# Will Park City Open This Year?



## tonicusa (Feb 27, 2008)

Park City bond ruling pushed to Friday | The Salt Lake Tribune


This is really down to the wire. I think Deer Valley should open to snowboarders.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

From an internal memo I was sent from one of my sources it's looking fucking bleak. The way I see it, if they do open it's going to end up with it being on the Epic pass.


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## Steezus Christ (Jul 29, 2013)

the whole situation is just a shit show. the world really needs less cunts.


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## COtoUT (Apr 1, 2009)

PCMR fucked-up big time by not protecting themselves. Talisker and Vail have always wanted to conjoin the resorts-and this is how they will do it. Talisker has PCMR in a legal strangle hold... and Park City is down to it's last breath.

The really shitty thing about this will be the loss of all the great side country along the ridge line at The Canyons. There will be a lift or two there within two seasons (max). Kind of like all those tree shots that have been annihilated by The Colony homes, a real bummer

The Epic Pass is reason enough to leave The Canyons (sadly). There are just too many people there now. BCC Pass is the answer.


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## tonicusa (Feb 27, 2008)

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/58378483-78/pcmr-park-resort-talisker.html.csp

Looks like they won't be opening. Who is going to pay $17 million in rent for one year! LOL

That sucks.

http://keepparkcityopen.com/


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## jtg (Dec 11, 2012)

It's too bad an antitrust argument can't be made. With no market pressures, prices are going to go up, service is going to go down, and employees are going to get screwed if Vail owns both. This is a huge risk in general for ski areas, since the conglomerates only get larger, not smaller. And we aren't building any new resorts any time soon.

Even if the eviction goes through, Vail still can't use the resort because they don't own the base, parking lot, facilities, or the water rights. The two are basically playing chicken right now.



tonicusa said:


> http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/58378483-78/pcmr-park-resort-talisker.html.csp
> 
> Looks like they won't be opening. Who is going to pay $17 million in rent for one year! LOL
> 
> ...



It's not necessarily rent, it's a bond. The idea is they put up the cash while the courts settle the dispute, and if they lose, it covers what would have been owed to Talisker. If they win, they keep it.


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## tonicusa (Feb 27, 2008)

Yeah I know it's not rent, I was oversimplifying and if you don't renew your lease you are shit out of luck. You better have a good relationship with your landlord then.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

Actually Vail taking over will more or less drop season/bulk ticket prices. When they introduced the Epic here it made multiple mountains affordable. Before the $579 pass price the Vail pass alone was like over a grand. 

PCMR/Powdr Corp fucked up.


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## Pigpen (Feb 3, 2013)

If they do post the $17.5M bond, imagine what they will do for a day pass to PCMR... Have fun paying $130 for a day.

If they don't post the bond, I truly do feel bad for Park City and its people, the economy will be destroyed for the whole year.


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## tonicusa (Feb 27, 2008)

It sounds like they know they can't raise prices just to stretch things out one more year. They are maneuvering to try and settle the issue longterm, or not at all it seems. 

Not renewing the lease was a huge mistake but Vail should realize nothing good comes from trying to "snake" someones business when they mess up a lease renewal. I've seen this happen before in other industries and it never ends well for the guy trying to steal someones lunch.

I think some sort of joint venture or cooperative effort would make the most sense. I think PCMR does a good job running their operation from what I see, but perhaps there are issues behind the scenes. Nonetheless it's a place that's not too hipster, and not too joe public. Just a place where people are going to ride and everyone seems polite. You can spend a lot of time there with no issues or major complaints, provided you are just looking to ride etc.

What I like about PCMR is that it doesn't attract a lot of poser skiers and boarders. You don't see a bunch of telemark hipsters with their Patagonia outfits and silly craft-everything vibe, and you don't see the tool snowboarders slapping their boards in the lift line and trying to ollie off of every thing way too hard like they didn't take their ritalin and they think they are Danny Davis impersonators. It's just a place you can be left alone and ride, where everyone is pretty polite and there are plenty of good riders.


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## Tuan209 (Dec 26, 2008)

I hope PC does open. They have the best park hands down out of all the resorts here in Utah. 

It be ashamed if PC were to close for the season, especially for the local businesses.

I do think that the EPIC pass is nice but there are downsides to it also. 

Ever since Canyons was added to the Epic pass, the place is just too crowded for my liking.


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## tonicusa (Feb 27, 2008)

I've been riding Park City for a while but only a few weeks a year out of my season. One of the things I love about PCMR is that the park has the lowest number of kooks I've ever seen in a large resort. 

I don't know why but in general the kids and everybody else riding in the park are unusually mellow and cool. Most parks have a bunch of kids who "just don't know better" and try too hard or are just asshats. PCMR not only has a great park to ride in, but it doesn't have a ton of d-bags. Quality parks are shrinking.


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## Tuan209 (Dec 26, 2008)

tonicusa said:


> I've been riding Park City for a while but only a few weeks a year out of my season. One of the things I love about PCMR is that the park has the lowest number of kooks I've ever seen in a large resort.
> 
> I don't know why but in general the kids and everybody else riding in the park are unusually mellow and cool. Most parks have a bunch of kids who "just don't know better" and try too hard or are just asshats. PCMR not only has a great park to ride in, but it doesn't have a ton of d-bags. Quality parks are shrinking.


Totally agree!


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

tonicusa said:


> It sounds like they know they can't raise prices just to stretch things out one more year. They are maneuvering to try and settle the issue longterm, or not at all it seems.
> 
> Not renewing the lease was a huge mistake but Vail should realize nothing good comes from trying to "snake" someones business when they mess up a lease renewal. I've seen this happen before in other industries and it never ends well for the guy trying to steal someones lunch.
> 
> ...


From the backend of things Powdr Corp is a disaster. Say what you want about Vail but they know how to run a resort company.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

So I'm confused, after living in Bend almost four years I have learned how powdercorp has fucked over all the locals. Well this year park city is on the list of sister resorts owned by powdercorp and I get 3 free tickets to ride there. Thanks powdercorp! Why is it not opening? (I read through but wasn't clear in the end)


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

ridinbend said:


> So I'm confused, after living in Bend almost four years I have learned how powdercorp has fucked over all the locals. Well this year park city is on the list of sister resorts owned by powdercorp and I get 3 free tickets to ride there. Thanks powdercorp! Why is it not opening? (I read through but wasn't clear in the end)


They didn't renew the land lease that the resort is on in time. So Talisker the company that owns the land did the smart thing and found someone new to invest it. Can't really open a resort when the land it's on doesn't belong to you and is in litigation.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

BurtonAvenger said:


> They didn't renew the land lease that the resort is on in time. So Talisker the company that owns the land did the smart thing and found someone new to invest it. Can't really open a resort when the land it's on doesn't belong to you and is in litigation.


Hmmmmm....wouldnt want that mistake on my resume.


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## tonicusa (Feb 27, 2008)

Yeah they fired the CFO Richard DesVaux who had been there for 8 years and hired Jennifer Botter in 2008 who came from the energy business like the Cummings family. She thought the lease somehow just automatically renewed and never bothered to check with the owner or the attorneys. Of course it did not. She no longer works at PCMR.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

Well looks like PCMR is ponying up the cash. Park City Mountain Resort To Remain Open For 2014/15 Season -


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

BurtonAvenger said:


> Well looks like PCMR is ponying up the cash. Park City Mountain Resort To Remain Open For 2014/15 Season -


What exactly was the bond for, and is it fully forfeited? I guess I'm not up to snuff on the legal lingo. Shirley (  ) they didn't just fork over $17M for a years lease and it's some sort of showing of good faith while things are in litigation?


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

It's not a lease payment, but by putting that bond up they can operate the resort while dealing with the litigation. They win they get it back, they lose well good by 17.5 million and all our jobs.


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

BurtonAvenger said:


> It's not a lease payment, but by putting that bond up they can operate the resort while dealing with the litigation. They win they get it back, they lose well good by 17.5 million and all our jobs.


Even if Vail just takes over? If you work in construction somebody has to tear down all the lifts and put the new ones up. Maybe you'll be able to play with some dynomite


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## tonicusa (Feb 27, 2008)

AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks Avram


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## jtg (Dec 11, 2012)

BurtonAvenger said:


> They didn't renew the land lease that the resort is on in time. So Talisker the company that owns the land did the smart thing and found someone new to invest it. Can't really open a resort when the land it's on doesn't belong to you and is in litigation.


Well, not quite...

The short version is that everyone on both sides knew PCMR was renewing, they spent $100M on developments, had a master development plan, etc. PCMR had a change in staff and they knew there was a mixup, so they sent in the notice the Monday after the weekend that the deal expired on (though they did backdate it to before the weekend). Talisker filed it away and it was business as usual.

In the following summer, after it supposedly expired, Talisker proposed that PCMR build an interconnect to link PCMR to Canyons and offer a unified lift ticket deal, and met with them to discuss those plans and other development.

8 months later, a Talisker employee was talking to the PCMR CEO about extending the lease for another 25 years into 2076. After that discussion, he went to look at the lease agreement, and only then did he notice the technicality and realized he might be able to use it to screw over PCMR.

Talisker tried to exploit that opportunity, and during the legal battle, Talisker sold Canyons to Vail for twice the market value, because Vail also bought the rights to the lawsuit, and rights to PCMR if they win.

Utah law is super strict about having all the paperwork in order, even though it's totally a technicality that caused no loss to Talisker and Talisker didn't even know it themselves, so PCMR is going to lose on the primary claims and they know it. They have a shot on some of the smaller issues that might reduce the damage, but their real strategy is to play chicken with Vail until Vail gives them the best possible offer on their way out, while Vail wants to take PCMR at a discount.



tonicusa said:


> She thought the lease somehow just automatically renewed and never bothered to check with the owner or the attorneys. Of course it did not. She no longer works at PCMR.


Actually some of the leases involved (there are 3 or 4) do automatically renew, and the lease that Vail has with Talisker automatically renews, so it's not unheard of. The original contract was pretty confusing, it was amended, and there are multiple shell companies involved.


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## COtoUT (Apr 1, 2009)

jtg said:


> Well, not quite...
> 
> The short version is that everyone on both sides knew PCMR was renewing, they spent $100M on developments, had a master development plan, etc. PCMR had a change in staff and they knew there was a mixup, so they sent in the notice the Monday after the weekend that the deal expired on (though they did backdate it to before the weekend). Talisker filed it away and it was business as usual.
> 
> ...


Good info... It was my understanding that Talisker leased out The Canyons to Vail Corp. to run-not sold. And that Talisker owned and operated the base area part of the mountain (i.e. the hotels and village). Am I correct in this?


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

Canyons is on a lease agreement.


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## SnowDragon (Apr 23, 2012)

Vail Resorts Acquires Park City Mountain Resort in Park City, Utah
2014-09-11 15:26:36.680 GMT

Vail Resorts Acquires Park City Mountain Resort in Park City, Utah

-- Acquisition settles all litigation and ensures no disruption to future
resort operations

-- Park City Mountain Resort will be added to the Epic Pass for the 2014-2015
ski season

-- Company intends to connect PCMR and Canyons for the 2015-2016 ski season to
create the largest single ski resort in the United States with 7,000 skiable
acres, subject to regulatory approvals

PR Newswire

BROOMFIELD, Colo., Sept. 11, 2014

BROOMFIELD, Colo., Sept. 11, 2014 /PRNewswire/ -- Vail Resorts, Inc. (NYSE:
MTN) today announced that the Company has acquired Park City Mountain Resort
(PCMR) from Powdr Corp. for $182.5 million in cash, subject to certain
post-closing adjustments. The acquisition includes all of the assets of
Greater Park City Company (GPCC), the land used for ski terrain at the resort
held by Ian Cumming, and certain base parking lands owned by Powdr Development
Corp., which have approved zoning for approximately 687,000 square feet of
residential and commercial development. The acquisition does not include the
Gorgoza tubing operation, located approximately 10 miles from the resort,
which will be retained by Powdr Corp.

With the acquisition, all aspects of the previously disclosed litigation with
respect to PCMR have been settled and this dispute will no longer pose any
future threat to disrupt the operation of the resort.

"First and foremost, we are very pleased to bring a permanent end to this
dispute and provide assurance to the guests and employees of PCMR, and to
everyone in the Park City community, that they no longer have to worry about
any disruption to the operation of the Resort. This has been a difficult
period for everyone involved and I commend John Cumming and Powdr Corp. for
helping to find a solution to this situation," said Rob Katz, chairman and
chief executive officer of Vail Resorts.

"Park City Mountain Resort is one of the most spectacular mountain resorts and
iconic brands in the ski industry and I am proud to have the resort become a
part of Vail Resorts. The acquisition will allow us to immediately bring Park
City Mountain Resort onto the Epic Pass, which will now offer skiers from
across the country and around the world access to 22 resorts, including
Canyons in Park City, Utah; Vail, Beaver Creek, Breckenridge and Keystone in
Colorado; and Heavenly, Northstar and Kirkwood in Tahoe. We look forward to
working collaboratively with the entire Park City community, as well as city
and county officials, as we chart the future for the resort, including how we
can best bring the Canyons and Park City ski experiences together to create
the largest mountain resort in the United States," he added. 

Blaise Carrig, president of Vail Resorts, will act as interim chief operating
officer for the resort.

"We understand that this acquisition represents a change for all of the
employees of PCMR and I look forward to working with everyone on the PCMR team
as we develop a vision for the future of the resort," said Carrig.

Mountain operations of PCMR and Canyons will remain separate for the 2014-2015
ski season. However, the Epic Pass and Epic Local Pass will be valid at PCMR.
All PCMR passes for the 2014-2015 ski season will continue to be honored and
can be exchanged or upgraded for a season pass that will also be valid at
Canyons. The majority of all lift tickets sold at either resort will be valid
at both PCMR and Canyons.

The Company also announced that due to the acquisition of PCMR, it expects $35
million in incremental EBITDA in Fiscal Year 2015, excluding any transaction
and transition costs. The Company anticipates additional contributions from
the acquisition in future years, particularly after it can connect the
experience of the two resorts together. The Company expects the acquisition to
provide significant tax benefits over the next 15 years, including an average
of approximately $12 million in additional annual taxable depreciation and
amortization expense through Fiscal 2021. The Company will be making
additional comments on PCMR and the Company's outlook in its 2014 fiscal
year-end investor conference call on Sept. 24. 

Park City Mountain Resort offers terrain for every type of skier and
snowboarder, from perfectly manicured groomers to powder-filled bowls and some
of the industry's most progressive terrain parks and half pipes. Located in
the heart of historic Park City, Utah–one of the country's greatest ski
towns–PCMR was named the fifth best resort in North America by readers of SKI
Magazine in 2014. The mountain resort's 16 lifts serve 114 runs, nine
powder-filled bowls, four terrain parks and two half pipes. The mountain also
offers many summer adventures including one of the world's longest alpine
slides, a nearly 4,000-foot long alpine coaster, zip lines and more than 70
miles of hiking and biking trails. Together with Canyons, the combined resort
will offer over 7,000 acres of skiing and will be the largest ski resort in
the United States.


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## jtg (Dec 11, 2012)

Looks like Big Sky is going to have to re-print a lot of marketing material.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

^ hahahaha.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Not surprised by this turn at all. Powder Corp was going to lose in the end. Vail resorts taking over the snow sports industry one resort at a time.


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## Big Foot (Jan 15, 2013)

Vail should change their name to Goliath International Ski Resort. Eventually they're just going to own every resort in the world.


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## LA Forever (Apr 2, 2013)

So glad I have an Epic Local pass...


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

so EPIC!!!!


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