# Purchasing for my son - please help me out!



## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

Please bare with me!!

Ok so it's my son's 18th soon and i am giving him a snowboard + bindings and boots for his birthday. 

We have the new board & i have the bindings chosen (Burton Cartel EST as recommended by Burton) but now i'm left feeling very overwhelmed by purchasing boots.

I'd like to get him Burtons and i'm looking at the Moto Boa, the Burton Swath Boa and Burton Ions. I've narrowed it down to these 3 for a few reasons, the main one being i have to purchase online and those are what's available in a variety of sizes. Trying anything on isn't an option as we live too far away from anywhere that sells snowboard gear. It's also a surprise so i can't really measure his feet.

He's normally a 9.5 in Vans, 10.5 in Nike runners.

My question is - would anyone else be the same size in either of those shoes and have any of those Burton boots and could tell me which size you wear in them? 

I know everyone is different and it's an odd question! I'd just like to give him boots as well as the board & bindings and i figure anythings better then the rentals he's previously worn. 

Thank you in advance.


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## SoaD009 (Jan 9, 2020)

What board did you get? Burton Ions are pretty stiff and Swath are medium to medium-soft. You want boots to somewhat match the stiffness of the board.

I know you won't want to hear this answer but you really want to measure his feet. I'd personally give my son the board, bindings, and an IOU on the boots. Boots are arguably the most important piece of gear so you want them to be a perfect fit. Too tight will cause a lot of pain and too loose is bad in many ways.


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

SoaD009 said:


> What board did you get? Burton Ions are pretty stiff and Swath are medium to medium-soft. You want boots to somewhat match the stiffness of the board.
> 
> I know you won't want to hear this answer but you really want to measure his feet. I'd personally give my son the board, bindings, and an IOU on the boots. Boots are arguably the most important piece of gear so you want them to be a perfect fit. Too tight will cause a lot of pain and too loose is bad in many ways.



We've got him the 2021 Burton Custom flying V.

I did think of giving him the board & bindings and some $$ for the boots but honestly, if he was to go and buy them himself he'd just get pressured into whatever the store pushed and not say anything if they didn't feel right or he hated them. 
If we didn't live 6+ hours from the nearest place that sold any i'd definitely take him to try some on, I'm really not sure what to do. I'm kind of hoping to just take a chance and hope for the best, if they aren't perfect i wont be offended if he sells/exchanges them & gets something else.


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

Boots are something that you don't want to go off a shoe size, in fact the best way to fit for them is to measure barefoot length and width to the millimeter. Usually people end up with a full size smaller than their shoe. If you search Wiredsports posts he has a wealth of knowledge about it. If you can do some sort of game where you get your son to stand with the back of his foot against the wall and make some marks on the floor at the end of his toes and the widest part for measuring later it might be the best way to stealthily go about it. Also different boots fit very different depending on your foot shape so a 9 in one brand might feel loose where in another they won't even get in. So you might want to find a place with a good return policy and get a few pairs a half size apart if you can. And hope he has Burton feet.


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

freshy said:


> Boots are something that you don't want to go off a shoe size, in fact the best way to fit for them is to measure barefoot length and width to the millimeter. Usually people end up with a full size smaller than their shoe. If you search Wiredsports posts he has a wealth of knowledge about it. If you can do some sort of game where you get your son to stand with the back of his foot against the wall and make some marks on the floor at the end of his toes and the widest part for measuring later it might be the best way to stealthily go about it. Also different boots fit very different depending on your foot shape so a 9 in one brand might feel loose where in another they won't even get in. So you might want to find a place with a good return policy and get a few pairs a half size apart if you can. And hope he has Burton feet.



That makes a lot of sense, thank you.
I was really only going for Burton as it's what we've been given each time we've hired packages (I guess it's whats readily available here and in New Zealand!) so i'll try and get some measurements and look into other brands.
Failing that i'll just give him the cash, buy a few pairs a half size apart or one pair on a decent special and give him some cash towards another pair. 💸💸🤦‍♀️


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

*Min* said:


> That makes a lot of sense, thank you.
> I was really only going for Burton as it's what we've been given each time we've hired packages (I guess it's whats readily available here and in New Zealand!) so i'll try and get some measurements and look into other brands.
> Failing that i'll just give him the cash, buy a few pairs a half size apart or one pair on a decent special and give him some cash towards another pair. 💸💸🤦‍♀️


We only have these boots in New Zealand mate


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

Manicmouse said:


> We only have these boots in New Zealand mate
> View attachment 157068


LOL! Love it over there, can’t wait to go back again as soon as possible.


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

*Min* said:


> LOL! Love it over there, can’t wait to go back again as soon as possible.


Travel bubble always seems close... But doesn't happen. 😕


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

Give him the board and bindings....and then homework and a test. Ask and tell him that you expect him to read the wiredsport thread, boot faq and angry's boot fitting yt series. Test on him on his foot size in mondo, have him show you his boot fitting questions on the forum and etc. Then once satisfied that he is at least somewhat schooled...release the $. Its his feet, his pain, his joy....his responsibility...have him earn/work for it. If he doesn't do it...I would not further support his ineptitude and lazy ass. That's what I've done with my 3 kids...and all of them are at different levels of their snowy life experience based on their passion and effort. Oldest has not gone in a decade, middle goes 1-2x a season and the youngest has a garage full of skis, boards, bc gear, a sled, truck and lives near the snow...she is only 26.


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## RayzTheRoof (Mar 10, 2014)

Give him the board and bindings, then measure his foot correctly on his birthday and order a few pairs online to try on and send back the ones you don't keep. Online stores like Rei, Backcountry, and Evo have excellent return policies and you can try on whatever and send em back.

Do *not *get stuck in the thought that you need Burton boots so it all matches and because Burton is the big name you see on everything. Not everyone's feet fit in a specific brand's boots.


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

RayzTheRoof said:


> Give him the board and bindings, then measure his foot correctly on his birthday and order a few pairs online to try on and send back the ones you don't keep. Online stores like Rei, Backcountry, and Evo have excellent return policies and you can try on whatever and send em back.
> 
> Do *not *get stuck in the thought that you need Burton boots so it all matches and because Burton is the big name you see on everything. Not everyone's feet fit in a specific brand's boots.


I'm going to take a wild guess here and assume they don't have REI, Backcountry or EVO in New Zealand and/or shipping would be crazy.


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## RayzTheRoof (Mar 10, 2014)

I thought they'd be big enough for that kind of setup or shipping :c

You're right though.


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

You gotta take him to go boot shopping so he fits something well. Hard to buy boots for someone else if they're not a boot they already ride in.


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

RayzTheRoof said:


> I thought they'd be big enough for that kind of setup or shipping :c
> 
> You're right though.


I'm pretty sure Backcountry ship some items to Australia, although postage is insane. The places here actually sell the same boots for a similar price with free shipping which is interesting. I thought they'd be a lot dearer here. 
At this stage i'll likely give him the cash.


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

Manicmouse said:


> Travel bubble always seems close... But doesn't happen. 😕



I'm really hoping we can get back to NZ during July. I wont hold my breath though.


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

Where are you in Aus @*Min*


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

NT.Thunder said:


> Where are you in Aus @*Min*


Airlie beach! Moving south towards the Sunshine Coast in a few months though.


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

*Min* said:


> Airlie beach! Moving south towards the Sunshine Coast in a few months though.


Yeah feel your pain, I'm in Darwin and had to buy boots online.


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

*Min* said:


> I'm pretty sure Backcountry ship some items to Australia, although postage is insane. The places here actually sell the same boots for a similar price with free shipping which is interesting. I thought they'd be a lot dearer here.
> At this stage i'll likely give him the cash.


Really? None of the big websites ship down under so they can fleece based on location. International shipping is usually not an option for the big ski and board brands. You have to use a middleman.

At least we get the gear first, before the northern hemi 😎


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

NT.Thunder said:


> Yeah feel your pain, I'm in Darwin and had to buy boots online.





NT.Thunder said:


> Yeah feel your pain, I'm in Darwin and had to buy boots online.



Did you know what size and exactly what you were after or did you chance it? 
I'm in two minds right now.cash is probably better but then anythings better then the rentals we've had in the past...


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

*Min* said:


> Did you know what size and exactly what you were after or did you chance it?
> I'm in two minds right now.cash is probably better but then anythings better then the rentals we've had in the past...


Combination. I knew what boot size I've previously owned over the years and the size/model I rented in Japan last season coupled with sending @Wiredsport my feet dimensions in this thread here

I was confident with my mondo sizing and just read a few reviews around several boots that I'd like to try and ended up ordering the Ride Lasso online with a view if it didn't fit or wasn't comfortable I'd return them. They were fine though. Risky but sometimes you have no other options.


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

Manicmouse said:


> Really? None of the big websites ship down under so they can fleece based on location. International shipping is usually not an option for the big ski and board brands. You have to use a middleman.
> 
> At least we get the gear first, before the northern hemi 😎


I haven't actually ordered from Backcountry before but Australia is definitely on their list of International shipments. I wouldn't bother though with the current conversion rate + shipping + taxes.
Maybe they only ship certain items, who knows? 🤪


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

NT.Thunder said:


> Combination. I knew what boot size I've previously owned over the years and the size/model I rented in Japan last season coupled with sending @Wiredsport my feet dimensions in this thread here
> 
> I was confident with my mondo sizing and just read a few reviews around several boots that I'd like to try and ended up ordering the Ride Lasso online with a view if it didn't fit or wasn't comfortable I'd return them. They were fine though. Risky but sometimes you have no other options.


Sounds like you knew what you were doing, i'm glad it worked out for you.


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

@*Min*

This link might be useful









Vans Sizing vs Nike - Always Measure Your Feet


Vans sizing vs Nike—how do they compare? We’re sizing up these two leading brands—detailing their measurements, plus tips on how to get the perfect fit.




bootmoodfoot.com














It's a little confusing actually but if I'm reading it correctly, the Vans run truer to size than a Nike shoe.

I've read that Burton and Vans run True-to-Size so possibly your best bet is the Burton in 9.5 but I'm sure @Wiredsport can comment best on that


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

NT.Thunder said:


> @*Min*
> 
> This link might be useful
> 
> ...


Thanks so much for that! I’ll have a better read of it after work.


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

*Min* said:


> I haven't actually ordered from Backcountry before but Australia is definitely on their list of International shipments. I wouldn't bother though with the current conversion rate + shipping + taxes.
> Maybe they only ship certain items, who knows? 🤪


Some sites block by brand or type of item.
Best looking for old stock stores want to get rid of


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## Jack87 (Jan 9, 2021)

Also what is his ability level? The Moto vs the Ion are very different boots on two different levels. I would probably consider Burton Swat or Ruler. But also Burton might not fit his feet very well either measuring is important. Ion seems over kill to me and Moto is just too low end. 

Keep in mind whatever shoe sizes he wears does not mean they are correct. Measuring his feet is very important. no sense in making such an expensive purchase that can totally be spoiled because of bad sizing on boots


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

Jack87 said:


> Also what is his ability level? The Moto vs the Ion are very different boots on two different levels. I would probably consider Burton Swat or Ruler. But also Burton might not fit his feet very well either measuring is important. Ion seems over kill to me and Moto is just too low end.
> 
> Keep in mind whatever shoe sizes he wears does not mean they are correct. Measuring his feet is very important. no sense in making such an expensive purchase that can totally be spoiled because of bad sizing on boots



I was looking at the Ruler, Photon or Swath. However at this stage i'll just be giving him some cash to get them at a later date.


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## Jack87 (Jan 9, 2021)

*Min* said:


> I was looking at the Ruler, Photon or Swath. However at this stage i'll just be giving him some cash to get them at a later date.


Good call! 

Let me know about this message board as a good resource to do some research because most retailers don't have people knowledgably about boot fitting. By the way the board and bindings as great! can't go wrong with those. What is your son's ability level?


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

Jack87 said:


> Good call!
> 
> Let me know about this message board as a good resource to do some research because most retailers don't have people knowledgably about boot fitting. By the way the board and bindings as great! can't go wrong with those. What is your son's ability level?


Thanks Jack, i hope he loves the board!

I'd say he's intermediate?? He progresses really quickly so i dont want to buy him entry level items that he'll outgrow before he gets much use out of them.

I've found this message board fantastic! I don't have a local retailer and the closest ones may be friendly but their product knowledge is nonexistent. In saying that i am literally HOURS & HOURS from the closest snow field so it's understandable.
I've been watching way too much YouTube and reading as much as possible about boot sizing and fittings, Burton themselves have been really amazing in helping me out too.


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## MountainMystic (Apr 24, 2019)

@*Min*









Your Personal Snowboard Gear Shopper Sherpa


There's personal shoppers in everything and while we continue to provide a free service to all you Snowboarders of the Internet on multiple...




angrysnowboarder.bigcartel.com





I would get your son to engage this service from Angry Snowboarder.
Avran (angry) has set more people on the right path to getting the gear that suits them than most of us have had hot dinners. With Boots, there is really no getting around going to a physical shop and trying a fark-ton of different boots on, even if it involves a road-trip.
I'm in Melbourne, so I don't know what shops worth visting are in Queensland, but I would say Brisbane would have a few. Another option is to buy boots at a resort-based shop, especially if going on a trip to say Perisher/Thredbo/Queenstown. The advantage of buying boots that way is that the shop (assuming they have a good fitter) can make fitting tweaks to his boots based on his feedback.
Is he wanting to do an AUS based snowboarding trip this coming AUS winter?

As Angry Snowboarder will tell you - The best boot is the one that fits his foot and fits his needs.


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## Jack87 (Jan 9, 2021)

*Min* said:


> Thanks Jack, i hope he loves the board!
> 
> I'd say he's intermediate?? He progresses really quickly so i dont want to buy him entry level items that he'll outgrow before he gets much use out of them.
> 
> ...


That is awesome you're doing your homework! Makes sense too not too much room for error in your position. And in the Burton line of boots the three you just mentioned are probably the best choice (Ruler, Photon or Swath) The Moto is too entry level and the ion is just super stiff. Photon is the stiffest of those three. I own it and it's not too stiff if you ask me. I ride a custom (in camber) with it.


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

MountainMystic said:


> @*Min*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## *Min* (Feb 6, 2021)

MountainMystic said:


> @*Min*
> 
> 
> 
> ...



There are NO shops worth visiting here in QLD lol. 
He's definitely keen to do an AUS based trip in July, we actually have accomodation booked in Thredbo already. Fingers crossed borders stay open!

I'll check out Angry Snowboarder, thanks for the recommendation.


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## MountainMystic (Apr 24, 2019)

*Min* said:


> There are NO shops worth visiting here in QLD lol.
> He's definitely keen to do an AUS based trip in July, we actually have accomodation booked in Thredbo already. Fingers crossed borders stay open!
> 
> I'll check out Angry Snowboarder, thanks for the recommendation.


no worries, just be aware that bindings have sizes, and all the manufacturers seem to do it a bit differently. so, might also be best to get bindings at the same time as boots, to suit the boot size he ends up with.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

*Min* said:


> I've found this message board fantastic!...
> I've been watching way too much YouTube and reading as much as possible about boot sizing and fittings, Burton themselves have been really amazing in helping me out too.


1. First place to start is to use wiredsport's measurement instructions and post up pics for his review and comments for the correct boot size.
2. Determine his foot characteristics/shape, e.g., arch, instep, toe box, ankle, calf and heels.
3. Based on foot characteristics will help determine the best strategy for getting a fit...to which there are 3 general levels of fit...lodge bunny, recreationalist and performance.
4. A general strategy: 
a. insole sorted (arch and subsequent instep) 
b. get the basic over-all volume with supportive insole in place. 
c. then address heel pocket issues (things like butterflies, c's, j's...maybe wedges)
d. lastly cuff issues.
5. So once you have the above issues addressed...often the central issue for on-going mods is the heel pocket...because the instep and toe box should have already been addressed.


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