# FlexMeter Demon wrist guards?? Or what are "better" wrist guards out there?



## Vital

Anyone know anything about wrist quards?


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## rfrich74

Buy a pair of Level gloves with the built in wrist guards and don't look back. I personally have the half-pipe model and my hands never want for anything.


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## Enigmatic

Yeah a couple of years ago someone on here referred me to level snowboard gloves and they've been pretty awesome. Make sure you look at their "protection" line that has "biomex" protection in it. They're expensive but much more comfortable than anything else on the market and I've had mine for 4 seasons before ripping through the kevlar finger tips. Im just using some burton pipe gloves for now until I get a new pair. Really miss them already, they made hand plants a lot softer.

Take a look at this page to learn about their tech, its well-explained: Gloves Snowboard Gloves Snowboarding Mittens Gloves Ski - Level Gloves


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## Vital

Not sure which exact line/model it was but I tried Level gloves with built in wrist guards 2 weeks ago at the store. According to saleman these were top of the line from last year. Cost was $119 irrc. Are these the gloves you guys talking about?

If so unfortunatly I didn't like them. They were just way to big/bulky looking on my hands as wrist guard felt very small to me even thou my hand is a regular medium size, not large by any means.


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## Gdog42

I've been using the Demon Flex wrist guards this season and they've been great. 


















I used to have the Dakine ones that you have, but I didn't like them because there was nothing on the back sides to actually stop my wrists from flexing in that direction too far, which would cause a sprain. They were also uncomfortable and kind of bulky.

The Demon Flex ones are so much better- they're completely low-profile, have splints on both sides, lighter, offer better protection, and are so comfortable I literally forget I'm wearing them.

Another benefit I have from them is that they keep my jacket's wrist gaiters in place. They used to pull back behind my thumb every time I bent over to strap in (because I'm kind of tall), which was uncomfortable on my hands. Now I wear them over the Demon Flex guards and they haven't been a problem- it's actually made the wrist gaiters more comfortable to wear.
So they have a lower profile, lower price, and offer just as much protection as the Flexmeter wrist guards. And putting my gloves on over them is insanely easy

I would grab a pair of these if I were you. The reason I got them in the first place was because for the last 5 seasons I've sprained my wrists multiple times, which was annoying. Hasn't happened with these! :thumbsup:

Here's a link to them on Demon's website. If you do get a pair, make sure you check the size chart first.
http://www.demonsnow.com/store/Demon%20Flex%20wrist%20guard


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## Gdog42

Here, I have some fancy pictures for ya. 










Yes, they really are this low.









I know from experience that they're good for punching skiers with. 









The inner material conforms to the shape of your wrist. 









Under the wrist gaiter. If you're someone else and you weren't looking for it, you wouldn't notice it. :thumbsup:


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## rfrich74

Vital said:


> Not sure which exact line/model it was but I tried Level gloves with built in wrist guards 2 weeks ago at the store. According to saleman these were top of the line from last year. Cost was $119 irrc. Are these the gloves you guys talking about?
> 
> If so unfortunatly I didn't like them. They were just way to big/bulky looking on my hands as wrist guard felt very small to me even thou my hand is a regular medium size, not large by any means.


The small size of the wrist guard in the Level gloves is precisely how they are designed. Go to the link that was posted earlier to see the science behind the design. It was designed to move away from the traditional splint style wrist guards which are prone to transmitting the force higher up the arm still causing fractures just higher up. The Biomex actually disperses the forces in many different directions. I don't find the gloves any bulkier than any other high end gloves that offer the same level of warmth and dryness.


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## ShredLife

i dealt with weak wrists for years from a broken scaphoid and ruptured bursa and in my experience learning to tape your wrists correctly is far safer and easier to ride with than any wrist guard. for my wrists i just needed about three bracelet style wraps and i'm good.


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## Enigmatic

You're the first person I've come across who didn't like Level gloves.. :icon_scratch: But hey its good you got a chance to try them on in the store and know you don't like them before dropping the dough on them. They are definitely bulkier than pipe gloves but as mentioned earlier they really aren't any bulkier than other thick/warm gloves. To each his own though, you'll definitely be saving money with the flexmeter/demons. However, according to Level's marketing/research, you increase the risk of breaking your wrist 3 inches up your radius/ulna 

I just found/picked up a pair of level half-pipe mitts (goretex) for $56 shipped, on eBay. So stoked... thanks for this thread haha, wouldn't have been stimulated to look without it :yahoo:


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## SnowDragon

Enigmatic said:


> However, according to Level's marketing/research, you increase the risk of breaking your wrist 3 inches up your radius/ulna


No.

This conclusion is based on inadequate "research" on inline skaters, not snowboarders, and wasn't done by Level. They just referenced the "old wives' tale" from the study above.
Go to Welcome to the all-new www.ski-injury.com! The number 1 site in Google for snow sports safety - Ski Injury for the explanation from a U.K. doctor who focuses on these types of injuries.

To the OP, I wear the Flexmeter guards. To me, they offer the best protection of any snowboard wrist guard available. You don't need the double-sided model for snowboarding, but if you really want the extra protection on the palm side, be aware that you will need larger gloves to fit over them. You can also buy the gloves with the (removable) protection built in to avoid this.

I know that the Level gloves are quite popular, but I don't understand how they protect your wrist from hyperflexion, which is the injury that occurs in snowboarding.

I definitely recommend the flexmeters.


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## Enigmatic

Yeah I'm a bit skeptical about level's research myself. They aren't exactly, totally clear about how biomex prevents hyperextension but here's what they did say: _"BIOMEX ( fig.5) is the only wrist guard that keeps the wrist in an anatomically strong position, where muscle-forces and bone congruency combine to provide optimum stability without compromising the freedom to move." _

It almost sounds a bit BS'y to me but I suppose what they're trying to say (with the accompanying picture on the site) is that the shape, contour, and hold of the glove keeps your hand in a position that disperses the energy from a fall across a greater number of paths or directions of your forearm. Whereas, traditional guards prevent a break at the wrist but then divert all the force into one direction (at the top of the guard, causing a slightly more proximal fracture). Your link's doctor found 2 snowboarders who had this type of injury, definitely not a very large number. 

The Level site says _"The effectiveness of wrist guards was demonstrated in a 4 year study conducted by the St.Moritz Orthopaedic Hospital, Klinic Gut The study involved over 40,000 snowboard hours and more than 2400 participants. The results of the study showed that the likelihood of a wrist injury is reduced 4.5 times using conventional wristgurads. With Biomex wristguards, the risk of injury is reduced 7.5 times." _

No mention of any actual research article with a detailed methods section so its not clear if the conventional wristguard people had this "higher up wive's tale" fracture or not but I guess that's to be presumed based on the numbers?

Then again, I've never met anyone whose broken the upper part of their wrist while wearing traditional wrist guards. And come to think of it, I only have one friend who snapped his wrist supperr gnarly falling off a rail. Could all be a marketing scheme/over-exaggeration... Based off the link you posted, it seems the wrist guards to definitely not wear are the short, rigid traditional skating ones. I wouldn't have imagined someone could snap both their radius and ulna directly under a guard like that until seeing that pic.

I dunno, but I do know I've taken a ton of pretty nasty falls, straight to my hands, and never even sprained my wrists. So that's why I keep going back to level, and also because the glove itself is pretty awesome as well (and especially because I keep somehow finding great deals on them...)


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## SnowDragon

Enigmatic said:


> The Level site says _"The effectiveness of wrist guards was demonstrated in a 4 year study conducted by the St.Moritz Orthopaedic Hospital, Klinic Gut The study involved over 40,000 snowboard hours and more than 2400 participants. The results of the study showed that the likelihood of a wrist injury is reduced 4.5 times using conventional wristgurads. With Biomex wristguards, the risk of injury is reduced 7.5 times." _


If anything, the above quote, corroborated by the "ski injury" website, points out that wearing ANY wrist guard is better than not wearing any for minimizing wrist injuries while snowboarding.

To be clear, I'm not saying that the Level guards don't work. I just don't see how they prevent/reduce hyperflexion. Interestingly, the "ski injury" website indicates that the protection should be on the back of the hand to prevent/minimize hyperflexion. This makes sense to me and why I like the flexmeters. However, the same site recommends two guards - Flexmeter and Level!:dunno:

I think I"ll send an e-mail to the site asking about that.:icon_scratch:


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## Vital

Found myself reading thru ski-injury articles for the past 2 hours lol.
Still have lots to read but this defiantly got my attention:



> ...studies that have been performed in this area are a bit bizarre – basically taking both arms off dead people, fitting one of them with a guard and leaving the other without and then seeing how much force it takes to break each wrist by simulating a fall. Four studies have now shown that, in the wrist with the guard on, one way or another more energy is needed to cause a fracture and that the fractures that do eventually occur are of a reduced severity. So now you know what really happens when you leave your body to medical science…


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## SnowDragon

LOL!
Yes, that one caught my eye when I first read it.

Also, if you like riding the park, don't go to the section on Terrain Parks. Nothing gruesome, but the stats might make you think a few times about riding the park, and the intelligence of the designers.

BTW, I sent an e-mail to Welcome to the all-new www.ski-injury.com! The number 1 site in Google for snow sports safety - Ski Injury this morning, asking about the Biomex (Level) protection. I'll pass on what I get back.


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## stickz

burton makes some that are great. not to rigid but gives the top of your hand a lot of support as to not hurt your forearm or elbow. the construction isn't the best though.


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## scottb7

I have been using these for a few years now and liked them so much I bought another pair.

Triple Eight Snow Underglove Wrist Guards (Pair)


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## rfrich74

Enigmatic said:


> I just found/picked up a pair of level half-pipe mitts (goretex) for $56 shipped, on eBay. So stoked... thanks for this thread haha, wouldn't have been stimulated to look without it :yahoo:


Damn you. I really wanted mitts. Originally ordered mitts but they sent gloves because mitts were out of stock. Offered me a nice little discount to keep the gloves so I did. Still wish I had mitts though.


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## rfrich74

GreyDragon said:


> No.
> 
> This conclusion is based on inadequate "research" on inline skaters, not snowboarders, and wasn't done by Level. They just referenced the "old wives' tale" from the study above.


No.

"The effectiveness of wrist guards was demonstrated in a 4 year study conducted by the St.Moritz Orthopaedic Hospital, Klinic Gut The study involved over 40,000 snowboard hours and more than 2400 participants. "

Quote directly from Level's site. Are you implying that Level is being deceptive?

Edit: Just noticed Enigmatic posted the same quote earlier.


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## SnowDragon

"Don't wrist guards lead to injury further up the arm?

O.M.G!!! This is an old chestnut with very little actual basis in fact but it still rears its ugly head far too frequently! In 1995 (15+ years ago now), Cheng et al reported four cases where skaters (not snowboarders) wearing wrist guards sustained open forearm fractures immediately proximal to the wrist guard. They hypothesised that the guard could transfer the energy of impact from the hand to the mid-forearm level. Their report did not describe the splints each individual was using or if they were fitted properly. Whilst it may sound a cautionary note, very few other case reports have been forthcoming out of the many thousands of skating injuries occurring every year.

You also have to remember that inline skating and snowboarding are different sports. Skaters usually fall onto concrete surfaces (consequently with a more abrupt stop involved). I am only aware of two individual cases where snowboarders wearing guards have sustained upper arm fractures, possibly as a result of wearing a guard. This must be compared to the thousands of potential wrist injuries that guards have prevented or reduced in severity. Subsequent biomechanical studies do not support Cheng’s theory and, in fact, demonstrate that one of the protective effects of guards is to dissipate impact energy safely throughout the device without increasing the forces at any one spot."


Quoted from www.ski-injury.com, a site that does not sell ANY brand of wrist guard, unlike Level.

The line you quote references numbers for the reduction of wrist injuries from wearing wrist guards (including Level) versus not wearing any wrist guards. It does not specifically give evidence of fractures "moving up" the arm where a wrist guard ends. 
From Level's website: "Standard wrist guards frequently push the fracture farther up the forearm". Well, how frequently? If they can give specific ratios for improvement in wrist injury reduction from their study, they should be able to provide similar numbers for the claim about injuries moving up the forearm. Notably, they don't.

And yes, the original quote is to what I was referring in my post that you reference.


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## Aw3bb

I never wore wrist guards till this season, can't afford to be hurt as far as work goes. Bought a pair of level gloves with biomex. Hated them at first, made myself wear them tho and got used to them, sort of. Rode for 7 hours yesterday and ran into an old riding buddy I hadn't seen in 2 years, we really pushed each other, had numerous bails, a couple pretty nasty ones. Today my right wrist hurts so bad I can hardly lift a gallon of milk with it, but its not broke. I'm sold now. They are a lot less uncomfortable than broken bones.


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## SnowMoose

GreyDragon said:


> No.
> 
> 
> To the OP, I wear the Flexmeter guards. To me, they offer the best protection of any snowboard wrist guard available. You don't need the double-sided model for snowboarding, but if you really want the extra protection on the palm side, be aware that you will need larger gloves to fit over them. You can also buy the gloves with the (removable) protection built in to avoid this.
> 
> 
> I definitely recommend the flexmeters.



I also wear the flexmeter guards (I have the double sided ones).

I take the additional small palm protection off for the snow and put them back on when (ice) skating.

Although I've learnt to pull my arms out of the way when falling back, I am happy with these guards and recommend them.

I can just get them over my xl sized gloves. I don't see many places that sell xxl sized gloves so I stick with the ones I have.

As a sort of 'comfortable' newbie, I can't comment on how bulky they feel as compared to *insert thing here* because I've always worn them.

I like them, and the feeling of protection they give, and the actual protection they give.

Hooray for my first post! :laugh:


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## behi

Enigmatic said:


> You're the first person I've come across who didn't like Level gloves..


Then, I guess, I'm the second. I tried Level Half Pipes and the Biomex insert didn't do anything for me. It might have, if it been held properly at the arm, but for me it didn't offer any support against hyperextension.

Level has a ton of different Biomex designs and it's not clear, what they used for their study.

I'm using the double sided Flexmeter now and it does work very well at preventing hyperextension. I have tested it in a nasty wipeout, when I was cut off by a skier and one of my wrists took a very large impact (totally unexpected crash, no time to consciously do the right fall technique). I think, the additional lower part in the double-sided version is helpful in spreading energy and softening impact a bit. It is pretty bulky though, so if you don't have narrow hands, it might be difficult to find gloves that fit over it.

The other nice thing is that you can different gloves, depending on temperatures. I hate warm gloves for spring riding.


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## Gdog42

Aw3bb said:


> I never wore wrist guards till this season, can't afford to be hurt as far as work goes. Bought a pair of level gloves with biomex. Hated them at first, made myself wear them tho and got used to them, sort of. Rode for 7 hours yesterday and ran into an old riding buddy I hadn't seen in 2 years, we really pushed each other, had numerous bails, a couple pretty nasty ones. Today my right wrist hurts so bad I can hardly lift a gallon of milk with it, but its not broke. I'm sold now. They are a lot less uncomfortable than broken bones.


The cool thing about the Demon wrist guards (both the Flexmeter and the ones I posted about on page 1) is that after wearing them and taking impact in the park all day, they *do not* ache or hurt my wrists whatsoever when I take them off later on. My wrists feel completely fine, and they were comfortable to wear since day 1. :thumbsup:

So I don't have to say that "pain from wearing them is ok because it's not a painful as a broken wrist", because there literally is no pain from wearing them and they offer just as much protection as the Biomex ones you guys have been talking about. This is what's bothering me here. That you should have to feel pain while riding all day just to protect from even more pain that might be unlikely to happen anyway.

Another good thing is that they've ft fine with all the gloves I've used so far.


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## Enigmatic

The first pair of level's I had were uncomfortable around the wrist at first but my current halfpipe mitts feel just like a normal glove, don't really notice the biomex. 

The only thing I don't like about these new ones is how much bulkier they've gotten around the wrists. Kind of annoying to stuff the wrist part under my sleeves. Considering cutting the wrist extension off... Other than that, I rode without the liners yesterday and they were much much cooler and thus fine for spring riding. Not ideal, but fine.


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## notfound

I have the Protec IPS wrist guards.. very nice and comfortable.


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## Vital

Gdog42 said:


> The cool thing about the Demon wrist guards (both the Flexmeter and the ones I posted about on page 1) is that after wearing them and taking impact in the park all day, they *do not* ache or hurt my wrists whatsoever when I take them off later on. My wrists feel completely fine, and they were comfortable to wear since day 1. :thumbsup:
> 
> *So I don't have to say that "pain from wearing them is ok because it's not a painful as a broken wrist", because there literally is no pain from wearing them *and they offer just as much protection as the Biomex ones you guys have been talking about. This is what's bothering me here. That you should have to feel pain while riding all day just to protect from even more pain that might be unlikely to happen anyway.
> 
> Another good thing is that they've ft fine with all the gloves I've used so far.


That's the point. 
I'd rather invest in something good and feel NOTHING when I take them off then feel hurt. If I feel hurt then it's not a good product for me.


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## aistis

hey guys

ended season very painful, broke my left hand wrist bone in 3 parts also fracture got an operation bone stabled with metal inside, doc said next season i a will be good to go again, only dont know which guards to get, i see ppl in here use Flexmeter and say that level biomex http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=xyB0V8tcL2g not good? my brother bought Level biomex http://www.levelgloves.com/biomex.php?recordID=english he is happy with them (we are both from EU) also saw dainese Wrist guards with or without Snowboard Ski gloves: Roller-skating and snowb

p.s doc gave me this guard only as for time being to keep arm steady, but i hope that those are low budget and i need something more effective. 

pic 1 my arm xray

pic2 docs given wrist guard


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## Gdog42

aistis said:


> hey guys
> 
> ended season very painful, broke my left hand wrist bone in 3 parts also fracture got an operation bone stabled with metal inside, doc said next season i a will be good to go again, only dont know which guards to get, i see ppl in here use Flexmeter and say that level biomex http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=xyB0V8tcL2g not good? my brother bought Level biomex http://www.levelgloves.com/biomex.php?recordID=english he is happy with them (we are both from EU) also saw dainese Wrist guards with or without Snowboard Ski gloves: Roller-skating and snowb
> 
> p.s doc gave me this guard only as for time being to keep arm steady, but i hope that those are low budget and i need something more effective.
> 
> pic 1 my arm xray
> 
> pic2 docs given wrist guard


Flexmeter, preferably the single-sided one so you can fit it under your gloves easily. I've heard several people (both here and people I know) saying that the Biomex ones are painful to wear. I have a pair of the Demon ones and they're very comfortable, although mine are the Flex guards (page 1) which are smaller but so far have given me just as much protection.:thumbsup:

Hope your wrist heels well. 
At least it was the end of your snowboarding season; it would have just been depressing if it had happened mid or early-season.


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## aistis

Gdog42 said:


> Flexmeter, preferably the single-sided one so you can fit it under your gloves easily. I've heard several people (both here and people I know) saying that the Biomex ones are painful to wear. I have a pair of the Demon ones and they're very comfortable, although mine are the Flex guards (page 1) which are smaller but so far have given me just as much protection.:thumbsup:
> 
> Hope your wrist heels well.
> At least it was the end of your snowboarding season; it would have just been depressing if it had happened mid or early-season.


yes thats true that i ended season and its not happened in a beginning, i think i should look maybe for flexmeter then...maybe even protection in both sides to be safe in 100 %:thumbsup:

p.s with flexmeter which gloves i can use?


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## SnowDragon

The flexmeters with the protection on both sides,is NOT necessary.
Feel free to try them if you wish, but they are a pain to get your glove over.
I use the single sided flexmeters and they provide all the protection you need for snowboarding.

If you really want the double sided protection, I'd recommend getting the flexmeter gloves with the protection built in. That way you don't have to struggle to get your own gloves over the guards.


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## Vital

For those interested there's Flexmeter gloves on ebay right now

Snow Board Gloves with Built in Wrist Guards | eBay


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## aistis

GreyDragon said:


> The flexmeters with the protection on both sides,is NOT necessary.
> Feel free to try them if you wish, but they are a pain to get your glove over.
> I use the single sided flexmeters and they provide all the protection you need for snowboarding.
> 
> If you really want the double sided protection, I'd recommend getting the flexmeter gloves with the protection built in. That way you don't have to struggle to get your own gloves over the guards.


thanks for info, so one sided means from up not from palm?


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## SnowDragon

One sided has the protective bar on the back of the hand, with only stretchy fabric on the palm side of the hand. That's all you need to prevent hyperflexion of the wrist.


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## bamfb2

Posted this on another thread, but what the hell:

The concept behind the Flexmeters is great. They allow your wrists to move and flex, while progressively hardening on impact. Designed by a trauma surgeon in France, who was experiencing far too many wrist injuries in his ER for his liking. 

Two points to note: 

1. You only need the single sided, as the double sided is more for skateboarding. It's too hard to fit a double sided under your gloves (unless, of course, you buy their gloves with the inserts already in). 

2. The only complaint people have is they sometimes don't fit well under certain gloves. This can be dealt with by finding a pair that fits with the guards (I have always used Dakine Titan mittens, and the flexmeters fit fine with my medium mitts). Alternatively, you can size up your gloves, and it's no issue. Just avoid tight gloves or gloves with elastic.

I broke my wrist and had to get some guards for support. These were the go and they haven't left my wrists since. They work as advertised. They are super light weight and don't feel restrictive. Your wrist and bones are free to move. Also, they don't transfer the force up the arm like other stiff wrist guards.


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## aistis

GreyDragon said:


> One sided has the protective bar on the back of the hand, with only stretchy fabric on the palm side of the hand. That's all you need to prevent hyperflexion of the wrist.


maybe you can link me to one sided and double sided? would like to see how they look and what difference is visible.

Thanks


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## SnowDragon

Google search Flexmeter.


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## Gdog42

aistis said:


> maybe you can link me to one sided and double sided? would like to see how they look and what difference is visible.
> 
> Thanks


http://www.demonsnow.com/store/Flexmeter%20Double%20sided%20wrist%20guard

This is a link to the page for the double sided, which you won't ever need for snowboarding. The double-sided one controls the movement of the wrist in *exactly the same way* as the single-sided guard. 
The reason the double-sided one has an additional plastic piece over the palm is to *protect your skin* from concrete and similar material when not on snow.
It's also nearly impossible to fit under the average glove. And it's more expensive.

The single-sided one is all you need.  Here's a link to it:

http://www.demonsnow.com/store/Flexmeter%20wrist%20guard?filter_name=flexmeter%20wrist


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## aistis

Gdog42 said:


> Flexmeter Wrist Guard Double Sided
> 
> This is a link to the page for the double sided, which you won't ever need for snowboarding. The double-sided one controls the movement of the wrist in *exactly the same way* as the single-sided guard.
> The reason the double-sided one has an additional plastic piece over the palm is to *protect your skin* from concrete and similar material when not on snow.
> It's also nearly impossible to fit under the average glove. And it's more expensive.
> 
> The single-sided one is all you need.  Here's a link to it:
> 
> Flexmeter Wrist Guard Single Sided


thanks man for info so you say that single sided is enough and double wont help much on snow? by the way single sided is possible to wear under standard gloves? or i need some special flex meter gloves? i used L size gloves for snowboarding but i think it will be to small with flexmeter wrist guard.

Regards,


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## bamfb2

aistis said:


> by the way single sided is possible to wear under standard gloves? or i need some special flex meter gloves? i used L size gloves for snowboarding but i think it will be to small with flexmeter wrist guard.


Yes, single is all you need. As far as fit, it all depends on what you wear. From my post above:

_The only complaint people have is they sometimes don't fit well under *certain* gloves. This can be dealt with by finding a pair that fits with the guards (I have always used Dakine Titan mittens, and the flexmeters fit fine with my medium mitts). Alternatively, you can size up your gloves, and it's no issue. Just avoid tight gloves or gloves with elastic._

So, to recap:
1. Flexmeters fit with plenty of gloves.
2. Easiest fit is with mittens.
3. Avoid gloves with elastic on the wrists. Go for the ones that are loose and have a cinch. 
4. If your hands are already tight in your gloves, then you might need to size up. If your gloves give you plenty of room, then the flexmeters might fit inside.


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## behi

aistis said:


> thanks man for info so you say that single sided is enough and double wont help much on snow?


I have the double sided and think it does provide some cushioning/additional stabilization. How much that helps in extra injury prevention - who knows...


> by the way single sided is possible to wear under standard gloves? or i need some special flex meter gloves? i used L size gloves for snowboarding but i think it will be to small with flexmeter wrist guard.


The double sided is very bulky, you need much wider gloves. The single sided will still need pretty wide gloves...


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## wildhorse

I wear dainese hector wrist guards every time I snowboard. Dainese and Flexmeter are probably the best wrist guards on the market.










They mainly limit bending the hand back, but also limit bending forward and side to side. They are more flexible than typical rollerblade wrist guards which tend to limit wrist movement too much. There are no pressure points, which means it would take a very nasty fall to injure wrists with these wristguards on. They seem superior to many gloves with built in wrist guards (the plastic part there is often too short and too hard). They are offered also in dainese gloves, but I wouldn't buy those as gloves may get cut or burnt (if you smoke  ) and may need to be replaced.

They are made of plastic and neprene. New gloves will probably be needed, I found Burton gloves perfect for them.

Its important to get the correct size. Dainese have a size guide on their website. Choose the nearest size, if too small, exchange for bigger. I wear size M and have normal hands. Males with large hands will need L, women probably S. For the hand on the image the wrist guard doesn't seem to be a good fit - it seems to be too large. The neoprene part has to fit around the hand like a glove with no space around it.

Pros:
+ excellent protection. If you injure yourself while wearing these, you better switch to skiing 

Cons:
- difficult to to put on/off, which means you will have to put them on in the morning and wear them all day, also for lunch
- neoprene may irritate skin due to overheating and lack of breathability. In my case skin gets irritated after I take them off, but applying Nivea body milk solves the problem.


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## Argo

I wear level/biomex every day. I have had the same gloves for 3 full seasons.... 132 days this season so far. They finally tore about 50 days ago but I keep using them. 

The are very comfortable. I have taken some really hard spills with them, probably would have broken a wrist or two without them.... 

Get any of the guards mentioned here. Whatever your comfortable with. Any protection is better than none....


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## aistis

Hey guys,

Eventually bought flex meter as red that when you fall down its not so painfull as with biomex (level) by the way bought one sided L size now need gloves wonder best mitten or 
Digitated gloves? 

http://img854.imageshack.us/img854/7343/20130404195718.jpg 


regards


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## bamfb2

aistis said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Eventually bought flex meter as red that when you fall down its not so painfull as with biomex (level) by the way bought one sided L size now need gloves wonder best mitten or
> Digitated gloves?
> 
> http://img854.imageshack.us/img854/7343/20130404195718.jpg regards



Mittens fit easier. Get something like the Dakine Titan. Very durable, warm, waterproof, and cheap at end of season sales.

You probably want a draw strap like on the Titan, and you _definitely _don't want gloves/mittens with elastic cuffs. Those won't work for you.

EDIT: For myself, I didn't even have to change size with my Dakine Titans. Medium without Flexy's, medium with Flexy's. That said, it probably depends on how your hands fit in the gloves; eg some people fill out a medium moreso than others. Also note, you do have to be careful when putting on your gloves, as some people have problems tearing the liner. I've never had that problem, as I just take care in putting on my gloves. It's not hard at all after a while and becomes automatic.


----------



## Gdog42

Great to see you got a pair!

So do you plan on using them next season, or do you live south of the equator and winter is only just coming up for you now?


----------



## aistis

Gdog42 said:


> Great to see you got a pair!
> 
> So do you plan on using them next season, or do you live south of the equator and winter is only just coming up for you now?




Hey if you talk about me then I will use it next season in swiss alps: )

@bamfb2

so you recommend http://www.evo.com/imgp/1500/59559.Image.1.jpg right?


----------



## bamfb2

aistis said:


> Hey if you talk about me then I will use it next season in swiss alps: )
> 
> @bamfb2
> 
> so you recommend http://www.evo.com/imgp/1500/59559.Image.1.jpg right?


Those look like the ones. A great budget mitten. So warm. They come with liners than I only end up using about once a season.


----------



## aistis

bamfb2 said:


> Those look like the ones. A great budget mitten. So warm. They come with liners than I only end up using about once a season.




Great, wonder that they will fit my wrist guards also was wondering about Travis rice mitten 
Travis Rice Collection 11/12 Quiksilver Snow - YouTube


----------



## bamfb2

aistis said:


> Great, wonder that they will fit my wrist guards also was wondering about Travis rice mitten
> Travis Rice Collection 11/12 Quiksilver Snow - YouTube


You don't want the TRice if you are going to use the flexmeters. You see that elastic on the inside of the right glove in this shot? That elastic is going to make it a royal pain in the ass to get the glove over the flexmeters. You don't want elastic.

That's why I reco'd the Titans. No elastic, only a wrist cinch. So you can have a nice snug fit AFTER you get them over the flexmeters.


----------



## aistis

bamfb2 said:


> You don't want the TRice if you are going to use the flexmeters. You see that elastic on the inside of the right glove in this shot? That elastic is going to make it a royal pain in the ass to get the glove over the flexmeters. You don't want elastic.
> 
> That's why I reco'd the Titans. No elastic, only a wrist cinch. So you can have a nice snug fit AFTER you get them over the flexmeters.


ahh okay thanks for clarification


----------



## aistis

bamfb2 said:


> Mittens fit easier. Get something like the Dakine Titan. Very durable, warm, waterproof, and cheap at end of season sales.
> 
> You probably want a draw strap like on the Titan, and you _definitely _don't want gloves/mittens with elastic cuffs. Those won't work for you.
> 
> EDIT: For myself, I didn't even have to change size with my Dakine Titans. Medium without Flexy's, medium with Flexy's. That said, it probably depends on how your hands fit in the gloves; eg some people fill out a medium moreso than others. Also note, you do have to be careful when putting on your gloves, as some people have problems tearing the liner. I've never had that problem, as I just take care in putting on my gloves. It's not hard at all after a while and becomes automatic.


hey

quick question i think this is what i am looking for Dakine Titan Mittgloves available online at the Blue Tomato Shop only question is which size i should go, because now i was using L size fingered gloves without any wrist guards, but now as i bought flexmeter guards, wonder do L size going to fit to me, as i am thinking to buy online and not in a actual shop so i wont be able to check fitment etc...


----------



## bamfb2

aistis said:


> hey
> 
> quick question i think this is what i am looking for Dakine Titan Mittgloves available online at the Blue Tomato Shop only question is which size i should go, because now i was using L size fingered gloves without any wrist guards, but now as i bought flexmeter guards, wonder do L size going to fit to me, as i am thinking to buy online and not in a actual shop so i wont be able to check fitment etc...



All I can give you is my experience. I owned Dakine Titan Mediums before getting my flexmeters. I bought the medium (silver) single sided flexmeters. They fit under my medium Titans. I would describe the fit as 'snug'. 

The cup over the back of the hand sticks up a bit, pushing against the inside top of the glove, and creating an impression from the outside. I don't really care about that though. As long as you don't yank your gloves on, the Titans won't rip and should hold up; mine have done so for three years.

Here's a video on fit I just came across.

Flexmeter Wrist Guards and Snowboard Gloves FAQs - YouTube


----------



## aistis

hey thanks for info i am going to buy L size because i wear L flexmeter size so L size gloves should fit as you wear M size flexmeters and L size gloves so going to look into actual shop first and try to fit in in real and if not going to find it in a store going to buy it online Dakine Titan Mittgloves available online at the Blue Tomato Shop STRATA color looks very cute

Regards


----------



## bamfb2

No worries. Cute is good.


----------



## SnowMoose

bamfb2 said:


> All I can give you is my experience. I owned Dakine
> 
> Here's a video on fit I just came across.
> 
> Flexmeter Wrist Guards and Snowboard Gloves FAQs - YouTube


I bought my flexmeters from snowboard secrets (who produced the above video) and they were the cheapest I could find, fast, answered all my questions and were generally good to deal with. 

I see that other places are only about $1 more than them but just putting it out there.

Thanks for some of the comments about mittens, I've never really considered mittens as they seem weird not being able have your fingers free and wiggly.

(wiggly?)


----------



## aistis

Well I think that you need to adapt thats all


----------



## aistis

hey

just made to fit my current gloves on flexmeters, so i save money and no need to buy new gloves


----------



## aistis

some more pics


----------



## bamfb2

There you go. Best wrist guard on the market.

Still need to know how to fall properly though.


----------



## aistis

bamfb2 said:


> There you go. Best wrist guard on the market.
> 
> Still need to know how to fall properly though.




Hey

What do you mean? My gloves with flexmeter is tight and no room left when put on everything is very tight hope it's not bad, anyways I am not going to walk in a street with it,so I think comfort is most less needed


----------



## bamfb2

aistis said:


> Hey
> 
> What do you mean? My gloves with flexmeter is tight and no room left when put on everything is very tight hope it's not bad, anyways I am not going to walk in a street with it,so I think comfort is most less needed


That's fine. Mine are a little tight too. You get used to it. If it is cutting off circulation, you probably need to buy new gloves!

Fall properly: never put your arms or hands out. If you must used your arms (like on some jumps), make fists out of your hands.

But mostly, you cross your arms over your chest and take the impact with your body.


----------



## aistis

Hey 

You mean cutting circulation of a blood or u mean something else? 

About falling yes I know but then you can break other part of your body no?


----------



## bamfb2

aistis said:


> Hey
> 
> You mean cutting circulation of a blood or u mean something else?


exactly. I doubt it's something you need to worry about. I've never heard of it happening.



> About falling yes I know but then you can break other part of your body no?


Your body is much more likely to withstand impacts this way. You don't want to stiffen up though. Just wrap up. It's the safest way.

Most common snowboard injury is wrist/arm. Then Head, then knee iirc.


----------



## aistis

bamfb2 said:


> exactly. I doubt it's something you need to worry about. I've never heard of it happening.
> 
> 
> 
> Your body is much more likely to withstand impacts this way. You don't want to stiffen up though. Just wrap up. It's the safest way.
> 
> Most common snowboard injury is wrist/arm. Then Head, then knee iirc.


Thanks man for answers, I only thinking if my gloves very tight with flexmeters and if I dont feel any discomfort do I need worry falling on my arms if it's going to happen I mean you never know how you going fall so I hope that tightened gloves with flexmeters won't harm and make more issues.


----------



## bamfb2

aistis said:


> Thanks man for answers, I only thinking if my gloves very tight with flexmeters and if I dont feel any discomfort do I need worry falling on my arms if it's going to happen I mean you never know how you going fall so I hope that tightened gloves with flexmeters won't harm and make more issues.


Yes, you do know how you are going to fall (most of the time -- not necessarily when trying big tricks off big jumps). You have to conciously be aware of how you are falling.

The Flexmeters will help, but like any piece of protective equipment, they are not full proof. You need to learn to protect yourself, or you will end up in the hospital. 

Tightened gloves do not matter. It's more about feeling uncomfortable. If they are comfortable to you, then they are fine.

And again, learn how to fall properly.


----------



## aistis

Thanks. But you can't protect all your body parts with protection like knees protection or elbow protection I think best maybe as u say learn how to fall and in my opinion maybe wrist guards main protection for snowboarders


----------



## Kevin137

bamfb2 said:


> But mostly, you *cross your arms over your chest* and take the impact with your body.


This is something i most definitely would NOT do...

If you cross you arms over you chest and land face down, then you are creating a pressure point where the arms CROSS... Meaning less flat contact with the ground and a higher risk of breaking your arms...

Pulling you arms into you chest with hands clenched into a fist but arms parallel with each other creates less risk for breakages as the impact area is increased...

Just so you know...


----------



## bamfb2

Kevin137 said:


> This is something i most definitely would NOT do...
> 
> If you cross you arms over you chest and land face down, then you are creating a pressure point where the arms CROSS... Meaning less flat contact with the ground and a higher risk of breaking your arms...
> 
> Pulling you arms into you chest with hands clenched into a fist but arms parallel with each other creates less risk for breakages as the impact area is increased...
> 
> Just so you know...


Kind of what I meant. Should have said pull your arms in. I also like to put my hands up near my face (without fist) so that I don't lose any teeth or bust my big nose. I care about both of those more more than my bones anyway.


----------



## aistis

GoodEnough said:


> How does this prevent you from jamming your wrist?
> These look like some tiny padding only.
> There are not like the thing with the L-shaped bar in it.
> Is the brace on the back side?
> 
> Another question, I've been wearing my old school wrist guards OVER my gloves.
> You're supposed to wear them under the glove?
> That velcro is itchy as hell


Hello,

I wear flex meter they are best


----------



## snowman55

Argo said:


> I wear level/biomex every day. I have had the same gloves for 3 full seasons.... 132 days this season so far. They finally tore about 50 days ago but I keep using them.
> 
> The are very comfortable. I have taken some really hard spills with them, probably would have broken a wrist or two without them....
> 
> Get any of the guards mentioned here. Whatever your comfortable with. Any protection is better than none....


I got the Level Half Pipe this year and the stitching is coming off already after 5 days of normal use. I was extremely disappointed because they do feel comfortable. Especially compare to the Fleximeter which I also have. 

You figure the quality could be better for a glove that cost $110+.


----------



## twinbee

Time to resurrect this thread. So I'm struggling to decide what kind of Demon wrist guard I should get. I see they have four main guards going from cheap to expensive:

Demon Wrist Guards

Demon Flex Wrist Guards - (or maybe version 2?)

Demon Flexmeter Single Sided Wrist Guard

Demon Flexmeter double sided wrist guards 

From this forum thread, there apparently isn't much reason to go with the double sided/splint over the single splint for snowboarding purposes. However, this page says differently:



> Flexmeter Snowboard Glove with Double Protection has the dorsal splint and has light palm-side protection added, and is the choice of surgeons, dentists, nurses, artists, musicians, writers, and anyone that wants a little more protection.


Also, the Flex guards are cheaper than the Flexmeter single splint ones (£25 compared to £35). How do they compare in terms of comfort and safety?


----------



## wildhorse

Ignore the first two, they are worthless.

Flexmeter double sided will offer better protection, but you will very likely need new gloves. They will be more restrictive though - I'm not sure you can wear them when eating etc (I have dainese wrist guards for snowboard which are more flexible and can be worn all day, while for inline skating I have powerslide wristguars which are much more restrictive).

With single sided you get less protection but they may fit into your existing gloves and won't need to take them off.


----------



## twinbee

Are you sure the second ones (Flex) are worthless? Gdog42 was raving about them on page 1, so I'm curious what draws you to that conclusion.

Regarding the third (single slint) versus the fourth (double slint), Gdog said:

"This is a link to the page for the double sided, which you won't ever need for snowboarding. The double-sided one controls the movement of the wrist in exactly the same way as the single-sided guard. The reason the double-sided one has an additional plastic piece over the palm is
to protect your skin from concrete and similar material when not on snow.....
.....The single-sided one is all you need."

Any thoughts?


----------



## SnowDragon

Flexmeter single sided is what you need for snowboarding.
The double sided doesn't give more protection for wrist hyper extension which is the injury in snowboarding.

The double sided is for use by inline skaters and skateboarders who need protection from scraping their palms when they fall on concrete/pavement.

If you get the double sided for snowboarding, good luck getting even an XL glove over them.

I've had both single and double sided btw.
I wear the Flexmeter glove so I don't have to pull my own glove over the guard.
Best solution IMO.


----------



## twinbee

Thanks GreyDragon.

Ignoring glove size (since I can get giant mitts), would you say there's much difference in comfort/maneuverability between the single and double splint?

Perhaps beginners (like me) would have more comfort falling over with the extra padding on the palm for the double splint?

Are you very sure the double splint won't protect more against sprains/breaks? Or conversely, could the double splint maybe even make it worse in a way?

Do the Flexmeter Gloves get smelly, since there's less ventilation in the one-piecer?


----------



## wildhorse

The single splint flexmeters are the original ones, then they came up with the double splinted ones since the single split didn't offer enough protection. For snowboarding it may be ok but I wouldn't bet on it. With double splinted you can remove the small pad on palm which is for summer sports. They sell gloves that fit over them, see Alps Gear for example. They also sell gloves with integrated flexmeters (there are two models, single and double split again).

There will definitely be a huge difference in comfort between single and double splinted. Double splinted will feel more restrictive, but also offer better protection. With double splinted flexmeters you would need to be incredibly stupid and unlucky to injure your wrists. Use common sense and decide what's best for you.


----------



## SnowDragon

According to the website of the doctor who originally invented Flexmeters, the single splint is all you need for snowboarding. The double splint, as I said, is for skateboarding and inline skating where you can fall on cement and want slide protection for your palms.

If you believe the double splint offers more protection, that is for you to choose.
While it does seem to brace your wrist more, the hyper extension protection improvement is minimal IMO.
The increment in discomfort wearing the double splint is not minimal IMO.

The Dainese guards are the next best level of protection IMO, if you want an alternative.
However, I still believe the best option is the single splint Flexmeter in its own glove.


----------



## twinbee

Thanks both. It's clear that this issue is not as cut and dried as I hoped, but I'm bleeding this one 'til it's dry - be nice to have some kind of definitive consensus! I inquired on Reddit, emailed the ski-injury.com site owner, and asked the reps at the Demon site for their opinion. You can see my findings, and also read a conversation I had with one of the staff:

Best Demon wrist guard flavour? : snowboarding

Two or three more people (one who has tried both) appear to agree with you GreyDragon, but Demon's reps appear to take wildhorse's view. Nothing's 100%, but I am SLIGHTLY veering towards a single slint for comfort's sake, and because I'm a beginner...



> According to the website of the doctor who originally invented Flexmeters, the single splint is all you need for snowboarding


Do you have the exact sentence/paragraph and the link for that claim?

Another thought is that if 'only' a 67%-85% reduction has been achieved with the single slint (instead of say 95-100%) then maybe the double slint could make up some of that remaining ground.


----------



## SnowDragon

I just did some research, looking for the quote from Dr. Binet.
Seems the reference is from "Snowboard Secrets" website, not directly from Dr. Binet.
My apologies.

FWIW, I currently own all 4 versions of the Flexmeters - single splint guard, double splint guard, single splint glove, double splint glove. I always go to the single splint glove. While the double splint glove "feels" solid, it is noticeably more cumbersome and nearly impossible to fit over or under the sleeve of your snowboard jacket.

One thing I discovered in snowboarding is no matter how much protection an item offers, it will provide none if you don't wear it. I don't enjoy wearing the double splint versions.

I recommend you buy both versions, either in the glove or guard only, make your decision and return the one you do not like.

Regardless, I believe Flexmeters are the best wrist protection available for snowboarders.
Good luck.


----------



## wildhorse

If you have dakine wrist guards and find those uncomfortable then definitely get single splint guards, as you would find double split even more uncomfortable and not wear them. I have double split guards (not flexmeters, but similar idea) for inline skating so I know how it feels like. You definitely want wrist guards that you will wear and not try just once.

Falling on the ground to test wrist guards is very different from snowboarding, since on slow even slight wrist support will cause the wrist to slide. Thats why I said the single splint guards may do the job too, but I haven't seen any study on the difference therefore can't claim how much more secure a double splint would be.

Long wrist guards like flexmeter are designed to be worn snug on your hands. Its questionable if the mentioned study tested the gloves with integrated flexmeters or just flexmeters. The figures could be little different. I always hated gloves with integrated splints because the splint would move around and when in wrong position could create strong pressure points that could cause injury during fall. GreyDragon could answer if that happens also with flexmeter gloves or not. How is the split secured in the glove against moving?


----------



## kosmoz

Let me ask a question, why do you need these? Don't you know how to fall on your butt? :dunno:


----------



## SnowDragon

kosmoz said:


> Let me ask a question, why do you need these? Don't you know how to fall on your butt? :dunno:


When you get off the bunny hill, you"ll stop asking this question.
I'll look for you in a couple of years then.


----------



## SnowDragon

wildhorse said:


> If you have dakine wrist guards and find those uncomfortable then definitely get single splint guards, as you would find double split even more uncomfortable and not wear them. I have double split guards (not flexmeters, but similar idea) for inline skating so I know how it feels like. You definitely want wrist guards that you will wear and not try just once.
> 
> Falling on the ground to test wrist guards is very different from snowboarding, since on slow even slight wrist support will cause the wrist to slide. Thats why I said the single splint guards may do the job too, but I haven't seen any study on the difference therefore can't claim how much more secure a double splint would be.
> 
> Long wrist guards like flexmeter are designed to be worn snug on your hands. Its questionable if the mentioned study tested the gloves with integrated flexmeters or just flexmeters. The figures could be little different. I always hated gloves with integrated splints because the splint would move around and when in wrong position could create strong pressure points that could cause injury during fall. GreyDragon could answer if that happens also with flexmeter gloves or not. How is the split secured in the glove against moving?


From memory, there is a strap within the pocket that holds the splint centred in the pocket where the splint sits within the glove.
I haven't noticed the splint moving off centre.


----------



## kosmoz

GreyDragon said:


> When you get off the bunny hill, you"ll stop asking this question.
> I'll look for you in a couple of years then.


 bunny hill :eusa_clap:








And it's in meters, not feets  And if you are dumb enough to fall on you hands, how you can be sure you won't brake your hand somewhere higher than your wrist? I do BJJ and MMA for a few years, I know how to fall and not to brake my limbs.


----------



## SnowDragon

kosmoz said:


> bunny hill :eusa_clap:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> And it's in meters, not feets  And if you are dumb enough to fall on you hands, how you can be sure you won't brake your hand somewhere higher than your wrist? I do BJJ and MMA for a few years, I know how to fall and not to brake my limbs.


Perhaps you should start the "Snowboarding Gods Forum" then, and leave this forum to we mere mortals.
Regardless, try contributing rather than criticizing. I've seen many of your other posts and you're quite miserable.


----------



## kosmoz

GreyDragon said:


> Perhaps you should start the "Snowboarding Gods Forum" then, and leave this forum to we mere mortals.
> Regardless, try contributing rather than criticizing. I've seen many of your other posts and you're quite miserable.


do some pushups with inverted palms, learn to sit and roll when chatching heel edge or drop on forearms instead of palms when catching toe edge. None of us are sending 60ft jumps or does 12 ft in halfpipe and who does that - does not ask in forums. Breaking a wrist is so much a beginner thing... I was 16 when i broke my wrist and dislocated elbow while playing basketball, wrist is just flowers compared to elbow so I STRONGLY recommend learn to fall instead of having all the armor and falling wrong way.


----------



## cookiedog

I'm with Dragon on this one. You can't always predict they way you gonna fall in the first place. It happens in seconds and falling safely doesn't prevent the injury it giving a chance to minimize it. Falling on forearms is good practice but not always doable. 
Problem is not only the direction of the impact but shear forces exerted on the bones and joints. Wrist guards designed BY SMART PEOPLE to counter injury by preventing hyperextension on several axes and act as a compression force at the moment of impact. 
I STRONGLY recommend learn to fall and have all the armor


----------



## twinbee

Hi kosmoz,



> Let me ask a question, why do you need these? Don't you know how to fall on your butt?


Apparently the risk between wrist injury is divided relatively evenly between beginners and experts such as yourself because you fall less often, but the results are a lot more severe if you do fall. Having said that, maybe you're more disciplined than even many advanced snowboarders, and have very good willpower in terms of keeping your wrists out of the way.

I'm wondering though.... would the best willpower/training in the world always prevent wrist injury if one didn't bother wearing wristguards?




> how you can be sure you won't brake your hand somewhere higher than your wrist?


This is a myth that's apparently been put to rest, for two reasons. Apparently, a break higher up the arm is far less disastrous than a wrist break, due to how people that break their wrist mostly never regain 100% use/strength of it. Injuries higher up are apparently are a lot 'nicer' to mend. The second reason is that more of the force is distributed evenly, not least because the wristguard eats up some of the force - at least the good ones such as the Flexmeter. See here for details, and look for where it says "Don't wrist guards lead to injury further up the arm?":

Wrist guards for snowboarders - www.ski-injury.com - Ski Injury



> STRONGLY recommend learn to fall


Well said - I think that should be standard in snowboarding training. I've been to two different centres, and one of them didn't even mention to keep wrists out the way when falling. Neither gave any time to physically 'fake falling' to train the mind to fall properly. I think that alone would cut injuries by at least 50% for bunnies.



> If you have dakine wrist guards and find those uncomfortable then definitely get single splint guards, as you would find double split even more uncomfortable and not wear them


Yes, the 'uncomfortableness' was due to aching (almost as if I was mildly spraining it!), rather than feeling restricted. Still, point taken, I think the single splint offer a good compromise between comfort and protection (if they are any less protective that is).



> I just did some research, looking for the quote from Dr. Binet.
> Seems the reference is from "Snowboard Secrets" website, not directly from Dr. Binet.
> My apologies.


Good stuff - another piece of the puzzle. Still leaning towards the single splint I think. I'll see how I fare with the non-gloved version with my existing gloves.


----------



## kosmoz

I pick breaking my wrist 5 times over one dislocated elbow or sth else. That energy doesn't go anywhere, if wristguard saves the wrist, that energy goes up. Ofcourse, upper the wrist harder to break, but totally doable. I was 16 when landed very badly, while playing basketball, broke two of my wrist bones and dislocated elbow + some bone broke of from elbow and went to elbow joint. A surgery has to be done, then rehab. Since then I fall on my back, on my side, try to roll and carry all the momentum. It wasnt hard to pick it up in BJJ and MMA classes, where everybody are taught how to fall, because I have learned that lesson the hard way. Ofcourse I had some 35ish MPH faceplants on forearms and chest after which had to sit down for a while to get back to normal breathing, but avoiding wrist breaks is so easy without all that wrist guards. It's not the same as learning to fall on rails and not braking your back or ribs, it's totally doable.

My wrist is totally fine, no surgery had to be done, all the strenght and flexibility is there. Elbow is almost the same. Almost, because I feel pain a few times a year when weather is changing + an ugly scar.


----------



## td.1000

kosmoz said:


> I pick breaking my wrist 5 times over one dislocated elbow or sth else. That energy doesn't go anywhere, if wristguard saves the wrist, that energy goes up.


nope. just no.


----------



## chomps1211

Well,.. the first thing I would say here is that I for one do not believe in any way, that old kosy is anywhere _near_ being the expert he claims to be! *In Anything!!!!*. There has been a DC type stink about him from the beginning. (Anybody remember his "Hitler" soccer post?)

So if it isn't DC? He is a JAOT! (Just Another Obnoxious Troll!) :trolls:


----------



## kosmoz

chomps1211 said:


> Well,.. the first thing I would say here is that I for one do not believe in any way, that old kosy is anywhere _near_ being the expert he claims to be! *In Anything!!!!*. There has been a DC type stink about him from the beginning. (Anybody remember his "Hitler" soccer post?)
> 
> So if it isn't DC? He is a JAOT! (Just Another Obnoxious Troll!) :trolls:


I didn't say ANYWHERE that I'm an EXPERT in ANYTHING :dizzy: and I would choose 10 times out of 10 to be some kind of DC prick than some old fat fart with broken back who can't walk without pain and can't do anything about it just to create a thread so everybody could feel sorry for him.


----------



## cookiedog

kosmoz said:


> Since then I fall on my back, on my side, try to roll and carry all the momentum.


 Can you please make us a video tutorial how you roll with your snowboard on? and later your video from hospital with broken spine. ..fkn bs this guy is saying.


----------



## chomps1211

kosmoz said:


> I didn't say ANYWHERE that I'm an EXPERT in ANYTHING :dizzy: and I would choose 10 times out of 10 to be some kind of DC prick than some old fat fart with broken back who can't walk without pain and can't do anything about it just to create a thread so everybody could feel sorry for him.


:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

…touch a nerve there, did I SuzieQ???? SWAK! 
:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:


----------



## cookiedog

kosmoz said:


> DC prick than some old fat fart with broken back who can't walk without pain and can't do anything about it just to create a thread so everybody could feel sorry for him.


Dude you are an asshole to say this shit. But I guess you way to fkn dumb to even remotely understand it.


----------



## kosmoz

cookiedog said:


> Can you please make us a video tutorial how you roll with your snowboard on? and later your video from hospital with broken spine. ..fkn bs this guy is saying.


Imagine falling tree, so that would be the opposite  when you catch an edge, do you sit and hit ground with curved back or straight legs straight back and hand first to hit the ground with elbows straight?


----------



## twinbee

SO....... back on topic, I'm glad your wrist turned out okay kosmoz, but remember you were young at the time, and youth is much kinder generally to healing joints etc. than older ppl.

Did you read that link I gave? The wrist guard almost certainly absorbs a lot of the impact. I quote



> I am only aware of two individual cases where snowboarders wearing guards have sustained upper arm fractures, possibly as a result of wearing a guard. This must be compared to the thousands of potential wrist injuries that guards have prevented or reduced in severity. Subsequent biomechanical studies do not support Cheng’s theory and, in fact, demonstrate that one of the protective effects of guards is to dissipate impact energy safely throughout the device without increasing the forces at any one spot.





> in BJJ and MMA classes, where everybody are taught how to fall


This is really another topic's worth, but do you and others think these two pics capture the essence of how to fall, at least for newcomers such as myself:

http://www.ski-injury.com/uploads/fck/image/Wrist page/front fall coll.jpg

http://www.ski-injury.com/uploads/fck/image/Wrist page/back fall coll.jpg


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## cookiedog

kosmoz said:


> Imagine falling tree, so that would be the opposite  when you catch an edge, do you sit and hit ground with curved back or straight legs straight back and hand first to hit the ground with elbows straight?


falling tree really??? opposite would be the fkn momentum that you have when falling forward. You can't roll with snowboard when falling forward or sideways. Any attempt and torsional forces will brake you spine. dam..why im even explaining.

Imagine falling tree on your head. That will fix ya.


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## td.1000

twinbee said:


> This is really another topic's worth, but do you and others think these two pics capture the essence of how to fall, at least for newcomers such as myself:
> 
> http://www.ski-injury.com/uploads/fck/image/Wrist page/front fall coll.jpg
> 
> http://www.ski-injury.com/uploads/fck/image/Wrist page/back fall coll.jpg


yeah this is a pretty good place to start. most of the times, as kosmoz was maybe trying to say, you keep your arms in and try not to 'fight' the fall. as you get more experienced you learn that there are some situations where trying to stop yourself from rolling around is a good idea (broken wrist > broken back). this is where the wrist guards come in handy.


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## kosmoz

cookiedog said:


> falling tree really??? opposite would be the fkn momentum that you have when falling forward. You can't roll with snowboard when falling forward or sideways. Any attempt and torsional forces will brake you spine. dam..why im even explaining.
> 
> Imagine falling tree on your head. That will fix ya.


I was speaking about heel edge, with toe edge no rolling, just fall on knees and forehand, like in pics. Anyway, no prob to do a front roll, but intentionally, not when you dont expect catching a toe edge.


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## cookiedog

kosmoz said:


> I was speaking about heel edge, with toe edge no rolling, just fall on knees and forehand, like in pics. Anyway, no prob to do a front roll, but intentionally, not when you dont expect catching a toe edge.


You have a good point on falling safely, but wrist guards are there for the reason in addition to safety technique.


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## twinbee

> as you get more experienced you learn that there are some situations where trying to stop yourself from rolling around is a good idea (broken wrist > broken back). this is where the wrist guards come in handy.


Do you think, as a beginner, it's worth trying to use my wrists/hands to save myself if I use the Flexmeters?


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## cookiedog

They look really bulky to be honest, and with my already big hands I'll have real trouble getting gloves on. So for me I think I'll try Demon Snow flex.


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## bamfb2

kosmoz said:


> Let me ask a question, why do you need these? Don't you know how to fall on your butt? :dunno:


When you are aggressively attacking the park, you quite often can't control how you fall. At times, if you don't use your arm to break your fall, you might crack your head open like an egg. If you fall on your butt off a 45ft kicker, you are going to break your back. 

Flexmeters have saved my wrists a number of times and are well worth the investment. Not that hard to fit under gloves, especially if you use mitts. I didn't even have to go up in size on my mitts.


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## kosmoz

bamfb2 said:


> When you are aggressively attacking the park, you quite often can't control how you fall. At times, if you don't use your arm to break your fall, you might crack your head open like an egg.


You break your wrist when trying to save your ass, not head


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## bamfb2

kosmoz said:


> You break your wrist when trying to save your ass, not head


Not if you are inverted. Nor if you are getting jackknifed.


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## kosmoz

bamfb2 said:


> Not if you are inverted. Nor if you are getting jackknifed.


Good luck breaking your wrist in this position. While your elbows are bent yourre safe. When you are saving your ass your elbows are locked and you are lucky to brake your wrist only.


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## SnowDragon

twinbee said:


> Do you think, as a beginner, it's worth trying to use my wrists/hands to save myself if I use the Flexmeters?


Always try to turtle when you fall.
Assume the fetal position - arms tucked in front of you close to your body.

Wrist guards will help in the case of sudden falls, but don't get in the habit of extending your arms to stop a fall.


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## Aplanis

Gdog42 said:


> I've been using the Demon Flex wrist guards this season and they've been great.
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> I used to have the Dakine ones that you have, but I didn't like them because there was nothing on the back sides to actually stop my wrists from flexing in that direction too far, which would cause a sprain. They were also uncomfortable and kind of bulky.
> 
> 
> 
> The Demon Flex ones are so much better- they're completely low-profile, have splints on both sides, lighter, offer better protection, and are so comfortable I literally forget I'm wearing them.
> 
> 
> 
> Another benefit I have from them is that they keep my jacket's wrist gaiters in place. They used to pull back behind my thumb every time I bent over to strap in (because I'm kind of tall), which was uncomfortable on my hands. Now I wear them over the Demon Flex guards and they haven't been a problem- it's actually made the wrist gaiters more comfortable to wear.
> 
> So they have a lower profile, lower price, and offer just as much protection as the Flexmeter wrist guards. And putting my gloves on over them is insanely easy
> 
> 
> 
> I would grab a pair of these if I were you. The reason I got them in the first place was because for the last 5 seasons I've sprained my wrists multiple times, which was annoying. Hasn't happened with these! :thumbsup:
> 
> 
> 
> Here's a link to them on Demon's website. If you do get a pair, make sure you check the size chart first.
> 
> http://www.demonsnow.com/store/Demon Flex wrist guard





Hey man

Those look comfortable. And thanks for the pics.

Question, what size glove do you wear? Did you order the same size guard? For example, large in both?

Do your hands feel constricted in these while wearing gloves?

Jeff


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## twinbee

I've got the Flexmeter (single splint) guards now.

As suspected, my gloves will not fit over the guards. However they DO fit under, though it's a rather tight squeeze.

So I was thinking of buying some (expensive if need be) thinner gloves instead to fit UNDER the guards. Would you guys advise this?

How about something like these:

6600 Hestra Silk Ski Glove Liner £21.00 - Edge And Wax

or maybe:

3415 Hestra Fleece Ski Glove Liner Waffled Fleece £15.00 - Edge And Wax

http://www.amazon.co.uk/963-EDZ-Mer...F8&qid=1408890918&sr=8-6&keywords=thin+gloves

They need to be relatively 'snow-proof' - at least a bit water resistant. I know being liners, they're meant to be used with outer gloves, but some of them may be warm enough.


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## bamfb2

twinbee said:


> I've got the Flexmeter (single splint) guards now.
> 
> As suspected, my gloves will not fit over the guards. However they DO fit under, though it's a rather tight squeeze.
> 
> So I was thinking of buying some (expensive if need be) thinner gloves instead to fit UNDER the guards. Would you guys advise this?
> 
> How about something like these:
> or maybe:
> 
> They need to be relatively 'snow-proof' - at least a bit water resistant. I know being liners, they're meant to be used with outer gloves, but some of them may be warm enough.


Be advised, the flexmeter single guards are meant to go UNDER your gloves. I suggest going for your tight fit gloves, or, if you are concerned about tearing, go one size up. I prefer mitts to regular gloves when wearing my flexmeters, but I don't think it matters much.


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## SnowDragon

Just buy the Flexmeter gloves with the guards built in.


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## tokyo_dom

Bump to old post...

After my break at the end of the season, i decided to upgrade my Dakine wrist guards (ironically i was not wearing them when i broke my wrist/collarbone). I scored a set of Demon Flexmeters (single sided) for cheap on an auction, and as indicated in this thread they feel like they will do very nicely for wrist protection. They are also much lower profile than my last set, meaning i can use them on gloves that were previously too tight with the Dakines

But my next worry is, are these likely to cause me breaking my fingers?! Has anyone had any decent falls with these and did the back plate cause any problems with your fingers? When flexing the back plate goes to about halfway up the back of my first joint on my fingers, exposing much of the stress to that first joint. 

Or did i get the wrong size? The pics i find online seem to show others with the same fitment


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## lab49232

ShredLife said:


> i dealt with weak wrists for years from a broken scaphoid and ruptured bursa and in my experience learning to tape your wrists correctly is far safer and easier to ride with than any wrist guard. for my wrists i just needed about three bracelet style wraps and i'm good.


This. In fact you want to see a gnarly injury, watch what happens when you land on your wrist with wrist guards super hard and something needs to give. You'll never see a more interesting (and gruesome) Ulna and Radius break. It's basically an explosion as the wrist guard won't break and redirects all the energy up to them. They're much stronger and less likely to break than your wrist, but taping is a much safer solution and to be honest I'll take my broken wrist every time in comparison.


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## td.1000

lab49232 said:


> This. In fact you want to see a gnarly injury, watch what happens when you land on your wrist with wrist guards super hard and something needs to give. You'll never see a more interesting (and gruesome) Ulna and Radius break. *It's basically an explosion as the wrist guard won't break and redirects all the energy up to them. They're much stronger and less likely to break than your wrist,* but taping is a much safer solution and to be honest I'll take my broken wrist every time in comparison.


This is a myth. Maybe back in the day wrist-guards were poorly designed, but now there is no evidence that they increase the chances of breaking your arm. If you've tried any of them on you'd know that they are quite flexible, and are there to reinforce/strengthen your wrist, not to keep it from moving. They are nowhere near stiff enough to break bones.


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## tokyo_dom

From what i have learned from my break earlier this year, despite my collar bone being broken clean through and unable to be fixed in a splint, it ended up healing faster than what seemed like hairline cracks in the corners of my radius and ulna. Sure, the splint came off the arm quicker, but i still dont have 100% confidence in the wrist, whereas my collarbone feels stronger than ever. 

So i will stick with these Flexmeter guards, they have quite a fair bit of give in them, but still prevent the pain which i would otherwise have trying to support myself on the recently healed wrist.

Still want to know about them fingers though...


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## SnowDogWax

Had a couple of nasty falls on my wrist last season.

Reading through this thread was very helpful. :eusa_clap:

Ordered the Level Half Pipe Mitten. 

Finally Xsports protective had a size 10 which according to my hand 

measurement & there chart will fit my leather big hands... :woohoo:


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## bamfb2

td.1000 said:


> This is a myth. Maybe back in the day wrist-guards were poorly designed, but now there is no evidence that they increase the chances of breaking your arm. If you've tried any of them on you'd know that they are quite flexible, and are there to reinforce/strengthen your wrist, not to keep it from moving. They are nowhere near stiff enough to break bones.


Well, you are both right. There's plenty of super stiff guards still on the market. Guards like the Flexmeter (my choice) or Level are both very flexible and act as you say. But there's still those guards (often marketed to skateboarders) that are simply too stiff or not the right length that don't distribute or dissipate the shock properly.

The best I've seen are the Levels, the flex meters, and some made for biking (bmx, downhill and motorcross).

In fact, a lot of the biking gear is fantastic for snowboarding. I own some Troy Lee Design stuff that's perfect.


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## bamfb2

SGboarder said:


> No, just no way. Makes no sense. First of all, it takes a lot to break the ulna and/or radius. Second, I will take a broken forearm over a serious wrist injury any day.


Exactly, in terms of healing time, flexibility, etc, the wrist is one of the worst breaks you can have. Forearms can heal as good as new (maybe need some screws/metal).


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## bamfb2

lab49232 said:


> This. In fact you want to see a gnarly injury, watch what happens when you land on your wrist with wrist guards super hard and something needs to give. You'll never see a more interesting (and gruesome) Ulna and Radius break. It's basically an explosion as *the wrist guard won't break and redirects all the energy up to them. *They're much stronger and less likely to break than your wrist, but taping is a much safer solution and to be honest I'll take my broken wrist every time in comparison.



There's a number of guards one the market that have the necessary flex to avoid this. Speaking to the Flexmeters specifically, they have progressive flex, so that the shock is actually 'decelerated', which is better than any other option. At the lower end of the spectrum, they are quite flexible, but the further you bend, the greater the stiffness. So when you take a hard fall, it effectively slows down the impact with gradual with incremental flex. And they never max out in terms of flexibility.


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## SnowDogWax

bamfb2 said:


> Well, you are both right. There's plenty of super stiff guards still on the market. Guards like the Flexmeter (my choice) or Level are both very flexible and act as you say. But there's still those guards (often marketed to skateboarders) that are simply too stiff or not the right length that don't distribute or dissipate the shock properly.
> 
> The best I've seen are the Levels, the flex meters, and some made for biking (bmx, downhill and motorcross).
> 
> In fact, a lot of the biking gear is fantastic for snowboarding. I own some Troy Lee Design stuff that's perfect.


+1
This is a great point.. :hairy:


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## RIDERUK

On a different note:

I've had my flexmeters for a couple of years now. Anyone aware of them "wearing out" or needing replacing after a certain time span? I'm just thinking the degree of support might wear out if the plastic loosens up.


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## SnowDogWax

IMO after a year or two of using any protective devise, a person would know when the fit has compromised the protection. The plastic in flex meters, level or others should outlast the wear of the material. Riding on asphalt as opposed to snow would change my thinking on the plastic.


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## bamfb2

RIDERUK said:


> On a different note:
> 
> I've had my flexmeters for a couple of years now. Anyone aware of them "wearing out" or needing replacing after a certain time span? I'm just thinking the degree of support might wear out if the plastic loosens up.





SnowDogWax said:


> IMO after a year or two of using any protective devise, a person would know when the fit has compromised the protection. The plastic in flex meters, level or others should outlast the wear of the material. Riding on asphalt as opposed to snow would change my thinking on the plastic.



Agree with SnowDog. Unless you are frequently folding them in half while sitting on the couch, I doubt you'll have any issues. The neoprene and velcro will probably go first.


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