# easy carving board for ice and powder



## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

All of the above will work fine, also look out for a Flow Darwin or Enigma 157 if you can find one.


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## GTDad (Feb 25, 2018)

Hi I got back into boarding after 20 year last year. I picked up a nitro suprateam used 163 in like new i condition with Burton CO2 bindings . It is a great board .

However I got like new used k2 Carveair this year. IT is off the hook. Love love love the board. Great for steep powder, wicked on the groomers, just so much fun. The updated version of carveair from K2 is called simple pleasures. It is from what I have been told from people a quiver killer.













ramjet said:


> Hi guys, would love a specific recommendation please. I get confused with so much info/tech out there
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## ramjet (Sep 14, 2012)

Thanks @GTDad though I've heard the carveair is not so good for powder. Do you have experience of that?


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## taco tuesday (Jul 26, 2014)

Are you going to be riding with the kids? If so you might want something that's more nimble at slow speeds. If not it looks like you have a decent list. Out of the boards you listed I have only ridden the Custom X and Flagship. Both are suitable to ripping around and dealing with ice. The Flagship probably has the edge in powder(haven't ridden a custom x in pow). I'm 6', 200lbs, size 10.5 boot, own the Flagship 162w and love it. Another one to consider is the Never Summer Chairman. I demoed that in both the 164 and 165x(wide) and it really holds an edge on hard and icey east coast conditions despite what some people might claim about the crc camber profile. It has a longer effective edge for its overall length than most boards I have ridden.


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Niche Story, Yes PYL, Burton Skeleton Key, Weston Big Cheif, Rome Mtn Division or Blur, Gnu Zoid, Lib Goldmember, Arbor Guch Camber or next year's A Frame, or next year's Rome Ravine. Really my top pick would be the Ravine, but you gotta wait.


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

So many boards so little time to try em all. From your list I like the flagship, xv and custom x. Find a shop to demo. 


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

Look at the Endeavor Maverick. It’s a good carver and it is nicely put together. Just look at all that effective edge. The board is all edge but still has s good shovel on it. Not many mainstream boards are doing it that way yet. But I believe it’s coming. Certainly the high end Donek and Prior and SG soft boot carve boards have been using a hammerhead -for lack of a better word- type shape for their soft boot carvering boards. That’s the shape used for boardecross boards too. But BX boards are built to go straight down on account of large turning radius and super stiffness. Can’t recommend one for casual vxzdvUninterrupted long edges with true camber will hold an edge and crush it on firm snow and ice. Also check on Fullbag Diamondblade.
I havent touched one but I see it is getting some good reviews by riders who want to go one way only and carve big turns. I held some Korua boards in my hands last week but didn’t feel tempted. Just eyeballing it and bending the boards in the shop, it seemed to me like they were too pow-carve specific for my purposes. They pretty much all seemed too small for me.


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## GTDad (Feb 25, 2018)

ramjet said:


> Thanks @GTDad though I've heard the carveair is not so good for powder. Do you have experience of that?




I set my bindings 1.5 back.
I love hitting powder with it as long as it has enough steepness or speed . 2 feet of snow it will bog down but get it on some steep powder it's like you're surfing )
It is a very playfull super surfy board.


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## pxn13 (Jan 19, 2016)

Is the niche aether a good carving board?


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

Fielding said:


> Look at the Endeavor Maverick. It’s a good carver and it is nicely put together. Just look at all that effective edge. *The board is all edge *but still has s good shovel on it.


It's really not... 1220mm of EE on the 165, my 160 Whiteout has 1240mm. 

I love Endeavor boards and I think both the Maverick and Archetype would be a good fit, but not quite as carving focused as the OP would like.


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## taco tuesday (Jul 26, 2014)

Phedder said:


> Fielding said:
> 
> 
> > Look at the Endeavor Maverick. It’s a good carver and it is nicely put together. Just look at all that effective edge. *The board is all edge *but still has s good shovel on it.
> ...


Yeah, that's not a very significant effective edge at all. I'm not familiar with the Maverick at all, maybe the shape looks like it would have more EE or the ride feels like it does? The 162 Jones Flagship I mentioned is about 1240mm also. The 165x chairman is over 1300mm. I think that 163 Fullbag Diamond Blade is around 1370mm, now that board packs a lot of edge for its total length.


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## Alpine Duke (Jun 21, 2015)

Its an old question on here. You want a pow board and carving board in one. Not really a good mix. You should to pick one of those areas as the primary and one as the secondary and pick based on that. IMHO. meaning "want a carving board that does fine in pow" or visa versa. Others are going to jump on here and flame me for saying this.....but it is give and take in those areas. They just dont make a 10/10 carver that is 10/10 pow. I have been on pow boards that surprised me with their carving ability.....but they still weren't carvers. I think your question is that you are looking for an all mountain.

There is true magic riding a pow board in pow and same with a true carver on a fresh groomer. i think you need to decide which area you can drop some of the magic  If you ride east coast mostly I think that tells you and you would then look for an All Mountain that is carve centric. IMHO


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## taco tuesday (Jul 26, 2014)

Alpine Duke said:


> Its an old question on here. You want a pow board and carving board in one. Not really a good mix. You should to pick one of those areas as the primary and one as the secondary and pick based on that. IMHO. meaning "want a carving board that does fine in pow" or visa versa. Others are going to jump on here and flame me for saying this.....but it is give and take in those areas. They just dont make a 10/10 carver that is 10/10 pow. I have been on pow boards that surprised me with their carving ability.....but they still weren't carvers. I think your question is that you are looking for an all mountain.
> 
> There is true magic riding a pow board in pow and same with a true carver on a fresh groomer. i think you need to decide which area you can drop some of the magic <img src="http://www.snowboardingforum.com/images/smilies/smile.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Smile" class="inlineimg" /> If you ride east coast mostly I think that tells you and you would then look for an All Mountain that is carve centric. IMHO


You are right, there are going to be some compromises. One option is to just get a more freeride oriented board that can handle both pretty well. Flagship, Billy Goat, XV etc. There are plenty of them to choose from.


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## Seppuccu (Dec 4, 2012)

Seeing that you're coming from a burly tapered positive camber board I'm thinking that the Niche board might feel weird for you, being RC and all.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

Alpine Duke said:


> Its an old question on here. You want a pow board and carving board in one. Not really a good mix. You should to pick one of those areas as the primary and one as the secondary and pick based on that. IMHO. meaning "want a carving board that does fine in pow" or visa versa. Others are going to jump on here and flame me for saying this.....but it is give and take in those areas. They just dont make a 10/10 carver that is 10/10 pow. I have been on pow boards that surprised me with their carving ability.....but they still weren't carvers. I think your question is that you are looking for an all mountain.
> 
> There is true magic riding a pow board in pow and same with a true carver on a fresh groomer. i think you need to decide which area you can drop some of the magic  If you ride east coast mostly I think that tells you and you would then look for an All Mountain that is carve centric. IMHO


Not really. Sure no board is 10/10 for everything but carving and powder performance are definitely not mutually exclusive. In fact many features can be beneficial for both - slightly wider, tapered, setback etc
Plenty of examples: Hovercraft, Nitro Squash, Endeavour Arechtype etc both float great and are carving machines

And he clearly is not looking for an all-mountain board which would have some aspects for freestyle/switch/jumps/buttering/etc - none of which he wants


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## david_z (Dec 14, 2009)

pxn13 said:


> Is the niche aether a good carving board?


The Aether grips pretty well but it shouldn't be on your list if you're looking for a pure carving board. It's going to be too soft. Super fun board and pretty capable all around, but it's not a carving deck.


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## mlouca11 (Mar 4, 2017)

Actually have a practically brand new barely used 2016 rossignol one magtek for sale. Check it out. It's been ridden under a handful of times. https://rover.ebay.com/rover/0/0/0?mpre=https://www.ebay.com/ulk/itm/202239671232


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

Consider that for an ideal ice carving board you want skinny, stiff, camber, with long edges, and good lateral stiffness. That part is key. For a pow you’re looking for pretty much the opposite.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

Fielding said:


> Consider that for an ideal ice carving board you want skinny, stiff, camber, with long edges, and good lateral stiffness. That part is key. For a pow you’re looking for pretty much the opposite.


Disagree:
1. Skinny is not a given/necessity for carving at all - it very much depends on the stance/boots set-up. Also skinny can be ok in pow if there is enough nose (in terms of width or length).
2. Stiffness helps for carving but unless you're going serious speeds it doesn't need to be over the top. A surprising number of carving boards are quite mid-flex. Similarly for pow, you don't want too stiff but also not a noodle - mid-flex works just nicely.
3. Yes clearly camber (or camber dominant), long edges, and lateral stiffness for for carving. Those are all fine for pow too.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

Fielding said:


> Consider that for an ideal ice carving board you want skinny, stiff, camber, with long edges, and good lateral stiffness. That part is key. For a pow you’re looking for pretty much the opposite.


Are these your carving and pow set ups?


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## tanscrazydaisy (Mar 11, 2013)

Where's the option for keeping the edges sharp? Unless you're out of metal to sharpen 

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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

So, lots of people get all nerdy and asthmatic when someone mentions carving. 99.99% of people are not talking about hardboot level carving when they say carving. Which means there are a quite a few boards that excel at carving and pow. Cause if you're not talking gate bashing carves, pow float and carving are basically independent of each other when youre talking board shape. Float is pretty much nose volume vs tail volume. So, nail that and literally everything else about a board can be tailored to carve. Most brand's know this now which is why, including 2019, you have just about every brand with a deck that rips carves and floats in the deepness.


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## ramjet (Sep 14, 2012)

*Rome Blur*

Great information all. Thank you much.

A good point is that I'll definitely be carving more than doing powder. But want it to be good at both. And i don't want to work too hard all the time, and on steeper slopes want a smaller turning radius

I'm leaning towards the Rome Blur. Probably the 159 or 162 (i'm 190 lbs and 6'2"). It seems they are east coast based and it's a traditional feeling board that has some tech for powder and is easier to handle than my Salomon Fastback 167.


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## vento95 (Sep 11, 2017)

You sound like my bigger twin. I also ride a Salomon Fastback (a 160 from around 2002), have two kids skiing age and live in New England. I've been snowboarding since the 90's but took time off because of kids/college/life but started going up regularly the last couple of years. I'm starting to look for something modern and a little more playful (e.g. capita mercury, jones twin, arbor coda, etc.) because the Fastback still feels like it excels at what it was designed to do - stiff full camber freeride deck that rips carves. I'm curious what a modern board will fee like. Let us know what you end up getting.


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## Mig Fullbag (Apr 15, 2014)

Nivek said:


> So, lots of people get all nerdy and asthmatic when someone mentions carving. 99.99% of people are not talking about hardboot level carving when they say carving. Which means there are a quite a few boards that excel at carving and pow. Cause if you're not talking gate bashing carves, pow float and carving are basically independent of each other when youre talking board shape. Float is pretty much nose volume vs tail volume. So, nail that and literally everything else about a board can be tailored to carve. Most brand's know this now which is why, including 2019, you have just about every brand with a deck that rips carves and floats in the deepness.


That's simply because pow and "carving" boards share a lot of caracteristics needed to perform at both. They both work a whole lot better with taper, setback, and when they don't fold fore of the front binding. That is why the main brands are now marketing their pow boards for both. Strangely, they did not seem to know this before the pow/carve board craze (rolling eyes)... What is now considered a pow board will be outperformed by a carving board when higher speeds and harder conditions will come into play. Longer effective edge, a bit less sidecut, no wavy edges, and stiffer flex will be highly desirable.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

Amplid Creamer might do your trick.


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

SGboarder said:


> Fielding said:
> 
> 
> > Consider that for an ideal ice carving board you want skinny, stiff, camber, with long edges, and good lateral stiffness. That part is key. For a pow you’re looking for pretty much the opposite.
> ...


So yes, you can really carve a wide board on ice provided it has lateral stiffness. But that’s rare board. And a rare rider. Most wider freestyle boards aren’t built to do it. Most people aren’t either. Wider boards are harder to stand on edge. Why do certain softboot carvers prefer wide boards? (Note: comparing a tailor made Donek Incline or similar to off the rack boards is not fair. They’re not the same thing at all.) It’s to prevent boot out. Boot out is a problem if you want to carve at fairly typical duck angles. Now if you wanna go + + then you can avoid boot out on a narrower board in softboots. Most hard softies I’ve seen are good up to about 30 degrees or so. After that you’re in the danger zone even if the bindings will allow for a higher setting. But I digress. Any extra board width, even if it’s well supported with carbon beams, metal sheets, etc. comes as a cost to the board’s nimbleness. Edge to edge changes take longer on a wide board. This means it’s harder to do quick wiggle turns on your way into a big carve. It also means you have to end your carve perhaps a bit prematurely. 

Another important factor in how a board carves is sidecut radius. For pow wow you really don’t want a tight one. But for carves on narrower trails you kinda do. Pow riding seems a lot more like surfing (actual ocean waves) in that you sink the tail and turn off of the bottom of the board. It’s almost like a pow board in just pow could work with no metal edges at all. 

As for stiffness, it’s not just a 1-10 spec. Boards are stiffer in different places. For good carving you need a board with a stable, sharp nose that you can load up as you initiate the carves turn. Thats not the ideal for pow. Most pow boards I’ve ridden have tended to have bigger fatter noses —but the key thing is that they’re usually soft and lately they’re very often rockered. While it might be possible to carve something like this on hard groom, it would not be my first choice for the mission. That kinda nose can’t take the preload you wanna give it in order to turn the board uphill. Pow riding is all about the float and trying to minimize leg burn. Is it even possible to carve uphill in pow? I’m asking out of pure desire to know. Because I don’t. 

Carving is all about regulating speed by varying turn shape in a manner that minimizes skids. You get speed by pointing down the fall line. Then you load the nose and release that load in combo with decambering and undecambering the board through the turn. (Add in some angulation for good effect.) You ride the sidecut and turn uphill. And then, before coming to a dead stop (or preferably long before that) you initiate the next turn and for a brief, magical moment you are turning off of your downhill edge with your body actually downhill from your downhill edge. That’s normally the recipe for a slam. But the speed you carry through a series of carves allows you to defy gravity. That’s the addictive part. Some boards do this well. Others really don’t. 

Ill say now that I have less experience riding pow boards and more experience riding carving boards. I have about 10 boards right now I think. 4 of them are hardboot only boards. 2 can go both ways. All of those are carving oriented boards. Then there’s a couple of dusty pow boards at the bottom of the pile. Back in the day I had one board and rode it for everything. I hadn’t more access to pow. All I had was a fairly long, stiff, regular camber board. That’s pretty much all there was. When there was pow I moved my stance back some and tweaked my angles a little.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

Fielding said:


> And then, before coming to a dead stop (or preferably long before that) you initiate the next turn and for a brief, magical moment you are turning off of your downhill edge with your body actually downhill from your downhill edge. That’s normally the recipe for a slam. But the speed you carry through a series of carves allows you to defy gravity. That’s the addictive part. Some boards do this well. Others really don’t.


I've never ridden a board I couldn't do that with, and there's a hell of a lot of very pow capable boards out there that will turn uphill and then carve off the downhill edge with the best of them.


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

Phedder said:


> Fielding said:
> 
> 
> > And then, before coming to a dead stop (or preferably long before that) you initiate the next turn and for a brief, magical moment you are turning off of your downhill edge with your body actually downhill from your downhill edge. That’s normally the recipe for a slam. But the speed you carry through a series of carves allows you to defy gravity. That’s the addictive part. Some boards do this well. Others really don’t.
> ...



Really? Powder boards that carve with the best of them? I’ve gotta say nope to that. Carving boards are made to carve. Powder boards are made to powder. 

I have this big, funny board called a Unity Reverse. I recall that it’s a 164. It has many virtues. But it’s a terrible groom carving board. I ride it every now and then just to be reminded what a un-carving board feels like. Ditto for my Never Summer Cobra. I can carve it a little but rocker between the feet feels meh. I still have it because it’s a great board for riding slow when I’m with the kiddies. It’s a good cruiser. It can handle diverse conditions. Both boards are fun. But they comparatively suck at carving hard groom. I could sorta do it with either. But the load the nose and pop up the hill into a zero G carve magic just isn’t but there. Not like it is with say with my full metal Coiler hardboot ride. Or my carve focused full metal Donek softboot board. Or even the Burton Custom (camber) I used to own. If I had to pick one softboot board that I own right now to do both carving groom and riding powder: I’ve got an Osin 3800 that I think of as a pow board that can carve. But with its width and flex profile I’d say it’s less than ideal for carving. It’s a serious compromise. It’s a good board to ride if there’s miles of groom to be cut up on the way to the pow wow.

Ive found that it’s possible to use the handle of a screwdriver to hammer a nail into a 2x4. But I’d rather use a hammer. Beyond that first level choice, depending on the job I’m working on, I may have a strong preference for what kind of hammer I want for the occasion.


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

Phedder said:


> ...very pow capable boards...






Fielding said:


> Really? Powder boards that carve with the best of them? I’ve gotta say nope to that. Carving boards are made to carve. Powder boards are made to powder...


Not the same thing.

I also think that the Korua boys and @Mig Fullbag might have something to say about your ignorant little rant (and Prior, Nidecker and all the other manufacturers producing boards that fill the pow+carve niche).


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

Fielding said:


> Really? Powder boards that carve with the best of them? I’ve gotta say nope to that. Carving boards are made to carve. Powder boards are made to powder.


There are a few unicorns...got one that does a verrry respectable job; carving high speed groomers, doing 14-16" of pnw pow and crushes the chop. Its an old school traditional cambered, with a big shovel nose, significant taper/pintail with healthy setback. And I don't need to shift the bindings...12 yr old Option NorthShore 162 :grin:


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## taco tuesday (Jul 26, 2014)

Snow Hound said:


> Phedder said:
> 
> 
> > ...very pow capable boards...
> ...


I think it's pretty obvious that he is talking about the fact that there are some boards that excel at one aspect or another. For example Migs best carver(diamond blade) is not his best pow board the more pow oriented boards are not full on carve boards. That doesn't mean they can't carve, they certainly can but the one that is designed as a carving board while it can handle powder, as most boards can to some extent is not the best powder board in the line. I have a Fullbag Hammerhead 171. It floats like a dream and it can carve too but it's not a full on carve/race board like fielding is talking about.


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

Snow Hound said:


> Phedder said:
> 
> 
> > ...very pow capable boards...
> ...


Read his post more closely to see what I was responding to. 

When I saw the Korua marketing vids i took note of their focus on carving. It’s a recent trend. Not a big trend, but a trend nonetheless. I pawed four Korua boards in a shop last week. It was the very first time I had seen Korua boards in person. They were out of the plastic wrap so I was able to look at them closely, bend them, twist them, and generally molest them. I forget the model names. One was the batwing looking one, one looked like a tampon, one looked fairly normal, and then there was one that looked like a tombstone. I didn’t see spec sheets so I could only guess as to how the boards were put together. Upon examination I didn’t detect any use of Titanal or carbon fiber. They looked like pretty standard glass boards. The shapes are definitely different than what’s mostly out there right now. That’s cool. I like to see experimenting. But really really carving on a short little glass board? Hmmmm. I dunno. They looked like they were made for soft snow. I like directional boards so I was intrigued but I didn’t buy one. Of course without riding one I can’t say much more. I’d ride one if there was a demo or if a friend had one. Based on the marketing vids i watched it seems that they may have figured out the perfect shapes for doing that new kind of carving where you drag your elbow on the ground while your butt sticks up in the air.

Lots of positive word out there about the Diamondblade. I’d like to try one. Seriously have heard good things about it as a soft boot carve board. I haven’t heard anybody talking about it as a powder board. But that’s not my peer group.

I own a Prior 4wd. Its a very well put together board. It’s ok in powder but not my first choice. It carves very very nicely on imperfect snow. I often travel with it because it’s very versatile. But it’s still not my go to board for carving perfect hard groom.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Fielding said:


> ...it seems that they may have figured out the perfect shapes for doing that new kind of carving where you drag your elbow on the ground while your butt sticks up in the air.


... and that's what 48% of us on this forum mean when we say carving  (50% mean just simple turning). 
This is not a hardboot really really really euro carve audience


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Nivek said:


> 99.99% of people are not talking about hardboot level carving when they say carving


Quoting myself for emphasis. Hardboot style carving is still, and probably always will be, a miniscule borderline novelty niche in snowboarding. Stop acting like that style is what defines the common term of carving. It isn't. Deal with it.


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

Fielding said:


> Read his post more closely to see what I was responding to.


Hands up. I jumped into this thread without reading all the previous posts. I thought that what you are saying id that there aren't any boards that are decent for carving and decent in powder. On review I see that the discussion is way more nuanced than this as well as way above my pay grade.


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

neni said:


> ... and that's what 48% of us on this forum mean when we say carving  (50% mean just simple turning).
> This is not a hardboot really really really euro carve audience


Don't give up so easily on the pursuit of the carve. Or at least don't let others give up so easily on the pursuit of the carve. 

That fully laid out style that many call Euro Carving or EC for short is --best I can tell after prowling a bunch of websites that all appear to have last been updated in 2001-- a minor subset of hardboot riding known among the hardboot community as Extreme Carving or EC for short. Dragging your body across the snow, especially on a fairly mild Blue Square trail, is not the goal of (dare I say) most hardboot carvers. There are many hardboot carving styles. Some are more surfing oriented. Some are more about speed and are more race inspired. For many hardboot carvers the snow body drag is not the goal. It is a thing that can happen when the board angulation necessary to achieve the turn becomes so great that the rider runs out of room to keep his body away from the snow. Keep in mind that hardboots at very forward angles don't permit a lot of side to side movement below the knees. Your knees when you're in hardboots at high angles move your body mass up and down, and maybe fore to aft, but not so much left to right. 

Some really excellent carving in softboots is fully attainable with off the shelf gear. I'm just not too jazzed about the making a goal out of purposefully dragging your body on the ground. While you might need to be carving in order to do that move, that move does not define carving.

Check these dudes on softboots making turns: https://youtu.be/CQ2U7Qu7ykE


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

neni said:


> ... and that's what 48% of us on this forum mean when we say carving  (50% mean just simple turning).
> This is not a hardboot really really really euro carve audience



I dont drag my elbow as @Fielding suggests, i drag my gut and hammer a beer while deep in a carve. No booting out for me. 

Really though, a good pow and carveable board is out there. Lots of them. Look for setback, taper, camber between the feet, longer subtle rockered nose. Your not going to lay lines down on sheet ice but a standard groomer will have pencil drawings for sure.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

Fielding said:


> Don't give up so easily on the pursuit of the carve. Or at least don't let others give up so easily on the pursuit of the carve.
> 
> That fully laid out style that many call Euro Carving or EC for short is --best I can tell after prowling a bunch of websites that all appear to have last been updated in 2001-- a minor subset of hardboot riding known among the hardboot community as Extreme Carving or EC for short. Dragging your body across the snow, especially on a fairly mild Blue Square trail, is not the goal of (dare I say) most hardboot carvers. There are many hardboot carving styles. Some are more surfing oriented. Some are more about speed and are more race inspired. For many hardboot carvers the snow body drag is not the goal. It is a thing that can happen when the board angulation necessary to achieve the turn becomes so great that the rider runs out of room to keep his body away from the snow. Keep in mind that hardboots at very forward angles don't permit a lot of side to side movement below the knees. Your knees when you're in hardboots at high angles move your body mass up and down, and maybe fore to aft, but not so much left to right.
> 
> ...


But EC's look so sweet.:snowboard4::thumbsup:


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

Fielding said:


> Some really excellent carving in softboots is fully attainable with off the shelf gear. I'm just not too jazzed about the making a goal out of purposefully dragging your body on the ground. While you might need to be carving in order to do that move, that move does not define carving.
> 
> 
> 
> Check these dudes on softboots making turns: https://youtu.be/CQ2U7Qu7ykE



Thats a motivating video. Headed up to VT this weekend. Hopefully we get snow not rain. I’ll be laying out carves on my soft boots with my deep carving, powder floating free ride board. 



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

Scalpelman said:


> Thats a motivating video. Headed up to VT this weekend. Hopefully we get snow not rain. I’ll be laying out carves on my soft boots with my deep carving, powder floating free ride board.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Looks like they have got a tiny bit of positive angle going on in the rear bindings. :chin:

Boards look very stiff, not much flex in them. Great carving.:snowboard4:


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## snowman55 (Feb 17, 2012)

Endeavor makes a board specifically for the soft boot carving craze in Asia. The Hammerhead. I think you can only get it in Asia.

It's a stiff camber board with a tons of EE. The 157cm has 132.6cm EE. It has a narrow waist (246). I noticed most people ride it with a forward angles. Probably due to the narrow waist.


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

Easy carving and ice? Is this the definition of an oxymoron? Maybe I'm just old.
Rome Blur is a great board.


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## snowman55 (Feb 17, 2012)

Ride Berzerker and Slash Brainstorm are some other options.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

70'sskater said:


> Easy carving and ice? Is this the definition of an oxymoron? Maybe I'm just old.
> Rome Blur is a great board.


He referred "easy" to the board.m (not to the action of carving on ice.)

I've interpreted it as he's searching an easy board, vs. unforgiving board


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## robotfood99 (Mar 19, 2016)

snowman55 said:


> Endeavor makes a board specifically for the soft boot carving craze in Asia. The Hammerhead. I think you can only get it in Asia.
> 
> 
> 
> It's a stiff camber board with a tons of EE. The 157cm has 132.6cm EE. It has a narrow waist (246). I noticed most people ride it with a forward angles. Probably due to the narrow waist.




Its called the Select Hammer SMU. Not a bad ride as softboot carvers go from a day of demo I had on it. Pales in popularity to the Japanese brands like Gray, Moss, Ogasaka, etc. though.


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

robotfood99 said:


> Its called the Select Hammer SMU. Not a bad ride as softboot carvers go from a day of demo I had on it. Pales in popularity to the Japanese brands like Grey, Moss, Ogasaka, etc. though.


I've seen some of these makers' board but never the specs. I always wondered if they were made for a smaller foot size. If I rode one in my size 10 Burtons would I have to use insane high angles to prevent boot out? In other words, do they make boards wide enough for western market feet to ride at reasonable angles?


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## robotfood99 (Mar 19, 2016)

Fielding said:


> I've seen some of these makers' board but never the specs. I always wondered if they were made for a smaller foot size. If I rode one in my size 10 Burtons would I have to use insane high angles to prevent boot out? In other words, do they make boards wide enough for western market feet to ride at reasonable angles?




I’ve ridden and ride with friends who are on Gray Desperados pretty much 24/7. They make a dizzying variety of them - from wood to titanal Type-R - and also wide models. The regulars are in the 240s range, wides in the 250s range. They do ride some ridiculous angles, and I see a lot of them riding rear-entry bindings and resorting to wacky voodoo boot hacks to avoid boot out. 

Have a look at the spec sheet (2nd image) here. I think these are for the regular woody but Ti and Type-Rs are very similar:

https://global.rakuten.com/en/store/dreamy1117/item/2018-gray-desperado/


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## snowman55 (Feb 17, 2012)

Fielding said:


> I've seen some of these makers' board but never the specs. I always wondered if they were made for a smaller foot size. If I rode one in my size 10 Burtons would I have to use insane high angles to prevent boot out? In other words, do they make boards wide enough for western market feet to ride at reasonable angles?


I noticed most boards marketed as a soft boot carving boards all have thin waist.

Even the Donek Incline, which is marketed as a soft boot carving board, has a waist width of 241 for boards 155cm and bigger. You can get it customized for wider width but I was surprised the standard width was very narrow.

The common theme for a board marketed as soft boot carving board seems to be a stiff, directional camber board with a narrow waist, a little taper, and long EE.


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

snowman55 said:


> Fielding said:
> 
> 
> > I've seen some of these makers' board but never the specs. I always wondered if they were made for a smaller foot size. If I rode one in my size 10 Burtons would I have to use insane high angles to prevent boot out? In other words, do they make boards wide enough for western market feet to ride at reasonable angles?
> ...


I have an Incline with a 25 cm middle. I ride it with +31 front and + 21 rear. Full Ti. It’s a big heavy, damp, but still pretty nimble board. It can’t do the quick wiggle turns but it can still cross under pretty good. It carves through the worst kind of crud snow. In my mind it’s like the snowboard equivalent of a Porsche Cayenne.


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## redlude97 (Jan 9, 2008)

I'm certainly no pro, but I think my eurocarve is decent on my pow stick short/fattish K2 87.
https://www.instagram.com/p/BdGlHS0Bvzi/


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

redlude97 said:


> I'm certainly no pro, but I think my eurocarve is decent on my pow stick short/fattish K2 87.
> https://www.instagram.com/p/BdGlHS0Bvzi/


It looked like getting your body on the ground was the main objective. So you did that first, right as you initiated the turn. And then you jammed a tight, carved turn very quickly as a means of generating force to upright yourself. This could be very handy for getting under ropes or fallen trees in the back country. That snow looks really nice!


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## redlude97 (Jan 9, 2008)

Fielding said:


> It looked like getting your body on the ground was the main objective. So you did that first, right as you initiated the turn. And then you jammed a tight, carved turn very quickly as a means of generating force to upright yourself. This could be very handy for getting under ropes or fallen trees in the back country. That snow looks really nice!


Yea in this case I was specifically trying to get low for a EC and being able to pop by up, higher speed high angulation drawn out carves for me usually just involve a hand drag and/or knee drag similar to the video you posted


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

redlude97 said:


> Fielding said:
> 
> 
> > It looked like getting your body on the ground was the main objective. So you did that first, right as you initiated the turn. And then you jammed a tight, carved turn very quickly as a means of generating force to upright yourself. This could be very handy for getting under ropes or fallen trees in the back country. That snow looks really nice!
> ...


I was taught in hardboots to decamber and angulate the board for the turn and to “let the snow come to you” as opposed to dive to the snow and then make the turn in order to get yourself back to your feet. By extension I see contact with the snow as more of a side effect of carving at high speeds on steep slopes rather than being the goal of carving. I realize that current soft “carving” fashion is to get on the ground if at all possible.


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## redlude97 (Jan 9, 2008)

Fielding said:


> I was taught in hardboots to decamber and angulate the board for the turn and to “let the snow come to you” as opposed to dive to the snow and then make the turn in order to get yourself back to your feet. By extension I see contact with the snow as more of a side effect of carving at high speeds on steep slopes rather than being the goal of carving. I realize that current soft “carving” fashion is to get on the ground if at all possible.


Sure, I'm not trying to mimic a hardbooter or alpine carve. More of the Knapton style where he also initiates with the arm drag


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

Pretty sick video. Only thing is, need tons of space. I NEVER see runs that barren. Laughed at the part when he says it’s getting crowded. Ha. That looked empty me. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

neni said:


> He referred "easy" to the board.m (not to the action of carving on ice.)
> 
> I've interpreted it as he's searching an easy board, vs. unforgiving board


.
neni you're confusing me:smile:
I don't know for me ice and easy don't mix.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Scalpelman said:


> Pretty sick video. Only thing is, need tons of space. I NEVER see runs that barren. Laughed at the part when he says it’s getting crowded. Ha. That looked empty me.


Lol, yeah, been thinking the same. Sooo wide and empty, AND perfectly groomed. I've never seen anything alike. Totally jealous. Where is this?


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## Seppuccu (Dec 4, 2012)

neni said:


> Lol, yeah, been thinking the same. Sooo wide and empty, AND perfectly groomed. I've never seen anything alike. Totally jealous. Where is this?


Looks like Keystone. I think it's more a question of when than where tbh.


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

I went carving on my '13 Fish 160 this morning. Full pow, full carve. Board rules.


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## Brass (Feb 17, 2018)

redlude97 said:


> I'm certainly no pro, but I think my eurocarve is decent on my pow stick short/fattish K2 87.
> https://www.instagram.com/p/BdGlHS0Bvzi/


What you did there is my favourite riding style, I just call it low carving, didn't know it was called eurocarve, I'm on a Rossy Taipan with some extra forward lean to the highbacks


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

Fielding said:


> In my mind it’s like the snowboard equivalent of a Porsche Cayenne.


To be, a snowboard Porsche Cayenne would be a twin alpine board with full rocker for good float when riding switch in powder.


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

Any rocker only board is at best a Hyundai Elantra. My comparison was meant to draw attention to the fact that the board hauls ass with tremendous stability and still has a fair bit of nimble handling intact.


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Fielding said:


> Any rocker only board is at best a Hyundai Elantra. My comparison was meant to draw attention to the fact that the board hauls ass with tremendous stability and still has a fair bit of nimble handling intact.


Well I guess you've never ridden a Venture Odin.


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

Nivek said:


> Fielding said:
> 
> 
> > Any rocker only board is at best a Hyundai Elantra. My comparison was meant to draw attention to the fact that the board hauls ass with tremendous stability and still has a fair bit of nimble handling intact.
> ...


Didn’t they go out of business?


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

For complicated reasons mostly out of their control they took a year off. They are alive and well and ripping Silverton.


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## zc1 (Feb 20, 2017)

Nitro Squash will be available in 163 cm next year, with a 26.0 cm waist. It's an outstanding, full camber do-it-all board. Long nose and short swallowtail for powder; full camber for everything else. I have the 159 cm. It's a phenomenal board.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

redlude97 said:


> I'm certainly no pro, but I think my eurocarve is decent on my pow stick short/fattish K2 87.
> https://www.instagram.com/p/BdGlHS0Bvzi/


Looks a "tiny" bit like Ryan Knapton???:chin:


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## Fielding (Feb 15, 2015)

Phedder said:


> Are these your carving and pow set ups?


As a matter of fact, I have a carving board made by the nice fellow in the picture. Slightly different model though.

I have less of a need for a pow board currently. If I was confronted with a local pow situation (unlikely to be too significant) I’d whip out my OSin 3800. Or maybe my D1+. If I was traveling I’d buy or rent a fishy or something like that.


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## MrDavey2Shoes (Mar 5, 2018)

pxn13 said:


> Is the niche aether a good carving board?


I rode a friends Aether, it was a fun board but too flexy for me. It was a pretty slushy day but I found it to really dig in a deep carve if you threw your weight into it. More of a sharp short carver not a long trench digger.


I'd look at the Gnu Hyper Kyarve, directional shape and magnetraction and a rocker profile so low speeds with the kids would be fun.


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## lottie (Mar 9, 2018)

Hi! I just got the Never Summer Prototype 2 and I love it. I am on the East Coast so was mainly concerned about those conditions, but my family had a couple trips out west planned for next year. I was wold for the NC Prototype 2 to just mount my bindings a little further back for powder, as it is alright in powder, but not a winner. I boarded this weekend two mountains and found everything from 12" of untouched, freshly fallen snow to groomers, to left over ice in the afternoon. No issues with the board. For reference, I'm 5/6, 200lbs ish, and a mens 9.5 boot. I got the 154-- could have gone up one size but overall I'm ecstatic about this board's performance. Couldn't recommend more. 

Also I saw you said you were on the East Coast-- anywhere near a Sun & Ski? They're having a great deal going on right now (as are most places) and I go the board and some Union Force bindings almost 40% off.


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