# Advice for heel lift with Burton motos



## Efilnikufesin (Oct 8, 2011)

You can try adding some xtra j bars. I just grab some thin stick on weatherstripping from a hardware store and use that for any minor adjustment with things like that.

Motos are soft though, and if they have that same speed lacing system they had 7 or so years ago, you are really going to want better boots, they will just get looser and looser.

Had mine for my first season, but after 20 days or so I moved on.


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## mizab70 (Dec 14, 2014)

This is my first year snowboarding I first got a cheap pair of simms and then was told these would be great for a beginner.... I wish I had the cash for a upgrade already but will likely have to wait until next year. 

For the weatherstripping do I just tape it around my heel area? For extra J-bar should I just put them on top of the existing ones? They are pretty big and j-bars I have to attach are no where near as big as ones already on the liner.


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## Efilnikufesin (Oct 8, 2011)

mizab70 said:


> This is my first year snowboarding I first got a cheap pair of simms and then was told these would be great for a beginner.... I wish I had the cash for a upgrade already but will likely have to wait until next year.
> 
> For the weatherstripping do I just tape it around my heel area? For extra J-bar should I just put them on top of the existing ones? They are pretty big and j-bars I have to attach are no where near as big as ones already on the liner.


The weatherstripping is self adhesive, just stick it on where you feel you need it. It is maneuverable so you can make J bars or C bars out of. Get the thinner type so you can make minor adjustments as you go along, and if you put it on in the wrong spot it is easy to pull off if you don't let it sit for too long.

Motos will prob get you though your first season, get them to work as best you can but you will prob want to move on to something better next season.


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## Efilnikufesin (Oct 8, 2011)

Check out this link, lot of good info.

http://www.snowboardingforum.com/boots/51066-boots-faq-etc.html


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## mizab70 (Dec 14, 2014)

Thanks for the link looks like I got a lot of work to do lol....


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

don't invest any money into those boots though. they will just squish and squish and squish no matter what you put into them they are a glorified sock. 

get them to where they work and abuse the fuck out of them so u can justify getting a quality pair of boots that fit.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Hi Miza,

Did the Selective heat fit solve/help your asym issue from the other thread?

I don't mean to oversimplify what is going on with your heel lift but let me ask about the simplest thing that is many times the answer with new riders. 

Snowboard boot liners are designed to be done up significantly tighter than many other forms of footwear. I mention this because we have watched many thousands of first time boot buyers in store lace up and they do it relatively gently at first. They lace the liner loosely enough that it could not hold the heel well and then spend a lot of time tensioning the outer. When we jump in and and torque on their liner a bit we get that ahah smile. Where heel lift is concerned the liner is the more important of the two. If your heel does not get tugged back and under the heel ridge(s) at the liner level there is no fixing this with outer tensioning. The liner is also much more compliant than the outer, so it allows tightening without circulation loss to a much greater degree than the outer.

When a liner is new you want to crank it down..and then crank it down again. Find the line between tight and too tight by crossing it...and then backing away incrementally.

Before you make any major changes please try this and let us know where you land.

STOKED!


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## mizab70 (Dec 14, 2014)

I tighten it down as much as I possibly can. The motos have the speed lace system but I try and get both the upper and lower as tight as possible.


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## Kevin137 (May 5, 2013)

mizab70 said:


> I tighten it down as much as I possibly can. The motos have the speed lace system but I try and get both the upper and lower as tight as possible.


Speed laces are outer, it is the liner you want tight, as that holds your heel in, so tighter liner, less on the outer speed laces is what is being said, as the outer do not stop heel lift...


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

mizab70 said:


> I tighten it down as much as I possibly can. The motos have the speed lace system but I try and get both the upper and lower as tight as possible.


Right. I am not referring to the outer which is tightened by the dual pull speed lace system. I am referring only to the liner which is tightened by a single lace pull and keeper system. Here is what you want to do. You want to put your foot in and stand. You the want to grab the liner's single lace pull with your strong hand. Pull it up slowly and (once tensioned) very hard. Do not jerk the pull, just apply strong upward pressure. While you are maintaining that upward pressure push the keeper as far down as you can with your other hand. Make sure that the keeper lock is fully engaged. Now do that again. Push the keeper down again. You will likely get another 1-2 inches of lace each time you do this. Do it again until the liner is uncomfortably snug. This typically takes 3-5 pull/tighten sequences. Then relax it incrementally.

This all occurs before you ever touch the speed lace system. 

STOKED!


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## SAVETHISNOOB (Feb 29, 2012)

Wiredsport said:


> Right. I am not referring to the outer which is tightened by the dual pull speed lace system. I am referring only to the liner which is tightened by a single lace pull and keeper system. Here is what you want to do. You want to put your foot in and stand. You the want to grab the liner's single lace pull with your strong hand. Pull it up slowly and (once tensioned) very hard. Do not jerk the pull, just apply strong upward pressure. While you are maintaining that upward pressure push the keeper as far down as you can with your other hand. Make sure that the keeper lock is fully engaged. Now do that again. Push the keeper down again. You will likely get another 1-2 inches of lace each time you do this. Do it again until the liner is uncomfortably snug. This typically takes 3-5 pull/tighten sequences. Then relax it incrementally.
> 
> This all occurs before you ever touch the speed lace system.
> 
> STOKED!


Wait, so you do all the tightening and then slacken it off? Lost me at that bit.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

SAVETHISNOOB said:


> Wait, so you do all the tightening and then slacken it off? Lost me at that bit.


Yes, at first this is typically best. You tighten until you have gone too far and then back off just a bit at a time until you you find the balance between very snug and too snug. This is valuable because new riders are typically no where close to snug enough in terms of liner cinching. This helps them find the line and really shows how amazing a boot can feel when the heel is fully engaged in the heel pocket. Even though "too far" will slightly strangle your foot, in terms of support and anti-lift it will also register as awesome. When you go to loosen from there you will not want to lose all of that even though the boot will become more comfortable. This leads to the best balance and top performance.


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## mizab70 (Dec 14, 2014)

Thanks guys for the advice. I didn't realize the liner was the key to heel lift, I do tighten the shit out of that too. Today I wore an extra pair of socks because my feet were cold and found that helped a bunch. I also was given a dr scholls heel insert and that seemed to help a lot as well. I might look into a better insole now since that might be able to make everything tighter too. 

I was told today by a few people that my boots and bindings are just crappy for anything past a beginner and I getting good enough to need something better.... Hopefully with tax return money can upgrade to some real boots.


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

2 socks making a better fit makes me think youre in a half size too big. Also, never wear 2 socks. That just creates more material for the moisture off your foot to move through and is actually more likely to make your foot cold. If regular merino wool snowboard socks arent cutting it, look for compression ones. Stance and Smatwool both have affordable options.

Relistically, you bought a Moto. The liner has very little shape to it the internal lacing doesnt provide that much support. You'd have been better off stretching your budget that $40 or so and getting Rulers. But, you have what you have. Make them rideable, and get fit with a higher quality boot when you can. 

Do get insoles. They likely wont effect heel lift, and in fact will probably make the boot fit bigger, but no matter what boots you buy, get aftermarket footbeds.


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## mizab70 (Dec 14, 2014)

Hmm never knew 2 socks could make colder, good to know. I am pretty sure the boot is the proper fit from a ton of help got on this forum. I just have some narrow ankles.... Do you have a specific sock would suggest for the warmest socks for snowboarding? I have poor circulation so hands and feet are always cold. 

I forgot to mention I also duct taped some crappy j-bars on liner on top of the existing j-bars. This actually helped but they didn't stay on well. I am going to try the weatherstripping suggestion tomorrow and burton is sending me some new j-bars so hopefully they will stick better.

I so wish I could go back and have spent like an extra 100 dollars on boots now... But live and learn next time I know better now.


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