# Looking for new boots that don't hurt my feet that much



## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Hey fellow riders,

After going through lots of threads on this forum, you seem to be the most experienced community regarding fitment of snowboard boots, so I'm humbly asking for your help 

My old boots broke down (some Nitros, dunno which ones) and I had to get new ones for the 2018 season. I tried different ones in the 44/45 size range (Salomon Malamute, Burton Ion, some Flow boot, some K2 boot) but each and every boot gave me horrible pain in both feet when riding on my toeside. Basically felt like my foot was being crushed after a few minutes. This pretty much ruined by vacation 

After my vacation I went to a shop to try different boots and ended up with a Burton Photon Boa Wide in 44,5.
Also using custom insoles.
Went on vacation again last week. Guess what: *Same pain. Like the front part of my feet is getting crushed. Can't stand it for more than a few minutes. Impossible to complete even a short piste.*
Also, the Photons seem to be pretty soft for me and start to fold in the front foot area when leaning against the tongue to ride on my toe side...

Now from what I've read here in the last couple days, I'm probably wearing too large boots, causing me to strap down the boots and bindings too tight. Loosening them up helped a bit, but didn't fully fix the issue, but led to a very wobbly board feel.

So now I'm here, looking for your advice on what boot might be right and if I need a wide boot at all.

I'd prefer switching to Burton Step Ons, as I'm mostly riding with Ski people and the Step Ons seem pretty convenient.
But I'm also open for other recommendations.

*My current setup:*
About 6'4" tall.
231lbs
Burton Custom 166w
Burton Cartel L
Burton Photon Boa Wide 44,5 (looking at my measurements, I should probably get a 43. No idea how I'm supposed to squeeze my foot in there, though)

*What I'm looking for:*
Stiff boots, with speed lacing or double/triple Boa (Burton Photon/Ion/Driver X/Salomon Malamute, stuff like that).
Also Bindings if my feet are suitable for Burton Ion Step Ons

*Where I ride:*
Almost only piste, no backcountry/park/freeride/whatever

*How I ride:*
Intermediate rider,
Regular, some switch riding,
currently at +21/-12 with a wider than ref stance

*My feet:*
- See attached pics -


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## LeDe (May 16, 2018)

Hey, 
You seem to have done a bit of research as you posted your measurement pics without being asked to!
I am not one of the expert here, but it seems like you could need wide boots as that would explain why you feel restricted at your mondo size and settle for 1.5 larger size. 
Unfortunately, you will probably have to go for the boots that fit not the model that has the tech you want. 
An example, I wear Adidas Acerra size 11, I now know I am a size 10. The Adidas having a really thin liner has not packed much or at all after about 50 days riding. This and the fact that my big calves just squeeze in means that I can accomodate with the small heel lift i experience. I start having small pain on some traverse if I do not tighten carefully. 
This is by far the best and most comfortable boots I ever had, however if I want the perfect fit and more performance I should look into something my mondo size. @Wiredsport advised on the Salomon Synapse.
I am only waiting because they do not have boas in wide and because my Adidas kind of work. 

Bottom line, when you have wide feet or low/high arch or anything unusual, there are lest choices and it becomes a matter of compromises between performance/comfort/heel lift/tech/...

For me comfort is key. 

I'll leave you with @Wiredsport and other knowledgeable guys.


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

LeDe said:


> Hey,
> You seem to have done a bit of research as you posted your measurement pics without being asked to!
> I am not one of the expert here, but it seems like you could need wide boots as that would explain why you feel restricted at your mondo size and settle for 1.5 larger size.
> Unfortunately, you will probably have to go for the boots that fit not the model that has the tech you want.
> ...


Thanks for your reply 

I don't even know IF I actually need wide boots. My assumption was that the pain was caused by the boots being too narrow. However, the Photon Wide didn't make a difference at all.


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

Your feet are the same length and width as mine (mine might be slightly wider) and I wear a regular US 10. However, my big toe sticks out sightly further than my second toe which can be a make-or-break thing in terms of comfort. Some brands are shaped for my foot, some for yours. 

FWIW I'm perfectly comfortable in a non-wide 32 TM2 size 10, and US 10 Burton boots have fit me well too. Salomon boots in normal widths feel way too narrow, but their wide sizes have been comfortable.

Wiredsport can make good recommendations, but I think your current boots are definitely too big. And part of the problem with Step-ins is that if you don't have a Burton foot, (or DC now I guess) they're just not going to work for you.

Finally, this is the best "what size boots should I get" post ever...all the info is there with pictures.


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

Yes, well done on your second post!


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## Radialhead (Jan 3, 2018)

Agreed about it being one of the better boot help posts, with one caveat. The photos are to enable people (mainly Wired) to confirm the exact length & width of your feet at the widest point. That isn't easy from your photos as the tape measure is so far from the widest point. It would be helpful if you re-did the photos with the tape measure in the right place, bearing in mind the measurements need to be millimetre accurate.


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

How about this way? Also okay?
Pretty much all of our door frames etc. have silicone seams that will put the ruler off a bit when measuring directly under my foot


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

By the way, I can also provide pictures of my feet on the current insoles and pictures of the boot where it folds if needed.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Hi Cornerback,

Thanks for all of the images. Those are nicely done! 

You are Mondopoint 280 which is size 10 US or *43 Euro. You are at the lower side of the measurement range for Mondopoint 280. The range is 276 to 280 mm. Your width (one foot only) is E width and requires a specific wide boot. Your other foot is a "normal" D. I would strongly suggest the Salomon Dialogue Wide or Synapse Wide in Mondopoint 280 or US size 10. 

STOKED!


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

*HiFi


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Hi folks and thanks very much for the replies and recommendations. The Synapse seems to be the stiffer boot, right?

Does it even make sense with my feet to go and try normal width boots? I don't have a chart here so I don't know on which side of the width-range I am 

Kind regards

Cornerback


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

Synapse is stiffer yes, think it's mostly wider in the toe with some softer side panels on the liner. Only thing stiff about the dialogue is the lacing.


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

Synapse really aren't that stiff once broken in.


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

So are my feet (or at least one) really too wide for a boot like the Burton Ion when thermoforming it? Would be a shame, as I'm looking for something stiff 
(Asking because I found a sweet deal for an almost new 2020 Burton Ion in size 43)


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## Radialhead (Jan 3, 2018)

If you're prepared to modify the liner (or maybe even swap it for a thin Imprint liner) you could make it work. You're about 3mm above D width.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Cornerback said:


> So are my feet (or at least one) really too wide for a boot like the Burton Ion when thermoforming it? Would be a shame, as I'm looking for something stiff
> (Asking because I found a sweet deal for an almost new 2020 Burton Ion in size 43)


Many riders that have been riding in boots that are significantly too large conclude that stiff boots are the answer. It is very common for them to change that preference once they are in a boot that is correctly sized and has the opportunity to perform as designed (a boot that is worn too large will never perform as designed). I would stroingly suggest that you size to your wider foot and do not vary from your mondopoint size.

If the assistance provided has been helpful to you, your positive reviews on either of the sites below (or both) would be greatly appreciated. STOKED!









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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Hey fella. Thanks for your reply. My wish for stiff boots is probably caused by the fact that when I started snowboarding, I used my Ski boots + hardboot bindings for the first couple of years. I really liked the response when pushing my shins agains the boots. So I stuck with stiff boots 

I will of course stay with mondo 280 then and try out some boots. Unfortunately, the Synapse Wide isnt available in 280 at the moment, so I'll wait until the new season begins before trying them out.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Got it. Ski boots have an integrated exoskeleton. We have bindings. You are on the right track now!


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Hey fellas,

I've got a Burton ION here now for testing in Mondo 28. The width doesnt seem to be an issue. But how the hell am I supposed go get my toes in there? I dont know how to get my foot further into the heel pocket and my toes are somehow flexed and cannot be extended. Is this what people mean by "Burton might not be the right fit for your foot"?

Kind regards

Cornerback


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Cornerback said:


> Hey fellas,
> 
> I've got a Burton ION here now for testing in Mondo 28. The width doesnt seem to be an issue. But how the hell am I supposed go get my toes in there? I dont know how to get my foot further into the heel pocket and my toes are somehow flexed and cannot be extended. Is this what people mean by "Burton might not be the right fit for your foot"?
> 
> ...


Hi Cornerback,

The Burton Ion is not a Wide model. It would not be expected to fit. Keep in mind that a boot which is too narrow will also be too short due to the arced shape of the toe box.


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Good point, didnt consider this  I also ordered the Synapse Wide you suggested, so I'm looking forward to this!

What about the K2 Maysis Wide? Would it also fit my needs? I can't find any info about how wide it is?

Also, what are the expected outcomes when using a 3E boot in Mondo 28? Also too much space and therefore pain in the foot?


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## LeDe (May 16, 2018)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi Cornerback,
> 
> The Burton Ion is not a Wide model. It would not be expected to fit. Keep in mind that a boot which is too narrow will also be too short due to the arced shape of the toe box.


Wiredsport, 
I knew you were right but I was missing this to make sense of it fully!

I'll also try to get a pair of Synapse next year. 
If only they could put Boas on the wide model.

Thanks a lot!


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## Radialhead (Jan 3, 2018)

Cornerback said:


> Hey fellas,
> 
> I've got a Burton ION here now for testing in Mondo 28. The width doesnt seem to be an issue. But how the hell am I supposed go get my toes in there? I dont know how to get my foot further into the heel pocket and my toes are somehow flexed and cannot be extended. Is this what people mean by "Burton might not be the right fit for your foot"?


Your left foot should be an easy D fit so if that's bad, then yes, you probably haven't got Burton feet. I'm fine with Burton, but my big toes are the longest, so that's one big difference.


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Does anyone have info on the width of the K2 Maysis Wide? Is it also an E width?


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Cornerback said:


> Does anyone have info on the width of the K2 Maysis Wide? Is it also an E width?


K2 does not publish a width. Width issue aside a second question is will the Conda System work for your foot? It works nicely for some feet but not for others. It is difficult to broadly suggest this boot.


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Trial and error it is then, I guess  looking forward to the Synapse. Should be with me soon.


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Hey fellas,

I've got a small update here:
I ordered a lot of different boots in mondo 28. Some of them already have arrived, including the Salomon Synapse Wide.

The following boots have arrived already and underwent some testing:

K2 Thraxis - Good fit, but the Boa Conda creates pressure points. Therefore not too comfortable. Width is okay.
Ride Insano - Good fit, but the internal J-bars cause painful pressure points on my ankle bones. Therefore not too comfortable. A bit narrow, but okay. Can heat molding fix the J-Bars?
Ride Trident - Good fit, but I dont like the lacing system. Also creates severe pressure points on my ankle bones. Uncomfortable. Width is okay.
Salomon Malamute - No way. Very narrow. The most narrow boot I have at the moment. Very uncomfortable. Also, I don't like Salomons lacing system
Salomon Synapse Wide - Interestingly, the second most narrow boot, right after the Malamute. Squeezes my front/mid foot very hard. Very uncomfortable. Also the flex is too soft for my liking.

I ordered some more boots, so stay tuned:

ThirtyTwo TM-Two
ThirtyTwo Focus Boa
DC Control Boa
Nidecker Flow Helios
Salomon Dialogue Focus Boa


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Hi Cornerback. It is important to remember that you are not looking for fit out of the box but after heat molding and break in. This varies greatly by liner design. 

STOKED!


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi Cornerback. It is important to remember that you are not looking for fit out of the box but after heat molding and break in. This varies greatly by liner design.
> 
> STOKED!


Yeah, I know. However, some of the boots are so uncomfortable (Malamute/Synapse) that I'm not sure heat molding can fix this. Unfortunately, I cannot return them if I heat mold them, so I have to figure out the best fit before heat molding.
By the way, do you know if the "JBars" on the liner of the Ride Trident & Insano are heat moldable as well? Will they soften up to be moldable? Otherwise i have to rule out both boots.


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## Surgeon (Apr 13, 2020)

Cornerback said:


> Yeah, I know. However, some of the boots are so uncomfortable (Malamute/Synapse) that I'm not sure heat molding can fix this. Unfortunately, I cannot return them if I heat mold them, so I have to figure out the best fit before heat molding.
> By the way, do you know if the "JBars" on the liner of the Ride Trident & Insano are heat moldable as well? Will they soften up to be moldable? Otherwise i have to rule out both boots.


I don’t have wired’s experience or expertise but I’ll say this to your question: I have new pair of Burton Imperial which gave me a lot of pain on the outside malleolous of my left foot due to the jbar on that side... It would be quite painful after a few minutes and my DIY-rice-heatmolding didn't solve the issue. 
I ended-up using a hairdryer for about a minute (if that, maximum) on the specific jbar that was giving me problems and then put the boot on for maybe 10 minutes. It completely solved my problem without reducing the jbar too much (it still appears just as big and supportive as before). That spot-molding really worked wonders for my problematic boot. I can't promise you it'll work for you but it sure did for me.
I hope this helps.


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## RMx400 (Jun 27, 2018)

Cornerback said:


> Hey fellas,
> 
> I've got a small update here:
> I ordered a lot of different boots in mondo 28. Some of them already have arrived, including the Salomon Synapse Wide.
> ...


I have dc control boas and they feel great until I begin riding, which is when the midfoot/cramping pain begins. @Wiredsport has also recommended to me synapse/dialogue wide boots but im definitely going to hold back until i get to try them in person, but there is a sweet deal on them in my size right now. I'm kind of skeptical because you have been recommended the same boot but find them uncomfortable. Interesting to say the least...Please update me on how the dialogue focus fits!


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

New Update:

ThirtyTwo TM-Two - Puts a LOT of pressure on top of my feet. Guess my insteps are too high for this model. Very uncomfortable
DC Control Boa - Seems to run 2 sizes small. My toes are fully curled and still hit the boot everywhere.
Nidecker Flow Helios - Seems okay, but makes weird squeaking noises  Also pretty soft and narrow.
ThirtyTwo Focus Boa - will ariive on monday
Salomon Dialogue Focus Boa - will arrive on monday

So for now, I somehow like the Ride Insano, the Synapse Wide, and the Thraxis. What I'm having difficulties with is... all of them cause some pressure points, but I don't know if heat molding is able to fix those. I can't test it because I can't return the boots if I heat mold them.

Is there a way to figure out if uncomfortable spots can be fixed by heat molding?


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## Surgeon (Apr 13, 2020)

Heat molding will help but there’s no guarantee that it’ll fix everything. Also keep in mind that the boots will break in/ pack with time, which will help. I’ve never encountered new boots that felt like slippers and I used to buy them a full size and a half too big...

There’s now way to know for sure. You’re lucky and are able to try a lot of models before buying. Just get the ones that feel best, you’re really doing all you can, short of going to a shop and deal with a pro bootfitter.


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Surgeon said:


> Heat molding will help but there’s no guarantee that it’ll fix everything. Also keep in mind that the boots will break in/ pack with time, which will help. I’ve never encountered new boots that felt like slippers and I used to buy them a full size and a half too big...
> 
> There’s now way to know for sure. You’re lucky and are able to try a lot of models before buying. Just get the ones that feel best, you’re really doing all you can, short of going to a shop and deal with a pro bootfitter.


Yeah, we don't have any good shops around here. And the shops we have, only have a few model in store. I ordered those boots from 4 different stores 
I'll just keep trying...


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## Surgeon (Apr 13, 2020)

Cornerback said:


> Yeah, we don't have any good shops around here. And the shops we have, only have a few model in store. I ordered those boots from 4 different stores
> I'll just keep trying...


Kinda likewhere I am...


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Three more coming up soon:

Nitro Team TLS
Nitro Capital TLS
Nitro Select TLS


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## Rood Ant Boarder (Nov 26, 2021)

Cornerback said:


> New Update:
> 
> ThirtyTwo TM-Two - Puts a LOT of pressure on top of my feet. Guess my insteps are too high for this model. Very uncomfortable
> DC Control Boa - Seems to run 2 sizes small. My toes are fully curled and still hit the boot everywhere.
> ...


I am having the exact same problem with the Ride Insano... I live fairly remote, no shops around, ordered Ride Insano online, and they seem great except for one of my ankle bones has pain points, I'm assuming the same 'j bars' issue you mention; I would love to hear the end of your story, what you went with, if you tried heat molding the Insano and if it fixed the issue.

Any further updates, Cornerback ?


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## Cornerback (Mar 16, 2020)

Rood Ant Boarder said:


> I am having the exact same problem with the Ride Insano... I live fairly remote, no shops around, ordered Ride Insano online, and they seem great except for one of my ankle bones has pain points, I'm assuming the same 'j bars' issue you mention; I would love to hear the end of your story, what you went with, if you tried heat molding the Insano and if it fixed the issue.
> 
> Any further updates, Cornerback ?


No happy end for now. Kept my old Photons and returned the rest. Could not do any further boarding due to Covid.


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## Rood Ant Boarder (Nov 26, 2021)

Cornerback said:


> No happy end for now. Kept my old Photons and returned the rest. Could not do any further boarding due to Covid.


Ah, sucks; we just had to get a refund for our season's passes to our closest hill because the are going to require proof of vaccination; but still should be able to ride somewhere.

As you were, I'm nervous to try heat molding these Insano liners in case it doesn't fix the ankle pain that I have when just wearing them in the house.

Well, all the best, hope you get to ride somewhere this year.


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## Surgeon (Apr 13, 2020)

Rood Ant Boarder said:


> Ah, sucks; we just had to get a refund for our season's passes to our closest hill because the are going to require proof of vaccination; but still should be able to ride somewhere.


I hope many people do exactly what you did at my local hill.
Shorter lines for the responsible and intelligent people.


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## Rood Ant Boarder (Nov 26, 2021)

Surgeon said:


> I hope many people do exactly what you did at my local hill.
> Shorter lines for the responsible and intelligent people.


ok ok, why does every discussion have to be turned into an insult on peoples COVID opinion
thanks for killing this profitable discussion about snowboard boots


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## Surgeon (Apr 13, 2020)

Rood Ant Boarder said:


> ok ok, why does every discussion have to be turned into an insult on peoples COVID opinion
> thanks for killing this profitable discussion about snowboard boots


Because your refusal to comply to proof of vaccination means you refuse to get vaccinated (unless you are vaccinated but refuse to show proof). This, in itself, is an ignorant and irresponsible position to take. You talk about "beliefs", I'm talking pure scientific facts that have nothing to do with opinions and subjectivity.
By all means talk about boots.


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## Rood Ant Boarder (Nov 26, 2021)

Surgeon said:


> Because your refusal to comply to proof of vaccination means you refuse to get vaccinated (unless you are vaccinated but refuse to show proof). This, in itself, is an ignorant and irresponsible position to take. You talk about "beliefs", I'm talking pure scientific facts that have nothing to do with opinions and subjectivity.
> By all means talk about boots.


"By all means talk about boots."
I guess I must have been confused... I thought I joined a snowboarding forum.

You know another way that we use the word 'ignorant' in my village is for people who are oblivious to others and butt in to force their views that they weren't asked for; that person is being ignorant.
I never mentioned "beliefs", and for scientific fact, did you realize it was not that long ago that it was reasonable scientific fact that a lobotomy was a good solution for mental illness? Even more recently, IN MY LIFETIME, it was reasonable scientific fact that to tear children away from their families was the best way to instill culture into them. Don't you lecture me on your white-man scientific fact of the moment that is being pushed by government, you ignorant colonialist.


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

...and, we're done.


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