# split bindings



## Justin

So I have been looking into bindings for my split next season and saw that karakoram has a lock down function now.

Is this a must? I have talked to some guys that say it would be really nice to have. I was looking at spark but is this a game changer?


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## killclimbz

It's kind of nice. I checked it out at SIA. I will give Bryce and the Karakorum guys credit. It's pretty ingenious in it's simplicity with how their system works. 

That said, the Spark Edison, which should come out around the beginning of next year, really looks to up the game. Lighter, easy set up, in other words simple. Out of everything I played with at SIA, this is what stood out of everything I saw. Of course I have no on snow experience with either system, but if the Edison delivers half of it's promise. I'll go with that. Don't be surprised if Will at Spark, comes up with a lock down for us by the end of the season. Even their regular split bindings that work with the Voile System are super nice. They have been in the game for quite a few years longer than Karakorum, and it's starting to show. They have a very well polished line up these days.


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## ShredLife

from the K website: " The purpose of the heel lock down is to allow splitboarders to skate more efficiently on flat terrain, and traverse and side step without skins on in tour mode."

IMHO this is completely retarded. you will never do any of this. 

we have long flat slogs in out here and i have never wished my heel was locked for it. tour mode without skins on?? it will never happen.


K's are great im sure - they havent been on snow as long as Sparks so there has been a few instances of design flaws over the last year, but they will continue to tweak them 

you can't go wrong with either, but sparks is without a doubt more proven and a simpler system. 

heel lock sounds pointless to me. 


- splitting since '03ish


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## killclimbz

The heel lock down will be nicer for those who know how to down hill ski. I can only think of one maybe two spots where I would even consider this feature as being something I might want.


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## ShredLife

shit if you wanna ski the only way to do it with any style at all is to be an accomplished tele skier. 

IMHO its a solution to a problem that simply does not exist and the Ks are wasting time that they could use to make their system less prone to icing and the bending of the mounting plates - both of which are real, documented, and in some cases serious problems. 


the more i write the more i convince myself that you (OP) should just go get some sparks - especially if you're new to splitting, especially if this is your only splitboard. 


Killz - edison by this fall you think? i heard it wouldnt be ready for the start of next season - presumably because sparks actually torture test their shit with real dirtbag splitters for at least a year before the public gets to get to it...

or you meant next calendar year?


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## Justin

thanks for the info guys. 

Is it worth it to get next years sparks or are this years fine? i think i saw a video with a quick release function.


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## lernr

Come on, tele isn't the only way to ski with style

I would like a simple heel lock-down mechanism that can be engaged and disengaged without much contortions. I've been in a few situations where it could be useful. Not a showstopper, though.

Current binders from Spark are great, can't go wrong with them. Next year the Edison should be even better, but for now I plan to continue using what I have. We'll see next year.


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## ShredLife

lernr said:


> Come on, tele isn't the only way to ski with style
> 
> I would like a simple heel lock-down mechanism that can be engaged and disengaged without much contortions. I've been in a few situations where it could be useful. Not a showstopper, though.
> 
> Current binders from Spark are great, can't go wrong with them. Next year the Edison should be even better, but for now I plan to continue using what I have. We'll see next year.


haha hey fellow NS-splitter - i didn't realize you were on this site too 

i KIND OF made that comment tongue in cheek. sarcasm doesn't work too good on teh interwebz sometimes... 

but sorta seriously when i see someone really ripping aggressively on tele skis it just makes downhill look almost pussy. 


if you truly wanna ski with style ride a fucking snowboard :cheeky4:


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## lernr

lol - agreed, I have lots of respect for tele! 

Bottom line: current Sparks work great, Edison would be available next year and will cost much more. If you want to ride now or early next season, and you want to limit spend - get the current ones. They are more than fine - they are pretty great


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## Justin

ok thx for the info, there are some on tactics so i will see if they go on sale. if they don't maybe i will see what the new ones cost. got all summer to save up lol.


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## legallyillegal

might as well just go full time skier and rollerblade if you tele


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## Justin

is the LT binding that much better then the standard binding or will i just not really even notice it?


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## ShredLife

the bindings themselves are identical, the "LT" is the lightweight touring bracket. you want it for sure. it is a far more solid, durable, and stronger connection to the board when in touring mode. it does make a difference.


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## Justin

awesome thx. i will get those ones then.


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## Justin

just looking at a second pair of gloves, should i go with a pair of warm mitts or just buy liners and a pair of gloves? i am generally not cold. 

what do you guys do for splitting?


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## lernr

Lately I've been using the Arcteryx Alpha SV glove, mostly just the outer gtx shell without the liner (the liner is nice, but skinning up I run hot and going down I don't need as much hand warmth in the PNW. The glove is versatile enough to do rope work. This glove is not warm enough for really cold weather.

Previously I used a modular system by OR - gtx mitt shell without any padding / insulation, and then fleece mitt liner and / or wool glove liners of different thickness, as needed. Worked great for our wettish weather but mitts are not as good for knots and such.

I tried Black Diamond Pursuit gloves - great dexterity and breathable shell but got soaked in our spring conditions, so I'm not a fan and wouldn't recommend for splitting.

Kyle Miller splits with 2 pairs, the Petzl belay glove for skinning up, and another set of gloves but I don't remember what.


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## Justin

Awesome, thx for all the help guys.


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## t.e.r.j.e

ShredLife said:


> the bindings themselves are identical, the "LT" is the lightweight touring bracket. you want it for sure. it is a far more solid, durable, and stronger connection to the board when in touring mode. it does make a difference.


More solid? I've experienced that a LT pin brake during riding, be sure to bring a replacement with you...


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## ShredLife

if you don't have a replacement pin in your backpack when you're in the BC then you're a fool - that goes for steel the same as aluminum. i am 100% sure that sparks will replace that broken one.

but yes, without a doubt - even with that failure the LT system is way more solid than the voile brackets. the voile brackets have so much wiggle and play to them that they end up cutting a notch into the pins, and i'm sure the failure rate is just as high or higher with steel compared to aluminum. 

if you were scared about your fat ass breaking a pin i guess you could always use steel pins with the LT bracket, although they say not to. regardless, carry a spare pin is pretty much as basic as carry water.


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## ShredLife

just to add, if that broke on the downhill - in ride mode - it's probably your fault for not having it seated/tucked in properly. it wouldn't just snap in half like that unless something was trying to bend it.


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## Justin

thx for the info. i was def going to buy some extra components with the bindings, looks like there is a spare kit, i will have to make sure there are pins in there.


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## Justin

just wondering what you guys do for boot size with split boarding. i wear a very small boot for my feet when i ride, salomon 12.5 wide (either dialogue or synapse)but if im not riding then my toes will hit the front of the boot and sometimes get cold/numb (i wear a 14 shoe, a 13.5 makes my toes bleed when i play basketball).

Do you wear something true to size or will i be fine in my current boot?


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## killclimbz

You do have a big foot. I am not sure what to tell you. I will say that you are on your feet skinning for hours versus minutes for riding. So you will be on your feet hiking for the most part. 

For myself, I value comfort of my boots more than I value a tight assed fit. So I run pretty true to size. Fortunately, for most boots my size (11) works great for me. On occasion I have gone down a half size due to something like heel lift. 

Just keep in mind you spend the majority of your time skinning, not riding. Nature of the beast. The time you do ride will be the best turns you've ever had. Time after time after time...


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## killclimbz

Spark runs L sizes. Keep in mind that current Spark's do not replace the Voile system. They just work with it, lightening your load a ton and making for much superior binding performance. Of course foot size could play a role if the bindings don't fit. Overall though a split specific binder is way better than using the plate your own binding combo. It's an amazing difference. As far as upgrade goes, it seems to run from smallest to biggest upgrade in downhill performance, Voile Lightrail, Spark, Karakorum. I am omitting the Spark Newton, as it looks like it will offer the same if not better performance than Karakorum, but it's not out yet. I haven't used it, so it remains to be seen. I will say that from what I saw, it looked like a pretty solid design. I am excited to try it. 

So you may be right, that adapter plates and his own binding are the way to go. I would make dang sure that none of the split specific bindings are going to work first. It is that big of a change.


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## lernr

If the boots fit at all, your toes are not likely to hit the front of the boots when you are skinning up because your weight is on the heel / back. 

Still, I'd go for a comfy boot for the bc. Much easier to manage a problem boot at a resort, where you can relax on the lift or in the lodge...


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## Justin

thanks for the info guys, i think i found a shop near me that sells some spark stuff, now its just a matter if they have it in stock and if they have boots in the right sizes to try with it.


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## AdamBQ

Quick question just to be clear.

The spark bindings will just slide directly onto the voile pucks on the split where their binding plate normally would right? I dont need anything extra?


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## ETM

Thats right. They completely eliminate the steel plate in the voile kit


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## walove

12.5 boots will work in large sparks, they have quite a bit of adjustment in the heelcup. i have size tens and use mediums. If your splurging for sparks might as well get the LT touring brackets too.


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## wrathfuldeity

Initially setting up the Sparks, so after a few outings this winter to get everything dialed and tweaked, I plan on going back through with loctite or something to lock everything down. Any drawbacks or warnings not to do this?


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## Justin

What if you buy different boots?


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## DrnknZag

Justin said:


> What if you buy different boots?


That's why you buy the blue loctite.


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## walove

blue loctite is what comes on the hardware from spark, nothing wrong with using it. Just a generals heads up, loctite will eat some plastics, not a lot of plastic on sparks though.


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## Justin

So i bought my bindings and am looking to round out my back country kit. I am thinking of adding 
Spark R&D Backcountry Kit - Snowboard Shop > Snow Accessories > Splitboard Accessories

i have taken the first course and have all the standard saftey gear, what else would you guys recommend making part of my kit?


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## killclimbz

The Spare Parts are not a bad thing to have. Add at least four Voile straps to your kit if you don't have them already. The 24" length is best. I've used them from keeping a boot tight, to making a binding work, to attaching a skin, and an ad hoc fix for a broken sternum strap on a back pack. They are just handy to have. Duct tape is another good thing. Wrap it around one of both of your ski poles. 

You should also probably carry some sort of First Aid Kit.


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## Justin

First aid kit i have. I will look into the straps and i was considering ducktape so i will add that as well. Thanks for the advice.


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## ShredLife

a few zip ties, a little bit of bailing wire, 10-20ft of 550 paracord, lighter(s), multi-tool...


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## Justin

ShredLife said:


> a few zip ties, a little bit of bailing wire, 10-20ft of 550 paracord, lighter(s), multi-tool...


Thx, i will look into that stuff.


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## Justin

Snowolf said:


> If going into real back country where you are going to be isolated, a personal locator beacon such as Spot or ACR is a good thing to have. I have the ACR Terrafix and carry it in the backcountry both winter and summer.


I have never heard of that, i will do some checking into it.


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## Justin

im canadian so does that matter? not sure the usa gov cares about me

wait im not sure the care about YOU

(let the snowolf rant ensue!)


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## killclimbz

Some of the PLB's have an international response. So it doesn't matter where you are at. Keep in mind though, you only turn it on when you need a rescue. We had a guy at Berthoud Pass that skied there without any avy gear and such. A well meaning friend bought him a PLB saying it was to help keep him safe from Avalanches. Dumbass thought it was an avy beacon and turned it on every time he went skiing on the pass. Which of course caused S&R to scramble. He was gone by the time they got there. This went on for about a month, until he forgot to turn it off one day. They showed up at his house and pointed out what a dumbass he was...


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## Justin

AAAAAAAAAHHHHHHhahahahhahahahaha that is awesome


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## ShredLife

killclimbz said:


> Some of the PLB's have an international response. So it doesn't matter where you are at. Keep in mind though, you only turn it on when you need a rescue. We had a guy at Berthoud Pass that skied there without any avy gear and such. A well meaning friend bought him a PLB saying it was to help keep him safe from Avalanches. Dumbass thought it was an avy beacon and turned it on every time he went skiing on the pass. Which of course caused S&R to scramble. He was gone by the time they got there. This went on for about a month, until he forgot to turn it off one day. They showed up at his house and pointed out what a dumbass he was...


hooooly shit. 


did he get a bill?


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## killclimbz

Nope, but he was a super dumbass. I found the article about it on the Denver Post here.

This actually went on longer and far more ranging than I thought. Two years. He used it in Crested Butte and many other places. I can't believe what an idiot he is though.


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## snowklinger

killclimbz said:


> Nope, but he was a super dumbass. I found the article about it on the Denver Post here.
> 
> This actually went on longer and far more ranging than I thought. Two years. He used it in Crested Butte and many other places. I can't believe what an idiot he is though.


Talk about being shamed. Is the BC community here in CO big enough to give him anonymity to hide? Just curious about the culture, I wonder if he had to return to the resorts or find somewhere else to go.


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## killclimbz

This guy has nothing to do with the BC community aside from going into the BC. I'm kind of surprised he wasn't an accident report actually. Although there are a ton of people out there without any knowledge or equipment in the backcountry. Generally speaking easy to hike out to spots. Rarely see someone on a big tour. They don't really interact much with the people who know what is up. I try to hand them a FOBP card and encourage them to look into education. That is about it.


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## ShredLife

there is just soooo much wrong with that. in reality all of his bc partners are complicit - do they not do function tests before they step into the skin track??

do they not practice with their shit? ever?

if i was on S&R i'd be pushing hard for a lawsuit - to recover time and money spent chasing this idiot's signal, and to send a message to fools who cry wolf - intentional or not.

abject stupidity must be punished.


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## killclimbz

Shred, I have no idea who his partners where if any. It kind of sounds like he was a solo act. If he did have partners, they were also not versed in backcountry safety at all. I agree that there should have been some penalties here. Stupid doesn't shield you from consequence.


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## Justin

ya don't worry if i get one i won't use it instead of my transceiver lol


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## hikeswithdogs

killclimbz said:


> Nope, but he was a super dumbass. I found the article about it on the Denver Post here.
> 
> This actually went on longer and far more ranging than I thought. Two years. He used it in Crested Butte and many other places. I can't believe what an idiot he is though.


Oh man this guys should spend every weekend for the next 10 years volunteering to help local S&R teams do whatever they ask him to do...wax skis, pickup trash, make coffee, feed and cleanup after dogs, buy beer.........


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## linvillegorge

Justin said:


> im canadian so does that matter? not sure the usa gov cares about me
> 
> wait im not sure the care about YOU
> 
> (let the snowolf rant ensue!)


Meanwhile, in Canada...


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## Justin

linvillegorge said:


> Meanwhile, in Canada...


lol i still like that commercial and its been out for a few years now. 

its for winter tires but it always makes me smile. in the beginning of the shot they are all sitting in their cars just spinning the tires.


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## Justin

awesome, thanks a lot for all that info. I will look into it.


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## Justin

I have the LT set up and MR chomps, do i need to put those plastic lifters under the brackets or is that only with the volie brackets?


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