# Feeling comfortable at high speed...is it 100% mental?



## njfastlfie (Dec 24, 2013)

been using the Trace app to track my speed and other statistics on the mountain. 

kind of bummed to see i max out at around 35mph, which, in my opinion, is sort of pathetic. 

i try to push it as much as possible but i think its almost completely mental for me. i can think of two reasons for this:

1. the firt time i ever rode, i broke my collar bone falling at 4mph about 10 feet from the lift - so injury is always in the back of my mind

2. i ride east coast hard pack/ice and it is completely unforgiving. 

your thoughts? how can i (do i even need to?) overcome?


----------



## stillz (Jan 5, 2010)

Skill isn't measured in miles per hour.


----------



## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

more important to be in control than ride fast .....


----------



## radiomuse210 (Sep 5, 2014)

stillz said:


> Skill isn't measured in miles per hour.



This. I see plenty of idiots flying down the mountain at breakneck speeds with no sort of style or skill whatsoever. And barely in control. Not that I'm saying you're one of these people.


----------



## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

Everytime I've ever hurt myself ridin it's been while I was either at slow pace or stationary!!!!! :embarrased1:


----------



## Handbanana (Dec 10, 2013)

Are you saying your max speed, or your sustained speed?

I use trace too. I find I tend to go faster when there's better conditions- you know, when you don't have to worry about ice patches. 

But really, who cares how fast you're going as long as you're having fun.


----------



## StAntonRider (Dec 15, 2014)

stillz said:


> Skill isn't measured in miles per hour.


Depends on where you live.


----------



## stillz (Jan 5, 2010)

If you want speed, then ski. Skis are faster.


----------



## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

stillz said:


> If you want speed, then ski. Skis are faster.


He said he wants to go faster, not turn into a wanker!!!!!


----------



## Tuan209 (Dec 26, 2008)

Learn to ride with control and after time you will be much faster. 

Pointing a board straight while flat basing and going as fast as possible isnt really a skill (it may take some cajones =)) and can be dangerous to other people on the hill.


----------



## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

If phone apps are to be belived, than I have the official world speed snowboard record at over 25000 km/h.

I've said it once and I'll say it again. Top speed readings from a phone app are useless. IGNORE THEM!


----------



## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

High speed is part mental, part skill, part conditions, 90% judgement and 10% luck. Last day out was bombing the usual, no body in sight except for the skiers buds who were clearing a path for me...maybe doing 40+ mph...hit a roller that launched me more than anticipated...landed doglegged heelside tail  and almost about bought the farm....idk if it was skill, judgement or luck....but there is no mental processing at that speed...the old brain don't work fast enough.


----------



## vajohn (Jan 12, 2014)

Trace uses gps for speed and it may not be entirely accurate, but I don't think it is all that far off. I am curious myself as to how accurate it is. Thinking maybe I could carry my garmin gps unit and compare. 

World record on skis is 156.8 mph and 125 mph on a snowboard. My speed on Trace is believable when I saw these records. I have been very interested in trace since I started using it at the beginning of this month and use it every time I ride now. 

You will get more confidence to ride fast the more you ride, though it will come more quickly to a few people...but that applies to every other aspect of riding as well, and some people just progress much faster than others. Riding a lot with fast riders also helps. It may not look like we have any style when bombing, but that is not always the case. It does take skill and experience to be able to bomb safely and still rail a turn or land a jump off a roller at high speed. Plus it is a rush for me and my mind is focused on nothing but riding for that very short time bombing down the slope. I only do it when I have a clear path as far as I can see and if someone enters my zone, I check the speed to get around them safely. 

As far as the injuries...that is just part of snowboarding unfortunately and you will get over it eventually. However, injuries when bombing can be fatal, so be careful and don't do it if you can't commit to it 100 %. 

I think it is more fun to try and beat the top skiers on sustained speed at my local resorts on the app than trying to see what my absolute highest top speed is. I have managed to get in the top 5 sustained at a couple resorts where I ride most and I got almost to the top position on average speed as well. Top 5 at those resorts is pretty much all skiers from what I can tell on the app and I really want to beat them for some reason. I typically only try to do it very early in the morning when I can get a clean run with nobody to potentially enter my path. 65-70mph top speed measured on the app seems to be as fast as I am comfortable going on the board I have been riding most lately, but I know have gone faster than that on my stiff camber board. What that is in reality...not sure until I can verify that the trace app is at all accurate on measuring speed. Some skier set the top speed at one of the resorts a couple hours north of where I ride and it is closer to 100 mph, which is pretty incredible and hard to believe at the same time.


----------



## njfastlfie (Dec 24, 2013)

poutanen said:


> If phone apps are to be belived, than I have the official world speed snowboard record at over 25000 km/h.
> 
> I've said it once and I'll say it again. Top speed readings from a phone app are useless. IGNORE THEM!


agreed, but my buddy and i (who is faster than me) was using the same app. i was at 35mph and he at 45mph. 

at any rate, i was uncomfortable trying to keep up with him which prompted this thread.


----------



## sabatoa (Jan 18, 2011)

Where I live, the phone tracker speed is reliable. It's fun to glance once in a while after bombing a run but it doesn't define me as a rider.


----------



## vajohn (Jan 12, 2014)

I am not totally confident in the accuracy of trace, but I am wondering why people believe it is completely inaccurate. It uses the gps sensors built into your phone. I have the latest gen Galaxy phone and tend to believe the gps is actually relatively accurate. Next time I go out, I plan to hold my garmin unit in my hand and point my go pro down at the screen to see if I can get a reading to compare to trace snow.


----------



## BoardWalk (Mar 22, 2011)

stillz said:


> Skill isn't measured in miles per hour.


Exactly, focus more on flowing down the hard shit than about how fast you go.


----------



## cookiedog (Mar 3, 2014)

Im also trying to get used to higher speeds. But ice, and people around me is something that I always keep in mind. I hate idiots flat basing and flying down the slope with very little control. They look like a runaway train that will wipe out anything on it's path. Progress slowly, being in control in safe manner to avoid injury to yourself and others on the slope. That's the right way I think.


----------



## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

My first full season, 2011/12? 18-22mph felt Scary fast to me. Being less than 100% confident in my ability and control? i was plenty familiar with how painful a fall or caught edge was at those speeds on relatively flat(ish) terrain. So, One of my goals then was to crack 30mph and have enough control not feel freaked out. I accomplished that goal by the end of that season. 

Last season, I was comfortably cruising the groomers at an average 30-35 mph or more with little or no fear. Buttering, spinning, riding switch, etc. i cracked the 50mph barrier on several occaisions when crowds and conditions were favorable. On hardpack, this is about the limit of my comfort and ability on my Proto CT. Any slight bobble at that speed and every sphincter in my body puckers and my brain stops focusing on terrain and starts showing me images of what "almost happened" just now. :laugh:

So, while fast definitely involves a certain level of skill and confidence?. I would say there is still a huge mental aspect to keeping it controlled and safe! Recklessly unskilled, ignorantly arrogant and fast is a really bad combination. :facepalm1:

:hairy:


----------



## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

*slow the fuck down tree ornaments, you don't ride as well as you think*

the reason that the gps is not accurate is because you are not travelling flat.

the gps can't take into account foot by foot slope changes as you go from 5 degrees to 30 back to 5.

at the same time you can often get a general idea by taking some averages and ignoring outliers.


----------



## trapper (Jan 15, 2013)

Not to belabor this GPS thing, but if anything wouldn't the GPS then underestimate the true speed, since you are traveling a greater distance on an incline than you would if your path of travel was flat?


----------



## vajohn (Jan 12, 2014)

My garmin generally corresponds pretty well with the speedometer on my truck even driving up and down mountain roads when I have actually bothered to glance at it on the dashboard...so I am wondering how is it much different on a snowboard? 

I know this is getting off topic...skill and confidence to ride "safely" at very high speeds generally only comes with years of experience. There are also factors such as agility...such as when you become airborne off a roller unexpectedly or need to carve at high speed around something or someone that comes in your path. If you are struggling to get over 35mph on the app, stop paying attention to it for a while...you are not ready to go really fast...you will know when the time comes. 30-40mph average speed is actually really fast if you are not just doing a bunch of straightlining, but 35 mph top speed is not. Seems like the app could be a little dangerous for some, causing them to push themselves beyond their abilities and knowledge of when it is a good time to really push it to the limit and when to hold back. 

Like I said before some people just get snowboarding much faster than others. My nephew was hitting 35 mph on Trace his 4th day riding ever. Day 8 or 9, his app is reading top speeds over 50 mph...but he is progressing faster than anyone I have ever seen and is riding in control...he is just a very athletic kid and picks up every sport he tries very quickly.


----------



## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

trapper said:


> Not to belabor this GPS thing, but if anything wouldn't the GPS then underestimate the true speed, since you are traveling a greater distance on an incline than you would if your path of travel was flat?


As I understand it, if the app is not accurately accounting for incline? Since you would be covering a sorter distance than if you were traveling along a flat horizontal plane? Yes, it should result in a slower top speed reading. 

I.E. if the terrain were flat and it takes 30 sec. to travel 1/4 mile? That same 1/4 mile If it were an incline plane, might only be 1/8 mile of horizontal travel. So it took the same 30 sec. to travel half the horizontal distance. 

I haven't checked to see exactly how accurate the vertical readings are on any of my GPS apps. So not sure how well the app is tracking or accounting for that. However, I'm not making any bold claims for accuracy with my speeds in comparrison to anyone else. Its more to track in general terms my own progression in that area. And as has been mentioned, speed alone is no true indicator of actual skill. However for my own purposes, a significant increase in speed, combined with a subjective evaluation of my own level of fear, confidence, feelings of comfort and control? I feel that at least gives me a decent reference point from which to evaluate my own progression. 

It's certainly not the definitive answer in that assesment. Just a place to start.


----------



## cookiedog (Mar 3, 2014)

Difference is negligible 
10% grade causes an increase in distance (therefore speed) of about 0.5%.
20% grade causes a difference of about 2% in speed.


----------



## KansasNoob (Feb 24, 2013)

The speed apps are all pretty innaccurate. My buddies all use those things and are constantly comparing their speeds. I've seen variations of 60 feet in altitude from one to another. 

I just don't give a shit what my top speed is, and I definitely don't need some app to track everywhere I ride during the day. Shit my phone is on airplane mode most of the time to keep it from dying.

If you want to accurately find your top speed, put a Garmin in your pocket and check the max speed at the bottom.


----------



## surfinsnow (Feb 4, 2010)

I have both SnoCru and OnTheSnow apps on my phone. Both seem to jibe. I can't really know if they're accurate, though. I've been clocked at 63mph at Stowe. I was really shocked to find I was clocked at 85 once, until I realized I forgot to turn off the app when I drove home.

The thing is, your "max speed" is kinda bullshit. You hit a steep drop, or go over a bump and you're going to naturally speed up. OnTheSnow at least offers an "average speed," which is more realistic. Sure, you can hit 63 mph make a crazy turn or going over a steep, but that's for like 2 seconds.


----------



## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

snowklinger said:


> the reason that the gps is not accurate is because you are not travelling flat.
> 
> the gps can't take into account foot by foot slope changes as you go from 5 degrees to 30 back to 5.
> 
> at the same time you can often get a general idea by taking some averages and ignoring outliers.


I'm not sure I believe that. The GPS constellation is in a 3 dimensional configuration. The satellite aren't in a single plane. It doesn't know flat or not not. It's just 'simple' trig.

The big question has to do with sampling rate. the faster the rate the more accurate you'll be.

A quick google shows that for example an iphone is 1Hz. Not very good. Some of the more specific sport gps systems seem to be between 15-20hz. WAY better.


----------



## vajohn (Jan 12, 2014)

surfinsnow said:


> I have both SnoCru and OnTheSnow apps on my phone. Both seem to jibe. I can't really know if they're accurate, though. I've been clocked at 63mph at Stowe. I was really shocked to find I was clocked at 85 once, until I realized I forgot to turn off the app when I drove home.
> 
> The thing is, your "max speed" is kinda bullshit. You hit a steep drop, or go over a bump and you're going to naturally speed up. OnTheSnow at least offers and "average speed," which is more realistic. Sure, you can hit 63 mph make a crazy turn or going over a steep, but that's for like 2 seconds.


Trace has top speed, sustained, and average. Sustained and average are the only scores that show up on the leaderboards. I have never had a competitive attitude about riding, and really could care less what other people think about how I ride. I was more interested in tracking vertical and how many runs I was getting in at first, but I ended up in first at one resort recently for sustained speed and now I like looking at the scores and seeing if I can beat the fastest skiers' sustained speeds at the resorts where I ride. You can enter whether you are a skier or a snowboarder and it shows up on the leaderboards, so I just really have this drive now to try and beat the fastest skiers on the app...for my local mountains at least, of course there are incredibly fast skiers at other resorts that I can't even try to compete with.


----------



## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

i will admit to having no technical knowledge and talking out of my ass because I think these apps are stupid and breed a stupid style of riding.

I know a couple people who are into it, they are kinda/fully retarded.

race on.


----------



## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

Keep the board on an edge will make you faster.
Flat basing is not the fastest and very dangerous at high speed.
Learn how to carve.


----------



## ItchEtrigR (Jan 1, 2012)

poutanen said:


> If phone apps are to be belived, than I have the official world speed snowboard record at over 25000 km/h.
> 
> I've said it once and I'll say it again. Top speed readings from a phone app are useless. IGNORE THEM!


qft

Olofsson dropped 3000 vertical feet in 35 seconds averaging 120 kph about 75mph, some of you ripping groomers at 125 mph are on a whole other level.


----------



## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

I actually just used trace for the first time last weekend. After realizing at lunch time I had shut it off in my pocket somehow I got 2 hours out of it. 6 runs, max speed of 24.7mph. Lol. Ya, I'm slow, but also less than an year riding, so whatever.

I actually like it for keeping track of time riding vs rest vs lift and seeing the run by run breakdown on the map of what you did. I could care less about hitting any particular speed, but I think it is a simple way to sort of keep track of your progression.


----------



## vajohn (Jan 12, 2014)

Yeah, it is pretty retarded. I have only used the app for about 3 weeks. I just had this weird urge to set the sustained speed record where I ride and then I will stop using it for a while. It drains the crap out of my battery and I am already starting to get sick of it. I hardly ever straightline on groomers, only first thing in the morning before all the slow people get out there. I knew I would ride pretty fast sometimes and always wondered how fast that really is...the app is cool for that, but I checked it out and now I am satisfied with getting some idea in terms of mph how fast that really is.


----------



## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

speedjason said:


> Keep the board on an edge will make you faster.
> Flat basing is not the fastest and very dangerous at high speed.
> Learn how to carve.


just saying...not necessarily true...it depends on conditions and terrain...and a few moments of flat basing at high speed can be dangerous but with a bit of skill and good judgement has minimal risks.


----------



## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

wrathfuldeity said:


> just saying...not necessarily true...it depends on conditions and terrain...and a few moments of flat basing at high speed can be dangerous but with a bit of skill and good judgement has minimal risks.


Well, it also depends on the board. Camber lock you in at high speeds where rockers can be a bit spinny.


----------



## surfinsnow (Feb 4, 2010)

vajohn said:


> Trace has top speed, sustained, and average. Sustained and average are the only scores that show up on the leaderboards. I have never had a competitive attitude about riding, and really could care less what other people think about how I ride. I was more interested in tracking vertical and how many runs I was getting in at first, but I ended up in first at one resort recently for sustained speed and now I like looking at the scores and seeing if I can beat the fastest skiers' sustained speeds at the resorts where I ride. You can enter whether you are a skier or a snowboarder and it shows up on the leaderboards, so I just really have this drive now to try and beat the fastest skiers on the app...for my local mountains at least, of course there are incredibly fast skiers at other resorts that I can't even try to compete with.



I never do any of the leaderboard crap. I just use the stats for my own enjoyment, not competition. And it gives you something to talk about when you're sitting at the bar at the end of the day.


----------



## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

surfinsnow said:


> I never do any of the leaderboard crap. I just use the stats for my own enjoyment, not competition. And it gives you something to talk about when you're sitting at the bar at the end of the day.


Exactly. If you want to be competitive join a race league where it's all on the up and up. For me top speed is the least important of the stats it keeps.


----------



## jtg (Dec 11, 2012)

Apps are quite accurate but can glitch. Note that they use the built-in accelerometer as well, so variations in terrain actually are accounted for. It's not just a sampling of your GPS position. It's up to the implementation to smooth out the readings from the sensors, and it varies across devices depending on what sensors your phone has. New iphone is way more accurate than iphone 4 for example.

Take them with a grain of salt, especially if something is obviously an outlier (easier to tell if your app has a graph view like Ski Tracks) but in general, they aren't totally out to lunch.

From the company who makes Trace (on their kickstarter for the external sensor they sell):



> ENGINEERING
> 
> Identifying the very complex motions found in action sports like surfing, skating, and others takes a lot of hard work, testing, and complicated math. ActiveReplay has an in house “math team” devoted to making all of our data and measurements accurate. Comprised of two Ph.Ds in Math and Control systems, ActiveReplay algorithms for skiing and snowboarding (AlpineReplay) identified 2.5 million jumps, 5 billion feet of vertical, and 4.6 million runs at thousands of ski resorts around the world. Our team is proven and working around the clock to do for all action sports what we’ve done for skiing and snowboarding. We have athletes already testing, our algorithms are already working, and we are very confident that Trace will work out of the gate for skateboarding, surfing, and of course, skiing and snowboarding.
> 
> ...


So they do have half a clue, it's not just some derp college kid logging a dot move on a gps track and selling an app.


----------



## kaner3sixteen (Feb 15, 2013)

I use trace as well, but I'm not posting anything like the speeds that you guys are. I find it interesting as you can use it at the end of the day to see which parts of the run you are consistently sustaining your speed, and then look at why other parts were slower, giving you areas to work on...

oh and as to the original question, maintaining speed for me is quite a bit of a mental challenge. I'm always paranoid about catching an edge, so i tend to check my pace quite a few times to make sure i'm in control.

is there an SBF trace group?


----------



## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

vajohn said:


> Trace uses gps for speed and it may not be entirely accurate, but I don't think it is all that far off. I am curious myself as to how accurate it is. Thinking maybe I could carry my garmin gps unit and compare.





vajohn said:


> I am not totally confident in the accuracy of trace, but I am wondering why people believe it is completely inaccurate. It uses the gps sensors built into your phone. I have the latest gen Galaxy phone and tend to believe the gps is actually relatively accurate. Next time I go out, I plan to hold my garmin unit in my hand and point my go pro down at the screen to see if I can get a reading to compare to trace snow.





vajohn said:


> My garmin generally corresponds pretty well with the speedometer on my truck even driving up and down mountain roads when I have actually bothered to glance at it on the dashboard...so I am wondering how is it much different on a snowboard?


I have used apps on various phones with various operating systems. For the last 3 years, I've been using a Garmin GPS sports watch specifically designed to do just what we're trying to do. The result? Generally I'd say it's accurate, but I have had days where my "top speed" was over 25000 km/h.

This is why I say do not look at a phone app and try to do a higher top speed.



surfinsnow said:


> I never do any of the leaderboard crap. I just use the stats for my own enjoyment, not competition. And it gives you something to talk about when you're sitting at the bar at the end of the day.


I love to GPS track my riding, for just this very reason. At the end of the day I look at total distance and vertical drop and compare it to other days I go out. Sometimes at lunch I'll look at my watch and see that I've only done "X" distance and push myself to ride longer and harder in the afternoon to keep up with my workout.

It's supposed to be fun, and the minute I start worrying about my top speed, will be the minute I stop having fun.

If we are to believe the GPS, then last April 19th during one of my patrol days, I did 26,946 km/h. :jumping1: I win!


----------



## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

We're all moving 108,000 km/hr right now. Everything else is just rounding error.


----------



## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

f00bar said:


> We're all moving 108,000 km/hr right now. Everything else is just rounding error.


Or is the rest of the observable universe moving 108,000 km/h around us? :hairy:


----------



## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

poutanen said:


> Or is the rest of the observable universe moving 108,000 km/h around us? :hairy:


No, actually just me :dance:


----------



## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

vajohn said:


> My garmin generally corresponds pretty well with the speedometer on my truck even driving up and down mountain roads when I have actually bothered to glance at it on the dashboard...so I am wondering how is it much different on a snowboard?
> 
> I know this is getting off topic...skill and confidence to ride "safely" at very high speeds generally only comes with years of experience. There are also factors such as agility...such as when you become airborne off a roller unexpectedly or need to carve at high speed around something or someone that comes in your path. If you are struggling to get over 35mph on the app, stop paying attention to it for a while...you are not ready to go really fast...you will know when the time comes. 30-40mph average speed is actually really fast if you are not just doing a bunch of straightlining, but 35 mph top speed is not. Seems like the app could be a little dangerous for some, causing them to push themselves beyond their abilities and knowledge of when it is a good time to really push it to the limit and when to hold back.
> 
> Like I said before some people just get snowboarding much faster than others. My nephew was hitting 35 mph on Trace his 4th day riding ever. Day 8 or 9, his app is reading top speeds over 50 mph...but he is progressing faster than anyone I have ever seen and is riding in control...he is just a very athletic kid and picks up every sport he tries very quickly.


pretty much totally agree with this. Also, I worry about the Strava type effect coming into snowboarding where people know what other's speeds are and are trying to compete. Seems like an accident waiting to happen. My Garmin also matches my vehicle odometer spot on. I think the ground motion is supposed to be taken into account when speed is calculated because the GPS also measures your altitude (Z axis), not just your X & Y coordinates (although the error is larger for the Z value). 










My brother-in-law sky dives with a similar GPS and they even have a skydive mode on it. the vast majority of the distance travelled, especially before pulling the chute is on the Z-axis and they use GPS to know their altitude (it interfaces with a barometer as well).


----------



## kaner3sixteen (Feb 15, 2013)

> If we are to believe the GPS, then last April 19th during one of my patrol days, I did 26,946 km/h. :jumping1: I win!


well, if Doc Brown is to be believed, at 88mph, you'll see some serious shit, so I can't imagine what it was like at 25000 kph+ :notworthy:


----------



## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

stillz said:


> If you want speed, then ski. Skis are faster.


Depends on who is connected to the planks. Be it one, be it two.



njfastlfie said:


> your thoughts? how can i (do i even need to?) overcome?


On a sidenote... Ain't it funny how these threads always lead to an app accuracy polemic :blahblah:

Anyway. Considering your question if you _need_ to go fast: only you know. Do you think you should go faster? Do you have an urgent reason for it?

I had to learn to overcome my reluctance abt going faster than my comfort zome (step by step) due to the topography of our resort (many flats to cover, long flat outruns, either bomb or walk) and the ppl I was riding with (all way more experienced). 
It's a continuous thing... the more you ride, the more your muscle memory and experience increases,the more confident you get. Push your limits from time to time when the conditions are good (hardpack n good sight are good; to bomb soft rutted snow will be way more demanding in terms of balance and fine adjustments), so you get used to the slightly increased speed. If you feel that you can cope with it, feel balanced and in control, your confidence will increase automatically, and the next time, it won't be such a psych thing anymore cos you already _know_ you can do it (and then you push yourself another tad further; rinse repeate). 
It took some years, but meanwhile I cover almost all flats at ours - and I'm not very brave by nature. Positive experience getting a tiny tad out of your comfirt zone, the trust in your skills and lot of repetition can compensate for a rabbit heart .

All this under the presumption that you _can_ (skill-wise) ride at higher speeds (balance, mini-adjustments) and it's "only" a mental thing! If you don't feel confident cos you lack the riding skills, DO NOT go faster than you feel comfortable.


----------



## stillz (Jan 5, 2010)

neni said:


> Depends on who is connected to the planks. Be it one, be it two.


True, to a certain extent. But as a good snowboarder and a quite mediocre skier, I can easily go faster in open terrain on skis than I do on my board. I also ride a lot faster when I'm with a group of skiers vs. riding with other snowboarders. Just think of how much more effective edge you are working with. Skis are typically longer, and you have two of them, and the sidecut is usually a much larger radius. Skis were invented for snowy mountains. They have home field advantage. Not hating, just saying. Board riding was invented in the ocean, and a snowboard is how we adapted surfing for the mountain. Two plankers have yet to make skiing work on ocean waves (at least without external propulsion), but I digress. I like to surf the mountain.

To the OP, here's my full answer: Don't worry about going fast if you're not comfortable. As others have said, ride with good style, even though there aren't any apps for quantifying and recording style. It's not a video game. It's life. It's art. Going slow can be way fun -- certainly a whole lot better than sitting in the lift or waiting for the rest of your group because you couldn't think of anything more creative to do than point it. I've been there. That said, don't always be the slowest in your group, either. No one wants to ride with that guy. I usually like to ride near, but not at, the back of the group. When you're ready to go faster, it will just start happening naturally.

Also, it's not quite 100% mental. If you're riding an undersized noodle with full rocker, your gear isn't doing you any favors as far as speed goes (though it's still possible to go fast on such boards). A stiffer board with longer effective edge length will inspire more confidence at speed (Rome Anthem, Burton Custom X, NS Chairman, etc.


----------



## SkullAndXbones (Feb 24, 2014)

a lot of it is mental but not all of it. 1) you need to have decent skills to handle yourself when you need to dodge people at the last minute. and 2) the right board will help. you want a board that'll be stable at high speeds. the rest of it is mental. if you are comfortable with your skill set then you kinda just have to go for it and commit to it. the first time you do it you're probably gonna feel like you're gonna die but then when you get down to the bottom you'll A) be relieved that you didn't die lol and B) realize it was kinda fun. and as you do it more you won't be as nervous or apprehensive about it and you'll really start to enjoy it more. the rush you get is fantastic.


----------



## SkullAndXbones (Feb 24, 2014)

oh and another thing is you really need to trust yourself and your abilities. that's pretty important when trying to overcome the fear of going too fast.


----------



## Soul06 (Dec 18, 2010)

When I first started I was pressed about how fast I was going too. My first year the top I every recorded myself doing was only around 28mph. Since then, while I know I can and do ride faster, I haven't recorded myself. And funny enough I have both Trace and Ski Tracks on my phone. But I try to avoid the battery draining. So long as everyone isn't passing by me then I'm going fast enough lol


As far as accuracy....if everyone is that pressed for it you could always have a friend hold a hand held radar like our refs do in paintball









If it can accurately track a paintball then I'm sure it can pick you up lol


----------



## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

SkullAndXbones said:


> a lot of it is mental but not all of it. 1) you need to have decent skills to handle yourself when you need to dodge people at the last minute. and 2) *the right board will help*. you want a board that'll be stable at high speeds. the rest of it is mental. if you are comfortable with your skill set then you kinda just have to go for it and commit to it. the first time you do it you're probably gonna feel like you're gonna die but then when you get down to the bottom you'll* A) be relieved that you didn't die lol and B) realize it was kinda fun.* and as you do it more you won't be as nervous or apprehensive about it and you'll really start to enjoy it more. the rush you get is fantastic.


+3
My top speed (= how close I reach the aprés bar at the end of the runout) depends a lot on the board I chose. From having to walk quite a bit with squirrelly little rocker (146 Savvy) to not at all with the stiff big RCR (158 Flagship). Going quite quick is fun with the plank. But has it's limits as well. 

I did commit to bomb from higher up than usual once on that runout, grit my teeth and withstood the urge to reduce speed by wind brake and stayed crouched all the way down... yea... there was this "shit, I gonna die" moment, no, I didn't, yea, the rush was there, but I won’t do anymore. I've reached my challenge comfort zone limits  More is plain n simple too much for me, from a rational point of view.


----------



## kalev (Dec 17, 2013)

My new 161 Flagship definitely gives me some added confidence to go faster

Beer helps too


----------



## Ballistic_BW (Jan 12, 2015)

speedjason said:


> Keep the board on an edge will make you faster.
> Flat basing is not the fastest and very dangerous at high speed.
> Learn how to carve.


^ this...and for those complaining about ice...you will be faster on ice. The back bowl on my local mountain is in the shade most the day so it stays cold and icy...i have never tried GPS but i used to run top of lift to bottom in ~45 seconds. Took about 3 pylons to stop will the brakes full on. Fun times :hairy:


----------



## Extazy (Feb 27, 2014)

I like speed, but I kinda have this feeling that I might hurt myself so I am slow, this is my 2nd season so I am still learning.

I am always amazed by my friends who just bomb it. They just pick steepest terrain they can find and just straight down. When I am with them I try to keep up and tend to go much faster (45 miles while if I am alone my best is 35) but my god I think if I will catch an edge in that moment I think I wont wake up lol. Ps. They still go faster than I am and wait for me.

And they started same time I did, so I think it's mental 

I wish I had insurance and resources that will support me if I get hurt. I have tough body and not afraid to get hurt, it's inability to make money that scares me


----------



## radiomuse210 (Sep 5, 2014)

neni said:


> I did commit to bomb from higher up than usual once on that runout, grit my teeth and withstood the urge to reduce speed by wind brake and stayed crouched all the way down... yea... there was this "shit, I gonna die" moment, no, I didn't, yea, the rush was there, but I won’t do anymore. I've reached my challenge comfort zone limits  More is plain n simple too much for me, from a rational point of view.


While I'm only in my fourth year riding, I definitely don't see myself as a bomber either. I like to pick up some speed and carve it out...but as far as bombing straight down - that's just not fun for me. I enjoy the turns and making things interesting...even if that means I'm not going 50mph straight down the mountain. On crowded days, it's pretty much impossible anyway. Way too many people making turns I'm not expecting or simply oblivious to anyone else on the mountain.


----------



## Ballistic_BW (Jan 12, 2015)

My worst injuries snowboarding have all been going <10mph. If you crash at speed, much of the force is moving forward, instead of down with gravity. So you actually don't hit as hard and just kinda skip =)

One of my most memorable crashes was at Schweitzer. They have run called Stiles and is a super steep black diamond that they groom with a winch cat. 

Anyways...being young and dumb (dumber) i bombed the entire thing...at the bottom there is a bit of a gully and then the run goes up a incline about 75 yards before topping out and merging with the main run down to the quad. I bent my knees a bit too much in anticipation of the gully and butt checked, end up sliding UP the incline on my ass over 75 yards and back down the other side before i came to a stop. 

Didn't hurt at all =p


----------



## udjalden (Jan 29, 2015)

Great question. This has been on my mind also. Flat basing I feel luke random bumps that are hard to see will kick my board off line. Carving on my edges, there's not much that can go wrong.

But, I personally like the experience of flat basing down the hill. So, I too would like to get better at flat basing. I'm going to work on this tomorrow and see if there are any tricks.


----------



## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

I would bet that you are not "carving", most people don't/cant on average. If you cant flatbase, you likely def cant carve...... Carving is a pretty penpoint line with a HARD edge in the snow, not sliding at all. In general most that think they are carving are doing skidded turns.

I used to think I was carving, I wasn't..... I learned to flat base before I learned to carve and most are the same. 

I do agree that in a hard carve you can stay more stable at high speed and can go faster in most groomer type conditions or chop meaning you can usually go faster. I will carve/ride at steep edge angles on choppy 3-6" pow days when the groom is chopped up with soft crud, turns it smooth. I will do it on freshly groomed runs. This is like 70% of our conditions here....

Flatbasing can be faster in some conditions too, I will flatbase in conditions that are on the verge of slush in spring or warm days(when it is slush you need a base texture), when I am going to fast in choppy icey conditions(not talking moguls here) as long as I can see the run out. I am way faster on a flat base in these conditions but it is super squirrely on a CRC board which is what I have been riding for a couple years primarily..... 

It takes getting over the mental block to point your board down a steep run and go fast, I cant do it with my camera gear on my back. My wife still can not straight line black runs and barely will do it on blues, she also does not carve well at all. 

While I will agree that you can probably get more MPH coming out of a carved turn than flat basing, you can get to the bottom of the mountain faster on a flat base than you can carving.....

In any case, when you are going fast, be ready and make sure you are loose in the knees and squatted while charging with your weight forward(unless your in powder over 3" deep....)


----------



## udjalden (Jan 29, 2015)

You're an idiot. Go ride around with a camera and your wife. Come up to Leadville and well see who can carve the board.


----------



## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

lol, will do, I will be at baby hill ski cooper on sat and sunday for some races. With my son though.....

By camera gear I mean professional quality gear that weighs an extra 30 lbs.....


----------



## Bertieman (Jan 19, 2014)

Argo said:


> I would bet that you are not "carving", most people don't/cant on average. If you cant flatbase, you likely def cant carve...... Carving is a pretty penpoint line with a HARD edge in the snow, not sliding at all. In general most that think they are carving are doing skidded turns.


I was talking to an older instructor and he was telling me how about 90% of ppl out there don't carve right. Yeah they have fun and all but now I see that too. It's like a mistress I can't always tame but I know when I'm railing a nice line. I try to tell my friends their form is shit but no one cares lol


----------



## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

Bertieman said:


> I was talking to an older instructor and he was telling me how about 90% of ppl out there don't carve right. Yeah they have fun and all but now I see that too. It's like a mistress I can't always tame but I know when I'm railing a nice line. I try to tell my friends their form is shit but no one cares lol


YEah, that is pretty typical as you can see from some posts here and from trying. some people can carve a turn or two then they skid out. Holding carves for multiple turns while going super fast is not easy and most people cant do it. Snow has to be perfect for me to hold a hard carved turn from skidding out because I am quite large and don't really feel like riding a 190cm board.


----------



## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

udjalden said:


> You're an idiot. Go ride around with a camera and your wife. Come up to Leadville and well see who can carve the board.


showdown at Ski Cooper ??!!??


----------



## udjalden (Jan 29, 2015)

A whole 30 pounds?


----------



## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

And $6k. I'm sure being that you live in Leadville(or are there for vacation or a season which is worse) you think "professional camera gear" means gopro..... 

Feel free to.come by the sbx course and challenge me to a carve off, I'll know immediately what you mean. Black pants, blue jacket, black smith helmet. Probably the fattest guy there.  

I have nothing to lose here so I'm down! you just gotta show me how hard you can carve. I am pretty heavy though so I will probably beat you to the bottom(flatbased)! Can we change your screen name to "Mr Carver"?


----------



## udjalden (Jan 29, 2015)

No fatties


----------



## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

Lol. This isn't a date for a hookup man.... you were just gonna show haw great you are at carving. I guess to prove something that no one cares about... :jumping1:


----------



## udjalden (Jan 29, 2015)

You seem to care.


----------



## Rogue (Nov 29, 2014)

kaner3sixteen said:


> is there an SBF trace group?


I like this idea  I'm kind of a Trace geek, I've been using it the last 3 seasons. I've also got the Trace device that goes on my board, pretty fun. The ap with and without the trace device is fairly accurate, but it still has bugs and glitches. It's a growing technology and therefore not perfect. 

Are other riders here interested in joining a SBF trace group if I set one up?


----------



## vajohn (Jan 12, 2014)

Rogue said:


> I like this idea
> Are other riders here interested in joining a SBF trace group if I set one up?


Sure, set it up. I turned into a bit of Trace geek this last month, but I'm not sure how long I will remain interested...these last weeks I have actually been charging up my phone just to use the app and getting sick of the battery drain, can always carry one of my backup battery chargers though. 

Does the Trace device improve accuracy drastically? The air time stats are a joke when using the phone, wonder if that device is able to accurately measure these type of stats. I have been running the app days when I was going off large kickers and it barely registered any airtime, but more airtime days when I am just doing ollies and 180s here and there off bumps and rollers.

-I am still interested in trying to verify accuracy as far as speed goes. I just realized I do currently have one of those of fancy gps watches because I was supposed to try and fix the cracked screen...going to try it this weekend, but I guess I will just need to keep it in a small dry bag. Seems like general consensus is that the app is relatively accurate when it comes to measuring speed.


----------



## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

udjalden said:


> You seem to care.


…and you seem to be a complete chicken shit, all talk, no balls, douche!!!! The Man's given you the opportunity to *put up or shut up!* You don't seem to care to do _either!_

He didn't insult or threaten you! (..although you were very rude and insulting towards him!) He simply said "come on over and lets see what you got!" 

If you don't take him up on his offer,..? You will forever prove, You are nothing more than a *Pussified, Obnoxious, Loudmouthed, Trolling Asshat!!* And you will *never* have any respect in the eyes of this forum! :finger1:

Kick his _*ASS*_ Argo!!! (_…metaphorically of course!_) :jumping1:
:hairy:


----------



## vajohn (Jan 12, 2014)

As far as all this carving, or not really carving crap goes. When I am really bombing, there is a little bit of everything going on. Ollie off bumps or rollers to get up to speed, then get really low flatbasing, alternating with more upright body position and board on edge a little bit, a few speed checks/skidded turns, and occasionally rail a big carve high speed. I get a rush launching off kickers and get a similar rush from bombing. I don't bomb all the time, but I really do enjoy it when the time is right.

I can carve pretty well on my custom x and enjoy really laying out huge carves on some nice corduroy. Other boards I ride are not as stiff and really don't have the pop for carving nice big turns...and can indeed be a little sketchy trying to do it over 60 mph on softer boards. My riding style changes a little bit depending on what board I am riding...I am generally more of a skate style rider and always have been. I have no desire to do that euro carve hardboot alpine board style riding...to me it looks stupid, but if you enjoy it, more power to you...I could care less and have no interest in seeing just how deep my board can dig a trench...to quote something I read some other guy post on here recently "I just turn away". If that is the only type of carving that is 'really' carving, then you can keep it. I am eternally grateful to riders like Noah Salasnek...who helped rescue our sport from people like that and all those people who felt the need to look like they were constantly on some imaginary slalom course, flailing their arms all around...I don't think I ever would have really got into snowboarding if it continued down the path it was going in the late 80's, and lingering into the early 90s.


----------



## Rogue (Nov 29, 2014)

vajohn said:


> Sure, set it up. I turned into a bit of Trace geek this last month, but I'm not sure how long I will remain interested...these last weeks I have actually been charging up my phone just to use the app and getting sick of the battery drain, can always carry one of my backup battery chargers though.
> 
> Does the Trace device improve accuracy drastically? The air time stats are a joke when using the phone, wonder if that device is able to accurately measure these type of stats. I have been running the app days when I was going off large kickers and it barely registered any airtime, but more airtime days when I am just doing ollies and 180s here and there off bumps and rollers.


It definitely varies by phone, at least in my experience. Even between Apple/Android. Plus your phone moves around in your pocket more than it can fixed to your board like trace is. Have you watched any of their youtube videos linked with the GoPro? You can see the jump height, distance, air time and it coordinates pretty well. I'm kind of a natzi when it comes to my data lol David has heard from me multiple times. He's got pro riders using Trace (device) too, so you know they're inovating and pushing forward with this technology. 

I backed them with the kickstarter project and I'm now on my 3rd trace, they improve everytime. That's the other thing, I like not having it drain my phone battery. 

Alrighty, starting the TS group then....with the super orginal group name of SBF...:dry:


----------



## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

I think I am going to try one of the gps programs on Monday or Tuesday. Curious about how close they are.... Or aren't.


----------



## BoardWalk (Mar 22, 2011)

Ballistic_BW said:


> My worst injuries snowboarding have all been going <10mph. If you crash at speed, much of the force is moving forward, instead of down with gravity. So you actually don't hit as hard and just kinda skip =)


Yep, you skip into other riders, trees, poles, rocks......


----------



## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

I don't generally ride with a GPS (almost never) but used to for a while several years ago out of curiosity. Once I got a sense of how a certain speed feels compared to the MPH I am actually traveling at, I didn't use it anymore (don't like the experience being detracted by too much info or too many gadgets).

I am using a GPS now specifically for a board test I am doing for 2 of next years' snowboards since high speed stability is the focus of the test. I think the numbers are a good measurement, but definitely not the only measurement of high speed riding. There are so many variables involved that come together to complete the experience... snow, weather visibility, crowding, terrain, board type, stance, etc... 

I echo the earlier sentiments to not worry about top speed and just concentrate on staying safe and in control and to keep having fun without putting too much pressure on yourself and without feeling the need to compete with other riders.


----------



## vajohn (Jan 12, 2014)

Sure, slow speed wrecks can be really dangerous. However, you need to consider peoples' opinion of 'high speed' varies...imo, once you get over 55 mph on groomers, falling is generally not an option. Slow speed wrecks, you are more likely to have a sprain, a broken wrist, maybe dislocate something...you wreck at high speed--medevac or death become very real possibilities. And I don't pay attention to the gadgets until I am done riding. Like I said before, the path ahead of me needs to be almost entirely clear as far as I can see to attempt bombing at very high speeds...if something were to happen, I need to be sure I am only going to injure myself. I will ride a trail a few times to pick my line first, and I agree that there are a lot of factors when trying to push your run to the limit...such as flat light, ice patches, rollers...etc. If you can't rip groomers a full day or multiple days without your butt ever touching the snow, better just focus on your technique and staying in control more than speed. Sure, compete with your friends on the app if they have similar riding abilities, but I definitely would discourage most people from trying to reach or compete with the top speeds on those apps for most resorts...the people setting the top speeds at individual resorts are typically pushing way beyond what would be considered 'safe' for the majority of riders...well for anybody really.


----------



## rafavilardo (Feb 21, 2014)

Rogue said:


> It definitely varies by phone, at least in my experience. Even between Apple/Android. Plus your phone moves around in your pocket more than it can fixed to your board like trace is. Have you watched any of their youtube videos linked with the GoPro? You can see the jump height, distance, air time and it coordinates pretty well. I'm kind of a natzi when it comes to my data lol David has heard from me multiple times. He's got pro riders using Trace (device) too, so you know they're inovating and pushing forward with this technology.
> 
> I backed them with the kickstarter project and I'm now on my 3rd trace, they improve everytime. That's the other thing, I like not having it drain my phone battery.
> 
> Alrighty, starting the TS group then....with the super orginal group name of SBF...:dry:


Yeah.......+1


----------



## Big Foot (Jan 15, 2013)

I had my most significant snowboarding injury to date while not moving, but I've also never fallen full speed. The few times I've been bombing and lost it I've been able to scrub off a significant amount of speed before going down thankfully. At 225lbs on a 171 board I'm yet to find anyone who can keep up when I'm going all out. I've never used the app, because frankly I'm afraid to know how fast I can get going.

That said, staying in control is more important than speed, and you should never be bombing runs that have other people on them or on sections that have merge points.


----------



## vajohn (Jan 12, 2014)

I am also around 225 lbs lately and have a couple 168 length boards, but I know some lighter guys on short boards who can ride extremely fast as well. Have also taken a few spills when bombing but same thing...was able to reduce speed a lot before going down. The highest speeds I have set on the app since I started using it very recently were actually on my shortest board (164w) and I am pretty sure I was pushing it as fast as I could for the slopes/conditions I was riding...getting chatter and having flat rocker board feeling a little squirrely at over 65 mph is not a very nice feeling. I am also a little scared to see just how fast my 168 custom x will go, but I am almost positive I have hit around 75mph on it before based on the numbers I have seen from the app, which is not even all that fast if you look at some of the incredible speeds people have set on Trace...I think the top overall sustained speed on there is around 85 mph and the guy is actually a snowboarder.


----------



## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

vajohn said:


> I am also around 225 lbs lately and have a couple 168 length boards, but I know some lighter guys on short boards who can ride extremely fast as well. Have also taken a few spills when bombing but same thing...was able to reduce speed a lot before going down. The highest speeds I have set on the app since I started using it very recently were actually on my shortest board (164w) and I am pretty sure I was pushing it as fast as I could for the slopes/conditions I was riding...getting chatter and having flat rocker board feeling a little squirrely at over 65 mph is not a very nice feeling. I am also a little scared to see just how fast my 168 custom x will go, but I am almost positive I have hit around 75mph on it before based on the numbers I have seen from the app, which is not even all that fast if you look at some of the incredible speeds people have set on Trace...I think the top overall sustained speed on there is around 85 mph and the guy is actually a snowboarder.


that sounds scary as %$#@! 

If you are ever at Copper, send me a message a few days before, would be fun to ride


----------



## vajohn (Jan 12, 2014)

deagol said:


> that sounds scary as %$#@!
> 
> If you are ever at Copper, send me a message a few days before, would be fun to ride


 Yeah man, definitely...just got back from Breck and Vail a couple weeks ago. Would love to ride Copper, hoping to get back out to CO a couple more times this year...but on the epic pass and funds are going to be really tight, so $140 lift tickets to ride Copper will probably be over my budget. I don't think I ever got much over 55 mph on the app when I was out west last time...conditions were not the greatest for doing a lot of bombing and it was really crowded/college week or something. Topping out over 65 mph here on our little ice hills back home and trying to dig for more, but snow was a little slow and forgot to wax the board those times actually, getting closer to setting my local resort's top speed on my little Raygun...have not even bothered riding the custom x since I got back, should be able to match the top speed of just over 70 on that board at some point soon, but I'm sure somebody will try to beat me and that is where the game starts getting dangerous.


----------



## the grouch (Feb 18, 2014)

deagol said:


> pretty much totally agree with this. Also, I worry about the Strava type effect coming into snowboarding where people know what other's speeds are and are trying to compete. Seems like an accident waiting to happen. My Garmin also matches my vehicle odometer spot on. I think the ground motion is supposed to be taken into account when speed is calculated because the GPS also measures your altitude (Z axis), not just your X & Y coordinates (although the error is larger for the Z value).
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Because GPS is rather innacurate for elevations, they usually calculate speed assuming you are traveling along a flat surface. So the steeper the hill you are on, the less accurate the GPS will be. On my bicycle, the Garmin is usually about 5% off compared with an old-fold-fashioned bike computer (bike computers work by counting wheel to rotations, so as long as you enter the wheel size right they are dead-on) when mountainbiking. On the road is closer.

The reason a Garmin would track almost even with a car speedometer/odometer is that the slopes on a road are uusually in the 5-6% range so the difference in real distance vs. horizontal distance is minimal (and the more points the GPS gets the closer it is to real) I can see how snowboarding down really steep runs the GPS could be understimating speed significantly. 

I also worry about the Strava-effect if people start trying to get King-of-the-Mountain for runs or just from beating their friends. I think the emphasis should be on control, not flat basing your board and hanging on for dear life.


----------



## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

njfastlfie said:


> been using the Trace app to track my speed and other statistics on the mountain.
> 
> kind of bummed to see i max out at around 35mph, which, in my opinion, is sort of pathetic.
> 
> ...


It's far from being 100% mental.

To hit faster speeds you need steeper slopes and being able to carve without shaving speed (ie not skidding).

To FEEL comfortable while going faster you pretty much need proper form.

If you still ride on the backseat, stiff legged and with mostly flat based skidded turns, the absolute LAST thing on your mind should be going faster.

Bend the knees, learn to turn... then you'll feel comfortable at (and will be able to achieve) faster speeds. A turn on your edge with your knees properly bent feels super comfortable and stable. Flatbasing with stiff legs amd no edge set in feels (because it is) super unstable. Your mind isnt playing tricks on you. So forget about GPS accuracy.


----------



## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

the grouch said:


> Because GPS is rather innacurate for elevations, they usually calculate speed assuming you are traveling along a flat surface. So the steeper the hill you are on, the less accurate the GPS will be. On my bicycle, the Garmin is usually about 5% off compared with an old-fold-fashioned bike computer (bike computers work by counting wheel to rotations, so as long as you enter the wheel size right they are dead-on) when mountainbiking. On the road is closer.
> 
> The reason a Garmin would track almost even with a car speedometer/odometer is that the slopes on a road are uusually in the 5-6% range so the difference in real distance vs. horizontal distance is minimal (and the more points the GPS gets the closer it is to real) I can see how snowboarding down really steep runs the GPS could be understimating speed significantly.
> 
> I also worry about the Strava-effect if people start trying to get King-of-the-Mountain for runs or just from beating their friends. I think the emphasis should be on control, not flat basing your board and hanging on for dear life.


This makes sense to me, but doesn't account for how the GPS works in skydiving mode (which I don't claim to understand). I wonder if skydiving mode somehow switches the calculation to focus more on the change in the Z-axis either by the distance to satellites increasing, or less likely something with the barometric pressure ????

But, yeah, if GPS is only calculating the horizontal component of distance, it would be underestimating your speed. The steeper the slope, the more underestimation. This is all just academic, though.

I heard somewhere along the line about the Strava accident where a guy on a bike went through a stop sign or something cuz he was going for a Strava record and got killed. That's the LAST thing we need on the ski slopes.


----------



## ItchEtrigR (Jan 1, 2012)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=REIbSgufwSU#t=184

this is about 75mph


----------



## the grouch (Feb 18, 2014)

deagol said:


> This makes sense to me, but doesn't account for how the GPS works in skydiving mode (which I don't claim to understand). I wonder if skydiving mode somehow switches the calculation to focus more on the change in the Z-axis either by the distance to satellites increasing, or less likely something with the barometric pressure ????
> 
> But, yeah, if GPS is only calculating the horizontal component of distance, it would be underestimating your speed. The steeper the slope, the more underestimation. This is all just academic, though.
> 
> I heard somewhere along the line about the Strava accident where a guy on a bike went through a stop sign or something cuz he was going for a Strava record and got killed. That's the LAST thing we need on the ski slopes.


My guess would be the barometric pressure is used for skydiving. But I don't skydive. 
And yes, we don't need speed competitions on the slopes.


----------



## Handbanana (Dec 10, 2013)

Rogue said:


> It definitely varies by phone, at least in my experience. Even between Apple/Android. Plus your phone moves around in your pocket more than it can fixed to your board like trace is. Have you watched any of their youtube videos linked with the GoPro? You can see the jump height, distance, air time and it coordinates pretty well. I'm kind of a natzi when it comes to my data lol David has heard from me multiple times. He's got pro riders using Trace (device) too, so you know they're inovating and pushing forward with this technology.
> 
> I backed them with the kickstarter project and I'm now on my 3rd trace, they improve everytime. That's the other thing, I like not having it drain my phone battery.
> 
> Alrighty, starting the TS group then....with the super orginal group name of SBF...:dry:


You should probably start a thread about your Trace group. Or at least post it in a thread about Trace. A lot of people will probably miss your post.


----------



## strycker (Jan 28, 2015)

Mizu Kuma said:


> Everytime I've ever hurt myself ridin it's been while I was either at slow pace or stationary!!!!! :embarrased1:


I find this statement to be extremely accurate. If I lose speed at all or come to almost a stop, I tend to lose balance and go down. Then trying to stand up again, down I go. I'm not bad off the lift though for a newbie, but I like to keep moving.

On the note of speed, I'm not going fast anytime soon, so feel free to pass me if you see me.


----------



## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

I was sad I never got the carve challenge! Lol

Really, slow down for a while so you can go fast.


----------



## surfinsnow (Feb 4, 2010)

strycker said:


> I find this statement to be extremely accurate. If I lose speed at all or come to almost a stop, I tend to lose balance and go down. Then trying to stand up again, down I go. I'm not bad off the lift though for a newbie, but I like to keep moving.
> 
> On the note of speed, I'm not going fast anytime soon, so feel free to pass me if you see me.


Totally true. My skiing buddies (which include my wife and virtually everyone else I ride with) don't seem to get it. Riding slow is PAINFUL and the only times I ever fall off the lift is because of a skier next to me planting his/her poles into my bindings. Then they can't understand why I don't want to ride across flat green trails where they can just pole it.


----------



## MDboarder (Feb 2, 2015)

> Feeling comfortable at high speed...is it 100% mental?


Back to what I believe was your original question.... I don't believe it is a 100% mental.... maybe 50% mental and 50% your equipment
When I first started boarding I bought a 200 dollar board 100 dollar bindings and thought that would be good enough... I didn't know any better.
After about 2 seasons I decided to spend some good money and buy a better board and bindings and it made all the difference in the world, I felt way more stable at high speeds.


----------



## CMCM (Dec 29, 2013)

the feeling of being unstable can also come from how you use your equipment, not only the equipment itself.
I discovered a world of stability the first time I increased the angle on my highbacks and changed the angles on my bindings. it was an immediate ability to make outside turns which i was struggling at for a while.
if you want to go at higher speeds it means you will be going more straight and less across the hill, so adjusting how your footing is, and even which binding holes you use (forward/back/width?) can change how you feel.
I am not a pro by any means, so take my advice with caution.


----------



## surfinsnow (Feb 4, 2010)

MDboarder said:


> Back to what I believe was your original question.... I don't believe it is a 100% mental.... maybe 50% mental and 50% your equipment
> When I first started boarding I bought a 200 dollar board 100 dollar bindings and thought that would be good enough... I didn't know any better.
> After about 2 seasons I decided to spend some good money and buy a better board and bindings and it made all the difference in the world, I felt way more stable at high speeds.


It's not 100% mental, but your head has a LOT to do with it. And there are all sorts of factors that influence the "mental" part of it. One of the biggest is knowing the terrain. First couple of runs are always a bit sketchy, speed-wise, until I figure out the condition of the mountain. Lots of good snow? Unseen ice patches? So you take it easy until you've determined just how balls-out you can safely go.

Attitude is another biggie. Are you pissed off? Fought with your SO before you left about spending too much time on the mountain? Or are you happy as hell because you got a raise and can afford a new board? I find there are days when I'm literally signing out loud along with my play list, just stoked to be alive and enjoying such an awesome sport. Sounds corny, but it really does effect your riding.

A little puff on the way up the lift can get you nice and relaxed, too, but I wouldn't recommend anything illegal! :snowboard1:


----------



## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

MDboarder said:


> Back to what I believe was your original question.... I don't believe it is a 100% mental.... maybe 50% mental *and 50% your equipment…*
> 
> ….After about 2 seasons I decided to spend some good money and buy a better board and bindings and it made all the difference in the world, I felt way more stable at high speeds.


Gonna have to disagree with you on that! While the "right" board is probably going to feel better, more stable at speed? A Rider's skill & confidence accounts for *far* more in that equation! Just watch Ryan Knapton's video where he rescues and rides a really cheap assed board from the trash heap! Damned things busted even and he _still_ rides the hell out of it. :blink:

Then of course, there's always the ETT, "Pinewood Derby" video. Those guys get up to speed on boards made from actual 2x4's!!! 

For the majority of us "low intermediate"  average skilled riders,..? Yeah, the equipment sure can help. But in the long run,.. skill _and_ confidence? Beats out equipment every time!


----------



## Guest (Feb 7, 2015)

Learn dynamic riding/turns..........then worry about speed........it is harder to ride slow and properly down extreme steep terrain then it is to ride fast......

With the east coast you don't see as much steep terrain and it gives you a false sense of reality at times.....also from the mountains you are riding there in lies this problem. Stratton and Mount Snow are very flat.


----------



## surfinsnow (Feb 4, 2010)

golfer1659 said:


> Learn dynamic riding/turns..........then worry about speed........it is harder to ride slow and properly down extreme steep terrain then it is to ride fast......
> 
> With the east coast you don't see as much steep terrain and it gives you a false sense of reality at times.....also from the mountains you are riding there in lies this problem. Stratton and Mount Snow are very flat.


Excellent point. At Mt. Snow I start out on North Face, which they consider "steep." I've ridden steeper stuff in Connecticut. There is nothing really "steep" at Snow or Stratton. Remember kids, the black diamond rating is only relative to that particular mountain, not reality.


----------



## PorkCereal (Dec 28, 2013)

My problem isnt the speed going down, its that damn mound or incline you miss that launches you in the air youre not ready for. Sadly for me its normally when im on a particular edge and not flat. I know its coming eventually and have to remember to keep shaving off speed. Guess my next goal is learning small jumps.


----------



## Guest (Feb 7, 2015)

PorkCereal said:


> My problem isnt the speed going down, its that damn mound or incline you miss that launches you in the air youre not ready for. Sadly for me its normally when im on a particular edge and not flat. I know its coming eventually and have to remember to keep shaving off speed. Guess my next goal is learning small jumps.


No thats probably chop, and you should ride THROUGH that. 

You are probably looking too far ahead of you. You should look MAX 2 turns ahead, unless you are in the backcountry or trees (slow down and pick a line and then go). I always look about 10 feet in front of me. There are so many different variations of riding per conditions.

You need to read the terrain ahead. Deep chop pow you have to read the snow more so. You may have to point it a little more in a section and make a nice big slash turn on open patch of pow. Or if everything is chopped up and no fresh snow you need to use your legs and energy to slow you down, make more short turns more often. Learn how to absorb the chop with your legs to slow you down.

Also if you are getting launched off a roller or a mound you aren't using your legs properly and probably standing too upright. Try bending at the knees more and use your legs more to stay contacted to the terrain you are riding. Pump through a mound and or incline. Check out some boardercross videos, really shows you how to pump through those types of inclines.


----------



## CassMT (Mar 14, 2013)

it is 100% mental, also, 100% physical


----------



## surfinsnow (Feb 4, 2010)

golfer1659 said:


> No thats probably chop, and you should ride THROUGH that.
> 
> You are probably looking too far ahead of you. You should look MAX 2 turns ahead, unless you are in the backcountry or trees (slow down and pick a line and then go). I always look about 10 feet in front of me. There are so many different variations of riding per conditions.
> 
> ...


Yup. You're not using our knees. You're looking too far ahead. Look just a couple of turns ahead, keep your knees flexed. There is tendency to see a bump ahead and try to brake...instant wash-out or worse, crash. You see the bump, want to slow down, but the slowing down is actually what makes you eat it. Rip through it, slough off speed AFTER the bump.


----------



## wickedsight (Jan 16, 2014)

It depends on a lot of things:

- Most importantly, skill. I improved my maximum about 20MPH by getting better at riding.
- Next up are the conditions. Firm groomers are the best for going fast. Fresh powder, ice or slush aren't the conditi0ns you want when you go fast.
- 3rd is your board. Your stance, wax, board shape, edges, etc all influence how fast you will go. Rental boards (at least in Europe) will never be fast, period.


----------

