# Burton Cartel vs Malavita for Attack Banaa



## guli (Mar 31, 2012)

Hey,

I've just got myself a new board - 153 cm Lib Tech Attack Banana and can't decide on the bindings for it. I've done a lot of research on the net, mainly on this forum and seems that a lot of people are recommending Burton Cartels for this particular board, but when I went to my local shop the guy there said the Malavita model would suit my needs better. I am an intermediate rider, 5.75 feet tall and 159 lbs, if it matters. I wanted to get an all-mountain board that would perform well on groomers and ice, but that would also give me a lot of fun in the meantime. I am not spending time in the park but hopefully it will change soon 

Any help on choosing the right bindings would be much appreciated. Of course I will consider any bindings, not just the two Burton models mentioned above. Thanks for you help!

Sebastian


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## DCG (Oct 11, 2012)

Sebastian,

Did you end up choosing a binding? If so, what did you get and have you tried it out? I have the exact same dilemma. Currently, I plan to go with the '13 Cartel Re:Flex. They've improved the high back and made it more responsive over the '12. I've been reading about the Rome 390, Union Force and Union Contact. I'm really looking for dampening and cushioning. I read that the Burtons are excellent on that. The Good Ride has reviews of all of these bindings. I compared all of the How It Rides tables on them. I currently have '08 Mission that I like, but I want to take things to the next level. I think the Cartel will do that for all mountain without being too soft.

David


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## tygrannas (Sep 14, 2012)

Im having the same problem looking at bindings for my neversummer revolver. The cartel was the all mountain binding in the past but this years model has a noticably softer highback than the malavita. Which is causing people to go over to the malavitas for the stiffer highback.

Im getting my bindings tomorrow and still havent made up my mind


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## hktrdr (Apr 3, 2012)

DCG said:


> Sebastian,
> 
> Did you end up choosing a binding? If so, what did you get and have you tried it out? I have the exact same dilemma. Currently, I plan to go with the* '13 Cartel Re:Flex. They've improved the high back and made it more responsive over the '12.* I've been reading about the Rome 390, Union Force and Union Contact. I'm really looking for dampening and cushioning. I read that the Burtons are excellent on that. The Good Ride has reviews of all of these bindings. I compared all of the How It Rides tables on them. I currently have '08 Mission that I like, but I want to take things to the next level. I think the Cartel will do that for all mountain without being too soft.
> 
> David


No! Burton has made the high back on the 13 Cartels significantly *less* responsive. Your call whether that is an improvement - sure as hell would not be for me, but it depends on your riding style...


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## marcdeo (Aug 8, 2011)

tygrannas said:


> Im having the same problem looking at bindings for my neversummer revolver. *The cartel was the all mountain binding in the past but this years model has a noticably softer highback than the malavita.* Which is causing people to go over to the malavitas for the stiffer highback.
> 
> Im getting my bindings tomorrow and still havent made up my mind


Shitty move by burton - weird. But what the hell do I know?


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## DCG (Oct 11, 2012)

Thanks for the input. I was going on what I had read and the conclusions I made from them. Good to know. Now I'm totally confused. I may pick up a '12 Cartel Re:Flex then. but I also read that some folks had issues with that high back due to the zero lean, which was new a year or so before.

@tygrannas: Let us know what binding you pick up...


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## tygrannas (Sep 14, 2012)

DCG said:


> @tygrannas: Let us know what binding you pick up...


Will do, Im leaning towards the malavitas at the moment. since my freeride board is a k2 slayblade with burton C60s and ive been doing park with that board. I figure out of those 2 i cant get to stiff of a binding but I can get a binding that is too soft


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## tygrannas (Sep 14, 2012)

I ended up getting the cartels, they didnt feel as soft as everyone is making them out to be and I saved $30. I cant wait to try them out, waiting for snow is even more depresing now that I have a whole new setup of board/bindings and a pair of boots i got warrentied.


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## DCG (Oct 11, 2012)

I ended up ordering the '13 Cartel Re:Flex Restricted. I went for them due to the rave reviews of the asym strap. I took a hard look at Malavitas but could not justify the extra cost. I'm sure I'll be happy with the Cartels seeing as I'm moving from a set of 07/08 Missions. Just wanted some newer tech / flex to work with my Attack Banana. I also figure that the '13s will have any bugs sorted out of the reflex system. Had a hard time going with the corporate giant... but at least they use reground material to make the Cartel (so they say) and my board is made in the US.

Watch... the '14s will have "The Hinge"... (which apparently Burton tired with the reflex system but generated too much flex... meaning... we can't undercut our proprietary EST system!) but I plan on living with these for five years.


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## Triple8Sol (Nov 24, 2008)

It's true that the Cartel back has been softened for this year, so you're not happy with that, then get this year's Mission Restricted. It has the same highback from last year's Cartel with an upgraded ankle strap like this year's Cartel. According to Burton's website the Mission is softer than the Cartel, but definitely felt stiffer when I played with it in the store.


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## SkittlesRgood (Feb 3, 2012)

I had some old missions that I kept stripping the ladders on them, every year. I wear my bindings ridiculously tight. When I looked at the ratchet I could see a noticeable slant so that the ratchet didnt engage the ladder perfectly straight. When I shopped for bindings this year I noticed that the '13 missions still have that angle on the ratchet but the cartels sit very flat on the ladder. This lead me to believe that I would have less of a chance at stripping the cartels, so that's what I went with. Hopefully that theory was correct.

Just something to look at if anyone else has that problem.


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## phony_stark (Jul 2, 2011)

SkittlesRgood said:


> I had some old missions that I kept stripping the ladders on them, every year. I wear my bindings ridiculously tight. When I looked at the ratchet I could see a noticeable slant so that the ratchet didnt engage the ladder perfectly straight. When I shopped for bindings this year I noticed that the '13 missions still have that angle on the ratchet but the cartels sit very flat on the ladder. This lead me to believe that I would have less of a chance at stripping the cartels, so that's what I went with. Hopefully that theory was correct.
> 
> Just something to look at if anyone else has that problem.





The problems with your ladders had more to do with the fact that the Missions have single component ratchets which are just metal. Metal on that kind of plastic ladder will start to strip. Your cartels have dual component ratchets, which has plastic touch the ladder, so there will be no stripping.


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## Supra (Jan 11, 2012)

hktrdr said:


> No! Burton has made the high back on the 13 Cartels significantly *less* responsive. Your call whether that is an improvement - sure as hell would not be for me, but it depends on your riding style...


Where are you getting your info from? The 2013 cartel highback has only 3% more torsional flex than the 2012. 3% is not significant.
Are basing your post on handflexing in store or have you ridden the bindings?


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## Supra (Jan 11, 2012)

tygrannas said:


> Im having the same problem looking at bindings for my neversummer revolver. The cartel was the all mountain binding in the past but this years model has a noticably softer highback than the malavita. Which is causing people to go over to the malavitas for the stiffer highback.
> 
> Im getting my bindings tomorrow and still havent made up my mind


The cartel is STILL the all mountain binding. The highback, if anything, would be stiffer than the malavitas, but not by much. The malavitas are still an all mountain binding with a touch more flex than the cartels (more freestyley if you're splitting straws)


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## Supra (Jan 11, 2012)

DCG said:


> Thanks for the input. I was going on what I had read and the conclusions I made from them. Good to know. Now I'm totally confused. I may pick up a '12 Cartel Re:Flex then. but I also read that some folks had issues with that high back due to the zero lean, which was new a year or so before.
> 
> @tygrannas: Let us know what binding you pick up...


zero lean came in with the 2012 cartel, not the year before. Folks had issues with the old forward lean (saying it didn't start at zero). There is no problem with zero forward lean because if you want more, you just adjust it for more.


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## Supra (Jan 11, 2012)

DCG said:


> I ended up ordering the '13 Cartel Re:Flex Restricted. I went for them due to the rave reviews of the asym strap. I took a hard look at Malavitas but could not justify the extra cost. I'm sure I'll be happy with the Cartels seeing as I'm moving from a set of 07/08 Missions. Just wanted some newer tech / flex to work with my Attack Banana. I also figure that the '13s will have any bugs sorted out of the reflex system. Had a hard time going with the corporate giant... but at least they use reground material to make the Cartel (so they say) and my board is made in the US.
> 
> Watch... the '14s will have "The Hinge"... (which apparently Burton tired with the reflex system but generated too much flex... meaning... we can't undercut our proprietary EST system!) but I plan on living with these for five years.


Glad you overcame your dislike of the 'corporate giant' which is the privately owned Burton. How do you like Lib tech being run by Quiksilver?

Anyways, your thoughts about Burton not wanting to undercut their EST system with the hinge are incorrect. The hinge was put into est bindings to mimic the natural lateral flex reflex and other disc bindings have. Reflex flex = good. Adding the hinge to reflex would mean too much flex = bad. They tested it out. So, with reflex, rest assured that you have the best that burton have out at this time


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## ARSENALFAN (Apr 16, 2012)

I have last year's Attack Banana with Cartels. Primo setup and NO complaints. Cheers!


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## SkittlesRgood (Feb 3, 2012)

phony_stark said:


> The problems with your ladders had more to do with the fact that the Missions have single component ratchets which are just metal. Metal on that kind of plastic ladder will start to strip. Your cartels have dual component ratchets, which has plastic touch the ladder, so there will be no stripping.


The main issue was not caused by metal on plastic. because of the reduced contact area, from the angled ratchet, and the fact that the whole ratchet can be moved away from the ladder, when I got my bindings really tight the ratchet would slip. each slip taking away a little bit of plastic. sure that's where the metal was doing more damage than plastic might but the root cause was mechanical. there was always proof that only about 1/4" was engaging because that was the only part that would be stripped on the ladder. again, i believe this is caused by the crooked ratchet. plus, if the both materials were plastic then they would both be slowly worn down by this slipping to where I would need a new ratchet and ladders.

I actually had a burton rep try to tell me the same thing you just did. but he had nothing to say after I explained what I saw happening.


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