# Damn it alive!!!!!



## binarypie (Nov 29, 2009)

Call them up and tell them their disks are defective. 

Alternatively if you don't care about adjusting your angles then just glue the plate to the binding.


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

binarypie said:


> Call them up and tell them their disks are defective.
> 
> *Alternatively if you don't care about adjusting your angles then just glue the plate to the binding*.


The plate is not rotating within the binding. Its rotating over the screws if you know what I mean.


----------



## binarypie (Nov 29, 2009)

Joe Coffee said:


> The plate is not rotating within the binding. Its rotating over the screws if you know what I mean.


OHHH now I understand. 

Maybe try different hardware if you can find a set of burton EST screws and washers?

Or if you really desperate just go get a really thin foam type material people put on the bottom of their kitchen drawers and sandwich it between your binding and the board. 

Perhaps you just need more friction?


----------



## gmore10 (Dec 23, 2011)

Shouldn't of bought a shitty channel board :yahoo:


----------



## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

The bolts are jumping from one location in the binding plate to another? That's what it looks like from the pix. Seems to me that would mean that the bolts and washers aren't the right profile for the concave sections in the slots, OR you're not making sure the bolts are sitting right in those concave sections when tightening, OR the bolts don't seat properly in there for some other reason -- like they're too long and bottom out before they form a snug fit. Or maybe there's supposed to be a pad underneath the plate that would increase the height slightly.

These are all just random guesses. But the alternative is that you're so hard on your equipment that you're able to deform the plates enough to have the bindings jump to another position. And you'd think the manufacturer would have heard about that kind of problem if it happened a lot.


----------



## J.Schaef (Sep 13, 2009)

OP: Call C3, the baseplates probably need replacing. Maybe if you are lucky, they will send you some. If you have to buy them, at least they are cheap. I seem to remember some of the baseplates from other binding companies being a bit problematic with burtons channel system.



gmore10 said:


> Shouldn't of bought a shitty channel board :yahoo:


Productive post. I have quite a few Channel boards, and I love all of them. I think the channel and EST bindings is pretty fantastic.


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

Thanks for the suggestions guys but I have tightened the hell out of the screws, Made sure the washers are seated correctly etc etc. I am just thinking now selling the bindings and buying some burton bindings to go with it.


----------



## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

Well, there's always that option too. :laugh:

There's a point at which you have to stop finessing it and just hit it with a hammer.


----------



## gmore10 (Dec 23, 2011)

J.Schaef said:


> OP: Call C3, the baseplates probably need replacing. Maybe if you are lucky, they will send you some. If you have to buy them, at least they are cheap. I seem to remember some of the baseplates from other binding companies being a bit problematic with burtons channel system.
> 
> 
> 
> Productive post. I have quite a few Channel boards, and I love all of them. I think the channel and EST bindings is pretty fantastic.


Awwwwwww just like every other person that's rides a Burton you get all butthurt, because burton makes the best boards ever yea right.


----------



## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

I feel a disturbance in the force, as if someone is starting to troll... :ban:


----------



## jjz (Feb 14, 2012)

C3 has a baseplate warrant if im not mistaken.

I have my 2011 forces mounted on my 2013 parkitec using Burton Conversion Discs, and hardware.


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

gmore10 said:


> Awwwwwww just like every other person that's rides a Burton you get all butthurt, because burton makes the best boards ever yea right.


Its not the board that is causing the problem. Its the conversion disc made by union that is the problem.


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

jjz said:


> C3 has a baseplate warrant if im not mistaken.
> 
> I have my 2011 forces mounted on my 2013 parkitec using Burton Conversion Discs, and hardware.


What conversion discs did you get and were did you get them?


----------



## J.Schaef (Sep 13, 2009)

gmore10 said:


> Awwwwwww just like every other person that's rides a Burton you get all butthurt, because burton makes the best boards ever yea right.


lol. I think they make as good a snowboard as almost any other company. I think they have a pretty great warranty program. I have a ton of snowboards, from many other companies. I ride quite a bit, and have ridden a LOT of boards. I have boards from 4 awesome companies in my quiver right now. I'd consider Burton to be one of them.

OP: Channel boards with EST bindings do feel pretty great. EST definitely feels a bit more responsive, and I prefer the way the board flexes under my foot. Hard to explain, but I would say get yourself a set of Cartels, or Malavitas.

If you don't go that route, Call C3, see if they have the updated discs. I almost wonder if those are the old discs, not meant for the M6 hardware. The M6 inserts that you have should extend upwards into the disc and lock into the holes provided. That should be what is preventing the slippage. If the M6 inserts do not fit fairly snugly in each individual hole, I would just call C3, and get these.


----------



## edlo (Jan 24, 2011)

*Washers*



Donutz said:


> . Seems to me that would mean that the bolts and washers aren't the right profile for the concave sections in the slot.


Not all washers are the same. If you've ever seen the k2 flat washer you know why different they can be not to mention impossible to find. If you currently have any type of foam or dampening material between the board and binding it might be compressing as you ride , jump, or land. If it compresses the whole disc will be a able to move. There is a reason why Burton's screw mounts are as far away from eachother as possible. 

The two point mounting system doesn't help because it is designed to flex. As the board flexes , it will push the screw up allowing movement , that is why your screws are still tight when you get to the bottom. You can 1)try to add friction under the disc with padding as some have mentioned, 2) add padding to the outside of the disk to absorb the board flexing 3) try different washer 4) get new bindings.


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

J.Schaef said:


> lol. I think they make as good a snowboard as almost any other company. I think they have a pretty great warranty program. I have a ton of snowboards, from many other companies. I ride quite a bit, and have ridden a LOT of boards. I have boards from 4 awesome companies in my quiver right now. I'd consider Burton to be one of them.
> 
> OP: Channel boards with EST bindings do feel pretty great. EST definitely feels a bit more responsive, and I prefer the way the board flexes under my foot. Hard to explain, but I would say get yourself a set of Cartels, or Malavitas.
> 
> If you don't go that route, Call C3, see if they have the updated discs. I almost wonder if those are the old discs, not meant for the M6 hardware. The M6 inserts that you have should extend upwards into the disc and lock into the holes provided. That should be what is preventing the slippage. If the M6 inserts do not fit fairly snugly in each individual hole, I would just call C3, and* get these.*



That is what I have.

is any oner elsew having this problem? How do you gys mount you unions to a channel board? Also what is C3? and what would padding do to help? Could I just get a power drill and drill them tight tight?


----------



## edlo (Jan 24, 2011)

Joe Coffee said:


> [/B]
> That is what I have.
> 
> is any oner elsew having this problem? How do you gys mount you unions to a channel board? Also what is C3? and what would padding do to help? Could I just get a power drill and drill them tight tight?


I dont recommend power tools, are you using a philips #3 screwdriver? 

It looks like you have two things going one, if you say it starts and 15 and ends at 6, the biding is rotating between the disk and the board.

Looking at the picture the disk is moving, it starts with one screw mounted on the 2nd whole and one screw mounted to the 3rd hole, but end up both on the 2nd hole.

The slots on the disc should probably stat perpendicular to the channel with both screws using the same corresponding hole. both using the 2nd hole. That disc can only rotate so far. 

The padding would add friction height and prevent the binding from rotating. But if the padding is too thick, your screws will be too short, and you won't be able to tighten them.


----------



## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

C3 is the parent company of union/capita/coal.....

Your disks look worn out....


----------



## Extremo (Nov 6, 2008)

Joe Coffee said:


> [/B]
> That is what I have.
> 
> is any oner elsew having this problem? How do you gys mount you unions to a channel board? Also what is C3? and what would padding do to help? Could I just get a power drill and drill them tight tight?


This is just what happens when you only have 2 screws holding a binding on. The only thing you could possibly do is place something abrasive between the binding and the board to limit it's ability to slide.


----------



## MochaBeans (Feb 1, 2013)

Put the screws into matching holes (2nd hole and 2nd hole or something) and then just rotate the binding around the disk more, might help


----------



## edlo (Jan 24, 2011)

MochaBeans said:


> Put the screws into matching holes (2nd hole and 2nd hole or something) and then just rotate the binding around the disk more, might help


That's what I tried to say. MochaBeans did a much better job


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

Ok apparently I am doing something wrong because no one has had this problem. I can't find anyone on the internet having this problem and guys in skate shops said they have never seen the problem before. So here is what I am doing. Maybe you guys can point out something wrong I am doing.


Step 1: I put the M6 sliders in the channel. 

Step 2: I put the binding on the board and put the two sliders up through corresponding holes on the disc. (Meaning both inserts are in hole 2 or hole 3 etc)

Step 3: I use a number 2 phillips screwdriver (Does a number 3 tighten better?) to tighten 13mm burton screws and union washers. I Tighten till I can not tighten them anymore. 

I have been thinking maybe the problem is as simple as not having them tight enough? Does a number 3 screwdriver work better other than fit better in the screw?


----------



## J.Schaef (Sep 13, 2009)

Joe Coffee said:


> Ok apparently I am doing something wrong because no one has had this problem. I can't find anyone on the internet having this problem and guys in skate shops said they have never seen the problem before. So here is what I am doing. Maybe you guys can point out something wrong I am doing.
> 
> 
> Step 1: I put the M6 sliders in the channel.
> ...


Yes. Everything sounds correct aside from the screwdriver. You want a #3.


----------



## airblaster503 (Dec 24, 2012)

Get some Burton hardware for the bindings. With that channel setup they have, I am guessing the Union hardware for normal inserts is to long, which is leaving a little room for play even when the screws are tight. That is the only reason that the bindings would move positions the way they are. I am almost positive though that boards with the channel set up require shorter hardware to fight against this. Should be able to get some from any burton dealer for cheap/free.


----------



## edlo (Jan 24, 2011)

Joe Coffee said:


> guys in skate shops said they have never seen the problem before.


I hope it is a skate and snowboard shop. I noticed you are in Canada, otherwise I'd send you a P3 bit for 2 bucks paypaled. You can get it at a autoparts store or hardware, or maybe even the skate shop that you use. Something buying it bundled with a bunch of other bits as a kit is acutally pretty cheap like $1-$2. But you've probally have already used a P3 at the Chalet, the one chained to the work bench is usually a P3. So it is either the screw lengths , or the orientiation of the disk. 

I realized that some of my comments might be off since I initially was comparing your left and right binding not realizing they were different. 
Does the binding start with screw in holes 2 and 3 then moves somewhere different to 2 and 2 or even 1 and 2? Does the indication start and 15 then move to 6?


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

airblaster503 said:


> Get some Burton hardware for the bindings. With that channel setup they have, I am guessing the Union hardware for normal inserts is to long, which is leaving a little room for play even when the screws are tight. That is the only reason that the bindings would move positions the way they are. I am almost positive though that boards with the channel set up require shorter hardware to fight against this. Should be able to get some from any burton dealer for cheap/free.


What do you mean? Shorter Screws? I am using all the neccesary hardware.

Burton M6 Sliders.

Burton 13mm screws (shorter than normal union screws)


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

edlo said:


> I hope it is a skate and snowboard shop. I noticed you are in Canada, otherwise I'd send you a P3 bit for 2 bucks paypaled. You can get it at a autoparts store or hardware, or maybe even the skate shop that you use. Something buying it bundled with a bunch of other bits as a kit is acutally pretty cheap like $1-$2. But you've probally have already used a P3 at the Chalet, the one chained to the work bench is usually a P3. So it is either the screw lengths , or the orientiation of the disk.
> 
> I realized that some of my comments might be off since I initially was comparing your left and right binding not realizing they were different.
> Does the binding start with screw in holes 2 and 3 then moves somewhere different to 2 and 2 or even 1 and 2? Does the indication start and 15 then move to 6?


The indication moves all over the place. 15 then to 6 was just one of the many positions it shifts to. It shifts all overt he place. My screws are in holes 2 and 2 (middle holes.) they move all over. I am using 13mm screws from burton. Should I be using the regular 16mm screws from union?


----------



## Cyfer (Feb 7, 2013)

It's been a while since I worked in a shop so I hope my information isn't too out of date. Use the 13 mm screws, they need to be shorter since the mounting hardware is not recessed into the boards top sheet. I would suspect your discs here, unless you base plates are warped. What I would try is simple, and cost you a lot less than new bindings. New discs and hardware first. You should be able to get everything you need with two phone calls, one to C3 and the other to Burton. I wouldn't be surprised for free. Try replacing all your hardware M6 sliders and bolts as well (due to heavy tightening something could be bent slightly) and the discs, before dumping two or three bills on new bindings. What do you have to lose by trying that, 10 bucks or so? 

Don't cut off the head to stop the headache first. Try the cheap route, if it still is screwed up then I would replace your bindings because your baseplates might be warped causing play when the board flexes. Hope it's just the discs, good luck.


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

Cyfer said:


> It's been a while since I worked in a shop so I hope my information isn't too out of date. Use the 13 mm screws, they need to be shorter since the mounting hardware is not recessed into the boards top sheet. I would suspect your discs here, unless you base plates are warped. What I would try is simple, and cost you a lot less than new bindings. New discs and hardware first. You should be able to get everything you need with two phone calls, one to C3 and the other to Burton. I wouldn't be surprised for free. Try replacing all your hardware M6 sliders and bolts as well (due to heavy tightening something could be bent slightly) and the discs, before dumping two or three bills on new bindings. What do you have to lose by trying that, 10 bucks or so?
> 
> Don't cut off the head to stop the headache first. Try the cheap route, if it still is screwed up then I would replace your bindings because your baseplates might be warped causing play when the board flexes. Hope it's just the discs, good luck.


Yeah I went and got new hardware from burton and discs from union. I also have a disc from burton on the way. I am going to install the news discs and put some padding underneath the binding and tighten the screws well with a #3 screwdriver. It should work this time around. If not I am going to nuke down a hill into a tree. (Or maybe I should call union and ask for a new pair of bindings in the event these ones are warped?)


----------



## Extremo (Nov 6, 2008)

Joe Coffee said:


> Yeah I went and got new hardware from burton and discs from union. I also have a disc from burton on the way. I am going to install the news discs and put some padding underneath the binding and tighten the screws well with a #3 screwdriver. It should work this time around. If not I am going to nuke down a hill into a tree. (Or maybe I should call union and ask for a new pair of bindings in the event these ones are warped?)


Try some grip tape. Put some on the board and on the binding. It shouldn't slide with those two surfaces pressed together.


----------



## Cyfer (Feb 7, 2013)

Joe Coffee said:


> Yeah I went and got new hardware from burton and discs from union. I also have a disc from burton on the way. I am going to install the news discs and put some padding underneath the binding and tighten the screws well with a #3 screwdriver. It should work this time around. If not I am going to nuke down a hill into a tree. (Or maybe I should call union and ask for a new pair of bindings in the event these ones are warped?)


If it turns out the base plates are warped, (doubtful, but it could happen) call union and request new baseplates they have a lifetime warranty. Hope the new hardware and discs solve your problem. It's what I would do before I shelled out a few hundred bucks for bindings.


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

I think that may be the problem.warped baseplates. I have new baseplates from union on the way as well as a conversion discs from burton. if none of this works I am finished with union because I will ditch union bindings before i ditch burton boards.


----------



## Cyfer (Feb 7, 2013)

Joe Coffee said:


> I think that may be the problem.warped baseplates. I have new baseplates from union on the way as well as a conversion discs from burton. if none of this works I am finished with union because I will ditch union bindings before i ditch burton boards.


If it doesn't work at least you tried everything possible to fix it. I hope everything works out and you can avoid shelling out the scratch for new bindings. On a high not, if you end up getting new bindings and go with burton EST you will get the full benefit if the EST system.


----------



## Joe Coffee (Dec 12, 2012)

I FIXED IT. This time around I did things differently.

You have to use the washers provided by union NOT the black ones providied by burton that you get with the 13mm screws. 

Plus you have to use a #3 screw driver (duh). You may think a #2 will work but it wont get the screws tight enough. USe a number 3.

Use some threadlock of some sort.


----------



## edlo (Jan 24, 2011)

Take it easy with the loctite you don't want to put too much, if you ever take out the screw make sure there isn't any loctite at the bottom of the holes when reinstalling. Too much loctite collected at the bottoms can actually cause problems. Shops around here will actually give you free screw with loctite on it.


----------



## Cyfer (Feb 7, 2013)

Joe Coffee said:


> I FIXED IT. This time around I did things differently.
> 
> You have to use the washers provided by union NOT the black ones providied by burton that you get with the 13mm screws.
> 
> ...


NICE!! Glad to hear it worked out for ya and it didn't cost you some hard earned bills. Always like hearing about someone saving a setup and some cash at the same time. :yahoo:


----------



## edlo (Jan 24, 2011)

Joe Coffee said:


> I FIXED IT. This time around I did things differently.
> 
> You have to use the washers provided by union NOT the black ones providied by burton that you get with the 13mm screws.
> 
> ...


Donutz called it on day 1 washer profile


----------

