# Bataleon Surfer - 154 vs. 159 ???



## Decade190 (Feb 26, 2012)

jherg said:


> Hi there -
> 
> I'm torn between which size to get for the Bataleon Surfer - 154 or 159.
> 
> ...


Why not save a huge amount of cash and get the party wave?
more volume and float for that japan pow anyway, probably more pop in the tail too which you'll be used to on a d.o.a.


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

You won't have a problem with the 159 for treeruns either, it's a quick turning swallowtail. For spring slush I prefer other boards.


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## goldmember (Feb 3, 2017)

Hi there. I'm the same weight as you and got the Surfer in 159. After using in handful of times I've got to say this board is all hype and I regret spending $900. 
I start with the flex; to my knowledge (and liking) powder boards, directional camber or not, should have stiffer tail than nose. The Surfer though is very soft in the tail. The swallowtail is cut super deep which makes it even softer.
3D (3BT) is ok for jibbing, but in pow it almost takes away the lift from the nose. TBH it's a park board with powder shape. (?)
Also, the sintered base is very soft. I've put scratches in it riding over some ice!
It's still a fun board for euro carving (Tyler Chorlton!!!) on slush or groomers but I would look elsewhere for powder specific board. Just my 2c


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## aldenowens (Jan 6, 2014)

You may want to consider this board in 153cm for local and Japan pow it will do everything you need. 

https://telossnowboards.com/products/telos-back-slash-rated-radical?variant=15213356122230

The 2019 Telos Back/Slash Snowboard Review - The Angry Snowboarder


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

goldmember said:


> Hi there. I'm the same weight as you and got the Surfer in 159. After using in handful of times I've got to say this board is all hype and I regret spending $900.
> I start with the flex; to my knowledge (and liking) powder boards, directional camber or not, should have stiffer tail than nose. The Surfer though is very soft in the tail. The shape is fun to look at but that's it, the swallowtail is cut super deep which makes it even softer.
> 3D (3BT) is maybe ok for jibbing, but in pow it almost takes away the lift from the nose. TBH it's a park board with powder shape. (?)
> Also, the sintered (apparently) base is very soft. I've put scratches in it riding through ice!
> It's still a fun board for euro carving (Tyler Chorlton!!!) on slush or groomers or but I would look somewhere else for powder specific board. Just my 2c


Looking at the specs on this board it has a pair of carbon strips either side of the nose and the tail which you would think would stiffen the board up. The Archetype has a similar carbon strip layout in the tail but not in the nose. I was thinking about grabbing this board but the owner reviews seem a little mixed.


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## goldmember (Feb 3, 2017)

Craig51 said:


> Looking at the specs on this board it has a pair of carbon strips either side of the nose and the tail which you would think would stiffen the board up. The Archetype has a similar carbon strip layout in the tail but not in the nose. I was thinking about grabbing this board but the owner reviews seem a little mixed.


Carbon strips or none, flex is below medium. 4 on Bataleon scale.


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## LeDe (May 16, 2018)

Just back from a week in Japan where I rode a Mind Expander for 5 days in some pretty tight trees at time. Loved the board! 
I dont have much reference as I have not ridden many board but the Mind Expander is light, quick and just about the flex I want, playful but not soft. 
I rode my Hovercraft split a couple of days, and they are really quite different. The Mind Expander is a powder tree board, it turns so quick and float so long. I could see the difference with some other guys on flatter section, they were just thinking about keeping speed where I kept playing around. 
I ll try to write a review over the weekend.


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## aldenowens (Jan 6, 2014)

LeDe said:


> Just back from a week in Japan where I rode a Mind Expander for 5 days in some pretty tight trees at time. Loved the board!
> I dont have much reference as I have not ridden many board but the Mind Expander is light, quick and just about the flex I want, playful but not soft.
> I rode my Hovercraft split a couple of days, and they are really quite different. The Mind Expander is a powder tree board, it turns so quick and float so long. I could see the difference with some other guys on flatter section, they were just thinking about keeping speed where I kept playing around.
> I ll try to write a review over the weekend.


What size Mind Expander were you on, and was it the perfect size?


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## LeDe (May 16, 2018)

aldenowens said:


> What size Mind Expander were you on, and was it the perfect size?


I was on the 158. I am 83kgs, 1.8m and a size 11US. This is definitely the right size.


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## aldenowens (Jan 6, 2014)

LeDe said:


> I was on the 158. I am 83kgs, 1.8m and a size 11US. This is definitely the right size.


Practically identical size and weight. Looking forward to your review on how this board rode in Japan.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

TJ's review. Sit back and relax:nerd:


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## rogerthat (Jan 26, 2019)

aldenowens said:


> LeDe said:
> 
> 
> > I was on the 158. I am 83kgs, 1.8m and a size 11US. This is definitely the right size.
> ...





Craig51 said:


> TJ's review. Sit back and relax<img src="http://www.snowboardingforum.com/images/SnowboardingForum_2015/smilies/tango_face_glasses.png" border="0" alt="" title="Nerd" class="inlineimg" />


How does this compare to a fish!??


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

'20 surfer looks pretty damn sweeeeet.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

rogerthat said:


> How does this compare to a fish!??


You'll have to wait 10 months. I will be taking both BS 159 and Fish 161 as well as Dump Truck 163 to Hokkaido next year. The fish is a brilliant board in powder. I fell in love with it straight away.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

2020 Bataleon Surfer and Surfer Ltd.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

My 159 '20 Surfer has arrived in Australia and is in the post at present. The owner took some snaps for me. No black other than graphics...., just a totally white board.


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

Craig51 said:


> My 159 '20 Surfer has arrived in Australia and is in the post at present. The owner took some snaps for me. No black other than graphics...., just a totally white board.


:dropjaw: :crazy7: :crazy2: :crazy1: :snowplow: :tongue4: :10:


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## buller_scott (Jun 10, 2018)

Decade190 said:


> Why not save a huge amount of cash and get the party wave?
> more volume and float for that japan pow anyway, probably more pop in the tail too which you'll be used to on a d.o.a.


The Party Wave that I had was pretty underwhelming - to my mind, why not funnel that $600aud into a proper board? Long sidecut + soft flex + camber functionality being robbed by 3BT..... 



goldmember said:


> Hi there. I'm the same weight as you and got the Surfer in 159. After using in handful of times I've got to say this board is all hype and I regret spending $900.
> I start with the flex; to my knowledge (and liking) powder boards, directional camber or not, should have stiffer tail than nose. The Surfer though is very soft in the tail. The swallowtail is cut super deep which makes it even softer.
> 3D (3BT) is ok for jibbing, but in pow it almost takes away the lift from the nose. TBH it's a park board with powder shape. (?)
> Also, the sintered base is very soft. I've put scratches in it riding over some ice!
> It's still a fun board for euro carving (Tyler Chorlton!!!) on slush or groomers but I would look elsewhere for powder specific board. Just my 2c


Thanks for the review - interesting to get an opinion that counters the hype! 



LeDe said:


> Just back from a week in Japan where I rode a Mind Expander for 5 days in some pretty tight trees at time. Loved the board!
> I dont have much reference as I have not ridden many board but the Mind Expander is light, quick and just about the flex I want, playful but not soft.
> I rode my Hovercraft split a couple of days, and they are really quite different. The Mind Expander is a powder tree board, it turns so quick and float so long. I could see the difference with some other guys on flatter section, they were just thinking about keeping speed where I kept playing around.
> I ll try to write a review over the weekend.


Interesting... I've shortlisted the ME for Japan next year. 

How does it carve [both in chop and on perfect groomed]? I'm looking for something that floats well AND can carve up a storm when the pow has been tracked out. 

Oh, and bombing? Is it alright, or does it get squirrelly?


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## buller_scott (Jun 10, 2018)

Craig51 said:


> You'll have to wait 10 months. I will be taking both BS 159 and Fish 161 as well as Dump Truck 163 to Hokkaido next year. The fish is a brilliant board in powder. I fell in love with it straight away.





Craig51 said:


> My 159 '20 Surfer has arrived in Australia and is in the post at present. The owner took some snaps for me. No black other than graphics...., just a totally white board.


Nice! Are you gonna ride it in Aus at all? I was toying with the idea of getting one, but I there's a lot on the shortlist [Mind Expander, Marhar Sasquatch, or something Japanese from Murasaki in 
Pivot - Japanese boards are fcking light]


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

buller_scott said:


> Craig51 said:
> 
> 
> > You'll have to wait 10 months. I will be taking both BS 159 and Fish 161 as well as Dump Truck 163 to Hokkaido next year. The fish is a brilliant board in powder. I fell in love with it straight away.
> ...


Probably just save it for Japan. Got enough boards for Australia: Custom, Custom X, Archetype, Vapor. Really too many.


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## JDA (Feb 10, 2016)

buller_scott said:


> Interesting... I've shortlisted the ME for Japan next year.
> 
> How does it carve [both in chop and on perfect groomed]? I'm looking for something that floats well AND can carve up a storm when the pow has been tracked out.
> 
> Oh, and bombing? Is it alright, or does it get squirrelly?


I rode a 158 ultra ME back to back with my 151 K2 simple pleasures last weekend at Perisher in what felt like spring slush/snow, I'm 85kg. The K2 is more locked in on the carves giving lots of confidence to lay it right over if you wanted, it can do either short or long drawn out carves with ease. The ultra ME can also carve but initiation was not as easy and it seemed to prefer a wider turning circle, less confidence inspiring, not quiet as locked in, back foot feels more loose and good for slashing. The stance was a little wider on it than I like and I only did a couple of runs so take these comments with a grain of salt as they say.


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## buller_scott (Jun 10, 2018)

Craig51 said:


> Probably just save it for Japan. Got enough boards for Australia: Custom, Custom X, Archetype, Vapor. Really too many.


No such thing as too many, even in Aus! Okay, question: it's snowed.... 10cm's overnight, on top a lovely cold-cum-warmish base yesterday, that's been groomed this morning. You're doing your thing, in the car on the way up the hill, then you see the groomed perfection on Front Valley and start to lose your shit with excitement, getting everyone in the car pumped as fck. What's your go to deck for laying waste for carving?



JDA said:


> I rode a 158 ultra ME back to back with my 151 K2 simple pleasures last weekend at Perisher in what felt like spring slush/snow, I'm 85kg. The K2 is more locked in on the carves giving lots of confidence to lay it right over if you wanted, it can do either short or long drawn out carves with ease. The ultra ME can also carve but initiation was not as easy and it seemed to prefer a wider turning circle, less confidence inspiring, not quiet as locked in, back foot feels more loose and good for slashing. The stance was a little wider on it than I like and I only did a couple of runs so take these comments with a grain of salt as they say.


Thanks for your take! TBH I'm thinking of the normal ME as opposed to the ultra - I've got it in my head that tighter carves and more run use are a way to get better value per run, in this world of increasing numbers of snowsports people [where at least in Aus, runs are being flooded with assholes who ski/snowboard as a function of looking cool to their friends on Insta, rather than actually enjoying snow sports]. 

Wow... wider turning circle on a ME, given that super tight sidecut - that's an interesting [and appreciated, respected] take - do you reckon that this might have been bettered if you'd had the board set up with your preferred stance, or are you thinking that the ME just wasn't "there" for you as much as you'd like?


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

buller_scott said:


> Craig51 said:
> 
> 
> > Probably just save it for Japan. Got enough boards for Australia: Custom, Custom X, Archetype, Vapor. Really too many.
> ...


Love the Custom the most really for our Aussie shit conditions. Archetype is a pretty good carver as well. I just got onto a few pretty mintish 2009 Burton Vapors that I'll give a workout this season.


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## JDA (Feb 10, 2016)

buller_scott said:


> Wow... wider turning circle on a ME, given that super tight sidecut - that's an interesting [and appreciated, respected] take - do you reckon that this might have been bettered if you'd had the board set up with your preferred stance, or are you thinking that the ME just wasn't "there" for you as much as you'd like?


It was my mates board so I had to run the stance he had which was about 55mm wider than what I prefer and noticeably too wide for me. Probably a combination of that and the extra stiffness of the ultra ME.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

Received my Surfer 159 today. Feels really light under arm (3050 grams). WTF....., made in the UAE.

Gave it a good wax up straight away. Never done a 3BT board before. A lot more difficult getting the iron into all the angles over a standard flat based board. Will fit this board up with Genesis X Re-Flex. Looks a pretty sweet deck.


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## sush1 (Sep 26, 2017)

buller_scott said:


> No such thing as too many, even in Aus! Okay, question: it's snowed.... 10cm's overnight, on top a lovely cold-cum-warmish base yesterday, that's been groomed this morning. You're doing your thing, in the car on the way up the hill, then you see the groomed perfection on Front Valley and start to lose your shit with excitement, getting everyone in the car pumped as fck. What's your go to deck for laying waste for carving?
> 
> Thanks for your take! TBH I'm thinking of the normal ME as opposed to the ultra - I've got it in my head that tighter carves and more run use are a way to get better value per run, in this world of increasing numbers of snowsports people [where at least in Aus, runs are being flooded with assholes who ski/snowboard as a function of looking cool to their friends on Insta, rather than actually enjoying snow sports].
> 
> Wow... wider turning circle on a ME, given that super tight sidecut - that's an interesting [and appreciated, respected] take - do you reckon that this might have been bettered if you'd had the board set up with your preferred stance, or are you thinking that the ME just wasn't "there" for you as much as you'd like?


ME is flat right? I wouldn't want anything flat for carving tbh. I have been enjoying my yes ghost for carving at perisher so far this year. I think yes makes some nice carving boards that hold up well in Australia with the slight side cut disruption for our icy mornings. But then things often get so slushy in the afternoons that full mag gets too grabby for me.

I'm very keen to try a super pig in aus this year, think it could be nice - carving, floating on slush, boosting side hits / jumps.


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## buller_scott (Jun 10, 2018)

Craig51 said:


> Received my Surfer 159 today. Feels really light under arm (3050 grams). WTF....., made in the UAE.
> 
> Gave it a good wax up straight away.


Speaking of waxing and tuning - what tune have you got on your S3???? 



sush1 said:


> ME is flat right? I wouldn't want anything flat for carving tbh. I have been enjoying my yes ghost for carving at perisher so far this year. I think yes makes some nice carving boards that hold up well in Australia with the slight side cut disruption for our icy mornings. But then things often get so slushy in the afternoons that full mag gets too grabby for me.
> 
> I'm very keen to try a super pig in aus this year, think it could be nice - carving, floating on slush, boosting side hits / jumps.


Hey man sorry for the late reply. One of the reasons I've been thinking flat, is because I was talking to a guy in a shop in Japan [when I was helping my mate buy his board], and the guy was very keen on flat-to-rocker shapes for surfy carving. His words, translated, were along the lines of "Yes, camber is best for carving, but these shapes are boards that you can carve the shit out of, but relax and play when you want to ride light-heartedly".

No, they'll never be as "bomb" oriented or stable as something like a CustomX, but after that incident I couldn't help but notice how many locals were rocking boards with set back, flat-to-rocker, tight sidecuts and noticeable taper etc.

And I thought I used to have fun on the cat-tracks when I lived there [snow groomers used to make little bumps and side hits - you could literally do cat-track runs all day and never get bored, even as a mostly park rider], but these "snow surfer" dudes [around 15 of 'em in single file, one behind the other] were carving up a storm, slashing up banks, popping side hits etc - it just looked fun!

Superpig would be interesting - have you ridden the regular Warpig? Part of my brain things tighter, shorter carving is where I'll likely be going in future [hence my thinking Jones ME or otherwise Field Earth or Death Label carvers from Japan].

Oh sht... I've gotta register for Demo Day! I'd be interested to try Warpig, Yes Y, Yes Hybrid, Jones ME and Hovercraft, Salomon Taka, MAYBE Nitro Woodcarver [although Nitro products don't really appeal to me because Lukas Huffman isn't their poster boy anymore haha]


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

buller_scott said:


> Craig51 said:
> 
> 
> > Received my Surfer 159 today. Feels really light under arm (3050 grams). WTF....., made in the UAE.
> ...


Gee you've got a pretty astute eye for detail. APR stage 1 232kw 4.9sec 0 to 100kmh. That's plenty enough.


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## buller_scott (Jun 10, 2018)

Craig51 said:


> Gee you've got a pretty astute eye for detail. APR stage 1 232kw 4.9sec 0 to 100kmh. That's plenty enough.


Not a bad snow rig! Or is the S3 parked behind an SQ5 with APR stage 2+? :grin:


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

buller_scott said:


> Craig51 said:
> 
> 
> > Gee you've got a pretty astute eye for detail. APR stage 1 232kw 4.9sec 0 to 100kmh. That's plenty enough.
> ...


Nah it's too little to drive from Newie to the snow with all our gear. Can't fault the Q5 for long distance cruiser comfort and economy/power from 3.0 turbo diesel. It's only stage 1 as well.


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## buller_scott (Jun 10, 2018)

Craig51 said:


> Nah it's too little to drive from Newie to the snow with all our gear. Can't fault the Q5 for long distance cruiser comfort and economy/power from 3.0 turbo diesel. It's only stage 1 as well.


That'd be a shit-ton of torque, and "only" Stage 1 is fine, given your experience / knowing the roads and conditions etc. - you'd have plenty on tap.

I need a snow car. Renaultsports don't like chains


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

buller_scott said:


> Craig51 said:
> 
> 
> > Nah it's too little to drive from Newie to the snow with all our gear. Can't fault the Q5 for long distance cruiser comfort and economy/power from 3.0 turbo diesel. It's only stage 1 as well.
> ...


You'd be okay......, the friendly and diligent staff at Buller would have a VIP car park reserved waiting for your arrival


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## sush1 (Sep 26, 2017)

buller_scott said:


> [


Have ridden the regular warpig yeah. Only thing for me is that no camber means there's not much spring out of the turn unless you get it from the tail of the board. It's a different style of riding I guess. I really liked my warpig though anyway. Carving is interesting though, quite different to a camber board.


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## buller_scott (Jun 10, 2018)

Craig51 said:


> You'd be okay......, the friendly and diligent staff at Buller would have a VIP car park reserved waiting for your arrival


HAHA you haven't been to Buller have you? Season park entry pass holders have to wait in line behind all the people lining up for day entry passes, to have their sticker sighted by the staff. Season pass veterans of 10+ years are treated the same as the Hiaces full of literally thousands of day trippers who are at the snow solely to buy Churros and walk around the village asking restaurant staff for free hot water to put in their cup noodles. 



sush1 said:


> Have ridden the regular warpig yeah. Only thing for me is that no camber means there's not much spring out of the turn unless you get it from the tail of the board. It's a different style of riding I guess. I really liked my warpig though anyway. Carving is interesting though, quite different to a camber board.


Liked? Why did you get rid of it - looking for that snap out of a turn? 

Definitely want to try a Warpig now, hopefully back to back with a Yes Hybrid at demo day.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

buller_scott said:


> HAHA you haven't been to Buller have you? Season park entry pass holders have to wait in line behind all the people lining up for day entry passes, to have their sticker sighted by the staff. Season pass veterans of 10+ years are treated the same as the Hiaces full of literally thousands of day trippers who are at the snow solely to buy Churros and walk around the village asking restaurant staff for free hot water to put in their cup noodles.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Sounds like Victorian ski resorts have a funny understanding of Customer Service.:surprise:


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## buller_scott (Jun 10, 2018)

Craig51 said:


> Sounds like Victorian ski resorts have a funny understanding of Customer Service.:surprise:


Want more? 
---When my friend asked a customer service representative [they call themselves "lifties" here, and forget that their job is... to serve the fcking customer] "Why hasn't even Family Run been groomed? It's Saturday..", the response was "how are they meant to groom when they're just getting up the hill now, after a big night last night?" - it was 11am.
---Lift line for a chair was icing up BAD - it was on a beginner run, and novices were slipping over EVERYWHERE in the lift line, it was pretty much sheet ice. I tell the customer service rep "lifty" that they need to chop it up because people are falling over, he replies "Nah man, you've got to learn to ride in all kinds of conditions" - Yeah, because THIS is precisely the kind of thing that people spend thousands of dollars and travel internationally to do - to slip over in lift lines while the lifties smoke, dance to music and act like dude-bros.
---NO crowd control - perfectly normal to see chairs go up with 1 or 2 people, when there are literally 400 people in the queue. Customer service reps too busy talking about last night's coma-inducing drinking, who fucked who [for all the kids in the lift line to hear], hanging out and catching up and dancing and hugging because oh-my-god-so-good-to-see-you-I-haven't-seen-you-in-like-totally-two-hours, etc.
---The list goes on. 

It's a joke. Falls is better, I'm guessing Hotham would be decent too.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

buller_scott said:


> Craig51 said:
> 
> 
> > Sounds like Victorian ski resorts have a funny understanding of Customer Service.<img src="http://www.snowboardingforum.com/images/SnowboardingForum_2015/smilies/tango_face_surprise.png" border="0" alt="" title="EEK! Surprise!" class="inlineimg" />
> ...


Falls always looks really good on cams. I've only ever done NSW as it's a few hours longer to get there. 7 hours is long enough rather than 10 from Newie to Vic Alps. We own a house down Crackenback so sort of locked into NSW (Thredbo and Perisher) for our winters really ....., then Japan in the summer. Lifties are pretty good in NSW.


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## frankyfc (Aug 11, 2017)

buller_scott said:


> The Party Wave that I had was pretty underwhelming - to my mind, why not funnel that $600aud into a proper board? Long sidecut + soft flex + camber functionality being robbed by 3BT.....
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Ah damn. I was looking at the party wave!
You ride it in powder? Has such good reviews from @BurtonAvenger


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## RIDERUK (Oct 22, 2014)

Craig51 said:


> Received my Surfer 159 today. Feels really light under arm (3050 grams). WTF....., made in the UAE.
> 
> Gave it a good wax up straight away. Never done a 3BT board before. A lot more difficult getting the iron into all the angles over a standard flat based board. Will fit this board up with Genesis X Re-Flex. Looks a pretty sweet deck.


Ridden it yet? 
How’s it compare to your fish? You on the 161 fish?


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