# Goggle Issues - help :(



## EastCoastChris (Feb 24, 2013)

So...packing my bag tonight for opening weekend (ohhhh yeahhh) I stuck every pair of goggles in my bag and realized they are all gonna suck on that first bluebird day. 

I've tried it seems like every lense color and can't find one that works for me. Though admittedly I am not using high end goggles and that may be my problem. The only way I can really see is with totally clear goggles. But on a bluebird day - obviously snow glare gets me too. But the second I put on yellow, amber or rose - boom shadows. Feel VERY blind. If I get in a shady spot on a trail... forget it. On an even mildly overcast day I am fine with the clear goggles. 

I have really good eye sight but I am a little blue/green color blind but that shouldnt affect yellow or rose lenses, no? (and when I say a little bit I mean I work with spreadsheets a lot and on occasion I have misinterpreted a graph on a quick look. If I really study something I can usually pick up color variations.) With the goggles on snow I am not sure what my problem is. Cept maybe the Dragon EG2s that I got for $30. Is there a pair you can recommend me that may have a yellow or rose tint but a very, very, very gentle one? 

Also...if I explain my problem to a board shop would they let me take a short run with a "good" (ie expensive) pair? The last ones I bought were fine in the parking lot. On an actual run near actual trees...not so much. Or is that a stupid thing to ask?


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

Only thing I would suggest is to use different colors see if anything works better for you. From my experience most of these colors follow a standard that doesn't deviate much on the price of goggle. Expensive goggles include other features like "made this year", spherical, etc.

Luckily there are alot of bluebird lense choices:

red
green
blue
gray/black
polarized (generally agreed bad on snow but maybe work for you)

Have u tried orange? May be the ticket.


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## EastCoastChris (Feb 24, 2013)

I don't believe I tried orange. I've tried a couple different between yellow and amber though. 

Maybe blue? I can always try blue. According to a guide i read there is some numerical measurement of how much light is filtered (or gets through - can't remember which.) But its never featured when you look to buy goggles there's nothing like that in the specs. but I am not sure it works that way anyway. 

Like I was looking at these by Giro and from the picture they LOOK like they are mostly clear with a small amount of tint.

http://www.evo.com/goggles/giro-ons...ck-icon-persimmon-boost-front.jpg&select=true

Which may be exactly what I am looking for for bluebird days. But like I said I may be an idiot and it just looks like that in the picture. And goggles dont really work that way. 

But I have like 5 pair of goggles now in the $30-60 range and hate all of them and only wear the clear ones. Which are like cheapo Smith's (the only ones I could find at my local shop and freeze and fog anyway but are still the least of all bad options for me.)

It really crushes my confidence though on days when everyone else is having a great time 
Maybe I am just getting old.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

Yea maybe. I'm picky about goggles myself. I roll with 6 pairs in my bag too.


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

If you are colorblind along the blue/green end of the spectrum? It may be next to impossible to get a lens to correct this. I could well be wrong but thinking along the lines of B&W photography. Different colored lenses are used to create and/or increase contrast along certain colors. 

In the case of blues it is usually reds & yellows. These colors increase the contrast of blues which is what is being effected in the shaded snow. Snow in shade picks up a blue hue reflected indirectly from the sky. A red or yellow lens (...at least in B&W photography) would cause an increased contrast in that blue tint. 

If You are blind to that hue,..? Maybe you cannot see any increased contrast. You might try asking an ophthalmologist if they would know of a tint or color lens that would work for you under those circumstances. 

Again, this is only a guess on my part based on my own experience as a photographer. Film and a persons eyes don't necessarily react the same. But it's worth asking about. A red lens would cause the most increase in contrast with blue light. Yellow, much less intense but still an increase. If you find a red lens to be worse for you than a yellow one in those conditions? I may be on the right track here. If so, definitely check with professional eyecare specialist to see if there is an alternative. 

Hope that help some. :thumbsup:
(...nobody believes it's me without an emoticon!) :hairy:


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## SkullAndXbones (Feb 24, 2014)

bring your goggles to a shop and try on a higher end pair and look at everything around you to see if you can get better contrast. look at the lights on the ceiling and look outside out of the window (if the shop has a window). or you could just tell the shop your predicament and ask if you can take the goggles outside and look around, see if things look better. i think most small/privately owned shops would be cool with you going outside for a second. and also, if clear works ok for you then you could always try a grey lens. grey lenses don't have any color distortion.


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## vice87 (Oct 24, 2014)

SkullAndXbones said:


> bring your goggles to a shop and try on a higher end pair and look at everything around you. you could just tell the shop your predicament and ask if you can take the goggles outside and look around, see if things look better. i think most small/privately owned shops would be cool with you going outside for a second. and also, if clear works ok for you then you could always try a grey lens. grey lenses don't have any color distortion.


that's what I did. made a couple trips on different light days, brought my helmet just in case and went through every lens color in different stores. I've been lucky to live in places where there is also snow on the ground, to get a good idea of the glare to expect on the hill.

color blindness def throws it off though. even more reason to suggest the above. good luck and rock opening weekend!


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

For Bluebird conditions, nothin will beat a Grey Lens, and especially a Polarised one when it gets glary!!!!!

And you really do get what you pay for when it comes to Optics!!!!! 

If you have the dollars, Photocromatic are the go!!!!!


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

Mizu Kuma said:


> *For Bluebird conditions, nothin will beat a Grey Lens, and especially a Polarised one when it gets glary!!!!!*
> 
> And you really do get what you pay for when it comes to Optics!!!!!
> 
> If you have the dollars, Photocromatic are the go!!!!!


doable, but you are in the minority there


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## EastCoastChris (Feb 24, 2013)

Oh man...good info on the red/yellow lenses. I always tried red/yellow lenses because they are always recommended for cloudy days. So I assumed they were the least "shady" and would work for me on a bluebird day.

Dag...yeah I am starting to wonder if a lens correction is even possible. I can totally try the grey and blue ones - maybe up at the mountain shop. I will explain my predicament and try to "demo" them outdoors. To be able to see I will totally spend the money.


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## Kevin137 (May 5, 2013)

What can i add...

TRY PINK...  I love my pink lens...! Its awesome... I am also colourblind, but never think of it, just change goggles or lens to whatever is best in those conditions, have 4 Oakley Crowbar and then 1 set of Airwaves with every available lens, and my goto if nothing else works is PINK in my crowbar...


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## racer357 (Feb 3, 2011)

the new Oakley Rose prism might be worth a look. Its pink when looking through it.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

My son is color blind. some days its worse than others oddly enough but its mostly blue/green type, some days he has a hard time with all colors so I think it is getting worse with age.... 

Anyhow, his favorite low light lenses are orange. His favorite full sun goggles(and anything in between) are blue with blue chrome or bronze with purple chrome. We probably have 20 different lenses laying around from clear to fire iridium/black. Fortunately we both wear EG2 so we can swap lenses or I can use his as he finds they don't work. Now after a few years of testing, he sticks with those three......


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

Try a medium dark polarized lens.


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## Duffman (Nov 22, 2014)

+1 for blue lenses, they work well in weird lighting. Going from really bright to completely shaded areas is what always got me. Got some smith blue sensor mirror and they worked really well. They have a higher visual light transmission, but I have never had a problem with it being too bright even on the sunniest of tahoe days


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## jtg (Dec 11, 2012)

You can't go by color at all, it's completely meaningless. You have to look at the lens specs, which are unique to each manufacturer.

For example, Anon has "blue cobalt" which is 6% VLT, meaning you will be blind in anything other than bright sunlight, and Smith has "Blue Sensor Mirror" which is 70% VLT and terrible in bright sunlight, perfect in overcast. EG2 has "blue" which is 55% VLT.


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## t21 (Dec 29, 2010)

i'm color blind myself like you. i have the Smith IOX blue sensor mirror and it works well on bluebird days out on the open until i get to shaded(trees) area. I use the green sensor that came with the package mostly because i could deal with the brigthness on bluebird days, and it works well on shaded area. Hope that you find what would work for you so you can enjoy your opening weekend.


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

jtg said:


> You can't go by color at all, it's completely meaningless. You have to look at the lens specs, which are unique to each manufacturer.
> 
> For example, Anon has "blue cobalt" which is 6% VLT, meaning you will be blind in anything other than bright sunlight, and Smith has "Blue Sensor Mirror" which is 70% VLT and terrible in bright sunlight, perfect in overcast. EG2 has "blue" which is 55% VLT.


That's a great point and I took his profile picture in to consideration, that's the only reason I responded to this thread, that and the colorblind thing.... He has electric goggles on in his picture. 

Also, when.people are colorblind they see everything differently than regular sighted people. Color is not a role player in the texture of the environment. My son is a great hunter since camouflage of animals doesn't hide them from him. However, the colors in the environment that he can't see are helped with particular shades of lens.... it doesn't matter how dark they make it or not, the color still makes all the difference. when grey and white normally look the same, you put a shade of color on it and the difference is recognized by him and it gives the slope contours where it wasn't before. It's just more noticeable to CB people....


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

Argo said:


> ... the colors in the environment that he can't see are helped with particular shades of lens.... it doesn't matter how dark they make it or not, the color still makes all the difference. *when grey and white normally look the same, you put a shade of color on it and the difference is recognized by him and it gives the slope contours where it wasn't before. *It's just more noticeable to CB people....


Excellent explanation and description of the issue Argo! That was why I mentioned the comparison to B&W photography earlier. B&W film _only_ sees varying shades of light, dark & gray. Under many lighting conditions different colors appear as the *exact* same shade of gray. Just like with a CB person.

Red flowers, green foliage,.. _both_ appear on film as exactly the same shade. No contrast at all. _BUT,.._ put a green filter on the camera lens and it absorbs the light from the green foliage, making it lighter, and blocks the light from a red flower making it appear much darker. It adds contrast. Use a Red filter, and the effect is the exact opposite!! Red appears white and green becomes very dark! 

Same principle you described. The trick for ECC, or any color blind person, is finding the right color of lens that can add contrast to the colors she isn't capable of distinguishing between, under the lighting conditions she's talking about!

Blue/Green lenses might just be a good choice in that they would absorb that wavelength and tend to make anything in that spectrum appear lighter in color. (…ECC, that is the spectrum that you are CB in, yes?) That might help to add contrast for you. I am just uncertain what Blue Green lenses will do for the other white/grey color elements (…snow) in the environment. Worth a try tho if you can demo a lens or two!


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## EastCoastChris (Feb 24, 2013)

Yes! Definitely can't tell the difference between most blues and greens. If they are really drastic contrast (like a lime green vs a royal blue) I am ok. But if I had a lime green against a teal I wouldn't be able to tell the difference at all. 

I will try the blue or blue/green lens tomorrow. Its supposed to be clearer tomorrow. It was a little overcast today so I just stuck with the totally clear lenses. But tomorrow is supposed to be bright and warm no cloud cover so I can investigate. 

I really appreciate everyone's help. I never really thought of it like filtering certain colors (ie scientifically) to improve contrast. I had always just looked at the manufacter's chart of colors. And since they usually show rose and yellow for very dark/overcast days so I figured they would be mellow enough for me on a bluebird day when sun glare off snow is rough with clear lenses. I have to squint ALL day. OR pop off something I never saw and scorpion land on my face. Ugh. Like I said, crushes confidence when other people are having fun. I am the only person that cheers cloudy skies. 

I will try the blue/green lens and see if that cuts glare without washing all all contrast of the snow. Will also try the grey too. 

I'm going to Mt. Snow again and those guys at the board shop are really really good. They are super understanding and I am thinking they will let me try EG2 lenses at least to see what they look like on a bluebird day.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

nothing to add...but its like good fitting boots...I used to try to cheap out on goggles...but imho goggles that work ought to be a high priority... ya got to beable to see...so spare no expense to see well and then your confidence and riding will improve. 
for low light and most light in pnw I use smith blue sensor mirror....and even on bright days....but...I can sometime feel tiny bit of burn on really bright days...but then gets the shadows about 2pm


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## Bamfboardman (Dec 11, 2012)

snowklinger said:


> Only thing I would suggest is to use different colors see if anything works better for you. From my experience most of these colors follow a standard that doesn't deviate much on the price of goggle. Expensive goggles include other features like "made this year", spherical, etc.
> 
> Luckily there are alot of bluebird lense choices:
> 
> ...


Almost all ski lenses are polarized. They're not bad for the snow, they cut glare.


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Bamfboardman said:


> Almost all ski lenses are polarized. They're not bad for the snow, they cut glare.


Actually, almost no snow lenses are polarized because polarization DOES eliminate the glare. Ice and hardpack patches become virtually invisible with polarized lenses.


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## Bamfboardman (Dec 11, 2012)

linvillegorge said:


> Actually, almost no snow lenses are polarized because polarization DOES eliminate the glare. Ice and hardpack patches become virtually invisible with polarized lenses.


You probably should read this, because you're wrong. There's more than one kind of polarization. A lot more effects how you seen then just the lens type. curvature of the lens plays a large role.
Smith Optics Goggle Technology | Smith Optics US Site


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## Argo (Feb 25, 2010)

Linville is correct. Only the high end shit has standardized polarization techniques. Anything your getting at the $150 or less range is a standard lens. Just because smith has a page about it for their prophecy, I/o line and other brands tout it for their top end lenses doesn't mean MOST goggles have the polarized lenses your talking about. 

If you take a poll on here I'd bet that 85% or more do not own polarized lenses.....


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Bamfboardman said:


> You probably should read this, because you're wrong. There's more than one kind of polarization. A lot more effects how you seen then just the lens type. curvature of the lens plays a large role.
> Smith Optics Goggle Technology | Smith Optics US Site


Smith has polarized lenses as an option in some of their goggles. I've personally used them. I stopped using them after damn near killing myself a couple of times when hitting windblown ice patches and having no clue they were coming.


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

Most manufacturers only do one or two models with a polarised lens in them cause the consumer doesn't want to pay the extra coin!!!!!

You'll find that it'll be the same with their sunglasses too!!!!!


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

I won't bother with any sunglasses that aren't polarized, but the opposite is true for goggles.


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## Mizu Kuma (Apr 13, 2014)

And that's why they make so many different types of lenses!!!!!

Not everyone likes the same types of lenses in the same conditions!!!!!

And there isn't one lens that simply does it all!!!!!


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## EastCoastChris (Feb 24, 2013)

Just wanted to update this thread in case anyone has the same problem and searches for it later. 

I tried a blue tint lens (it was actually a replacement lens for the Electric EG1.) Like blue chrome or something. In any event it was a sunny day (except with a little fog at the summit) but bright enough that I was having the perfect storm of glare/snow contrast problems. 

As someone suggested here I tried the blue tint and it both cut down glare just enough in sun AND added a really good amount of contrast to uneven snow. It was still a liiiitle tough to see ice patches. But I had SO much more confidence after noon when the top couple inches gets pushed around just a enough to make a bumpy ride. But blue lense filtering made it possible to see all the variations, rollers, shadows, tracks etc EXTREMELY well for me. This was particularly true in the bit of summit fog. With every other lense I had the snow was like...basically looking at this back ground. Literally like a white sheet with ZERO texture. But blue lenses were the best in helping me see the snow. Oddly enough orange (and to some extent rose) did help somewhat as well. But yellow and gray almost made it worse. But def two thumbs up for blue!

If anyone is having the same problem I would suggest the trying lenses solution. I just borrowed em from riding buddies, and in one case I literally traded with another super cool member of the tribe I met on the lift (explained the issue and he totally understood my plight and let me take a run with him with switched goggles!)

Makes a huge difference for confidence and riding ability. Because, I guess, not feeling blind will do that.


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## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

Awesome news! Glad to hear something made a difference like that for you.


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