# Torsional Twist in Carving: Front foot vs Back foot Priority



## supern00b (Jan 27, 2020)

In this video, the instructor explains the difference between using the front foot and back foot for torsional edge change initiation. He prefers back foot leading the change, because he feels more edge lock than front foot leading. With front foot twisting first, he feels the board wash out a bit more when changing edges.

edit: I should add that he is talking about this in light of flexier boards.

Conceptually, this makes sense to me (in the context of changing edges by unweighting + relying on the front knee to drive the start of the turn), because this eliminates the moment of time where the rear foot is typically unweighted after the completion of a turn, and instead ensures that the rear foot edge is locked into the slope, when changing edges. Not sure if this relates if the rider doesn't unweight at all when changing edges (e.g. riding passively cross-over, or stiff like a cadaver).

Thoughts?


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

i dont really think bout this stuff, but been riding a bit without a highback on the back binding on a board with reverse directional flex (stiff front, med back), and that feels more locked in on a groomer, however that fits any theory. body position and board flex matters more, but of course you need to or can manipulate the flex throughout the edge to match turn radius, terrain and conditions. how you do it is style, how well you do it is skill.


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## supern00b (Jan 27, 2020)

Whoa, interesting. What made you do that?


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

well its nothing new, but started riding without highbacks in powder for awhile, when «everybody» was trying it, then we tried some on groomers and in the park aswell. think it was dirksen that used back binding highback only for something, so i tried that, but it felt more natural with only the front highback. think it makes more sense for slashing where you bone out the back foot.


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## supern00b (Jan 27, 2020)

Don't your heel turns suffer though?


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

not unless im tired or the conditions are bad. can still control the board with straps and the boot. of course catching an edge doing this stuff could end up being bad.


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## kimchijajonshim (Aug 19, 2007)

This is a pretty solid video about a pretty subtle change in technique. I'm Korean-American and can happen to understand it. I tried to the auto-translate function on Youtube captions and it butchered things pretty badly.

The jist of it is the rider saying he feels like he gets quicker edge purchase and can turn tighter when initiating the carve with back foot torsional twist. Personally I think this differs pretty dramatically based on shape. Some boards like to be driven off the backfoot (I notice this most dramatically with my Mosses, but also Koruas and some United Shapes). Others require more initiation off the front contact point, and you need to drive the weight forward. Just depends on the board.


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## supern00b (Jan 27, 2020)

kimchijajonshim said:


> This is a pretty solid video about a pretty subtle change in technique. I'm Korean-American and can happen to understand it. I tried to the auto-translate function on Youtube captions and it butchered things pretty badly.
> 
> The jist of it is the rider saying he feels like he gets quicker edge purchase and can turn tighter when initiating the carve with back foot torsional twist. Personally I think this differs pretty dramatically based on shape. Some boards like to be driven off the backfoot (I notice this most dramatically with my Mosses, but also Koruas and some United Shapes). Others require more initiation off the front contact point, and you need to drive the weight forward. Just depends on the board.


Thanks for the input. So I need to consider not just flex pattern, but board shape as well?


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

since shaping can determine flex, kinda? but you will feel taper and variations in sidecut. pretty much have to adjust to the board


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## Kijima (Mar 3, 2019)

Don't focus on your board, focus on your body movements instead and you will improve at a much faster rate.


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## kimchijajonshim (Aug 19, 2007)

supern00b said:


> Thanks for the input. So I need to consider not just flex pattern, but board shape as well?





Rip154 said:


> since shaping can determine flex, kinda? but you will feel taper and variations in sidecut. pretty much have to adjust to the board


This. Board construction is so multi-factorial trying to isolate some particular riding attribute down to one thing is basically impossible. Everything works in tandem. Waist width works with sidecut which works with camber profile which works with blend zone which works with nose and tail kick which works with some esoteric construction technique that no company actually takes the time to explain because it'd just confuse you further even if they did.

Best I can explain it is that I can just just "feel" how a particular board wants to be ridden. Some boards demand front foot input, some rear. Some you can just slap lazy skate ollies, some you need to really load up the tail to catch any air. Eventually you ride enough stuff and recognize patterns, but that takes years of practice and falling down.

Like @Kijima said, just focus on your riding and less on the equipment. You become a good enough rider, you can adapt to most anything.


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

Different boards ride differently depending on flex patterns. I use a back foot steer when things get tight and hairy. Front foot is my gas pedal. Many of us do this already without thinking.


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## supern00b (Jan 27, 2020)

Scalpelman said:


> Different boards ride differently depending on flex patterns. I use a back foot steer when things get tight and hairy. Front foot is my gas pedal. Many of us do this already without thinking.


I thought the rear foot was the gas pedal for carving?


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## Kijima (Mar 3, 2019)

I went out yesterday and played with this concept. I found it totally distracting to be thinking about my feet and the board, I also found that upper body rotation forces tortional board twist and trying to change the tortional twist from where my natural body positions were creating it was stealing my physical power/messing up my line of force. 

So i think tortional twisting of the board is certainly a thing we should be doing but not something we should focus on whilst riding, it should be (and will be) a by product of our body movements, so creating clean effective body movements is the goal once again. 
Stance angles play a big role in upper body rotation and upper body rotation plays a big role in tortional twist of the snowboard so peeps running FF stance are certainly twisting their boards a lot more than peeps running duck stance.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

supern00b said:


> He prefers back foot leading the change, because he feels more edge lock than front foot leading. *With front foot twisting first, he feels the board wash out a bit more when changing edges.*


That would only be the case if his body positioning isn't on point as well, so basically what Kijima ^ said. 

If you're riding one footed and you drive your front knee towards the heel edge and open your hips up, the back of the board will rotate out and you'll be side slipping. If you initiate the same turn just by pointing your front toes towards the sky the board will tilt on edge and use the sidecut to turn without the back washing out or rotating at all. 

I think turn initiation should be a smooth blend and combination of both of the above scenarios, because with your back foot strapped in as you're rotating that front knee, opening up the hips, and pointing your toes to the sky, you should also be pointing your rear toes up to help get angulation on the board and the whole edge to engage with the snow. If you're too aggressive with the front foot and lazy with the rear foot, yes the board will wash out.


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## lbs123 (Jan 24, 2017)

Malcolm Moore also has a detailed video on this topic, although more oriented on beginners teaching standard technique.


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## Kijima (Mar 3, 2019)

lbs123 said:


> Malcolm Moore also has a detailed video on this topic, although more oriented on beginners teaching standard technique.


I watched it and I agree, once you have falling leaf locked down you should stop thinking about twisting your snowboard


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

Don't get it twisted


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## Oldman (Mar 7, 2012)

kimchijajonshim said:


> Best I can explain it is that I can just just "feel" how a particular board wants to be ridden. Some boards demand front foot input, some rear. Some you can just slap lazy skate ollies, some you need to really load up the tail to catch any air. Eventually you ride enough stuff and recognize patterns, but that takes years of practice and falling down.
> 
> Like @Kijima said, just focus on your riding and less on the equipment. You become a good enough rider, you can adapt to most anything.


I agree that each board has a different feel as to how it want's to be ridden. I will often take two boards to the hill. Camber for the morning; hard & fast cord, switch up mid day for an RCR deck for the softer conditions. It always takes a run or two to dial into the second deck and it has so much to do with "feel". The subtle differences in pressure of both feet when turning is real, but nothing "radically different" in how I ride.


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

supern00b said:


> I thought the rear foot was the gas pedal for carving?


Clarification. I don’t try to steer the board with torsional flex when carving. It’s more of a freeride move. But yeah the faster I go the more I’m engaging the front of the board when carving.


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