# Never Summer West vs 25



## robotfood99 (Mar 19, 2016)

Will this be your only board? If so, West. If you have an all-mtn stick already, 25. 

I'd still get the 25 just because its a one-off. And it seems to fit your location and riding style.


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## buggravy (Feb 19, 2008)

I'd say the West IS better all around, but it sounds like your riding leans pretty heavily toward the freeride side. I found the West to be a pretty mellow board. I liked it a lot, but I wouldn't consider it a charger. I also found the 25 to be more versatile than you might otherwise think. Based on how you describe your riding, I say 25.


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## ricksen24 (Sep 9, 2015)

buggravy said:


> I'd say the West IS better all around, but it sounds like your riding leans pretty heavily toward the freeride side. I found the West to be a pretty mellow board. I liked it a lot, but I wouldn't consider it a charger. I also found the 25 to be more versatile than you might otherwise think. Based on how you describe your riding, I say 25.


Do you mind me asking how your finding the 25 on hard ice pack groomers (im from Scotland) and on long cat tracks and such environments? 

Im seriously tempted to get one!


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## buggravy (Feb 19, 2008)

ricksen24 said:


> Do you mind me asking how your finding the 25 on hard ice pack groomers (im from Scotland) and on long cat tracks and such environments?
> 
> Im seriously tempted to get one!


Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately) I don't have any experience on it on hard pack. To be honest, if it's icy I just choose not to ride. Sorry I couldn't be more help.


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## ricksen24 (Sep 9, 2015)

buggravy said:


> Unfortunately (or maybe fortunately) I don't have any experience on it on hard pack. To be honest, if it's icy I just choose not to ride. Sorry I couldn't be more help.


No worries.

That makes me jealous that you have that option. 

I have to plan trips months in advance like last year we booked Whistler arrive there and just looking at the shine on the piste gave you the shivers!


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## DaveMcI (Aug 19, 2013)

If absolutely no switch then the 25 all day.


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## Triple8Sol (Nov 24, 2008)

I had a West last season and loved the board. Very versatile and handled all conditions in the PNW and even on trips to Tahoe/Utah/Whistler. That said, it was not as much of a charger as I was hoping for. The ripsaw profile and vario grip was great, but it was just a tad too soft for what I was hoping for. I think the 25 would be perfect for me, just need to keep an eye out for some kind of deal/sale, if that's even possible, since it was produced in limited quantities...


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

Triple8Sol said:


> I had a West last season and loved the board. Very versatile and handled all conditions in the PNW and even on trips to Tahoe/Utah/Whistler. That said, it was not as much of a charger as I was hoping for. The ripsaw profile and vario grip was great, but it was just a tad too soft for what I was hoping for. I think the 25 would be perfect for me, just need to keep an eye out for some kind of deal/sale, if that's even possible, *since it was produced in limited quantities*...


Haha, what does that even mean? Ever seen a snowboard with infinite production volume. FYI NS pressed more of the 25s than the entire production of some other brands.


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## redlude97 (Jan 9, 2008)

SGboarder said:


> Haha, what does that even mean? Ever seen a snowboard with infinite production volume. FYI NS pressed more of the 25s than the entire production of some other brands.


its still only being produced this year, so if its the board for you then better snatch it up and don't expect to see any closeouts


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## NickinCO (Jan 3, 2013)

Love the West. Riding styles sound similar but I ride switch a fair bit. Great all around board. I wouldn't get the 25 as my only board. The west slays the trees!


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

Not sure if you've bought a board yet, but for what you described, 25 all day everyday.


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## llamabrew (Nov 26, 2016)

I went with the NS 25, size 158. Taking a quick break from setting up the bindings as I type this  

At 5'10" 180lbs I was pretty divided between the 158 and the 160 but I decided to get the slightly smaller stick to gain just a bit more maneuverability. I'm not too concerned about board float in powder with this one so I figured a more nimble ride would be the way to go. 

Thanks for the advice everyone.


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## jae (Nov 27, 2015)

you made a great choice. detune the tip, it's quite grabby if you get a hair sloppy.


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## jae (Nov 27, 2015)

ricksen24 said:


> Do you mind me asking how your finding the 25 on hard ice pack groomers (im from Scotland) and on long cat tracks and such environments?
> 
> Im seriously tempted to get one!


it handles ice like a champ. it has excellent edge hold and dampness.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

ricksen24 said:


> Do you mind me asking how your finding the 25 on hard ice pack groomers (im from Scotland) and on long cat tracks and such environments?
> 
> Im seriously tempted to get one!


If you're mostly riding in icy conditions you better look at a camber dominant board and/or something with Magnetraction or similar.


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## snowklinger (Aug 30, 2011)

*people actually CHOOSE vario for ice performance*



SGboarder said:


> If you're mostly riding in icy conditions you better look at a camber dominant board and/or something with Magnetraction or similar.


good call, both these boards have vario grip, which is even more accentuated by the Ripsaw camber, a very proven ice-tool.

you may want to check out the details of how their edge tech and camber function. Maybe take a peek at a picture of the ripsaw profile.

Then again, it sounds like you have spent alot of time on both the Type 2 prototype as well as prodution model, a rare opportunity.


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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

snowklinger said:


> good call, both these boards have vario grip, which is even more accentuated by the Ripsaw camber, a very proven ice-tool.
> 
> you may want to check out the details of how their edge tech and camber function. Maybe take a peek at a picture of the ripsaw profile.
> 
> Then again, it sounds like you have spent alot of time on both the Type 2 prototype as well as prodution model, a rare opportunity.


Yes, it reallly helps to have ridden the boards extensively in order to form a view.
Variogrip helps, but not as much as Magnetraction - or even as much as Arbors Grip Tech or Rome's QuickRip.
Similar with the ripsaw profile: It helps to get more pressure to the contact points compared to the 'regular' CRC profile - but it is still a center rocker board with the assoicated pro's and con's.


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## llamabrew (Nov 26, 2016)

jae said:


> you made a great choice. detune the tip, it's quite grabby if you get a hair sloppy.


Word, thanks for the info. Will give that a shot. 

I've read this board is a beast in powder. Hoping to finally give my back leg a break on pow days after ditching my old regular camber board. 

Speaking of which, I've never been on a center rocker. Any differences or "negatives" I should be prepared for?


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

It's going to be a surfier ride. The center rocker creates a pivot point in the center of the board that simply doesn't exist on a cambered board. It'll feel a lot different at first and might feel sketchy. Just give it some time. The harder you lean on the edges the harder it'll bite. It's when you're flat basing that you'll notice the biggest difference.


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## llamabrew (Nov 26, 2016)

Good info, thanks. One more question...what's the best approach to setting up bindings on a board that already has natural setback? 

My approach was basically to center them up as much as possible based on the holes themselves while trying to maintain my 21-22" stance width. That resulted in the front binding landing in the 3rd hole placement and the back in the 2nd hole placement. Measuring from the contact points on each end of the board it's about a 1" or 1.5" setback. I can see how it could easily be 2-4" setback on this board if I wanted.


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

For the most part, try to stay as centered as you can over the reference points within your personal stance width. In my experience with boards that are rockered between the feet, you want to try to stay pretty centered over that rocker section. I don't like the way those boards ride when you set the bindings back, but your mileage may vary. Depending on your bindings and how centered you are heel to toe in them, you may be able to flip the mounting discs around to give you more tip to tail centering options.


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## jae (Nov 27, 2015)

ride it centered. on deep pow days try riding it centered or if you're having trouble, you can always set it back.


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## llamabrew (Nov 26, 2016)

Hey just wanted to say thanks one more time to everyone who helped with advice on both my threads involving this subject. Took the board out for the first time yesterday and again today. Right off the bat I can say it's the best damn board I've ever had the pleasure of riding in my life. Took a couple of runs to get my feet under me but oh man does this board level everything in its path. Haven't had much of a chance to ride it in powder conditions yet but it's a damn stiff ride (but not overwhelmingly so) that handles groomers and chunder like an absolute beast. 

Hard to explain but I actually found myself forcing to back off and let the board do more of the work at times. I'm used to my old setup where I had to put a lot of energy into every little movement. With this guy, I found that if I just get into a groove with leaning into the flex a bit, it feels like the board almost takes over and does a lot of the work for me. 

That said, you definitely have to be on your game at all times with it. There's never a second where you can be lazy and say "eff it" and laze-out on a turn. If you do, the board reminds you who's boss immediately. Jae's comment about de-tuning the back tail is right on as well. I haven't done that yet but probably will when I get it tuned up this week as the back tail can get grabby quick if you aren't fully committing in a transition. I noticed it more as my legs tired. 

As mentioned before there wasn't as much powder so I didn't really get to test that aspect. The few quick tree runs didn't leave me terribly impressed, it seemed like the nose still had a tendency to bury if I wasn't leaning back. However that could just be the crappy conditions and/or my own false expectations for Rocker tech. To be honest I'm a little paranoid I should have rolled 160 because of that, but then again 2cm shouldn't make THAT much difference. I probably just have to get it into real powder a couple of times.


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## The_Squid (Dec 15, 2008)

I'm also in the same boat as the OP, stuck between the West and the Twenty Five. I was able to demo the Twenty Five and it felt super stable at speed and I could really feel the dampness. It charged really, really well but I'm worried that it might only want to charge and may be less maneuverable than the West is. I wish I could demo the West but they don't have it to demo. I consider myself to be an expert rider, riding 50-70 day seasons out west and don't ride any park or switch. I have a dedicated powder board for deep days and a regular cambered board for groomer days but I'm looking for a board that will be good on the days with a little fresh snow or when I'm hunting for powder so I don't care too much about a super floaty board. I'm just worried that the Twenty Five might be too stiff. Is there a draw back to a board being damp? How stiff does the West ride? Are Never Summer boards typically stiffer than other brands? I've been riding Gnu and Lib-Tech boards primarily before checking these out. I pressed on it and it felt pretty stiff but it's only rated as a medium flex. Are the ripsaw camber profiles on them exactly the same? I can't remember how they compared in the store. I feel like I couldn't go wrong with either but still can't make a decision!


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## llamabrew (Nov 26, 2016)

The_Squid said:


> I'm also in the same boat as the OP, stuck between the West and the Twenty Five. I was able to demo the Twenty Five and it felt super stable at speed and I could really feel the dampness. It charged really, really well but I'm worried that it might only want to charge and may be less maneuverable than the West is. I wish I could demo the West but they don't have it to demo. I consider myself to be an expert rider, riding 50-70 day seasons out west and don't ride any park or switch. I have a dedicated powder board for deep days and a regular cambered board for groomer days but I'm looking for a board that will be good on the days with a little fresh snow or when I'm hunting for powder so I don't care too much about a super floaty board. I'm just worried that the Twenty Five might be too stiff. Is there a draw back to a board being damp? How stiff does the West ride? Are Never Summer boards typically stiffer than other brands? I've been riding Gnu and Lib-Tech boards primarily before checking these out. I pressed on it and it felt pretty stiff but it's only rated as a medium flex. Are the ripsaw camber profiles on them exactly the same? I can't remember how they compared in the store. I feel like I couldn't go wrong with either but still can't make a decision!


I've owned both the 158 and 160 NS25 (I sold the 58 to a friend and got the 60 afterwards). Also my main riding buddy owns the West 161 and we've swapped out boards several times. 

The 25 rides noticeably stiffer than the West. It's the same basic profile, just set back more and stiffer flex and a few other bells and whistles but you can feel the same ripsaw profile underneath the ride. 

When I ride my buddy's West it feels a lot softer and more playful. That said, I prefer the 25 because when I get up to speed the 25 feels a lot more stable and in control. Also it floats better in powder. The West is also a really fun board and it does many of the same things he 25 pulls off but I personally like the super stuff "destroys everything in its path" feel of the 25. Keep in mind though, the 25 is also harder on the legs/ankles after a day breaking through resort chop. You also have to have the technique and leg strength to ride it correctly or else it will remind you who is boss in a hurry. The West is a bit more forgiving.

Back to the 25--there's a big difference between the 158 and 160 models too. 158 a lot more playful, 160 more of a hard charger, carving, powder board.


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## Stavros (Sep 13, 2015)

llamabrew said:


> I've owned both the 158 and 160 NS25 (I sold the 58 to a friend and got the 60 afterwards). Also my main riding buddy owns the West 161 and we've swapped out boards several times.
> 
> The 25 rides noticeably stiffer than the West. It's the same basic profile, just set back more and stiffer flex and a few other bells and whistles but you can feel the same ripsaw profile underneath the ride.
> 
> ...



thank you for the review

how much do you weight>?


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