# Packing out



## zc1 (Feb 20, 2017)

I took the Imprint 2 liners out of my Rulers and put them into my Photons when the Photon liners were packed out. The Ruler liners have packed out a bit now as well, but at least they'll get me through the rest of this season. I considered buying a pair of Motos that were heavily discounted, just for the liners even though they're Imprint 1. The Photon shells are still in great condition so I'd like to keep using them as long as I can, and Burton only sells the Toaster liners separately. 

There are Intuition liners as well, but I don't have experience with them and I could get a whole new pair of boots for the same price as the Intuition liners.


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

Yes, new footbeds will probably suck up some volume. If the shells are still good, I think you can strategically add adhesive foam and get those boots fitting like a glove again. Boot Fit 101


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## Radialhead (Jan 3, 2018)

Sticking the liners in the oven might expand the foam if they're heat mouldable. That's what I plan on trying if mine get to that stage.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

WigMar said:


> Yes, new footbeds will probably suck up some volume. If the shells are still good, I think you can strategically add adhesive foam and get those boots fitting like a glove again. Boot Fit 101





Radialhead said:


> Sticking the liners in the oven might expand the foam if they're heat mouldable. That's what I plan on trying if mine get to that stage.


Depending on where/what is packed out and has created space/looseness...will depend on what mod or bits of foam to add. Definitily support @WigMar thought of strategically adding foam. A few thoughts:

Perhaps if its just general looseness and your footbed/insoles are good, just put in a thin pice of plastic or plain flat converse tennis shoe foam under your current insole. This will take up a LOT of volume...a little goes a long way...like a 16th or an 8th of an inch. Its basically a "boot shim" that will soak/suck up perhaps 1/2 mondo size. Its a cheap and easy fix that is also easily reversible. I'd recommend maybe starting here first.

Often times its not the packing out of the lower boot/foot...because we like abit more room for da tootsies. But it is the heel pocket and we are getting heel lift...So you make the heel pocket deeper by adding a 1/2 butterfly and perhaps some j/c bars to get the heel held down And sometimes you need some foam bit on the outside of the tounge liner to help keep/push your foot/heel back in to that new pocket. Thus you keep some space for your toes and fore foot and instep/arch that will help with circulation issues...But will lock down your heel and cuff...which is where you get your leverage and power...especially if you are more of a freerider/carver style rider.

For re-heat moulding the liner, ime it will work...BUT it only works for a short time...a few days. It will re-expand the foam liner (intuition liners ime) but the liners will pack out again in short order...so why bother. Imho the since your liners are already moulded to your foot and are perhaps comfortable except for some volume issues, its better to pursue the 2 above options first.

edit: scalp...so if your toes are sore at the end of the day...I'd suspect that your foot is moving fore/aft and you are getting "toe bang"...So good insoles with good/proper arch support will help. And perhaps a bit thicker/more volume via the boot shim...And the foam bits on the tongue liner will all help...presuming that you are not having heel lift issues. If you are having heel lift issues...make a deeper heel pocket.

And another thing...if you have old liners that have all your tweaks to a performance fit slippers but your boots are trashed....just put your old liners in the new shells and you don't need to mess around with break-in and all that stuff. Anyway that is what I've done with my old 32 focus boas soft boots...new shells and old liners...works great. And its probably what I will at least try with my AT boots when the time comes. Thus the moral of the story...save your old liners. It iwll also act as a guide of what and how much to mod new liners...old liners are a valuable source of information for future boot fitting and tweaks.


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## Myoko (Dec 11, 2018)

Nothing will stiffen up packed out boots more than 'Strapins'. Google it.


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

I Actually think bontex boards between the liner and shell are the play here. 

You can get foam pads on Amazon for like 8-10 bucks. You can either cut one of those to fit under your insole. I would get a different footbed as well since they pack out as well. 

I would get new insoles and a bontex board or two to start. You can use the Amazon foam prn where you need it.


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## Jennifer Crew (Jan 17, 2019)

ridethecliche said:


> bontex boards between the liner and shell are the play here.


I ended up adding shims, and ankle wraps on my packed out Burton Limelight’s, plus eliminator tongue shims, they are pretty stiff and add some extra responsiveness. Not perfect, but much better. No insoles. I have high instep so afraid insoles would make my problem worse. And BTW, I heard, that for flat feet, arch supportive insoles actually shorten feet.


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

Jennifer Crew said:


> I ended up adding shims, and ankle wraps on my packed out Burton Limelight’s, plus eliminator tongue shims, they are pretty stiff and add some extra responsiveness. Not perfect, but much better. No insoles. I have high instep so afraid insoles would make my problem worse. And BTW, I heard, that for flat feet, arch supportive insoles actually shorten feet.


He already has an aftermarket insole in his boots. They do wear out over time so it's possible that a new one would take up just a hair more volume. I get the issue re: high instep which is one of the reasons I moved to lace up boots. If you get the right insole for your foot type, it shouldn't make a huge difference. If you have flat feet, then high arch support insoles would be pretty uncomfortable and would definitely shorten your feet.

I'm actually going to be doing some more of what you did. I put foam on the tongue of my liners and under the 'wings' of the boots where the speed hooks for the laces are... I also made C bars. Tonight, I think I'm going to add ankle wraps as well. This feels kinda ridiculous to say but I feel like I may have been able to fit into 7.5's with heel lifts... Jeez.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Scalpelman said:


> I have some two year old burton photon boots that are becoming painful to wear. I find that my toes are newly sore at the end of the day. It seems that thinks are a bit looser.
> 
> Can I revive these boots that are otherwise still responsive? Will new footbeds help?


You can re-heat and it will help a little. Trick is to heat it and then wear them without tightening to full strength and with the thinnest sock you can find. Then adding J or C where you feel things are looser (typically the heel).

Footbeds can help. It's always a mix between foam, footbeds, and so on.

Stiffer liners last a lot longer because they pack out to a set thickness and stay there longer. The problem is with the "comfy" liners, which typically have a bunch of low density foam or open cell foam; these ones pack out and degrade.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Closed cell:





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Open cell:








Speaker / Filter Foam


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Most liners are a hybrid and use both.


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

I'll post the foam pads I use later. I've been using them to snug up the heel pocket for my low volume heels and ankles.

I put a bit too much in last night but I should have it solid tonight. Way less heel lift today vs any other day with these boots!

Here's the foam. 






Amazon.com: Black Self-Stick Adhesive 10" x 10" EVA High Density Foam Sheets (5 Pack) 3mm by Strong Back Crafts- for Canoe & Kayak Seats & Traction Pads, Dog Traction for Cars, Scrapbooking: Arts, Crafts & Sewing


Shop Strong Back Crafts at the Amazon Arts, Crafts & Sewing store. Free Shipping on eligible items. Save on everyday low prices.



go.skimresources.com


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## OldSnow (Nov 20, 2019)

Check out AngrySnowboarders boot fit month series - lots of ideas to mod your boots to where you feel its lacking


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

WigMar said:


> Yes, new footbeds will probably suck up some volume. If the shells are still good, I think you can strategically add adhesive foam and get those boots fitting like a glove again. Boot Fit 101


This was very helpful.


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

So I picked up new shredsoles and the toe gap was immediately filled in the toe box. Looked at some Angry boot fitting 101 vids and fixed a heel lift problem that has been ongoing for over a year. Good stuff guys. Thanks for the tips/links.


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## TooNice (Feb 7, 2014)

Myoko said:


> Nothing will stiffen up packed out boots more than 'Strapins'. Google it.


I think I will give them a go.

My boots seem to pack out very quick. If I was made of money, I would probably swap them out every 30 days. By day 50-60 there is a good chance that I am tightening the boots so much that the boa wires are ripping the fabric once I start to apply pressure via riding, which leads me to tighten the boa even more and wrecking the boots more. And I average 100+ days a season.

The boots I settled for (after trying many others) fits nicely volume wise, and the heel is pretty well locked on.. but as it packs out the shin loses a lot of support and eventually leave me with shin gaps. If those Strapins can help with those gaps I would be very pleased.


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

Have you been going back and adding foam in areas that are getting packed out?


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

I've built up the tongues of my liners with adhesive foam before, and it really tightened things back up. I've always got some foam and a heat gun lying around for when my boots start to pack out.


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## Myoko (Dec 11, 2018)

TooNice let us know how you find those Strapins


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

Myoko said:


> TooNice let us know how you find those Strapins


Yeah, I've been curious too. 

Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


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## TooNice (Feb 7, 2014)

Will do. It's ordered but I managed to sprain my ankle in the meantime from a bad landing.. on an _airmat_ which I suspect wouldn't have happened if my boots weren't completely wrecked.

It's not too serious though I had to take my first day off after 91 days of consecutive riding (88 on snow), so I am pretty sure that I will be back on my board before they get here.

(Also ordered a new pair of boots, so I will probably use the strapins with the new boots and see if the extra assist would help the boots last longer. I basically put so much strain on my boots that the seams always rip within 2 months, but perhaps with the extra support the seams might last longer).


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## Myoko (Dec 11, 2018)

Well fitted new boots shouldn't need any extra support for at least a week I would think? Maybe try them when you notice a gap being created at the top. Makes sense that extra support will prolong their life though. 91 days of consecutive riding, bugger that, I like my lay days which generally occur on a weekend


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

Myoko said:


> Well fitted new boots shouldn't need any extra support for at least a week I would think? Maybe try them when you notice a gap being created at the top. Makes sense that extra support will prolong their life though. 91 days of consecutive riding, bugger that, I like my lay days which generally occur on a weekend


Sometimes boots need a bit of extra help to be well fitted. If you want a truly custom fit in boots, you're going to have to make modifications.


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

ridethecliche said:


> Sometimes boots need a bit of extra help to be well fitted. If you want a truly custom fit in boots, you're going to have to make modifications.


Whenever I get new boots, I set about customizing them to my feet immediately. It starts with a good heat fit of the liner and insole combo, but always includes strategically adding foam as they break in and pack out. Usually I need a little extra heel hold right out of the gate because I have skinny ankles. With my Ride Fuse, I didn't have to do anything besides heat molding the liners for about ten days. Guess it depends on how well the boots fit your feet to start with.


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## TooNice (Feb 7, 2014)

Replaced my 90+ days boots. Wow, how did I ride with them (flex = 0, no wonder for the injury if I mess up).

Strapins arrived, but they only sent me one instead of the two pairs I ordered. Hopefully they will rectify this mistake. Can't recommend the goods if the company is dodgy.

First impression of the product is.. super light, from being rather thin. The product feels cheaper than the price paid (*), though I do note that the price do include free worldwide shipping.

Given that the strap material is pretty thin, I do wonder about their longevity. But, I won't jump to any conclusions. For all I know, they may last a few seasons.

Now given that my boots are new and pretty snug, and I don't have access to my old boots at the moment (left them at a friend's place), at the moment, I don't feel like they make that much difference. It also seem like I didn't tighten them enough on one of the boots as they slipped out. I may need to really pull on them to ensure they stay in place (and hope they don't rip).

More update to come after my boots starts to unpack or I get to try them on my old boots.

(*) Still, given how much a pair of boots cost, if they can extend the lifespan of a boot by about 10 days, it would already be "good value". And Googling for similar product in Japan, I found some made for ski boots that cost a lot more so I guess they are good value (as long as they fulfil the order properly!).


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## Myoko (Dec 11, 2018)

I would have been surprised if they made much difference with new boots but keen to hear when they pack out a bit or if they help your old ones. Annoying you only got one packet, hopefully its a stuff up and they fix it quickly so you get what you paid for. Nothing worse than shit follow up service. Not sure what Strapins you have, mine still look super strong after a year of abuse.


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## MrDavey2Shoes (Mar 5, 2018)

I'll probably get a pair of these. I always end up with gaps at the shins after about 10 days....if that.


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## TooNice (Feb 7, 2014)

Myoko said:


> I would have been surprised if they made much difference with new boots but keen to hear when they pack out a bit or if they help your old ones. Annoying you only got one packet, hopefully its a stuff up and they fix it quickly so you get what you paid for. Nothing worse than shit follow up service. Not sure what Strapins you have, mine still look super strong after a year of abuse.


They've been quick to respond, which is promising. Though I do hope that m new boots won't pack out _that_ quickly, perhaps I will already be able to benefits from them when they get here.

On a side note, I notice people talk about customising the boots with foams and whatnot (*@WigMar @*[B]ridethecliche[/B])

Would you please tell me more about the material you use, and how to fix the material to the boots (e.g. do you superglue the foam on the boots or..)?

I am pretty sure that I have tried virtually every boots I can get my hands on, and I am not going to get a much better fit out of the box than K2 boots. But since they fit almost perfectly (snug, but not blood circulation stopping snug) once they start packing out, I wish I could start filling the gaps. Perhaps the strapins will get the job done, but I may also want to start looking at other work I could do.

Thanks.


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

3m makes a nice adhesive-backed foam. It comes in sheets. You cut it to shape, peel off the backing, and stick it on like a sticker. I use a heat gun to warm the adhesive first, and it sticks really well. Lately I've been using a cheaper generic version from amazon. I got this cheap foam to patch up some old boots I didn't plan on spending five more days on, but it's been holding up in my regular boots pretty well.


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