# Binding weight porn



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

I love my Rome Targas and had the impression that they were the heaviest of the bindings I own, but that was based on how heavy they *felt* compared to others.

But now since I'm bored and broken, I weighed all the bindings I own on a kitchen scale and was a bit surprised at the results. For reference, my wallet with a few credit cards in it and about $12 in cash weighs 100 grams.

From lightest to heaviest, including mounting hardware and screws:

1. Burton Malavita (Medium, 2014) = 900g
2. Salomon District (Large, 2014) = 1000g
3. Rome DOD (L/XL, 2018) = 1058g
4. Union TRice Pro (Large, 2017) = 1062g
5. Rome Targa (L/XL, 2017) = 1142g

The Malavitas are the most impressive weight-wise, but then again they are Mediums and the rest are Large or L/XL. (I've had trouble in the past with larger boots baaarely fitting in the Vitas) 

The Targas are definitely the heaviest, but the difference between those and say, the Salomon District, was much less than I expected.

I was surprised that the DOD's came in as light as they did cause I thought they used the same base plate as the Targa with a flexier highback, but that's not accurate; the heel loop on the DOD's is thinner and apparently lighter than the Targa. I'm excited to ride the DOD's; I haven't yet.

My impression of the Unions was that they were "pretty light, but not light the Vitas" and it turns out they're on the heavier end of the bindings I own. The Trice's also seemed marginally heavier than the Atlas and the Forces when I bought them.

Lesson learned: You probably don't need to worry about the weight of bindings. The difference between the heaviest and the lightest is negligible and you can probably save more weight by waxing the top of your board with car wax and being diligent about wiping the snow off before you get on the lift. The differences within a class of bindings with the same sort of characteristics is even less.


----------



## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

I just did the same with my Fluxes.
2017 DS = 853g
2018 TM = 960g

Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk


----------



## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

Damn I just mounted my 2012 Union MC-Metafuses last night! Will need to take one off again...

Base Material - DuPont Zytel ST nylon
Highback Material - Carbon fiber
Ratchets - Magnesium/aluminum

These should be pretty damn light.

Edit: 829 grams! Nice  Size L/XL


----------



## mojo maestro (Jan 6, 2009)

This thread is worthless w/o some pics of feet............


----------



## zc1 (Feb 20, 2017)

Medium Now Drive 907 g
Medium Now Pilot 930 g

Pretty sure Salomon Quantums would be right down there, too, but I don't have any unmounted right now.


----------



## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

So its too damm hot and bored...me thinks ya'll are weighing just 1 single binding and not the pair.

So according to tech specs...per single binder

binding with cleat 583g

However more importantly, the plan is to enlighten myself by the beginning of the season...so far seemingly on track


----------



## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

wrathfuldeity said:


> So its too damm hot and bored...me thinks ya'll are weighing just 1 single binding and not the pair.
> 
> So according to tech specs...per single binder
> 
> ...


The pair won't fit easily on the kitchen scales 

What bindings are those?


----------



## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

Manicmouse said:


> The pair won't fit easily on the kitchen scales
> 
> What bindings are those?


Doh..oh yea...forgot, I've got a kitchen scale...somewhere's in the creepy basement.

Perhaps cheating on the bindings...Phantoms

http://www.phantomsnow.com/

However so far 1 week in, got 3600g of my 13600g goal before the season off my lardness.


----------



## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

wrathfuldeity said:


> Doh..oh yea...forgot, I've got a kitchen scale...somewhere's in the creepy basement.
> 
> Perhaps cheating on the bindings...Phantoms
> 
> ...


Thought you were comparing apples with oranges :grin:

Nice work! I achieved no fitness goals over the southern hemisphere summer..... Paying for it now.


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

wrathfuldeity said:


> So its too damm hot and bored...me thinks ya'll are weighing just 1 single binding and not the pair.
> 
> So according to tech specs...per single binder
> 
> ...


Yeah, if you'd like to weigh bindings according to what I did:

1. Weigh a single binding
2. Make sure you include all hardware required to mount it to the board. Disc, screws, etc.


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

Medium Now Drives - 922g with mounting hardware. These are a riding buddy's and they seem really light for the promised responsiveness so he's stoked to try them out.


----------



## francium (Jan 12, 2013)

Large Spark Surge 714g


----------



## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

francium said:


> Large Spark Surge 714g


That excludes the puck, though...


----------



## Board Doctor (Feb 1, 2018)

2018 Burton Genesis X Reflex (M) = 856g
2019 Flux TM (M) = 960g


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

Hi there

interesting thread:grin: 
I´ve always been a sucker for light gear and i think it´s really a pain to get some information about the weight of gear online but its definately something to consider when buying bindings. 
Sure it´s not the most important thing I look for in a binding but if the bindings offer a good, confortable ride but feels like an anker that would be a reason to consider a change (at least for me)
In my opinion if you are a hard charger and just like to bomb down the hill the weight of your bindings ie your setup as whole is pretty much irrelevant.
I even kinda like the added weight of my longer board which i use when I feel like charging. :grin:
As soon as you start to jib around in or out the park or you do alot of hiking the weight of things suddenly get a whole new relevance.
I actually never really cared about the weight of my bindings, i still liked light boards though ;-) , until i got my union contact pros.
I was like: holy hell these things weigh nothing:surprise: I mostly used burton bindings because they were just the only ones i´ve tried that really stayed relieable over the years, they are on the light side of things but how the unions felt was just on another level. So i decided to weigh them. I was pretty surprised to learn that the difference between the contact pro and the burton cartel reflex i had at the time (I think the 2015 model with the old baseplate i guess the newer models with the newer more streamlined baseplate will weigh quite a bit less) was just about 130g per binding. 
So yes, the about 260g-difference (for both bindings) does make a difference!
The board just feels lighter when you pick it up and when you`re jibbing around especially when ollieing but also for spinning of kickers or on rails it just feels a little more effortless.

So for the sake of putting some information in the ether here is the weight of my current bindings:
All with discs and screws.

Union contact Pro 2016 size M: ~800g
Burton cartel M 2015 reflex: ~930g (That one is from memory though i dont have them anymore could be +/- 20g or so)
Frankenbinders the ones i use mostly now: diode baseplates 2016 size M with cartel straps and highback: ~840g
The Burton EST ones are without the screws because I don´t know if i should include only the male part (12g) or the female part of the screw too, since the female ones technically are inserts so they´re probably more board than binding, both would add 25g)

Burton Cartel EST 2015 size M : ~895g
Burton diodes EST 2016 size M: ~995g


----------



## kosmoz (Dec 27, 2013)

Flow NX2 Fusion L Black 2018 - 1071g for one binding with everything included.


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

2017 Rome Katana M/L = 1017g


----------



## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Be sure to knock the snow off of your topsheet. Bang, you probably just saved more weight than the difference between the heaviest and lightest bindings in the market.


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

linvillegorge said:


> Be sure to knock the snow off of your topsheet. Bang, you probably just saved more weight than the difference between the heaviest and lightest bindings in the market.


I like the snow on my top sheet. Don't tell me how to live my life.


----------



## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

drblast said:


> Medium Now Drives - 922g with mounting hardware. These are a riding buddy's and they seem really light for the promised responsiveness so he's stoked to try them out.


For the response they have and at that weight, the Drives are pretty impressive.


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

F1EA said:


> For the response they have and at that weight, the Drives are pretty impressive.


Oh hell yeah, I've ridden these on my buddy's Yes Optimistic and they were super responsive. One of the few bindings I'd consider as a replacement for my Targas, although I like the straps and pivot mount on the Targas better.

I also feel like my size 10's baaaarely fit in the Medium Now's so I have that same in-between sizing problem that I do with Burton bindings. Still, on medium Malavita's I feel like I just overpower the binding and I got none of that from the Drives. Excellent design.


----------



## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

drblast said:


> Oh hell yeah, I've ridden these on my buddy's Yes Optimistic and they were super responsive. One of the few bindings I'd consider as a replacement for my Targas, although I like the straps and pivot mount on the Targas better.
> 
> I also feel like my size 10's baaaarely fit in the Medium Now's so I have that same in-between sizing problem that I do with Burton bindings. Still, on medium Malavita's I feel like I just overpower the binding and I got none of that from the Drives. Excellent design.


Drives are great. Also Rome has great straps and buckles; they're kinda heavy and have a lot of little nuts and bolts... they don't come loose and stuff. So the only thing is not as plug and play as the others and the weight. Neither is a big deal.

I'm US10.5 so it's also a pain... I just get bulky boots (Vans, ThrityTwo - luckily they fit my feet very well) and go ok with L bindings...


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

F1EA said:


> Drives are great. Also Rome has great straps and buckles; they're kinda heavy and have a lot of little nuts and bolts... they don't come loose and stuff. So the only thing is not as plug and play as the others and the weight. Neither is a big deal.
> 
> I'm US10.5 so it's also a pain... I just get bulky boots (Vans, ThrityTwo - luckily they fit my feet very well) and go ok with L bindings...


I was tossing around the idea of a Rome franken-binding cause I think a DoD with pivot mount would be pretty great. I have DoD's, Targas, and the older style Katanas now and I want those all combined somehow. Maybe the new stiffer Katana is exactly that.


----------



## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

drblast said:


> I was tossing around the idea of a Rome franken-binding cause I think a DoD with pivot mount would be pretty great.


My plan exactly.


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

Nivek said:


> My plan exactly.


Can we (and by "we" I mean "you") ask someone at Rome to make a pivot mount DoD for 2021? That would rock.

Looks like the square hole in the Targa and Katana heel loop is larger than the three on the DoD. I guess I could throw a DoD highback and strap on a Targa base but the Targa base is beefier than the DoD one.


----------



## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

drblast said:


> Nivek said:
> 
> 
> > My plan exactly.
> ...


I have done zero research into the compatibility. This makes me sad. They probably wont add pivot to the DOD since that's a defining upgrade to Targa and as the team binding no pivot is one less thing to break or go wrong. I may have to do what you're saying and go Targa with DOD straps and highbacks...


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

Nivek said:


> I have done zero research into the compatibility. This makes me sad. They probably wont add pivot to the DOD since that's a defining upgrade to Targa and as the team binding no pivot is one less thing to break or go wrong. I may have to do what you're saying and go Targa with DOD straps and highbacks...


I don't have a Vice to check but I am wondering if the Vice pivot mount is different enough that it might fit in the DoD. I'd be happy with the reduced angle options on a DoD if it helped them sell Targas too. And next year's Targa has the cool toe strap so maybe the completely different upgraded straps are enough to differentiate it.


----------



## JDA (Feb 10, 2016)

Burton X Base EST size M with mounting hardware 750g


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

Wow thats really light! Even lighter than my Contact Pros!
I wonder where they managed to shave this weight off, is it really just the onepiece-baseplate?
I weighted all the parts of my Diode Est (2016 model) against my Cartel Est to see where the weight difference comes from, so I could make the lightest possible hybrid.

The diodes (size M) weighs just over 1kg - 1005g with screws. Whereas the Cartels weigh around 100g less - 909g (size M 2015 model with screws).
When I weighted all the parts though; straps, hichbacks baseplates and footbeds, I found that the majority of the weight-difference comes from the footbed. The springbed is really heavy: 205g, whereas the Cartels EVA-footbed only weighs 125g. The highback of the Diodes is also abit heavier around 20g more a piece. The straps just have some minor differences. I expected the carbon baseplate of the diode to make a big difference though. Turns out: There is only a 15g difference beteween the two baseplates! So carbon vs glass-nylon doesnt really make a huge difference weight-wise.

So I wonder where they managed to shave off 160g per binding compared to my cartels - thats alot!


----------



## JDA (Feb 10, 2016)

All the hardware is titanium and nothing is tool-less plus the foot bed is very thin. I've been toying with the idea of using them on my skipjack without the foot bed since it already has padding. The board feel should be insane!


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

Hahah well, its definately worth a try :-D

Personally, Im more of a shockabsorbtion over boardfeel guy - so I would kick the thinbed out for a more cushioned footbed anyway...
Im still thinking about buying an X-Base too though. I would probably swap the footbed out for the springbed.
I love the repsonse and the feel of the diodes but I just cant get over the weight of them.
I caught myself alot of times mounting my cartels instead of the diodes just to save a little weight, even though they are less responsive. And this solution still cant completely satisfy me in terms of weight. Yes, burton bindings Est and Reflex are not heavy by any means but since I experienced my the contact pros - everything significantly heavier than them just feels really heavy end restrictive....
Compared to my lighter bindings, the diodes just feel like an anker. 

The Springbed would make the X-base significantly heavier but it would still be quite light. The feeling of the springed is just awesome and it gives you WAY more response compared to an EVA-Footbed.
I just dont know if the response would be too much for me or if I would miss the hinge-system with the X-base...


----------



## lab49232 (Sep 13, 2011)

I'm confused is this a Biking forum? I bet if we all agree to pay $1,000 we can get bindings that are down to 500 grams each! Best part is they'll feel the exact same. 

I love the industry more than most anyone but I'm more on the functional working tech side than stats just to say stats thing. In my head I just always go "do they make sure they go to the bathroom before getting on the board to reduce weight, do they decide not to carry a protein bar because of the added weight?"

(Caveat backcountry hiking is a completely different story)


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

lab49232 said:


> I'm confused is this a Biking forum? I bet if we all agree to pay $1,000 we can get bindings that are down to 500 grams each! Best part is they'll feel the exact same.
> 
> I love the industry more than most anyone but I'm more on the functional working tech side than stats just to say stats thing. In my head I just always go "do they make sure they go to the bathroom before getting on the board to reduce weight, do they decide not to carry a protein bar because of the added weight?"
> 
> (Caveat backcountry hiking is a completely different story)


I still have the first board I bought, a 90's O-Sin 163W. I got it on sale with some horrible bindings that didn't have a front ratchet. I never realized how heavy that board was until I got a new Burton Dominant that weighed about the same with bindings as the old board did without. I could never understand why I was so tired at the end of the day when my buddy was still going strong, but the next day out with the new lighter board I was the one who wanted to keep going.

So while my favorite bindings (Targa) are actually the heaviest ones on here, weight is still a consideration. If I could have a binding that rode exactly like the Targas but 100g lighter I'd jump on that depending on the cost. I still hate paying more than $200 for bindings and luckily I can pick Targas up for less than that on sale.


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

Sorry double post?


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

lab49232 said:


> I'm confused is this a Biking forum? I bet if we all agree to pay $1,000 we can get bindings that are down to 500 grams each! Best part is they'll feel the exact same.
> 
> I love the industry more than most anyone but I'm more on the functional working tech side than stats just to say stats thing. In my head I just always go "do they make sure they go to the bathroom before getting on the board to reduce weight, do they decide not to carry a protein bar because of the added weight?"
> 
> (Caveat backcountry hiking is a completely different story)


Well thats funny. I bike too and I always feel that people way overthink the whole weight of everything :-D With my bike I dont really care that much about the weight.

I agree with you that weight can be soemthing pretty stupid to focus on for snowboard gear too.
And Im definately with you on the issue that function and comfort are the most importand parts when it comes to bindings - thats why i still use burton bindings and didnt abandon the ship yet to get some ultralight fully carbon bindings - because I ilke the comfort of burton binders more and I think they are more reliable.

I also dont buy snowboards because of their weight. Yes light snowboards are fun, especially for riding park and messing around on piste but in my experience they just fall apart sooner than the heavier, and therefore heftier constructed conterparts I`ve owned.
Boot weight is pretty noticeable - but i dont watch out for light boots either. With boots fit stands above all else. and then function - meaning flex and longevity aka flex retention.

With bindings though, I believe there really is something to gain. Yes, I guess to some extend you will still sacrifice a little bit durability but in recent years some companies have proofen, that one can build durable yet light bindings. (like union for example). Me personally, I do notice lighter bindings, even if its just 50g per binding - I`ll notice it.
Im not saying that its a dealbreaker if my bindings are a bit heavier but if the bindings can offer me all the function I need, comfort, response, boardfeel, butterability AND reliability and still manages to be lighter than the competition I will be drawn to that bidning over a heavier one.

It also depends on your riding style though. If you just bomb down the piste you probably wont care about the weight of your gear at all. I personally even like a little added weight on my feet for bombing, makes everything feel a little more damp.
But as soon as you start throwing some freestyle elements into your riding - you will profit from a lighter setup!


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

drblast said:


> I still have the first board I bought, a 90's O-Sin 163W. I got it on sale with some horrible bindings that didn't have a front ratchet. I never realized how heavy that board was until I got a new Burton Dominant that weighed about the same with bindings as the old board did without. I could never understand why I was so tired at the end of the day when my buddy was still going strong, but the next day out with the new lighter board I was the one who wanted to keep going.
> 
> So while my favorite bindings (Targa) are actually the heaviest ones on here, weight is still a consideration. If I could have a binding that rode exactly like the Targas but 100g lighter I'd jump on that depending on the cost. I still hate paying more than $200 for bindings and luckily I can pick Targas up for less than that on sale.


I bet that was a whole new world ?

I never really thought much about the weight of my bindings too until I got my Union contact pros. Compared to my older Burton cartels, which werent exactly heavy to begin with, they felt almost like I got no bindings on my feet at all.
It really is a noticeable difference - at least for me. 

Board weight is really noticable as well of course. But in my experience with boards its more important how the weight distribution is (thinned out tips for example). I once got a slash paxson. which felt airy and light as hell. I thought that that was the lightest board I ever had. When I weigtet it though, I saw that it was pretty similiar in weight to my other boards. But it felt way lighter when riding and especially when spinning.

Im not a fan of light boards though. While they certainly are fun, light usually just means that theres less material in them - unless of course they have some crazy carbon-whatever construction...
So the material loss usually means a less durable construction overall. Every (noticable) light board I had wasnt durable at all. I m aware that this is just a very small sample size and is based on my experience so take that for what is worth.


----------



## lab49232 (Sep 13, 2011)

drblast said:


> I still have the first board I bought, a 90's O-Sin 163W. I got it on sale with some horrible bindings that didn't have a front ratchet. I never realized how heavy that board was until I got a new Burton Dominant that weighed about the same with bindings as the old board did without. I could never understand why I was so tired at the end of the day when my buddy was still going strong, but the next day out with the new lighter board I was the one who wanted to keep going.
> 
> So while my favorite bindings (Targa) are actually the heaviest ones on here, weight is still a consideration. If I could have a binding that rode exactly like the Targas but 100g lighter I'd jump on that depending on the cost. I still hate paying more than $200 for bindings and luckily I can pick Targas up for less than that on sale.


The board weight difference wasn't 50 grams and there was a lot more to that than board weight alone. Binding weight will ABSOLUTELY not affect fatigue if your riding lifts except for when you're actually on the lift and the boards dangling, but again snow weight will be ore than binding weight.. Weight doesn't affect turning strength, that's stiffness and board flex. It cant be felt when the board is on the ground in any meaningful manner. That's not binding weight that's all conditions, form, stiffness, >1% binding weight.


----------



## lab49232 (Sep 13, 2011)

fzst said:


> Me personally, I do notice lighter bindings, even if its just 50g per binding - I`ll notice it.
> Im not saying that its a dealbreaker if my bindings are a bit heavier but if the bindings can offer me all the function I need, comfort, response, boardfeel, butterability AND reliability and still manages to be lighter than the competition I will be drawn to that bidning over a heavier one.


You CANNOT feel the difference in 50 gram snowboard bindings. that's 0.1 lbs. If I put one thing in each hand with a difference of 50 grams youd barely be able to tell which is heavier, let alone as part of an entire setup strapped to your feet.

To put it in snow perspective, 50 grams is the equivalent of 0.4 cm of snow on a 6x6 inch area of your board.

Or ~1.3 cm of snow on a square inch of your board is 50 grams.Youll fluctuate more snow weight than that each run, you wouldn't be able to even have a baseline to go off of.

My math is probly slightly off with conversions and everything but you get the point.


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

lab49232 said:


> The board weight difference wasn't 50 grams and there was a lot more to that than board weight alone. Binding weight will ABSOLUTELY not affect fatigue if your riding lifts except for when you're actually on the lift and the boards dangling, but again snow weight will be ore than binding weight.. Weight doesn't affect turning strength, that's stiffness and board flex. It cant be felt when the board is on the ground in any meaningful manner. That's not binding weight that's all conditions, form, stiffness, >1% binding weight.


Again: I fully agree with you. It all depends on your riding style. If you dont get any airtime whatsoever, dont ever do a 180 or even a noseroll and just carve down the slopes regular: you wont notice the weight of your bindings at all. Although I guess it still affetcts the maneuverability of your board on some level but im sure thats not really a noticeable difference. 
I even think the weight of your board doesnt really matter for just riding groomers. Alot of other things will have way more influence on how your board feels, how tired you get or how easy your board turns.
In that regard bindings are REALLY important too though. But in terms of flex, response, and above all: comfort.


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

lab49232 said:


> You CANNOT feel the difference in 50 gram snowboard bindings. that's 0.1 lbs. If I put one thing in each hand with a difference of 50 grams youd barely be able to tell which is heavier, let alone as part of an entire setup strapped to your feet.
> 
> To put it in snow perspective, 50 grams is the equivalent of 0.4 cm of snow on a 6x6 inch area of your board.
> 
> Or ~1.3 cm of snow on a square inch of your board is 50 grams.Youll fluctuate more snow weight than that each run, you wouldn't be able to even have a baseline to go off of.


Yes, 50g is a very extreme example and its very subtle. I just took that number because its the weight difference of my cartels versus my union contact pros and I can feel a difference when I conentrate on it. And to be clear: yes, iI dont feel this difference while riding! I just feel it when handling the board. Read: picking the board up, riding lifts etc.

This changes when you scale the difference up though. When i put my diode est on my board instead of the contact pros, then thats about a 200g difference per binding. And that is REALLY noticeable - also while riding.
Again there is not really a difference for just carving regular but as soon as I do an ollie, a spin or even a noseroll- I really feel that my setup is just heavier than usual and that I have to work more to hop on to a rail for example....


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

All else being equal the weight of the bindings doesn't really matter and since they're right under your feet it's not affecting things like spin weight. Of all the places to cut weight they're probably the least noticeable when riding.

BUT, when you're jumping a lot or spinning or riding lifts all day for multiple days with the board hanging off your foot overall weight does matter for comfort. I have some heavier boards that are 500g heavier than the light ones and with an extra 400g for both bindings (comparing heavy bindings to light ones) and the extra weight of the vibram sole on XLT TM-2's I ride over regular TM-2's, the grams can add up significantly for the whole setup. And you definitely feel 1000g of difference over a whole day.

Still not going to turn me off of Targas for most boards but if I can save half a pound by riding Drives or Falcors instead on a heavy board I might. For the same reason I wax the top of my boards with car wax so I can brush snow off more easily.


----------



## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Is this where the skiers are hanging out? Wouldnt it be better to be in shape than have to worry about saving grams of weight? Is this a troll thread?


----------



## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

I'll take shock absorption and comfort over grams anyday. Targas rule.


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

Phedder said:


> I'll take shock absorption and comfort over grams anyday. Targas rule.


Im with you on that! Depends on what boots you got though. With some you require more additional shockabsorbtion from your bindings, with some less...
Still with bindings the most important things for me are:

Comfort (shockabsorbtion) -> then response -> and then weight.

With todays bindings though, you can have all 3


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

drblast said:


> All else being equal the weight of the bindings doesn't really matter and since they're right under your feet it's not affecting things like spin weight. Of all the places to cut weight they're probably the least noticeable when riding.
> 
> BUT, when you're jumping a lot or spinning or riding lifts all day for multiple days with the board hanging off your foot overall weight does matter for comfort. I have some heavier boards that are 500g heavier than the light ones and with an extra 400g for both bindings (comparing heavy bindings to light ones) and the extra weight of the vibram sole on XLT TM-2's I ride over regular TM-2's, the grams can add up significantly for the whole setup. And you definitely feel 1000g of difference over a whole day.
> 
> Still not going to turn me off of Targas for most boards but if I can save half a pound by riding Drives or Falcors instead on a heavy board I might. For the same reason I wax the top of my boards with car wax so I can brush snow off more easily.


Yes, swingweight isnt really affected by the bindings, the weight you have to carry into the air when doing an ollie (and therefore everytime your board is leaving the ground) is though. There the weight of a setup as a whole comes into play, ie boots, bindings and board together.

But I agree with you that the weight of the board is much more noticeable than the bindings.
With boards though, the feel depends much more on how the weight is distributed alongside the board (reducing swingweight in the tips) and also how much pop you can get out of the board.
I remember when I got my Slash Paxson. When I first hit the slopes with it, I thought this was the lightest board I ever had.
Last season I got curious and weighted all my boards. I was really surprised. The slash wasnt really lighter than the others and all 6 boards I weighted were within a 75g-window!!
So if you put this in perspektive, a 200g difference per bidning is quite alot.


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

Rome Cleaver, M/L = 983g

These things are considerably stiffer than the Targas. Wow.


----------



## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

drblast said:


> Rome Cleaver, M/L = 983g
> 
> These things are considerably stiffer than the Targas. Wow.


I also noticed that when I hand flexed them. I’m curious if they break in and soften like the Katanas cos the highback is also very thin. Out of the box, they really feel like if the highback was a full carbon one (while it’s 30/70 carbon nylon).


----------



## Manicmouse (Apr 7, 2014)

fzst said:


> Comfort (shockabsorbtion) -> then response -> and then weight.
> 
> With todays bindings though, you can have all 3


It might be this:
*Durability* -> Comfort (shockabsorbtion) -> then response -> and then weight.

A couple of seasons ago my Union MC-Metafuses got a snapped heel cup and I got replacements under warranty with no fuss. Sometimes the tech is lighter, but more brittle in the cold...


----------



## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

Yeahti87 said:


> I also noticed that when I hand flexed them. I’m curious if they break in and soften like the Katanas cos the highback is also very thin. Out of the box, they really feel like if the highback was a full carbon one (while it’s 30/70 carbon nylon).


I don't get the feeling they're going to break in much, they really feel like full carbon to me too. I just strapped into them on a board in my living room and they're no joke. The base is stiff too. As long as they ride smooth I think I'll really like them. These Auxgrip straps feel even better than the Targa ones which were my previous favorites.

There's next to no info on the Cleavers out there but my first impression is that if you wanted a lighter, stiffer, even more comfortable Targa, here you go.


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

Manicmouse said:


> It might be this:
> *Durability* -> Comfort (shockabsorbtion) -> then response -> and then weight.
> 
> A couple of seasons ago my Union MC-Metafuses got a snapped heel cup and I got replacements under warranty with no fuss. Sometimes the tech is lighter, but more brittle in the cold...


Well, of course durability is a pretty big factor as well. It´s still not the most important one for me though; A binding that would last me for years but is uncomfortable as hell is not much use to me whereas a comfy one which only lasts maybe a season or two is...


----------



## ericliuhc (May 19, 2020)




----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

ericliuhc said:


> View attachment 154826
> View attachment 154827


Unions are light as hell!
I assume these are the large models? Did you already ride them? If so, how do you like them?


----------



## ericliuhc (May 19, 2020)

fzst said:


> Unions are light as hell!
> I assume these are the large models? Did you already ride them? If so, how do you like them?


They r size M. Still brand new in box due to COV. 😭😭


----------



## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

ericliuhc said:


> They r size M. Still brand new in box due to COV. 😭😭


Ok, well in that case the weight isn't even that impressive. Still very light but my Burton M reflex Bindings (Diode baseplate and Cartel highback + straps) are about the same weight.

I have a pair of Union contact pros M, which are just under 800g. I thought the falcors were even lighter. The Contact Pros are not really good bindings though - at least compared to Burtons imo. They are way too soft/unresponsive for my taste and still not as comfortable as stiffer Burton Bindings. The straps are too small and the baseplate doesn't feel as smooth as Burton re:flex or EST. I still would like to try the falcors, it seems like they would solve almost everything I don't like about the contact pros...


----------



## Board Doctor (Feb 1, 2018)

2022 Ride C-9 are seriously stout (medium without screws):
1085g with the Composite disk
1118g with the Aluminum disk

It’s not a mini disk and the base frame practically covers the width of this board. I kinda wonder if I could’ve squeezed into a small. The high back sliders allow angle adjustment up to about 15 degrees either way. They don’t appear to have a lot of padding (I thought they’d be more like the K2 Harsh Mellow), though there is some air space in the toe ramps. 

A Ride tech told me the C8,9 and 10 all used the same base frame. The 9 adds firmer straps (though the ladders are still fairly modest) and the 10 gets a carbon highback, which I didn’t want.

I think the Matte Black & Silver look good on the Maelstrom:










Total weight is 10.6 lbs, which coincidentally is exactly the same as my 148 Special Effects with Genesis X bindings.


----------



## Board Doctor (Feb 1, 2018)

21/22 Rome Cleaver M/L with hardware = 974g

(I hated the Ride C9)


----------



## Steven (2 mo ago)

Board Doctor said:


> 21/22 Rome Cleaver M/L with hardware = 974g
> 
> (I hated the Ride C9)


Got a couple days on the C8’s and I’m also considering alternatives. Pretty heavy and they don’t feel much more responsive than my Union STR’s.


----------



## Board Doctor (Feb 1, 2018)

Steven said:


> Got a couple days on the C8’s and I’m also considering alternatives. Pretty heavy and they don’t feel much more responsive than my Union STR’s.


I like the base a lot (even though it’s heavy), but the ankle strap is too low for me & the straps seriously suck. If they did something like the Rome pivot mount or the Bataleon kink ladder and added a modern strap, it’d be better.


----------



## Steven (2 mo ago)

Board Doctor said:


> I like the base a lot (even though it’s heavy), but the ankle strap is too low for me & the straps seriously suck. If they did something like the Rome pivot mount or the Bataleon kink ladder and added a modern strap, it’d be better.


Yep. They are damp and smooth, but require more effort in chopped up/demanding terrain. Maybe they’ll work better on a less aggressive board.


----------

