# Powder board recommandation



## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

Have you had a look at the Amplid Surfari?

Great board, haven't had the chance to ride it in deep pow but have no doubt it ticks most of what you've asked. 

The antiphase should help with tracked out pow and reduces any chatter coming through and holds an edge.no problems.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

It looks like a great board but probably won’t work: 

- tail width is not enough for size 12 boots. The 161 which is their biggest size (and likely too big for me) has the same tail width of my Taka, which gives me drag when laying it. the shorter size is even worst
Also it costs an arm and not widely available in the US but that’s secondary.

Interestingly, it looks a lot like some of the boards I listed (particularly the excavator which is wider though).


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## The_Stigs (Jan 3, 2012)

wolf33d said:


> Advanced rider 6’5” 175lbs 12 boots based in Salt Lake City.
> Looking for a bord that best suits the following:
> 
> 
> ...


My immediate thought was the Salomon x Asmo HPS 157 (now the Salomon Wolle Nyvelt, I think), which probably isn't too far off of the Taka. I was riding mine at 215ish and it has a massive WW with a good bit of setback. It has amazing float and is fun to carve with on groomers. I'm not sure on the tracked conditions. I know a few who swear it's one of the best boards they've been on, but I ended up getting off of mine after a couple of runs because of how much it bucked me. BUT, that's in the heavy, wet conditions at The Summit at Snoqualmie. I can easily see how if it was riding the dry, soft powder it would be incredible. Avran's review from Colorado said he had no problem with tracked out crud. The Good Ride said they wouldn't ride it in tight bumps, but I had no trouble navigating moguls. I had one day in more dry powder and it was so much fun, but that was untouched stuff that was a bit drier. I ended up trading it away.

For now, the board I ride in those tracked conditions is the Amplid Surfari 161. It's unsinkable in deep powder and incredibly stable. It's fine on a carve, but not incredible. I haven't had it in tight trees but I wouldn't mind taking it in. 

Wish I could comment on the Dart. I know a few who swear by it and would ride it in all of the conditions you're looking for.


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

Have a look at the Niche Pyre 155.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

The_Stigs said:


> My immediate thought was the Salomon x Asmo HPS 157 (now the Salomon Wolle Nyvelt, I think), which probably isn't too far off of the Taka. I was riding mine at 215ish and it has a massive WW with a good bit of setback. It has amazing float and is fun to carve with on groomers. I'm not sure on the tracked conditions. I know a few who swear it's one of the best boards they've been on, but I ended up getting off of mine after a couple of runs because of how much it bucked me. BUT, that's in the heavy, wet conditions at The Summit at Snoqualmie. I can easily see how if it was riding the dry, soft powder it would be incredible. Avran's review from Colorado said he had no problem with tracked out crud. The Good Ride said they wouldn't ride it in tight bumps, but I had no trouble navigating moguls. I had one day in more dry powder and it was so much fun, but that was untouched stuff that was a bit drier. I ended up trading it away.
> 
> For now, the board I ride in those tracked conditions is the Amplid Surfari 161. It's unsinkable in deep powder and incredibly stable. It's fine on a carve, but not incredible. I haven't had it in tight trees but I wouldn't mind taking it in.
> 
> Wish I could comment on the Dart. I know a few who swear by it and would ride it in all of the conditions you're looking for.


Interesting, what’s your weight size and boot size? I thought about that one because at first it looks like the Taka but stiffer, but ruled it out because of how mega massive it is. I mean 20mm more width in both the nose and tail compared to my Taka looks like it will be a chore especially in trees, which thegoodride review seemed to confirm. 
I would love to try it but I am reluctant to buy it as I could bet it’s gonna be too wide to be fun and agile.


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## The_Stigs (Jan 3, 2012)

210 - 215 lbs
10.5 boot

I had no issues with feeling like it was slow edge to edge. 
They can be found used around 300-350 if you want to try one and sell it if you don't like it.

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

What about the Telos Backslash


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

wolf33d said:


> Can handle deep powder with EASE (ride Utah all season, occasional trip to Japan). Some serious float needed.
> 
> Handles tracked powder really well (let’s face it, after 2 hours the entire resort is tracked).
> Nimble enough to not be a chore in trees.
> ...


Not sure about the Utha part as I've never ridden there and thus don't know the terrain/type of snow, but all the other requirements of your list would be matched by Nidecker Mellow.

It's the board I got for hubby when he wanted something more nimble after riding a Jones Carbon Flagship for years in all conditions/trips. I don't remember him using the Jones even once last season... It's two years since, but lots of forum veterans gave their recommendations then who may not be active right now. You may find some ideas in that thread, too: Quiver pow board for aggressive rider


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## MountainMystic (Apr 24, 2019)

@wolf33d

K2 Excavator 158
Telos Backslash 153 (<-- Check with Telos though)
K2 Simple pleasures 156


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

neni said:


> Not sure about the Utha part as I've never ridden there and thus don't know the terrain/type of snow, but all the other requirements of your list would be matched by Nidecker Mellow.
> 
> It's the board I got for hubby when he wanted something more nimble after riding a Jones Carbon Flagship for years in all conditions/trips. I don't remember him using the Jones even once last season...


That's a fun looking board that Nidecker Mellow, damn you @neni


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

That Nidecker Mellow looks nice and like an Amplid...but Amplid is the BOMB.


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## The_Stigs (Jan 3, 2012)

I have nearly pulled the trigger on a Mellow SO many times. Nearly bought one from a local last week that I got a pair of bindings from. He was more into party boards, but said the Mellow was a great all arounder.

@neni How is it with deep powder? 

Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

[


The_Stigs said:


> I have nearly pulled the trigger on a Mellow SO many times. Nearly bought one from a local last week that I got a pair of bindings from. He was more into party boards, but said the Mellow was a great all arounder.
> 
> @neni How is it with deep powder?
> 
> Sent from my GM1915 using Tapatalk


Define "deep" 

We had some days with knee to thigh deep snow, enough to have upper mountain closed due to avy danger, so only runs below treeline were open. The 160 Mellow surely floats the old man better than the 164 Flgship. And I never heard him complaining. He really liked it's nimblemess in trees, but also took it to the climbs for steep chute riding.


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## toaster (Jun 12, 2021)

wolf33d said:


> Also it costs an arm and not widely available in the US but that’s secondary.


Amplid boards are available for special order, with no additional duty charged, from the Splitboard Shop.









New Splitboards | The Splitboard Shop | United States


New and used splitboards, splitboard bindings, backcountry gear, custom splitboard assembly, and splitboard wax.




www.thesplitboardshop.com


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

Don’t think you can leave the Yes Optimistic/Y out on this one. The Moon Buggy from Burton wasn’t bad. It has float and can be carved and it’s wide but agile, and that’s with size 9,5. Bit weak nose, but that’s fine for carving. Maybe it’s too long? Gentemstick has some nice wide ones, but probably too expensive then. Moss Fluffy or U4 half could work, same price issue though. The Furberg boards are pretty nimble, and the biggest size could work, but they need soft snow, or at least they did until next seasons (and I’m not sure if it’s just one model or all), and not everyone can carve them anyways. If you can deal with the sidecut, you will lay some deep carves. They are boards where you want a loaded backfoot for carving at least. New Stranda Shorty 164 wide is pretty spot on.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

Thanks all for some great recommendations that I am currently researching.
However did anyone tried/compare some of the boards I listed? Would love to see a report from someone who tried the orca, stalefish and dancehaul for example.


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

wolf33d said:


> Thanks all for some great recommendations that I am currently researching.
> However did anyone tried/compare some of the boards I listed? Would love to see a report from someone who tried the orca, stalefish and dancehaul for example.


Those and the excavator are pretty much the same board. Pick the graphics or image you like best.


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

wolf33d said:


> Thanks all for some great recommendations that I am currently researching.
> However did anyone tried/compare some of the boards I listed? Would love to see a report from someone who tried the orca, stalefish and dancehaul for example.


From the boards listed here I’ve owned the XV and the Optimistic. My friends who are also gear whores own the Dart, the Surfari, the Simple Pleasures, the new Flagship, the Dancehaul, the Pyre and the Orca and I had a chance to ride them more or less extensively as well so I can help with comparing these.

Since you want something that carves well on piste you can already drop the idea of the CRC Orca.
If you want a Lib, I’d look at the Gremlin (I’ve not ridden that one but it looks like a cambered Orca). @snow & pow adventures can help extensively with the Orca vs Dart, he does a lot of freeriding like that.

For the Dancehaul’s feedback @Phedder nailed it imo with the review in the board review section on this forum and @drblast can help you with the Stale Fish.


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

The Stalefish is the best board I've ridden for having fun in deep powder but not having to put it away when things get tracked out. It depends what you mean by "charging" but mine handles my typical high speeds (45-50mph) just fine. I love carving on it. 6'3", 200lbs on a 157.

I'd also consider the Yes Optimistic if you want something extra beefy. Optimistic is a stiff, hard charging board and rails turns, also really good in powder. Due to the stiffness it's less fun than the Stalefish on tracked out groomers and if you do freestyle things, but if you want a powder board that's also a hard-charging freeride board look no further.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

At this point I might buy a Stalefish, Excavator, Dancehaul and Orca, try them and sell 3. What I am happy about is that reports from above seem to confirm I found the right category of board. Now to choose the best one for my taste is the hard part and pretty much impossible without trying. 
The Yes Hybrid seems a copy and paste of my board (the Taka) very similar specs and flex and thegoodride ratings are pretty much the same for both in every category. At the end of the day it’s the one I like the least in design so with that many options on the table it’s out, but I am sure it’s a great board.


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

wolf33d said:


> Thanks all for some great recommendations that I am currently researching.
> However did anyone tried/compare some of the boards I listed? Would love to see a report from someone who tried the orca, stalefish and dancehaul for example.


Angry dropped the Dancehaul review this morning, link below


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

He doesn’t even mention the word powder once, instead talking about how it’s jibbing superbly well  
Like I feared this one sounds too centered/freestyle for me.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

drblast said:


> The Stalefish is the best board I've ridden for having fun in deep powder but not having to put it away when things get tracked out. It depends what you mean by "charging" but mine handles my typical high speeds (45-50mph) just fine. I love carving on it. 6'3", 200lbs on a 157.
> 
> I'd also consider the Yes Optimistic if you want something extra beefy. Optimistic is a stiff, hard charging board and rails turns, also really good in powder. Due to the stiffness it's less fun than the Stalefish on tracked out groomers and if you do freestyle things, but if you want a powder board that's also a hard-charging freeride board look no further.


Would you mind measuring the tip width and tail width on the 157? It’s the only snowboard I know off that I couldn’t find that info anywhere.


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## powderjunkie (Jun 30, 2015)

I absolutely adore my Orca. Deep powder, trees, chutes, chasing powder pockets over groomers, dropping an occasional cliff. It's a great board. That side cut is so tight man... sometimes I shake my head at how hard i can charge through the trees. It's downright blistering fast edge to edge. I don't ever take it out on a groomer day and I never take it out with less than 6 inches of fresh so I cannot speak as to how good it is once everything is tracked out. Also I have one of the original models so I believe it is a bit softer than the newer models.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

powderjunkie said:


> I absolutely adore my Orca. Deep powder, trees, chutes, chasing powder pockets over groomers, dropping an occasional cliff. It's a great board. That side cut is so tight man... sometimes I shake my head at how hard i can charge through the trees. It's downright blistering fast edge to edge. I don't ever take it out on a groomer day and I never take it out with less than 6 inches of fresh so I cannot speak as to how good it is once everything is tracked out. Also I have one of the original models so I believe it is a bit softer than the newer models.


what’s your body specs and size of orca? 
how can you not know how it does in tracked out powder? Where do you live lol? Here on a deep powder day everything is tracked out everywhere even in the slack country after a few hours. So even if I were to take a board only on deep powder days, I would immediately experience tracked snow after 2 hours..


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## powderjunkie (Jun 30, 2015)

wolf33d said:


> what’s your body specs and size of orca?
> how can you not know how it does in tracked out powder? Where do you live lol? Here on a deep powder day everything is tracked out everywhere even in the slack country after a few hours. So even if I were to take a board only on deep powder days, I would immediately experience tracked snow after 2 hours..


I'm 6 2. Weight about 230 with gear. Ride a 159 Orca. If I told you where I lived I'd have to kill you. Those who know don't tell....

I guess I should say I ride it once it gets tracked out but I'm usually leaving right about that time. Powder sticks around here till 2 or 3PM. By that point I'm so tired anyway I'm heading out. So is it good in tracked out snow? Depends. If you're taking groomers to chase the few bits of remaining freshies it's solid. Its good in tracked out trees due to that sidecut and magnetraction. Now,, would I ride it down a steep chute that was tracked out? Fuck no. That wouldn't even be fun. Would I ride it down super steep terrain that had been tracked out? Fuck no. It's too soft for anything super gnarly and tracked out. But that's why you take a quiver to the resort in your case right? I do believe that Lib Tech did stiffen it up though with their HP construction in the newer models. So keep that in mind too.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

powderjunkie said:


> I'm 6 2. Weight about 230 with gear. Ride a 159 Orca. If I told you where I lived I'd have to kill you. Those who know don't tell....
> 
> I guess I should say I ride it once it gets tracked out but I'm usually leaving right about that time. Powder sticks around here till 2 or 3PM. By that point I'm so tired anyway I'm heading out. So is it good in tracked out snow? Depends. If you're taking groomers to chase the few bits of remaining freshies it's solid. Its good in tracked out trees due to that sidecut and magnetraction. Now,, would I ride it down a steep chute that was tracked out? Fuck no. That wouldn't even be fun. Would I ride it down super steep terrain that had been tracked out? Fuck no. It's too soft for anything super gnarly and tracked out. But that's why you take a quiver to the resort in your case right? I do believe that Lib Tech did stiffen it up though with their HP construction in the newer models. So keep that in mind too.


let me guess: idaho. Good to know you never experience tracked snow I’ll move in a heartbeat. Haha. 
thanks for the write up, and yeah they have stiffen up the Orca.

the quiver I tried and I don’t mind owning 10 boards if I need too but it just doesn’t work for me. I don’t do park and I mostly go ride on a powder day but after a few hours when it’s tracked out I’ll hike a bit side country, maybe do a steep chute, then after the chute comes mellow trees. Then I’ll do 2 runs in tracked snow then 2 on piste the leave.

I can’t change board in between each run and in the middle of the run. How are people doing ? Riding the steep chute and then they arrive at the car to change board ? What about the trees and mellow terrain between the chute and the cars?
I mean the mountain is big with many faces, I don’t see how a quiver can work, but it doesn’t for me. I need something that work well on powder days anywhere on the mountain (powder, mellow, steeps, trees, tracked powder, and a little carve here and there on piste at the end of the day).
I just go for any terrain that has powder left and when it’s tracked out everywhere I do piste and leave and can only use one board for all of that unless someone tells me how to pack 3 boards inside a backpack.


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## campbellt3 (Feb 25, 2016)

I have not tried any of the boards you are interested in, but I have a 156 Simple Pleasures that does everything you are looking for. Good luck.


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

Nose = 321mm









Tail = 300mm

That's a 157 Stalefish. Width at inserts is approx 280mm nose and 275mm tail at the center insert.


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

wolf33d said:


> At this point I might buy a Stalefish, Excavator, Dancehaul and Orca, try them and sell 3.


Please do and post the comparative reviews!


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

wolf33d said:


> I need something that work well on powder days anywhere on the mountain (powder, mellow, steeps, trees, tracked powder, and a little carve here and there on piste at the end of the day).
> I just go for any terrain that has powder left and when it’s tracked out everywhere I do piste and leave and can only use one board for all of that unless someone tells me how to pack 3 boards inside a backpack.


That's pretty much how we ride. A (one) board needs to handle all conditions the day throws at us. This may start with a handfull early lift rides doing untouched deep runs in high alpin, then move below treeline and do all the untracked "secret" lines in trees, then move on to bootpack some high alpine steep stuff, then do a handfull groomer carving runs to finish those legs. Or in spring, the other way around: start with carving the perfect corduroy groomer, and then bootpack for corn runs in the chutes. For the first situation (deep winter, deep days), hubby takes the Mellow. For the later situation however, he prefers the Flagship, as in firmer snow, he prefers the stiffness of Flag over Mellow. Thus: quiver=yes, but no changing throughout the day; just different boards for different parts of winter.


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## snow & pow adventures (Oct 28, 2020)

I rode Orca and Dart, Orca is an all-rounder in powder. Very nimble, great in trees, awesome in very deep powder. But I had more fun and more surfy feel on Dart, and in deep powder making turns on Dart felt just better. Orca is just a safe bet in powder. You can't be disappointed.
But it's just bad on piste. It someone says it can carve well, well, it can't. Dart can and it's pretty good in carving. So if you like to carve and love powder, Dart will be a better option. If you like to do some freestyle tricks in powder - then Orca will be better than Dart, easier to handle, way more stable at landings.

My friend who borrowed me Orca has Dancehoul too. We were 7 days in LAAX last season, he took Dancehoul only once and changed it back to Orca the next day. That says a lot about Dancehoul vs Orca comparison.

You can see what I can do with Dart here for example:


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

drblast said:


> View attachment 158969
> 
> Nose = 321mm
> 
> ...


thanks a lot
And thanks to the following posts for the added info


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## buller_scott (Jun 10, 2018)

wolf33d said:


> I don’t mind owning 10 boards if I need too but it just doesn’t work for me.
> 
> I can’t change board in between each run and in the middle of the run. How are people doing ? Riding the steep chute and then they arrive at the car to change board ? What about the trees and mellow terrain between the chute and the cars?
> ... I don’t see how a quiver can work, but it doesn’t for me.


Not doubting your experience nor snowboarding history, but it works - exploit the best of your (specific-application) setup in the conditions that lend themselves to it, suffer the last 19% of the runout back to the car when conditions change, swap setups, back up the hill after an acceptable 15min wait at the bottom commuter chairlift, to get back higher up the hill with the right board for the right conditions.

You purport to mostly riding pow - that is enviable (if I hadn't lived for 3 years in Hokkaido before the foreign shitcnuts raped the place, moving their vacations from Bali to "Nar-sayyyy-kohhh").

*drblast* posted measurements of his Rome Stalefish (which I think is generous and in keeping with the sense of helping each other out in this community).

I own BOTH a Yes Hybrid 157 and the predecessor to the Stalefish - the Tramline 157 MoonTail (2020 model if I recall).

I can assure you that the Rome is a ridiculously, ridiculously versatile ride - fantastic sidecut, nice long nose, stiffer tail that you can truly lean on....

I really love that board, it's SUCH a carver on groomed for example, when it's not too firm underneath. The below *does NOT* detract from the fact that I have enjoyed the Tramline for the last 3 seasons.

Yes' directional tapered underbite in the Hybrid, is the reason that I will be moving my Tramline on to a good home - either that, or keeping it as a "let's try!" deck for friends and family who want to give a real directional board a go when they visit. If i didn't have friends or family that i enjoy having gear for them to try, it'd be up for sale right now.

Food for thought.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

Bear in mind for Angry Snowboarders review of the Dancehaul he's on the 152 at 200lb, you'd be buying the 157 at 175lb, which pushes it much more in the freeride direction for you. At 200lb I had plenty of deep days on my 157 and never struggled for float or felt like it wasn't enough board in freeride scenarios, but it does retain that freestyle vibe in its ride feel. I think you'd have fun on the board, but the Stalefish or Pyre are likely better picks in that short wide camp from the sounds of what you're after. 

Just to give you more options, 162 Nitro Slash. Basically full camber but with a massive nose, you won't have any issues with float or stability on that.


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

wolf33d said:


> Advanced rider 6’5” 175lbs 12 boots based in Salt Lake City.
> Looking for a bord that best suits the following:
> 
> 
> ...


Massive fan of the end archetype, I'm 6'5 250 12 boot and rock the 160w, amazing in pow and a joy to slash in trees and groomers, you maybe able to drop down to the 158W, the size of the nose and the swallow make it very challenging to sink while the camber and carbon will still throw on edge


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

buller_scott said:


> Not doubting your experience nor snowboarding history, but it works - exploit the best of your (specific-application) setup in the conditions that lend themselves to it, suffer the last 19% of the runout back to the car when conditions change, swap setups, back up the hill after an acceptable 15min wait at the bottom commuter chairlift, to get back higher up the hill with the right board for the right conditions.
> 
> You purport to mostly riding pow - that is enviable (if I hadn't lived for 3 years in Hokkaido before the foreign shitcnuts raped the place, moving their vacations from Bali to "Nar-sayyyy-kohhh").
> 
> ...


Thanks for the info. I assume you mean the Rome Powder Division MT? I didn’t find a board called tramline. So from what you say the Yes has more edge hold but how do they compare in powder and in general?
Thanks.


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## MountainMystic (Apr 24, 2019)

wolf33d said:


> Thanks for the info. I assume you mean the Rome Powder Division MT? I didn’t find a board called tramline. So from what you say the Yes has more edge hold but how do they compare in powder and in general?
> Thanks.


"tramline" was a graphic on certain binding colourways of the Rome Katana, and maybe others, and there was a collection of pow boards in the Rome 2018-19 catalogue with the tramline graphic on the base. @buller_scott could tell you more


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)




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## arbroadbent (Sep 14, 2019)

Orca all the way. Bought mine last year and can't stop riding it on everything. Of course it smashes pow but I love riding it on groomers too.


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

arbroadbent said:


> Orca all the way. Bought mine last year and can't stop riding it on everything. Of course it smashes pow but I love riding it on groomers too.


How does it carve though with that C2x profile?


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## StCBoarder (Sep 24, 2019)

neni said:


> [
> 
> Define "deep"
> 
> We had some days with knee to thigh deep snow, enough to have upper mountain closed due to avy danger, so only runs below treeline were open. The 160 Mellow surely floats the old man better than the 164 Flgship. And I never heard him complaining. He really liked it's nimblemess in trees, but also took it to the climbs for steep chute riding.


Is this the new Mellow or the old pointy nosed Mellow?


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

StCBoarder said:


> Is this the new Mellow or the old pointy nosed Mellow?


Old pointy one.


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

NT.Thunder said:


> How does it carve though with that C2x profile?


some of the c2x boards are actually nice to carve on, depends how stiff they are to you.


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## buller_scott (Jun 10, 2018)

wolf33d said:


> Thanks for the info. I assume you mean the Rome Powder Division MT? I didn’t find a board called tramline. So from what you say the Yes has more edge hold but how do they compare in powder and in general?
> Thanks.


Yes, Pow Division Moon Tail 157. I don't know if this board was split into a softer version (Service Dog)/Stiffer version (StaleFish), I don't know and I don't mind - it's a really great board that has served me well over the last two years.

The tail is stiffer (by virtue of being so flat and short) than the Hybrid.

But the Hybrid..... That wanky Yes sidecut.... it works. I went up with another setup today, I will be culling a lot of stuff. Next time I can make it to LOCAL Japan (none of this NARSAYYYKOHHHHH shit), I suspect that it's the Hybrid + all mtn freestyle deck. Hybrid will be able to handle the so-called "low angle pow"


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

Another vote for niche pyre. S camber. Mid wide. Float, pop, carve. I have the 155. It rips.


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

wolf33d said:


> Advanced rider 6’5” 175lbs 12 boots based in Salt Lake City.
> Looking for a bord that best suits the following:
> 
> 
> ...


Sounds like a great board, another to add to the list if I stumble over a demo day someway.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

NT.Thunder said:


> Sounds like a great board, another to add to the list if I stumble over a demo day someway.


Yep saw the review earlier today. I eliminated the Dancehaul which sounds more freestyle oriented and I'll try to buy an Excavator, Stale Fish, Orca and maybe a Yes Hybrid and keep the one I like the most. Depending on availability and price. 

So far from the comments in this thread + online reviews + my hours of research it's in this order:

1. Excavator because it's exactly the specs and flex I am looking for + review says it's exceptional 
2. Stale Fish, basically exact same specs as above with 4mm less tip/tail, and great reviews but seems it will be less stable at high speed, be less of a charger, to be confirmed 
3. Orca because everybody including here raves about it, specs very similar as above with a bit less taper, seems it'll carve not as good as the above due to rocker
4. Hybrid due to recommandations here and in reviews. I am a bit reluctant because it seems exactly like my Taka meaning less taper than the above, might be too soft to charge. Also I am concerned about it feeling too centered. 

At the end of the day I love my Taka, I just want something that powers a bit better through tracked powder and is a little more locked in on piste without being overwhelming. Per the Angry review the K2 might be just that, but it might be too much also (too stiff/agressive) thus why I am considering the others as well.


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## MountainMystic (Apr 24, 2019)

...


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## RadDad801 (Dec 7, 2020)

I live in Utah too and actually prefer having a two board quiver. But I have an old Burton Barracuda that slays pow and does well on groomers as well. The newest Burton that is similar is the Wave Tracer and it shows some promise. I now have a 21 BSOD, but have yet to ride powder on it. Other boards I have looked at that look like great Pow/Groomer sticks are K2 Excavator, Rome Ravine Select, Jones Ultra Flagship, Bataleon Camel Two. I do have a couple friends that ride Orca's and they do love them as well.


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## campbellt3 (Feb 25, 2016)

wolf33d said:


> Yep saw the review earlier today. I eliminated the Dancehaul which sounds more freestyle oriented and I'll try to buy an Excavator, Stale Fish, Orca and maybe a Yes Hybrid and keep the one I like the most. Depending on availability and price.
> 
> So far from the comments in this thread + online reviews + my hours of research it's in this order:
> 
> ...


I'm tellin' ya bro, the Simple Pleasures does everything you want. Angry described the Excavator as a slightly softer version of the SP, comparable to the Niseko Pleasures. None of the three will overpower you. I live in Florida and only get out west around 10 days a year and the SP isn't too much for me. It's fantastic in powder and hero groomers, but it's just as solid in rutted out shit. It's the perfect one board quiver for me since I don't ride switch or hit the park. I don't think you could go wrong with any of the three from K2. Good luck!


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

Scalpelman said:


> Another vote for niche pyre. S camber. Mid wide. Float, pop, carve. I have the 155. It rips.


So stoked to get some time in on mine this season! 

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## snow & pow adventures (Oct 28, 2020)

NT.Thunder said:


> How does it carve though with that C2x profile?


poorly
but it's always a safe choice for huge powder days, treerides, and high mountain freeriding. Very good in powder, can't deny that.

Even with my current quiver, I wouldn't mind adding Orca there. Just in case


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## Paxford (Jan 7, 2019)

Check out Snoplanks and Elevated Surfcraft


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

Signal Tailgunner 

This ticks all your boxes. I don't think I want another powder board ever. Signal, keep making this beast and get one to Angry already!


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

I ordered a Niseko Pleasures Because I found a good deal on it and I just wanted to try it. Curious to see how that does on deeper days...I have a Storm Chaser and Endeavor Archetype as well.


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

Watched the Angry Top 5 Powder Boards this morning. The Archetype seems to be a topic of conversation around here regarding its place as a true powder deck - interesting to see it at #1.


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

NT.Thunder said:


> Watched the Angry Top 5 Powder Boards this morning. The Archetype seems to be a topic of conversation around here regarding its place as a true powder deck - interesting to see it at #1.


I have a archetype which is my first “pow” board, experience before this was a yes PYL, t rice pro & party platter.

At 6”5 250 the 160w never submarined me in upwards of 2 foot of fresh last year. In fact when id try to sink it would pop the nose right back up. I also found I quite liked it on soft groomers, it was a hoot for slashing and nimble carves. It definitely was a more natural floater then my 164w PYL even when set back though I know that’s not a pure pow deck.


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

I’m digging the new white top sheet for the archetype this year!


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

The worst top 5 in history of snowboarding.
He did not even mention the best dedicated pow boards on the market like Mind Expander and several others. Yet he puts in 3rd the Rome Ravine, an all mountain board!! If you put a Rome board in there at least put Rome’s pow deck… 
And his top 1 is a fantastic board, but far from being the best powder board, maybe because it’s also not a pow board to start with…


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

wolf33d said:


> The worst top 5 in history of snowboarding.
> He did not even mention the best dedicated pow boards on the market like Mind Expander and several others. Yet he puts in 3rd the Rome Ravine, an all mountain board!! If you put a Rome board in there at least put Rome’s pow deck…
> And his top 1 is a fantastic board, but far from being the best powder board, maybe because it’s  also not a pow board to start with…


It’s an interesting point, the ravine surprised me, archetype is on brand, I have to admit I thought of the hovercraft as more of a pow board then the expander and the pow surfer more so then both . Surprised not to see the bataleon surfer. I love the archetype and think it’s my favorite because it’s not pow or bust.

What would your top 5 be?


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

Elevation212 said:


> It’s an interesting point, the ravine surprised me, archetype is on brand, I have to admit I thought of the hovercraft as more of a pow board then the expander and the pow surfer more so then both . Surprised not to see the bataleon surfer. I love the archetype and think it’s my favorite because it’s not pow or bust.
> 
> What would your top 5 be?


I am not sure but I would mention Mind Expander, Storm Chaser, a Capita Spring Break maybe the Tree Hunter, a Korua maybe the Dart, Yes 420, Weston Japow, Rossi Sushi…
I am missing some for sure. But making a top 5 powder board by excluding all of those and including some all mountains and freeride board in it instead, You got to be kidding me lol.

The board I listed probably float better than half of his list.


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

wolf33d said:


> I am not sure but I would mention Mind Expander, Storm Chaser, a Capita Spring Break maybe the Tree Hunter, a Korua maybe the Dart, Yes 420, Weston Japow, Rossi Sushi…
> I am missing some for sure. But making a top 5 powder board by excluding all of those and including some all mountains and freeride board in it instead, You got to be kidding me lol.
> 
> The board I listed probably float better than half of his list.


Very true...Angrys views on powder boards confuse me.


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

wolf33d said:


> I am not sure but I would mention Mind Expander, Storm Chaser, a Capita Spring Break maybe the Tree Hunter, a Korua maybe the Dart, Yes 420, Weston Japow, Rossi Sushi…
> I am missing some for sure. But making a top 5 powder board by excluding all of those and including some all mountains and freeride board in it instead, You got to be kidding me lol.
> 
> The board I listed probably float better than half of his list.


Definitely seems like he’s shading towards boards that will float but will also be fun on groomers/when pows tracked out. To your point the hybrid over the 420, hover craft over storm chaser, ravine over the stale fish


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

Never ridden a Surfari but seems like it should be on that list.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

I've ridden the EA 162 in waist deep powdery Japan and it goes okay but it is not in the same ball park as my Fish 161 (dedicated flat top powder). Even though I was fully set back on the front with EST and -20mm on the rear the nose was always sitting low in the powder. When I ride the EA 162 in powder I kept wanting it to be longer up front to lift that nose up. I never burried it but just wanted the EA to drive up and out on top more. The big problem with the EA is that the swallow tails gives you an illusion it's a dedicated powder slayer.










I'll work with what I've got here but just look at the references on the EA (white dots) compared with that in the Fish. The EA has a 10mm greater length but the front reference is 82mm more forward than the Fish and 45mm forward on the rear. The rear tail rocker (uplift) on the Fish and the EA are close to the same point and the front is close to the same. This is a '21 Fish 3D so I'm comparing my riding experience with my older '18 Fish 161 (same as 3D fish) that I no longer own. Every Freeride/Powder board I compare the EA too you get this same above scenario. You just can't get enough set back with EST with the EA design. I may be a little over Endeavors weight range at 210lbs on a 162 but Avran is 200lbs on a 158. Now the latest EA 164 could be a better ride for me but I found I loved my EA on the piste more than the powder ie Hover Camber (setback camber). Here I don't have to worry about the nose submerging. This is my experience with the EA and it may/will be different for others.


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

Craig64 said:


> I've ridden the EA 162 in waist deep powdery Japan and it goes okay but it is not in the same ball park as my Fish 161 (dedicated flat top powder). Even though I was fully set back on the front with EST and -20mm on the rear the nose was always sitting low in the powder. When I ride the EA 162 in powder I kept wanting it to be longer up front to lift that nose up. I never burried it but just wanted the EA to drive up and out on top more. The big problem with the EA is that the swallow tails gives you an illusion it's a dedicated powder slayer.
> 
> View attachment 159242
> 
> ...


The difference in setback is pretty noticeable here also..











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## RobPowderjunkie (Oct 7, 2021)

As you yourself mentioned it, how about a good old freeride classic: Jones Flagship?? I´m so in love with that board. Never had an issue in any terrain with it!!!


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

Jkb818 said:


> The difference in setback is pretty noticeable here also..
> 
> 
> 
> ...











I’ve tended more towards the resort pow board that can rock in powder but still be fun on groomers, based on that i lined up my 4 decks I grab on snowy days and was shocked by the lack of setback on the AE compared to my moss. Im wondering if what makes it float me so well is that it’s the 160 wide and the waist is up to 276mm compared to the rest of the line, I believe it has more total surface area then the 164. Setback at maximum is about in line with my optimistic which is 3cm shorter

Back to the angry conversation, he seems to ride resorts and I’m wondering if he’s looking at resort pow boards over pure back country boards, I wonder if pow boards should be further sliced into resort/off piste/Japan


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

…


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

Elevation212 said:


> View attachment 159244
> 
> I’ve tended more towards the resort pow board that can rock in powder but still be fun on groomers, based on that i lined up my 4 decks I grab on snowy days and was shocked by the lack of setback on the AE compared to my moss. Im wondering if what makes it float me so well is that it’s the 160 wide and the waist is up to 276mm compared to the rest of the line, I believe it has more total surface area then the 164. Setback at maximum is about in line with my optimistic which is 3cm shorter
> 
> Back to the angry conversation, he seems to ride resorts and I’m wondering if he’s looking at resort pow boards over pure back country boards, I wonder if pow boards should be further sliced into resort/off piste/Japan


Love that Moss!


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

Jkb818 said:


> Love that Moss!
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It a a weird one, camber bubble under the rear insert pack, rocker all the way up from there

I thought you’d like with it, crazy set back on a 165


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

RobPowderjunkie said:


> As you yourself mentioned it, how about a good old freeride classic: Jones Flagship?? I´m so in love with that board. Never had an issue in any terrain with it!!!


Fantastic freeride board like my Rossi XV was, and my Super 8. But definitely not what I look for. I am looking for a pow board that can also charge (eliminates things like storm chaser sushi…), that doesn’t get bucked around in tracked snow (eliminates stuff like Yes 420 and other very short fat), that can carve and can be nimble and fun all day long and in trees (eliminates XV, Flagship…)
Also, the when people tell me those freeride board float I believe they haven’t ride a pow board. When I had the super 8 I thought it floated. Then I got the Taka and understood. Night and day difference in powder.

At the end of the day I want exactly the Taka but a tiny bit more agressive / better for carving and charging than the Taka is. But that board is so good in powder yet decent in everything else I might get disappointed in what I get because the Taka is close to be my board. That’s why I enjoyed it for 2Y. It’s my perfectionist aspect that pushed me look for something perfect.

One thing I noticed is board dimensions and tapper help, but what really helps a board more to float is setback and shape. Super 8 is way more camber than Taka, and on pow the feeling is night and day. The super 8 plunged back into the snow because of camber where the Taka always stay up and super surfy and easy to turn.

One final world. I can’t carve a Flagship even in 162W. Forget waist width. Width at rear Insert is too narrow due to the taper. People look at waist width when they should look at tail width. With my size 12 I can’t ride less than 300mm tail width. That’s one more reason I want something like Excavator, Stalefish, Orca, Hybrid, Dancehaul…. They have perfect width for me.


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

wolf33d said:


> Fantastic freeride board like my Rossi XV was, and my Super 8. But definitely not what I look for. I am looking for a pow board that can also charge (eliminates things like storm chaser sushi…), that doesn’t get bucked around in tracked snow (eliminates stuff like Yes 420 and other very short fat), that can carve and can be nimble and fun all day long and in trees (eliminates XV, Flagship…)
> Also, the when people tell me those freeride board float I believe they haven’t ride a pow board. When I had the super 8 I thought it floated. Then I got the Taka and understood. Night and day difference in powder.
> 
> At the end of the day I want exactly the Taka but a tiny bit more agressive / better for carving and charging than the Taka is. But that board is so good in powder yet decent in everything else I might get disappointed in what I get because the Taka is close to be my board. That’s why I enjoyed it for 2Y. It’s my perfectionist aspect that pushed me look for something perfect.
> ...


For powder, carve & wide feet I’d add the AE, Optimistic, Gremlin, PYL

All have nice taper, good effective edges, stiff ness for carving and float that will keep you up in most scenarios


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

wolf33d said:


> Fantastic freeride board like my Rossi XV was, and my Super 8. But definitely not what I look for. I am looking for a pow board that can also charge (eliminates things like storm chaser sushi…), that doesn’t get bucked around in tracked snow (eliminates stuff like Yes 420 and other very short fat), that can carve and can be nimble and fun all day long and in trees (eliminates XV, Flagship…)
> Also, the when people tell me those freeride board float I believe they haven’t ride a pow board. When I had the super 8 I thought it floated. Then I got the Taka and understood. Night and day difference in powder.
> 
> At the end of the day I want exactly the Taka but a tiny bit more agressive / better for carving and charging than the Taka is. But that board is so good in powder yet decent in everything else I might get disappointed in what I get because the Taka is close to be my board. That’s why I enjoyed it for 2Y. It’s my perfectionist aspect that pushed me look for something perfect.
> ...


Also why not the telos backslash?


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

You could have a look at the Stranda Tree Surfer and the Bowlrider. They feel like they should handle rutted out terrain well. Personally not a fan of the nose shape but they ride really well, and carve like carving boards, although they have a shorter sidecut than what I prefer. Really nice looking boards too... and seem well built. My personal favorite among the Stranda boards is the Shorty though. I've tried the 169 and it's incredible on edge and has a good scooped nose. Maybe not the most agile tree board though. Maybe the 164 wide could be something.

My personal favorite is the Pencil plus. Downside is that it's a little bouncy in uneven terrain, but I suspect the Classic version is more stable. Really nice balance to it in powder and is really fun doing high speed carves. It's only front foot ridden when you initiate the turns. The shorter sidecut in the front makes it turns faster and initiate better like that. From then on through the turn you ride it front foot to back foot.

Then you have the Tur Buteo... sort of like a mix between a powderboard and a nimble Bullet Train.


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

Elevation212 said:


> View attachment 159244
> 
> I’ve tended more towards the resort pow board that can rock in powder but still be fun on groomers, based on that i lined up my 4 decks I grab on snowy days and was shocked by the lack of setback on the AE compared to my moss. Im wondering if what makes it float me so well is that it’s the 160 wide and the waist is up to 276mm compared to the rest of the line, I believe it has more total surface area then the 164. Setback at maximum is about in line with my optimistic which is 3cm shorter
> 
> Back to the angry conversation, he seems to ride resorts and I’m wondering if he’s looking at resort pow boards over pure back country boards, I wonder if pow boards should be further sliced into resort/off piste/Japan


Most boards can be pow focused. Some of my best pow boards are full camber no taper, just longer and narrower with setback (15 cm longer with same ww as my park board), and my fav resort board is a «japan» board. It’s hard to make a golden standard for reviewing or marketing descriptions, and what people feel each board is good for. Some brands are good at describing it. I keep tail width pretty consistent, and mostly look at sidecut, tail shape and flex. I have long boards for deep days because I don’t really like them too wide.


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## bschmitty34 (Oct 15, 2020)

I'll put a +1 in for the Mind Expander. I don't have experience with a ton of powder boards (my last pow board was the K2 gyrator which I liked) but I've got to say that I've never had more fun on a board in my 20+ years of riding than on the Mind Expander. Love the float and surfy feel. I feel great on drops and landings in deep powder. Just super stoked on the board. Plus I love the way it looks.

I know there are a ton of other great powder boards that I haven't tried but love the ME, and know a couple others on my local hill that love it as well.


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## Balinus (Mar 7, 2021)

wolf33d said:


> Also, the when people tell me those freeride board float I believe they haven’t ride a pow board. When I had the super 8 I thought it floated. Then I got the Taka and understood. Night and day difference in powder.
> 
> At the end of the day I want exactly the Taka but a tiny bit more agressive / better for carving and charging than the Taka is. But that board is so good in powder yet decent in everything else I might get disappointed in what I get because the Taka is close to be my board. That’s why I enjoyed it for 2Y. It’s my perfectionist aspect that pushed me look for something perfect.


Stumbled on this review while exploring the Taka.

According to them, HPS Louif Paradis is very freeride focused, stiffer than the Taka (a board they loved). Salomon advertise it as a pow board (HPS line). So perhaps your dream board is a cousin of the Taka? 

Its in french.


https://www.snowsurf.com/snowboard-2022-salomon-hps-louif-paradis


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

Balinus said:


> Stumbled on this review while exploring the Taka.
> 
> According to them, HPS Louif Paradis is very freeride focused, stiffer than the Taka (a board they loved). Salomon advertise it as a pow board (HPS line). So perhaps your dream board is a cousin of the Taka?
> 
> ...


I really like Salomon, but some of their "powder boards" aren't that much powder boards compared to many other. I have the First Call 151 and 162 and they're marketed as powder boards. Can you ride them in powder? Absolutely you can... and have fun doing it. The difference between nose and tail is mediocre at best and while they work... I wouldn't really call them powder boards. "Boards that also work in powder", much like most boards.


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## The_Stigs (Jan 3, 2012)

Snowdaddy said:


> I really like Salomon, but some of their "powder boards" aren't that much powder boards compared to many other. I have the First Call 151 and 162 and they're marketed as powder boards. Can you ride them in powder? Absolutely you can... and have fun doing it. The difference between nose and tail is mediocre at best and while they work... I wouldn't really call them powder boards. "Boards that also work in powder", much like most boards.


Going to counter that and go back to what I said earlier in this thread. The HPS Wolle (previously HPS X Asmo 157) is a rad powder board through and through, if said powder isn't wet, heavy, and heavily tracked.


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

The_Stigs said:


> Going to counter that and go back to what I said earlier in this thread. The HPS Wolle (previously HPS X Asmo 157) is a rad powder board through and through, if said powder isn't wet, heavy, and heavily tracked.


Oh absolutely! I've been eyeing just that board many times. And I'm also sure the Taka, Speedway and Super 8 works really well. I was talking more about their "freestyle" powder boards. Like the First Call, Sick Stick, and such. I'm not saying they're bad boards... just not a dream powder board.



Snowdaddy said:


> I really like Salomon, but *some of their "powder boards"* aren't that much powder boards compared to many other. I have the* First Call 151 and 162 and they're marketed as powder boards.* Can you ride them in powder? Absolutely you can... and have fun doing it. The difference between nose and tail is mediocre at best and while they work... I wouldn't really call them powder boards. "Boards that also work in powder", much like most boards.


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

Besides... for anyone in Europe... at Freshfarm.it they sell these Salomon at a 40% discount.


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## JDA (Feb 10, 2016)

This is a review I did on the Archetype after taking it to Japan.

I wanted to leave my thoughts on taking my 158 Archetype out in knee deep Japow after an overnight storm. At 85kg or 187lbs I'm leaning toward the upper weight range of this board but still well within the range. I didn't change my normal stance, I ride it at reference but slightly nudged in a bit equally at each end as I have short legs. I usually prefer to ride boards as close to reference as possible.

We got to the resort early and lined up for the top chair which has the steepest runs and they don't groom, I've been there before and knew the drill and where to go. Lined up for 20 minutes and I think we were about 10 - 15 people back in the queue. First run down was the best, big undulating rollers, pretty steep in places for Japan and a wide run with minimal people in my way. I went for maximum speed, boosting the rollers and landing in deep pow but still found that if I didn't put my weight on the back leg the nose would submarine. My back leg was aching toward the end of the run but it was a great run, couldn't get the smile off my face.

Got straight back in the line which was not even a 5 minute wait and we were back up top again, this time I ducked under the lift and into the steepest tree section on the mountain, found a line quickly with some reasonably spaced trees and charged it. Again I had to load up my back leg to keep the nose up.

We did about 5 - 6 more tree runs and then it was close to lunch time, most lines were tracked out by then but there were still plenty of untouched stashes, its a big resort. I spent the afternoon going as fast as possible, dipping in and out of pow stashes and boosting natural side hits with the odd pow butter on the nose. I think this is where the archetype really shines, it has a playful enough flex but still holds a really good edge and can lay a trench with ease and plenty of pop and stability on jumps. For riding fresh and deep Japow it did not have the required float but if your legs are strong enough you will be rewarded and have a great time once the main lines are tracked out. If you are going somewhere that you can ride un-tracked lines all day then its probably not a great choice. I have other boards in my quiver that are perfect for that.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

Here the Endeavor Archetype is laid alongside the Bataleon Surfer with the references for the EA marked with the white dots. You can clearly see the differences with the effective edge with EA having its rear finish 195mm short of the pulled in tapered tail. It's dramatically different to that of the Surfer which has the rear EE running just short of the tip in the tail. The EA 162 has an EE of 1200mm to the Surfer 159 at 1289. So a 30mm shorter board with an 89mm greater effective edge. The contact length also is shorter with the EA at 995mm against the Surfer at 1160. Both have 30mm of taper. One of these Boards is heaps better in Powder than the other.


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

And here is the Archetype 160W vs Korua Cafe Racer 159 I used to own (now on 164). The boards are aligned to the effective edge which is also the point of reference for the setback specs. Rode both with ~~ 2.5 to 4 cm setback. You can clearly see how much more nose the CR has, no matter where you put your bindings on. This shorter nose and the very little upkick on the EA makes it prone to nose diving.
So even if the CR is called ‚not a powder board’ by Avran, it completely outfloats the Archetype.























Unfortunately the short and flat nose profile is somehow not visible here, it’s only shown from the top - the ‚powdery’ side of things:


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

Burton Backseat Driver is awesome in pow! If they can make a version of this with bindings I would buy it in a heartbeat.










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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

Regarding the talks about Salomon:

having ride the Sick Stick and Super 8 (owned) those are not pow boards for sure. Flot well relatively to a freestyle board maybe but that’s it. Still have to put back foot weight, doesn’t turn amazing in pow, and not great in low angle. Both have a decent amount of rocker not that much setback and taper. The Taka is night and day in powder versus those. And the main difference between a Taka and Super 8 is the rocker in the tip.

Now the Asmo 157 (it’s a different name this year though) is a different story. It’s actually way too wide even for me at 33cm tip width to be nimble in trees. I am sure it would float well though.

The comparison above between the Korea and the EA is excellent. It illustrates what I said earlier: amount of camber or rocker makes a massive difference. The mind expander has the best float in the world despite being not so long not so wide. But the Gigantic rocker does all the work. Here we can see the Korua despite having camber has more rocker on the nose than the EA and that makes a big difference. Most if not all the korua are too narrow at the tail for my feet though.

What’s frustrating is that it’s almost impossible to know the amount of camber/rocker of a board without seeing it on a table. Taper, setback, length and width are just numbers easy to compare.

If I had the Excavator, Stalefish and others on a table I would be able to know which will float best. They all have similar dimensions and spec that warrant great float at the condition that there is enough rocker on the nose.

Koruas are great because they have enough rocker in the front to float, all the necessary specs to float (loads of tapper….) and enough camber between feet to carve.


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

I suppose I should throw in moss snow sticks, those decks are built to hand japow and then lay euros on groomers.

the step back rocker series is going to give you rocker from rear insert to nose with camber under the rear foot.

here’s the jelly fish laying carves


__
http://instagr.am/p/B3zVyYGAkNb/




__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=1171466742956600



Mini long


__
http://instagr.am/p/BJPUi_ChRCE/




__ https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=675157632587516



fluffy 54






I can send some pics along of the rocker on my mini long, when I put pressure-on the rear camber bubble 3/4 of the board lifts off the ground


Login • Instagram


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## Balinus (Mar 7, 2021)

How about Borealis Koi? Reviews seems real nice, with strength being carving and powder. Anyone has rode it? Looks similar to Taka, but stiffer. 

The owner answered my questions by email. At my weight (220lbs, he has the same weight) he suggested ( and he rides) the 156 for on-piste or the 160 for more back country oriented riding.


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## micaelaf (Mar 9, 2019)

I just got the Wave Tracer and rode it at Brighton opening, as u prob already know the snow sucks right now but the WT handled it really well. Haven’t tried it on pow but I’d probably still use my Stick Shift in deep powder, if we get any 



RadDad801 said:


> I live in Utah too and actually prefer having a two board quiver. But I have an old Burton Barracuda that slays pow and does well on groomers as well. The newest Burton that is similar is the Wave Tracer and it shows some promise. I now have a 21 BSOD, but have yet to ride powder on it. Other boards I have looked at that look like great Pow/Groomer sticks are K2 Excavator, Rome Ravine Select, Jones Ultra Flagship, Bataleon Camel Two. I do have a couple friends that ride Orca's and they do love them as well.


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## micaelaf (Mar 9, 2019)

wolf33d said:


> Advanced rider 6’5” 175lbs 12 boots based in Salt Lake City.
> Looking for a bord that best suits the following:
> 
> 
> ...


I also live in Utah and I just got the new Wave Tracer, I always rode traditional camber except my powder board, so I did not know what to expect with this directional Flying V but it did really well on the shitty snow at Brighton opening day, even carving to my surprise. I know it will be amazing on powder too although I’d always prefer my fish for deep stuff, if we even get any 🥲 I think the Wave Tracer is great all around, more versatile.


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

This winter is looking bleak in Utah... 


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

I ended buying the K2 excavator for now, will report back


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

wolf33d said:


> I ended buying the K2 excavator for now, will report back


Volume shifted stiff freeride board. Get ready.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

Nivek said:


> Volume shifted stiff freeride board. Get ready.


Get ready for what?


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Not many volume freeride boards, and I think this board rides stiffer than most people realize. It was reminiscent of the aluminium Ride Timeless.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

Nivek said:


> Not many volume freeride boards, and I think this board rides stiffer than most people realize. It was reminiscent of the aluminium Ride Timeless.


Have you tried it? Angry review says it’s less stiff than one thinks… So I guess I will see. One of the reason I am changing my Taka 158cm which I love in pow is it’s a tad soft and not great at high speed in tracked snow. So I wanted something a bit stiffer, but I don’t want a 8/10 stiffness either. Let’s see… If this is too stiff or does not work for me I’ll try the Orca or the Rome Stale Fish those are the next 2 on my list. 
I might also get a Dancehaul because I can get that one for very cheap, just to see if I like it. I just don’t like that there is 0 setback on it.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

wolf33d said:


> I might also get a Dancehaul because I can get that one for very cheap, just to see if I like it. I just don’t like that there is 0 setback on it.


0 Setback on sidecut, but the nose is 11cm longer than the tail.


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

wolf33d said:


> I might also get a Dancehaul because I can get that one for very cheap, just to see if I like it. I just don’t like that there is 0 setback on it.


The Dancehaul has a radial sidecut. I like being centered on those. You can always slam the bindings all the way back if you want that setback.


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## RadDad801 (Dec 7, 2020)

I also picked up an Excavator as the pow in Utah doesn't last long and I don't want to be heading back to the car to swap boards once it's all tracked out. I'll report back when we actually get any snow.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

OP here. 1st day on the Excavator 158 in Utah.
First impressions the day after 24in of fresh pow:

Medium stiff a good 7/10, definitely not as stiff as other freeride boards I have riden. Stiffer than the Taka 158, about the same as the Super 8, less stiff than a Rossignol XV, slightly stiffer than an Assassin, on part with a Weston Backwoods. Just to give you a comparison with boards I have riden a lot.
Torsional flex is less stiff, so it’s easy to turn the board despite the width.
I overall really liked the flex and it was PRECISELY what I was looking for. A bit stiffer than my Taka workhorse but still fun and playfull.

Carving was absolutely perfect. Best board I have ever ridden for carving. It just works and is effortless.

I did a lot of going through tracked snow and happy to report it does well in that regards. Better than my Taka. Great stability yet again easy to turn. Again, it was what I was looking for and my research paid off.

So if you remember I was trying to get a board for powder that does great in tracked snow and carves well. Like I said, groomer, tracked snow and carving perfect.

Now the powder is where my concern is. You see my Taka is 158cm, with 30cm tail width and 31cm tip width, this Excavator 158 is 30.4 tail and 32.4 tip so you would think it floats even better. The issue is compared on a table, the Excavator is pretty much full camber with a bit of rocker in the nose where the Taka is a light camber with large rocker in the nose.
Most of the powder was tracked out, but I had the opportunity to go in 24in deep powder for lenghts of 50ft or so. My test was limited but my initial feedback is that if my weight is in the front: cartwheel. If weight is centered, board still dives a bit, and if weight is on back foot it’s perfect.
NOTE: I WAS ON REFERENCE STANCE. Obviously next time I will set all the way back and my impression could change in powder.
This Excavator has enormous surface, decent setback, large taper but misses the rocker. It floats much better than the board listed above and most freeride board out there. But it floats less than the same board with more rocker.
I will have to do more test and experience a powder day from the beginning (not the day after it snowed) and with proper stance set back to confirm.

One thing I did not like: the base had deep scratches and peeling off after lightly touching a couple rocks. It looks worst than my Taka after 2 entire season and hundreds of touching with rocks. Hard to believe but true.

So early conclusion:
Excellent carving board with almost the stability of a stiff freeride board yet more playfull and with more float. However so far less float than a real powder board (Mind expander, storm chaser, Japow, HPS Taka). But for most people and most places in the world it can and will exceed their expectation in floatation.

Again, that’s the early feeling. I lacked speed in the powder fields I could hit so powder is what I did not test enough today + I was not set back. If I find out that it’s perfect in powder when I can do a real test in powder, then it will be my perfect board cause everything else is perfect. If it ends up disappointing in pow, then my quest continues.


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## RadDad801 (Dec 7, 2020)

I haven’t taken my excavator out of the plastic yet. I am looking for more reviews like the above one. I want something that will float pretty effortlessly in pow.

I have a ‘21 BSOD as a daily driver and I asked Avran if he thought the BSOD and Excavator would have too much overlap. He said no. But now I am second guessing that. They both seem to have fairly similar camber profiles up front. I’m now looking at possibly returning the Excavator and possibly picking up something like a Surfari, assuming it has more rise in the nose.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

RadDad801 said:


> I haven’t taken my excavator out of the plastic yet. I am looking for more reviews like the above one. I want something that will float pretty effortlessly in pow.
> 
> What size did you get and what is your weight? I am 210 and got the 162.


I wrote the size twice in the above review which is 158 and my weight in OP which is 175lbs. 

The best is for you to try it. I have seen dozens of people online saying boards like Super 8 or Salomon Sick Stick had great float. They don’t and suck in powder. People can only relate to their own experience. Someone riding an all mountain for 2y then switching to a super 8 of course will say it floats. Someone who has a Mind Expander and tries a Super 8 will say it sinks like a tank.

Most boards that will float better than this will buck you around in tracked snow or won’t carve well.

If basic twins are a 1/5 in pow, basic directionals a 2/5, directional freeride boards with some taper (super 8, PYL…) a 3/5, and a mind expander a 5, this would be a 3.5-4 so far. With my Taka being a 4-4.5. 
Again that’s with reference stance.


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## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

The amplid Snommelier is the definition of effortless pow float


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

I had my new signal tailgunner 166 out in crested butte this weekend 30” of fresh. Was very pleasantly surprised on the float, certainly better then my 164w PYL and my 160w AE. Tomorrow the moss minilong, that things rockered nose extends all the way to the start of the rear insert, will report back


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## RadDad801 (Dec 7, 2020)

Have you had a chance to try the Excavator in this recent powder with the stance set back? I asked Avran why he considered the Excavator a "pow" board and the Surfari a "freeride" board and of course got a smart ass answer. I was really curious if there is more early rise in the Excavator.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

RadDad801 said:


> Have you had a chance to try the Excavator in this recent powder with the stance set back? I asked Avran why he considered the Excavator a "pow" board and the Surfari a "freeride" board and of course got a smart ass answer. I was really curious if there is more early rise in the Excavator.


I'd assume it has a lot to do with the width and sidecuts, as well as length. Freeride runs the full gamut of conditions, which could mean icy refrozen push mounds from hell. In those conditions, short-fat style boards suck. Their width means they get pushed around by the uneven snow, and it's harder for you to leverage the board and keep it on your intended line. The tighter sidecut means when they do get bucked around and put you on edge, that's going to force you into a tighter turn, and when you didn't intend to make a turn at all, the tighter it is the more it's going to surprise you/throw you off. 

Surfari would be ridden longer than an Excavator, it's not as wide, and has a larger sidecut. It's going to ride through and over choppy conditions better than the Excavator, increased length helps a lot on steeper terrain, and the narrower width helps it cut through and around the chopped up snow where the widest point of the Excavator may have connected with the chunk of ice just to the side of your intended line, potentially bucking you.


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## RadDad801 (Dec 7, 2020)

Supposedly the Excavator plows through almost anything. IIRC it's also not a ton wider than the Surfari, I'd have to look at the specs again.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

For me the Excavator is a mix between a freeride board and a powder board.
It keeps the more camber / little rocker of freeride board, and their stiffness and dampeness but with the tapper and setback on board (not on sidecut) of powder boards.
That’s exactly what I was looking for. Most pow board suck on piste or in tracked snow, and most freeride board are not effortless in powder (from a float and manoeuverability perspective) thus why I wanted a combination.

I confirmed in my review on the piste / tracked snow / carving it does the job exceptionally well even better than some freeride decks I have had.

I have yet to have been able to test it in deep pow with proper setback so I have yet to answer how well does it compare to a proper pow board there.
Needless to say if it checks that box (of being 95% as good as a proper pow board in deep pow) then it would be the perfect board for me and anyone looking for the same thing.
Stay tuned.


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

wolf33d said:


> I am not sure but I would mention Mind Expander, Storm Chaser, a Capita Spring Break maybe the Tree Hunter, a Korua maybe the Dart, Yes 420, Weston Japow, Rossi Sushi…
> I am missing some for sure. But making a top 5 powder board by excluding all of those and including some all mountains and freeride board in it instead, You got to be kidding me lol.


Late to the party, but I have a Tree Hunter and that thing floats like nothing else I've been on. Like 200lb guy ollies off a side-hit into deep flat powder and keeps going float.

I hype this board and Rome boards in general a lot, but Rome Stalefish 157 has 90% of the float of the Tree Hunter 161 and rides very, very well on groomers. Specs make it look like a Dancehaul with more setback. Since I bought the Stalefish I've ridden the Tree Hunter once to make sure I wasn't making a mistake selling it.

Verdict: I don't need a Tree Hunter for deep powder - Stalefish covers that just fine. I'm keeping the Tree Hunter anyway cause I just love the look and it's a fun quiver board for that very deep weekend day where I'm gonna get there first chair and do a few pow laps and go home.

And actually the Excavator has similar specs to the Stalefish so I'm guessing it's gonna be just fine in powder for you.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

drblast said:


> Late to the party, but I have a Tree Hunter and that thing floats like nothing else I've been on. Like 200lb guy ollies off a side-hit into deep flat powder and keeps going float.
> 
> I hype this board and Rome boards in general a lot, but Rome Stalefish 157 has 90% of the float of the Tree Hunter 161 and rides very, very well on groomers. Specs make it look like a Dancehaul with more setback. Since I bought the Stalefish I've ridden the Tree Hunter once to make sure I wasn't making a mistake selling it.
> 
> ...


Would you minding sending a picture of the stale fish from the side on a table to show the rocker and camber? 
this was my second choice behind the Excavator. They have pretty much the same specs, but obviously I couldn’t compare the rocker profile so I am wondering if it has more rocker or not


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

wolf33d said:


> Would you minding sending a picture of the stale fish from the side on a table to show the rocker and camber?
> this was my second choice behind the Excavator. They have pretty much the same specs, but obviously I couldn’t compare the rocker profile so I am wondering if it has more rocker or not


Hard to get pics due to the 3d nose but here's my best shot:










There is no rocker in the tail, and when I weight the board the contact point in the nose is about 4cm back from the widest part of the nose, so plenty of rocker and 3D shaping in the nose. The tail is no joke though and one of the reasons I love this board and boards like it - it's not a narrow washy tail and you can count on it holding an edge even in bad conditions.

Compared to Tree Hunter, very similar shapes with more taper on the Tree Hunter:


























That little bit of extra tail effective edge you see on the Stalefish is why I love it. Carves great like a directional S-camber board should but as you can see still will float in pow.

The full rocker Tree Hunter is still better for effortless float but not by a huge amount.


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## Elevation212 (Apr 21, 2019)

drblast said:


> Hard to get pics due to the 3d nose but here's my best shot:
> 
> View attachment 160534
> 
> ...


have you ridden the service dog? Trying to understand the difference between the decks? Just a bit o stiffness?


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

Thanks for the picture. It’s quite a lot of camber and not much rocker. Looks like the excavator


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

More testing today. We got 40" of pow however due to work schedule I arrived after the party. So I still could not get in deep pow properly but being set back, from the few turns I could make in pow it was better than last time. I can feel it's gonna be good. Still too early for proper pow judgement though.
A dream on piste. Powers through anything, stable but comfortable to ride all day. Carves better than any board (freeride board like Super 8 and XV included) I have tried. 
I got a LOT of moguls today. I hate moguls. But it performed beautifully in 158 and set back I could turn in moguls very well.

So far super happy with the purchase. I just need one first chair run in deep pow (20+ inches) to confirm deep powder performance and if it performs I am all set.
If it doesn't I will maybe end up buying an Orca. I don't see how any other similar board (like the Stale fish) would perform better in pow considering specs. Only the Orca thanks to the big rocker (at the detriment of carving) could do better in pow. Then the Orca has much less tapper so I am not even sure it would be that much better in pow.


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## SB79 (Dec 26, 2021)

wolf33d said:


> More testing today. We got 40" of pow however due to work schedule I arrived after the party. So I still could not get in deep pow properly but being set back, from the few turns I could make in pow it was better than last time. I can feel it's gonna be good. Still too early for proper pow judgement though.
> A dream on piste. Powers through anything, stable but comfortable to ride all day. Carves better than any board (freeride board like Super 8 and XV included) I have tried.
> I got a LOT of moguls today. I hate moguls. But it performed beautifully in 158 and set back I could turn in moguls very well.
> 
> ...


Looking forward to hearing your final thoughts on the excavator after you ride it on a fresh pow day. How far did you set both binding back for your last pow day? ( relative to reference stance) 

I’m eyeing it out to replace my Mindexpander. ( loved the float, but it stank on piste and whwn the piste got icey it was terrible) 
Currently have a Burton Hometown hero. That I use for pow/freeride. Hoping the Excavator can be the replacement for my HTH and ME.

Got a Capita Mercury for my general piste /resort board.


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

Ok so we got decent powder days recently and I was able to have fresh tracks top to bottom on the Excavator 158.

Set all the way back, it’s much better than in reference stance. I did not get the same feeling as last time and powder performance was great. 
I could float effortlessly. A friend bought it in 154 at 170 lbs, he rode the same day same place and loved it as well. Said it floats as much as his 159 Japow which is one of the best floater around with the only difference being the Japow more effortless in pow turns with the non existant tail.

note: the powder was dense for Utah. This makes it easier to float despite some slopes I had chest deep powder.
I would imagine in chest deep super light powder the float would be less so I still need to test those condition.

But so far I m happy to report this board is the perfect combination of a freeride resort destroyer (jones flagship, yes PYL, … for carving and tracked snow performance) and a pow board.

That reminds me of the Korua Pencil and Dart which most people say excel at carving but can be dedicated pow boards as well.

If you want to carve on piste, destroy the resort, perform well in tracked snow, have the ability to go steep, yet have a pow board all in one this is the board.
If you are more into the same as above but more slow speed cruising playing around on lower angle (and therefore don’t need the stability) I would look at the Dancehaul and Stalefish, or the Niseko Pleasures. All 3 are reputed to carve well, have similar measurements and specs but are softer than the Excavator.
The excavator is not soft. It’s not super stiff either. It’s a true 7/10 medium stiff board with a little more give in torsional flex. I have been overwhelmed with too stiff boards before (XV) but not here.


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## treehugger (Mar 21, 2021)

Had my Nidecker Mosquito out in an unexpected pow day (at the start of current storm cycle) and was super impressed. Snow started off kinda dense but got really deep and lite as it kept dumping. I wasn't expecting any upper mt lifts to open or I would have been on a wider board. It was amazing doing high speed untracked turns in 2-3' powder. Never even thought about float. Made me rethink width and stiffness for powder.

Excavator sounds like something I would like for mid width pow board.


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

treehugger said:


> Had my Nidecker Mosquito out in an unexpected pow day (at the start of current storm cycle) and was super impressed. Snow started off kinda dense but got really deep and lite as it kept dumping. I wasn't expecting any upper mt lifts to open or I would have been on a wider board. It was amazing doing high speed untracked turns in 2-3' powder. Never even thought about float. Made me rethink width and stiffness for powder.
> 
> Excavator sounds like something I would like for mid width pow board.


Mosquito looks like my kinda board


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## wolf33d (Dec 31, 2018)

I posted the full review including new thoughts after a deep pow day today here









K2 Excavator 158 Review


This post is a copy and paste from several posts I have made reviewing my Excavator. I thought it would be beneficial to group them into one review. Size: 158 Weight: 175 LBS Condition of test: groomers at first but deep powderdays towards the end of the review. Plus moguls tracked snow etc...




www.snowboardingforum.com


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## Paxford (Jan 7, 2019)

Jkb818 said:


> Very true...Angrys views on powder boards confuse me.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Angrys don’t surf 


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## RadDad801 (Dec 7, 2020)

He deleted a post I made on his website about the Excavator vs Surfari for some reason.


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## Paxford (Jan 7, 2019)

RadDad801 said:


> He deleted a post I made on his website about the Excavator vs Surfari for some reason.


A conspiracy! Seriously though I have the utmost respect for Avran, just stating the fact and how it impacts his reviews.


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## Nolefan2011 (Mar 12, 2011)

All these posts and no Burton Family Tree line? I won a Cheetah in a raffle. After that, bought a Landlord. Then a Skipjack. Tried many others. They’re all good, just different flavors. And the best part is, they’re fun after it’s tracked out.


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## RadDad801 (Dec 7, 2020)

You just need to take reviews with a grain of salt. A board one person likes, you may not like. Everyone has their own tastes.


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## Paxford (Jan 7, 2019)

RadDad801 said:


> You just need to take reviews with a grain of salt. A board one person likes, you may not like. Everyone has their own tastes.


+1 it ain’t easy to get on the same page when there are so many variables. Even with the same tastes folks ride different conditions, have different skill levels, different body shapes, absolutely no fear to total cowards, stingy to open checkbooks, different motivations like looking cool vs actually caring about how their equipment works etc. 

Luckily there is a crew here that has sort of aligned so they can speak to one another and get somewhere.


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

RadDad801 said:


> He deleted a post I made on his website about the Excavator vs Surfari for some reason.


Interesting, what did you post out of interest sake?


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

NT.Thunder said:


> Interesting, what did you post out of interest sake?


He mentioned that the good ride does better comparisons 


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

Jkb818 said:


> He mentioned that the good ride does better comparisons
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


That'll do it!! 😂


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## Paxford (Jan 7, 2019)

What if they are actually the best of friends and just cooked this beef up because, ya know, controversy sells.

Ok back to reality …


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## RadDad801 (Dec 7, 2020)

NT.Thunder said:


> Interesting, what did you post out of interest sake?


I just asked why he put the Surfari on the top 5 Freeride list and Excavator on the pow list. He replied that he would rather ride the Excavator in pow which is a perfectly fine response. Then a few days later I noticed the question had been deleted.


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

RadDad801 said:


> I just asked why he put the Surfari on the top 5 Freeride list and Excavator on the pow list. He replied that he would rather ride the Excavator in pow which is a perfectly fine response. Then a few days later I noticed the question had been deleted.


Wow, the Excavator must be good in pow


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## RadDad801 (Dec 7, 2020)

NT.Thunder said:


> Wow, the Excavator must be good in pow


I was hoping to find out yesterday, but had other obligations. ☹
I’m just hoping the 162 was a good choice for me. (210 lbs).


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

RadDad801 said:


> I was hoping to find out yesterday, but had other obligations. ☹
> I’m just hoping the 162 was a good choice for me. (210 lbs).


Let us know how you go, have you ridden the Surfari out of interest?


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## RadDad801 (Dec 7, 2020)

I have not. I just retired my Burton Barracuda.


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

A board (and brand, for that matter) that I never see mentioned here is Venture. I have a *Venture Storm* (splitboard) and it's great in powder. I also like the Never Summer Swift, but that board gets plenty of attention (these are the only powder boards that I have experience with). The Venture Storm deserves some, IMO. Looks like Angry Snowboarder has a review video of it.


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