# Having some trouble carving?



## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

Also used to a longboard's concave. The rocker isn't an issue, my main board is rockered concave. 

Back when I snowboarded, probably 4 years ago, I was much better. I guess I just got better at longboarding and my muscles forgot this stuff.

Funny thing, is that I learned to longboard because of me snowboarding well. Now I am forgetting to snowboard because of me longboarding well. The irony..


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

you gotta get some basics into the muscle memory

your back leg is the enemy


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

Snowboarding *isn't* longboarding. Regardless of similarities in stance, balance, etc. I can ride a snowboard but I can't longboard for shit. 

Take a lesson,... or three!! Learn the proper basics and progress from there. You'll enjoy your time on the hill a lot more that way.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

creepy basement vid


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## DaftDeft (Mar 7, 2016)

wrathfuldeity said:


> creepy basement vid


INCREDIBLY creepy.

But very helpful actually, I'm going to consciously try the (forever now in my mind) humping stance next time I go. Nice clear explanation of how to move to engage each edge. 

The outfit is like double creepy points too. What inspired this vid?


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Slipping and scratching over the snow comes from uncoordinated pressure distribution over the edge. Your first task is to learn/feel to follow the boards radius without disturbing the edgehold. (I do not skateboard, but I'm sure, the wheels can loose grip as well if you overdo movements; it just takes more cos the friction of wheels is bigger than the friction of an edge)

Actually, a small hill is a good place to get a feel for how to engage the edge for first carves. Start out going straight to get a bit speed, knees bent(!), centered weight, then induce a turn carefully/softly with your front foot. As soon as you feel that the edge grips the snow, try to follow with your weight, softly! (no ruddering, no overdo of movements, no leaning back), just slightly lean into the turn and wait for the edge doing its work. The board will glide along its radius and you will get a feel for what the "natural" radius of that board is. Do this many runs till you manage to "get a feel" for your board. Exercise these soft carves with different body positions (i.e. bit more weight on front foot, one timeinducing the turn with your ancles, one time only by leaning in with your weight, then with bit more speed and more tilt (more tilt to compensate for the additional momentum of the added speed, a.s.o.)

Once you manage to _follow_ that radius without you disturbing that movement, you can begin to influence the radius, i.e. do tighter turns at higher speed with more tilt and dynamic.


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## david_z (Dec 14, 2009)

SnowPenguin said:


> What do you guys suggest?


Get a lesson.


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## KIRKRIDER (Mar 18, 2008)

SnowPenguin said:


> I went to snowboard today. It was my first day in a few years.
> Two runs were open, the small hill and the bigger park hill. Of course I went to the smaller hill. I can take on bigger hills, so this hill was way too small. It gave me some insight on what I need to improve though.
> 
> So I have one problem. That's turning and carving.
> ...


Snow conditions? Try with fresh snow or at least later in the day. Invest in butt-protection especially while you learn. Try different binding angles. Try more.


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## goalieman24 (Aug 28, 2009)

SnowPenguin said:


> On a longboard, you turn by putting your weight on the heelside or toeside of the board. Yep, that means my full weight.
> 
> Tried doing that here, didn't work well. Caught the edge and slammed down on my tail bone. Whatever. I thought I would learn quickly.


Put more weight on the edge. 
If you're catching edges there's too much weight on your downhill edge and not enough uphill. Weight on the uphill edge makes you turn.


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

No, I won't get a lesson. I can teach myself. That's how I learned to skateboard, longboard, wakeboard, and ski. 

I realize snowboarding isn't longboarding, but they do cross over. At least that is my only explanation of why I was great on longboarding first day.

Thanks for the help guys, I'll watch the video and try what you guys said. Especially neni's advice, that looks like it will help a lot

EDIT:
Do you only use one foot to initiate a turn? I'm regular so it would be my left foot. Or is it left foot for going left, right foot for going toeside/right?


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## Kenai (Dec 15, 2013)

SnowPenguin said:


> No, I won't get a lesson. I can teach myself. That's how I learned to skateboard, longboard, wakeboard, and ski.
> 
> I realize snowboarding isn't longboarding, but they do cross over. At least that is my only explanation of why I was great on longboarding first day.
> 
> ...


#ohtobe13again 

You initiate a turn with your front foot. As you are regular that means your left foot; if you are riding switch it is your right foot. One big difference between snow and skate is that you can literally twist your board so sometimes your feet are doing slightly different things.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

focus on the front knee/foot and let the trailing foot/knee follow...but don't swish it about.

initiate the turn with the front knee and shift hips toward the nose to weight the nose...weight on the front foot

during the middle of the turn, weight will be equal on both feet...but knees more deeply bent, i.e., squatting with straight back...and moving your center of gravity over the heel or toeside edge

finishing the turn...weight on the back foot...while then moving your cog/body to weight on the nose

realize that real carving is an advanced skill and it takes several years for most folks to do it well...took me like 10 years to really get it down


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

A combinations of instruction and practice is by far the best way to progress.


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## dfitz364 (Jan 10, 2014)

SnowPenguin said:


> *No, I won't get a lesson. I can teach myself. That's how I learned to skateboard, longboard, wakeboard, and ski.*
> 
> I realize snowboarding isn't longboarding, but they do cross over. At least that is my only explanation of why I was great on longboarding first day.
> 
> ...


This is hands-down the worst mentality you can have. If you were going to try and be good at basketball, would you listen to your coach? Or would you say, "nah, I've already taught myself to swing a baseball bat and play hopscotch, I'll teach myself to shoot a basketball. Cause after all, you have to move your arms to swing a bat, and jump to play hopscotch. They are basically the same."

Everything you mentioned above is very little like a snowboard. You don't turn a longboard by using both of your feet to leverage and steer the board. Similar? Sure. Does one help with the other, "carving" wise? No. 

No one is suggesting you go to the beginner's lessons on the bunny slope, but a good instructor who knows how you want to progress would do wonders with improvement. Best of luck continuing to learn to carve. There is great advice through this thread, just don't completely count out quality coaching.


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

DaftDeft said:


> What inspired this vid?


This. About 100 times every season:



SnowPenguin said:


> I went to snowboard today. It was my first day in a few years.
> Two runs were open, the small hill and the bigger park hill. Of course I went to the smaller hill. I can take on bigger hills, so this hill was way too small. It gave me some insight on what I need to improve though.
> 
> So I have one problem. That's turning and carving.
> ...


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

SnowPenguin said:


> No, I won't get a lesson. I can teach myself. That's how I learned to skateboard, longboard, wakeboard, and ski.


As someone who is self taught - and now has to spend a _huge_ effort on overcoming bad habits burnt deep into muscle memory - I'd strongly suggest to get lessons and lean it the _right_ way right from the beginning w/o the danger of doing it wrong many years. It will only accelerate your progression curve.

I _know_ that I have a wrong body position to get to the next level of carving. But by the live of me, I cannot correct it. All my innate movements only just lead to this wrong result which keeps me from getting better. I'm pretty sure that it's a basic mistake but I may never find out cos I'm too stupid/lazy/occupied/suspicious-abt-the-young-age-of-those-coach-kids/insert-other-lame-excuses to take a lesson... (ah well, maybe this year...!)


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

david_z said:


> Get a lesson.


Entered the thread just to type that ^

So yeah.... get a lesson.


Oh just read you dont want to take a lesson.

Well, good luck then.


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

one thing about carving, is that you commit to following the arc of your board's curve and you don't get in the habit of disengaging your edge to convert to a slide to scrub your speed. I see people do this all the time. you have to control the shape of your turns to avoid objects (including other people) and to avoid gaining so much speed that you can't control it anymore. It really takes a lot of effort mentally to balance all the things going on: from how the physics of it is affecting your board and body to the changing speed and directions of all the other riders around you. You have to be able to avoid a collision. You have to be able to look ahead and judge the snow (scraped-off areas of ice, especially) to be able to determine where your edge will hold and where it may not. If more skiers/boarders learned how to carve, the snow on the slopes would not get scrapped down to ice the way it often does, so it's great to see people develop an interest in this type of turning. We see a lot of people never progressing past slide turns, especially on steeper terrain where the leverage you have with both feet on one board allows an enormous amount of snow to be scrapped off and pushed down the hill. This is especially potent on heelside turns. The worst example IMO is the "falling leaf" habit taught and/or practiced by some.

Once you learn how to do this properly, you may be able to experience g-forces that feel like those you get when riding a roller-coaster. Sometimes when I go into a toeside at the bottom of my favorite run, I feel enough g-forces to make my quads scream out in agony.. there is nothing else like it!


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## david_z (Dec 14, 2009)

SnowPenguin said:


> So I have one problem. That's turning and carving...


no, your two problems are that you don'tknow fuck all about what you're talking about, and you're refusing advice from knowledgeable people.



SnowPenguin said:


> Do you only use one foot to initiate a turn? I'm regular so it would be my left foot. Or is it left foot for going left, right foot for going toeside/right?


you're light years away from "carving" by even the loosest definition. this question has proved that much. you don't know the basics of terminology let alone the coordination or right actions to take while on your board.


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

david_z said:


> no, your two problems are that you don'tknow fuck all about what you're talking about, and you're refusing advice from knowledgeable people.
> 
> 
> you're light years away from "carving" by even the loosest definition. this question has proved that much. you don't know the basics of terminology let alone the coordination or right actions to take while on your board.


I'm a teen and even I don't act like a pissy bitch. 
In skating and longboarding, carving is practically cruising and getting in sharp and deep turns. 

I am not refusing advice. I am taking advice from others with my arms open. However, when it comes to people like you I'd rather object them than take their advice.

Next time, try to be a bit nicer. Simple as that. 


And for the people telling me to get lessons, it's not like refusing advice from a coach. Because lessons cost money, additional to the cost of a board and equipment. A coach comes with paying for the basketball team. 

I'd even get a coach if I had no expierence at all. But I have snowboarded very well in the past, so it's just up to me remembering how to do it.

And for those of you saying snowboarding is nothing like longboarding or wakeboarding, you're wrong. Board control is common in all three of those sports, so it does cross over. 
Me learning to snowboard made me ride excellent on my longboard.
Me riding on my longboard made me learn wakeboarding first day.

It's obvious that they are each on different terrains, however they all utilize a board and have something in common.

I frankly don't care how much hate I will get for this post. Some people on this forum have proven they can't be patient with a teen and actually help instead of showing behavior a child would excersize.


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

Thanks to wrath and neni to actually offering some help. Much appreciated.

EDIT:
And it's not like I can't even get on a board. I can ride it, I just feel a bit inconfindent about the turning because I've gotten used to a longboard style.

I'm not going to get lessons because of the price and because all I need is a step in the right direction for me to get going.


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

Yeah a lesson will cost money but it'd be worth every penny. If you're a quick learner and someone who listens to advice (evidence here isn't promising) it could be as straightforward as lesson in the morning, carving in the afternoon.


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

SnowPenguin said:


> I'd even get a coach if I had no expierence at all. But I have snowboarded very well in the past, so it's just up to me remembering how to do it.
> 
> I frankly don't care how much hate I will get for this post. Some people on this forum have proven they can't be patient with a teen and actually help instead of showing behavior a child would excersize.


You're either a really good troll, or extremely ignorant about snowboarding. Don't be stupid, snowboarding costs a lot of money, and a lesson every once in a while is money well spent.

I've been snowboarding for 25 years or so, I'm a patroller, instructor/evaluator, I've entered a few competitions over the years, and I'm heading for another week of lessons this February... but don't listen to me, I'm sure you'll remember how to snowboard very well again. What does being a teen have to do with anything anyway?


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

poutanen said:


> You're either a really good troll, or extremely ignorant about snowboarding. Don't be stupid, snowboarding costs a lot of money, and a lesson every once in a while is money well spent.
> 
> I've been snowboarding for 25 years or so, I'm a patroller, instructor/evaluator, I've entered a few competitions over the years, and I'm heading for another week of lessons this February... but don't listen to me, I'm sure you'll remember how to snowboard very well again. *What does being a teen have to do with anything anyway?*


....you mean besides not listening to people who know better?? :blink: :dunno:


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## dfitz364 (Jan 10, 2014)

SnowPenguin said:


> Thanks to wrath and neni to actually offering some help. Much appreciated.
> 
> EDIT:
> *And it's not like I can't even get on a board. I can ride it, I just feel a bit inconfindent about the turning because I've gotten used to a longboard style.
> ...


Let me clarify, you are not asking any questions about "carving." What I imagine you are currently doing is slip-sliding around the mountain ruddering your back foot to attempt to control. Linking turns in the most basic way is not carving. That is basic snowboarding. And pointing the board downhill and flat-basing it down the green hill does not constitute riding a board. That board is riding itself and you are just along for the ride. 

And let me also clarify, I couldn't care less if you are 13 or 50. If you come to a forum and ask advice, and then choose to blatantly claim you don't need to follow what we say, people tend to get a little upset. No one is saying you have to follow our advice, and try and get lessons. What people do respect around here, is respect. Don't bite the hand that feeds you my friend.


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## WasabiCanuck (Apr 29, 2015)

This thread turned hilarious fast. Haha.

To the OP, a lesson will save you time and pain. But I can understand not wanting to take a lesson, you feel like it is a waste of money. I never took a lesson either, I taught myself. That was partly due to necessity since I mostly learned in Japan and English speaking instructors are rare over there. But I'm also stupid and stubborn so that is also why I didn't take a lesson.

If I was to do it all over again, I would definitely take at least one lesson. I dislocated my shoulder, torn up my knee, and smashed my head on ice while teaching myself. Lots of doctor visits and lost riding time due my stupidity.

Dude take advice from people that have been where you are. That's why you are on here isn't it?


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

I don't have strong opinions about taking a lesson or not. I never took a lesson myself, but I started back a long while ago. My brother taught me how to ski with a verbal explanation, but he was telling me to weight the uphill ski instead of the downhill one and I told him that I was weighting the downhill ski and he said something like "whoops, that's what I meant". It took me about 2-3 runs, but figured it out. Snowboarding was quite a bit harder as the equipment *sucked* back then. Probably about 3 days of getting the %^&%$ beaten out of me, but it was worth it. There are two sides to this: one is that there was a time before lessons where the pioneers of any sport have to develop technique by trial and error. The other side is now that technique has been worked out, taking a lesson would help most people leap-frog all the abuse and progress straight to workable technique. At least people these days have a choice.


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## goalieman24 (Aug 28, 2009)

SnowPenguin said:


> I'd even get a coach if I had no expierence at all. But I have snowboarded very well in the past, so it's just up to me remembering how to do it.


You're a teen. That means if it's "been a while" since you did "very well", it's impossible that it was even that long ago... unless you were a ripper at age 3. So maybe you're inflated idea of "very well" is a bit of a stretch... because if you knew the technique well, it's not something that just completely disappears and all of a sudden you go from a carver to an edge catcher.


> And for those of you saying snowboarding is nothing like longboarding or wakeboarding, you're wrong. Board control is common in all three of those sports, so it does cross over.
> Me learning to snowboard made me ride excellent on my longboard.
> Me riding on my longboard made me learn wakeboarding first day.
> 
> It's obvious that they are each on different terrains, however they all utilize a board and have something in common.


I've spent little time on a longboard, but I'll say with great certainty that wakeboarding is nothing like snowboarding. Yes, you're right... they both have "board" in them. But other than your feet also being attached, the technique is nothing alike. A wakeboard is cut in a completely OPPOSITE shape as a snowboard. If you try and use the same sort of stance and turning technique on a wakeboard as you do a snowboard, I guarantee you'll be under water 99.9% of the time.


SnowPenguin said:


> And it's not like I can't even get on a board. I can ride it, I just feel a bit inconfindent about the turning because I've gotten used to a longboard style.


But wait, you just said it's very similar to longboarding. Now you're using it as an excuse as to why you can't do it?



> I'm not going to get lessons because of the price and because all I need is a step in the right direction for me to get going.


Bottom line, lose the ego and take a lesson. As others have said, don't think of "lesson" as such a bad word. There's all levels of lessons, so it's not like you'd be just hanging out with a bunch of blue-jean-wearing gapers who don't even know what a binding is. 
Swallow your pride and be more accepting of the help. This is the internet, no one knows who you are. So there's no need to try and pretend you're at a skill level that you actually aren't just so people think you're cooler.


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## offthewallds (Dec 16, 2016)

goalieman24 said:


> ....snip...
> 
> Bottom line, lose the ego and take a lesson. As others have said, don't think of "lesson" as such a bad word. There's all levels of lessons, so it's not like you'd be just hanging out with a bunch of blue-jean-wearing gapers who don't even know what a binding is.
> Swallow your pride and be more accepting of the help. This is the internet, no one knows who you are. So there's no need to try and pretend you're at a skill level that you actually aren't just so people think you're cooler.


This. If you didn't need help, you wouldn't have posted. Forget riding a skateboard when you're on the snow. Your muscles and body move differently.

If you (or your folks) can afford longboarding/wakeboarding/snowboarding, and the associated costs of gas, food, and lift tickets, then you can afford a lesson. If that means compromising and not being able to ride that one extra day this season, so be it. Life's full of compromises kiddo, but it will be worth it when you're having more fun out there.

When I started riding around 12 years old, I was about 5'2" riding a 166 Lamar loner. That thing whooped my ass for a year before I got the hang of it; only instructions I got from friends was "Meet me at the bottom." Been riding an old, noodly Evo for the past 8 seasons and I feel like I can hold my own now. Point is, I've probably got bad habits I'm not even aware of, so when it comes to riding this new West, I may suck it up and take a lesson to get back into the groove.

If it's something you truly do love, it's worth investing your time and money to maximize your enjoyment and progression.


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## ItchEtrigR (Jan 1, 2012)

If you don't want to take a lesson just go get on the hill and practice, anyone with the desire can get a hang of it, as for being really good at carving it's going to take time, like everyone else says a lesson helps you make the most of that time on the hill, and helps you not throw a lot of that time down the drain as you build up bad riding habits learning without.

Honestly I've never took lessons, wish I've had as I probably wouldn't be as shit as I am now ridding 20 yrs without.


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## DaftDeft (Mar 7, 2016)

I'm just curious SnowPenguin. You say you are a teenager, so how did you pay for all your snowboarding, wakeboarding and longboarding equipment?

I don't want to assume that your parents just bought you all that stuff (like I just buy my son all his baseball, skiing and kendo equipment). Maybe you work part-time jobs to save up money for all that?

The cost of a lesson is about $100 - $200 bucks, while the cost of a whole snowboarding setup is probably around what, $600? If you get used/discounted gear and a lot more if you get new/nice stuff.

A couple of hundred bucks to get a lot more enjoyment out of your $600 purchase doesn't sound like such a bad deal to me. If I busted my ass to buy all that gear delivering pizzas or washing dishes, I'd jump on getting better quicker so I could ride the mountain instead of just sliding down it. On the other hand if I asked my parents for that stuff I might balk at asking them to shell out again for lessons.

You've got a ton of old people telling you that they wish they had taken lessons when they were younger. You're younger. But what the hell do old people know right? I get it, I think that way STILL and I'm ancient.

I suggest YouTube! Type "how do I carve" and follow the video instructions and pointers! If there is a turkey or ham in the video, its the wrong kind of carving.


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

I'm not imagining myself being better than I was. This was four years ago, and I was actually doing quite well. 
I'm just going to go ahead and say I'll ignore any reply that's showing disrespect or being a jerk. I opened this thread for a bit of help, not for immense critique. 

Me being a teen has to do with this because I wouldn't know as much as you older guys. I'm newer to the sport, cut me some slack. 

Anyways, I can get a lesson but it would cost me. What I will do first is ride around a bit and see if I can get the hang of it again. If there's no luck, I'll get an instructer.


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

Can I also clarify that I don't have an ego?
I'll just say it right now. 
I can't snowboard well at this point and need to remember how.

Alright? Now that we've gotten that over with, I do not think it is time for an instructer after me going out ONCE on the tiniest ass hill they had. I'll try for a few more hours by myself and see if I'll get the hang of it. 

This isn't me having an ego. This is me already spending 1,500$ on gear and not wanting to spend some on a trainer because I am not a millionare.

I'll get a trainer if I see I'll need one. But it's not like I went out 7 different times for the whole day and couldn't properly turn. It was 1 day, for roughly an hour, on a small hill. And I managed to get decent turns in there at the end.


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

DaftDeft said:


> I'm just curious SnowPenguin. You say you are a teenager, so how did you pay for all your snowboarding, wakeboarding and longboarding equipment?
> 
> I don't want to assume that your parents just bought you all that stuff (like I just buy my son all his baseball, skiing and kendo equipment). Maybe you work part-time jobs to save up money for all that?
> 
> ...


I've saved up 850$ from the past 6 months or so. That's actually covering the cost of the board, bindings, and boots. For the gear, I payed 300$ and I got the extra 200-300$ for Christmas. Also pointing out the fact that parents divorced last few months so I got a bit more help than usual.


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## DaftDeft (Mar 7, 2016)

SnowPenguin said:


> I've saved up 850$ from the past 6 months or so. That's actually covering the cost of the board, bindings, and boots. For the gear, I payed 300$ and I got the extra 200-300$ for Christmas. Also pointing out the fact that parents divorced last few months so I got a bit more help than usual.


Hey, great job saving up!

You saved $850 in 6 months? That's awesome and about $140 a month, a good take for a teenager (well, it was in my day I don't know about now). At that rate, you can save up for a lesson in a single month! I'd say try out what you can for a month and then get a lesson! 

You'll get to see how far you can progress by self-teaching and compare it to what you learn at the lesson. Use that experience to judge the worth of lessons in the future.


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## dfitz364 (Jan 10, 2014)

SnowPenguin said:


> Can I also clarify that I don't have an ego?
> I'll just say it right now.
> I can't snowboard well at this point and need to remember how.
> 
> ...


Let me clarify, pigs actually can fly!!
(It's amazing, you can say anything on the interwebz. Doesn't discredit what we've already seen with said ego :embarrased1

Let me also go ahead an get this out here. I don't give a fuck how much you spent on your snowboard equipment (btw, $1,500 is hilarious. You spent about double anything I ever have and I have 6 boards). I also don't give a fuck about what you have "taught" yourself in the past. It's a glorious age of the internet. You can "teach" yourself anything, doesn't mean you know what the fuck you are really doing. 

Let me give you advice, before you get run right off of this forum. When you ask for advice, don't throw back in people's face by saying "I don't need that" or "I won't do that." Those responses show your maturity level. You yourself said we all are older and know more. Take the advice with open mind and even if it's not something you want to do, don't spit in the face of those who gave you the time to type up help. That is the only reason you have started this flame war (which trust me, having been on here a long time, it won't end well for you). 

My advice, take what neni and wrath said and run with it. If you get better, fantastic! If you continue to stoke the flame on this thread though and keep making claims like you know more than the people you asked for advice, you won't last long around here. Best of luck learning. Hope you invested in some impact shorts in that $1,500 you spent on snowboard equipment :rotfl:


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

SnowPenguin said:


> I went to snowboard today. It was my first day in a few years.
> Two runs were open, the small hill and the bigger park hill. Of course I went to the smaller hill.


Where did you end up going?


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

It would take far too long to multi-quote you and every reply that was worth dittoing,...

So let me just say this.....

This is the Iterwebz! You'll need a *much* thicker skin if you're going to continue surfing it, let alone sticking around here! :blink:


If you continue to ask advice and then refuse or ridicule said advice as unecessary or unwanted? You _definitely_ won't last long here! ....and we're a much mellower bunch than we were even a year ago! 








We're not inclined to be At All gentle with such individuals!! >
(...I miss shredlifes or BA's unique and colorful approach to these type posts! I always learn new & interesting ways to insult people!!) :laugh:

Good luck,... Have fun busting or not busting your ass,... :thumbsup:


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

SnowPenguin said:


> Anyways, I can get a lesson but it would cost me. What I will do first is ride around a bit and see if I can get the hang of it again. If there's no luck, I'll get an instructer.


That's a sound plan. 
Spend 2 days on the slopes and re-activate the muscle memory, get a feel for the board n edge n snow n your body. Then go over the books and see if you improved as much as expected, are at the spot where you think you've been before, did dust off the former skillz or hit a plateau. If the latter? Get one private lesson, soak up what you learn there and then exercise by your own again.

Time on slopes is the most important thing anyway. Go out there and have fun


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

dfitz364 said:


> Let me clarify, pigs actually can fly!!
> (It's amazing, you can say anything on the interwebz. Doesn't discredit what we've already seen with said ego :embarrased1
> 
> Let me also go ahead an get this out here. I don't give a fuck how much you spent on your snowboard equipment (btw, $1,500 is hilarious. You spent about double anything I ever have and I have 6 boards). I also don't give a fuck about what you have "taught" yourself in the past. It's a glorious age of the internet. You can "teach" yourself anything, doesn't mean you know what the fuck you are really doing.
> ...


Sick. I don't give a fuck about anything you say at this point. I don't care if I spent double what you did and you have 6 boards. I am talking about equipment and board price here, along with boots and bindings. 
You honestly aren't helping here. I am taking information from neni, wrath, Deacon, and others with open arms. To help someone, you don't need to be an arse about it. 
I didn't teach myself. My dad taught me, not an instructer. And he has been snowboarding for over 10 years. At this point he can't help me because he lives in Ukraine right now. Probably bombing the Alps near there..

I also don't need you to tell me how to spend my money. I am very happy with how I spent it. You can laugh all you want. Pretend to be tough behind a screen and bashing on me. Don't care. 

Me saying I do not want a trainer at this point is not an ego. It is me being wise and seeing how I fair after two or three more sessions to see if I still need one. 

I'm just eager to see how you respond here. 

For future reference, you can post here all you want. I just won't take any of your advice. You've shown me your intolerance, and your "help" has really degraded to critique now. 

Also for Deacon, it was Elm Creek. I had two hours I could spend there, so it was either there or Hyland Hills. I went to Elm Creek because it was my first time this season and I knew it would be open.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

dfitz364 said:


> (btw, $1,500 is hilarious. You spent about double anything I ever have and I have 6 boards).


A little btw to you btw... I spent x-fold this for snowboarding stuff this year. So... I'm a fool? How can you say if you don't know a) how many boards b) how many bindings c) how much outware d) how many trips? You don't know what he has put into the mix/sum, so there's no point in judging. He may have also counted for new outware and season pass. 

Asking before judging is also a kind of respect...
Just saying


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## dfitz364 (Jan 10, 2014)

SnowPenguin said:


> Sick. I don't give a fuck about anything you say at this point. I don't care if I spent double what you did and you have 6 boards. I am talking about equipment and board price here, along with boots and bindings.
> You honestly aren't helping here. I am taking information from neni, wrath, Deacon, and others with open arms. To help someone, you don't need to be an arse about it.
> I didn't teach myself. My dad taught me, not an instructer. And he has been snowboarding for over 10 years. At this point he can't help me because he lives in Ukraine right now. Probably bombing the Alps near there..
> 
> ...


Merry Christmas my friend.


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## dfitz364 (Jan 10, 2014)

neni said:


> A little btw to you btw... I spent x-fold this for snowboarding stuff this year. So... I'm a fool? How can you say if you don't know a) how many boards b) how many bindings c) how much outware d) how many trips? You don't know what he has put into the mix/sum, so there's no point in judging. He may have also counted for new outware and season pass.
> 
> Asking before judging is also a kind of respect...
> Just saying


You're right neni, that was my fault. Got a little hot under the collar and went all warrior fingers on the keyboard :embarrased1:. I was more or less just reacting to it being used as an argument was all. Didn't mean to offend anyone else! Stoke is stoke, no matter the cost!!


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

SnowPenguin said:


> Also for Deacon, it was Elm Creek. I had two hours I could spend there, so it was either there or Hyland Hills. I went to Elm Creek because it was my first time this season and I knew it would be open.


Yeah, Elm Creek, I wouldn't count that either. Afton was awesome on Saturday (the 17th), we had a big group there. Monday would have still been pretty good, but not worth it for 2hours.


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

dfitz364 said:


> Merry Christmas my friend.


And a Happy New Year.

I'll list out what I have spent money on.
Board - 400
Bindings - 320
Boots - 275
Socks - 20
Snowpants - 120
Jacket - 200
Main layer pants 50
Main layer shirt 50 
Balaclava 20 
Helmet 30 
Goggles 60 
Gloves 20 
So that's actually 1,500$, and not spending way more than needed (Kinda expensive bindings, I do love them though. They're freestyle bindings so they'll be good on jumps and such. Also pretty stiff, which I like.)
From that 1,500$ I had 850$ saved up. 300$ I payed along with 850, the rest was gifted. 
I did get some of the 850$ from a Birthday (uncle, friends, dad gave some because of divorce) but I mowed a bunch of lawns, did yard work, and helped at my mom's work for a good duration. 

So I am not being gifted all of this stuff. Happy with the purchase. You can buy each of your boards for 175$, that's your choice. My choice was to get a nicer board that'll last me this and next year.

EDIT: I don't want this thread to escalate any further. It seems as everyone is chill now. I will report how I fair after next time I go boarding.


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## dfitz364 (Jan 10, 2014)

SnowPenguin said:


> And a Happy New Year.
> 
> I'll list out what I have spent money on.
> Board - 400
> ...


Right on. Like I said to Neni above, I didn't mean to bash without knowing. Obviously, as you can see, we on the forum get this a lot where people come about, ask questions, and then blatantly rub our advice in our face. May not have meant to, but as you can see, some of us smelt a troll. >

That being said, neni and wrath gave you great advice and I won't continue down any flame war moving forward. Good on you for raising that money, and if you spent it on snowboard stuff, obviously you want to take it a bit more seriously. I'll admit I may have come on strong and angry. Sitting at work when all of our analysis gave inconclusive results made me a little feisty. Bah-hum-bug.. :embarrased1::hairy:


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

dfitz364 said:


> Right on. Like I said to Neni above, I didn't mean to bash without knowing. Obviously, as you can see, we on the forum get this a lot where people come about, ask questions, and then blatantly rub our advice in our face. May not have meant to, but as you can see, some of us smelt a troll. >
> 
> That being said, neni and wrath gave you great advice and I won't continue down any flame war moving forward. Good on you for raising that money, and if you spent it on snowboard stuff, obviously you want to take it a bit more seriously. I'll admit I may have come on strong and angry. Sitting at work when all of our analysis gave inconclusive results made me a little feisty. Bah-hum-bug.. :embarrased1::hairy:


Cheers 

10101010


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

Can we stay on topic, guyz?
Carving requires finesse. You can't just suddenly load the board with your full weight and expect it to carve. It does not work that way.
You have to load the board gradually and front to back so the edges would start to dig into the snow to turn. If you just suddenly load the board, it will not dig and turn.
When initiating a carve, you want to load the front foot then rear. Also you shift weight from front to back as you finish the turn.
Transition is where you will unload the board front to back as well as shifting weight.
But that's very advanced stuff.
For beginner, I would do maybe a skidded turn and then start loading the board. Remember, speed is your friend when carving. You can't carve when going slow because there is not enough centrifugal force to utilize the edges.


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

deagol said:


> I don't have strong opinions about taking a lesson or not. I never took a lesson myself, but I started back a long while ago.


The trouble is, without taking some good lessons, 99% (okay probably 100%) have some really obvious issues with their riding. I see this all the time when evaluating people who want to patrol. The self taught are good, and can certainly get down the steeper terrain at mountain resorts. But make that same person steer a toboggan with an injured person in it, down the toughest run at your hill, in the worst conditions, after they've been fixing fences all day and are tired: that's when the nasty habits come to bite you in the ass!

The biggest thing I noticed from taking lessons again (after starting with 3 lessons back in 1992 or so and nothing in between) is that after the lessons I wasn't riding any steeper terrain, or faster, etc. etc... I noticed that I was much less tired after a tough run. Good technique makes snowboarding easier. Which means you can do more runs, which makes you better, which makes it easier... You get the picture!



SnowPenguin said:


> Anyways, I can get a lesson but it would cost me. What I will do first is ride around a bit and see if I can get the hang of it again. If there's no luck, I'll get an instructer.


You've spent $1500 on gear, you'll spend at least $50/day on lift tickets, gas and food (that's a VERY conservative estimate unless you live on the hill), but you won't spend a little money for a lesson? Okie dokie. Just hand pick the advice you think is good then, and tell the rest of us we're out to lunch.



SnowPenguin said:


> I didn't teach myself. My dad taught me, not an instructer. And he has been snowboarding for over 10 years.
> 
> Me saying I do not want a trainer at this point is not an ego. It is me being wise and seeing how I fair after two or three more sessions to see if I still need one.


No offence to your dad, but if he's not an instructor, how do you know he taught you good technique?

Deciding you don't need instruction isn't "wise", it's obtuse. Absolutely spend some time out there getting back to how you used to board if that's what you want, but the simple fact is that good instruction will make things a lot better, a lot faster, likely bringing you a lot more pleasure from the sport.

Understand one thing here: The people that you think are bashing you on this thread are really trying to offer you the best advice, to get the most out of the sport, because we LOVE the sport and want other people to love it to.

Not spending money on a couple lessons, is like not spending money on condoms because you think you'll remember to pull out. It works for many people, but I wouldn't chance it! >


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

No offense taken. But who taught the instructer? Who taught him? Who taught that guy? etc. 
My dad has most likely taken lessons, but I've seen the type of hills he rides in Europe. And I know the information he has given me is correct, because otherwise I wouldn't of progressed so quickly and well.

I'm hesitant to spend extra money. My mom offered to pay for lessons, but she works hard every day and I just feel sorry for her. If I do get lessons, it will be with my hard earned money. Let's see if it pays off.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

If you don't want to pay for lessons...then let the world be your instructor...but then you better be a very observant and diligent student or you will pay for your inattention. :surprise:

Ride up...or play up...try ride with folks better than you and try to keep up...you will develop some bad habits...that will slow you down...but then you will have to find better habits. Its not impossible to learn with out lessons...but it takes longer and is more expensive.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

SnowPenguin said:


> No offense taken. But who taught the instructer? Who taught him? Who taught that guy? etc.


Other more highly qualified, experienced, and continually evaluated instructors. People who are paid to coach or teach instructors. 

I've never paid for a lesson. But I have worked on mountain and ridden with many instructors to know the value of their advice. Every time I've asked one to give me one thing to work on for the next hour, day, week etc, it's made me a better rider. I absolutely wish I took more lessons, and more advice, when I first started riding, along with many others commenting in this thread I'm sure.

Maybe you don't need it immediately, but sometime in your next ~10 days of riding, please get a lesson before bad habits become further ingrained.


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

SnowPenguin said:


> No offense taken. But who taught the instructer? Who taught him? Who taught that guy? etc.
> 
> I'm hesitant to spend extra money. My mom offered to pay for lessons, but she works hard every day and I just feel sorry for her. If I do get lessons, it will be with my hard earned money. Let's see if it pays off.


Totally understandable about the money. Two lessons a year might be all you need to really progress. That's how my wife did it, about once every 10 days out, and within 5 seasons she was really boarding WELL.

Who teaches people to perform brain surgery? Others that have worked to perfect the craft of brain surgery, and have been taught how to teach. Same thing for snowboard instructors. As your instructor level goes up, you're required to be able to snowboard at a higher and higher level (as judged according to a standard), and you're required to have more teaching experience. Both of these are good things to have before teaching people how to snowboard.

About 110 ski patrollers from across Canada head to Kicking Horse for a week every year to take 4 days of intense lessons (you stop for lunch, that's about it). I'm heading for the second time this year! It's an awesome week, and it's nice to get rid of 25 year old habits that have been holding me back.


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

I am gonna say instructor money is usually well spent if you want to be good at snowboarding.
Of course reading up and hearing people who knows how to snowboard will give you the same result.
There are many things you can do to avoid bad habits.
Everybody here is willing to help and if possible, a video of yourself riding will allow us to see what's lacking in your riding.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

So yesterday was watching a young gal (teens/twenties) slay down a steep narrow black cat track...she had perfect form, a great line, in control and made it look easy. I can make it down just as well and perhaps a small bit faster...but without the elegant form. I am confident that she had lessons because of her form...me I look like shit getting flung everywhere narrowly avoiding disaster. I too am an old geezer, completely self-taught and wish that I would have had the sense to take lessons.


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

you can definitely develop form without taking lessons (this doesn't mean that most riders will, though). 
But just to clarify, I am not pushing or advocating for anyone to skip lessons.


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## DaftDeft (Mar 7, 2016)

speedjason said:


> Everybody here is willing to help and if possible, a video of yourself riding will allow us to see what's lacking in your riding.


This is an interesting idea to me. As a beginner myself if I wanted to film my riding for critique and pointers, what would be the most useful shots?

I'm going to assume that helmet and board mounted camera footage is going to be worthless. Would a selfie-stick from behind be better? Pointed at my mid-section I'm guessing. A lot of the really nice videos online have a cameraman following; but I won't have that luxury as no one I ride with can ski/snowboard well enough to handle filming at the same time.

Stick the camera on a tripod somewhere just off the run and ride past it?

I'd imagine just having the camera and selfie stick to manage while I'm trying to snowboard would, in itself, impede my snowboarding.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

DaftDeft said:


> Would a selfie-stick from behind be better?


 negative. This would only show parts of you and won't hepl to get a full picture, literally. 

But even w/o seing the entire pic, the first answer will be "bend those knees! Don't sit in the backseat!"  (Make this your mantra. I tell it myself every day (500 days in))



DaftDeft said:


> I won't have that luxury as no one I ride with can ski/snowboard well enough to handle filming at the same time.


 If they have a helmet cam, they don't need to handle anything. Just point the cam straight n look at you. Either stationary while you pass, but better following or going next to you.


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

DaftDeft said:


> This is an interesting idea to me. As a beginner myself if I wanted to film my riding for critique and pointers, what would be the most useful shots?
> 
> I'm going to assume that helmet and board mounted camera footage is going to be worthless. Would a selfie-stick from behind be better? Pointed at my mid-section I'm guessing. A lot of the really nice videos online have a cameraman following; but I won't have that luxury as no one I ride with can ski/snowboard well enough to handle filming at the same time.
> 
> ...


I would say from the back showing all of your body.


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

speedjason said:


> I would say *from the back showing all of your body.*


Preferably wearing yoga pants!!! >

:rofl3:


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

There are a lot of vids out there to show you how to carve. Some are better than others. I first saw this one a few years ago and it really spoke to me:

https://youtu.be/mvADH_dLb4w

Riding the bull? Cracking the whip 90s style? Holding the invisible girlfriend? Doing the zombie? As Ryan K would say, "That's dogshit." Once I saw him doing it wrong on purpose I was like --oh hell that's me!-- and I was able to fix my carve almost instantly.

The sequel vid is also good.


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

I'm back from a whole day of snowboarding. I went on many runs. My favorite was the village run. I got REALLY fast speeds (for me) 25 mph.
I also went on the black diamond and while it was fun and I had to do some speed checks, I had more fun on the blue circle village run. 
At the very end of the black diamond there was a sidewall of ice that I for some reason got on. I got propelled into the air and straight into my ass. The run was over and this was near the chairlift haha.
For turning, I'm doing well. Caught the edge a few times, mostly on toe turns. Turns can be smooth, by when I am trying to turn sharp they're a bit scratchty.

Practice will get me into good shape. 
I did hurt myself once. Not the place you'd expect. I was getting off the chairlift and my friend was RIGHT in front of me, which is super annoying, so I caught the nose edge and twisted my ankle. It's fine now though.

But it was SOO much fun. I want to go there tomorrow and the day after that and the day after that.


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## SnowPenguin (Nov 24, 2016)

I'll need to take a lesson or watch tons of YouTube videos to make sure I don't start riding bad


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## KroogySBF (Nov 14, 2017)

For me it was just practice and practice. I can carve regular but still have not figured out the right motion for riding switch. A nice easy downhill slope helps with the practice. Fresh soft snow helps too


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