# Helmet Danger. Does Safety Make Us Stupid?



## AcroPhile (Dec 3, 2010)

Well, there was another fatality inbounds today in Colorado and like most other inbounds fatalities the rider was wearing a helmet. So what's with the disproportionate amount of deaths involving skiers/riders? Are beginners more likely to wear a helmet and also more likely to crash due to inexperience? Or are helmet wearers lulled into a false sense of security and ride more recklessly than they would have if they were not wearing one? IMO, it's the latter. In my experience, all my friends who always wear helmets regularly bump their helmets on something in the event of a fall or crash and the talk about how lucky they were to be wearing a helmet. Me on the other hand, I never wear a helmet. I have been riding since I was in the sixth grade (I'm 25 now) and in all that time I have only hit my head once snowboarding and that was during my first year of riding. I feel that people who do not wear helmets tend to be more careful to not injure themselves while riding and more mindful of the way they fall (if possible). Anyone concur or am I way off on this one? What does this mean for any future legislation or rule changes mandating helmet use at resorts?


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## jdang307 (Feb 6, 2011)

My friends who started with a helmet hit their heads all the time. I now wear a helmet but started without one. I think the mind is very powerful and subconsciously protects your body


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## cjcameron11 (Feb 5, 2011)

I too started snowboarding NOT wearing a helmet but i decided to buy one for that off chance that it might save me from serious injury. So now that i wear one i do not feel i ride any differently in fact i believe i am still cautious and ride within my abilities. Obviously i can't speak for others but i believe that most people wear helmets as a preventative measure and i would assume that they would not ride a double black as opposed to their regular blue runs just because they have a helmet on.

In fact i still don't think i will wear one all the time but i did mainly get it so i could start getting into jumps and park some more, if i wasn't going into that i probably wouldn't wear one.


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## AlexS (Feb 12, 2010)

You go big while wearing a helmet, sure sometimes too big thinking it's a lifesaver. I don't know if you're bragging about not wearing a helmet or saying wearing one is wrong but you'd be dumb to do either. I hope for your sake you do start wearing a helmet if you're doing any difficult riding


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

You know most serious injuries and fatalities happen on greens and blues and less in the park or on blacks right? Helmets have their place it's individual users that are stupid. I'm from the generation that grew up with helmets are uncool yet I wore one in the late 90's early 00's then stopped then wore one again, then stopped, and now I'm going back to one. They save lives for sure but they aren't some invincibility cloak to protect you from anything. I remember when I blew my spleen apart in 02 and I quote this verbatim from the doctor, "if you were wearing a helmet this wouldn't have happened!" OK Doc how would an internal injury behind my stomach have been prevented by this. That right there shows the stupidity behind things.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

I forget what the exact number is but if you are traveling over 15-20 mph and take a square blow to your head, a helmet is not going to make a difference. You can't make a helmet to protect against that. It would have to be huge. For glancing or low speed impacts they are great. 

They add a measure of protection, but that's about it. People need to get realistic.


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

I remember reading that once mandatory seat belt legislation was brought in that people started driving faster because they felt safer. Same thing happened with air bags. Same thing in states/provinces where motorcycle helmets are mandatory. But here's the thing -- In none of those cases did the increase in risk-taking come even close to netting out the benefits of the safety devices. It only reduced the overall statistical benefit slightly. Overall, by a HUGE margin, we're better off with seatbelts, airbags, and mandatory seatbelt helmets. I'd bet it's the same with snow-sport helmets.


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## slyder (Jan 18, 2010)

AcroPhile or anyone, the people dying, what are their injuries???
Head trama or blunt force to the torso??

I know the helmet for me is just like a seatbelt. I feel safer but don't do stupid things because I'm wearing a helmet. I consider it part of the equipment to do this sport, much like pads in football. I would think this is a similar case for most riders.


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## AlexS (Feb 12, 2010)

slyder said:


> AcroPhile or anyone, the people dying, what are their injuries???
> Head trama or blunt force to the torso??
> 
> I know the helmet for me is just like a seatbelt. I feel safer but don't do stupid things because I'm wearing a helmet. I consider it part of the equipment to do this sport, much like pads in football. I would think this is a similar case for most riders.


Exactly but you always have the exception who think theyre empowered by their pea brains and the freak accidents..


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

Today was massive facial and brain trauma.... All others have been torso trauma this year. Keystone is having a rough year.....


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## AcroPhile (Dec 3, 2010)

Don't get me wrong, I understand the value of helmets. I ride a motorcycle and I would NEVER get on my bike without one no matter how short of a distance I am driving. Also I understand that riding park has a whole other set of factors to consider in terms of safety and helmets are key. As everyone knows it doesn't take much of an impact to the head to kill a person. However, the statistics don't lie. Most people that lost their lives were wearing helmets (and riding groomers for the most part). There are plenty of noobs and people that have no idea what they are doing as well as advanced riders and experts that do not wear helmets. They, however, don't seem to be equally represented in a proportionate amount of fatalities.


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

I'm not gonna lie. I try way more shit and go way crazier with a helmet on. To me it's just using what you have to get better. If you were in a race and had Nos wouldn't you use it to win. I know my helmet gives me some more protection and I'm gonna use that advantage to get better. Why not?


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

btw that is strictly park I'm talking about there^


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

You're going to die.


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## rfrich74 (Jan 18, 2012)

As far as bumping your head more with a helmet vs. without, your body is VERY aware of how big it is. For your entire life your body has known exactly how big your head is and subconsciously keeps it from banging against stuff. Now you add 1" to the size of your melon on all sides and your body just doesn't adjust to the extra size. So where your brain would have told your neck how much to tense up to keep your head from hitting something before, your helmet smacks into something before your body stops your head from moving. Our bodies are amazing at allowing everything to move and flex the maximum amount to avoid blunt force trauma but stopping things just short of smacking into things. If you are traveling in a certain direction and your shoulder impacts the ground first your brain knows exactly how much your body can "give" before your head smacks the ground and makes the adjustments. Of course it can only react so fast and thats when you still get the bad injuries. If you want to test it put on your helmet or a hard hat and crawl around in a confined space. I guarantee you will bang that thing off everything around. Take the protection off and you will hit your head a lot less.

All this being said, I wear a helmet in whatever sport I participate it. No it will not protect me from my brain slamming into my skull at higher speeds, but it will protect from some of the head injuries that can occur at lower speeds.


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## Cycle4Fun (Feb 22, 2012)

Donutz said:


> ...Overall, by a HUGE margin, we're better off with seatbelts, airbags, and *mandatory seatbelt helmets*.


I want one of those.

I pictured little helmets covering my chest strap as I drive down the highway.

Seriously though, it's no different than when I wear a helmet road or mountain biking. In 8 years I'm on my 4th helmet. 3 from mountain biking with incidental contacts like the top of a low branch, or just a hard fall. One from a nasty road crash at 20mph. I went down sideways scraping my hip and shoulder pretty well. I had a choice as my head was going for the pavement. Either my jaw and cheek hit the road and scrape along, or my helmet. I chose the helmet. Giro had me send that one too them for analysis.

I would suggest that most people who own their own equipment wear helmets now. The mountain looks very different from 10 years ago.


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## cjcameron11 (Feb 5, 2011)

rfrich74 said:


> All this being said, I wear a helmet in whatever sport I participate it. No it will not protect me from my brain slamming into my skull at higher speeds, but it will protect from some of the head injuries that can occur at lower speeds.


Even basketball? Jks

But I disagree with your statement about wearing a helmet and hitting it more, no reason other than I have never seen any evidence of this written anywhere (and no I haven't read up on the subject) people wear shit on their heads from kids onwards and u expect us to believe that the body is so retarded that it says oh oh something on head can't judge distance anymore.......c'mon man


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

Cycle4Fun said:


> I want one of those.
> 
> I pictured little helmets covering my chest strap as I drive down the highway.
> .


:laugh: I'm not going to edit that out. That deserves to be preserved. NARF!


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

cjcameron11 said:


> Even basketball? Jks


Definitely need to wear a helmet in volleyball! I got my first concussion while playing volleyball-- I got hit in the head by a football  . Not kidding. Two assholes were tossing a football around in the gym while we were playing, and they weren't very accurate... Next thing I knew I was standing at my locker wondering how I got there.


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## rfrich74 (Jan 18, 2012)

cjcameron11 said:


> Even basketball? Jks
> 
> But I disagree with your statement about wearing a helmet and hitting it more, no reason other than I have never seen any evidence of this written anywhere (and no I haven't read up on the subject) people wear shit on their heads from kids onwards and u expect us to believe that the body is so retarded that it says oh oh something on head can't judge distance anymore.......c'mon man


Unless you spend way more time than the average person wearing a helmet no your body won't adjust. Think about it, most people do something where they wear a helmet for a few hours MAYBE once a week. You could up that to 2-3 times a week and you still spend way more of your life without the helmet than with. I don't care if you have been wear a helmet for 20+ years in everything you do. If it's only for a few hours 1-2 times a week you are not going to adapt. Apparently you have never been involved in anything g that required you tower a helmet, i.e. football, construction, etc.

I doubt you will find any reading on it. It is purely anecdotal evidence, but I have observed it throughout my life and a few others just in this thread have mentioned it so I don't think you can discount the validity.


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## forestfalcon (Jan 5, 2012)

It's not helmets that are killing people. Putting one on your head does not give you instant common sense and immunity to anything that comes your way...you still have to use the thing that the helmet is protecting...


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## MarshallV82 (Apr 6, 2011)

Most the people who have died this year were beginners or intermediates riding well above their level. Correct me if Ii'm wrong, But not one person has died from a terrain park incident in CO this year.


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## AcroPhile (Dec 3, 2010)

MarshallV82 said:


> Most the people who have died this year were beginners or intermediates riding well above their level.


Would they have been riding more carefully or more appropriately for their skill level if they were not wearing a helmet? :dunno:


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## MarshallV82 (Apr 6, 2011)

AcroPhile said:


> Would they have been riding more carefully or more appropriately for their skill level if they were not wearing a helmet? :dunno:


Who knows... maybe beginners feel a little more confident with a helmet, I really don't.. It always hurts to fall! :dunno:
I never used to wear helmets, but over the last 4-5 years I've actually got the point where I enjoy wearing them, it just feels cozy.


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## TBomb (Dec 29, 2010)

I didn't wear a helmet when I started off...spent a lot of time eating it and banging my head on the hardpack. Now that I'm more experienced and eating it is a rarity, I wear a helmet every time. I'm a good snowboarder, I can go down the hill fast and with complete control of myself, but I can't control everyone else around me and you never know what can happen. I don't think the helmet makes me take more risks, but I do think it helps keep me safe :dunno:


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## cjcameron11 (Feb 5, 2011)

rfrich74 said:


> Unless you spend way more time than the average person wearing a helmet no your body won't adjust. Think about it, most people do something where they wear a helmet for a few hours MAYBE once a week. You could up that to 2-3 times a week and you still spend way more of your life without the helmet than with. I don't care if you have been wear a helmet for 20+ years in everything you do. If it's only for a few hours 1-2 times a week you are not going to adapt. Apparently you have never been involved in anything g that required you tower a helmet, i.e. football, construction, etc.
> 
> I doubt you will find any reading on it. It is purely anecdotal evidence, but I have observed it throughout my life and a few others just in this thread have mentioned it so I don't think you can discount the validity.


Well i did play lacrosse for many years and i ride motorbikes as well as mountain bikes, skateboards, snowboards etc. By that logic everyone who wears shoes should stub their toes more, or people who wear cowboy hats would be knocking them off walking through doorways everyday, soldiers hitting their heads on light fittings everyday not to mention all of the muslims who wear head pieces al the time.

I understand what you are saying but i disagree with the flawed idea of your body not knowing how to deal with wearing an item of clothing. Its ok to disagree and I'm not flaming you i just disagree with the entire concept.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

Snowolf had a very appropriate response to the exact same question as the OP, however it was last week to the avy deaths in the PNW and avy danger, not helmets. 

In regards to helmets:

Basically you have a huge proportion of the population that will get beyond beginner level, but progress very VERY VERY fucking LITTLE into intermediate territory. This MASSIVE slice of the pie of people at the resort creates a crowd of over-confident, under-experienced missiles with steel on their feet and plastic on their heads. 

No amount of raw talent or skill can help people who are in this crowd.

SLOW THE FUCK DOWN.

I've been riding slower and there is alot of time to get better now.

knock on wood


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

rfrich74 said:


> Unless you spend way more time than the average person wearing a helmet no your body won't adjust. Think about it, most people do something where they wear a helmet for a few hours MAYBE once a week. You could up that to 2-3 times a week and you still spend way more of your life without the helmet than with. I don't care if you have been wear a helmet for 20+ years in everything you do. If it's only for a few hours 1-2 times a week you are not going to adapt. Apparently you have never been involved in anything g that required you tower a helmet, i.e. football, construction, etc.
> 
> I doubt you will find any reading on it. It is purely anecdotal evidence, but I have observed it throughout my life and a few others just in this thread have mentioned it so I don't think you can discount the validity.


Muscle memory your body gets used to wearing it therefore it compensates. Without muscle memory we wouldn't be able to do spinny flippy tricks all the time when we want. I know hard concept to understand but unless you ride a lot you wouldn't. 



MarshallV82 said:


> Most the people who have died this year were beginners or intermediates riding well above their level. Correct me if Ii'm wrong, But not one person has died from a terrain park incident in CO this year.


There's been 2 terrain park deaths in the 6 years I've lived in CO both at Breck. Both fucking retards deciding that hitting a 45 foot jump for the first time was a good thing. Most people it's off the groomed run into a tree boom blunt force trauma.


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## The_Bully (Nov 11, 2011)

Its called Risk Compensation, people taking more risk when they feel safer. This is a flaw in human nature and not helmets. Helmets will definitely save for people from injury when hitting a certain speed or height on jumps but they become useless after a certain speed and height. 

First few year I snowboarded I didn't wear a helmet and never hit my head but fell a lot. I have years of martial arts training where you learn to fall and not hit your head and maybe it helped. However when I progressed into the blue runs and wanted to hit some jumps/park riding I got a helmet. The 1st jump I did was maybe a 1 foot bump going across the run (not downhill) I didn't expect my board to give out from under me and I fell hard and hit my head. Also also went of a ledge this weekend and my front end just got buried in snow and I went feet over head and bumped again. I have also been hit a bunch of time by people putting the lift safety bar on my head (assholes).


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## JamesX (Feb 26, 2012)

One of the reason I bang my head more on the ground with a helmet is because it makes my head heavier, so on a surprise heel edge catch it is harder to keep my head tucked in. 

I disagree that helmet makes you take more risks. That may apply to people who lacks self-control or awareness, but I wear helmet to manage my risks. True if I don't have a helmet I wouldn't be as diligently in trying to learn the heel to toe turn - because I know I will fall [consistently]. That doesn't mean the helmet is what enables this "risky" behavior. It is more like helmet is what makes this necessary learning step safe.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

JamesX said:


> One of the reason I bang my head more on the ground with a helmet is because it makes my head heavier,


LOL wtf thats crazy talk! Funny tho :laugh:


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## losib3257 (Mar 20, 2011)

I agree that a helmet will help, but like many have said, you can expect it to be a bullet proof vest for your dome. I wear one, but I don't go off 60 foot kickers with it. I know my ability and know something like that is not smart even with a helmet.

I always remember though, broken bones heal, but a brain injury does not.


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## BarrettDSP (May 10, 2009)

I wear a helmet now so I dont have to hear my wife bitch Im gonna kill myself when riding and it makes her think I'm safer on the mountain. :laugh:


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

BarrettDSP said:


> I wear a helmet now so I dont have to hear my wife bitch Im gonna kill myself when riding and it makes her think I'm safer on the mountain. :laugh:


Not only is this QFT, but I use this same excuse for alot of my gear... "I need those big spherical goggles so I can see skiers trying to hit me" etc 

Fit the new helm into the budget pretty quick after I cracked my last one. FWIW my new BERN HardHat is like 100x better then my Red Avid was in a million ways. Number one of course being how my mom stitched a speaker kit into the liner and it looks better than the factory version on other lids.


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