# Very Wide Duck Feet Burton Photon vs Photon Step On vs Ruler



## flinstoneKid (Jan 20, 2020)

TL;DR AKA Long story long. I have feet that were made for caveman. I I've tried an 8.5 Photon Step On but that was too tight. Are the non Step On Photon/Ruler that much more expansive in the forefoot? I did read on here where someone said that the ankle BOA/strap kept their heel locked in even with an oversized boot. Has anyone tried on both the Photon and the Photon Step On? Can you compare? Does the ruler afford more room because it's more flexible? I'm looking at ordering a 9 and 9.5 wide in the Photon. 

Excessive Details for the above 
Hello I have super wide Flintstones feet. They are a duck feet. They don't get narrower at my toes/ball of my foot. So the tip of my toe is the widest part. I also have normal to small arches by a high volume instep. My big toe points inward making even more toe pressure. Traditionally my brannock size is a 8.5-9 4E (and those still toe rub). My left foot is at least 5 to 7 mm longer than my right (1/2+ size). I measured my feet using the aforementioned wall system. My left foot is 25.7 cm long, 11cm width. My right foot is 25.1 cm long, 11.4 cm width. This is a morning measure. I did it a couple of times and my left foot was as long as 26 cm, but that could just be a weird angle. If you measure the width away from the wall from the edge of my big toe to outside of my foot and it's 12.5cm wide. I know this equates to a 255-260 Mondo size. I always have to go up a couple of sizes for a rental. Then ratchet my binding until my feet hurt and still have lots of heel lift.

I've been looking for boots and struggling. My local mountain is a midwest style mountain with only a 1100 ft of elevation gain. Plus not being young and being overweight, I was really hoping the step ons would work. I understand they can put more pressure because of the built in reinforcement. Due to the distance to a major city, all of my boot search is mail order as the local shops don't want to order a boot they can't sell if it doesn't fit and I don't want to be stuck with a boot that doesn't fit. So, I ordered an 8 and an 8.5 Burton Photon Wide Step On. The 8.5 is a no go. could barely get them on. Helped without an insole but it was an all round forefoot pressure. Tried it twice, an hour a part, with different socks and after less than 20 minutes, there was no "getting used to it". In fact my left foot was sore the next day. When I tried the liner on outside of the boot, there was gap between the sides of the tongue and the rest of the liner and you could see my socks. 

Thanks in advance for any input!

Look Away!


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## bazman (Jan 15, 2017)

I didn't read all of your post, but if you have struggled getting boots to fit you shouldn't limit yourself to just Burton boots. Search for measuring advice from Wiredsport then try on as many pairs and brands as you can.

I seem to be saying this a lot recently - it would be a big mistake to get bad fitting boots just to get step on bindings


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## flinstoneKid (Jan 20, 2020)

bazman said:


> I didn't read all of your post, but if you have struggled getting boots to fit you shouldn't limit yourself to just Burton boots. Search for measuring advice from Wiredsport then try on as many pairs and brands as you can.
> 
> I seem to be saying this a lot recently - it would be a big mistake to get bad fitting boots just to get step on bindings


Thanks for the reply! I am open to any model. I have narrowed it somewhat to the Burton's because there seem to be 4 main wide boot providers. Burton, Salomon, K2 and Adidas. Burton's are equivalent to a EEE, The Salomon's are single "E"s. I have heard mixed things about K2, from a EE up to EEE, but not significantly wider than the Burtons. I just recently read the Adidas Tacticals are as wide as the Burtons but many users reported a hotspot on the center middle foot from high arches (i definitely have a high volume foot). The Burtons are the one that I feel most confident in being EEE. I'm definitely not wedded to the Step Ons, but if I can get a very similar fit, I'd definitely consider them.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Hi Flint!

You are going to be a little bit of a tricky fit. Your smaller foot is the smallest size in the range for Mondopoint 275 or size 7.5 US in snowboard boots. Your larger foot is Mondopoint 260 (even at your longest measurement) which is size 8 US in snowboard boots. At 11 and 11.4 wide your feet are EEEE width (no one produces snowboard boots for EEEE width). If you are actually 12.5 cm wide, that is off the charts Wide. Let's hope that is not correct .

Please measure your feet using this method and take 4 images of your barefoot measurements being taken (2 length, 2 width):

Kick your heel (barefoot please, no socks) back against a wall. Mark the floor exactly at the tip of your toe (the one that sticks out furthest - which toe this is will vary by rider). Measure from the mark on the floor to the wall. That is your foot length and is the only measurement that you will want to use. Measure in centimeters if possible, but if not, take inches and multiply by 2.54 (example: an 11.25 inch foot x 2.54 = 28.57 centimeters). For width please place the inside (medial side) of your foot against a wall. Please then measure from the wall out to the widest point on the lateral (outside) of your foot.


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## flinstoneKid (Jan 20, 2020)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi Flint!
> 
> You are going to be a little bit of a tricky fit. Your smaller foot is the smallest size in the range for Mondopoint 275 or size 7.5 US in snowboard boots. Your larger foot is Mondopoint 260 (even at your longest measurement) which is size 8 US in snowboard boots. At 11 and 11.4 wide your feet are EEEE width (no one produces snowboard boots for EEEE width). If you are actually 12.5 cm wide, that is off the charts Wide. Let's hope that is not correct .
> 
> ...


Thanks for the reply. Sorry about the delay. Life got crazy.
I remeasured and came up with pretty much the same measurements. Just over 11CM wide for both feet. The process of pushing my foot against the wall pushes the toe in. If i flip it around and measure with the big toe floating free, it's over 12cm. But like you said, no one makes a 4E boot let alone a 6E boot. The length is just over 25 (25.3) CM for my left foot and just under 25 (24.7) for my right foot. High volume foot (not a high arch). I'm attaching pictures. 

I've tried on a few pair of Burton Wides now (mail order).

*Burton Photon Step Ons 8.5,* I could get them on, but quick numbness and foot pain. In fact I tried them on for about 20 minutes, twice. The next day my foot hurt. 
*Ruler 9*. Lace bite and tightness on the arch. Top of foot had pressure. Heel lift in the left foot
*Ruler 9.5* Similar, definitely more comfortable but even more excessive heel lift. Plus probably due to my size( I'm 6'2 280 lbs). They didn't seem to offer much support. If I didn't tighten them down as much as possible when I leaned forward there was a gap in the calf area and heel lift. 
*Photon 9.5,* Weirdly some pressure on the bottom/pad of my foot. Slight bit of heel lift in one foot but pretty good. Still tight in some areas. Basically tightened the top boa but not the bottom. A bit worried they might get sloppy with pack out. When I got the least heel lift they were almost too tight in the numb department. 
I'm now on the fence between trying to track down some 9 Wide Photons on the internet and just going with the Photons. The Photons seemed to offer enough support I didn't feel like I had to excessively tighten everything down. The liner tightening on the Burtons is actually on the inner shell wall, I think relacing it so the bottom most eyelets are skipped may help with the laces cutting into my arches. But so far the Photons are the best boot that seemed to minimize heel lift while not going numb in the first minute. Will custom insoles help with pressure on the bottom of my foot? I'm also a little worried the 9.5's will leave too much lift after heat molding and pack out. But then again it can't be any worse than rental boots that are two sizes too big.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Hi Flint,

You have a very unusual foot. There is really no good stock option for you. Have a look at the chart below and you will see that you are at size 11.5 EEE before we start seeing widths that are correct for you (even though your smaller foot is only size 7). EEE is the widest snowboard boot produced. Clearly that won't work. My best advice for you is to visit with a very skilled boot fitter. Each one will have their own approach to your issues and each will likely have a different suggestion for how they want to proceed. They likely each have a different preference for your start point. I wish that I had a better solution for you but it really does not exist. 

STOKED!



https://www.wiredsport.com/width2.JPG


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## flinstoneKid (Jan 20, 2020)

Thanks for the help!


Wiredsport said:


> Hi Flint,
> 
> You have a very unusual foot. There is really no good stock option for you. Have a look at the chart below and you will see that you are at size 11.5 EEE before we start seeing widths that are correct for you (even though your smaller foot is only size 7). EEE is the widest snowboard boot produced. Clearly that won't work. My best advice for you is to visit with a very skilled boot fitter. Each one will have their own approach to your issues and each will likely have a different suggestion for how they want to proceed. They likely each have a different preference for your start point. I wish that I had a better solution for you but it really does not exist.
> 
> ...


 I appreciate the advice! Thanks!


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

It's unfortunate, but I second using a very good boot fitter. It's amazing what skilled modifications can do for a boot's fit. More and more I think new boots are just a starting point. For those with unusual feet, a proper fit is achieved after much tinkering.


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