# So.... T-bars......



## CassMT (Mar 14, 2013)

i'm tryin to slash the walls


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

That depends on the terrain it's dragging you over.... Sometimes flat, sometimes On edge. Just don't double up with someone that isn't around your same height, usually the shorter people fuck me up....


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## t21 (Dec 29, 2010)

I'll be up there the weekend it opens up.BUT! i hate that poma lift cuz it kicks my ass:laugh: It's basically a round disk that you place between your thighs and hold on the rope while it drags you uphill. I've seen boarders that has got it down well,but there are some that are like me. I almost had it down last time i was there but the day was over and i was dead tired. I think i will ride the Gardiner wall and hike up instead if i fail on that poma lift:dunno: btw, those times i made it uphill on that lift i stayed flatbased mostly.


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

But ya back foot up hard against ya back binding, keep that foot centred as if it was in the binding, bend ya knees, weight centered, and relax!!!!!

Flat base it, and let the T-Bar do it's thing!!!!! If ya feel like ya goin off to the sides, it will drag ya back in line!!!!! 

After a few times, you'll be confident enough to steer away with ya edges!!!!!

* if you can ride solo it'll be easier to learn!!!!!


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

CassMT said:


> i'm tryin to slash the walls


Padded Cell?????


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## francium (Jan 12, 2013)

T bars tend to be easier to get on than pomas just tuck the bar up against your front leg and away you go. Is usually easier by yourself the first few times. Pomas same thing really except it's just a small rubber disc. I hope the lifts are kinder there than in Scotland some of the pomas there launch you into the air as you hang on for dear life.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

no different from normal technique: NEVER FULLY FLAT BASE.

NEVER.

EVER.

Even if you are "flat" keeping pressure (not an actual high edge) on toe or heel edge at all times will keep you happy and successful.

True for t-bars, poma lifts, rope tows and flat traverses.

A flat base and a flat base with a pressured edge do the exact same thing except one of them can surprise you with a mustache ride (the bad kind).


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## slyder (Jan 18, 2010)

I've only riden the J-hook ones. No probs there. So not much to add from the others.

Only there are a ton of hilarious video of ppl failing. So don't let your buddies tape you to share with the us 

Let us know how it goes


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## ACairngormFace (Oct 6, 2013)

All my home mountain has is pomas and t-bars. Just go flat base, point forward and let the drag lift do the work.


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## CassMT (Mar 14, 2013)

Mizu Kuma said:


> Padded Cell?????


no big thing, it's just fun and passes the time

the key to the tbar starting out is: don't do anything, relax, let the thing do all the work


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

snowklinger said:


> no different from normal technique: NEVER FULLY FLAT BASE.
> 
> NEVER.
> 
> EVER.



Hmmm... I don’t see why one shouldn't flatbase, especially on t-bar. 




ACairngormFace said:


> All my home mountain has in pomas and t-bars. Just go flat base, point forward and let the drag lift do the work.


+1.



Try to relax, no stiff legs, be centered with your weight especially the first times when you could be surprised by the sudden pull. Then just let you drag flat based as long as the lift drags you within the track, only adjust by edge if you're going off the track.


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

After that video of those dudes falling all over each other on one of those earlier this winter, BA pointed out that they're designed to go between a skiers legs... Why wouldn't you just grab it under your arm?:dunno:


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

The Deacon said:


> After that video of those dudes falling all over each other on one of those earlier this winter, BA pointed out that they're designed to go between a skiers legs... Why wouldn't you just grab it under your arm?:dunno:


Bad idea. You'd be off balance and get pretty tired being dragged up a steep t-bar lift. It really isn't a big deal; if you are confident with skating, and riding with one foot strapped you'll have no problem with them. I found it easier when pairing up with either a confident snowboarder or a skier, they'll stabilize. But never pair with kids, cos then you'd have the bar down on your knees = very uncomfortable.


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

The Deacon said:


> After that video of those dudes falling all over each other on one of those earlier this winter, BA pointed out that they're designed to go between a skiers legs... Why wouldn't you just grab it under your arm?:dunno:


That's what I would do and basically makes it like the rope tow that my son learned on. They had a plastic/rubber tail hanging off them you could put behind your back once you started going.

Once you get going it's a no brainer to pull yourself up and put the tee under your shoulder and behind your back. The key to starting is you have to treat it like a tug of war to get going or it'll pull you over and you're gonna have a bad day.

It wasn't until his 3rd trip that he finally managed to make it more than 20 feet. Give him credit for not calling it quits, but he hung in there.


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## CassMT (Mar 14, 2013)

you can put it under your arm if you want, but i'm sure it'll tire you out faster. behind the front leg is the way of least effort, i've done laps and laps like that


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## Tatanka Head (Jan 13, 2014)

T-bars can be very humbling. As stated before, relax. Let it pull you, and don't fight with it. I have a buddy that will actually hook it behind his front foot. His local his is all t-bars. I can't, nor would I, do it.


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## Bamfboardman (Dec 11, 2012)

It's a poma lift, how will that change from a T-Bar?


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

francium said:


> T bars tend to be easier to get on than pomas just tuck the bar up against your front leg and away you go.


Actually maybe this is from my skier days (first lift I ever rode was a t-bar), but I find it easy to just put the thing behind my butt and go. T-bars are easy, button/platter lifts are a little harder on a board. Jam the platter as far up your ass as you can. I actually bring my back foot up against my front foot to ease the pressure off the steepest sections.

The platter at Louise has one part that is pretty close to 45 degrees... Fun stuff!


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

I remember when I was about 10 and probably 55lbs going to Okemo which at that time was half high speed pomas. I was so light and they were so fast that I spent most of the ride struggling to keep some part of my skis still touching the ground. Was exhausted both mentally and physically by the time I'd get to the top.


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## boarderaholic (Aug 13, 2007)

snowklinger said:


> no different from normal technique: NEVER FULLY FLAT BASE.
> 
> NEVER.
> 
> ...


I flat base, but keep my knee's bent. Haven't gone down yet unless someone takes me down.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Tatanka Head said:


> T-bars can be very humbling. As stated before, relax. Let it pull you, and don't fight with it. I have a buddy that will actually hook it behind his front foot. His local his is all t-bars. I can't, nor would I, do it.


It's the first time I ever hear the idea to ride a t-bar _not_ behind the front leg = between the legs like with a poma. 
We've plenty of t-bars, I ride them every day I spend in a resort since 20y with boards, never seen anyone not riding them like that :dunno:


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## CassMT (Mar 14, 2013)

yeh, i flat base all the time, esp. if it's fully flat. if not totally flat you flatbase and kinda drift around. no prob


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## Tatanka Head (Jan 13, 2014)

neni said:


> It's the first time I ever hear the idea to ride a t-bar _not_ behind the front leg = between the legs like with a poma.
> We've plenty of t-bars, I ride them every day I spend in a resort since 20y with boards, never seen anyone not riding them like that :dunno:


I think you have to have it on your front leg otherwise you'll be fighting it the whole time. He actually brings it down to his *foot*, by his highback.


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## t21 (Dec 29, 2010)

There are two poma lifts up at Beartooth basin, i do not have much problem on the bottom one because the loading area is on a flat surface.The upper part is the bitch one, the loading area is small and it is on an slight angle. The best way i can ride it is to stand at a goofy stance with both feet strapped in and as soon as the disk gets close i grab it, stick in between my legs, then turn or hop to regular stance and away i go. Other boarders do the same but they obviuosly have been doing it for a while and i just copied them:laugh: It is pretty tiring holding on on the rope and staying in balance on the steeper sections.


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

Tatanka Head said:


> I think you have to have it on your front leg otherwise you'll be fighting it the whole time. He actually brings it down to his *foot*, by his highback.


It's not hard at all to ride with it behind you butt. Stand on your board with your front foot strapped in, and have somebody push you on your side just below your butt. Easy! Goofy foot riders go on the left side of the bar, regular go on the right side. Hold the bar with your front foot hand and relax!

I'll take a picture next time I'm at Fernie.


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## Tatanka Head (Jan 13, 2014)

I know how to ride tow bars and j-bars. I do what most people do and bring it up and under or lean back on it. I was just amazed at watching my friend dip the bar behind his front binding for hands free tow action. Granted, it was on a steeper bit, but he was hands free.


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

Poma - lol never put it between your legs!!! Designed for skiiers. Have it under your armpit. (edit: only ever seen pomas on very flat learner slopes)

T-Bar - Never put it under your armpit, that gets really hard when it's steep. Put an end between your legs so it pulls on your inner thigh. You can do it either way so it works no matter which side you are on. If you struggle, go with a skier, snowboarders often take each other out...

And flat line them both, use an edge to steer when needed.

Speaking from experience here, I'm the only person I know who has both broken a T-bar off the wire and also popped the entire poma cable from the gear  Those were black days...


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## ACairngormFace (Oct 6, 2013)

"Poma - lol never put it between your legs!!!"

Wit!, Pomas always go inbetween your legs


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## francium (Jan 12, 2013)

ACairngormFace said:


> "Poma - lol never put it between your legs!!!"
> 
> Wit!, Pomas always go inbetween your legs


Haha just imagine trying to put the westwall poma under your arm.


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## ACairngormFace (Oct 6, 2013)

francium said:


> Haha just imagine trying to put the westwall poma under your arm.


I don't want to imagine that  I'd be knackered half way up :L


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Tatanka Head said:


> ...He actually brings it down to his *foot*, by his highback.


Ok, not I get it. Well now, _that's_ a strange way to use them...


Funny to go through this thread and see the strange ideas/ways of how to ride a T-bar when it actually would be pretty simple and easy: hind foot unstrapped, bar between legs, flat, let it just drag. Like this, hands are free to have a smoke, clean goggles, or whatever, the hind leg will keep the bar in position when the track has parts which point downwards and the board gets faster than the lift, and you can bend down to adjust bindings/boots while on the lift without loosing the bar - which could be hard if you hold it with your arms or behind the butt.


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## slyder (Jan 18, 2010)

poutanen said:


> Actually maybe this is from my skier days (first lift I ever rode was a t-bar), but I find it easy to just put the thing behind my butt and go. T-bars are easy, button/platter lifts are a little harder on a board. Jam the platter as far up your ass as you can. I actually bring my back foot up against my front foot to ease the pressure off the steepest sections.
> 
> The platter at Louise has one part that is pretty close to 45 degrees... Fun stuff!


Damn why wouldn't this run have a chair. I can't imagine a Tbar up that bad boy. Effort not worth the reward here....


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

slyder said:


> Damn why wouldn't this run have a chair. I can't imagine a Tbar up that bad boy. Effort not worth the reward here....


Yep, it's actually steeper than that picture makes it look! It's a thigh burner for sure, but it accesses some of the best powder at Louise, so it's worth it! Plus it keeps all the noobs away. You know that anybody that makes it to the top has to at least have SOME clue.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

poutanen said:


> ... You know that anybody that makes it to the top has to at least have SOME clue.


...and strong adductors 
I don't care about t-bars at all, but not keen on pomas cos they're exhausting in steeps. _That_ lift you showed is a great filter indeed.


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

The pomas I've used have this solid pole sticking out from the circle of plastic which then is attached to the rope, so if you stick it between your legs the pole pulls you in a rotation. You would have to hold an edge the whole way to counteract it!

But yeah if a poma is on steep terrain for some odd reason then underarm would be hard work...


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## ACairngormFace (Oct 6, 2013)

Manicmouse said:


> The pomas I've used have this solid pole sticking out from the circle of plastic which then is attached to the rope, so if you stick it between your legs the pole pulls you in a rotation. You would have to hold an edge the whole way to counteract it!
> 
> But yeah if a poma is on steep terrain for some odd reason then underarm would be hard work...


Must be a different type of poma then. The only type of poma which I've encountered has a kink before the button which curves round you're front leg so it hooks behind your front leg.









Some random pic I found online.


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## francium (Jan 12, 2013)

ACairngormFace said:


> All my home mountain has is pomas and t-bars. Just go flat base, point forward and let the drag lift do the work.


And hang on tight....hmy:


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## Kevin137 (May 5, 2013)

Seb has been riding in the park this season, and loved the jump at the bottom which has a drag lift, he would just ride up strapped in holding on the the pima with one hand and he is 8, i found it weird to watch, but loads of the kids where doing it as it is only 200 metres to drop in, so they just went round and round in circles, if they wanted to go higher they would put between the legs, but he could get up holding it with no issue... 

I guess not weighing anything helps a lot...  I tried and couldn't do it...!!!


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## kalev (Dec 17, 2013)

I want to know how to ride this slingshot lift in Portillo Chile


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## Deacon (Mar 2, 2013)

kalev said:


> I want to know how to ride this slingshot lift in Portillo Chile


Ask PowdermanDan.


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## CassMT (Mar 14, 2013)

kalev said:


> I want to know how to ride this slingshot lift in Portillo Chile


from that i would say: don't, under any circumstance, ride it with a skier


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

CassMT said:


> from that i would say: don't, under any circumstance, ride it with a skier


...I thought _that_ was "a given?" :huh:


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## CassMT (Mar 14, 2013)

CassMT said:


> i would say: don't, under any circumstance, ride it with chomps1211


.................................


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

CassMT said:


> .................................


...I thought that was a given as well! :dunno:


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## MarshallV82 (Apr 6, 2011)

I just hook them behind my front leg and let it pull me up. It'll take a few tries to get it though. You'll look like a dumbass and get laughed at your first time. Just have fun with it.

When I rode the TBar at Castle Mtn in Alberta I'd let it pull me up. You could do rodeos on your way up the mountain in spots that it would slingshot you!


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## OU812 (Feb 2, 2013)

That Portillo lift is crazy. I know someone who trains there in the off season for World Cup, gonna ask him about it next time I see him.

First time I snowboarded I had to use a T-bar lift, took me about 5-6 times till I got it right but once you get the balance its alright. Ran into problems though when the ground got uneven and ski tracks zig zagging but I was a complete noob. Haven't been on one since and avoid them at all cost haha.


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

I had so many disasters on T-bars as a beginner that I used to ride them by myself to avoid taking out people 

Some T-bars have a really aggressive acceleration when the cable goes taut and that just throws people.


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## OU812 (Feb 2, 2013)

The worst is when you lean back too early on a T-bar and the cable isn't fully extended yet and splat, down on my ass. Speaking from experience here, fucking embarrassing lol


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## ctoma (Aug 9, 2011)

^ Thanks for reviving this dead thread, which has been dormant for about 8 years, 2 months, 8 days...


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## Eivind så klart (Aug 30, 2020)

ahenisno said:


> The issue with T-bars is that their design has traditionally remained the same since 1930s, with zero or very minimal improvements. www. boardie .se has come up with wider and more ergonomic T-bars that are seemingly more comfortable. There is also a video of theirs that you can watch which shows how easy they are to use:


Meh.. i tried those or similar in Storlien. And they are no better than normal, just a gimmick thing. And younger ones have trouble with them due to a smaler stance.


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## MassSnowboarder (Mar 3, 2015)

Since the video shows only skiers using the ergonomic T-bars, it gives me no idea of how it would work for a (sideways-stance) snowboarder.


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

They're better.


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

Eivind så klart said:


> Meh.. i tried those or similar in Storlien. And they are no better than normal, just a gimmick thing. And younger ones have trouble with them due to a smaler stance.


Kungsberget has blue ones that are wider and flatter than the traditional black ones. Much more comfortable. Don’t really know if they are the same brand though.


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## Eivind så klart (Aug 30, 2020)

Snowdaddy said:


> Kungsberget has blue ones that are wider and flatter than the traditional black ones. Much more comfortable. Don’t really know if they are the same brand though.


Same in Storlien, they have the normal black ones. Another type that’s red (didn’t get to try that one) and a light blue one that is more cushy, wider and flater. I don’t know if they are trying them out or what because it’s like 1 new one after 4-5 normal ones on their lifts. Don’t know what brand either, just know that they where not a hit for us. My youngest kids hated them, they are too bulky for a short stance like they ride. Same with me, never had a issue with the standard old ones.


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

I've never used a T-bar. I'd use one of there was somewhere that had them, but I'd be a little intimidated for sure! 

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## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

Are you all putting the t-bar between your legs? I put it behind my back and lock it under me downhill arm pit. I’ve personally found it not only makes it easier to manage but so much more comfortable


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

bseracka said:


> Are you all putting the t-bar between your legs? I put it behind my back and lock it under me downhill arm pit. I’ve personally found it not only makes it easier to manage but so much more comfortable


I have it pulling on the inner thigh of my forward leg. Then it works with the height skiers need, you're not always solo. In your armpit pulling on your upper body would be tough on steep climbs.


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## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

Always been solo on t-bars so never really had to give sharing any thought. Personally I've never really found steeps to be an issue with the bar higher up on the body


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## BoardieK (Dec 21, 2015)

T bars are a doddle. One of my favourite areas has ten of these, no chairs and not many snowboarders!


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## Eivind så klart (Aug 30, 2020)

BoardieK said:


> T bars are a doddle. One of my favourite areas has ten of these, no chairs and not many snowboarders!


We used to have those on the toplift back in the days. Fun as hell, remember we could do 7’s on them when the snow was low. Just brake to load the spring up and pop! Now they moved them to the kiddy hill. Fat t bars are a problem for kids with a short stance, those plate things is impossible! My 4 year old rides the normal t bar with no problems, but those are a no-go.


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

The type of lift with discs on the end of a bar are called pomas (Poma lift), they sit under your armpit when snowboarding. I wouldn't use T-bars in the same way.


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## Etienne (Apr 2, 2021)

I use "Pomas" in between de the legs and have never seen anyone using them differently. In French we call them "tire-cul", literally "ass-dragger"... Which is explicit enough on where to put them [emoji23]

We have T-bars mostly on glacier. In les 2 Alpes summer park it was a whole skillset to grab one midair, circle carve to join a friend (or total stranger...), ride it 6 people on one bar, to avoid the queue! 

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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

Pomas between the legs would cause you to twist on a snowboard, it’s another design for skiers! Depends if there is a fixed pole from the disc I guess vs just a rope.


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## Etienne (Apr 2, 2021)

You mean this kind of lifts or is it something else?





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## Eivind så klart (Aug 30, 2020)

Manicmouse said:


> Pomas between the legs would cause you to twist on a snowboard, it’s another design for skiers! Depends if there is a fixed pole from the disc I guess vs just a rope.


First time I’m hearing of this. For over 26 years og riding and with a lot of different people, not one I’ve ridden with has had that problem. Fixed pole with a spring up top, no rope. Only problem with them I’ve come up on is that my youngst struggles to get the disc between her legs due to the short stance.


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## Etienne (Apr 2, 2021)

Yeah, when I was 5/6 yo, my local resort had only these, I was just flying in some sections.

That and considering myself lucky to still be able to have children, because those things can really smash your balls! 

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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

It’s been a long time since I used them, they’ve been phased out for magic carpets around here. At least I don’t have to show my kids!

Guess you guys are right! I just recall it not working well that way.


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## BoardieK (Dec 21, 2015)

Manicmouse said:


> The type of lift with discs on the end of a bar are called pomas (Poma lift), they sit under your armpit when snowboarding


The button lifts with a retractable rope are very gentle and only found in beginner areas, it's possible you could use one of these under your arm. Most sprung pole type are fine once you get used to them (I have tell some of my friends this year after year though 😁) but a few vicious ones will launch you into the air. This is the worst when the track starts level so you overtake the pole, flail around a bit before coming to a halt and then get launched into the air for a second time as the bastard pole overtakes you again!

"Under my armpit?" 🤔 No thanks


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

Never seen a poma outside of learner areas! Is it worse than a T-bar on a steep slope?


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## dwdesign (Mar 30, 2011)

First and only time ever on a poma was 2004 in France at the top of the mountain on a somewhat steep slope and what seemed like a really long ride. Never seen anything like it as I had never even tried a t-bar or rope tow. Took me 2 tries to get on one (after the requisite embarassing being dragged along the ground on the initial attempt) and used the hook behind front thigh method. It was worth the ride for the untracked powder runs.


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## Eivind så klart (Aug 30, 2020)

Manicmouse said:


> Never seen a poma outside of learner areas! Is it worse than a T-bar on a steep slope?


We had them on the top lift wich was the steepest part of the mountain. They could lift you way up in the air if the snow was low. And the start would launch you from 0 to what felt like a million miles pr hour in a second. So they would be scary for someone not used to them. Every one at my local loved them though, way more fun than the t bars lower down. Brake, pop and air!


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## BoardieK (Dec 21, 2015)

Manicmouse said:


> Never seen a poma outside of learner areas! Is it worse than a T-bar on a steep slope?


Better than a T bar on steep slopes. Some will say "Expert skiers only" because of the steepness and remoteness from a piste. 

I've just remembered another issue with them for snowboarders. Where the wires hang low and there has been a lot of snow any unoccupied buttons (gate fails) will drag in the snow creating a trench about a foot wide and up to a foot deep. Essential to avoid but pretty difficult unless experienced. 

Also, camber boards are much more difficult to control on these lifts. I couldn't believe how much easier my first flat board was.


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## Etienne (Apr 2, 2021)

There are som pretty steeps one indeed! But these are the cool parts, you can load the coil and do some nice takeoffs 😎


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## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

I broke a poma in a learner area popping the rope off the giant wheel by going too wide 😂

It’s my secret shame…


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## foe (Feb 10, 2017)

Pomas.... they can be a bit of a nightmare as a beginner, leaving you mentally scarred for life: 
Getting slingshotted out the gate, your backfoot slipping off the board whilst trying to get the button in to the least-uncomfortable position, burning front leg from a never-ending steep section, bruised thighs from the button, the path pitching away to the left/right causing your board to drift one way whilst the rope pulls you the other, making it 3/4 of the way up, falling and have to do it all over again 😂 - happy memories!! 

I didn't want to miss out by always avoiding them (and some places where there was no other option) so I forced myself to ride them with a list of mental cues to help me:
Weight on front foot, shoulders aligned with the board, rear hand towards/over tail, hold the pole gently (don't pull on it - let it pull you), generally just be a passenger (but anticipate where you might need to be a bit more active with your edges) and finally... don't forget to breathe and relax 
Don't mind them so much now (front leg still burns on the long ones!).

I was initially taught to ride them one footed so I assumed you had to do it this way but then another instructor told me to strap in both feet (and then got me doing 180 nose rolls back and forth "to practice in case I want to give my front leg a rest"). I generally still ride them one footed unless they are particularly awkward. 2 footed feels like I'm doing something illegal 🤣 I assume everyone talking about getting air is riding 2 footed?


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## BoardieK (Dec 21, 2015)

I expect they learnt to get air as kids, I was 52 when I started.


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## Eivind så klart (Aug 30, 2020)

foe said:


> Pomas.... they can be a bit of a nightmare as a beginner, leaving you mentally scarred for life:
> Getting slingshotted out the gate, your backfoot slipping off the board whilst trying to get the button in to the least-uncomfortable position, burning front leg from a never-ending steep section, bruised thighs from the button, the path pitching away to the left/right causing your board to drift one way whilst the rope pulls you the other, making it 3/4 of the way up, falling and have to do it all over again 😂 - happy memories!!
> 
> I didn't want to miss out by always avoiding them (and some places where there was no other option) so I forced myself to ride them with a list of mental cues to help me:
> ...


Fall on one those with both feet straped in and you will end up in a hospital if your board get’s caught by the plate… there is no way of and you are in for one hell of ride. Always one footer on both those and t bars. One footer for air time too, easy to learn - just angle/tip your front foot so the board is flat during air. 

The more i read about this the more i see the difference of what people are used to. For people at my local this is not a issue, it has always been like this so every one just have to learn it.


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## Eivind så klart (Aug 30, 2020)

BoardieK said:


> I expect they learnt to get air as kids, I was 52 when I started.


12 years old the first time ✌🏻 Would’nt be so easy to learn now.


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## BoardieK (Dec 21, 2015)

Going through photos and found this shot in Grimentz, Switzerland. Definitely not a beginners area!


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