# Skidded turns on steep ice.



## NoirX252 (Aug 1, 2009)

I have no trouble making short radius turns, the types that are slightly wider than "body static down the hill".... meaning the type of turns where I keep my body aligned with the board, but make semi short radius skidded turns on steep ice, no problem.

Now keeping my body pointed down? problem, I feel like at it's best, to do near walking speed, there is near zero turn shape, and it's just a pivot.. skiddddddddd semi carve.. pivit skiddd semi carve at end.. although the semi carve at end doesn't happen all the time, not to mention if I hit a bump while in this twisted position.. especially at the end.. the skid gets invited back. Not a super skid, just a small skid.

I wonder if keeping the body static is even worthwhile. I notice there is a tendency for most people, to keep that body static on toesides, so you turn turn, end up in a twisted positioin.. but on the heelsides, u dont' end up so twisted, and are more facing down the hill with the chest.. therefore to keep things even, i make more of a conscious effort to "counter rotate" as i go do the heelside, to keep my shoulders pointing downhill.....

Or. i do a variation.... i prerotate as I turn, and the second the turn starts, I start pre rotating the other way, it almost looks like counter rotation, but it's not, and it's harder to keep your arms still...

Yeah... being OCD is not good!!.. or is it?


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## Edge (Sep 30, 2012)

I honestly don't know if that made sense or not. What the fuck.

Don't skid on ice, you'll die. 

Learn to carve, or stay away from ice.


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## Efilnikufesin (Oct 8, 2011)

NoirX252 said:


> I have no trouble making short radius turns, the types that are slightly wider than "body static down the hill".... meaning the type of turns where I keep my body aligned with the board, but make semi short radius skidded turns on steep ice, no problem.
> 
> Now keeping my body pointed down? problem, I feel like at it's best, to do near walking speed, there is near zero turn shape, and it's just a pivot.. skiddddddddd semi carve.. pivit skiddd semi carve at end.. although the semi carve at end doesn't happen all the time, not to mention if I hit a bump while in this twisted position.. especially at the end.. the skid gets invited back. Not a super skid, just a small skid.
> 
> ...


Maybe the OCD isn't good. Are you looking for confirmation that static turning is better than dynamic? 

When you legs are truly moving independent of your upper body, your shoulders should stay mostly down the fall line, i.e being dynamic. If all this counter rotation and such with your shoulders is still occurring, you are still moving staticly(word?.)


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## AAA (Feb 2, 2008)

Not sure what to make of that post, but static (stiff bodied) movements on ice are usually an act of fear and are less than ideal.


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## grafta (Dec 21, 2009)

NoirX252 said:


> I have no trouble making short radius turns, the types that are slightly wider than "body static down the hill".... meaning the type of turns where I keep my body aligned with the board, but make semi short radius skidded turns on steep ice, no problem.
> 
> Now keeping my body pointed down? problem, I feel like at it's best, to do near walking speed, there is near zero turn shape, and it's just a pivot.. skiddddddddd semi carve.. pivit skiddd semi carve at end.. although the semi carve at end doesn't happen all the time, not to mention if I hit a bump while in this twisted position.. especially at the end.. the skid gets invited back. Not a super skid, just a small skid.
> 
> ...





AAA said:


> Not sure what to make of that post, but static (stiff bodied) movements on ice are usually an act of fear and are less than ideal.


Dude! This dude AAA just called you a pussy! Dude! FIGHT! :laugh:


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## AAA (Feb 2, 2008)

Haha! Noooo, I did not call him that! :yahoo: The natural fear instinct is to stiffen up. I just take it that he seems to think stiff is good (restrain comments, please), and is something that needs to be worked on (again, with comment restraint).


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## Casual (Feb 9, 2011)

I just bomb the ice flat and dig my edge in whenever I find some hardpack lol... My edges are way to dull to even bother. So thats my advice to all you beginners trying to ride ice - just bomb that shit flat yo. mg:


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## NoirX252 (Aug 1, 2009)

Ok, to reiterate, I was mentioning the benefits of keeping your body naturally aligned with your stance angles vs ending up in a counter-rotated position by keeping your body still doing text book aasi-dynamic turns.

Unless it's my inexperience talking, I feel the twisted position resulting at the end of each turn, if doing a complete C, or uphill, puts the rider at a disadvantage, especially on bumpier terrain, although the side effect of ending up counter-rotated is, you naturally are in the back seat, as you should be finishing a turn.

Also, that I think for most riders, and for me too, let's say riding duck +15/-15, doing AASI dynamic skidded turns... leading shoulder pointing DOWN fall line, the result of a toe side turn is often in a "counter-rotated" position, with the board perpendicular to the fall line, with the lead shoulder pointing down (as it should be), however from the toe to the heel side, most people open up, and now the lead shoulder is no longer pointing down the slope, it is pointing more to the side, and more often, they are still looking down, reminiscent of a heel side edge slide, to keep the lead shoulder pointing down often definitely feels like "counter rotation"

I was also experimenting with active "anticipatory rotation", where just as one turn begins, u actively start rotating the other way, and vice versa, almost seems like counter-rotation but it's not, or maybe if you look at it some way, it's pre rotation with an active counter-rotation as you are rotating for the next turn...

I hope this makes more sense.

PS: I definitely know how to carve, any local rider who has seen my riding, knows this is an utter fact, I am trying to work more on different turn shapes, styles... maybe delve into freestyle.

PPS: My idea of dynamic riding is the utilization of the body to create edge angles, including pressure distribution, including different techniques of unweigh, up unweighting, down unweighting, and mid-weighting. WEEEEEEE

Oh yeah the question!
1. So is keep the body aligned better in steep/bumpy sections vs letting the board move about totally independently? 
2. is my "anticipatory rotation" fubar, and just keep a "silent" body?
I find the "anticipatory rotation" helps a lot.. with moguls...


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

AAA said:


> Haha! ...I just take it that he seems to think stiff is good (restrain comments, please), and is something that needs to be worked on (again, with comment restraint).


Stiff _IS_ Good! Can't "_Work On It_" otherwise!!! :blink:

(Seriously,.. restraint??? ...haven't been around here much lately, eh??) :eusa_clap: :laugh: :yahoo:
sorry, lack of snow has made me _silly_!!! I should be all better by Monday!!


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## tdn (Dec 30, 2010)

I don't know if I should be worried that without skipping a beat, I completely understood the OP's first post.


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## NoirX252 (Aug 1, 2009)

You scare me  

You are most likely a snowboard instructor... or an engineer, or both.


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## MGD81 (Mar 13, 2012)

Edge said:


> I honestly don't know if that made sense or not. What the fuck.
> 
> Don't skid on ice, you'll die.
> 
> Learn to carve, or stay away from ice.


You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.

OP, post a video of your riding, without that any feedback is impossible.


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## NoirX252 (Aug 1, 2009)

A video of me riding would be about 120 riding days ago, or 2 years, completely different.


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## aiidoneus (Apr 7, 2011)

I think it really depends. In really steep moguls, I personally like to ride by starting the turn with my upper body (shoulder). Then drive my knees hard to get a lot of edge angle and a quick turn. On my heelside, I lead with shoulder again but instead I lean back hard, and bring my mid section forward. This sounds funny, but it keeps my back, and weight better in line with the heelside edge.

The other technique you are talking about, keeping your upper body mostly static, and really only carving with the lower body is quite a bit harder for most I think. The timing and edge transitions are much faster, and the lower body is very dynamic. This is just a guess, but I think if you are too counter rotated doing this, it may be a timing issue. I find just before I am too rotated, the board has lots of energy and wants to pop to the other edge.

P.S. you can't carve on real ice .. You only skid, head to Mont Tremblant out east after rain then a freeze.


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## Slush Puppie (Aug 15, 2011)

Surely riding ice or steep ice at that isn't especially different from any other (non-pow) riding...

keep a balanced position, keep you body inline with the board (quiet upper body) Let the board turn in good time, don't force it around - allow it to flow. Get more dynamic with your legs the steeper it is. This will help control your speed and allow you to turn through the fall line with easy confidence.

Soak up bumps with your legs.

Save rotation and other exaggerated movements for adjustment and finesse during the turn only.


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