# Need help with Union factory bindings



## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

I just got a pair of union factory bindings and no matter what I do I can't get the ankle strap to fit over my boot centered it's hard to even get the ratchet to grab the ladder. 
I got the M/L and my boot is a burton imperial size 9.5
Everything is adjusted the strap is at the longest setting. It seems like the strap itself is to small.


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## jojotherider (Mar 17, 2011)

^^he's having trouble with the ankle strap, not the toe strap.

OP - adjust the heel cup so your boot sits further back in the binding.


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## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

Heal cup is adjusted all the way back. It's in position 2.


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## trapper (Jan 15, 2013)

NB2 said:


> I just got a pair of union factory bindings and no matter what I do I can't get the ankle strap to fit over my boot centered it's hard to even get the ratchet to grab the ladder.
> I got the M/L and my boot is a burton imperial size 9.5
> Everything is adjusted the strap is at the longest setting. It seems like the strap itself is to small.


Pretty sure you explained it well enough, but honestly if you could post up a picture it would greatly help us in helping you. 

I'm rocking a 13 boot and am in a L/XL Factory and with my ankle strap I've still got room to spare. So while you may be correct, it's hard to believe that the M/L (which go up to size 11 I think) won't fit correctly. That's why a picture would help; we could rule out any obvious user error immediately.


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## buggravy (Feb 19, 2008)

NB2 said:


> I just got a pair of union factory bindings and no matter what I do I can't get the ankle strap to fit over my boot centered it's hard to even get the ratchet to grab the ladder.
> I got the M/L and my boot is a burton imperial size 9.5
> Everything is adjusted the strap is at the longest setting. It seems like the strap itself is to small.


I'm guessing you're talking about this year's Factory? From last years to this years they changed the adjuster for the ankle strap, and for some reason that adjuster is about an inch shorter than last year. I wear size 10 Kaijus in the M/L binding, and last years fit with room to spare. This years do fit, but I have the length maxed out on the strap. Might be worth calling C3 to see if they'll send you a couple of the adjusters from last year if they have them.


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## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

Yes its for this years binding. 

I spoke to c3 shop and all they said was that it should fit and that I could buy parts from the L/XL bindings off their website to try them out. 

I will get pictures up later today of the boot in the binding.


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## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

Here's the pictures. Boot is laced tight as if it were being worn. The ratchets are tight and only gets a few clicks on the ladder. Not sure if you can see it from the picture but the strap is starting to push into the boot also.


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## jojotherider (Mar 17, 2011)

did you try the l/xl binding? I wear a size 10 boot and I went with the l/xl. I had a pair of medium Atlas bindings, but I didn't like everything maxed out. The only problem you might have is that the base could be too wide. I think you should see if you can exchange them.

Only reason I suggest that is because I don't think you should have to buy extra parts to make the bindings fit. It may only be $5, but you also have to wait for it. Its a small thing, but they should be ready to go out of the box. Its not like you're buying custom made bindings or something.

-joel


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## jojotherider (Mar 17, 2011)

I just noticed something in the third pic, you have a gap between the highback and the heel cup. what's going on there? did you adjust the highback forward or something? I have 3 sets of union bindings right now and I don't think any of them have that gap.


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## trapper (Jan 15, 2013)

Looks like you're losing some space between the highback and the heelcup. I don't know if you can adjust that highback to rest more closely to the heelcup or not, but it might give you more room.


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## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

I Haven't tried the L/XL because I think it will be to big especially with the reduced footprint on the Burton Imperials.

The forward lean adjusted is set to zero cant go any further back unless I take the adjuster off. But even that doesn't give me anywhere near what I need.


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## jojotherider (Mar 17, 2011)

Did you get yours from a shop or online? Is there a shop nearby you could check out the sizing?

I think the high back has some different mounting holes. Try use the outer most hole for the high back. It could get you a little more room.


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## trapper (Jan 15, 2013)

Yea you need to move that highback further back into the heelcup if you can. I have last year's model and my highbacks rest directly against the heelcup with no gap whatsoever.


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## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

Only way to get the highback flush is to remove the adjuster completely. Even when that is done there is still no way to get the strap to fit correctly. See pictures


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## buggravy (Feb 19, 2008)

My hunch is if you strap in and do a couple of laps things will settle in, and the straps will compress/stretch to fit fine. That was the case with my Navigators. That said, it is pretty ridiculous that they fit a 9.5 boot like that out of the box. Don't Imperials have some degree of shrinkage tech to them as well? Though maybe that just applies to heel to toe length.


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## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

You might be right with them stretching but its not something I want to risk. If they don't stretch I'm out $250 on a set of bindings I can't use. 

The imperials do have a reduced footprint and they don't seem bulky at all.

If I can't get to the bottom of this soon I'm probably going to have to return these and pick up a pair of FLux Sf or Rome Targa bindings.


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## jojotherider (Mar 17, 2011)

you should really try the bigger size. I know that it won't be according to the sizing chart, but its worth a try. did you get these from a local shop or online?


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## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

Got them online. I had a credit from something I returned. Also no stores near me carried the Factory only the Forces and Contact Pro's.


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## trapper (Jan 15, 2013)

I wouldn't bank on them stretching too much. Mine didn't.


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## Brewtown (Feb 16, 2014)

Did you make any adjustments to rotate the highback? What hole do you have the highbacks mounted to the heel loop at?


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## jojotherider (Mar 17, 2011)

NB2 said:


> Got them online. I had a credit from something I returned. Also no stores near me carried the Factory only the Forces and Contact Pro's.


The sizing ought to be the same. I have the Contact Pro, Atlas, and the Capita Bad Ass collab (which is really just the force with the team high back). I've set them all up exactly the same and all fit the same. I had the Atlas in m/l and they were a little too small for my liking. I had to max everything out.

I would still go in with your boots and see how the fit is. I think the Factory has an Atlas baseplate.


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## buggravy (Feb 19, 2008)

buggravy said:


> I'm guessing you're talking about this year's Factory? From last years to this years they changed the adjuster for the ankle strap, and for some reason that adjuster is about an inch shorter than last year. I wear size 10 Kaijus in the M/L binding, and last years fit with room to spare. This years do fit, but I have the length maxed out on the strap. Might be worth calling C3 to see if they'll send you a couple of the adjusters from last year if they have them.


I have to correct myself here. I bought both the TRice binding, and Factory from this year. The strap on the Trice binding barely fit, but ultimately it did. After posting this I realized I hadn't actually adjusted the straps on the Factory binding yet, because they were on a board I hadn't ridden. Went to do that the other day, and they were definitely too short for my size 10 Kaijus. Even though the strap on the TRice is more streamlined, there is one more adjustment hole on the strap than there is on the Factory. In last year's Factory I'm one hole away from the max setting, and it centers perfectly.


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## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

Yeah I maxed mine out and couldn't get it even close to fitting a size 9.5. I ended up returning them. Now I'm trying to decide if I wan to give it another shot but with the L/XL or just switch all together to Rome Targas.


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## buggravy (Feb 19, 2008)

NB2 said:


> Yeah I maxed mine out and couldn't get it even close to fitting a size 9.5. I ended up returning them. Now I'm trying to decide if I wan to give it another shot but with the L/XL or just switch all together to Rome Targas.


That base plate in L/XL is pretty big. I had a pair of Atlas in that size a couple years back with the same model boot that I have now, and there was quite a bit of room on either side of my boot, and more overhang than I wanted at the toe. Functionally I wouldn't say that it presented a problem that I could discern, but it didn't look like a great fit. The Factory from last year is my favorite binding ever, and I'm sure you would have no issues with fit on that. Maybe keep a look out on ebay, or elsewhere to see if some pop up.


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## jojotherider (Mar 17, 2011)

i'm going to voice my opinion again that you should take your boots into a local store and test fit them. even if its not the same binding it should still give you ball park on size. The Targas have a lot of adjustments as well, but how are you going to know if the sizing will fit?


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## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

jojotherider said:


> i'm going to voice my opinion again that you should take your boots into a local store and test fit them. even if its not the same binding it should still give you ball park on size. The Targas have a lot of adjustments as well, but how are you going to know if the sizing will fit?


I am going to test fit them this time. Either way I had to return the M/L because there was no way my boots would fit in them. My friend has the Targas and I will get to try them tomorrow. As for the Unions I will have to find a local shop that carries them and test fit there. After that I will decide which way I want to go. 

I am still shocked that a size 9.5 will not fit in the M/L which should fit up to a size 11 boot.


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## jojotherider (Mar 17, 2011)

maybe it got the mounting straps from women's bindings. but yeah, that's crazy.


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## Extremo (Nov 6, 2008)

NB2 said:


> Here's the pictures. Boot is laced tight as if it were being worn. The ratchets are tight and only gets a few clicks on the ladder. Not sure if you can see it from the picture but the strap is starting to push into the boot also.


Damn...they changed the connector design. IDK what was wrong with the other one. If it ain't broke, don't fuck with it.


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## ekb18c (Mar 11, 2013)

I thought I read somewhere that you can get last years factory connector or get L/XL one and it should work better. I don't know if there a cost involved though.


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## Jcb890 (Dec 12, 2014)

I was going to make a thread, but wanted to wait until I got everything resolved. I am in a similar situation to the OP (NB2). I figure I may as well post my experience in this thread. Hopefully it will help someone.

I purchased a set of the L/XL Union Factory bindings and have a size 13 Thirty-Two Focus BOA boot.

Immediately I noticed that the Union Factory bindings simply do not have long enough ankle straps. Period. I have spoken with Union a few times and I suggested that they make more than a One-Size-Fits-All set of straps. Next year they plan to have different length straps depending on the size of the binding.

Now, I was able to get the toe straps to fit and work once I moved them to the front-most settings. They're on the last hole for length setting, but that should be OK. The ankle straps... that's not happening. There's no way they're going to fit. The closest I can possibly get them to fitting is with the boot as tight as it will go and I can get 1 ratchet click if I really try hard at it. It is not a functioning ankle strap though. There is no way it would be useful on the mountain attempting to get it to strap.

So, I spoke to the guys at Union. They were quite pleasant and helpful. The end result? They are sending me a new set of straps which I believe will be last year's straps since they are a bit longer. I have not gotten the new straps yet, but I hope to get them by tomorrow or Friday. I will report back whether this allows me to strap in at the ankle.


Also, my highback sits just like in the OP's pictures. In order for the highback to sit flush against the heelcup, the part must be entirely removed. Otherwise, the closest you can get it is with a small gap. So, should I remove the piece back there so it will sit flush against the heelcup? I assume the piece is on there because that is how they are designed to work, right? I'm not entirely sure why they do it that way, since I wouldn't think too many people ride with their highbacks tilted forward, but whatever.

Thoughts?


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## Extremo (Nov 6, 2008)

The bindings had been dialed. I don't know why they had to go fuck this up. The old connector works flawlessly.


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## deepers (Dec 7, 2011)

Jcb890 said:


> I was going to make a thread, but wanted to wait until I got everything resolved. I am in a similar situation to the OP (NB2). I figure I may as well post my experience in this thread. Hopefully it will help someone.
> 
> I purchased a set of the L/XL Union Factory bindings and have a size 13 Thirty-Two Focus BOA boot.
> 
> ...


I too just bought the new Factories and feared the same problem. Size L/XL binding, with a 11.5 DriverX boot but might have a simple solution.

When doing a dry fit with just the boot and binding it was almost impossible to even get the strap fed into the ratchet with all straps on the furthest out setting. I was about to call it quits and start packing things up to send back when I thought I should try it again with my foot in the boots fully laced up and see how that worked. When I did this the strap fit way easier and is pretty much centered.

I agree that it shouldn't even be that close, but if you try the boots while they're on your foot and laced up, it also frees up some space and might work for those with some fit issues. I haven't been able to get out on the slopes yet to try them out, but at least everything seems to fit like it should.

cheers


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## lab49232 (Sep 13, 2011)

Have you strapped them in with your foot in the boot? Its actually amazing how much boot profile shrink when you put them on and tighten them. Doubt it's that easy but it's at least a thought.


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## Jcb890 (Dec 12, 2014)

deepers said:


> I too just bought the new Factories and feared the same problem. Size L/XL binding, with a 11.5 DriverX boot but might have a simple solution.
> 
> When doing a dry fit with just the boot and binding it was almost impossible to even get the strap fed into the ratchet with all straps on the furthest out setting. I was about to call it quits and start packing things up to send back when I thought I should try it again with my foot in the boots fully laced up and see how that worked. When I did this the strap fit way easier and is pretty much centered.
> 
> ...


Yes, I did that. The ankle strap was only able to click once like I said in my prior post. Sure, that may constitute as technically being strapped in, but that is not acceptable. The ankle strap is too short. Period.



lab49232 said:


> Have you strapped them in with your foot in the boot? Its actually amazing how much boot profile shrink when you put them on and tighten them. Doubt it's that easy but it's at least a thought.


If this was directed at me, yes I did. It did provide a tiny bit more room to latch the ankle strap, but only got 1 "click" out of it. And even then, it was a struggle.


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## deepers (Dec 7, 2011)

Jcb890 said:


> Yes, I did that. The ankle strap was only able to click once like I said in my prior post. Sure, that may constitute as technically being strapped in, but that is not acceptable. The ankle strap is too short. Period.
> 
> 
> 
> If this was directed at me, yes I did. It did provide a tiny bit more room to latch the ankle strap, but only got 1 "click" out of it. And even then, it was a struggle.


Cool, yeah 1 click is not clicked in. If I didn't think it was a hassle to return mine (even though they do fit) I think I'd rather have my other choice now, which would have been the Flux SFs...maybe next time.

To be fair, I haven't tested the bindings out yet, but with the lunacy of short straps, I'm crossing my fingers that that will be the only issue with these...


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## NB2 (Feb 12, 2014)

I also tried it with my foot in the boot no different than the picture. 
It's almost to tight when strapped in because the strap is so short and you have to apply pressure to get the strap locked down.

Besides the ankle strap the bindings look and feel solid. Wish I could have used them but I don't think they will work for me even if I go with the L/XL.


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## Jcb890 (Dec 12, 2014)

Nobody has answered whether the adjustable piece for the highback should be removed either. That is the only way to get the highback to sit flush against the heel cup.

Should this piece be removed so it sits flush or should it be left alone?


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## deepers (Dec 7, 2011)

Jcb890 said:


> Nobody has answered whether the adjustable piece for the highback should be removed either. That is the only way to get the highback to sit flush against the heel cup.
> 
> Should this piece be removed so it sits flush or should it be left alone?


For some reason, my highback came attached in the forward position which left a small 1/4' gap between it and the heel cup when the high back was resting on the adjuster.

Because I had to unscrew everything to adjust it, I just reattached the highback with it fitting flush to the heel cup, still attached to the adjuster and everything fits nice and flush now.

You might want to see if there are holes left to attach your highback tighter to the heel cup. If you over rotate it to account for a super duck stance, you might not have enough play to do it.


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## Jcb890 (Dec 12, 2014)

deepers said:


> For some reason, my highback came attached in the forward position which left a small 1/4' gap between it and the heel cup when the high back was resting on the adjuster.
> 
> Because I had to unscrew everything to adjust it, I just reattached the highback with it fitting flush to the heel cup, still attached to the adjuster and everything fits nice and flush now.
> 
> You might want to see if there are holes left to attach your highback tighter to the heel cup. If you over rotate it to account for a super duck stance, you might not have enough play to do it.


How did you rotate yours to make it sit flush? Both highbacks are in the center of the 3 holes on each side, that's how it came out of the box. Did you rotate them a bit to have them sit flush?


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## deepers (Dec 7, 2011)

Jcb890 said:


> How did you rotate yours to make it sit flush? Both highbacks are in the center of the 3 holes on each side, that's how it came out of the box. Did you rotate them a bit to have them sit flush?


I did rotate them, but I don't know if I needed to in order to make them fit. The board is buried in the garage someplace but I want to say its maybe middle hole one side and farthest out hole on the other. If they're on the middle holes now, couldn't you just reattach them to the farthest out hole, thereby moving the high back towards the heel cup?


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## grimsontyde (Oct 13, 2011)

After rotating the highback on my union t.rice bindings I also noticed the small gap between the heel hoop and highback, I cant seem get rid of it. Today Im going to have to mess around with them cause the stock forward lean is killing the back of my calfs.


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## Jcb890 (Dec 12, 2014)

grimsontyde said:


> After rotating the highback on my union t.rice bindings I also noticed the small gap between the heel hoop and highback, I cant seem get rid of it. Today Im going to have to mess around with them cause the stock forward lean is killing the back of my calfs.


I went and rotated my highbacks on my Union Factory bindings and now the highbacks sit flush against the heelcups.

I also got my "new" ankle straps in yesterday (*FINALLY* - shipping took forever) and they fit! One thing I'm not a big fan of though, is that the ankle straps they sent are Union _FORCE_ straps and they are not nearly as nice looking and seem to be lacking in quality compared to the Factory straps. These Force straps will work for now, but I informed Union that I am disappointed that I am forced to replace my nice Factory straps with not-so-nice Force straps. We will see what happens, but at least I have functional bindings now.


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## grimsontyde (Oct 13, 2011)

Interesting that you rotated the highbacks and got them flush..I ride 15/15 so that might be why I am stillseeing the gap. I ended up removing the forward lean adjusters and now they sit back flush, I see how it rides tomorrow.


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## Jcb890 (Dec 12, 2014)

grimsontyde said:


> Interesting that you rotated the highbacks and got them flush..I ride 15/15 so that might be why I am stillseeing the gap. I ended up removing the forward lean adjusters and now they sit back flush, I see how it rides tomorrow.


I think I am going to try and ride 15/-3 to start off this season with my new gear. I think previously I was 15/-5 or -8 on my last setup, but I want to lessen that a bit and get closer to 0 or even work my way towards a positive back foot.

With the highbacks on the stock setting out of the box (middle hole on both sides), there was a small gap and could not sit flush due to adjuster. But, now with them being rotated a bit to fit my stance, they sit flush.


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## jojotherider (Mar 17, 2011)

why do you want to work your way towards a positive back foot?


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## Jcb890 (Dec 12, 2014)

jojotherider said:


> why do you want to work your way towards a positive back foot?


I've always had a goofy stance around 15/-8, but I don't really put that -8 back foot to use ever.

I don't ride in the park at all and I'm looking to be able to carve my best. I have been hearing from some people that duck stance is not ideal for this type of riding. So, I'd like to start @ -3 or possibly 0 and maybe go to +3 or more as I see how it feels.

Also, my new board is a directional twin and generally do not ever ride switch, so that's even more reason to not bother with a negative back foot.

Perhaps what I'm thinking is just all incorrect, if so, hopefully someone can correct me.


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## Jcb890 (Dec 12, 2014)

Jcb890 said:


> I went and rotated my highbacks on my Union Factory bindings and now the highbacks sit flush against the heelcups.
> 
> I also got my "new" ankle straps in yesterday (*FINALLY* - shipping took forever) and they fit! One thing I'm not a big fan of though, is that the ankle straps they sent are Union _FORCE_ straps and they are not nearly as nice looking and seem to be lacking in quality compared to the Factory straps. These Force straps will work for now, but I informed Union that I am disappointed that I am forced to replace my nice Factory straps with not-so-nice Force straps. We will see what happens, but at least I have functional bindings now.


If anyone else has this problem, you can use the Union Factory ankle strap with the Union Force hardware where it attaches to the binding/heel cup. The straps themselves seem to be about the same length, it is just that the Factory hardware is shorter than the Force hardware.


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## StAntonRider (Dec 15, 2014)

Jcb890 said:


> I've always had a goofy stance around 15/-8, but I don't really put that -8 back foot to use ever.
> 
> I don't ride in the park at all and I'm looking to be able to carve my best. I have been hearing from some people that duck stance is not ideal for this type of riding. So, I'd like to start @ -3 or possibly 0 and maybe go to +3 or more as I see how it feels.
> 
> ...


Yeah, they call it alpine stance, and it is "better" for carving and straight lining. But it takes a while to get used to, esp when you get above +3 on that back foot. Never go negative on front foot. Ever.


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