# help needed going straight on heel side



## taz (Sep 27, 2019)

Hi, I´m having some trouble going straight on my heel side, usually you don't go straight downhill, but sometimes in flat narrow paths is just about going straight . I can do it on my toe edge, but when I change to my heel edge, the board start to turn, I dont know if its the pressure on my feet, my knees, or my shoulders, but something in making the board turn, I´ve already tried different thing but cant figure it out. Any advice will be really appreciated, and if there's any video you can point to, that would be fantastic, 
thanks a lot !!


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

Just get more weight over the front foot and align your shoulders with the board.


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

You need to keep your base flat and do what Rip154 said. Yeah it will be sketchy at first and you'll probably catch an edge and slam a few times.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

u will only catch an edge if:

you have not weighted the nose

you have not aligned your shoulders and hips to the board

more info than you evar thought
https://www.snowboardingforum.com/t...73690-scorpioned-while-flat-basing-now-i.html


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

It is possible that when you're going heelside, you're lifting the toes on one foot more than the other. This results in torquing the board, which is a legitimate way of turning when you do it on purpose. If you're doing it accidentally, you're probably not centered fore/aft.


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## taz (Sep 27, 2019)

thank you very much for the replys!! I´v been trying today , and probably is a bit of all the things that you said, I noticed some improvement by the end of the day. I have a shoulder alignment problem, when I look over my shoulder I kinda twist my upper body, even If I don´t want to, lack of flexibility or something. Also tried to put more weight on the front foot, an specially not lifting my toes, @Donutz I think you nailed it on that , I was totally unaware , in my head switching to heelside was started by lifting the front foot toes, but what I´m actually doing is starting a turn, wich is good to avoid catching an edge, that's why probably I always done it like that, but of course is not good for going straight. 
will continue working on it tomorrow, if you guys have any other ideas, let me know, everything is appreciated !
thanks !!


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

taz said:


> thank you very much for the replys!! I´v been trying today , and probably is a bit of all the things that you said, I noticed some improvement by the end of the day. I have a shoulder alignment problem, when I look over my shoulder I kinda twist my upper body, even If I don´t want to, lack of flexibility or something. Also tried to put more weight on the front foot, an specially not lifting my toes, @Donutz I think you nailed it on that , I was totally unaware , in my head switching to heelside was started by lifting the front foot toes, but what I´m actually doing is starting a turn, wich is good to avoid catching an edge, that's why probably I always done it like that, but of course is not good for going straight.
> will continue working on it tomorrow, if you guys have any other ideas, let me know, everything is appreciated !
> thanks !!


I really had to think about how I do this, but on very flat tracks when I'm trying to go straight where I have to be on my heel edge, my front foot is slightly heel heavy and I'm steering a bit by twisting the boards with the back foot. Sometimes there's slight pressure on my back toes.

It's really difficult to stay straight if you're going slow too, which is most people's problem. It's not that you get this magic slow speed turning ability, you just learn how to steer with a minimum of digging in the edge so you can maintain your speed and blow past the newbies who are sliding sideways because they aren't going fast enough to make small corrections.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

^yup depends on yer speed...faster is better that way you can be on a gentle edge and just make a very long/elongated S shaaaape. Or if slow, just lay the board flat, weight yer nose and adjust your body rotation...(even just by slightly positioning/pointing yer leading hand slightly over heelside or toeside. Or better yet just relax yer knees, ankles...have your hips/shoulders aligned and slightly weight yer nose.

As your original post notes...having your head turned looking over your lead shoulder makes you go heeledge...don't turn yer head or only do it briefly. Part of learning the finer parts and thus progression is that...you need to learn to isolate various body parts and how it effects your board. So that as you progress to an advanced level you can integrated these isolated body part movements into effective and efficient use of those body parts/movement as a whole.

Just realize there are different ways to do this...Dr Blast is referring to torsionally twisting the board by heel pressure on the front foot and toe pressure on the rear foot. Or you can also do the opposite...toe pressure on the front foot and heel pressure on the rear foot.

However, in general, you want to get your hips and upper body positioning/rotation alignment sorted because it effects all kinds of things as you progress. If you are not aware, find the creepy basement vid...lol


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## taz (Sep 27, 2019)

I´ll have to work on weighting the nose, and also going more "flat" helped ... speed is definitely a factor, i guess if exactly the same turning motion is applied to the board, when going faster you travel more distance before needing to change edges, but sometimes in crowded or really flat tracks thats not possible, thats why I wish to straighten my path. 




wrathfuldeity said:


> As your original post notes...having your head turned looking over your lead shoulder makes you go heeledge...don't turn yer head or only do it briefly.


I see the point, but how am I supposed to look where I go ? sometimes when no one´s ahead I try to ride looking to the front of my body instead of where I go (not twisting the neck at all), to feel the board really aligned, and of course it goes much straight, not torsioning, but its not posiible most of the times when you need to look where to go



wrathfuldeity said:


> However, in general, you want to get your hips and upper body positioning/rotation alignment sorted because it effects all kinds of things as you progress. If you are not aware, find the creepy basement vid...lol


found it! creepy indeed but very revealing ..in many ways, there are some pretty good advices there, the hip motion to keep the back straight ... that's gonna be usefull, never considered it like that. 

thanks guys !!


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

taz said:


> I see the point, but how am I supposed to look where I go ? sometimes when no one´s ahead I try to ride looking to the front of my body instead of where I go (not twisting the neck at all), to feel the board really aligned, and of course it goes much straight, not torsioning, but its not posiible most of the times when you need to look where to go


It comes with exercise. Hundreds of repetitions will make your body parts move independently at one point. Teisting neck, even twisting upper body can be compensated with knees/feet so the board still goes straight. But for that, you need to develop independent body movements, i.e. the muscle memory in your legs need to build up so legs/toes automatically react and level out what the upper body does.

So while you exersise your mini adjustments with toes and getting weight over the nose as drblast mentioned to keep a straight line (which probably will make you tense from all the concentration on this), also put in some short exercise of independent movements to loosen up again. Search for a slope in nice pitch where you won't be too fast but also not too slow, and go straight, but turn ur body left n right, look uphill, over your shoulder, bend down, straighten up, hop, swing your arms, etc. Increase those odd movements slowly, to not get thrown off balance. All the while ur upper body does those odd movements, ur feet/heels/knees should still keep your board in the same direction. It'll take time, but at dome point, it will work.


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## taz (Sep 27, 2019)

Allright, sounds good ! the best part here is that practice is fun!


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## MCrides (Feb 25, 2019)

That old thread on this is an interesting read, but IMO it's asking the wrong question. We shouldn't be asking "is flat-basing possible?" Of course it's possible, especially for advanced riders and specific applications. The question we should be asking is, "is flat-basing advisable for newer riders?"

9 times out of 10 when this comes up, it's because a newer rider is asking how to go straight. These riders would be better served learning how to subtly pressure their edges than by learning how to flat-base; pressuring edges is THE basic snowboarding skill that will rapidly unlock the mountain, while flat-basing is an advanced, niche skill with limited application.


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## MCrides (Feb 25, 2019)

Also, here's a lol for you from that thread:

"we aren't skiers worrying about turns"

WTF man.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

MCrides said:


> That old thread on this is an interesting read, but IMO it's asking the wrong question. We shouldn't be asking "is flat-basing possible?" ...


Uhm... i thought this thread is all about how to keep a straight line *on* heel edge... :chin:


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## MCrides (Feb 25, 2019)

“That old thread”

I’m talking about the thread linked by wrathfuldeity on the first page. Forum won’t let me quote it for some reason.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

McSir you are correct...*"is flat-basing advisable for newer riders?"* of course it is "NO." However a mere "no" does not educate the knob as to why or how not to punish them selves....however its entertaining to watch them. 

A lot of noobs want "how do I go straight on heel side" and a host of other nobbish questions...usually there are several methods and actions that will allow them to go straight or whatever.

The underlying reality is that the newbs "does not know what they don't know." In the case of going straight on heelside...the knob does not know that because of the side cut of the board, it is inherently not designed to go straight and likely does not understand the mechanical concepts or even the vocabulary of how to counter the inherent design to carve. WE have all been the knowBEE.

Anyhows...merely linked an old thread for nobee's in hope to expand his education, entertainment and appreciation for the historical and diversity of solutions to "a simple question".


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

wrathfuldeity said:


> Anyhows...merely linked an old thread for nobee's in hope to expand his education, entertainment and appreciation for the *historical* and diversity of solutions to "a simple question".


Omg Wrath... historical, indeed . 
Too funny to go throught that old thread again. Too funny to discover how I posted in there that I only just begun to exercise flatbasing and only yet dare for few meters and for gods sake, only with a certain board profile :laugh: while nowadays, it became so second skin no matter what profile, sober or hungover, I can't even figure out how exactly it works. 

Q.e.d., OP, lol. Keep on riding and exercising and having fun. It all comes with time on slope.


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

To be honest... I've never really thought about it. I just sort of "_Go_" straight. :shrug: I do way more thinking about making all the various turns while riding. 

I'll try to pay attention to this situ this coming season and see if I notice anything I do in particular to stay in a straight line.


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

OK, so here's a question I've tried experimenting with and am still unsure about. On a long, flat cat track that I get stuck on and have to skate sometimes, will I glide further/faster flat basing or on edge? 

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## bazman (Jan 15, 2017)

smellysell said:


> OK, so here's a question I've tried experimenting with and am still unsure about. On a long, flat cat track that I get stuck on and have to skate sometimes, will I glide further/faster flat basing or on edge?
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


If you have a nicely waxed base then flat base will normally be faster. Relax, keep legs slightly bent, shoulders in line with board, weight a bit over front foot and enjoy the ride.

You can also pump the board to generate speed on shallow cat tracks. On downward slopes when going slow crouch down low on board then stand up as quick as you can by pushing down on the board. You will get a little boost like in Mario Kart

Its possible in certain situations to generate speed from carving by using power in legs and board, but needs technique and energy


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

What works for me is bending the front knee a little bit more and align the shoulders. This makes it easier to alternate between toe and heel side pressure. When you twist the board the front or the rear side part of your edge/sidecut will engage making the board turn. Not just because you put it on a carving edge, but because the friction is different front and rear on one side.

So if my nose is starting to swivel/slide to the left I press my front toe and rear heel and align my shoulder slightly more to the right. (I'm a regular).


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## MCrides (Feb 25, 2019)

WD: sure, don't disagree with anything you've said there. IMO, the first response to someone asking how to go straight should be "learn to pressure your edges." If we then want to burn 13 forum pages arguing about the mechanics of actual flat-basing, I'm in--just want to get the important stuff out of the way first.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

smellysell said:


> OK, so here's a question I've tried experimenting with and am still unsure about. On a long, flat cat track that I get stuck on and have to skate sometimes, will I glide further/faster flat basing or on edge?
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


In part, it depends on the snow conditions, more specifically the temp of the snow and the resulting friction and the correct wax. There is perhaps some physics involved that someone like @Snowdaddy could explain. But for moi in general...ice/colder snow temp--flat basing is faster, on softer warm and sucky slush being on edge is faster and fresh cold...who cares but best to have the correct wax.

edit: the real trick is to see/feel the snow/condition/temp and change your edge/flat. For example at the hill there is about 1/3 mile of flat and at times there is sun and shade and you get warm and ice so its best to change it up whether your in the sun or shade. Some days I will practice my 1 footy...so cruising in to the flat section, I'll release my rear foot to between the bindings incase I need to skate...but try to get through the whole section just riding 1 footy. Anyway this really forces me to pay attention to alot of things like stacking, alignment/rotation, keeping my ankles, knees and hips loose. And if the area is relatively empty, I try to look at the various chutes that drop in to this area instead of the flat track...kind of like trying to ride blind and let your propriceptive body awareness do its thing.


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## rayt100 (Aug 29, 2016)

wrathfuldeity said:


> u will only catch an edge if:
> 
> you have not weighted the nose
> 
> ...


I skimmed through the long thread and it was interesting. Most of the guys don't post anymore, well it was mainly one guy arguing with the pod


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

wrathfuldeity said:


> In part, it depends on the snow conditions, more specifically the temp of the snow and the resulting friction and the correct wax. There is perhaps some physics involved that someone like @Snowdaddy could explain. But for moi in general...ice/colder snow temp--flat basing is faster, on softer warm and sucky slush being on edge is faster and fresh cold...who cares but best to have the correct wax.
> 
> edit: the real trick is to see/feel the snow/condition/temp and change your edge/flat. For example at the hill there is about 1/3 mile of flat and at times there is sun and shade and you get warm and ice so its best to change it up whether your in the sun or shade. Some days I will practice my 1 footy...so cruising in to the flat section, I'll release my rear foot to between the bindings incase I need to skate...but try to get through the whole section just riding 1 footy. Anyway this really forces me to pay attention to alot of things like stacking, alignment/rotation, keeping my ankles, knees and hips loose. And if the area is relatively empty, I try to look at the various chutes that drop in to this area instead of the flat track...kind of like trying to ride blind and let your propriceptive body awareness do its thing.


The pressure under the board turns snow into water and that water will create more friction. The faster you go the more opposing force you will experience. Colder snow will have less liquid and more ice and also be more difficult to turn into liquid. Putting the board on edge will focus the force on a smaller area and thus increasing pressure. Meaning... producing more friction in colder conditions or on certain board bases. At least this is a qualified guess...

Without overthinking this I think it's just as you say. It depends on the snowconditions and your base. One simply has to try it and see what happens. Sometimes (and maybe often) it's better to flatbase, and sometimes not.


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