# Regular Camber vs. Rocker/Banana



## wo0ter (Oct 21, 2009)

Does Rocker really feel THAT different from regular camber boards? What are the main disadvantages to owning a rocker/banana? I keep hearing good things about rocker but not many bad things. In what situations does rocker perform the best? What about the worst?

I'm trying to decide which board to buy, but I have no idea what rocker feels like. I don't think Gnu or Lib Tech are doing any demos around here (NJ) either


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## Guest (Dec 25, 2009)

Yes rocker feels different than camber, especially if its rocker that is raised in between the feet as opposed to outside the feet. Disadvantages - generally unstable, especially at high speed, less edge hold through turns. Advantages - absolutely awesome float in powder, easy to press/butter. Best situation - powder. Worst situation - high speed carving. In the end its all preference. Some people swear by rocker, others (like me) stick to regular camber for stability. I always recommend trying a rocker board before buying one. Even if lib/gnu aren't doing any demos there may be other companies that are. Or if not, maybe a friend has a rocker board.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

wo0ter said:


> Does Rocker really feel THAT different from regular camber boards? What are the main disadvantages to owning a rocker/banana? I keep hearing good things about rocker but not many bad things. In what situations does rocker perform the best? What about the worst?
> 
> I'm trying to decide which board to buy, but I have no idea what rocker feels like. I don't think Gnu or Lib Tech are doing any demos around here (NJ) either


Hey WoOter,

Rocker is an overused term that inaccurately groups about twenty different variations on Reverse Camber designs. One common element to all of the "Rocker" boards is that by design, the tip and tail, when the board is flat weighted, are not in firm contact with the snow. Some current designs are using additional cambered sections, etc, to re-achieve weighted wide point contact, but these are straying from "true" Rockered designs.

Of the rocker designs there are designs that are made for pow only, others that are park only and still others that are taking a stab at all mountain. 

Sorry to be give a non-answer, but there is truly no way to answer your question as asked. You will need to dive in deeper, define the type of riding that you do, What type of terrain you ride, your ability level, your weight and foot size, and start looking at specific models and sizes. Only then can you really get sound advice about the pros and cons of a design.


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## Phenix_Rider (Dec 24, 2008)

Well, as far as I know there are only about three variations on rocker: original/simple reverse camber, v-rocker which is basically a stepped reverse camber, and then rocker/camber which uses standard camber and reverse in combination.


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## MunkySpunk (Jan 7, 2009)

R.C. kicks *royal fucking ass*. It's most agile board I've ever been on. Still stable at speed.


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## wo0ter (Oct 21, 2009)

Thanks for your responses, Wiredsport and snowboarding101.

I'm borderline beginner-intermediate. On my most recent day out on the snow, I was able to transition heelside-toeside without much problems on green runs, except on the icy patches. I saw this as a huge improvement, since the time I went before that, I could barely transition without getting nervous.

For now, I'm probably just going to be carving down green runs and I'll move on to blue when I'm more comfortable with the speed. Eventually I'd like to try out some park stuff (maybe boxes, rails, small jumps), but I think it will be a little while until I have enough confidence for that.

I'm currently riding a used Rossignol 145, regular camber. I'm 5'3", 120lbs, size 7.5 (women's) boots. I live in NJ so most likely I'll be riding a lot of groomed trails with lots of icy patches.

I've mainly been looking at the Gnu B-Nice BTX: B-Nice Series » GNU Snowboards
It's a "banana" board though, and I'm not sure if that's really for me

Other ones I've considered are the Never Summer Lotus and Infinity:
{ Lotus } Never Summer Boards
{ Infinity-R } Never Summer Boards
Both of these board have "Rocker & Camber" and I'm curious about how that rides, but also don't know if that's for me

The problem is that the only board that I'm attracted to are so-called "rocker" or "banana." I haven't seen any 2010 girl boards with regular camber that have caught my eye

Anyway, I appreciate any insights you have. Thanks!


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## arsenic0 (Nov 11, 2008)

As wired said, you cant just flat out say Rocker is bad at high speed carving. I can only assume when you say that you are using a Lib Tech Banana as the board your talking about...which is true in that case because its a soft ass board meant for park riding.

There are plenty of stiff Rocker and Reverse Camber boards which will kill it at speed carving and pow but suck at park, as with any board.


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## Guest (Dec 26, 2009)

Phenix_Rider said:


> Well, as far as I know there are only about three variations on rocker: original/simple reverse camber, v-rocker which is basically a stepped reverse camber, and then rocker/camber which uses standard camber and reverse in combination.


No. There is R.C. (Never Summer, or Libs C2), Burton S-rocker, rocker between the feet, flat between the feet and raised tips, camber between the feet and raised tips, and I think theres a few more.



wo0ter said:


> Thanks for your responses, Wiredsport and snowboarding101.
> 
> I'm borderline beginner-intermediate. On my most recent day out on the snow, I was able to transition heelside-toeside without much problems on green runs, except on the icy patches. I saw this as a huge improvement, since the time I went before that, I could barely transition without getting nervous.
> 
> ...


I'd recommend either of the Never Summers before any gnu. They will both do great, and the rocker camber is 10 times better than just rocker in my opinion.


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## mike v (Jan 9, 2009)

I tried out my new GNU BTX Street Series this past weekend at Titus Mt in NY and it handled well carving. This is more for wooter because the magna-traction totally made it earier to stabilize on the groomed icy trails.


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## surfstar (Mar 6, 2009)

Some good camber/rocker reading:

The Angry Snowboarder Blog Archive Camber Theories Explained

The Angry Snowboarder Blog Archive Camber Theories In Use


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## Toecutter (Oct 11, 2009)

Never Summer with rocker/camber is the greatest invention EVER! I don't know how it does it, but it lets me go faster with more control than I thought possible. It's also saved my ass more than once when I swear I should've wrecked hard but somehow ended up back in control wondering, "WTF just happened??? Why am I still upright???"


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## wo0ter (Oct 21, 2009)

surfstar said:


> Some good camber/rocker reading:
> 
> The Angry Snowboarder Blog Archive Camber Theories Explained
> 
> The Angry Snowboarder Blog Archive Camber Theories In Use


Thanks so much for these links! They were really good reads. Now I'm leaning more to Never Summer instead of Gnu


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

> I live in NJ so most likely I'll be riding a lot of groomed trails with lots of icy patches.


Hey WoOter,

OK, that is good info. All true reverse camber boards lose some effective edge and running surface. This is what gives the board its super loose feel, but it also works against you on hardpack/ice. There is no give without take. The first gen rocker boards (banana style) were horrible on hardpack/ice. The concept had a lot of merit for other snow conditions, though, and additional design elemnts were introduced to help these boards hold better in tough conditions (magnatraction, etc). As you will read here, there is a LOT of disagreement about how well the extra elements perform, and the pros/cons of some of the added quirks that they have.

Knowing that you are an Ice Coast rider that is still relatively new, I would highly suggest a traditional camber board. Remember that even the sponsored pros who are paid to ride rocker are pulling out their cambered sticks on icy days. Their are tons of great cambered options available in your size range. 

Now if you want to have a second board for good snow days & park or an awesome Pow board then a second "rockered" board may be in order.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

Wiredsport said:


> Remember that even the sponsored pros who are paid to ride rocker are pulling out their cambered sticks on icy days.


Got proof of that cause I'm pretty sure at Dew Tour everyone was rocking Reverse and it was sheet ice here in Breck.

Regardless if it's reverse or not for where you're riding you want something that has extra edge grip whether it's Vario, Mag, Smokin traction, equilizer, whatever the hell arbor calls theirs, pomona, anything that creates extra contact points with the snow is what's going to grip.


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## bryantp (Dec 1, 2008)

*Ice riding*

If you ride ice, you need magnetraction or one of its competitors. I bought a used Travis Rice Lib Tech a few years ago just to try magnetraction as I was very cynical...it works. 

In non-ice conditions, you can argue all day. I recommend 2 boards minimum if you're riding a lot. If not and you're on the East Coast, go Lib Tech. BTW, one of my other boards is a NS Summit that I love...but not on ice.

I'm hesitant to recommend radical camber changes to someone new. Why not buy something on eBay and try it for a season? Cheaper to buy 2 or 3 used boards than one good one.


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## Critical_gp (Jan 3, 2008)

Do you honestly feel the difference with Magne Traction? The reason I'm asking is because I heard so many good things about it that I bought GNU CHB and I was very disappointed... and i mean it. I was catching edges left and right. The board was bouncy/the ride wasnt very smooth and would chatter at high speed turns (this is where Magne traction should have kicked in)....board was sold!

Currently riding a Custom X and I gotta say, its amazing compared to the CHB... 

Based on my experience I would look at Burton Feelgood. My sister loves it and swears by it...



mike v said:


> I tried out my new GNU BTX Street Series this past weekend at Titus Mt in NY and it handled well carving. This is more for wooter because the magna-traction totally made it earier to stabilize on the groomed icy trails.


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## bryantp (Dec 1, 2008)

I do and I didn't expect to. I like it so much that I'm not sure I'll buy another board without it. I think Jeremy Jones' new brand will have it...under a different name. He's big on it too although none of the Mervin guys signed him. 

I'm not sure what caused the chatter. I ride Flow NT FRX and ATX and have no chatter...don't know if that's a factor or not. 

A few years ago, I rode Vail for the first time. One of their volunteers offered me a tour. It was an icy day and when we got to Riva Ridge and the upcoming Tourist Trap, she said lots of snowboarders couldn't handle it at high speed (she was a skiier). Long story short...I waited for her at the bottom. Been a Magne-pimp ever since.

I like it in powder too. You can traverse higher and pick lines better. I'm not always a fan of the boards it comes on...that may be your problem. Still, the tech is sweeet. For someone who rides a lot in the ice, it would be indespensible. I should, in all honesty, confess to never riding the park. I'm only talking about the piste and the off-piste...I live for the trees.


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## Critical_gp (Jan 3, 2008)

this is how I'm. I like slopes and natural jumps but park so much. My board might have been a little too soft for me, but my cuz has the same board and he complains about the same thing...his board is 159 vs my 156 and wer both 180lb...
I have no chatter whatsoever with the Custom X, but its a much stiffer board...and it feels so light, I can ride for hours non-stop....

Been looking at the Skate Banana but the CX is staying for sure...


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## banana420 (Dec 7, 2009)

Well i have a gnu carbon high beam with banana and magnetraction. Personally ive never riden a rocker without magnetraction but i dont think it would work very well in ice. Its very stable at high speeds and but still soft enough to ride in the park. Honestly it really depends on the board all rocker boards will ride different


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## ATOTony76 (May 26, 2009)

Critical_gp said:


> Do you honestly feel the difference with Magne Traction? The reason I'm asking is because I heard so many good things about it that I bought GNU CHB and I was very disappointed... and i mean it. I was catching edges left and right. The board was bouncy/the ride wasnt very smooth and would chatter at high speed turns (this is where Magne traction should have kicked in)....board was sold!
> 
> Currently riding a Custom X and I gotta say, its amazing compared to the CHB...
> 
> Based on my experience I would look at Burton Feelgood. My sister loves it and swears by it...


The Magne Traction makes a huge difference on Bananas, and most of the other gnu/libtech boards. With these rocker boards tho, if you get really flexy ones like the banana, they will def chatter at high speeds and are super bouncy, but that is what makes these boards so much fun! You just have to adjust the it.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

There's 2 variations of magnetraction. Mervins which is a more elongated duller serration and Smokins which is more S shaped. Smokins grips better hands down people can argue with me all they want about it I don't give a fuck. I owned a first generation Dark Series with mag hated it, the tail would buckle and kick out, had the same issue with theres ever since. Smokin came out with there's damn if I didn't ever have a problem with that. 

If you go reverse you need something that has just a little bump in the edge underfoot that'll give you the control you need due to the fact you steer more underfoot.


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## bryantp (Dec 1, 2008)

Mine works. Ridden it for 3 years in Japan and Colorado. Never used the Dark Series. Perhaps the board affects the performance as well as the Magnetraction or, forbid this, each rider has their own preferences ;-)


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