# Hardboot splitboard setup?



## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

From my experience, every person that has switched to hard boots has only had good things to say. I personally have never found any need for my own endeavors but for those that are climbing in some pretty sketchy stuff, ultimately they will benefit from it. Phantom is the gold standard. A good friend of mine that has spent the last two winters in AK stopped by yesterday in his way back to Mammoth and said he just got the new phantoms and he's way stoked.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

https://www.instagram.com/p/BFuljChxAxc/?taken-by=earnyourturn


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Hard boots definitely have their advantages. I find that I am using my ski crampons a little sooner than the Phantom hard boot guys, but in most situations they are putting on the crampons too. Being able to quick release boot crampons and an easier time kicking steps is huge though.

The owner of Phantom is a friend of mine and he has definitely put a lot of time and thought into the bindings. They are well designed. I am sure I will eventually get a hard boot set up and I am probably going Phantom.

Dynafit TLT 6 is the boot of choice. There are some mods you have to do. Pretty minor, but you are basically chopping a brand new expensive boot. Plus the liners suck. You will want to get new liners are expect cold feet. Everyone gets a half size larger than what fits and puts Intuition liners in the boot.


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

Only one thing to add to what Killclimbz said: in the meantime if you don't want to go full hardboot, there is a simple trick I learned from a guy who works for Voile, some people probably already knew this, but you can take a simple Voile strap and run it through the slots on your highback and around you ankle and it gives you pretty good side-hilling support. Obviously not going to be as good as hardboot, but it does help.

I have also used boot crampons with softboots and can definitely see how they would be better with hardboots.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

The Spark option for hard boots is actually pretty nice and it sticks to their keep in simple formula. I know the Phantom guys at times have to spend time cleaning the ice off the interface to get the board back together. I doubt that is a problem with the Spark bindings. 

All things equal though, the Phantom system is lighter and is supposed to be a more solid ride.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

deagol said:


> Only one thing to add to what Killclimbz said: in the meantime if you don't want to go full hardboot, there is a simple trick I learned from a guy who works for Voile, some people probably already knew this, but you can take a simple Voile strap and run it through the slots on your highback and around you ankle and it gives you pretty good side-hilling support. Obviously not going to be as good as hardboot, but it does help.
> 
> I have also used boot crampons with softboots and can definitely see how they would be better with hardboots.


Yeah, I've used that trick; without I wouldn't had been able to climb those icy peaks in Svalbard w/o those goddamn crampons - got them replaces with the newer model with the more solid pin w/o problems btw. Spark has a solid customers service - yes, it does make a difference, but only a bit. 

It's a pity that on the splitfest there was noone with a hardboot setup to try. I'd have to order the Phantom stuff directly from the US out of the dark. Pretty expensive trial and error try...


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

I actually like using the Spark ski crampons with soft-boots, but don't love using boot crampons with soft-boots. 

The only thing I can really say is that everyone I go with who uses hard boots is always preaching at the rest of us soft booters about the errors of our ways and all....

I have met the guy who owns Phantom a few times but don't know him as well as Killclimbz does. I know people like his bindings, though. 

Good luck with whatever you decide. I think I am going to stick with soft boots and manage whatever difficulties I have via route selection or stubbornness....


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

deagol said:


> , actually like using the Spark ski crampons with soft-boots, but don't love using boot crampons with soft-boots.


I don't remrmber your boots... maybe they don't have a stiff sole? I'm very comfy with crampons on my Deluxe XV with their rigid Vibram sole.

Haha, the skinning gets pretty easy with the crampons, but it absolutely kills the "out in nature quiet"... KKKKHHHHRRRR-ZING... 
KKKKHHHHRRRR-ZING... KKKKHHHHRRRR-ZING


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## deagol (Mar 26, 2014)

Neni,

My boots are just some old Burton Driver X's with replacement liners (Remind liners). The sole is starting to fall apart near the heel.


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## timmytard (Mar 19, 2009)

I'm sure someone on bomber knows what you're searching for?


TT


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## Alonzo (Dec 30, 2015)

The splitboard.com forum has all the info you could ever want about Phatoms, including all the various modifications you'll want to make to the various boots that work best for splitboarding.

The long and short of it is this: the three best boots are the Dynafit TLT6, La Sportiva Sideral, and the Scarpa Alien, depending on what you're looking for and how wide your feet are. You'll want to modify most boots for increased medial flex, increased forward range of motion, and a more relaxed ride mode default forward lean position. Generally, this is done by cutting down cuffs with a Dremel and/or drilling holes in the medial side of the cuff to facilitate increased flex and by modifying the forward lean mechanism, which is individual to each boot. Many like to make other modifications to give a more progressive feeling to the forward and rearward flexion, rather than the dead-stop feeling that stock ski boots apparently have (I've never had them on my feet). 

There are literally dozens of threads on this stuff over there. Good luck.

Cheers.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Alonzo said:


> The splitboard.com forum has all the info you could ever want about Phatoms, including all the various modifications you'll want to make to the various boots that work best for splitboarding.
> 
> The long and short of it is this: the three best boots are the Dynafit TLT6, La Sportiva Sideral, and the Scarpa Alien, depending on what you're looking for and how wide your feet are. You'll want to modify most boots for increased medial flex, increased forward range of motion, and a more relaxed ride mode default forward lean position. Generally, this is done by cutting down cuffs with a Dremel and/or drilling holes in the medial side of the cuff to facilitate increased flex and by modifying the forward lean mechanism, which is individual to each boot. Many like to make other modifications to give a more progressive feeling to the forward and rearward flexion, rather than the dead-stop feeling that stock ski boots apparently have (I've never had them on my feet).
> 
> ...


Thanks for the hint. I'll check for suitable threads. The last time I checked that forum it seemed dead (forgot my password and am waiting for a new one since over a year...)


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## Alonzo (Dec 30, 2015)

neni said:


> Thanks for the hint. I'll check for suitable threads. The last time I checked that forum it seemed dead (forgot my password and am waiting for a new one since over a year...)


Me too! I have submitted half a dozen requests and have been met with radio silence. Those dudes need some new admins. 

There's lots of info there though...more than enough to guide you through the boot decision and modification process without having to ask any questions yourself. To me, the decision on whether to go hardboot or not turns on how gnarly the terrain you ascend is, how much weight savings mean to you, and how much feel you are willing to sacrifice on the way down to have an easier time on the up track. 

If you don't need boot crampons or have to do any serious rock climbing to access the stuff you ride, and don't feel hampered by a couple extra pounds on your feet, it's probably not worth potentially compromising the sweet feel of softies on the descent, in my opinion.


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

Alonzo said:


> Me too! I have submitted half a dozen requests and have been met with radio silence. Those dudes need some new admins.
> 
> There's lots of info there though...more than enough to guide you through the boot decision and modification process without having to ask any questions yourself. To me, the decision on whether to go hardboot or not turns on how gnarly the terrain you ascend is, how much weight savings mean to you, and how much feel you are willing to sacrifice on the way down to have an easier time on the up track.
> 
> If you don't need boot crampons or have to do any serious rock climbing to access the stuff you ride, and don't feel hampered by a couple extra pounds on your feet, it's probably not worth potentially compromising the sweet feel of softies on the descent, in my opinion.


Diy boot adjustment







Edit sbforum pic uploader sucks balls @admin 

Screenshot_20160525-150600 by Ves, on Flickr


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Alonzo said:


> ...To me, the decision on whether to go hardboot or not turns on how gnarly the terrain you ascend is, how much weight savings mean to you, and how much feel you are willing to sacrifice on the way down to have an easier time on the up track.
> 
> If you don't need boot crampons or have to do any serious rock climbing to access the stuff you ride, and don't feel hampered by a couple extra pounds on your feet, it's probably not worth potentially compromising the sweet feel of softies on the descent, in my opinion.


Hmmm... actually, rock climbing and wearing boot crampons work pretty well with my Deeluxe XV sofg boots; I even did some ice climbing with them. They hold crampons very well and the stiff Vibram sole works for hitting steps in hardpack. 

The thing I aim to improve is really the sideways edgehold on steep teaverses on icy surface where the soft setup is just... well... soft. And maybe the ski down short parts while in ski mode. Lol, I feel super uncomfortable even skiing 5m down with the split. 

Another point... touring in spring here means high alpine with lots of glacier passages, sometimes with long rather flat runouts back, which always is a major PITA (being attached to the board and push forward with poles ruins my arms and iften is the most strenuous part of the day). You can't board-scate cos the pushing leg would sink into snow, it's cumbersome to put the skins back on only to negotiate flat parts. Scate in ski mode is unfeasible for me with the soft set up; maybe this would be easier with a hardboot setup...


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Proud new owner of the most ugly boots ever designed :laugh:









The guy who selected this color combination must have used too much LSD when young... :barf2: urgh, especially ugly since the tour binding will be red... but hey, I'm super stoked that the go-to alpine touring boot does actually fit my feet perfectly so I'll bit the lemon with pleasure and be Skittles again (add a dark green split, red bindings, pink pants, orange jacket, white gloves and turquoise helmet) :laugh:

Pretty amazed how comfy the boot is in walking mode. Huge freedom of movement, _way_ better than in my "soft" boot. And in riding mode, with the stiff additional tongue removed, it seems plus minus equally stiff like my Deeluxe XV softboot when firmly tightened n strapped in. I probably won't even have to do further modifications cos that's about the stiffness I like my boots to have...

Super curious to try the new set-up on snow!


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