the same extent. The Deelux dude said no.



Fire Rose said:


> I've considered mens boots, but I thought I read somewhere that it isn't a good idea. Now I don't remember if there was specific reasoning (other than just women's boots have been specially made for women's feet) and I can't find where I read it. Maybe I'm just imagining things.


Men's boots have - next to being wider - a different boot leg: they're higher AND have a firm upper hind end of the boot leg. Women's boots - or the few unisex boots - have sort of a bulge or softer part at the hind boot leg entry that gives way at that point to give room to where the calve muscle begins. Women's calve muscles are lower positioned than men's. I've tried several men's boots: they pinch the calve muscle even tho I'm tall. You can try if certain models will fit you, just check carefully if your calves aren't pinched when the boot is nicely tightened.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

I'd recommend getting higher end 32's, the lower end soften up pretty quickly

with 32, they pack out about 1/2 to a full size....so eventually you will want to add some butterfly wraps or etc.

the other thing is the inner laces...pull them really tight and it will pull you whole foot back

and get some good fitting foot beds...will help keep your foot back.

read .... and look at the pics.... my 32's

http://www.snowboardingforum.com/boots/51066-boots-faq-etc.html


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

Look into the Ride Sage if you can try it on, it has a velcro feature at the top that lets you expand the top of the boot to accommodate larger calves, not sure how the rest of the boot would fit but I thought that was a very cool feature.

Sage Boots | Women's Snowboard Boots | Ride Snowboards 2015-2016


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

ride contour are fairly wide

iirc...ur in Seattle, go to evo
Seattle Ski, Snowboard, Skate, Bike, Surf, Wake Shop | evo

if not in Seattle
Women's Snowboard Boots | evo outlet


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

wrathfuldeity said:


> ride contour are fairly wide


Do you mean Ride _Cadence_ ot K2 _Contour_? First one is for slim ancles, second is rather wide - at least they were öike that in '12 and '13.


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## Rogue (Nov 29, 2014)

neni said:


> wrathfuldeity said:
> 
> 
> > ride contour are fairly wide
> ...


Right, the K2 are definitely wider than Ride. 32 also seemed wider but short in the toes. Burton's are also narrow but have the right length (for my feet ) but poor heel hold. 

Salomon's are also shorter in the toes but narrow. 

Good luck on getting sorted out, it was a total pain in the ass for me. I didn't want boa at all, but guess what I ended up getting.....boa. 

Also consider adding insoles (I went with remind medic) and it made a huge difference in performance.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

sorry k2 contours


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## Fire Rose (Feb 15, 2016)

So I went ahead and returned the 32 lashed boots that I had bought. I decided that they were probably half a size too big plus the heel hold thing was just causing more pain that I thought I would be able to deal with.

I tried the 32 STW boas on again in 8, and decided against them because the liner was gaping around my calf and causing the boot to pinch a bit. Plus they also had a fairly large heel hold in the liner as well, which was pushing my foot forward.

I tried on the 32 binary boa, which had the same issues as the other 32 boots. In K2 boots they had the Haven in 8 and Sapera in 8.5. The Sapera boots had a velcro closure on the lining, which pulled way apart when I bent my knees forwards. I also asked about mens boots but they didn't have anything that would be in my size. Probably for the best anyways, since I'm already having issues with womens boots being too high on my calves.

I decided to go with the Havens. They have regular linings with laces which actually (mostly) closed around my calves. I think this is because they are lower in the back of the calf. The also had some heel hold padding in the liner, but not much. They are pretty tight, but no pinching or specific pressure points, just all over tight. When I take the liner out my toes are touching the liner, not curling or pressing out on it. I'm hoping they will pack out a 1/2 size or so.

Should I get the liners heat molded before I use them? Or wear them a few times and see if they will pack out enough on their own without heat molding? I know that heat molding too many times is bad, but will heat molding a liner damage it or reduce the life span significantly?


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

Have done both...and prefer the wear molding method...cause in the end that what happens anyway...and they give a more precise in real action feel. heat molding is static mold if that makes sense.


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## Fire Rose (Feb 15, 2016)

I've worn my boots 5 times now, and I started to notice some issues on the 3rd time out. First 2 times were great, the boots were super comfortable and I didn't have any heel lift. Third day I was getting really bad pain and numbness in my right (front) foot. It felt like my foot was getting smashed down in the boot, but if I loosened it up I would get heel lift. Yesterday and today I had foot pain in the morning but after some fiddling with my right boot the pain went away and the heel lift came back. I am getting heel lift in my left as well, but not nearly as much pain. I was having a really hard time getting on to my toe edge at times, and felt like I had to work harder to hold it. If I tighten the boots to where it is causing my foot to hurt I can still easily move my toes (they no longer touch the end of the liner) and they are very tight, not quite pinching, around my calves.

I was hoping to get some opinions. I could return the boots or I could try to make them fit better. 
As far as better fit goes am I right in assuming the first place to start would be insoles for the foot pain? Then what? The liners have j-bars on them, but I can barely feel them.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

get some good fitting aftermarket insoles...remind, superfeet, vissure sole...and etc....this will help so that you won't need to crank the laces so much.

your boots are beginning to pack out...see the boot faq sticky and consider using some j/c/butterfly foam pieces to snug things up. It is really easy to do...iirc everything you need is in the sticky. So just try it, make adjustments, try again...and you will get it dialed in. Its good that the boots fit well the first few days....so now you just need to make some minor adjustments.

do both of these things and your feet will be happy


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## Fire Rose (Feb 15, 2016)

I bought a pair of Sole high volume insoles which helped with the foot pain, sort of. I was fine on the very short/easy beginner runs but when I decided to try blue runs I was getting the foot pain again. My foot was arching up in the boot when I was on my toe edge which was very painful. It was also pressing down on the top of my foot from over tightening trying to fix the other issue.

I decided to go into a local snowsports shop with to get some boot fitting advice. The guy measured my foot at 7.5. Since I told him I could still return my current boots he recommended I get a pair in the correct size, or add padding then wait until next season when there is a better selection. I think when I was trying on 7.5 boots before I wasn't getting my heel all the way back. 

All they had in my size was the Burton Mint and Starstruck. The Mint was too narrow in the toe and heel but the Starstruck fit a lot better. He put my insoles in the Starstruck and that helped with some of the fit issues. The heel padding was still pinching, and I was getting some tingling (very minor) in my right foot but that was mostly just if I was sitting. He seemed pretty sure that the boot would pack out enough for me, but was also said if I waited until next season I might be able to find a dual boa boot that fit better. I didn't want to deal with trying to work with boots that I knew were a half size too big so I went with the Starstruck. It didn't hurt that they were 40% off (but all sales final, so I guess they better work!).


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