# Dakine 11L vs 20L heli pack?



## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

Rethink carrying a pack unless you're in the bc especially since you're still getting form and skills down. Otherwise 11l for inbounds, carrying layers and small items; 20l for bc/heli/cat/splitting


----------



## xIceHoundx (May 12, 2013)

bseracka said:


> Rethink carrying a pack unless you're in the bc especially since you're still getting form and skills down. Otherwise 11l for inbounds, carrying layers and small items; 20l for bc/heli/cat/splitting


Hadn't really considered that, do you think wearing the 11l pack with some small items in it would make any difference in form and skill at a beginner level? Me coming into my 2nd season this coming winter.


----------



## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

xIceHoundx said:


> Hadn't really considered that, do you think wearing the 11l pack with some small items in it would make any difference in form and skill at a beginner level? Me coming into my 2nd season this coming winter.


meh, it could. Maybe! In the beginning I hated stopping for anything! A drink, food, takin' a piss, whatever! (plus I Hate having a lot of shit in my pockets!) I rode a lot my first season & half with one of two camelbak packs! One a 70ml (water capacity, not pack volume!) with two small pockets, the other a Big 100ml (same, water not pack) pack with room enough for the kitchen sink! 

I don't know for sure if it hurt my progression or not, I did notice a difference when I stopped riding with them regularly! I Just felt a little less restricted! I prefer to ride without now, but manage fine when I want to carry a shitload of GoPro stuff & whatnot! You will have to sit cockeyed on the lift, some places make you one shoulder it! Depends on the resort or the "lifty!"


----------



## hktrdr (Apr 3, 2012)

xIceHoundx said:


> Hadn't really considered that, do you think wearing the 11l pack with some small items in it would make any difference in form and skill at a beginner level? Me coming into my 2nd season this coming winter.


It it quite likely to have a negative impact, especially for relative beginners - it took me a while to get used to riding with a pack. And after I got comfortable with it I took some lessons to correct all the bad habits it introduced to my technique.
So I would say avoid it if possible, especially for resort riding. That said, the German/European resorts that you seem to be riding tend to be a bit weak in terms of facilities/amenities, so it might make sense to carry some essentials - but I would really try to keep it to a minimum.


----------



## hktrdr (Apr 3, 2012)

chomps1211 said:


> meh, it could. Maybe! In the beginning *I hated stopping for anything!* A drink, food, takin' *a piss*, whatever! (plus I Hate having *a lot of shit in my pockets*!) [SNIP]


I generally think it is preferable to stop for piss - unless I am locked into a super long carve or on a boring traverse :laugh:

And even without personal experience, I would really recommend against shitting in your pockets


----------



## chomps1211 (Mar 30, 2011)

hktrdr said:


> I generally think it is preferable to stop for piss - unless I am locked into a super long carve or on a boring traverse :laugh:
> 
> And even without personal experience, I would really recommend against shitting in your pockets


:eusa_clap::eusa_clap::eusa_clap:
Very good! Well played! :laugh:

Honestly tho, when I first started riding, I _really_ didn't want to stop for anything!! And running like I was even on our short assed Mi runs, from first to last chair, I was sweating out as much as I was putting in! Didn't really _need_ to piss much! :dunno:

As for the pockets,.. I agree! (...._that's why I shit in the pack! LOL!_)


----------



## DigitalReaver (Mar 10, 2013)

I have the 11 L pack and wear it all the time I'm riding, mostly just has water and a spare pair of goggles in it. If you pull the straps tight its pretty low profile just remember to do the waist strap up so it doesn't get caught in the lift chairs.


----------



## xIceHoundx (May 12, 2013)

hktrdr said:


> It it quite likely to have a negative impact, especially for relative beginners - it took me a while to get used to riding with a pack. And after I got comfortable with it I took some lessons to correct all the bad habits it introduced to my technique.
> So I would say avoid it if possible, especially for resort riding. That said, the German/European resorts that you seem to be riding tend to be a bit weak in terms of facilities/amenities, so it might make sense to carry some essentials - but I would really try to keep it to a minimum.


I can see where that is a valid point, which I guess kinda leads me to another question unrelated to the bag one. I got in a ton of snowboarding last season riding every weekend but a few, and on a local hill some weekends as well, but am basically self taught since day 1 from trail and error and seeing others while up on the mountains. Im sure ive got nothing but bad habits in my technique, should I really bother getting lessons? Being an american who only speaks english in germany (and ive got 2 more years here) I wonder how accessable lessons would even be for me here.


----------



## hktrdr (Apr 3, 2012)

xIceHoundx said:


> I can see where that is a valid point, which I guess kinda leads me to another question unrelated to the bag one. I got in a ton of snowboarding last season riding every weekend but a few, and on a local hill some weekends as well, but am basically self taught since day 1 from trail and error and seeing others while up on the mountains. Im sure ive got nothing but bad habits in my technique, should I really bother getting lessons? Being an american who only speaks english in germany (and ive got 2 more years here) I wonder how accessable lessons would even be for me here.


For sure get lessons. There are plenty of English speaking snowboarding instructors in continental Europe, including Germany. Even if you wind up with somebody who is not used to teaching in English, the vocab and concepts are not rocket science. Very well worth addressing bad habits early on in your progression.


----------



## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Pretty solid advice going on here. Skip the pack. Especially since you are just getting started. You can always add it later if you feel the need.


----------



## cav0011 (Jan 4, 2009)

I learned how to snowboard in Austria, I am also an american who only speaks english. I think the lessons were awesome. ALmost every resort hires some english speaking people.


----------



## xIceHoundx (May 12, 2013)

Thanks guys guess i'll look into taking some lessons in the start of this coming season when im fresh back at it and kill some of those bad habits. Appreciate the advice.


----------



## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

If you don't yet feel comfortable riding with it, just store it somewhere :dunno:

Since you're in Germany, you might have a look at Deuter backbacks too. I had a Dakine Heli first, but didn't like the horizontal snowboard mount (might have changed) and thus got a Deuter with vertical mount and am very satisfied with the Deuter. The other advantage of it over the Dakine (might have changed too) was that the Deuter had an integrated backprotektor, which makes sense in my opinion. Imagine what a thermos in the backpack does to your spine if you have a backwards fall...

I always have one with me, sometimes ride with it the entire day, sometimes I store it at a cable station to get it if I'm thirsty/hugry/cold. Most of the times it only contains a spare fleece, some energy bars and a thermos. I love to have a hot cup of tee in the cable cabin, or on a peak. The bag has many nice features, is light and comfortabel and compression straps provide a very low profile. I feel no restriction with it.


----------



## Some Guy (Mar 13, 2013)

xIceHoundx said:


> I can see where that is a valid point, which I guess kinda leads me to another question unrelated to the bag one. I got in a ton of snowboarding last season riding every weekend but a few, and on a local hill some weekends as well, but am basically self taught since day 1 from trail and error and seeing others while up on the mountains. Im sure ive got nothing but bad habits in my technique, should I really bother getting lessons? Being an american who only speaks english in germany (and ive got 2 more years here) I wonder how accessable lessons would even be for me here.


You could always go to ODR provided you are military or work on a US installation. They give lessons, or some bases do anyways. I know ansbach has lessons on most, if not all of their trips.


----------



## xIceHoundx (May 12, 2013)

Some Guy said:


> You could always go to ODR provided you are military or work on a US installation. They give lessons, or some bases do anyways. I know ansbach has lessons on most, if not all of their trips.


I am active duty military and I know they do trips but I've never heard anything of them having instructors along on the trips. Ive never gone on any of the ODR trips because I always just link up with a buddy or group and roll out right after work on Fridays or Thursdays if 4 day weekend and ride up to sunday closing or Monday closing and return back to make work the next day, as much time riding as possible.

I did look into Garmisch and there are 2 day (189$) and 4 day (355$) lessons that are group session sort of things. Downside to that is a friend of mine says she had put her 7 y/o daughter in the 2 day class and the entire 2nd day she said they didn't ride at all. They also offer 2 hour 101 sessions for 90$ so I may just do that once or twice to get more focused lessons and feedback on how I currently ride and how to correct or make it better.


----------



## Some Guy (Mar 13, 2013)

xIceHoundx said:


> I am active duty military and I know they do trips but I've never heard anything of them having instructors along on the trips. Ive never gone on any of the ODR trips because I always just like up with a buddy or group and roll out right after work on Fridays or Thursdays if 4 day weekend and ride up to sunday closing or Monday closing and return back to make work the next day, as much time riding as possible.
> 
> I did look into Garmisch and there are 2 day (189$) and 4 day (355$) lessons that are group session sort of things. Downside to that is a friend of mine says she had put her 7 y/o daughter in the 2 day class and the entire 2nd day she said they didn't ride at all. They also offer 2 hour 101 sessions for 90$ so I may just do that once or twice to get more focused lessons and feedback on how I currently ride and how to correct or make it better.


Ansbach ODR has instructors and they are pretty good. I'm pretty sure they are cheaper than Edelweiss/Hausberg too.


----------



## xIceHoundx (May 12, 2013)

Some Guy said:


> Ansbach ODR has instructors and they are pretty good. I'm pretty sure they are cheaper than Edelweiss/Hausberg too.


Hmmmm suppose I will contact ODR when the season gets closer and inquire about it. Do the Ansbach ODR instructors cost to give lesson or is it basically included in the overall trip price they charge?


----------



## Some Guy (Mar 13, 2013)

I think they cost a bit extra, but I think it costs less with a trip. I don't remember the sign in there perfectly, but i think it costs less through them with a trip.


----------



## xIceHoundx (May 12, 2013)

I posted up on the MWR facebook page asking about if our ODR does the same sort of thing so hopefully I will get a reply back from them. Im over at Grafenwoehr. Thanks for the info man. Hey im gonna PM ya something too.


----------



## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

When you get your lesson spring for the private; it will be worth the $$ difference.


----------



## Mystery2many (Aug 14, 2013)

I use to ride with a small snowboard specific back pack and also a camel pack. The thing I hated the most about it was getting on and off of chair lifts, when the lift picks you up it shoves you forward. So then I took one sholder out and unbuckled the support straps and that made it just as annoying. Like they said, if you are resort riding I don't think its necessary. You can get water or what not at the concession area. Also it can affect your balance in some situations.

I buy pants and jackets that have sweet pocket features to store all my items.


----------



## lander91 (Mar 14, 2013)

For what it's worth, our first holiday in the French alps (a year after we started snowboarding) I carried this backpack around with two baguettes and two small plastic water bottles each day. I didn't notice any real difference in how I rode with/without it, and it didn't seem to get in the way on chair lifts at all. My husband tried carrying his bottle and baguette in his (very baggy) jacket the first day, but he said it still felt bulky and in the way, so I carried both our lunches after that.

From my experience, if you keep it light and fairly low profile, it shouldn't affect how you ride.


----------



## xIceHoundx (May 12, 2013)

Mystery2many said:


> I use to ride with a small snowboard specific back pack and also a camel pack. The thing I hated the most about it was getting on and off of chair lifts, when the lift picks you up it shoves you forward. So then I took one sholder out and unbuckled the support straps and that made it just as annoying. Like they said, if you are resort riding I don't think its necessary. You can get water or what not at the concession area. Also it can affect your balance in some situations.
> 
> I buy pants and jackets that have sweet pocket features to store all my items.


In Europe it really isn't as easy as that, a simple bottle of water is premium price. No joke the saying about beer being cheaper than water is true for Germany. Germany and I'm sure the rest of Europe doesn't really have concession stands, it's restaurants as they like to take serious breaks when they stop for one. Having a camel back on the mountain even just sitting in a locker or stashed away in some spot is money saved lol.


----------



## Mystery2many (Aug 14, 2013)

xIceHoundx said:


> In Europe it really isn't as easy as that, a simple bottle of water is premium price. No joke the saying about beer being cheaper than water is true for Germany. Germany and I'm sure the rest of Europe doesn't really have concession stands, it's restaurants as they like to take serious breaks when they stop for one. Having a camel back on the mountain even just sitting in a locker or stashed away in some spot is money saved lol.


Ah, I see. I guess having those circumstances will change things a bit. lol



lander91 said:


> For what it's worth, our first holiday in the French alps (a year after we started snowboarding) I carried this backpack around with two baguettes and two small plastic water bottles each day. I didn't notice any real difference in how I rode with/without it, and it didn't seem to get in the way on chair lifts at all. My husband tried carrying his bottle and baguette in his (very baggy) jacket the first day, but he said it still felt bulky and in the way, so I carried both our lunches after that.
> 
> From my experience, if you keep it light and fairly low profile, it shouldn't affect how you ride.


My girl rides with a small backpack but she just cruises and keeps up with the guys while we jump and spin all over the place. You made a good point and I guess it depends on how you ride.


----------



## lander91 (Mar 14, 2013)

Mystery2many said:


> My girl rides with a small backpack but she just cruises and keeps up with the guys while we jump and spin all over the place. You made a good point and I guess it depends on how you ride.


I was cruising most of the time, but I also hit off-piste and lapped the park quite a few times as well. Presses and spins on gentle runs and ollies through a fairly easy mogul field. So a bit of everything, and the light load didn't make a noticeable difference.


----------

