# Stance Width Adjustment for Burton Reflex



## ashraff (Feb 23, 2018)

Hi all,

Just bought my first board and bindings... Got myself the Yes Typo and Burton Malavitas. 

I've noticed that the Burton Reflex bindings do not allow you to do any stance width adjustment but only the heel / toe adjustment. 

Is there an alternative disc i can use that will allow me to also do stance width adjustment? If so where could i get it from? 

I"m residing in Malaysia right now and would need to be an online purchase.

Thanks...


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

A fair few people make this complaint so you're not alone but personally I don't understand it? How much difference does going to the next set of holes actually make? If you want to focus on freestyle a touch wider might be a good thing. Likewise a touch narrower if you want to focus on carving. 

Binding angle will also have a big affect on your actual stance width because your ankles are actually actually at the end of your foot and not in the middle.

If you happen to be in the middle set of holes you could just turn the disc 90 degrees to give you a finer adjustment. 

As I said don't get it as I use various Reflex bindings on various boards and they all have slightly different stance widths - I'd have a really tough time noticing. I've even made a small mistake when setting up and not noticed a until I've gone to take the bindings off again. Binding angle has a much bigger effect on me.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

ashraff said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Just bought my first board and bindings... Got myself the Yes Typo and Burton Malavitas.
> 
> ...


Just write to Burton customers service. They'll send you those discs. 



Snow Hound said:


> A fair few people make this complaint so you're not alone but personally I don't understand it? How much difference does going to the next set of holes actually make? If you want to focus on freestyle a touch wider might be a good thing. Likewise a touch narrower if you want to focus on carving.
> 
> Binding angle will also have a big affect on your actual stance width because your ankles are actually actually at the end of your foot and not in the middle.
> 
> ...


I'm the contrary. I feel the difference of 1cm stance width immediately. Feel constricted. Few degrees of angle shift? Idk. Honestly? I have to look up angles alla time. Can't memorise them. it's something around 18/6, but wouldn't be surprized, if on some boards, it's 15/3 or 18/3 or 15/9. Dunno. All fine. But I surely know that every board has 58.5cm stance width cos any other number feels odd


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## ashraff (Feb 23, 2018)

Snow Hound said:


> A fair few people make this complaint so you're not alone but personally I don't understand it? How much difference does going to the next set of holes actually make? If you want to focus on freestyle a touch wider might be a good thing. Likewise a touch narrower if you want to focus on carving.
> 
> Binding angle will also have a big affect on your actual stance width because your ankles are actually actually at the end of your foot and not in the middle.
> 
> ...


Yeah i can understand that this may not be a priority to some... however i just feel that having that ability to change my stance width even slightly would be great. After all its all about rider feel.


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## ashraff (Feb 23, 2018)

neni said:


> Just write to Burton customers service. They'll send you those discs.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm the contrary. I feel the difference of 1cm stance width immediately. Feel constricted. Few degrees of angle shift? Idk. Honestly? I have to look up angles alla time. Can't memorise them. it's something around 18/6, but wouldn't be surprized, if on some boards, it's 15/3 or 18/3 or 15/9. Dunno. All fine. But I surely know that every board has 58.5cm stance width cos any other number feels odd


Yeah i've written to Burton about 6 days ago and yet no reply. So am wondering if i need to write to them again or go elsewhere if necessary. What say you?


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

another alternative to find the disc

https://www.fixmybinding.com/


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

ashraff said:


> Yeah i've written to Burton about 6 days ago and yet no reply. So am wondering if i need to write to them again or go elsewhere if necessary. What say you?


Maybe call? Dunno how US custommer service usually works... Euro one is reliable and answers within few days.


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

ashraff said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Just bought my first board and bindings... Got myself the Yes Typo and Burton Malavitas.
> 
> ...


Ugh, I suppose there are no snowboard shops in Malaysia hey?
Maybe join some snowboard groups on facebook. I know Snowboardtraders has a lot of shops and just helpful people who probably have the part you need for way less that retail. I'm sure shipping will be crazy tho.


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

ashraff said:


> Yeah i've written to Burton about 6 days ago and yet no reply. So am wondering if i need to write to them again or go elsewhere if necessary. What say you?


Try again. They are known for customer service, or so I'm lead to believe.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Burton has those discs, you can call them instead of emailing and stuff.
But you lose the Reflex functionality, plus you lose heel/toe adjustability to center your boots on the board, which is far more important than a very precise stance width. 

If you're that picky about a precise stance width; then either trade your board for a channel board, or trade the bindings for Union or Rome bindings with an adjustable heelcup.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

Snow Hound said:


> If you happen to be in the middle set of holes you could just turn the disc 90 degrees to give you a finer adjustment.


Nope, can't do that with the Burton reflex disks.



neni said:


> Just write to Burton customers service. They'll send you those discs.


This. And...



neni said:


> Maybe call? Dunno how US custommer service usually works... Euro one is reliable and answers within few days.


...yes, might have to try a couple of different rider services because there is customer service team responsible for SE Asia. US team will usually pass it to the Australia team or sometimes to Japan. Somebody should be able to help eventiually.


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## Bertieman (Jan 19, 2014)

So I also got a pair of malavitas and raised this same question to burton. First off, let me assure you their entire team is clueless; why they don't have an adjustable heel cup and better mounting discs is BEYOND me. I have the same stance width issue as you, plus I also have super heel overhang. My mounting discs are all the way forward and I have way more heel overhang than toe overhang. The issues with burton adjustability also goes for the toe/heel length as well as our stance width issue. 

This is what their response was: 

"Thank you for providing me with that photo. Based on the image, I do not imagine you would have difficulty with heal drag. 

Our hard good's specialist confirmed to me that adjusting the heel cup with our binding would not solve this specific problem. 

If you are able to, I would suggest downsizing to a Medium binding for a smaller footprint."

Point proven, their 'goods specialist' doesn't know anything about binding adjustability outside of burton. I know my toe/heel overhang issue is different than yours, but it plays a part in how their adjustability blows chunks.


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

Bertieman said:


> So I also got a pair of malavitas and raised this same question to burton. First off, let me assure you their entire team is clueless; why they don't have an adjustable heel cup and better mounting discs is BEYOND me. I have the same stance width issue as you, plus I also have super heel overhang. My mounting discs are all the way forward and I have way more heel overhang than toe overhang. The issues with burton adjustability also goes for the toe/heel length as well as our stance width issue.
> 
> This is what their response was:
> 
> ...


Wow that's kinda fucked up that they say an image is more correct than your real world experience.


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## Bertieman (Jan 19, 2014)

freshy said:


> Wow that's kinda fucked up that they say an image is more correct than your real world experience.


Well there is clearly more heel overhang than toe. They are suggesting the overhang would not cause heel drag. May it wouldn't, but there is literally like half a cm of toe overhand and over an inch of heel overhang, so I'm just hinting there adjustability is lacking.


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Bertieman said:


> freshy said:
> 
> 
> > Wow that's kinda fucked up that they say an image is more correct than your real world experience.
> ...


The reason Rider Services gave you the andwer they did is cause your heel toe overhang issues are cause you're in the wrong size binding. If you're that far off of center pushed forward the you're in the wrong size binding. Sorry. There are plenty of brands that do unibody frames like Burton. Flux, K2, Salomon, Fix. There are benefits and drawbacks. There are also plenty that do offer 2 piece frames. So if it bothers you that much get something else. It doesn't mean Burton makes a bad binding. Complaining about Burton not doing 2 peice frames is like complaining that Venture doesn't make jib decks. It's not what they do, others do though.


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## JDA (Feb 10, 2016)

I had this same problem when using my burton genesis reflex on my springbreak twin. Being a twin I wanted the bindings centered on the board but one setting gave me a very narrow stance and the next size up meant I had to move both front and rear to the next holes to keep centered and this was way too wide. 

I solved the problem with a pair of union contacts, great adjustability on those!

Having to buy new bindings was not a big deal either because the genesis actually gave me a perfect stance when I put them on my recently purchased amplid pillowtalk.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

Bertieman said:


> So I also got a pair of malavitas and raised this same question to burton. First off, let me assure you their entire team is clueless; why they don't have an adjustable heel cup and better mounting discs is BEYOND me. I have the same stance width issue as you, plus I also have super heel overhang. My mounting discs are all the way forward and I have way more heel overhang than toe overhang. The issues with burton adjustability also goes for the toe/heel length as well as our stance width issue.


Erm no, the issue is you have the wrong size binding and/or board.



Nivek said:


> The reason Rider Services gave you the andwer they did is cause your heel toe overhang issues are cause you're in the wrong size binding. If you're that far off of center pushed forward the you're in the wrong size binding. Sorry. There are plenty of brands that do unibody frames like Burton. Flux, K2, Salomon, Fix. There are benefits and drawbacks. There are also plenty that do offer 2 piece frames. So if it bothers you that much get something else. It doesn't mean Burton makes a bad binding. Complaining about Burton not doing 2 peice frames is like complaining that Venture doesn't make jib decks. It's not what they do, others do though.


Exactly


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## Bertieman (Jan 19, 2014)

SGboarder said:


> Bertieman said:
> 
> 
> > So I also got a pair of malavitas and raised this same question to burton. First off, let me assure you their entire team is clueless; why they don't have an adjustable heel cup and better mounting discs is BEYOND me. I have the same stance width issue as you, plus I also have super heel overhang. My mounting discs are all the way forward and I have way more heel overhang than toe overhang. The issues with burton adjustability also goes for the toe/heel length as well as our stance width issue.
> ...


My boot fits 100% fine into the ADVERTISED 10+ boot size binding. It's not my fault they have over priced trash that lacks adjustability in both stance width and toe/heel adjustments. I even got a second opinion at a burton shop and they said they wouldn't even try putting a size 11 non burton boot in any medium burton binding.


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

They have plenty width adjustability in channel, so they don't experience that problem with reflex, but size 11ish is kinda fucked with Burton either way. You can ride with it fine, at least with most Burton boots, but you won't get it centered in a large, mediums could be fine, but could also be too narrow.


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Flex Seal advertises you can put a screen door on the bottom of your dingy. Gonna?

I could not care less what the Burton store told you. Regrettably, they are not an authority. I know a guy at one of ours that more or less flat out refuses to ride anything without channel and infinite ride claiming anything without as inferior. He bothers me.

I put 10's into larges all the time. Just depends on the boot. I also put 11's in mediums all the time. Depends on the boot. I guess you just expect Burton to go out and make sure that every single boot fits perfectly into their bindings. My bad.

In fact, my Burton's are the bulkiest boots I've owned in the last 4 years. My DC 8.5s were smaller than my 8 Almightys, my Ride Fuses are like a full size smaller footprint than the Burton's. I pretty much had to shelve my Lien FS last year cause my Burton's didn't fit into the M, which say they fit an 8. Did you see me get on the interwebz and throw a bitch fit? Nope. 

Again, if you feel like Burton has wronged you so, then sell/return them and buy something else. Woopdy doo. No-one is holding you're cat hostage to make you use them.


Edit: If their discs are so trashally designed, then why don't you show us how you'd get edge to edge adjustment, tip to tail adjustment, and Reflex all on one disc without it braking at the first ollie? I'll wait.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Bertieman said:


> My boot fits 100% fine into the ADVERTISED 10+ boot size binding. It's not my fault they have over priced trash that lacks adjustability in both stance width and toe/heel adjustments. I even got a second opinion at a burton shop and they said they wouldn't even try putting a size 11 non burton boot in any medium burton binding.


Absolutely clueless.


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## Vincent Gagnon (Dec 22, 2017)

F1EA said:


> Burton has those discs, you can call them instead of emailing and stuff.
> But you lose the Reflex functionality, plus you lose heel/toe adjustability to center your boots on the board, which is far more important than a very precise stance width.
> 
> If you're that picky about a precise stance width; then either trade your board for a channel board, or trade the bindings for Union or Rome bindings with an adjustable heelcup.


I have the same problem (I got a new twin and a brand new pair of cartels and I want the bindings to be centered.

Do you think one would lose the Reflex functionnality with these?


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Vincent Gagnon said:


> I have the same problem (I got a new twin and a brand new pair of cartels and I want the bindings to be centered.
> 
> Do you think one would lose the Reflex functionnality with these?


Yeah those are the discs. With these ones, you do not lose Reflex if you use them to adjust stance width or if you use them on a channel board. But you would lose it if you want to use the discs to center the boots to the board width.


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## Vincent Gagnon (Dec 22, 2017)

F1EA said:


> Yeah those are the discs. With these ones, you do not lose Reflex if you use them to adjust stance width or if you use them on a channel board. But you would lose it if you want to use the discs to center the boots to the board width.


Yeah, that's what I figured out.

I'm my case, I do not need the heel/toe adjustment.

Any idea where I can find these quickly?

The only one I can find are in Europe.
(I'm in Canada by the way)


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

Vincent Gagnon said:


> Yeah, that's what I figured out.
> 
> I'm my case, I do not need the heel/toe adjustment.
> 
> ...


Fixmybinding.com


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Vincent Gagnon said:


> Yeah, that's what I figured out.
> 
> I'm my case, I do not need the heel/toe adjustment.
> 
> ...


Yes, so if you have these discs plus the ones that came w the bidings, then you have the two options. 

If you're in Canada its easier: just contact Burton canada support and they will sort you out either by email or phone. The other option is if you have any authorized Burton dealers or shops nearby; they typically have all this extra little bits around if you need them.


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

^That^

...naturally, if'n you kin git free? By all means, git it!! >


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## Vincent Gagnon (Dec 22, 2017)

F1EA said:


> Yes, so if you have these discs plus the ones that came w the bidings, then you have the two options.
> 
> If you're in Canada its easier: just contact Burton canada support and they will sort you out either by email or phone. The other option is if you have any authorized Burton dealers or shops nearby; they typically have all this extra little bits around if you need them.


Yeah, already done that.
Local shop never heard of them and Burton is closed for the weekend, will try tomorrow, 

thanks.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

chomps1211 said:


> ^That^
> 
> ...naturally, if'n you kin git free? By all means, git it!! >


Hahah yes, free is better.

Also, I think Burton canada headquarters are in Eastern canada, so close to you. Should be quicker shipping.

Many times the shops have the parts, but the kids on the floor have no idea, don't even know what it is, don't want to go out and look for little stuff that makes them no $.


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## Giannis (Oct 20, 2011)

I contacted Burton Europe about those same discs a few days ago and they said that they don't have them in stock, as they stopped producing them a few years ago.

Sent from my MI MAX 3 using Tapatalk


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Giannis said:


> I contacted Burton Europe about those same discs a few days ago and they said that they don't have them in stock, as they stopped producing them a few years ago.
> 
> Sent from my MI MAX 3 using Tapatalk


Yeah, likely because those discs are pointless. Not needed.


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## Vincent Gagnon (Dec 22, 2017)

F1EA said:


> Yeah, likely because those discs are pointless. Not needed.


Well, they can be useful for a twin setup.

Without them, I have a choice of 24 or 22 and a half inches stance (keeping in mind I want the board to be symmetrical.

And the fact that they have them in stock kind of cancel your point.

I simply do not understand why you would claim that nose/tail adjustability is pointless.

Oh well...



If this can help anybody, I've simply called Burton and they are sending these discs my way for free.


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## Giannis (Oct 20, 2011)

Vincent Gagnon said:


> Well, they can be useful for a twin setup.
> 
> Without them, I have a choice of 24 or 22 and a half inches stance (keeping in mind I want the board to be symmetrical.
> 
> ...


I think he was being ironic. Which Burton did you call?


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## Vincent Gagnon (Dec 22, 2017)

Giannis said:


> I think he was being ironic. Which Burton did you call?


Ah!, maybe he was, hard to know sometimes without the subtilities of spoken language

I called this number: 800 881-3138. 

I gues you can call it the North American division.


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

I'm still baffled by all of this? 1.5" between options really isn't that much and means you can never be more than 3/4" away from where you really really want to be.

I've done some calculations and come to the conclusion that this issue is mostly in your heads.


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## Vincent Gagnon (Dec 22, 2017)

Snow Hound said:


> I'm still baffled by all of this? 1.5" between options really isn't that much and means you can never be more than 3/4" away from where you really really want to be.
> 
> I've done some calculations and come to the conclusion that this issue is mostly in your heads.


Yep, 3/4 of an inch sounds about right.

In my particular case, I'm exactly 3/4 of an inch too wide or too narrow, I would prefer to be exactly in the middle (that's been my prefered stance for years).

Is 3/4 of an inch the end of the world?: no.
Is in all in my head?: maybe.

But since this "problem" is fixable for free with just a phone call...I mean, why not?


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Snow Hound said:


> I'm still baffled by all of this? 1.5" between options really isn't that much and means you can never be more than 3/4" away from where you really really want to be.
> 
> I've done some calculations and come to the conclusion that this issue is mostly in your heads.


Lol. Some are just more sensitive. Oh hell, if someone mocks with my car seat adjustment! :laugh:


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

neni said:


> Lol. Some are just more sensitive. Oh hell, if someone mocks with my car seat adjustment! [emoji23]


But you already said that messing with your angles is bearly noticeable? Doing so could affect where your heels sit more than the 2cm we're talking about here. It doesn't seem possible to me that you can be affected by one and not the other as the two are inextricably linked - they both affect how far apart your heels are and therefore your actual stance width.

Say you're a whole 2cm narrower than you'd ideally like to be - could you not just reduce your binding angles a few degrees pushing your heel(s) out to make up the difference? 

Messing around on my kitchen floor this morning makes it obvious that there's way more biomechanical stuff going on in the relationship between ankle, knee and hip position than I'm accounting for here.

I'm still convinced that this problem is at the very least partly psychosomatic and that a little tweek of binding angles could have you feeling comfortable again at slightly suboptimal stance widths.

All those long words have you convinced right?  I'm supposed to be looking after my little boy today but I might be getting all my snowboards out and showing him what a total geek his dad is.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Snow Hound said:


> All those long words have you convinced right?  I'm supposed to be looking after my little boy today but I might be getting all my snowboards out and showing him what a total geek his dad is.


Lol. coworkers look bewildered as I'm now n doing weird foot angle shifts during break 

The angle may affect heel position, but it doesn't affect my knee/hip position. Sure, angle affects knee/hip _rotation_ (and as such, how aggressively I can move over the front leg), but not the position of knee over center of foot. That position is determined by stance width. For me and my knock knees.


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

neni said:


> Lol. Some are just more sensitive. *Oh hell, if someone mocks with my car seat adjustment! *:laugh:




*Oh HELL No!!!*
Don't you dare mess with my car seats adjustment!!! :laugh:

.... but honestly? When it comes to stance width? I guess Im one of those _insensitive_ clowns.  :laugh:

I started out on my Arbor Roundhouse, learning to ride with a 19.25" stance. It was pointed out to me that, that was too narrow for a guy my size. (6'-32" inseam!) So I Opened it up to 21.75 or so and did find that to work a bit better. (...more stable, somewhat less toppley!) 

I still ride with _that_ stance on that board, but I ride my shorter NS & Jones decks at over 23" & 24" stance. And I regularly switch between all 3 boards during a days riding. I can't say that 3 inch difference is all that noticeable! (...btw, that is *NOT* what _she_ said!) :blink: 

Not only that, but I will borrow & try out a buddy's ride on occasion. It's not like Im changing up his boards setup for a run or two. I just adjust. :shrug: 

If the OP is _this_ freaking sensitive to a 3/4" change in stance,... methinks they need to buy a channel system board. Then you can go Hog Wild with how much you fine tune & adjust your stance. Your only limit will be min/max width. Heel/Toe adjustments will be practically infinite as well. 

My 2¢! >


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Vincent Gagnon said:


> Ah!, maybe he was, hard to know sometimes without the subtilities of spoken language
> 
> I called this number: 800 881-3138.
> 
> I gues you can call it the North American division.


Hahaha
No, not ironic.

Those discs are unnecessary. 

Lots of pointless stuff is available, in stock... ready to be sold... waiting for its rightful owner...
So that doesn't really cancel any point.

I also didn't say tip to tail adjustability is pointless. I said the discs are pointless. 

In any case, I was not trying to prove any point. The discs are there. You can get them for free and relatively easy. If you think they are important, go ahead and get them.


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## Vincent Gagnon (Dec 22, 2017)

F1EA said:


> Hahaha
> No, not ironic.
> 
> Those discs are unnecessary.
> ...


Yeah, like I said, I'm not obsessing, but they are there.

I ride different stances all the time (going from hardboots to freestyle to freeride).

On this board, I just want to be as wide as possible without having the impression that my knees are going to tear.
I can do without the heel/toe adjustability with a 305mm waist...mouhahahhahaha.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Vincent Gagnon said:


> Yeah, like I said, I'm not obsessing, but they are there.
> 
> I ride different stances all the time (going from hardboots to freestyle to freeride).
> 
> ...


Yes of course, they are easy to get, and if they are available.... why not get them? even if just for experimenting and to realize on your own whether you need them or not.

I also ride different stances, width and even angles. It makes no real difference (and even at bigger differences than 1cm here and there). I mean, there's very minute differences, but nothing that 'affects' riding in any way.


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## Vincent Gagnon (Dec 22, 2017)

F1EA said:


> Yes of course, they are easy to get, and if they are available.... why not get them? even if just for experimenting and to realize on your own whether you need them or not.
> 
> I also ride different stances, width and even angles. It makes no real difference (and even at bigger differences than 1cm here and there). I mean, there's very minute differences, but nothing that 'affects' riding in any way.


Amen to that.


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