# Alternative for Burton Flight Attendant



## Marc Nio (Jan 30, 2018)

I like my Burton 156 FA a lot. I’m 1,68, 68kg. Intermediate advanced, Ion boa Eu 40,5, Cartel Est. 1-2 weeks/year St Anton, Hinterglemm, the Alps, Austria.
Does exactly what I like!
Groomers, boarding fast, turning and carving, off piste but nothing extreme, no parkriding, no tricks at all.
The only disadvantage: no grip on ice... the first morning groomers are no much fun if the snow is nof fresh. After 1 or 2 runs it gets better, the rest of the day, perfect... except on icey patches...

What would be the solution?
Prepare the edges differently?
Alternative Burton board/other brand (EST bindings!)? ‘It should ride ‘exactly’ as my FA’, I would just love better grip on ice... (I had a Custom X before... less fun, less forgiving, too agressive for me, not that good in powder at all, not comfortable at the end of the day on groomers)?


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

Sharpen the edges.

Or get a Gnu Mullair.


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

I had similar experience on ice/frozen groomers on that board. Use the custom x in the morning and FA in afternoon


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## SlvrDragon50 (Mar 25, 2017)

If you want a board taht will ride exactly like your FA, I feel like the only option is to keep the FA and sharpen the edges. Otherwise, any other board you're going to get will ride differently especially if you limit yourself to EST. Not too many companies out there are using the Channel. Maybe give the Deep Thinker a try.


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

I've been wanting to ask what people consider to be ice? And what kind of edge hold do you expect to get on ice?


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## LALUNE (Feb 23, 2017)

For those who want to grip on ice, here is a video:


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

Snowdaddy said:


> I've been wanting to ask what people consider to be ice? And what kind of edge hold do you expect to get on ice?


This is an interesting question. Last week I complained mightily about the ice situation on Whistler that particular morning. You know the feeling, like you're riding on fine sandpaper, especially when you edge. You don't really dig into the snow, you kind of scrape a layer off. The best metaphor I can think of is scraping your windshield in the morning after a particularly thick frost.

But that's not the worst you can have. A couple of weeks ago, going down Lower Fantastic, I took a little side shoot to the right, and discovered REAL ice. I mean the kind that's semi-transparent. No crystals. You could break it up and put it in your drink. I avoided that little side shoot after that.

Then of course there's the compressed and polished surface you get on the cat track leading down to the bottom of the lift, where everyone has been flatbasing. It's not technically ice, but it's like one step down.

I was on my Yes PYL on that first example, and I basically did very conservative scarving curves all the way down, moderate speed. I think the difference between handling that kind of ice and not handling it is essentially whether your board slides out from under you and you do a slam.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

SlvrDragon50 said:


> If you want a board taht will ride exactly like your FA, I feel like the only option is to keep the FA and sharpen the edges. Otherwise, any other board you're going to get will ride differently especially if you limit yourself to EST. Not too many companies out there are using the Channel. Maybe give the Deep Thinker a try.


Not really.
A lot of boards are very similar to the Flight Attendant. And the one thing that makes it feel like it does has nothing to do with the channel.

Boards like Mullair, Pick your Line, Deep Thinker, Lago Double Barrel? etc etc etc will feel very similar.

The problem is...... none of this will make much difference on ice. For ice you need camber, and sharp edges. And to lower your expectations....


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## SlvrDragon50 (Mar 25, 2017)

F1EA said:


> Not really.
> A lot of boards are very similar to the Flight Attendant. And the one thing that makes it feel like it does has nothing to do with the channel.
> 
> Boards like Mullair, Pick your Line, Deep Thinker, Lago Double Barrel? etc etc etc will feel very similar.
> ...


Well, notice how he emphasized exactly. Not similarly. He has an extremely specific ask. Again, all those have screw bindings, not channel.

If he's willing to accept a different ride then options open up a bit, but I agree it comes down to lowering expectations.


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

F1EA said:


> For ice you need ... to lower your expectations....


Basically this.

I think the FA is a bit overrated, but it is mostly camber and not a noodle. 

If you want that shape(ish) and something different that may or may not do better on ice for you, Rome Ravine, Lago Open Road, Lib Ejack, Arbor Clovis or Guch, Burton Speed Date.


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

LALUNE said:


> For those who want to grip on ice, here is a video:
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjfh9F9eT34




So now that I own Xavier’s board and watched his video, I’m ready to bomb ice in the alps.......


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## Marc Nio (Jan 30, 2018)

Nice youtube video but that’s not my kind of ice ?. 

I mean those hard morning groomers, still frozen, hardly used. Or very very hard packed snow. That gets better once more people have used it, because everybody scrapes off soms snow/ice from that hard toplayer. I ‘scan’ those hard groomers for those patches with scraped off loose snow, because that’s were the grip/edgehold is better.

And aboute an alternative bosrd: it doesn't have to ride ‘exactly exactly’’ as the FA, ‘almost exactly/very similar’ will do.
I had the Mullair in mind as wel.

But ‘sharpening the edges’... I guess that will be a custom job that needs to be done by somebody who is used to tune snowboard edges? Not a standard machinary job? It’s more than ‘just standard sharpening’ I guess?


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## taco tuesday (Jul 26, 2014)

You want more edge hold? Get more edge.


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

Marc Nio said:


> Nice youtube video but that’s not my kind of ice ?.
> 
> I mean those hard morning groomers, still frozen, hardly used. Or very very hard packed snow. That gets better once more people have used it, because everybody scrapes off soms snow/ice from that hard toplayer. I ‘scan’ those hard groomers for those patches with scraped off loose snow, because that’s were the grip/edgehold is better.
> 
> ...


Get a file guide. Do a few rounds at 90 degrees with the file, or adjust if you know what it's at originally. Then use a ceramic stone to polish it. Done, and tons of new grip.


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## MrDavey2Shoes (Mar 5, 2018)

taco tuesday said:


> You want more edge hold? Get more edge.


Yup!
Also aim your carves down the hill opposed to across it. S carves rule the day on ice. Save those sscchhheeeeeet C carves for snow.


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

Sharpening the edges can be done with a $20 hand file and guide.

The trick is to do a little bit of sharpening every time and not let the edge get dull or else it requires a lot more effort. Gummy stone and quick edge touch up whenever you wax/ride keeps those edges in tip-top shape.

Magnetraction does help a bit on hard/icy conditions too, but it's more difficult to sharpen. One of the nice things about boards that are just camber with flat edges is that sharpening is quick and easy and they have excellent edge hold.


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

taco tuesday said:


> You want more edge hold? Get more edge.


I rode my new Doughboy Shredder on Sunday. And yes, yes this is true, couldn't agree more.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

Scalpelman said:


> So now that I own Xavier’s board and watched his video, I’m ready to bomb ice in the alps.......


I think it might be safer to jump out off a plane without a parachute???


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

Signal yup might not be a bad fit for something more camber heavy.


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## taco tuesday (Jul 26, 2014)

ridethecliche said:


> Signal yup might not be a bad fit for something more camber heavy.


Isn't the Yup very similar to the Branch Manager? I rode the Branch Manager and Gate Keeper back to back at a demo a few years ago. The Branch Manager was like a washy noodle compared to the Gate Keeper. I've heard that the Gate Keeper is maybe a bit softer than the flight attendant. 

If the Yup rides anything like the Branch Manager I can't see how that would be the answer. Looks like it would have a somewhat short EE. Is it stiffer with more camber?


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

taco tuesday said:


> You want more edge hold? Get more edge.





MrDavey2Shoes said:


> Yup!
> Also aim your carves down the hill opposed to across it. S carves rule the day on ice. Save those sscchhheeeeeet C carves for snow.





drblast said:


> Sharpening the edges can be done with a $20 hand file and guide.
> 
> The trick is to do a little bit of sharpening every time and not let the edge get dull or else it requires a lot more effort. Gummy stone and quick edge touch up whenever you wax/ride keeps those edges in tip-top shape.


The three pillars of riding ice.


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## LALUNE (Feb 23, 2017)

Scalpelman said:


> So now that I own Xavier’s board and watched his video, I’m ready to bomb ice in the alps.......


I guess the main takeaway of this videos is: If it's ice, you don't set edge and just go straight to pass it. I am tried of people telling me to how you can "carve" on "ice".

If it's just firm hard pack that's edgeable, you carve through it.


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

LALUNE said:


> I guess the main takeaway of this videos is: If it's ice, you don't set edge and just go straight to pass it. I am tried of people telling me to how you can "carve" on "ice".
> 
> 
> 
> If it's just firm hard pack that's edgeable, you carve through it.




Pretty much. But doesn’t take long to learn it. Ice-turn-eat shit reinforces quickly. Need to look much farther ahead. Look for patches of Hawaiian shave ice and turn there.


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## benjinyc (Feb 24, 2017)

Marc Nio said:


> Groomers, boarding fast, turning and carving, off piste but nothing extreme, no parkriding, no tricks at all.


if you're not doing parks, and just want to rail carves… consider beveling your edges from default 90 degrees to something like 88, you'll get better grip

http://snomie.com/snowboards-edges-bevel-sharpen/


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

benjinyc said:


> Marc Nio said:
> 
> 
> > Groomers, boarding fast, turning and carving, off piste but nothing extreme, no parkriding, no tricks at all.
> ...


Wut? No. Backwards.


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