# Foot Size for Burton Swath Step On (Beware, gross feet photos!)



## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

@Wiredsport , as per my other post https://www.snowboardingforum.com/s...ce-beginning-snow-boarding-3.html#post3361681 I've remeasured my feet and posted the photos below. You can see the bruising on my left big toe as a result of the 5 days snowboarding in size US 9.5 Burton Progression Rental Boots. Pardon the grotesque nature of the photos.

Left Foot: 27.3cm / 9.8cm
Right Foot: 27.1cm / 9.6cm

In the following picture the squares are each 0.5cm in size and the purple line is at 27cm and was checked with a ruler.










In the following pictures the squares are each 0.5cm and the purple line is at 10cm and was checked with a ruler.



















Base on these photos I believe I am Mondo size 275 and am therefore correct in going for US Size 9.5 ? As my feet seem fairly similar in size I am hopeful that this means the Burton Step On Swath boots (Imprint 3 liners) could be viable assuming they are comfortable when I try them on.

thoughts?

TheSalamander


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

TheSalamander said:


> @Wiredsport , as per my other post https://www.snowboardingforum.com/s...ce-beginning-snow-boarding-3.html#post3361681 I've remeasured my feet and posted the photos below. You can see the bruising on my left big toe as a result of the 5 days snowboarding in size US 9.5 Burton Progression Rental Boots. Pardon the grotesque nature of the photos.
> 
> Left Foot: 27.3cm / 9.8cm
> Right Foot: 27.1cm / 9.6cm
> ...


Hi,

Please show your entire foot and the wall in your images. Please also reverse your foot for the width measurement and measure against the wall as below. 

Please measure your foot using this method:

Kick your heel (barefoot please, no socks) back against a wall. Mark the floor exactly at the tip of your toe (the one that sticks out furthest - which toe this is will vary by rider). Measure from the mark on the floor to the wall. That is your foot length and is the only measurement that you will want to use. Measure in centimeters if possible, but if not, take inches and multiply by 2.54 (example: an 11.25 inch foot x 2.54 = 28.57 centimeters). For width please place the inside (medial side) of your foot against a wall. Please then measure from the wall out to the widest point on the lateral (outside) of your foot.


STOKED!


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi,
> 
> Please show your entire foot and the wall in your images. Please also reverse your foot for the width measurement and measure against the wall as below.
> 
> ...


Trying again. Same as before re: graph paper. Purple line is at 27.0cm and the squares are in 0.5cm increments










For the width the purple line is at 10.0cm and the squares are in 0.5cm increments



















thanks

TheSalamander


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

TheSalamander said:


> Trying again. Same as before re: graph paper. Purple line is at 27.0cm and the squares are in 0.5cm increments
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Hi,

Your foot is Mondopoint 270 or size 9 US in snowboard boots. You are a Standard D width. 

STOKED!


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

Thank you. Perfect timing on the response as I was on my way to my local ski/snowboard store. They had one pair of Ruler Step Ons left in stock which were a size 9. I tried them on and they fitted snug but well. I was very tempted to buy them as they are on discount, but really want the Swath Step Ons instead. 

Having confirmed the size fitted I put myself down for the Swath Steps Ons in size 9 for next season. 

I also bought the GNU Carbon Credit 156 I was after. So a successful day!

TheSalamander


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## SlvrDragon50 (Mar 25, 2017)

TheSalamander said:


> Thank you. Perfect timing on the response as I was on my way to my local ski/snowboard store. They had one pair of Ruler Step Ons left in stock which were a size 9. I tried them on and they fitted snug but well. I was very tempted to buy them as they are on discount, but really want the Swath Step Ons instead.
> 
> Having confirmed the size fitted I put myself down for the Swath Steps Ons in size 9 for next season.
> 
> ...


How big is the discount? Might be better off getting the Rulers and then taking the savings towards stiffer boots next year when these pack out.


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

Just under $100 if I recall, which is pretty good considering very few places have them in stock. However I don't have any more snow days left this season and I would rather have the double boa, Imprint 3 liner and slightly softer flex of the Swaths. I'm going to get a set of Snowboard Addiction training bindings in the interim so I can at least spend the next few months focusing on my cereal box and other things mentioned in the 'Scary Basement video'.

Thanks to all for the input, looking forward to next season.

TheSalamander


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## SlvrDragon50 (Mar 25, 2017)

TheSalamander said:


> Just under $100 if I recall, which is pretty good considering very few places have them in stock. However I don't have any more snow days left this season and I would rather have the double boa, Imprint 3 liner and slightly softer flex of the Swaths. I'm going to get a set of Snowboard Addiction training bindings in the interim so I can at least spend the next few months focusing on my cereal box and other things mentioned in the 'Scary Basement video'.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Oh wow. If it's just under $100 I would definitely pick the up Rulers. That's a sweet deal. Speedlaces are actually really nice. I find that they hold their tension better than Boa. I don't think you will see much difference between the Impritn 2 and 3 liners. 

The rulers are really quite soft and honestly wouldn't want to go any softer unless it's park. 

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## LALUNE (Feb 23, 2017)

SlvrDragon50 said:


> The rulers are really quite soft and honestly wouldn't want to go any softer unless it's park.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


That's pretty much the incorrect myth all beginner shares. You don't need stiff boots just for responsiveness/support or whatever you think stiff boots bring you unless you are over 200lbs.


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## SlvrDragon50 (Mar 25, 2017)

LALUNE said:


> That's pretty much the incorrect myth all beginner shares. You don't need stiff boots just for responsiveness/support or whatever you think stiff boots bring you unless you are over 200lbs.


I mean people always say that by look at most people on this forum, nearly everyone wants to go to a stiffer boot. We're not using like 10/10 stiff boots but the ruler is absurdly soft. I never said he NEEDS the stiffer boot, but nearly everyone ends up WANTING a stiffer boot. 

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

I appreciate the different viewpoints and the Rulers at the discounted price are definitely tempting. 

My thinking at present is that many places recommend the Burton Moto (Boa or non-Boa) as beginner boots and they are Flex 2 - albeit some have mentioned about durability issues. The Rulers are Flex 6 with Imprint 2 and single Boa whereas the Swath are Flex 5 with Imprint 3 and dial Boa. 

I'm also assuming, perhaps incorrectly, that Burton may tweak the design slightly for 2020 based on the learnings from 2018 and 2019. From a money perspective if I get two seasons out of the Swath (30-35 days each season) then I'll be more than happy to then replace them with Photon Step Ons or whatever offerings DC has by then with the Step On system.

TheSalamander


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## LALUNE (Feb 23, 2017)

SlvrDragon50 said:


> I mean people always say that by look at most people on this forum, nearly everyone wants to go to a stiffer boot. We're not using like 10/10 stiff boots but the ruler is absurdly soft. I never said he NEEDS the stiffer boot, but nearly everyone ends up WANTING a stiffer boot.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


So you just assume he wants everyone else wants? What if he wants some correctness rather than widely spread misconception?


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## SlvrDragon50 (Mar 25, 2017)

LALUNE said:


> So you just assume he wants everyone else wants? What if he wants some correctness rather than widely spread misconception?


You have got to be kidding me. Is that really the conclusion you drew? Are you really going to tell me that people aren't allowed to want stiffer boots and that stiff boots are misconception? Yea, I'm assuming that he might want stiffer boots in the future because that's what a very good majority of people want. Who are you to tell them that they don't want stiff boots? I for sure feel WAY more comfortable in my stiffer boots knowing my ankle is better supported with my history of repeat ankle sprains. Tell the hardboot snowboard slalom guys that stiff boots are a misconception and they can get by with soft boots. There is absolutely nothing wrong with using the evidence that most snowboarders do want to get stiffer boots as they progress whether it's for support or response.

Regarding my advice to him, did you even see the scenario laid out? We're talking about $100 Rulers vs $ an estimated $320 for Swaths. I'm not suggesting he gets Burton Driver X or some insanely stiff boots. Hell, the difference between the Swath and Ruler is probably negligible at the end of the day. The primary differences are Imprint 2 vs 3 and single boa vs dual boa. 

See here for difference between Imprint 2 and 3: 



 Granted it's from a Burton salesman, but it still highlights the differences.
Take the difference and upgrade the insole and you're already almost at the Imprint 3. And moreover, the Imprint 3 insole still might not even support your foot well. Many of us here are getting insoles in any boot we get (or just move them from boot to boot).

Now dual boa vs single boa: arguably a big difference. Is it worth $220? That's debatable. Now look at it from this perspective, will you go back out to the mountain? If yes, how much does it cost to rent a boot each time you go out now that you have your own board. The savings rack on quick from not having to rent gear and not to mention the learning experience will be MUCH better using the same gear over and over again.


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

Just to respond as I appreciate the dialogue and differing viewpoints. The slightly under $100 discount is for the Ruler boots/bindings combined, apologies if this was unclear. So this would mean instead of $549.90 for the Ruler/binding combo it is more like $470 (I don't recall the exact discounted price as it was applied separate to the boots and bindings). I am assuming that the 2020 Swath/binding combo next year will sit between the Ruler and Photon $649.90 price so presumably the Swath boot/binding bundle will be $599.90.

Before I realized the Swaths were coming out in 2020 I was going to buy Photons as they have a pseudo 2 boa system, however based on being a beginner and being ok with spending the $599.90 I will most likely wait until next season and buy the Swath bundle. However if at the end of the month the Rulers are still in the store and they can offer a bigger discount it may be enough to make me go that route.

I don't expect to get anymore snow time this season, particularly due to family commitments and available vacation days. I went to the store a couple of weeks before my March 6th snowboarding trip as my wife was buying skis/boots. At the time I thought I was a size 9.5 or 10 boot, which they didn't have. If I had realized I was a size 9.0 (based on the WiredSport directions) I could have been tempted to buy a board/boots then - albeit that would have been a little crazy. Luckily for March our ski resort has discounted rentals.

Either way I go, I think it will be a good set up for my requirements for the next two seasons after which I'll be more experienced in knowing what it is I am after.

Without the Step-On option I probably would have just stuck to skiing, so I am glad to see manufacturers innovating and continuing to find ways to grow the customer base.

TheSalamander


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## SlvrDragon50 (Mar 25, 2017)

TheSalamander said:


> Just to respond as I appreciate the dialogue and differing viewpoints. The slightly under $100 discount is for the Ruler boots/bindings combined, apologies if this was unclear. So this would mean instead of $549.90 for the Ruler/binding combo it is more like $470 (I don't recall the exact discounted price as it was applied separate to the boots and bindings). I am assuming that the 2020 Swath/binding combo next year will sit between the Ruler and Photon $649.90 price so presumably the Swath boot/binding bundle will be $599.90.
> 
> Before I realized the Swaths were coming out in 2020 I was going to buy Photons as they have a pseudo 2 boa system, however based on being a beginner and being ok with spending the $599.90 I will most likely wait until next season and buy the Swath bundle. However if at the end of the month the Rulers are still in the store and they can offer a bigger discount it may be enough to make me go that route.
> 
> ...


If it's only $100 savings then it's a completely different scenario. I would be comfortable buying $100 or so more for the dual boa. Give Edge of the World (828-898-9550) a call as I saw they are trying to clear out their Step On stock. Get an idea for what their price is on the Ruler + Binding combo.


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## LALUNE (Feb 23, 2017)

SlvrDragon50 said:


> The rulers are really quite soft and honestly wouldn't want to go any softer unless it's park.





SlvrDragon50 said:


> There is absolutely nothing wrong with using the evidence that most snowboarders do want to get stiffer boots as they progress whether it's for support or response.


I understand you enthusiasm about snowboarding, but like many of your other posts your opinion is from very limited knowledge and can be misleading sometimes.

There's absolutely nothing wrong with stiffer boots, but stiffness doesn't equal to better support/response, nor does softer boots mean park riding. Snowboarding boots stiffness is all about PREFERENCE, meaning you can do whatever you do in stiffer boots when you are in softer boots with your technique dialed (ruler not being soft either). And hardboot is a different sport.

All I am saying is, if you don't know what you are talking about, don't give advice.

As for the OP, I personally think speed lacing > dual boa > single boa and Ruler step on will be a great choice.


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

As a beginner the Boa system seems more appealing, although it may not be quite so good as the speed lacing. However I wouldn't be surprised that with a couple more seasons of experience that this view evolves and I end up with Speed Laces. While rental boots are not a fair comparison I can say categorically I hated doing the manual laces of the rental boots I had so that then leaves me with Boa or speed laces. And remember I am not a young kid, so convenience for me outweighs absolute performance when considering my requirements ;-)

The pro/con of going for the Step On system is that it really limits my boot/binding options therefore meaning I won't get lost in the vastness of the different brands/models/variations that are available with traditional bindings. *Assuming that the Step On boots fit me,* and so far from trying on some size 9 Ruler Step Ons it does seem promising, then my options for next season are:

Ruler - single Boa - Flex 6
Swath - dual Boa - Flex 5
Photon - dual Boa (sort of) - Flex 7
Ion - Speed laces + Boa - Flex 8

As a beginner I am therefore ordering the Swath and plan to get 2 seasons out of them (about 30-35 days each season). Assuming the boots meet my needs for the two seasons then I will be happy with my return on investment - i.e. bringing me into the world of snowboarding, helping me get to at least a reasonable level of competence while also having convenience factor including being able to readily ride alongside the rest of my family who ski.

By the 3rd season I'll be more experienced and able to determine whether to remain on the Step On route, go with more normal bindings or (worst case) return back to skiing. Assuming I remain a boarder and on the Step On route then I expect we'll see more offerings from Burton by then and also the DC Step On boots will have been launched. It could therefore be a natural progression to the Photons or Ions or the DC offerings. 

From a personal mindset perspective, I like to try the latest gadgets and things and I am sure I fit squarely into Burton's customer profile for the Step Ons. Ultimately time will tell whether the Step On system is a dead end or has a long future ahead of it. At least as a middle age beginner snow boarder it has made the difference for me between remaining a skier or becoming a new snowboarder. Anything that helps broaden the appeal of the sport and brings in new customers is a good thing in my view.

regards

TheSalamander


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

My experience is skinny and flat feet will need some wedging on the heels and better support insoles. It makes a huge difference.
As far as stiffness, I have moved to a medium to stiff ish flex boots and love them.


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## pointblank (Feb 26, 2015)

You might want to look into the hot spot issue with the step-ons before finalizing your size.

I get it sometimes but usually only on long runs (plus 5 minutes) but my buddy's got it pretty bad to that point that he is looking to get strap bindings next season. He got a size 10 with a snug fit.


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

Thanks, appreciate the feedback and insight.

regards

TheSalamander


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## pikm57 (Dec 28, 2017)

I had Rulers last season (standard version/not step on) and the flex wast perfect at the beginning. After 10 days of riding they went from stiffness 6 to 5 or maybe even 4 and become to soft (I have around 175 lbs). For this season I bought Photons which are little stiffer, but after a few days in them they fit perfectly, they become softer as well but not that much as Rulers did.


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

pikm57 said:


> I had Rulers last season (standard version/not step on) and the flex wast perfect at the beginning. After 10 days of riding they went from stiffness 6 to 5 or maybe even 4 and become to soft (I have around 175 lbs). For this season I bought Photons which are little stiffer, but after a few days in them they fit perfectly, they become softer as well but not that much as Rulers did.


What experience level are you and/or how many days/seasons have you been snowboarding, and do you go to the park or just down groomed runs etc? 

regards

TheSalamander


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## pikm57 (Dec 28, 2017)

TheSalamander said:


> What experience level are you and/or how many days/seasons have you been snowboarding, and do you go to the park or just down groomed runs etc?
> 
> regards
> 
> TheSalamander


I would describe myself as a strong advanced rider. I've been snowboarding for 10 seasons now. Last year for an example, I had 12 days on a snow (I broke my rib so it was an early end :frown I ride everything, if there is some fresh powder I would spend all day riding powpow and trees, otherwise I spend 1/3 of a day on a groomers and 2/3 in a park (some days I just lap the park all day long)


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

Just as a quick update on my thread from a few months ago. Earlier this week my Burton Swath Step Ons (size 9) arrived. Fit is good (tight but not painful) and the stepping on/off seems simple enough. I'm heading to my local ski/snowboard store this morning to have the liners heat molded. 

Thanks to the forum and WiredSport for educating me on correct boot fit etc.


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## Quasio (Nov 13, 2019)

How do you find the flex on the Swath?


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

I've been wearing them around the house every day since they arrived plus around 15 minutes each day on the board since my first snowboard trip isn't for another week. During this time the boots have definitely broken in somewhat and become more flexible. As I'm a beginner I'm fine with the flex, and the set up seems to compliment the GNU Carbon Credit well.

However, the difference in flex between first trying them and now is very noticeable. Probably fine for Park use or beginner/intermediate on groomers. More experienced riders, riders with a lot more weight and/or riders who like to go very fast probably should look to the Photons.


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

To help provide a visible example of the flex I've included a short video of me demonstrating the flex from today, after about 2 weeks of wearing them around the house. I typically average 1-2 hours a day wearing the boots and about 15-20 minutes or so doing some stance/flex practice on the board. I am wearing US size 9, I weigh around 150-155 lbs and am 5'9". The boots have much more flex now than when I first put them on. Depending how this season goes (planned for about 25-30 days on the snow) I could see me potentially upgrading to the Photon Step Ons either next season or the one after.






You can also see in the photo below which was taken just after the video that the top BOA is almost as tight as it can go. There is more opportunity to tighten the lower BOA.


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

I’ve done a 4 day vacation during Thanksgiving (snow not very good) and have just finished day 2 of a 15 day vacation where the snow is much better, albeit east coast so icier. Very pleased with both the Step On bindings and the Swath boots.
For me it is much quicker and easier to go once I get off the ski lift, and I am far less fatigued from not having to bend over as much etc. overall I find I am getting more runs down the mountain for the same amount of time - but I am a beginner so when I was using traditional bindings at the end of last season it probably isn’t a totally fair comparison. 

I find the boots comfortable enough to wear all day and while we have not yet had any super cold days I haven’t experienced any issues with cold feet. While I know it would be possible, I’ve not yet Stepped On at the exact same moment I get off the ski lift and just gone without stopping.

Overall very pleased and do not foresee me reverting back to traditional bindings for what I am after.

TheSalamander


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## ktcred (Jan 25, 2021)

@TheSalamander

This was a helpful thread; thanks for posting. My feet are just a tad bigger than yours, and I'm also looking at the Step Ons (and Photon boots). Now that over a year has passed, what is your official verdict on both the boot size (9US) and Step On bindings?

Should I make the investment?


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## TheSalamander (Mar 11, 2019)

Personally for me the Step Ons are awesome, I wouldn't have switched to snowboarding without them as I am older, don't want to sit on the snow or fall over doing up my bindings, and my kids/wife ski so I need to be quick of the lift. I am sure that Burton will continue to refine the concept over the coming years but for a beginner/intermediate or even advanced snow boarder I believe they work well and don't give up much in the way of compromise. Probably the trickiest thing at first is getting OUT of the Step Ons as you need to twist your foot slightly.

In terms of the sizing and comfort - With my feet the boots are comfortable, I can snowboard for a full day without discomfort so I guess I am fortunate in that I have 'Burton feet' - or at least close enough. I may get a pair of Photon Step Ons or other stiffer boot next year but will see. At the moment my snowboarding ability is still the limiting factor than anything to do with the boots/bindings/board.

I have seen a couple of snowboarders with the K2 Clicker bindings on the slopes, although I've not had a chance to ask them how they find them. I haven't looked but I assume by now there are some comparison videos/threads between the two since they take a different approach to solve the same 'problem'.

Are Step Ons/K2 Clickers necessary? No!... But as with many things in modern lift they add a convenience factor that some people, including me, prefer and the total cost of the StepOn binding/boot is not prohibitively more than a non StepOn binding/boot although you do have less options and are somewhat then locked into the system going forward.

As to whether you should make the investment, that's a tricky one, both in terms of how well the boots would fit YOUR feet, but also your snowboarding style and what you are looking for. Ultimately it is a subjective decision. I know from both this forum and elsewhere that a number of people have tried StepOns and not found them comfortable, not due to an issue with the boot/binding, but just the shape of their foot vs the space limitations of the boot/binding with the Step On cleats.

Hope this helps

TheSalamander


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