# Carving/freeride board?



## al99 (Oct 28, 2017)

What boards would y'all recommend for someone who is 5'10 145lbs and rides mostly around a resort, but does some off piste stuff as well? Looking for something that's great for high speeds and hard carving, but can handle some powder and tree runs. I don't really go into the park. I've been riding for 10 yrs, but never paid much attention to what was under my feet. Just recently had the "oh, duh!" moment where I realized that my noodly board might be limiting my carving abilities haha.

Thanks in advance!


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Burton Deep Thinker, Ride Alter Ego, Lago Open Road, Yes PYL, Lib Goldmember, Bataleon Camel Toe, Rome Blur.


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

If you were heavier, I would say the Never Summer Chairman. It holds an edge better than my trad camber boards (Burton T6 & Donek incline -which is a purpose built carving board). The Donek sinks like a submarine in powder (the T6 was "ok" but not great, but the Chairman wide floats better). Chairman wide is a bit slower edge to edge, but carves better due to no toe drag. At your weight, it might be a bit stiff, though. The thing about these CRC boards is once you get them on edge, they hold very well. I am no longer a fan of trad camber for deep powder. Some of the other profiles are interesting and the new Yes PYL does look nice, but I have not tried it.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

As deagol notes...crc for 6-16" pnw/maritime pow....but if high speed carving groomers stick with traditional camber...and for 16"+ pow...get a big/deep pow stick.


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

I used to believe in Trad camber only for carving, but no longer, I love the pop of trad camber, but CRC has more contact length when on hard edge- holds the G-forces better


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Nivek said:


> Burton Deep Thinker, Ride Alter Ego, Lago Open Road, Yes PYL, Lib Goldmember, Bataleon Camel Toe, Rome Blur.


I guess I'll elaborate.

Deep Thinker. Camber dominant with some early rise in the nose. Setback, tapered, and a bitchin sidecut. It floats and carves. 

Alter Ego. As Ride puts it, Groomers or Pow. Pick 2. I have one of these, it's one of my favorite carving decks and is super fun in deep snow. The Ride team either rides this or the Warpig in deep snow.

Open Road. The first day I rode this I was carving a bank slalom where there wasn't one. In fact it was through chop. It's tabered and early rise, in a 156 it's been my tree pow board.

Lib Goldmember. RC, so it floats. Stiff and a directional flex and Mag so it grips. Defintely not your quick snappy terms, it's more of a freeride board.

PYL. Tapered underbite is sick. Tapered floats, underbite grips. Camber grips. It's sick.

Camel Toe. TBT was initially created to turn. It's still really good for that and the Camel Toe ish shaped to float. 

Blur. It charges. And floats. Nothing super crazy in this one, it just charges, and floats.


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## poopresearch (Jan 2, 2016)

Nivek has given an excellent list. I would add the Burton Flight Attendant to it though.


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

Nivek said:


> I guess I'll elaborate.
> 
> 
> Blur. It charges. And floats. Nothing super crazy in this one, it just charges, and floats.


.
Like Nivek said the Rome Blur is a great board. The faster you go the better it gets.


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## robotfood99 (Mar 19, 2016)

deagol said:


> If you were heavier, I would say the Never Summer Chairman.



I think he would be fine on the 157? I am 150lbs and loved it. Could have gone with 160 but wanted it for a daily driver and it rips.


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

robotfood99 said:


> I think he would be fine on the 157? I am 150lbs and loved it. Could have gone with 160 but wanted it for a daily driver and it rips.


Yeah, I think so. I was just automatically thinking that the length I have was the shortest (which it is for the wide) but the normal width does go down to 157.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

deagol said:


> I used to believe in Trad camber only for carving, but no longer, I love the pop of trad camber, but* CRC has more contact length when on hard edge*- holds the G-forces better


No, board/camber profile has nothing to do with effective edge length.


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## GDimac (Nov 19, 2015)

SGboarder said:


> No, board/camber profile has nothing to do with effective edge length.


Pls elaborate? Been curious about this.


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## Clayton Bigsby (Oct 23, 2012)

Check out Korua Shapes website and their videos on their site,mtheir boards are build/designed for the type of riding you described.

I've been looking at the 163 Stealth. EVO is their state side carriers, they'll start receiving them on Nov 17th


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

SGboarder said:


> No, board/camber profile has nothing to do with effective edge length.


Yes, that may be true, but that's not what I am referring to. Within any edge length, there are areas of either low or high pressure. With the Ripsaw CRC profile, a higher percentage of the effective edge is higher pressure than Trad camber. With Trad Camber, you do have high pressure out towards the tip and tail, but not so much around the waist. CRC give it to you at Tip/tail and in between the bindings.


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## francium (Jan 12, 2013)

I'd say the Korua Tranny Finder would fit the bill.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

deagol said:


> Yes, that may be true, but that's not what I am referring to. Within any edge length, there are areas of either low or high pressure. With the Ripsaw CRC profile, a higher percentage of the effective edge is higher pressure than Trad camber. With Trad Camber, you do have high pressure out towards the tip and tail, but not so much around the waist. CRC give it to you at Tip/tail and in between the bindings.


I'd say it depends how you weight the board through the turn as well. You might be right across the whole effective edge there's more pressure distributed, but if you shift your weight more towards the tail at the end of a carve, I feel like the traditional camber tail contact points will hold much stronger than any CRC profile will. Board inclination comes into it as well, where I think at lower angles the ripsaw profile has really good edge hold, but the higher you tilt the board, the more that would shift to favouring a traditional camber profile as you fully decamber the board to engage the whole edge. 

Just thinking out loud there, but makes sense in my head.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

Phedder said:


> I'd say it depends how you weight the board through the turn as well. You might be right across the whole effective edge there's more pressure distributed, but if you shift your weight more towards the tail at the end of a carve, I feel like the traditional camber tail contact points will hold much stronger than any CRC profile will. Board inclination comes into it as well, where I think at lower angles the ripsaw profile has really good edge hold, but the higher you tilt the board, the more that would shift to favouring a traditional camber profile as you fully decamber the board to engage the whole edge.
> 
> Just thinking out loud there, but makes sense in my head.


Phedder is on to something. A crc you cant decamber as much because it's already decambered. Thus at low board inclination and lower speed you may have a more even pressure along the effective edge...but you don't have the increased dug-in pressure at the tips. Verses on a cambered you have an increased dug-in pressure at the tips and have the decambered middle additionally supporting the effective edge...therefore allowing more board inclination, higher speeds, better stability and deeper trenches. Thus you have better stability and pop coming out of a carve because you have the decambered tail still holding (presuming your weight is properly shifted aff/tail wise). I know when blasting groomers I get more speed, higher g's and stability from my 3 traditional cambers than with my 2 c2btx boards which tend to wash out at higher speeds. 

I do agree with deagol about the crc at lower speed for hotrodding and railing turns....

Perhaps we are talking about railing tight radius turn verses higher speed carves, e.g., surface to air verses icbm's.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

GDimac said:


> Pls elaborate? Been curious about this.


Effective edge length is determined by the shape of the board (looking at it straight from the top): It is the distance between the contact points. This distance does not change with the camber profile of the board if everything else is equal - a Custom/Custom X Flying V has exactly the same EE as the caber version, same for the Arbor Iguchi rocker and camber versions etc


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

deagol said:


> Yes, that may be true, but that's not what I am referring to. Within any edge length, there are areas of either low or high pressure. With the Ripsaw CRC profile, a higher percentage of the effective edge is higher pressure than Trad camber. With Trad Camber, you do have high pressure out towards the tip and tail, but not so much around the waist. CRC give it to you at Tip/tail and in between the bindings.


That is quite different from what you wrote before. And still misleading/not quite correct - with a CRC profile there are (potentially) more 'high pressure areas' BUT the 'average pressure' is of course lower than with camber (same force applied to larger area = less pressure).


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

wrathfuldeity said:


> Phedder is on to something. A crc you cant decamber as much because it's already decambered. Thus at low board inclination and lower speed you may have a more even pressure along the effective edge...but you don't have the increased dug-in pressure at the tips. Verses on a cambered you have an increased dug-in pressure at the tips and have the decambered middle additionally supporting the effective edge...therefore allowing more board inclination, higher speeds, better stability and deeper trenches. Thus you have better stability and pop coming out of a carve because you have the decambered tail still holding (presuming your weight is properly shifted aff/tail wise). I know when blasting groomers I get more speed, higher g's and stability from my 3 traditional cambers than with my 2 c2btx boards which tend to wash out at higher speeds.
> 
> I do agree with deagol about the crc at lower speed for hotrodding and railing turns....
> 
> Perhaps we are talking about railing tight radius turn verses higher speed carves, e.g., surface to air verses icbm's.


Together I think we make a bit of sense :happy:


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

From my experience, I get my Trad Camber board on edge at angles close to 60-90 (?) degrees. With the sidecut (don't know the sidecut radius off the top of my head) the areas near the tip & tail have good pressure into the snow, but my body weight is on the bindings, like a ball on a string being twirled around. There is the force wanting to disengage the edge as if the string broke. The pressure isn't great along the section of the edge between those points and the board flexes due to that force. I can feel the grip isn't great near my toes of heals in comparison the CRC at similar angles. I have boards that have almost identical effective edge lengths, but different profiles and can feel the grip difference. 

It's hard to describe, but I can demonstrate it when putting the board on edge on the floor: when the board goes up on edge- the middle rocker section comes "back down" to engage the surface where it doesn't with the trad camber. Board flex with g-forces would seem to undo this affect at speed, but I can't feel that happening. I think this might be something you have to feel first in order to believe it.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

deagol said:


> From my experience, I get my Trad Camber board on edge at angles close to 60-90 (?) degrees. With the sidecut (don't know the sidecut radius off the top of my head) the areas near the tip & tail have good pressure into the snow, but my body weight is on the bindings, like a ball on a string being twirled around. There is the force wanting to disengage the edge as if the string broke. The pressure isn't great along the section of the edge between those points and the board flexes due to that force. I can feel the grip isn't great near my toes of heals in comparison the CRC at similar angles. I have boards that have almost identical effective edge lengths, but different profiles and can feel the grip difference.


Many factors go into that and you're not comparing boards that are otherwise identical. For example the shaping of the contact points has a major effect on the 'grip'.



deagol said:


> It's hard to describe, but I can demonstrate it when putting the board on edge on the floor: when the board goes up on edge- the middle rocker section comes "back down" to engage the surface where it doesn't with the trad camber. Board flex with g-forces would seem to undo this affect at speed, but I can't feel that happening. I think this might be something you have to feel first in order to believe it.


You realize that the middle section 'coming down' reduces the pressure and grip at the nose and tail contact points?


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## fraxmental (Jun 25, 2011)

*would this be another good option?*

for the same purpose, charging and floating ,would Salomon super 8 and Rome Sawtooth fit in?
i look into changing my '12 ns legacy for one of this...at some point. It rides great, but feels like a tank somehow. i think i need a lighter board but still able to hold my 200+ pounds in high speeds turnings and powder..but there is chattering so..guess i'll see.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

fraxmental said:


> for the same purpose, charging and floating ,would Salomon super 8 and Rome Sawtooth fit in?
> i look into changing my '12 ns legacy for one of this...at some point. It rides great, but feels like a tank somehow. i think i need a lighter board but still able to hold my 200+ pounds in high speeds turnings and powder..but there is chattering so..guess i'll see.


What size Legacy were you on? 

For what you aim to ride, don't look for soft boards. Get a decent stiffness and length for your weight and speed.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

fraxmental said:


> for the same purpose, charging and floating ,would Salomon super 8 and Rome Sawtooth fit in?
> i look into changing my '12 ns legacy for one of this...at some point. It rides great, but feels like a tank somehow. i think i need a lighter board but still able to hold my 200+ pounds in high speeds turnings and powder..but there is chattering so..guess i'll see.


The Sawtooth should be noticeably more aggressive. I haven't ridden one, but I own a 163 Super 8 at 200lb. I love it, but I wouldn't describe it as a charger. Fantastic all mountain board though, it does carve well and great in the powder but the effective edge is a little short for it's length, the sawtooth should be able to carve harder/grip better on hard pack.

Sawtooth hands down for higher speeds and groomers, Super 8 hands down for powder and trees.


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## al99 (Oct 28, 2017)

Nivek said:


> Burton Deep Thinker, Ride Alter Ego, Lago Open Road, Yes PYL, Lib Goldmember, Bataleon Camel Toe, Rome Blur.


I'm intrigued by the Open Road, PYL, and Blur. How do they compare?

Thanks for the responses everyone!


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## SkullAndXbones (Feb 24, 2014)

my recommendations would be the burton flight attendant, rome mountain division, or gnu billy goat


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

al99 said:


> I'm intrigued by the Open Road, PYL, and Blur. How do they compare?
> 
> Thanks for the responses everyone!


Open Road is the most freestyle focused and the softest. It's like a mid flex park deck in a pow shape. The PYL is the most freeride with the most setback and stiffer flex. Tapered underbite is pretty rad. The board carves extremely well and is very calm at speeds. The Blur is more you classic all mountain freeride board. Charger but still lively.


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## htfu (Mar 18, 2015)

the bataleon the jam is not on your list, but it is a hard charger and pretty damn good pow board (if you shift your bindings back a bit). i had the 2011 in 164 and it was an animal that wanted to get pushed hard, it was stiff but you could really get a lot out of it ... just was not a lazy cruiser and tended to ride you if you weren't riding it.


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## motleybeast (Mar 25, 2015)

htfu said:


> the bataleon the jam is not on your list, but it is a hard charger and pretty damn good pow board (if you shift your bindings back a bit). i had the 2011 in 164 and it was an animal that wanted to get pushed hard, it was stiff but you could really get a lot out of it ... just was not a lazy cruiser and tended to ride you if you weren't riding it.


This is good to hear. One of our crew going to Japan in January has just bought one of these this year. He's only used it on hard packed so far, but he said its a bit of a weapon. He said, you could feel the stiffness of the board straight away, and he was certainly going pretty well on it. I didn't get a chance to ride it unfortunately.
We're not really aggressive riders, but we don't hang about either!


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## htfu (Mar 18, 2015)

i'm so tempted to get the 17/18 the jam, it just looks sooooooo good and my riot may have been on its last legs for a while now as the base does not hold wax for long (although i may give it one last base grind and see how it goes before retiring it to a display board).
@motleybeast get your buddy to post a review or if you get to ride it give us your impressions ... i'm interested to know how it goes in japan conditions.


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## motleybeast (Mar 25, 2015)

htfu said:


> i'm so tempted to get the 17/18 the jam, it just looks sooooooo good and my riot may have been on its last legs for a while now as the base does not hold wax for long (although i may give it one last base grind and see how it goes before retiring it to a display board).
> 
> @motleybeast get your buddy to post a review or if you get to ride it give us your impressions ... i'm interested to know how it goes in japan conditions.


Yes, definitely, I should get a chance to ride it, so I'll put a little review up. And I agree, it does look pretty good!


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## Jonny C (Mar 16, 2017)

Between the Deep Thinker and the Flight Attendant, what would you guys recommend?


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## QCMP (Aug 5, 2016)

Jonny C said:


> Between the Deep Thinker and the Flight Attendant, what would you guys recommend?


From what my friends said, testers, both boards might be great choices. Both boards might ride well in powder since Deep Thinker has setback and taper and Flight Attendant, well look at Christian Haller's film of last year, Glue.

If it was me, I'd go with the Deep Thinker but I think it is a surprising board. It's stiff for carving but not too stiff (not Custom X like) if you want to mess around.


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

SGboarder said:


> Many factors go into that and you're not comparing boards that are otherwise identical. For example the shaping of the contact points has a major effect on the 'grip'.
> 
> You realize that the middle section 'coming down' reduces the pressure and grip at the nose and tail contact points?


They are, aside from the profile & width, fairly similar:

CRC sidecut radius = 8.5 meters multi radius average 
TC sidecut radius = 9 meters multi radius average. 

CRC Effective edge = 127
TC Effective edge = 127

CRC waist = 26.6
TC waist = 24.5

CRC overall length = 161
TC overall length = 162


RE: the second point, the middle rocker section "coming down" (ie contacting the snow) just increases the overall edge hold. I am being specific to Ripsaw CRC profiles - not including original CRC- when I say they have excellent edge grip (better than TC from my experience). As far as these 2 boards (a carving specific Trad Camber) and the Chairman with Ripsaw CRC, the Chairman actually holds better. I was surprised, too. I've been a fan of TC boards for many years (and still am), but Ripsaw CRC is an eye opener.


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## fraxmental (Jun 25, 2011)

Phedder said:


> The Sawtooth should be noticeably more aggressive. I haven't ridden one, but I own a 163 Super 8 at 200lb. I love it, but I wouldn't describe it as a charger. Fantastic all mountain board though, it does carve well and great in the powder but the effective edge is a little short for it's length, the sawtooth should be able to carve harder/grip better on hard pack.
> 
> Sawtooth hands down for higher speeds and groomers, Super 8 hands down for powder and trees.





neni said:


> What size Legacy were you on?
> 
> For what you aim to ride, don't look for soft boards. Get a decent stiffness and length for your weight and speed.




it's been a while but..hey
it's a 163 size legacy, and i am looking for stiffer boards, so i'm thinking if super 8 163 will feel stiffer or not than mine. Or i could just go with a stiff sawtooth and use mine for the rest. anyway thanks for the reply


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## buddhafist24 (Dec 31, 2008)

Nivek said:


> I guess I'll elaborate.
> 
> Deep Thinker. Camber dominant with some early rise in the nose. Setback, tapered, and a bitchin sidecut. It floats and carves.
> 
> ...



Bought the Mercury last year. Do you think I'd notice much of a difference between the Mercury vs Alter Ego vs Open Road?

Like the OP, looking for carver, not into the park.


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Absolutely. The Ego feel is unique. And the Open Road is softer and tapered. For straight carving I grab my Ego more than my Open Road.


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## buddhafist24 (Dec 31, 2008)

Picked up a '16 Ego for $320 in 162. 

I'm at the top of the weight range, 190, 5'11, size 10 boots. Will I be good?

From your reviews, it doesn't seem like anything has changed since '16.


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

At 150lbs I ride the 59. You'll be good.

The only difference has been for this years, the wood topsheets damped the board a little.


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