# [Beginner] Turning/weaving



## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

So I started snowboarding yesterday at Big Bear mountain in California and I got it down in a couple hours. The only problem I have currently is turning/weaving im not sure the term for it. When I look at other people it seems so easy/effortless but for me I feel as if after 3 or 4 turns my legs are BEAT. 

I ride with my left foot back which is goofy when you skateboard not sure about snowboarding. Basically what im asking is why is turning/weaving taking so much energy out of me when other people are doing it effortlessly. Is it just something I need to learn as time goes on?

Also turning left(edit*) seems to be hard for me. I ride goofy so turning right means Im turning into the mountain with my body facing upwards toward the mountain and my back facing downwards.

Sorry if this did not make much sense just leave a post below and ill try to clarify anything thats confusing. Thanks in advance guys.

EDIT: Also sometimes when I turn I catch alot of snow and fall.

EDIT2: Okay sorry for the confusion the turns I am having trouble with are TOE SIDE turns. Just got the term for it now.


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

TedBundy said:


> So I started snowboarding yesterday at Big Bear mountain in California and I got it down in a couple hours. The only problem I have currently is turning/weaving im not sure the term for it. When I look at other people it seems so easy/effortless but for me I feel as if after 3 or 4 turns my legs are BEAT.
> 
> I ride with my left foot back which is goofy when you skateboard not sure about snowboarding. Basically what im asking is why is turning/weaving taking so much energy out of me when other people are doing it effortlessly. Is it just something I need to learn as time goes on?
> 
> ...


if you ride goofy wouldnt turning right means back facing up hill?
anyways, learning proper edge control and front foot to add pressure to initiate turning.
also how are your bindings set up?


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## 24WERD (May 9, 2012)

Rental board?
too big? too stiff?

camber?

It could be anything.

any video?


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

speedjason said:


> if you ride goofy wouldnt turning right means back facing up hill?
> anyways, learning proper edge control and front foot to add pressure to initiate turning.
> also how are your bindings set up?


Im not sure what goofy is to snowboarding. So ill just put it like this I ride with my Right foot forward Left foot back. A right turns means me turning with my face down the mountain and my back facing up mountain. A left turn means me turning into the mountain my face facing upwards looking up the mountain and my back downward.

My bindings are at 15 Right and Left


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

24WERD said:


> Rental board?
> too big? too stiff?
> 
> camber?
> ...


It was a rental board. And I am actually glad you said this the whole trip I was telling my cousins this board feels to big. I remember the board saying 155W. I am going to get my phone to see exactly because I took pictures of the setting for this reason  ty man. 

Also they measured me by height but on youtube I saw a lot of "pros" saying that you should go by weight and comfort.


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

TedBundy said:


> Im not sure what goofy is to snowboarding. So ill just put it like this I ride with my Right foot forward Left foot back. A right turns means me turning with my face down the mountain and my back facing up mountain. A left turn means me turning into the mountain my face facing upwards looking up the mountain and my back downward.
> 
> My bindings are at 15 Right and Left


now you are saying it right.
15 degrees duck seems like okay. how heavy are you and length of the board? what board?


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

speedjason said:


> now you are saying it right.
> 15 degrees duck seems like okay. how heavy are you and length of the board? what board?


My phone is charging up at the moment its totally dead I took some pics of the board ill add them here soon. Just stay tuned.


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## Banana12 (Nov 15, 2013)

Its really hard to tell what you are doing (or not doing) without being able to watch. Since you just started I would highly recommend a lesson so that the instructor can really correct your technique to get riding on your own safely and quickly.

That said, guesses based on common beginner problems:
You are leaning too far back which is making it hard for you initiate turns. Moving your weight to the front foot will make it easier to start the turn.

It sounds like you are having trouble making toeside turns (but I would think of that as a left turn for a goofy rider). You may be leaving your sholders "open" which will make it hard to turn toeside. Try keeping your shoulders parallel to the edge of the of the board and try to both look and point with your lead hand where you want to go. Looking and pointing will naturally take your body through the proper motions for the turn.

Again, it could be something else, those are just common problems and tips for beginners.

EDIT: I see you cleared up the left/right turning statement, technique still applies for it


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

Here's a picture of the board not that great of a pic sorry.


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

Banana12 said:


> Its really hard to tell what you are doing (or not doing) without being able to watch. Since you just started I would highly recommend a lesson so that the instructor can really correct your technique to get riding on your own safely and quickly.
> 
> That said, guesses based on common beginner problems:
> You are leaning too far back which is making it hard for you initiate turns. Moving your weight to the front foot will make it easier to start the turn.
> ...


YES EXACTLY! Toe side turns. Wow I should have just said that I am extremely sorry. What can I do to better my toe side turns.

And yes I am turning left I am sorry if I was unclear on that as well.


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

TedBundy said:


> Here's a picture of the board not that great of a pic sorry.


155W. is it me or the bindings are very close to each other?

anyways, common new guy fear is leaning too far back so your back foot is having too much pressure. you are basically fighting with yourself.:icon_scratch:


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## Banana12 (Nov 15, 2013)

For toeside turns it is important not to let your sholders "open" so that they face downhill, that will make your upper body fight you through the turn. Try doing the pointing exercise I mentioned, it will really help with upper body positioning. Keep your knees bent and weight over the front foot along with pressuring on your toes.


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

Banana12 said:


> For toeside turns it is important not to let your sholders "open" so that they face downhill, that will make your upper body fight you through the turn. Try doing the pointing exercise I mentioned, it will really help with upper body positioning. Keep your knees bent and weight over the front foot along with pressuring on your toes.


Okay ill try that I saw some lady doing this wasnt sure why but now I see. You guys are really helpful I appreciate it


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

Also do you think the board is the right size for me?


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

Also another thing is right when I come out of the toeside turn and try to turn the other way to continue snowboarding or to turn right I catch to much snow and fall. Should I be leaning on my heels coming out of the toeside turn?


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## Casual (Feb 9, 2011)

TedBundy said:


> Also do you think the board is the right size for me?


Whats your weight? Shoe size?


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## Banana12 (Nov 15, 2013)

TedBundy said:


> Also do you think the board is the right size for me?


What is your specs? e.g. weight and shoe size? Without that you can't know at all.

Also do you know happen to know the model of board, or anything else about it other than its a 155 wide?


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

TedBundy said:


> Also another thing is right when I come out of the toeside turn and try to turn the other way to continue snowboarding or to turn right I catch to much snow and fall. Should I be leaning on my heels coming out of the toeside turn?


you need to start easing the pressure on the toes so the board starts to point down hill then you add pressure to the heels (or in my opinion lifting up your toes).


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

Banana12 said:


> What is your specs? e.g. weight and shoe size? Without that you can't know at all.
> 
> Also do you know happen to know the model of board, or anything else about it other than its a 155 wide?


I weigh about 150 my shoe size for the boots is 9.5 I think it was a burton? He said something about it being a type of board where it didnt matter if you were goofy or regular. Im guessing its a beginner board or something. They didnt give to much specs.


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## Banana12 (Nov 15, 2013)

Well I would say you certainly don't need a wide board (that's what the W denotes)

Without know the model it is hard to know what weight the board was designed for, but I would think you should try between a 150cm and 153cm normal width board. The smaller size will be easier for you to practice getting your turning down. If you are renting right at the mountain they normally let you trade sizes if you are unhappy with your initial rental, so try a few sizes out.


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## baldylox (Dec 27, 2007)

With a 9.5 boot, you don't belong on a wide board. That definitely makes it more difficult for you to turn because you have less leverage. *155 is fine for your weight. It is better to learn on a longer board. You will be less likely to develop bad habits such as relying on counter-rotation.*

Right foot downhill is goofy. Left foot down hill is regular.

To initiate a toeside turn, center your weight between your feet, favoring the front foot a little. Keep your shoulders over your feet and your arms quiet. Move the knee of your leading leg toward the center of the board/back leg and press your front shin against the tongue of the boot. The edge will engage and you will follow through by pressing the shin of your rear foot against the tongue of that boot as well. Congratulations! Your are now in a toeside turn. :yahoo:


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

Alright thanks you two for all your advice! I will probably be investing in a snowboard soon. Any links to websites I should check out? I live in California big bears like an hour and a half away. After my first experience I know I will be going often. So renting will eventually become a waste of money.


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

baldylox said:


> The problem is not your equipment, so get that out of your head. There may be things you want to change later on, but wait until you can actually snowboard. The board is not too big. Learning on a larger board will be better in the long run because it is more difficult to 'cheat'. By 'cheat' I mean turn using counter rotation.
> 
> Right foot downhill is goofy. Left foot down hill is regular.
> 
> To initiate a toeside turn, center your weight between your feet, favoring the front foot a little. Keep your shoulders over your feet and your arms quiet. Move the knee of your leading leg toward the center of the board/back leg and press your front shin against the tongue of the boot. The edge will engage and you will follow through by pressing the shin of your rear foot against the tongue of that boot as well. Congratulations! Your are now in a toeside turn. :yahoo:


Thanks man I really appreciate this reply.  ! You guys are all so helpful on here. Glad I signed up.


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

baldylox said:


> With a 9.5 boot, you don't belong on a wide board. 155 is right in the middle of the range for your weight.
> 
> Right foot downhill is goofy. Left foot down hill is regular.
> 
> To initiate a toeside turn, center your weight between your feet, favoring the front foot a little. Keep your shoulders over your feet and your arms quiet. Move the knee of your leading leg toward the center of the board/back leg and press your front shin against the tongue of the boot. The edge will engage and you will follow through by pressing the shin of your rear foot against the tongue of that boot as well. Congratulations! Your are now in a toeside turn. :yahoo:


on a side note, I found my toe side turn skidding too much. too much weight on the back foot? my heel side turns are pretty good.


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## baldylox (Dec 27, 2007)

TedBundy said:


> Thanks man I really appreciate this reply.  ! You guys are all so helpful on here. Glad I signed up.


I editing a bit based on your reply with stats. Look again. 

Is Ted Bundy your real name? Sort of an unusual choice, if not.


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## baldylox (Dec 27, 2007)

speedjason said:


> on a side note, I found my toe side turn skidding too much. too much weight on the back foot? my heel side turns are pretty good.


Skidding or shuddering?


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

baldylox said:


> I editing a bit based on your reply with stats. Look again.


Thanks I knew it couldnt all be me. I understood that snowboarding was going to take practice but something just felt a LITTLE off about the board. So 155 is fine? Just not wide? I want to PURCHASE a board so will this be good to last me for a while?


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## baldylox (Dec 27, 2007)

TedBundy said:


> Thanks I knew it couldnt all be me. I understood that snowboarding was going to take practice but something just felt a LITTLE off about the board. So 155 is fine? Just not wide? I want to PURCHASE a board so will this be good to last me for a while?


I would probably rent a few more times. You'll have a better idea what your goals are then. For an all-mountain board, I would probably put you on a 153-155. However I am a much more free-ride /carving / powder chasing focused rider than a lot of these guys. Most boards will have specific recommendations based on rider weight and accounting for the boards specific construction. A couple of cm really does not make as much of a difference as you might think based on the way people talk. If you think your going to want to pursue freestyle, you may want something a bit shorter, if you think you'll want to chase pow and live somewhere that is feasible, then you might want something a bit longer with a rockered tip. If you are anything like the rest of us, you'll probably end up with 4 or 5 boards for different things.


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

baldylox said:


> I would probably rent a few more times. You'll have a better idea what your goals are then. For an all-mountain board, I would probably put you on a 153-155 at your weight however I am a much more free-ride / powder chasing focused rider than a lot of these guys. Most boards will have specific recommendations based on rider weight and accounting for the boards specific construction. A couple of cm really does not make as much of a difference as you might think based on the way people talk.


Alright my last question. When he was screwing in my bindings the positioning felt perfect but i cant quite remember what holes he used... If that doesnt make sense look at the picture below. You see how the are so many different ones? I'm not sure which he put them in.



Also I think he had my front foot(right) at a different position. Is this something Ill just have to trial and error? OR does it not make that much of a difference?


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

baldylox said:


> Skidding or shuddering?


I would say skidding then edge grabs. maybe a bit shuddering like the front would grab and the back skidding a bit then grabs.:laugh:


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

TedBundy said:


> Alright my last question. When he was screwing in my bindings the positioning felt perfect but i cant quite remember what holes he used... If that doesnt make sense look at the picture below. You see how the are so many different ones? I'm not sure which he put them in.
> 
> 
> 
> Also I think he had my front foot(right) at a different position. Is this something Ill just have to trial and error? OR does it not make that much of a difference?


it all comes down to personal choices. whatever makes you comfortable.


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

Quick question do medium size bindings the (7~9) also cover 9.5?


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## DevilWithin (Sep 16, 2013)

I have Medium Burton Cartels and a size 10 foot. You just have to adjust the foot bed to lengthen it a bit. Not sure about other bindings, but I believe most would work. What particular binding?


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

DevilWithin said:


> I have Medium Burton Cartels and a size 10 foot. You just have to adjust the foot bed to lengthen it a bit. Not sure about other bindings, but I believe most would work. What particular binding?


I was looking to buy this package. On Sale LTD Quest Snowboard w/ LTD LT25 Bindings Black up to 60% off board-binding-package-0527 

can you provide me feedback? ty


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## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

TedBundy said:


> I was looking to buy this package. On Sale LTD Quest Snowboard w/ LTD LT25 Bindings Black up to 60% off board-binding-package-0527
> 
> can you provide me feedback? ty


It's shitty, don't waste your money


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

bseracka said:


> It's shitty, don't waste your money


What are you basing this on if I may ask?


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

TedBundy said:


> I was looking to buy this package. On Sale LTD Quest Snowboard w/ LTD LT25 Bindings Black up to 60% off board-binding-package-0527
> 
> can you provide me feedback? ty


Start here:
Snowboard, Wakeboard, Skateboard, Package, Bindings, Boots



bseracka said:


> It's shitty, don't waste your money


+1
I'm a fan of The House, but mostly because they're local for me. I'm meh on their website. WiredSport, on the other hand, is a super helpful member of this forum, and has a great website... particularly for people starting out.


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## kaborkian (Feb 1, 2010)

I made the mistake of buying the cheapest board/boots/binding setup once long ago, with the intention of saving on rentals. Ended up giving the shit away after a week, literally. The one you're looking at from thehouse will end up the same way.

Already been said, but it deserves being said again. That wide board will make turns significantly harder for your size 9.5 feet. Also, those bingings, if they are what I think they are (the burton made for rental quick adjust model) are total and utter crap. They are loose on the board, and allow a lot of relative movement between your boots and the board. When you try to make a turn, or just a small change in lean angle, whatever, there so much slop, the board doesn't respond. It's like trying to drift in a 1973 Buick with worn out steering.

If you continue to rent, spend the extra money on whatever the shop's upgraded package is, at least for one day so you can see the difference.

If you are truly intending to stay with the sport, budget about $150 and get a good pair of last year model boots, and another $200-$300 for either a used board and bindings from the classified here or a last year board and bindings new. You'll end up around $400 into it, which is 10-12 days of rentals.

Check evo.com outlet for some ideas.

Rome Garage Rocker Snowboard 2013 | evo outlet

Rome Libertine Snowboard Boots 2013 | evo outlet


I've also got a pair of rome arsenal bindings that have only been used a few days collecting dust in the closet, would sell for cheap.


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## TedBundy (Dec 23, 2013)

kaborkian said:


> I made the mistake of buying the cheapest board/boots/binding setup once long ago, with the intention of saving on rentals. Ended up giving the shit away after a week, literally. The one you're looking at from thehouse will end up the same way.
> 
> Already been said, but it deserves being said again. That wide board will make turns significantly harder for your size 9.5 feet. Also, those bingings, if they are what I think they are (the burton made for rental quick adjust model) are total and utter crap. They are loose on the board, and allow a lot of relative movement between your boots and the board. When you try to make a turn, or just a small change in lean angle, whatever, there so much slop, the board doesn't respond. It's like trying to drift in a 1973 Buick with worn out steering.
> 
> ...


Great reply dude really! I will start saving up now. And yes I do plan on staying with the sport. When I was up at big bear it just felt so right lol! Out of everything ive ever done skating, swimming ,etc etc Snowboarding just felt like it fit. Thanks for the reply though man really appreciate it 

PM me about the bindings please?


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## jml22 (Apr 10, 2012)

I have a set of Red TT30s that are probably one of the best newbie bindings.


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## stickz (Feb 6, 2013)

TedBundy said:


> YES EXACTLY! Toe side turns. Wow I should have just said that I am extremely sorry. What can I do to better my toe side turns.
> 
> And yes I am turning left I am sorry if I was unclear on that as well.


I would change your binding set up. keep the front at +15 and instead of your back binding being -15 put it at +3. this with the other advice will really help you initiate toe side turns. I rode ducked all last year. this yr I made the switch and my riding has really improved because of
it.


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## stickz (Feb 6, 2013)

my advice in gear is this. don't buy "beginner" shit. grow into your gear not outta it.


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## baldylox (Dec 27, 2007)

speedjason said:


> on a side note, I found my toe side turn skidding too much. too much weight on the back foot? my heel side turns are pretty good.


It's tough to say without video. Most likely it is one of, or a combination of two things.

1) Your *center of gravity is too far outside the edge.* Shift your hips in as if you are humping the inside of the carve. Hump and dump! (pelvic thrust toeside, sitting on the potty heelside). 

2) You are also probably *not getting the edge up high enough*. Bend those knees as much as possible, as soon as possible. You lose a little bit of shock absorption by shifting your hips in so it becomes critical to bend your knees.

When you first start to really get the toeside carve it'll be tough to balance but stay with it. Once you get the hang of it your toeside carves will probably far surpass your heelside and you'll spend the rest of your riding career seeking the perfect heelside carve, which is much much harder.

There is nothing like the feeling of getting low in a locked in carve. It's second only to waist high champagne pow! :yahoo:


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## Outlander (Nov 28, 2011)

It sounds as if you did not take any coaching and are just learning by doing. A concept you need to really focus on right now is "front foot steering" What you are doing is using your front ankle to pressure either the toe edge or the heel edge to engage the sidecut of the board. With good front foot steering, you all but eliminate the danger of edge catches.

Ride in a nice centered position with equal weight on both feet. A slight forward shift of your hips toward the nose of the board will make turn initiation easier. For heelside, squat down like you are going to sit down (keep your back straight and try not to bend at the waist). Take your front knee and pull it toward the nose of the board and lift your toes up to try to touch your toenails on the top of your boot. This will cause the ankle joint to open a little bit and you will feel most of your weight on the heel of your foot.

For toeside, drive the front knee out in front of you toward the snow. It also helps a lot to pull the knee toward the tail of the board as you do this. Make sure you do not lean over (bend at the waist) to initiate your toeside turns. Instead, push your pelvis slightly forward and arch your back just a little. This position will make you tend to stand on your tip toes and this really pressures your toeside edge.

If you are not doing this front foot steering yet, I highly recommend that you take a few minutes on a very gentle slope with a flat run out and do some one footed glides with your back foot unstrapped. Practice initiating and control both your heel and toe turns using only the front foot. After you get a feel for the board response, then go back up on the lift and strap both feet in. 

Your back foot will act in a supporting role for your basic skidded turns. Do not apply any edge pressure with your back foot until you have really started the turn with the front foot. Turn completion is also started with the front foot. All you do is simply relax the edge pressure that is holding you in the turn. Let the board straighten out and slowly allow the nose to drift back down the fall line. Don`t force this step. Many people get in a hurry and pressure their downhill edge too soon and this cause those edge catches. Before you initiate any turn at this stage in your riding, you should let the board ride pointed down the fall line on a totally flat base for just a second, before pressuring the new edge.


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## kaborkian (Feb 1, 2010)

http://www.snowboardingforum.com/buy-sell-snowboard-equipment/113745-brand-new-dc-ply-156-5-a.html


Here's your board!


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

Mr. Bundy...the best you can do for yourself...spend money and TAKE LESSONS...its not the equipment...its the rider.


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## Kevin137 (May 5, 2013)

As above, the best money you can spend now is a lesson or 2... If will benefit you greatly, and make sure you have fun rather than so many bruises, you will still fall, but you will fall less as a result, and will progress so much faster...


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