# Another vote for helmets!



## jegnorge (Feb 15, 2010)

so when he fell he didnt wear a helmet?


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

Ya, happened a while ago but still shitty. I really want a helmet but they are too much money right now.


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## jegnorge (Feb 15, 2010)

ThunderChunky said:


> Ya, happened a while ago but still shitty. I really want a helmet but they are too much money right now.


^ aint a helmet like, $50 or less? surely your brain is worth more than that. lol


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## Sick-Pow (May 5, 2008)

ThunderChunky said:


> Ya, happened a while ago but still shitty. I really want a helmet but they are too much money right now.



What size helmet do you wear?


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

Yeah, this season my girl is not letting me ride without a helmet, so I'm in the market to buy something <$75..


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

The good ones are more than that. I have no clue, I had one but it broke. I only used it in the park, but if I could find a comfortable one I wouldn't mind wearing it all the time. I just need a job and then I'll be able to get one.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

ThunderChunky said:


> The good ones are more than that. I have no clue, I had one but it broke. I only used it in the park, but if I could find a comfortable one I wouldn't mind wearing it all the time. I just need a job and then I'll be able to get one.


dude it sounds to me that you're good at riding since you're hitting the park etc... So I would suggest instead of going 5 times this year, go 4 times but go with an helmet..
Also, if an helmet is certified it's certified to protect you.. you can get a helmet for $40 easy.. check out K2 INDY at backcountry.. I'm looking to get that 

There's no difference besides comfort or warmth on helmets.. all the certified ones will give you decent protection


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## Tech420 (Jul 1, 2011)

druj said:


> dude it sounds to me that you're good at riding since you're hitting the park etc... So I would suggest instead of going 5 times this year, go 4 times but go with an helmet..
> Also, if an helmet is certified it's certified to protect you.. you can get a helmet for $40 easy.. check out K2 INDY at backcountry.. I'm looking to get that
> 
> There's no difference besides comfort or warmth on helmets.. all the certified ones will give you decent protection


Not sure if it is the same for snowboard helmets, but motorcycle helmets offer better protection as the price goes up. The impact material is different, thus helping more than cheap helmets.


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

The average helmet only protects you up to 15 mph and is only good for one hit. If I'm getting one,and I am, I am getting one that is worth it and they're expensive. Because the only time I am going slower than 15 mph is jibbing or skating.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

ThunderChunky said:


> The average helmet only protects you up to 15 mph and is only good for one hit. If I'm getting one,and I am, I am getting one that is worth it and they're expensive. Because the only time I am going slower than 15 mph is jibbing or skating.


I'm sorry but I'm little skeptical about this. I think all these helmets have to adhere to a set of safety standards.


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## ClevelandSB (Dec 4, 2010)

took a pretty hard hit to the head last year on the landing of a 25 foot kicker, got a mild concussion whilst wearing my helmet. I'm guessing it would have been worse if I had not had it on.


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

The manufactures said themselves that helmets are good for only one hit. Just because someone slaps a sticker on something doesn't mean it's safe. In doing this you have to trust the company, I find it hard to believe that a 200 dollar helmet and 50 dollar one are the same safeness. I would like to know the tests they go through and how to tell which is safer and more durable.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

ThunderChunky said:


> The manufactures said themselves that helmets are good for only one hit. Just because someone slaps a sticker on something doesn't mean it's safe. In doing this you have to trust the company, I find it hard to believe that a 200 dollar helmet and 50 dollar one are the same safeness. I would like to know the tests they go through and how to tell which is safer and more durable.


well I would love to find that out too.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

ThunderChunky said:


> The manufactures said themselves that helmets are good for only one hit. Just because someone slaps a sticker on something doesn't mean it's safe. In doing this you have to trust the company, I find it hard to believe that a 200 dollar helmet and 50 dollar one are the same safeness. I would like to know the tests they go through and how to tell which is safer and more durable.


this might help: Ski and Snowboard Helmet Safety Standards and Certifications | All Sport Protection
I'm surprised BERN helmet is not certified... The protec helmets are less expensive then other helmets so I wasn't looking into it but after reading this I'll def look into these helmets.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

druj said:


> this might help: Ski and Snowboard Helmet Safety Standards and Certifications | All Sport Protection
> I'm surprised BERN helmet is not certified... The protec helmets are less expensive then other helmets so I wasn't looking into it but after reading this I'll def look into these helmets.


and these are the testing standards... somebody has to buy it I guess... 
ASTM F1446 - 11a Standard Test Methods for Equipment and Procedures Used in Evaluating the Performance Characteristics of Protective Headgear


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## Tech420 (Jul 1, 2011)

druj said:


> I'm sorry but I'm little skeptical about this. I think all these helmets have to adhere to a set of safety standards.


There is a minimum safety standard that helmets must meet. The higher priced helmets (at least for motorcycles) have better than just the minimum safety standards. Also helmets, as someone above me said, are meant for one major impact.


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

Ya that helps a little, but I wanna know how hard of a hit it can take, what speed, and where on the helmet it can take it. I don't wanna buy a helmet that it isn't going to do anything for me. And I highly doubt that all of the certified helmets are the same safety level.


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## Tech420 (Jul 1, 2011)

ThunderChunky said:


> Ya that helps a little, but I wanna know how hard of a hit it can take, what speed, and where on the helmet it can take it. I don't wanna buy a helmet that it isn't going to do anything for me. And I highly doubt that all of the certified helmets are the same safety level.


I have been trying to say that for 2 posts now :laugh: I can't say for sure about snowboard helmets, but I race motorcycles and know that they vary in safety level (even though they have the same certifications)


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

Tech420 said:


> There is a minimum safety standard that helmets must meet. The higher priced helmets (at least for motorcycles) have better than just the minimum safety standards. Also helmets, as someone above me said, are meant for one major impact.


this might be true but I think it's crazy... I mean most people fall down more than once a day.. This is probably for impacts that you had while going 50mph an hour and falling from 50ft... And what are the signs of being not safe any more.. Have you ever had a helmet cracking after you fall down.. Obviously you wouldn't wear a helmet that's cracked but I personally haven't seen a cracked helmet yet - thank god...
Also, I'm not questioning your knowledge or anything, and these questions are not against your argument.. Just questions for general forum..


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## Tech420 (Jul 1, 2011)

druj said:


> this might be true but I think it's crazy... I mean most people fall down more than once a day.. This is probably for impacts that you had while going 50mph an hour and falling from 50ft... And what are the signs of being not safe any more.. Have you ever had a helmet cracking after you fall down.. Obviously you wouldn't wear a helmet that's cracked but I personally haven't seen a cracked helmet yet - thank god...
> Also, I'm not questioning your knowledge or anything, and these questions are not against your argument.. Just questions for general forum..


It isn't the outside you have to worry about, it is the layers inside that break during a hard impact. These layers are what soften the impact on your head. I have trashed 2 motorcycle helmets and you can hear things moving around inside them.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

Tech420 said:


> I have been trying to say that for 2 posts now :laugh: I can't say for sure about snowboard helmets, but I race motorcycles and know that they vary in safety level (even though they have the same certifications)


for motorcycles I'm sure it would be different.. You can find a helmet for $25 or $1000... you wouldn't want to wear a $25 helmet if you're traveling at 200mph... 
Anyways... I quit.. I don't know... I'll in case just buy a good helmet... $50 more is not worth risking my life..


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

There is a video where KP talks about it, but it's like actual falls not like fall and it scraps against the ground. Like a good whiplash type of solid hit to the helmet. There can be tons of cracks in a helmet you can't see mainly on the inside. 

Here it is:

Why you should wear a helmet with Kevin Pearce - YouTube


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

Tech420 said:


> It isn't the outside you have to worry about, it is the layers inside that break during a hard impact. These layers are what soften the impact on your head. I have trashed 2 motorcycle helmets and you can hear things moving around inside them.


sounds like they were bad accidents.. I hope nothing happened to you..
but I get your point now about the helmets... what's inside matters also.. not just outside.. 

Like I said, I'm bumping my budget from $50 to $100-150.. don't mind spending $$$ for safety


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

^Same here, that's why I am saving up a bit and just taking it easy until then.


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## Tech420 (Jul 1, 2011)

druj said:


> sounds like they were bad accidents.. I hope nothing happened to you..
> but I get your point now about the helmets... what's inside matters also.. not just outside..
> 
> Like I said, I'm bumping my budget from $50 to $100-150.. don't mind spending $$$ for safety


It's part of racing  good choice :thumbsup: don't cheap out when it comes to your head.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

Tech420 said:


> It's part of racing  good choice :thumbsup: don't cheap out when it comes to your head.


soooo Tech420.. since you're knowledgeable about helmets... Could you make a suggestion for me? Also what do you think about the helmets that come with the headphones attached? 
I have $30 skullcandy in-ear headset and I'm pretty happy with them.. i was planning to use them inside the helmet


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## Justin (Jun 2, 2010)

ThunderChunky said:


> The average helmet only protects you up to 15 mph and is only good for one hit. If I'm getting one,and I am, I am getting one that is worth it and they're expensive. Because the only time I am going slower than 15 mph is jibbing or skating.


i thought it was to 25mph?

the reason you still get a concusion with a helmet on is because when you come to a quick stop and your brain doesn't it smashes into your skull and gets a bruise which is what a concusion is.


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

Ya, it's somewhere around there, but I am no where below 40 so it's almost useless except for jibbing. I am more worried about it for hitting trees and jumps. But we should get this back on topic, this is kinda the wrong place especially for getting off topic unless it's about getting more info about helmet safety.


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## Tech420 (Jul 1, 2011)

druj said:


> soooo Tech420.. since you're knowledgeable about helmets... Could you make a suggestion for me? Also what do you think about the helmets that come with the headphones attached?
> I have $30 skullcandy in-ear headset and I'm pretty happy with them.. i was planning to use them inside the helmet


Haha well I am currently in the market for a snowboard helmet also :laugh:. Haven't used one the past few seasons and I am pretty good at hurting myself so I figure it's time. I know bike helmets, not snowboard so I don't want to recommend something I haven't researched. Make sure you try on a helmet at a shop before ordering one offline. Helmet fit is VERY important.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

Tech420 said:


> Haha well I am currently in the market for a snowboard helmet also :laugh:. Haven't used one the past few seasons and I am pretty good at hurting myself so I figure it's time. I know bike helmets, not snowboard so I don't want to recommend something I haven't researched. Make sure you try on a helmet at a shop before ordering one offline. Helmet fit is VERY important.


gotcha.. I'm looking at the Smith Maze helmet right now.. 100 bucks and got many good reviews in a lot of websites.


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## Tech420 (Jul 1, 2011)

druj said:


> gotcha.. I'm looking at the Smith Maze helmet right now.. 100 bucks and got many good reviews in a lot of websites.


:laugh: I was actually trying that helmet on today in the shop. It didn't fit my head too well, but that doesn't mean it won't fit you. Remember to try on before you buy, all helmets fit different.


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## racer357 (Feb 3, 2011)

I too have been involved in the motorcycle industry as a racer and a shop owner for over 30 years.

My theory when it comes to helmets is " if you were going to jump from an airplane would you wear a cheap parachute?"

Your head is one of the slowest healing and most dificult to treat bodyparts, why wouldn't you want the best protection you can afford.

A quality helmet will protect you at any speed. Do you have a higher chance of injury at 40 mph than 25 mph? Yes, Of course, physics dictate that. But to have the mentality that your helmet is not effective above a certain mph is naieve. No matter what speed you are traveling, the helmet is going to absorb and dissepate the energy as evenly as possible around your skull. MEasuring the reduction of energy to your skull is how the certifications are met.

I cant speak for the snow industry but the current snell and atsi certs for M/c helmets requires 50 randomly selected shells to be submitted for testing. If 1 helmet fails to pass,the construction materials are changed and the test is ran again until they all pass. I am sure the testing of snow lids is the same.

For my money, everytime I ride, I will be wearing the best head protection I can find.
After studying and trying on many brands, I will be wearing the POC receptor bug communication this year. the fit and quality was tops for my head shape.

as was stated in a previous post, fit is critical. An improperly fitted helmet can actually CAUSE injury. Keep the fit in mind while you are shopping,


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## Tarzanman (Dec 20, 2008)

Tech420 said:


> Not sure if it is the same for snowboard helmets, but motorcycle helmets offer better protection as the price goes up. The impact material is different, thus helping more than cheap helmets.


Yeah... this statement is pretty much completely wrong. I don't know where you're getting your information but there's been a lot of debate about motorcycle helmets and DOT vs SNELL vs ECE. There were also a couple of tests showing some $100 low end DOT helmets protecting the head better than $300 Snell rated lids.


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## Tech420 (Jul 1, 2011)

Tarzanman said:


> Yeah... this statement is pretty much completely wrong. I don't know where you're getting your information but there's been a lot of debate about motorcycle helmets and DOT vs SNELL vs ECE. There were also a couple of tests showing some $100 low end DOT helmets protecting the head better than $300 Snell rated lids.


Care to argue the guy posting right above you? Surely he knows nothing also. $300 is by no means anywhere near a high end helmet. I consider $300 a cheap motorcycle helmet (if we are talking full face helmets). My head is wrapped in $700 worth of material and I don't even own a real high end helmet.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

racer357 said:


> I too have been involved in the motorcycle industry as a racer and a shop owner for over 30 years.
> 
> My theory when it comes to helmets is " if you were going to jump from an airplane would you wear a cheap parachute?"
> 
> ...



Thank you for all the valuable information you provided. Although I would love to buy the POC helmet, it's little bit too expensive for me. I know protection is important but I won't be (can't) do Travis Rice tricks anyways, not even close 
So I don't think at this point getting a $200 vs $100 helmet would make much difference for me. This is of course my personal opinion..


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## ThunderChunky (Oct 1, 2011)

Ya, the only real threat besides freestyle for advanced riders are trees. The only other times it happens out of the park is just an issue of skill besides trees. Just be careful of trees and look out for out of control people and you should be good.


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## racer357 (Feb 3, 2011)

you do realize it only takes an impact equal to 6.7 mph to certain areas of your head to kill you? 

I was sponsored by Shoei when I raced motocross, and they had a seminar back then at the Indy dealer shoe that showed the helmets during the different cert tests and explained the technology and why a shoei VFX helment breaks in the areas it does during the different impacts. It is all done to move the point of impact evenly over the surface of your head.

the materials used in a board helmet work the same way. They are releived in different areas so the styrene will compact and absorb the energy. That is why they say they are only good for 1 hard hit. The styrene gets crushed and the effectiveness is lost.

with all of that said...

It is a free country, wear a helmet/ don't wear a helmet. The only head that really matters is yours.


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## racer357 (Feb 3, 2011)

fwiw the poc receptor can be found online for under 120.00 without theheadphones


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## jegnorge (Feb 15, 2010)

not wearing helmet is like not wearing condom


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## racer357 (Feb 3, 2011)

100,000 life points if you can use a condom while wearing a helmet


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## CheoSamad (Nov 18, 2011)

Danny is my favorite rider and makes me proud to wear a helmet!


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## Justin (Jun 2, 2010)

hmmmm, interesting reading, i will have to do some more research.


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## herzogone (Oct 19, 2010)

Tech420 said:


> Not sure if it is the same for snowboard helmets, but motorcycle helmets offer better protection as the price goes up. The impact material is different, thus helping more than cheap helmets.


This is demonstrably untrue, as shown by testing detailed in the article "Blowing the Lid Off" in the June 2005 issue of Motorcyclist. In independent testing, safety had no correlation to price. I believe this is also the article Tarzanman was indirectly referencing. Though it has been a while since I read it, I recall it actually took issue with one of Snell's anvil tests necessitating extra stiffness that compromised safety for more common impacts (resulting in some of the DOT-only helmets actually providing better protection for this case). They may have since even addressed this, I haven't followed up on that part. In any case, I think the more important takeaway is that more expensive != more safe. The helmet that did the best in their testing was one of the cheapest, the $79 Z1R ZRP-1. On the other hand, the $700 Schuberth S-1 also did pretty well. Just to be clear, I'm not arguing that more money doesn't buy you anything (you may get lighter weight, better ventilation, adjustability, etc.), just that it is folly to assume that price differences are strictly about better protection.



ThunderChunky said:


> The manufactures said themselves that helmets are good for only one hit. Just because someone slaps a sticker on something doesn't mean it's safe. In doing this you have to trust the company, I find it hard to believe that a 200 dollar helmet and 50 dollar one are the same safeness. I would like to know the tests they go through and how to tell which is safer and more durable.


Price doesn't necessarily have any correlation to safety (see above article). ASTM, CEN, and independent tests are your only real assurance when it comes to safetly performance. Also, as racer357 said, fit is quite important in ensuring safety.


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## Tech420 (Jul 1, 2011)

2005? I was still in high school back then let alone racing. Show me something recent, not a 7 year old study.


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## Bayoh (Dec 17, 2010)

Last year I was riding down the hill on a run in the shadows. We had gotten a light dusting of snow, which was great, but it had concealed a section of icy hardpack on the run I was on. 

Was going into a carve on my toe edge and all of a sudden I feel my board sliding out from under me. I shift my body weight to try and keep balance but my board skids and pops onto my heel edge causing me to fall straight backwards onto the back of my head. I hear the loudest crack I've ever heard my skull make and I just laid there on my back thinking I've really screwed myself this time.

To my surprise, I'm fine. I have a minor headache(minor concussion), but at least I'm not bleeding out my ears and getting that metal taste in my mouth which I most assuredly thought was gonna happen to me.

So ya, this year I'm wearing a helmet. 

And cmon people... a helmet's a helmet. It's designed to displace at least SOME pressure from your skull in a crash no matter it's rating. If you're not gonna buy one till you can get one rated for smashing your skull into a speeding garbage truck, why bother getting one at all? Having some protection is better than none.


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## jyuen (Dec 16, 2007)

I wear a helmet, but I think it's a matter of choice... seems almost darwinian to me. if they don't want to wear helmets, leave them alone :dunno:


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## herzogone (Oct 19, 2010)

Tech420 said:


> 2005? I was still in high school back then let alone racing. Show me something recent, not a 7 year old study.


Are you actually suggesting that in the last 7 years motorcycle helmets and safety standards have changed so completely that there _is_ now a direct correlation between price and safety? Do you have anything to support that argument?


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## roremc (Oct 25, 2009)

Still haven't heard a good reason not to wear one. Why wouldnt you spend $100 bucks on one? We think nothing of spending $200 on a set of bindings. These things could save your life!?!?!!?


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## dreampow (Sep 26, 2011)

Just picked up a smith vantage after trying a few on. Fits me sweet and seems to be a great helmet.
Last years model on sale for 120 where this years is 180. No real difference.

Just had to get one as I am a father now so need to protect my head for more than just myself.

Smith Vantage Helmet 2011


only a few left in white I think.


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## Sick-Pow (May 5, 2008)

Smith Holt here. Cheapish too.


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## john doe (Nov 6, 2009)

I'm stunned by people talking about price on here. I got my Smith Hustle for $60 and you couldn't really ask for any more features or protection. Lots of other certified helmets can be found even lower and offer plenty of protection. No matter what speed you are going a correct fitting helmet is better then none. You almost alway have something on your head while snowboarding so it might as well be something that could save your life. When a name brand beenie is $20 and a Helmet is $40 you really have no arguement for not wearing one. If it's your personal choice that is fine but don't try any of the uncomfortable/expensive shit.

I will say that my next helmet will be brock foam so it can take multiple hits.


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## LuckyRVA (Jan 18, 2011)

Sick-Pow said:


> Smith Holt here. Cheapish too.


Same here. Very comfortable as well. I rarely ever notice I have it on.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

LuckyRVA said:


> Same here. Very comfortable as well. I rarely ever notice I have it on.


I'll be going for a helmet shopping today.. Smith Holt and Maze are the ones I'll be looking at for now.. Any ideas about the differences..


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## LuckyRVA (Jan 18, 2011)

Just looking at the specs quickly on the Smith website they look like nearly the same helmet but the Maze is lighter (11.5 ounces compared the the Holt which is 19 ounces).


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## MeanJoe (Jul 20, 2011)

druj said:


> this might be true but I think it's crazy... I mean most people fall down more than once a day.. This is probably for impacts that you had while going 50mph an hour and falling from 50ft... And what are the signs of being not safe any more.. Have you ever had a helmet cracking after you fall down.. Obviously you wouldn't wear a helmet that's cracked but I personally haven't seen a cracked helmet yet - thank god...
> Also, I'm not questioning your knowledge or anything, and these questions are not against your argument.. Just questions for general forum..


Yes, my own helmet from last year. I split it from the base of the helmet to 2/3rds of the way to the crown of my head. That said, it doesn't have to be a dramatic impact to substantially reduce the helmets protection. If you take a good hit to the head on your helmet you should inspect it and consider replacing it. Nice thing is several companies will actually replace the helmet for free. When I broke mine nearly in half, Gyro replaced it for free.


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## druj (Nov 4, 2011)

So just went out to a local shop and got the Smith Holt for $75. I was going to get the Maze but thought, I can get the Holt and also get a phd smarwool sock for $100, which I did.. Holt fits pretty well.. Tried some other Giro's but wasn't much happy with the fit.


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