# How much better is Flow's NASTY?



## Lollingsgrad (Jan 13, 2015)

So there's a sale of 2013 Flow Fives on at the moment and I'm keen to give Flow a try. Are these cheaper models without NASTY much worse? I've heard the lower end models give Flow a bad name, but I've also heard that the Fives aren't considered lower end. These things are going so cheap right now that the next cheapest model with NASTY (Flow Fuse) is more than double the price.

I don't think I can try before I buy unfortunately, best I can do is check they fit my boot indoors and send them back if they don't. What do you reckon? Worth a try? NASTY or bust?


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## Hirvy (Dec 30, 2012)

I've got a pair of Flow The Fives SE that don't have Nasty and honestly I wouldn't recommend them and not convinced Nasty would help me. I've been doing all I could to like them and even justify them to my friends. One time my foot came out of the binding. They've been a chore to setup and keep the toe strap comfortable on the mountain (not sure if this is entirely the Hybrid strap or not). Was using the 4x4 setup until I got my Burton board and got the channel adapter plates and today broke the adapter plate on my second run w/ the new board and plates. Fixed it and had to continually dial in the straps on each run (Nasty may fix this issue).

tldr: will sell my Flow the Fives SE 2012? 2013? for about $100


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

I used to use the flow five and before that the flite II. I liked them. didn't love them. I would have to slightly loosen and tighten them on every strap in.

I use flow NX2-GT this season and used the NX2-SE last season. I love them. The responsiveness and dampening is great, the ease of entry is way better. They do take some getting used to also but once you have them set, they are good to go(the hybrid strap is harder to deal with). The NASTY opens them up to get in and cranks them down when your in. No lie, they still take a little fiddle once a day but no biggie. I have the fusion strap on the NX2GT and do not like the response as much as the hybrid on my older bindings. 

I also have union factory bindings and use them on deep pow days or in terrain I have to hike to and strap in at. Even with they real ratchets on the flows, it just isn't easy enough to strap in while dangling off the side of a mountain ridge.....

Their talon and hylite boots are the shit for boots. Best boots every(for me)


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## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

I have the Fives from last year (not the SE), picked up cheap. I used them with a new board this season, so cant really give an accurate performance comparison to my Burton Missions that i was using last year, but from a usage point of view i havent had a single issue yet. I set the bindings at the start of the day, and dont really touch them for the rest of the day. A couple of times during the day i would notice they were a bit tighter; taking my boot out would reveal some snow buildup inside - easily fixed.

Mind you i am doing more freestyle snowboarding, so I am not too worried having a bit of freedom in the binding.


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## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

Actually one thing that is bugging me, and i am not sure if its how i set them up (had to move the wire mounting point forward since i am using an L with size 9 boots). But the highback will NOT sit down. It springs straight back up to the top meaning its a bit of an awkward thing to strap in (One hand to push down the highback as i step down). Bit disappointed in this because it takes longer and makes it harder to do while standing up.


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## Oldman (Mar 7, 2012)

I would suggest that if you want to experience the best that a Flow binding has to offer in terms of fit, performance and ease of use, you only consider those models that offer the NASTY system.

I am riding NX2 AT's and RS's ( RS no longer available, GT now ) all with the fusion strap ( No hybrid strap for me ) and all with NASTY and I love them. :jumping1:

I also have an older style NXT-FSE ( no NASTY ) that I still ride and enjoy, but the fit and performance is noticeably less than that of my newer bindings.


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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Have no experience with the fives, but I ride both the nx2-at, and the nx2-se (with upgraded 2015 toe cap).
I find the -se takes a little longer to dial in than the -at version, as well as the -se seems to me to be a bit more responsive.


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## jten9 (Oct 29, 2014)

I can't directly answer your question regarding Flows, I've never used them. Although I was considering the Fives, I ended up getting some lower end Gnu Backdoor bindings.

They have an auto open strap, that when the highback is lowered the ankle strap "opens" to a larger size. Same theory as NASTY by flow.

Main difference I see is that the Gnu's take 2 steps to close: lift the highback (just like flows) then flip closed the ankle strap. At first I thought this would just slow things down with an extra step, but I actually really like it. When you are bent over lifting the highback, it is less than half a sec to do the ankle. You can really crank down the the ankle strap if you like it tight, and use the pressure release to loosen things up while waiting in liftlines or on the chair for comfort.

My Backdoors don't have any ratchets, but I *think* all the current Gnu bindings have ratchets if traditional entry is important to you in addition to rear entry. To me personally, I never have a need for traditional entry, and I like the simplicity of no ratchets. I set my bindings up on day one, and haven't adjusted them since. I just step in and ride. 

Just another option to consider if you don't want to drop coin on NASTY, although I do hear good things about that system.


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## Lollingsgrad (Jan 13, 2015)

jten9 said:


> I can't directly answer your question regarding Flows, I've never used them. Although I was considering the Fives, I ended up getting some lower end Gnu Backdoor bindings.


Funnily enough I did want a Fastec binding first, but GNU is uncommon in the UK. What we have instead is SP and I've heard horrible stories about reliability which Flow don't have. I'd have immediately gone with Fastec if that wasn't the case but supposedly the SP ratchets slip a lot and one guy supposedly managed to make the ankle lever detonate by accidentally standing on it whilst skating.


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## jten9 (Oct 29, 2014)

Lollingsgrad said:


> Funnily enough I did want a Fastec binding first, but GNU is uncommon in the UK. ...


Ah, I didn't pay attention to where you are located, sorry... I suppose even if ordered online, shipping would be pricey.


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## Lollingsgrad (Jan 13, 2015)

Oldman said:


> I would suggest that if you want to experience the best that a Flow binding has to offer in terms of fit, performance and ease of use, you only consider those models that offer the NASTY system.


It's not so much that I want to experience the best; just not the worst. If the Fives are good but not great then it's worth the £80 saving to me. If they have a habit of falling apart or chewing up boots then I might give it a miss and just hope NASTY gets cheaper so I feel like it's cheap enough to try it out.


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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

it's all about convienience. with nasty you are spending less time tweaking. without nasty you may have to click a few times to get the snug feel. I don't think the bindings will fall apart. but they also don't have the canting (great on knees), and nasty system easier in and out,


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## honeycomb (Feb 6, 2011)

tokyo_dom said:


> Actually one thing that is bugging me, and i am not sure if its how i set them up (had to move the wire mounting point forward since i am using an L with size 9 boots). But the highback will NOT sit down. It springs straight back up to the top meaning its a bit of an awkward thing to strap in (One hand to push down the highback as i step down). Bit disappointed in this because it takes longer and makes it harder to do while standing up.



How new are they? That's how they usually are new, just need broken in and the highback will lay down when you unstrap.

I've had 3 pairs, cheapo flight II's, 5's, and NXT-AT's, all older so no Nasty tech. None of them ever tore up boots, but if you want a tight hold you'll have to kick your boot in hard. The Nasty setup gets rid of that, boot slides in and out easy and can clamp down harder. I've only played with the new ones at the store, but they feel way nicer than the old ones, and I still like my old ones.


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## t21 (Dec 29, 2010)

I had the Flow Fives on my second season (had the union force before that) for a cheap price and it served me well. The only problem i had with them was snow build up on the base that makes your boot harder to insert and clamp, but you always wipe the snow off before, but you get some snow buildup that are not quite easy to wipe off. Other than that, i did like them a lot until they came out with the NX2 with NASTY system and there goes my fives:happy:.


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## tokyo_dom (Jan 7, 2013)

honeycomb said:


> How new are they? That's how they usually are new, just need broken in and the highback will lay down when you unstrap.


Thanks for the reply. i've had 4 days on them so far and they were brand new when i got them. Maybe i'll just have to wait a bit longer - but then the highbacks are very free moving (the bolts are tightened as far as they will go), i got the impression that others have a bit more friction hence staying down? Or is it the wire that gets softer?


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## Lollingsgrad (Jan 13, 2015)

You guys should be Flow salesmen; I decided to stump up for the 2015 Flow Fuses since I was able to get a good deal on some ex-display ones. That and also they were fire engine red. Lets see if my boots actually fit in it.


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## Lollingsgrad (Jan 13, 2015)

Well I've just gotten back from a week in Arinsal, Andorra. I was careful to follow all advice with adjustment and I love my Flow Fuses. I never had any trouble getting in or out and I felt like the hand-wringing over how difficult they were to fit to a boot or maintain was overblown. They were easy to setup, fit well on my Northwave Domains and were very very comfortable and responsive even if you fit them slightly loose for convenience. It probably helps that my last bindings were over the top of the boot rather than toe caps.

I will say that the stuff about boot-wear is somewhat true though. They're not destroying my boots but there's a little bit of heel wear. I find what really helps with this is having your boot heel slightly elevated when you raise the high back as it will then make contact with the back of your boot rather than the bottom of your heel first. Also taking your foot out by lifting your foot to lever down the highback prevents it from catching your heel when you get out of the binding, but obviously this only works if you have the NASTY system.


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## tannersdad (Jan 9, 2013)

larrytbull said:


> Have no experience with the fives, but I ride both the nx2-at, and the nx2-se (with upgraded 2015 toe cap).
> I find the -se takes a little longer to dial in than the -at version, as well as the -se seems to me to be a bit more responsive.


Larry, how did you get the 2015 toecaps? I would also like to upgrade my NX2 SE! The webbing on the originals looks a little sketchy. Thanks.


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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

I called flow to purchase parts. I just happened to get a flow rep with whom I have dealt with many times prior . He sent them to me for free

I think purchase price is approx. $25

Just tell them toe caps on 2014 model did not stay on place and was giving u issues


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## tannersdad (Jan 9, 2013)

Thanks! I will call today!


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