# Death on the Mountain



## Mooz (Aug 14, 2007)

Darwin wins again. Wear a helmet people!


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

He hit a tree and they said he probably would be alive if he had a helmet on? We've had at least 3 deaths from people hitting trees while wearing helmets. Probably wouldn't have saved him. If he's going fast enough to knock the life out of him by hitting a tree, you're going to need a helmet much more substantial than what is offered today. We're talking medicine ball sized. Sucks that happened, but what a lame statement. While I am a big proponent of helmets, this type of accident is something that they offer very little to no protection for.

Condolences to his friends and family.


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## laz167 (Nov 27, 2007)

Here's my story I don't wear a helmet 80 percent of the time..The reason they sometimes feel uncomfortable.As far as helping you during a fall no question it will help, but I fell last year caught my heel edge at a good amount of speed as I fell I remembered to tuck my head in to my chest didn't hurt my head at all (this was without a helmet). This year i fell again heel egde with a helmet on did the same thing tucking my head but still slaped my head against the ground.The reason to me was the bulkness my the helmet prevented me from really tucking.


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## Guest (Mar 18, 2008)

I'm a proponent of full body armor...for me :laugh:
I'm very prone to falling and hurting myself so the more Michelin Man armor I can get the better. That being said, I'll recommend anyone to wear a helmet if they ask. If they don't want to, well, it's a free country and you reap what you sow. 
I think people who do intense boarding w/o a helmet are crazy. I also think people who hit 7s and tweaks and drop off cliffs are crazy. I also think they are awesome and I want to do that some day, helmet or no helmet, just have fun and be as safe as possible while still not letting fear prevent you from throwing down.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Let's not turn this into a helmet debate thread as it's easily going to. Someone died, and being the internet there is a good chance family could find this thread while they are looking for some sort insight to their child, friend, loved one. I've seen it happen many, many times. I know I am guilty of side tracking this as the next, but let's try to keep it relatively on topic.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

Mooz said:


> Darwin wins again. Wear a helmet people!


As others have said, it may not have done anything. People wearing helemts in football, or on motorcycles, and get head injury all the time. 

However, there might have been a "Darwin factor" at work here. I know the trail well he died on. To get to it, you have to come down a blue/black trail, and fork off. It is possible to get obscene uphill speed before you fork off onto this trail. To do so is wreckless. It is blue. Narrow. Twisty. If there is any type of crowd on this trail when you enter it (at speed), there are going to be problems. Even if there is no crowd, if you hit any ice, things could get scary. This kid knew how to ski. My guess is that he *did* get crazy uphill speed and bombed this trail, and something went terriblly wrong. 

Knowing that mountain like the back of my hand, my guess is that a helmet wouldn't have saved him. Better judgment would have.

A sad story no matter what happened.


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## scottland (Jan 8, 2008)

If snowboard helmets were up to the quality of motorcycle helmets, I would say that it probably would have save his life.

On the flip side, if snowboard helmets were like motorcycle helmets, no one would wear one. :laugh:


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

Snowolf said:


> ...than getting hit by a bus...


*shudder*

Yesterday I cam across this about 45 min after it happened. I live a block away. The scene was still quite...gruesome. Streaks in the road, etc. Not something I'll ever forget.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

Snowolf said:


> Yikes...thats bad. This video from an intersection camera has always freaked me out. This poor guy did`nt know what hit him...


Holy sh*t. 

(and looks like you finally got the "embed" thing down pat!)


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## PaoloSmythe (Aug 19, 2007)

whoa-hoooo

i know that clip wolfie without even clicking play!

goes to show, when its time its time!

ain't no 'looking both way before you cross' gonna allow for that scenario!


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## Guest (Mar 18, 2008)

wear a helmet, i got lucky here.
<object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/r1yHO_0D56Q&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/r1yHO_0D56Q&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>


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## Suburban Blend (Feb 23, 2008)

*Please, please, please*

Last run of the day and friends and I were hauling ass to the bottom. My Race Crew buddy came over a knoll to find a small girl laying on the backside. He booted her head and without a helmet she died.

His life is ruined, last I heard he had a police suicide standoff or something....:dunno:

If you going outside and your sport makes you or others go fast; Put on a brain bucket just like you would put on a seatbelt.


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## Guest (Mar 18, 2008)

The first week of January in Breck a young boy from Europe I am not sure were from, impacted a tree(he was wearing a helmet) but he died in the scene. Breck latter on made a statement that the helmet was snowboarding/skiers helmet but it did not meet with Summit standards for crash rating. I didn't even know that Summit had their own ratting for helmets. Either way that shows you death comes at you with no warning. This family had to fly back to Europe with their son in a coffin, poor people.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

I haven't heard about any Summit county standards for helmets. Even if they do (I don't doubt you), I doubt it would have made a difference. You just can't make a helmet to protect from that sort of impact.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

Snowolf said:


> Yeah, it only works in the general chat section..you can`t embed anywhere else.


Ok, note to self...


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Just a quick note. A 15yr old was killed at Beaver Mtn Utah this weekend when she hit a tree. She was wearing a helmet. When you are doing 35mph, well a helmet doesn't help much.


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## Guest (Mar 24, 2008)

shits harsh, having suffered from a C.H.I myself.. i tend to hit the brakes big time when im up against large firmly planted inanimate objects..may the ones we've lost from our big winter sports community rest in peace.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Another note, I don't think they are in the "trees" but skiing on intermediate runs that have trees on the sides of the run and maybe a tree or two on the run. So speeds tend to be up. I can't imagine anyone doing 35mph in the middle of an actual tree run.


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## Guest (Mar 25, 2008)

I was actually boarding up at Beaver on Saturday when the girl died. I saw the life flight helicopter leaving but had no idea at the time what was going on. There are some areas that are off the actual path with trees but they aren't super dense so you can go a bit faster but still...I don't dare do that. I also heard that she died because her larynx was crushed...so like ya'll had said, the helmet was really no help because it wasn't due to head injuries.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Another one at Targhee. Brain dead after hitting a tree. Not mentioned in the article but reportedly he was wearing a helmet.


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## neednsnow (Nov 30, 2007)

Gots to chime-in. 

1st- I wear a Helmet, how is it too bulky to tuck your chin?

2nd- I was last-run treeing at Breck, last week, (Last run of the trip actually) and out of nowhere I got punched in the face....by a branch. The helmet did me no help at that point, but when I went backwards and knocked my noggin on another tree...I was happy for the helmet. It happened so quick and unexpected that I hadn't any time to react.

3rd, I first bought a helmet because I tooka back edge once that threw me on my ass, back, and my head whipped back into the hard-pack. (I am from the east coast). When I got up (completely dizzy-brained) my head had left a divet in the hard-pack. I have done this since with a helmet and no dizzy-brain. 

Seriously, if a helmet can help you in at least a few instances, isn't it worth it? We are so concerned with Camber and an extra cm or 2 in length, yet the minimal gain from a helmet is not worth it? Come on.

If you ride the trees or on the Ice coast, wear a helmet! Either way, we may just buy the farm, but till then.....bucket the brain!


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## Guest (Mar 27, 2008)

It seems that helmets don't help much at high speeds. I wear a helmet all the time, it just makes me feel safer. I can say that helmets work in some other cases including high speeds, the only reason I survived my motorcycle accident was because I was wearing a helmet, it cracked during the accident and I came out only with bad road rash in my arms, shoulders and back. The cops said the helmet probably impacted the car, I really don't remember anything about it, it happened to fast. Of course motorcycle helmets have a higher standard and they are much larger and to uncomfortable to ride.

Either way I will always wear a helmet, you just never know.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Damn, this one is horrible. I can't believe this killed the girl. Very tragic and unusual. I don't get how a fall on your ass is enough to severe a vertebral artery, but yet that is what happened. Maybe she was in a terrain park? I dunno, but my condolences go out to her friends and family. Absolutely terrible.

http://www.9news.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=88920



9News said:


> SUMMIT COUNTY - In a tragic turn of events, an Indianapolis pharmacist has died in Colorado after what appeared to be a minor snowboarding accident.
> 
> According to the Summit County Coroner's Office, Jennifer Ash, 28, had come to Colorado to visit friends and snowboard on a vacation. On March 16 she fell quite hard on her rear end while snowboarding on Inas Way at Keystone.
> 
> ...


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## BRsnow (Jan 26, 2008)

That is pretty awful...sorry to hear...


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## tboooe (Mar 16, 2008)

killclimbz said:


> Damn, this one is horrible. I can't believe this killed the girl. Very tragic and unusual. I don't get how a fall on your ass is enough to severe a vertebral artery, but yet that is what happened. Maybe she was in a terrain park? I dunno, but my condolences go out to her friends and family. Absolutely terrible.
> 
> http://www.9news.com/news/article.aspx?storyid=88920


Wow, this one really hits home. Last weekend, I suffered one my worst falls this season. I think either I chipped my tail bone or I have a severe bone bruise. I still cannot sit directly on my tail bone. It just feels weird that I experienced the same thing that just killed someone. This sad story shows that if you ever have an injury that you are not sure about, its not good to "suck it up". Its way better to be safe than sorry.


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## Guest (Mar 29, 2008)

A kid at my local resort died this year from falling off the lift into a river, they said his skis got caught up in rocks and he drowned to death. I saw the ski patrol getting him out of the river and saying he wasn't breathing. People who were behind him on the lift said his bar was up. I don't see the point in not putting the bar down, its not a discomfort(if anything it adds comfort) and its a saftey thing. As for helmets I've had one save my life when I used to ski, I hit fog on a trail I had never been on and missed a turn, slammed into a tree and my helmet split clean in two, I was fine however. I still wear a helmet, knowing its not very likley to save my life in the event of a terrible crash, just more of something to make mild falls not as harsh.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

Ok, lets cheer this thread up a bit...Speaking of falling off the lift...

I was at Sunday River a few weeks ago. One of the days had a little ice / rain storm for about 45-60 min. I had been riding the park during this time, but everything got ice coated, so I stopped for a bit. There were these two people who were also in the park with me. One on skis, one on a board. Both, totally obnoxious. Snaking people. Heckling from the lift, cutting in lift-line (got passes pulled later in the day for that, too!), etc. 

Anyway, so lifts got seats got real slippery from the little rain/icy storm. The two idiots are ahead of me in line. They get into the loading area, and are pushing and shoving each other. Lift attend yells at them. they stop, for a brief moment, and then start again. Lift come around. They are both off balance when it comes to them. They sit on it, barley. the lift swing forward, and starts to move. they go about 10-feet. somehow the skis got tangle with boarders feet legs. Next thing everyone sees is the skier on top of the boarder, ON THE GROUND. Total fall was about 4' feet. EVEERYONE is laughing at them. Karma is such a great thing.


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## Guest (Mar 29, 2008)

That is hilarious and well deserved.


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## Guest (Mar 30, 2008)

Yeah I have to agree every time I board in the east coast, the atmosphere is much rougher than out west. Every time I have been there something happens, well except when I got to Jay peak, half of the people there are Canadian, very nice, calm and respectful. 

But over all I found Colorado to have the friendliest crowds, well except Vail, California is not bad either. The worst by far are the Poconos, When we were learning up there we almost got into a few fights, skiers simply don't respect rider and some riders thought they own the slopes. I have not been to Killington but I heard in the weekends it can get real nasty.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

Simply^Ride said:


> ...every time I board in the east coast, the atmosphere is much rougher than out west.


Well, as the classic hardcore album says...










Welcome the ice coast, hippies. And the "ice" isn't about the conditions, it's about the _people_.


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## Guest (Mar 30, 2008)

sedition said:


> Welcome the ice coast, hippies. And the "ice" isn't about the conditions, it's about the _people_.


yeah...f that. give me hella chill people.


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## Guest (Mar 31, 2008)

Hi all,

My perception of wearing a helmet drastically changed last week. We where snowboarding with 6 friends in Trois Vallees, France. 

We where doing a boardercross, but the weather was snowy so we where just making turns and slowing in between. Then suddenly my friend fell on his head on an icy spot. At first we thought he just had a broken nose but things just from bad to worse at that time. He passed away and a helicopter had come to pick him up and bring him to the hospital. 

We went to the hospital our selfs and there we heard the teribble news that he had broken his skull (don`t know the proper translation, how we call it here). There was alot of blood in his brains and he was in coma. Because he was brain dead there was nothing more left to do. He was still artificially kept alive so they literally pulled out the plug... 
And that was that, we went with 6 ppl to snowboard a week in France and we came back with 5...

I never believed in a helmet and I tought I don`t need it for just some simple jumps and some speed. But the accident just happend on an almost flat spot with little speed. 


it feels good to write this off myself,
hopefully ppl will wear a helmet more often then accidents like this with my friend won`t happen anymore/less...

Cheers for reading,
Simon


PS: If there are guys who understand dutch: http://www.gva.be/Antwerpen/2380/artikel.asp?art={7A9F5CC5-E201-4719-A2ED-C052E94C5B23}


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Oh man, that is horrible news. I am so sorry this happened to your friend. I can't imagine. I still stand by the fact that that wearing a helmet is an open choice and always should be. No arguement that a helmet offers more protection and has it's benefits. I always wear one for various reasons.

You have my condolences.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

Wow. I am at a loss for words. I'm so sorry. At the least he went out doing something he loved...rather than getting hit by a bus on the way to work or something. My thoughts are with you.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Well, back to helmets. The reason I wear one came painfully to light yesterday. While on Berthoud Pass enjoying a fat blower (3+ ft North Faces) pow day, I took a tumble that luckily didn't end up with me getting evac'd by search and rescue maybe a flight for life. End of the day, we had just done the Frankenstein Chute into Second creek and had attempted to skin back up the ridge to go do the 110's. 1500 vertical of sweet low angle turns with some steeper terrain down low. Well the ridge climbing from Second Creek is about 40-45degrees and it's a bitch to skin up even if it's on 400 vert to the top. My partner Tom was skiing on DPK reverse sidecut, rocker ski's, 200 cm long. Climbing up a slope like that requires lot's of switchbacks, which he just couldn't make with the long ski's. Part of it was definitely skill and he just wasn't used to climbing stuff that steep. Anyway, after trying to boot pack it, then skin it again his skins failed and we had to bail from doing the 110's and exit out Second Creek. On the way down there was a small cliff with snow perfectly spatula'd off the top. About a 10-15ft drop. After looking and talking it over I decided to side shot it, to give me the best landing as it went from steep to flat pretty quickly. Well pointing it and going for the launch, a snow snake bit my board and hurled me forward over the cliff. I rolled, scraped my helmet in a couple of spots on the rock and landed on my back with my pack taking most of the impact, but my side got hit a little too. When I got up out of my bomb hole, there was less than a foot of snow covering jagged rocks. The helmet definitely kept my skull off of the rocks and I got lucky other parts of me didn't get broken. Without the helmet I could have easily have had a big gash, best case, and been knocked unconscious or knocked dead worst case. Unexpected crap like that happens frequently enough in the backcountry that gives me reason enough to sport the brain bucket.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

Yikes. Glad your OK n'shit.


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## Guest (Apr 2, 2008)

My first time out I was falling all over the place but I fell once on my back and my head went flying back and hit the ground pretty hard. Didn't knock me out or anything but sure made me sit there for a few. After that, I went to Sport Chalet that day and picked up a helmet and have been wearing it ever since. I thought I would look like a goober but I see plenty of riders of all skill levels wearing them so I don't mind. Besides, it keeps my ears nice and warm and keeps my headphones in  I honestly am surprised I didn't think to buy one to start with because I ride a dirt bike and had a really nasty fall a few years ago that sent me flying over the handle bars and landed on my head and back. Only protective gear I had was the helmet and it sure saved me from much more severe of injury...esp since I was in the middle of nowhere alone. I just sent Simon's story to my boyfriend...he finally bought a helmet but didn't use it till he went on the intermediate hill and I think he probably wouldn't wear it all the time. Hopefully he will after reading that. My condolences to you Simon.


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## Guest (Apr 2, 2008)

Blackcomb Mountain the resort I board at recently has a missing Asian exchange student and she was last seen at an area with thick trees. I'm guessing she got stuck in a tree well or hit a tree and got covered in snow. She has been missing for about 2 weeks now and the search and rescue still haven't come up with anything leading to where she could be. If shes been missing for 2 weeks she is probably a gonner.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

I had heard about this from another board. I haven't heard that they have ruled it an accidental death, but I don't know what else it could be. Unless some sort of foul play was involved. 

On a side note Colorado hit it's accidental death record this year. Tied with the 2001-2002 season for deaths at 16.


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## Guest (Apr 2, 2008)

Djezz these thread is really painfull to read. 
I just went back from the funeral from my friend who died exactly a week ago with snowboarding. And it just is not worth going out for a ride without a helmet because it 'feels unconforable' or so. I stongly advice everyone to wear one. 
It annoys me when I see the "pro-riders" doing dangerous rails without a helmet. And then knowing that my friend just died on a blue piste when going very slow...

I guess its just a matter of bad luck...




PS: Thanks for the condolances, guys/womens, altough I do not know you it does mean something to me.


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## Guest (Apr 3, 2008)

tonysimoni said:


> Djezz these thread is really painfull to read.
> I just went back from the funeral from my friend who died exactly a week ago with snowboarding. And it just is not worth going out for a ride without a helmet because it 'feels unconforable' or so. I stongly advice everyone to wear one.
> It annoys me when I see the "pro-riders" doing dangerous rails without a helmet. And then knowing that my friend just died on a blue piste when going very slow...
> 
> ...


Sorry to hear about your friend.

Also its also a matter of people not thinking when doing something dangerous like going in the backcountry/out of bounds by themselves. Its also happens when people are just being stupid and not thinking like not wearing a helmet or thinking they can drop off 20 foot ciffs etc....


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Actually the 16 skier/rider deaths is all inbounds collisions. With trees, rocks, snocats, people, moose, elk, and yes avalanches (none in bounds). Out of bounds accidents are counted differently. I believe we are at our average for avalanche deaths at 6.

Skiing/riding inbounds is statistically far safer than flying. So overall it's a very safe sport. If you wear a helmet or not, it's not going to change the safety stats. It might make a difference to your friends and family though.


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

killclimbz said:


> Skiing/riding inbouds is statitically far safer than flying.


Cite, please? Common sense seems to dispel this claim. Somehow I don't think park riding is as safe as flying. I've hit my tailbone so many times over the past 20 years I can't even count it. I've never hit my tailbone, or anything else, on an aeroplane.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

It's something like 1 death in 20 million skier visits. And sedition thanks for quoting all my early morning misspelling. :laugh:

If it's not safer than flying, well it's safer than playing softball, swimming, soccer, etc. Still very safe from a numbers perspective. Not very safe if you are hitting a tree at 35mph...


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## sedition (Feb 8, 2007)

killclimbz said:


> It's something like 1 death in 20 million skier visits. And sedition thanks for quoting all my early morning misspelling. :laugh:
> 
> If it's not safer than flying, well it's safer than playing softball, swimming, soccer, etc. Still very safe from a numbers perspective. Not very safe if you are hitting a tree at 35mph...


Depends on how you are defining "safe." I've played baseball and softball (and flow in aeroplanes) for years. I've gotten far more injured riding than I have in all of the other activities combined. And I still ask for cites to the sources you are claiming.


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