# Any one ever snowboard out of boinds?



## Ridethesnow80 (Nov 10, 2011)

Has any one gone or even thought about going out of bounds?


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## BoardWalk (Mar 22, 2011)

Ha, good one....


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## theMayor (Jul 30, 2013)

I do sometimes. Most places will take your lift ticket if you are caught though... the boundaries are set for general safety though, so it's not recommended.


With that said, some of the best riding I've experienced was on a slope that was closed because they didn't think there was enough base to open it for the public...









I smell troll.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

What did you intend with this question? You'll get a bunch of posts with "yes"... Now, what exactly did you want to ask?


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

if you duck ropes at ski resorts expect one or more of the following things to happen:

- your lift ticket/season pass pulled
- S&R costs/fines
- getting lost and spending the night(s) out in the snowy wilderness
- dying a horrific death in an avalanche, fall off a cliff, other snow burial, hypothermia, etc. 

if you want to ride backcountry and live, do it right. this involves learning. this will require to do research on your own.


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## Ridethesnow80 (Nov 10, 2011)

Asking about any ones experience riding out bounds ? Plain and simple


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## BoardWalk (Mar 22, 2011)

Ridethesnow80 said:


> Asking about any ones experience riding out bounds ? Plain and simple


It's fun, but you had better do your homework before you duck.


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

Ridethesnow80 said:


> Asking about any ones experience riding out bounds ? Plain and simple


riding "out of bounds" is for idiots and gapers. its that simple.

if you want to ride _backcountry_ like a fucking badass, you need to take it upon yourself to learn how to do it and minimize risk. 

i don't ride lifts/resorts much anymore, mostly snowmobiles and splitboards to get me where i'm going.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

What's out of boinds?


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## Ridethesnow80 (Nov 10, 2011)

Yeah it is . Did it once last year fresh snow the night before! Ski patrol was right there riding the lift shouting *"stop stop"*. I took of right to my car a rolled out. Plain stupidity in my part putting my self in that position of being caught. Vowed right then and there never to do it again..


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

BoardWalk said:


> It's fun, but you had better do your homework before you duck.


if you're ducking ropes at the resort, do you wear a beacon, probe and shovel and always ride with a partner, drop one at a time, keeping within eyesight? if you answered no to anything you should probably sack up and learn to ride real backcountry. 

if you answered yes, you should sack up and ride real backcountry and get off the resorts, quit making ski patrol and S&R follow your tracks out of bounds, wasting their time and possibly distracting them from real emergencies. not to mention your tracks acting as a beacon for every retarded weekend warrior to follow to their death below the catchline.


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## Ridethesnow80 (Nov 10, 2011)

ShredLife said:


> riding "out of bounds" is for idiots and gapers. its that simple.
> 
> if you want to ride _backcountry_ like a fucking badass, you need to take it upon yourself to learn how to do it and minimize risk.
> 
> i don't ride lifts/resorts much anymore, mostly snowmobiles and splitboards to get me where i'm going.


This is true it is for idiots ! I'm not talking about back country riding!


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

.... and if you don't listen to me then i hope you die quickly, and soon - i am a big fan of natural selection.


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## Ridethesnow80 (Nov 10, 2011)

What is your deal. I'm agreeing with you . The main reason if for this is for people to learn from those mistakes made by others.


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## Ridethesnow80 (Nov 10, 2011)

Ridethesnow80 said:


> What is your deal. I'm agreeing with you . The main reason if for this is for people to learn from those mistakes made by others.


Including my self!


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

Ridethesnow80 said:


> What is your deal. I'm agreeing with you . The main reason if for this is for people to learn from those mistakes made by others.


"my deal" is that i've been doing this for over 20 years, i've had friends die in the mountains, and people think that just because you're at the resort you can do what ever the fuck you want. you can't. 

ducking ropes isn't that funny when someone dies. that shit is real. it happens. 





what the fuck. i thought i dropped the mic on this thread. fucking done.


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## Ridethesnow80 (Nov 10, 2011)

Ok your point is made very clear. And I respect that.


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## Ridethesnow80 (Nov 10, 2011)

For even stating this thread . To any one that has been through something tragic doing some as stupid as this, my apologies. Thread over should have never started it to begin with . Completely my fault. Peace


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## CheeseForSteeze (May 11, 2011)

Well, at least you sacked up and admitted it, I can respect that. I'm not sure but some places seemed to have quasi bounded areas that are "at your own risk" in the sense that they won't nab you for going out of bounds but they just can't necessarily provide the same level of control and safety.

I went out of bounds by mistake this March riding up at Keystone. I was riding South Bowl off Wapiti Peak back in the Outback area and came down through Teletrees and went skiier's left too far. I ended up going through a lot of meadows due to pow fever and because the snowpack was so deep, I lost all my speed. I made it through a few but I eventually came to a stop in an eerily silent meadow with the sun beating down on me. Nothing happened but I did have to spend a ton of energy getting out of about chest deep snow going uphill back to the trail about 75 yards. My buddy was about to call ski patrol by the time I made it back down. I felt like an asshole and a clown. I'm not even sure it was out of bounds since it's not marked that much back there but it just goes to show that you need to pick your lines carefully no matter where you are going.

I also rode off Loveland Pass on a wicked pow day Tuesday in April because the lines at Basin were so fuckin' long and all the resort employees were done and half the Denver metro area must have called in to come ride. We did so without beacons, probes, shovels or any real avy training. I was reticent to go in the first place and tried to talk the others out of going. I ended up taking two lines and then just was the driver for the rest of the day. About a week later, that bad avy killed 5...


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Sorry, I don't think it's idiotic... I do that a lot in my home resort. When ever there's fresh and avy danger at a reasonable level, we only use groomers to get back to the lift. Beacon, showel, probe, safety distances, check each slope for possible dangers. Evidently. Why not backcountry then? Cos if up there early, I get many untacked verticals and the convenience of a close by resort (bar, sausages and a lift that takes you up). No such thing as ski patrols taking your pass here... why should they? Out of the groomer is out of the resort, not their responsibility. It's just normal to duck ropes. No local stays on the groomers if there's fresh left and right. If in a resort I don't know, I only ride SC if I have a good view on the terrain out of the cable car or from below so we know the line to go (including all the other SOP safety measures). Or go with a local guide. 
Haha, try to ride a snowmobile here.... THEN they'd be after you! They don't exist. Splitting is wonderful for the following days after a storm when the SC is tracked.


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

neni said:


> Sorry, I don't think it's idiotic... I do that a lot in my home resort. When ever there's fresh and avy danger at a reasonable level, we only use groomers to get back to the lift. Beacon, showel, probe, safety distances, check each slope for possible dangers. Evidently. Why not backcountry then? Cos if up there early, I get many untacked verticals and the convenience of a close by resort (bar, sausages and a lift that takes you up). No such thing as ski patrols taking your pass here... why should they? Out of the groomer is out of the resort, not their responsibility. It's just normal to duck ropes. No local stays on the groomers if there's fresh left and right. If in a resort I don't know, I only ride SC if I have a good view on the terrain out of the cable car or from below so we know the line to go (including all the other SOP safety measures). Or go with a local guide.
> Haha, try to ride a snowmobile here.... THEN they'd be after you! They don't exist. Splitting is wonderful for the following days after a storm when the SC is tracked.


that is "slackcountry". in the US the places that allow that typically have you exit the resort thru gates like these:



















they want you leaving thru the gates so that liability wise you see the sign, and so that dumbass newbs don't follow your random track under a rope and out of the resort. keep in mind that we live in a far more litigious society than most of europe. 

what you're talking about doesn't really involve ducking ropes in the US. it involves proper BC education and equipment and leaving the resort thru the designated gates.


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## rwspear (Mar 26, 2012)




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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

ShredLife said:


> that is "slackcountry". in the US the places that allow that typically have you exit the resort thru gates like these:
> 
> they want you leaving thru the gates so that liability wise you see the sign, and so that dumbass newbs don't follow your random track under a rope and out of the resort. keep in mind that we live in a far more litigious society than most of europe.
> 
> what you're talking about doesn't really involve ducking ropes in the US. it involves proper BC education and equipment and leaving the resort thru the designated gates.


My bad. Still a bit confused by the different nomenclatures for things that seem to be inexistant here. Thanks for the pics :thumbsup: Guess, now I understand what is meant with "gate" . Only signs I saw here are "wildlife protection area" and sculls if the really REALLY don't want you to leve the groomer right at this site cos there's a huge cliff after some meters. 
So I conclude that the term "ducking ropes" does not mean that you actually duck a rope but implies that you do it without knowing what you're doing.


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

neni said:


> So I conclude that the term "ducking ropes" does not mean that you actually duck a rope but implies that you do it without knowing what you're doing.


naw, it is ducking an actual rope. 



















the ski areas here typically have a ropeline on either far side. usually if you cross (duck) the ropeline and continue for a bit in that direction you will get into a place where you won't be able to make it back to the ski area without walking uphill like Cheeze described. his two examples are actually the prime reasons why you shouldn't duck, plus the reason of dumbasses following your track cuz they figure its ok. 

ski patrols will also rope off hazard areas within the ski resort that may have: cliffs, rocks, creeks, snowbridges, uncontrolled (unbombed) avy slopes, ice sheets, fumaroles, zombies, etc. 

there will also usually be a ropeline at the bottom cattrack on runs that wrap around the mt to keep you on that catchline. 

*entering sidecountry thru resort sanctioned gates while equipped with the proper gear is not ducking ropes. *

yes there is powder beyond the ropes, but they're there for a reason. if you want powder that bad get up earlier or go learn to ride real bc.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

rwspear said:


>


OMG, this literally IS a gate! I read many times of these gates and had no clear picture of it. Also the difference between sidecountry and slackcountry and out of bounds is somehow blurred, hard for me to understand... BC for me is skinning way off a resort. But behind the ropes I follow the same rules as in "real" BC anyway.

Edit: Thanks Shred. The picture is getting clearer. We lack these gates. Would be a good thing though...


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## miplatt88 (May 13, 2013)

I ducked a couple ropes at Loveland before but one of the workers went with me. It was nothing hardcore there was just a cliff there that was difficult to see. It was completely untouched snow and was pretty sick.... Speaking of which I am getting sick of summer.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

By this definition, yes, I admit, I did only once duck a rope and followed a track in a sick pow hunt moment without proper gear and knowledge of the terrain and this turned out to be the most fearful moments of my live (mentioned it in a thread I started with the same intent as the OP, I assume: to warn others from doing the same mistake) cos I ended up at the top of a huge cliff. Never before, never afterwards. Was a very weak decision. Either know the terrain (or with guide) and have proper gear or leave it.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

There areas where ducking a rope is considered okay. The rope just marks where ski patrol no longer patrols. My understanding is that snobasin operates under this, end well we used that freedom.

There are areas that just have an open boundary policy too.

Oh yeah, and I have cliffed myself out before too neni. Yeah, don't care for that experience again...


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

CheeseForSteeze said:


> I also rode off Loveland Pass on a wicked pow day Tuesday in April because the lines at Basin were so fuckin' long and all the resort employees were done and half the Denver metro area must have called in to come ride. We did so without beacons, probes, shovels or any real avy training.


Sounds like typical Loveland Pass activity. I've simply stopped picking up hitchers on that pass because of the rampant cluelessness.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

linvillegorge said:


> Sounds like typical Loveland Pass activity. I've simply stopped picking up hitchers on that pass because of the rampant cluelessness.


I missed that post.

Loveland Pass is a real problem. Then of course we have the worst snow sports avalanche accident in the state, and maybe the worst ever on it. Didn't help that it was experienced backcountry travelers either. 

I just don't know how to help drive awareness at that pass. I play on it from time to time, but it is just not Bert mid winter. FOBP has little traction in Summit and Loveland Pass. 

Awareness needs to be a mantra that everybody breathes while they are out there. 

Everyone out there needs to have an attitude of minimizing risks to ensure that their trip is a round trip every time. 

I am all ears for people with ideas.


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## Noreaster (Oct 7, 2012)

neni said:


> By this definition, yes, I admit, I did only once duck a rope and followed a track in a sick pow hunt moment without proper gear and knowledge of the terrain and this turned out to be the most fearful moments of my live (mentioned it in a thread I started with the same intent as the OP, I assume: to warn others from doing the same mistake) cos I ended up at the top of a huge cliff. Never before, never afterwards. Was a very weak decision. Either know the terrain (or with guide) and have proper gear or leave it.


Ha. A Zermatt guide managed to cliff us few years back. In hindsight the guy was an Aussie transplant, so maybe not the best choice. Europe is pretty much free for all circus, no gates, few boundaries, ski patrol is not be seen, go wherever at your own risk. North American terrain is almost always better controlled, in my opinion.


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

killclimbz said:


> I missed that post.
> 
> Loveland Pass is a real problem. Then of course we have the worst snow sports avalanche accident in the state, and maybe the worst ever on it. Didn't help that it was experienced backcountry travelers either.
> 
> ...


You're just a better person than me. I have no patience for stupidity and/or willful ignorance - which are pretty much the only two choices for people going out there with no gear or knowledge. Everyone knows there are avalanches in the CO mountains and a quick Google search can turn up plenty of sources for info. Anyone disregarding it has to be either stupid or willfully ignorant.

I just hate when experience, well equipped people make a mistake and get caught. Shit happens though and it's a risk you have to come to terms with being willing to accept.


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## koi (May 16, 2013)

Noreaster said:


> Ha. A Zermatt guide managed to cliff us few years back. In hindsight the guy was an Aussie transplant, so maybe not the best choice. Europe is pretty much free for all circus, no gates, few boundaries, ski patrol is not be seen, go wherever at your own risk. North American terrain is almost always better controlled, in my opinion.


I would say USA is more controlled, but a lot of it is because of stupid people. Think of that Vail teen who jumped an out of bounds rope, and his family sued because he died. 

Here in the USA we are much more sue happy than other countries.


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## Noreaster (Oct 7, 2012)

koi said:


> I would say USA is more controlled, but a lot of it is because of stupid people. Think of that Vail teen who jumped an out of bounds rope, and his family sued because he died.
> 
> Here in the USA we are much more sue happy than other countries.


If I'm not mistaken that boy didn't just duck rope. The trail was roped off at the top but not down the slope and that's where he entered, I think. A clear ski patrol fuck up. I don't know, perhaps the portion of such strict terrain control in N. America exists to protect resorts from possible litigation although they're already well insulated from it. There's another reason - in Europe most of the rideable/skiable areas are above tree line. We have more terrain diversity here. In fact big portions of rideable terrain in general lies below tree-line and that necessitates better grooming, trail marking and patrolling simply because your average 5 days a year snow slider won't be able to use poorly controlled resort area like that.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Yes, he did enter through a spot and then chose to hike uphill. Which unless it is an area that is marked for doing that, you are not supposed to do anyway. Ski runs are open for downhill traffic only for the most part. 

Maybe it could have been better marked, the courts can hash that one out.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

linvillegorge said:


> You're just a better person than me. I have no patience for stupidity and/or willful ignorance - which are pretty much the only two choices for people going out there with no gear or knowledge. Everyone knows there are avalanches in the CO mountains and a quick Google search can turn up plenty of sources for info. Anyone disregarding it has to be either stupid or willfully ignorant.
> 
> I just hate when experience, well equipped people make a mistake and get caught. Shit happens though and it's a risk you have to come to terms with being willing to accept.


You know that all I do in winter is ride backcountry terrain. So my interest in raising awareness is self serving to some degree. That, and having been around multiple deaths now, seeing some bodies being removed at the trail head, has me constantly thinking about it. I was one of the last people to see Ben alive at Berthoud Pass. The same thing with the victim on Torreys at the end of the record 10-11 season. 

I talked to his friends in the parking lot after the accident when there was still hope he would survive and S&R was working to bring him down. The weekend after Sam died on Mines 1 in 2005, I talked to a group of his friends driving over to Winterpark. They were just stunned as how this happened and hurt by the loss of their friend. It is just a really shitty thing to be around, no matter if the victim was stupid, uneducated, unprepared, or a seasoned vet. It still hurts. 

Regardless people are going to get out there. I think awareness is at an all time high, but people still ignore it for various reasons. A beacon isn't cheap, neither is a Level I class. But yet, they'll have new boards, season passes, the critical gear will fall to the side. Maybe they'll have a close call, maybe a friend will die, then shit just got serious and that stuff doesn't seem so expensive anymore. This is how a lot of people got into avalanche safety. I know several of my mentors, the experts, got into it because they lost friends. So just getting people in general to realize that it takes some investment and education to have the tools to get out there safely. You also have to use it wisely of course. I think we've done a good job at Berthoud. The majority of users out there have the basics. I can't say about education, but at least they are thinking about it. It is just not the case at Loveland. It is also frustrating when such a large accident happens and it involves people who you would think would not get caught like that. I am sure there are people who believe that if an experienced group at Sheep Creek got caught what is the point in education? They just do what they have done before. So how do we get past that?

Then of course there are outside forces, such as land managers. If enough of these bad accidents happen, access could be restricted during winter significantly. It will have to go a lot further than this, but if we as a user group don't push ourselves in the right direction, someone else will try to make those choices for us. The exploding popularity in the backcountry scene has put a spotlight on it. 

Enough of my soapbox. Obviously I have a passion for this and could go on for much longer.


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Nope, all good and very fair points my friend.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

I find myself overly cautious. 
I just booked in for ast2 also. I cant wait for that in feb


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

killclimbz said:


> Yes, he did enter through a spot and then chose to hike uphill. Which unless it is an area that is marked for doing that, you are not supposed to do anyway. Ski runs are open for downhill traffic only for the most part.
> 
> Maybe it could have been better marked, the courts can hash that one out.


You know of any level 1 classes in the region coming up between now and October? I need my son to get in another one this season.....


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

I don't think anyone teaches a level 1 until it is time for some snow to be on the ground. Not to mention if he has already taken one your $400 would be better served taking a II or investing in other things. They don't give those classes away. Several places will have free backcountry awareness classes this fall. Which is a great refresher. FOBP should have a class schedule announced in September. Winterpark is usually about as close as we get to Vail Valley though.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

Sorry, he has done awareness classes the last 2 years.... Not a level 1. Winter park is ok though. I just would like to do it earlier then do on snow before Jan. He rides all slack country in competition and that's what we ride to train too.... Slack can be sketch in east vail and alot of the venues we go to. I like him to be as prepared as possible.

Thanks


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

East Vail is some seriously dangerous terrain. That area has taken lives over the past three decades. Not to scare you off, but just letting you know it is the real deal. Some of the best slackcountry in the US to boot. You just have to remember slackcountry is backcountry.

Anyway, enough of that. If you are traveling in that terrain, I highly recommend taking a Level I course. There are a lot of tools you learn in it that really help with your decision making process. Check out Silverton Avalanche School or Alpine World Ascents. 

And of course the awareness class doesn't hurt at all. Read Staying Alive in Avalanche Terrain by Bruce Tremper if you haven't already. If you have it, read it again. Great book and I always pick up a pearl or two every time I read it. 

I'll post the FOBP class schedule up once it is finalized. Should be in early September.


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

ETM said:


> I find myself overly cautious.
> I just booked in for ast2 also. I cant wait for that in feb


No problem with that. That line will be there tomorrow, next week, next season, and long after all of us are pushing up daisies.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

linvillegorge said:


> No problem with that. That line will be there tomorrow, next week, next season, and long after all of us are pushing up daisies.


No kidding. Two full seasons of not getting the ride the cliffs at Vail Pass. Hopefully this coming season is the one where we can go slam them again...


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

My son has gotten to ride with some great riders/skiers out there, east vail. Usually patrollers from breck and vail of which two are On the avy control team. he has made some laps with Seth Morrison and his filmer(forgot his name) too, his mom works with me. Never alone and always with really experienced people. Big lines is his passion. That really steep shit scares me, I'm pretty sure I need a change of undies any time I ride with him. He and I have both read that book a couple times and watched the online avy courses that SW posted along with going to vail ski patrols avy awareness courses.

Also, if you get a chance, there is some great terrain dropping outthe back of blue sky, go down to red cliff and have a beer then take the mangos van or get a ride home, or to vail....


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Don't forget, season before last two very experienced Loveland patrollers were caught in an avy on the other side of I-70 in Dry Gulch. One died and I'm pretty sure the other had to have a leg amputated. Experienced people fuck up too, even in areas they know well. Hell, maybe even more so in familiar areas. It's easy to get lulled into a sense of safety in terrain you've ridden lots of times before.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

lol. Couple people died in a car accident yesterday. They had been driving for 35 years.... kid died riding his bike the other day too. Had been riding for 10 years.....


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## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

Argo said:


> lol. Couple people died in a car accident yesterday. They had been driving for 35 years.... kid died riding his bike the other day too. Had been riding for 10 years.....


Experience and group size can lead to complacency. Its s difficult thing to learn and when you do is usually after the whit has hit the fan. There's s valuable lesson to be learned from what recently occurred at Stevens pass


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Yes experienced people fuck up. I am just as capable as the next guy. Ski patrol is kind of dubious when saying you are going with experts. These guys spend a ton of time on skis at the area. They also do a great job. Wild snow assessment is not their thing though. Not a knock, it is just what they do. 

Regardless, I know I'd like to have the tools to know if what I was getting into is a smart choice or not. Hence the reason I am recommending the level I. It honestly sounds like it is time for your son to take that next step. This is a life long thing he is getting into. At some point people are going to start looking at him to help make decisions. 

My opinion of Vail is that as a resort it kind of sucks. The backcountry access from the resort is some of the best in the lower 48. Being some of the best means that it will have it's dangers.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

linvillegorge said:


> Don't forget, season before last two very experienced Loveland patrollers were caught in an avy on the other side of I-70 in Dry Gulch. One died and I'm pretty sure the other had to have a leg amputated. Experienced people fuck up too, even in areas they know well. Hell, maybe even more so in familiar areas. It's easy to get lulled into a sense of safety in terrain you've ridden lots of times before.


This one scares me. As much as I ride Bert and there are definitely favorite tours that I do over and over again. You just can't get complacent. The 90's gave everyone a huge reminder of that last season, ripping wall to wall. Something I have not seen happen at the pass before. Grant it I haven't been riding there that long, but after 13 years, you would think I would have seen it before.

I also believe that this complacency is what caused so many horrible accidents late last season. There seems to be some disbelief that stuff like that is happening when is normally the time that the snow pack is very stable. I know I had my close call during the 10-11 season, doing the same thing. I swore I would never let myself ignore clues like that again. Trying to stick to that one.


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## Blake1979 (Aug 18, 2013)

Wow! some serious ego stroking in here. You guys sound like tele skiers....

OP....in Minesota, you really don't have to worry about shovel, probe and beacon. I don't think theres ever been an avalanche there ever. Your biggest concern is trespassing on private property that border the ski area.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

guess one ought to wear a black bear costume when going bc in da sota


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

If there is ever a time to do FOBP type of classes in eagle/summit, this is it. People tha didn't care before are hyper aware. Even partner with vail for it. A lot of people lost friends this past winter due to back country dangers. I'll be first in line with my son, right now we plan on doing silvertons class. 




killclimbz said:


> I missed that post.
> 
> Loveland Pass is a real problem. Then of course we have the worst snow sports avalanche accident in the state, and maybe the worst ever on it. Didn't help that it was experienced backcountry travelers either.
> 
> ...


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

Blake1979 said:


> Wow! some serious ego stroking in here. You guys sound like tele skiers....
> 
> OP....in Minesota, you really don't have to worry about shovel, probe and beacon. I don't think theres ever been an avalanche there ever. Your biggest concern is trespassing on private property that border the ski area.


Let me guess you're just the best rider on the mountain and no avalanche will ever get you? EVER. 

I grew up on a resort with 750 vertical in NY, guess what? They had an avalanche about 6 years ago that did enough damage it pushed one of the slopeside houses off the foundation.


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## Blake1979 (Aug 18, 2013)

Cool story bro! I`ve read your bullshit on this site. Youre a legend in your own mind who`s done and seen everything and been everywhere. Now go on one of your childish name calling rants if that's what you need to feel like a big man and impress your little followers. I couldn't care less what a nutjob with anger issues thinks.

Minnesota, where the guy, is at is not New York. New York has mountains steep enough to slide though its really rare due to how thick the trees are on those mountains. Vertical feet has nothing to do with it, its the slope angle and terrain that's key to whether one can be triggered. There`s simply nothing steep enough without dense trees in Minnesota or Michigan to ever slide.


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## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

Blake1979 said:


> Cool story bro! I`ve read your bullshit on this site. Youre a legend in your own mind who`s done and seen everything and been everywhere. Now go on one of your childish name calling rants if that's what you need to feel like a big man and impress your little followers. I couldn't care less what a nutjob with anger issues thinks.
> 
> Minnesota, where the guy, is at is not New York. New York has mountains steep enough to slide though its really rare due to how thick the trees are on those mountains. Vertical feet has nothing to do with it, its the slope angle and terrain that's key to whether one can be triggered. There`s simply nothing steep enough without dense trees in Minnesota or Michigan to ever slide.


And yet ski patrol still bombs out there, guess it must be because they like to see/hear things go boom :dizzy:


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

bseracka said:


> And yet ski patrol still bombs out there, guess it must be because they like to see/hear things go boom :dizzy:



That's because these guys are way brighter and better than any ski patrol could be. :bowdown:


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

Blake1979 said:


> Cool story bro! I`ve read your bullshit on this site. Youre a legend in your own mind who`s done and seen everything and been everywhere. Now go on one of your childish name calling rants if that's what you need to feel like a big man and impress your little followers. I couldn't care less what a nutjob with anger issues thinks.
> 
> Minnesota, where the guy, is at is not New York. New York has mountains steep enough to slide though its really rare due to how thick the trees are on those mountains. Vertical feet has nothing to do with it, its the slope angle and terrain that's key to whether one can be triggered. There`s simply nothing steep enough without dense trees in Minnesota or Michigan to ever slide.


Right, and because he LIVES in Minnesota, he couldn't POSSIBLY ride anywhere else, therefore there is no chance of danger. 
Additionally, with this being an international forum, occasionally people can learn things or find new things that interest them.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

Blake1979 said:


> Cool story bro! I`ve read your bullshit on this site. Youre a legend in your own mind who`s done and seen everything and been everywhere. Now go on one of your childish name calling rants if that's what you need to feel like a big man and impress your little followers. I couldn't care less what a nutjob with anger issues thinks.
> 
> Minnesota, where the guy, is at is not New York. New York has mountains steep enough to slide though its really rare due to how thick the trees are on those mountains. Vertical feet has nothing to do with it, its the slope angle and terrain that's key to whether one can be triggered. There`s simply nothing steep enough without dense trees in Minnesota or Michigan to ever slide.


Aww how cute you're offended.

And tree wells and other obstacles don't exist? Good job captain oblivious!


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## readimag (Aug 10, 2011)

Don’t worry I will save the day with under butt!


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## Blake1979 (Aug 18, 2013)

bseracka said:


> And yet ski patrol still bombs out there, guess it must be because they like to see/hear things go boom :dizzy:



Hmmmm. I would be interested in seeing proof of this. Been in Minnesota and Wisconsin all my life and I've never heard of any ski area here bombing for avalanche control.


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## Blake1979 (Aug 18, 2013)

BurtonAvenger said:


> Aww how cute you're offended.
> 
> And tree wells and other obstacles don't exist? Good job captain oblivious!


How predictable....Now wait, here it comes.....you're going to tell everyone again how many days you ride. 

Tree wells and "other obstacles" aren't avalanches. I never said there weren't risks and yes, ride with a partner but you don't have to have avalanche training and avalanche gear to ski in the back country here.


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## Blake1979 (Aug 18, 2013)

The Deacon said:


> Right, and because he LIVES in Minnesota, he couldn't POSSIBLY ride anywhere else, therefore there is no chance of danger.
> Additionally, with this being an international forum, occasionally people can learn things or find new things that interest them.


Oh no Deacon, I agree if he goes out west get trained and get gear. But it sounded to me like he was talking about ducking ropes here locally. We ride behind snow machines all over the UP and there is no reason to have a beacon nor need of training.


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## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

Blake1979 said:


> Oh no Deacon, I agree if he goes out west get trained and get gear. But it sounded to me like he was talking about ducking ropes here locally. We ride behind snow machines all over the UP and there is no reason to have a beacon nor need of training.


You're forgetting that natural snow does occur even where they use snow machines. Natural snow on top of a man made ice block is a great recipe for a slide due to lack of adhesion.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

Blake1979 said:


> How predictable....Now wait, here it comes.....you're going to tell everyone again how many days you ride.
> 
> Tree wells and "other obstacles" aren't avalanches. I never said there weren't risks and yes, ride with a partner but you don't have to have avalanche training and avalanche gear to ski in the back country here.


No reason to talk about days here. This is basic logic something your midwest lame ass doesn't possess.


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

BurtonAvenger said:


> No reason to talk about days here. This is basic logic something your midwest lame ass doesn't possess.


Hey that's racist! There's cool people in the Midwest! Except the UP. THEY'RE weird. 
:laugh::laugh:


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## Blake1979 (Aug 18, 2013)

More insults, how typical and entirely predictable. Can't have a disagreement without acting like a 2 year old can you?

My logic is intact I assure you. We simply do not have avalanches here in Minnesota, Wisconsin and Michigan; simply doesn't happen. Is it possible given just the right combination of weather and an open slope above 30 degrees if you can find one? Sure, but then so is a meteor impact. Doesn't mean a normal person is going to plan for it. We also do not get tree wells up here that anyone needs to worry about. We don't have the right trees for them, we don't get the snow depth and we have get too much wind for them to form.


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## Blake1979 (Aug 18, 2013)

Deacon... Yooppers may be weird and they are, but they're good people.


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## Blake1979 (Aug 18, 2013)

bseracka said:


> You're forgetting that natural snow does occur even where they use snow machines. Natural snow on top of a man made ice block is a great recipe for a slide due to lack of adhesion.


I appreciate your thoughts here and I'm not forgetting that. I have the level 2 AST. Took it before heli skiing in Utah so I do appreciate your caution. It's just not warranted here in the upper Midwest. Been skiing and recently riding here for 20 years and I have never seen nor heard of an avalanche. Sure, some minor sloughs happen when fresh snow falls on an icy groomer like you mentioned but we just don't have the slope angle for it to travel nor do we get propagation or slabs.

I'm totally in agreement with you when it comes to skiing and riding in avalanche terrain and I carry and practice with the gear when I go out west.


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

Blake1979 said:


> My logic is intact I assure you. We simply do not have avalanches here in Minnesota, Wisconsin and Michigan; simply doesn't happen. Is it possible given just the right combination of weather and an open slope above 30 degrees if you can find one? Sure, but then so is a meteor impact. Doesn't mean a normal person is going to plan for it. We also do not get tree wells up here that anyone needs to worry about. We don't have the right trees for them, we don't get the snow depth and we have get too much wind for them to form.


who the fuck are you to inject logic into a perfectly good semantic argument??? :blink:


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## Ridethesnow80 (Nov 10, 2011)

I now do not regret starting this thread.. Great insight from alot of you. All I know is no matter where your ridding in the world, respect where your ridding (back country or resorts) get the proper training to better you self and gain the knowledge that could one day save your life or someone you know...


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