# tbt vs reverse camber



## slanteye (Dec 26, 2008)

has anyone riden both and which do u perfer?

currently im riding a 09 uninc 155 this year for the most part, havent touch my old boards it rides great and awesome on jumps. but i feel it does lack a bit in the jibbing/buttering department (my old boards arent great and definitely not made for park). so basically ive narrowed it down to 2 types of boards reverse camber like the burton hero or lib tech skate banana, etc OR tbt which is basically only bataleon boards (look these up if u dont know what they are, pretty sick concept). 

How many ppl prefer one to the other?


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## Triple8Sol (Nov 24, 2008)

Riding both this year, I prefer the TBT base. If Bataleon adds magnetraction or a similar technology, I'd prob never ride another brand again.


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## jmacphee9 (Nov 11, 2008)

the UN INC is pretty stiff, definetly a solid jumping board though.
though everytime this thread comes up i say the same thing: the best board ever would be a 0 camber bataleon. the skatey feel of rocker, and some more pop then a regular rocker.

if i had to pick one or the otherrrr i would say tbt, but i feel like bataleon is not too far away from making a rockered board..


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## landonk5 (Aug 19, 2007)

jmacphee9 said:


> the UN INC is pretty stiff, definetly a solid jumping board though.
> though everytime this thread comes up i say the same thing: the best board ever would be a 0 camber bataleon. the skatey feel of rocker, and some more pop then a regular rocker.
> 
> if i had to pick one or the otherrrr i would say tbt, but i feel like bataleon is not too far away from making a rockered board..


i hope they dont. they've been advertising against rockers and
how TBT gives all the benefits of camber without the cons of
rocker. i would hate to see a brand like bataleon fall into the
trend, but making money is first priority for any company.

I <3 my TBT.


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## baldy (Nov 14, 2007)

are bataleons cambered? and do they perform well on ice? i live on the east coast and im really interested in getting a bataleon for next year


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## Gnarly (Mar 12, 2008)

Check out the Omatic Extr-Eco next season. It's reverse camber and "TBT" combined into one.

I think that if Bataleon doesn't do some sort of rocker design, they're going to get left in the dust in the next few seasons. A double rocker (Think Never Summer) + TBT would be sick!



baldy said:


> are bataleons cambered? and do they perform well on ice? i live on the east coast and im really interested in getting a bataleon for next year


Yes, the Bataleon is cambered and they perform pretty well on ice. Not as good as the Never Summer with the Vario Power Grip or a Lib with MTX - but the Bataleon is no slouch either.


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## baldy (Nov 14, 2007)

Gnarly said:


> Check out the Omatic Extr-Eco next season. It's reverse camber and "TBT" combined into one.
> 
> I think that if Bataleon doesn't do some sort of rocker design, they're going to get left in the dust in the next few seasons. A double rocker (Think Never Summer) + TBT would be sick!
> 
> ...


haha i asked this in another post but i don't think i got an answer, i actually have the sl-r and i notice that it grips the ice farely well. but i just don't understand the concept of how it works. mtx is serrated and creates more contact points but to me vario grip is still just 2 contact points on each edge.


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## RidePowder (Oct 30, 2008)

Ive ridden both and TBT rocks my shit.

It transfers edges for you, butters like crazy, my enemy, with a 15mm setback, and the stiffest in their line can tackle rails like it was made for it.


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## v-verb (Feb 1, 2009)

RidePowder said:


> Ive ridden both and TBT rocks my shit.
> 
> It transfers edges for you, butters like crazy, my enemy, with a 15mm setback, and the stiffest in their line can tackle rails like it was made for it.


Justin Lamoreux of the Canadian Snowboard team uses an Enemy and does half pipes I think - I'm getting one of his used Enemy's this week. He's selling a few used bataleons and I'll see if I can get a list and prices


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## Triple8Sol (Nov 24, 2008)

v-verb said:


> Justin Lamoreux of the Canadian Snowboard team uses an Enemy and does half pipes I think - I'm getting one of his used Enemy's this week. He's selling a few used bataleons and I'll see if I can get a list and prices


Good luck with that. I'm sure he's really busy and not on the comp much, but reponses take him several days at a time.


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## v-verb (Feb 1, 2009)

Triple8Sol said:


> Good luck with that. I'm sure he's really busy and not on the comp much, but reponses take him several days at a time.


He's been pretty good with me - usually 1-2 days. Cool guy and I realize he's on trips and comps in the last few weeks etc. Good sense of humor for sure.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

landonk5 said:


> i hope they dont. they've been advertising against rockers and
> how TBT gives all the benefits of camber without the cons of
> rocker. i would hate to see a brand like bataleon fall into the
> trend, but making money is first priority for any company.
> ...


Might want to read this.  The comments are especially interesting.



baldy said:


> haha i asked this in another post but i don't think i got an answer, i actually have the sl-r and i notice that it grips the ice farely well. but i just don't understand the concept of how it works. mtx is serrated and creates more contact points but to me vario grip is still just 2 contact points on each edge.


It's actually 4 contact points on each edge. Look down your sidecut and you'll see where the radius "kinks" and goes into a flat radius. This allows it to grip between the feet.



Gnarly said:


> Check out the Omatic Extr-Eco next season. It's reverse camber and "TBT" combined into one.
> 
> I think that if Bataleon doesn't do some sort of rocker design, they're going to get left in the dust in the next few seasons. A double rocker (Think Never Summer) + TBT would be sick!
> 
> ...


The extr-eco isn't as close to TBT as people think it is. When you run your hand over the base you only feel a slight bump where their B.S technology is. 

Anyone that rides a TBT then hops on a reverse camber or rockered board will feel the difference immediately. Skid a turn and you'll know what I'm talking about.


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## RidePowder (Oct 30, 2008)

avenger do you have aim


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

Only if it involves killing.


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## RidePowder (Oct 30, 2008)

what do you think of the 07-08 k2 darkstar as a park oriented all mountain board. mounted with a pair of union forces or k2 autos. I dont want to hurt my bataleon enemy so I picked up a use darkstar for jibs and jumps


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

Solid choice for sure.


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## Triple8Sol (Nov 24, 2008)

BurtonAvenger said:


> Anyone that rides a TBT then hops on a reverse camber or rockered board will feel the difference immediately. Skid a turn and you'll know what I'm talking about.


Yup, there's a reason why I prefer my TBT over the BTX


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## darkninja (Jan 17, 2009)

I've yet to ride a reversed cambered board because i fear that the 'skate' like feel will make it less stable at high speed.

I've been riding my evil twin, with tbt of course, for a majority of the season and can honestly say its made riding more fun and helped me progress in the park.

I really don't think i can go back to a regular non tbt board now lol. And really think that everyone should at least try a board with tbt for a few runs to see and feel the difference.


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## Gnarly (Mar 12, 2008)

darkninja said:


> I really don't think i can go back to a regular non tbt board now lol. And really think that everyone should at least try a board with tbt for a few runs to see and feel the difference.


I tried to ride a non-TBT board last Saturday for 1 run and I felt very unstable when turning. I had to put all of my concentration into riding and linking turns - it was like I took a big step backward in riding ability.

My friend rode the Airobic all day long too and the next day tried to ride his non-TBT board and said he caught edges all day long and generally hated it. 

I'm sure that after a few days on a non-TBT board, you'd get used to it again, but as for me - I'm not going back.


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## Guest (Feb 24, 2009)

Gnarly said:


> Yes, the Bataleon is cambered and they perform pretty well on ice. Not as good as the Never Summer with the Vario Power Grip or a Lib with MTX - but the Bataleon is no slouch either.



i thought they were flat? until the ends were they curve up they dont look cambered in any pics ive seen :dunno:


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## jmacphee9 (Nov 11, 2008)

zeekman said:


> i thought they were flat? until the ends were they curve up they dont look cambered in any pics ive seen :dunno:


nope, bataleons have a pretty deep camber...im guessing but the airobic and et are about 8mm off the ground in the middle..


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## DiamondCarver (Jan 27, 2009)

Would Rome 390's work better on a K2 Darkstar than Forces for park-oriented all mountain riding? (BTW, i'm looking at next years bindings)


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## Triple8Sol (Nov 24, 2008)

zeekman said:


> i thought they were flat? until the ends were they curve up they dont look cambered in any pics ive seen :dunno:


Nope, they're cambered longitudinally. The TBT is seen laterally.


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## Guest (Feb 25, 2009)

ohh i see lol


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## slanteye (Dec 26, 2008)

hmmm ive always thought tbt was 0 camber, guess i gotta go some more homework haha


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## Guest (Mar 3, 2009)

zeekman said:


> i thought they were flat? until the ends were they curve up they dont look cambered in any pics ive seen :dunno:


Bataleon's website has a good write up on how the TBT works. i have heard great reviews from many riders here in NZ with varied styles of riding and everyone seems to love the TBT technology


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## Ego (Jan 5, 2009)

i guess i still don't follow as to why TBT is better than BTX. what are the cons of reverse camber boards? i was about to order a gnu riders choice btx until i found this thread now i'm thinking i should hold off on that.


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## Gnarly (Mar 12, 2008)

Ego said:


> i guess i still don't follow as to why TBT is better than BTX. what are the cons of reverse camber boards? i was about to order a gnu riders choice btx until i found this thread now i'm thinking i should hold off on that.


BTX still feels like a monster snowboard under your feet (you have to ride a TBT to understand what I'm talking about) and you can still catch an edge if you under/over-rotate spins. BTX is a great shape for a do it all board though. You can hit park & pow with the same board...IMO, that's the only advantage of BTX.


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## Ego (Jan 5, 2009)

gnarly so do you ride tbt or btx? by monster snowboard is it a good thing that it feels like a bigger board as far as stability or it feels like a bigger board as in it is harder to maneuver it? if a btx is a great all around board then what is a tbt good for?


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## Gnarly (Mar 12, 2008)

Ego said:


> gnarly so do you ride tbt or btx? by monster snowboard is it a good thing that it feels like a bigger board as far as stability or it feels like a bigger board as in it is harder to maneuver it? if a btx is a great all around board then what is a tbt good for?


I have ridden TBT (Airobic & Riot) & NS SL-R. By monster snowboard, I mean, edge to edge transition is so much easier on TBT that you will hate riding anything else. I had the misfortune to ride a non-TBT board a week ago for a run or 2 and it felt DOG slow edge to edge compared to my TBT. Hence, it felt like a monster board under my feet...Something I hated.

TBT is great for carving, butters, spinning, hauling ass, uphill/flat portions of the trails & riding switch. Honestly, you have to ride one to really understand. My friend rode my Airobic a week ago and said that going back to his regular board was really hard and he felt like a noob all over again because TBT makes boarding so effortless and gives loads more confidence to try new stuff.

IMHO, the only areas that BTX are better than TBT are riding shorter boards in pow (I mean, have you seen the vids of the guys riding a 156 Banana in pow with centered stance) and making pressing so easy that a retarded monkey could do it. For anything else, I'd take TBT.


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## Guest (Mar 3, 2009)

Gnarly said:


> I have ridden TBT (Airobic & Riot) & NS SL-R. By monster snowboard, I mean, edge to edge transition is so much easier on TBT that you will hate riding anything else. I had the misfortune to ride a non-TBT board a week ago for a run or 2 and it felt DOG slow edge to edge compared to my TBT. Hence, it felt like a monster board under my feet...Something I hated.
> 
> TBT is great for carving, butters, spinning, hauling ass, uphill/flat portions of the trails & riding switch. Honestly, you have to ride one to really understand. My friend rode my Airobic a week ago and said that going back to his regular board was really hard and he felt like a noob all over again because TBT makes boarding so effortless and gives loads more confidence to try new stuff.
> 
> IMHO, the only areas that BTX are better than TBT are riding shorter boards in pow (I mean, have you seen the vids of the guys riding a 156 Banana in pow with centered stance) and making pressing so easy that a retarded monkey could do it. For anything else, I'd take TBT.


did the riot ride alot better due to the sintered base?


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## Gnarly (Mar 12, 2008)

kim.nz said:


> did the riot ride alot better due to the sintered base?


Compared to the SL-R? The Riot is faster than the SL-R and handles speed much better because it has camber.


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## Guest (Mar 3, 2009)

Gnarly said:


> Compared to the SL-R? The Riot is faster than the SL-R and handles speed much better because it has camber.


sorry dude, should have worded my post better. i meant riot vs airobic, is the airobic an extruded base, and the riot sintered?


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## Gnarly (Mar 12, 2008)

kim.nz said:


> sorry dude, should have worded my post better. i meant riot vs airobic, is the airobic an extruded base, and the riot sintered?


The Riot is definitely faster than the Airobic and stiffer. It handles the steep runs and fast lines better for sure.

As for which one is better, it depends on what you're wanting to do. The Airobic slays the butters & jibs while the Riot is awesome to hit big kickers & haul ass/carve on. They each have their place.

But if I were to pick 1 of the 2 - I'd say that unless you're a park rat, get the Riot becasue depending on your weight, it can be pressed decently after it breaks in and can still stomp the huge park jumps...And it more than holds it's own on the whole mountain. I think the Evil Twin would be the sickest all around board ever though.


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## Ego (Jan 5, 2009)

ok...i decided on and ordered the GNU Riders Choice BTX 162W. Checked out Bataleon but can't find a board that comes sized the way I wan't it. Looking for a 162W/163W, Bataleon has 161 and 164. I don't know if Bataleon does this but I know some of the board makers(non-China boards) used to make custom sizes for you for a little extra $$$. I know lots of them will do it as far as surfboards and bodyboards but I know the tech that goes into snowboards is higher as well as the cost of making one and the difficulty factor compared to bodyboards/surfboards. Haven't gotten a response from Bataleon so does anyone know if they do this?


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## jonas007 (Feb 24, 2009)

Gnarly said:


> The Riot is definitely faster than the Airobic and stiffer. It handles the steep runs and fast lines better for sure.
> 
> As for which one is better, it depends on what you're wanting to do. The Airobic slays the butters & jibs while the Riot is awesome to hit big kickers & haul ass/carve on. They each have their place.
> 
> But if I were to pick 1 of the 2 - I'd say that unless you're a park rat, get the Riot becasue depending on your weight, it can be pressed decently after it breaks in and can still stomp the huge park jumps...And it more than holds it's own on the whole mountain. I think the Evil Twin would be the sickest all around board ever though.


I was tossing around getting either a Riot, NS SL-R, or revolver. Which would handle jumps/pipe with the occasional rail/box thrown in?


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## arsenic0 (Nov 11, 2008)

You cant go wrong with any of those boards honestly. You'd want the Evo-R though the Revolver is the wide version.


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## jonas007 (Feb 24, 2009)

I see you have 151 SL-R. I'm 5'6", 165. Would that be the right length for me or should I go a step up?


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## Gnarly (Mar 12, 2008)

jonas007 said:


> I see you have 151 SL-R. I'm 5'6", 165. Would that be the right length for me or should I go a step up?


For all mtn - 151 will be just fine. For pure jib stick, step down.


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