# Do i naturally suck at snowboarding???



## Hannah-2004 (Jan 1, 2020)

so i have been snowboarding since the beginning of last year and my carving really sucks i cant lean back enoughand everything. i cant do rails or anything i can barley do boxes.
i have been trying to improve my riding and carving skills but i still seem like im not getting any better? ??:-(





how many years did it take yall to be a decent carver?


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## Hannah-2004 (Jan 1, 2020)

Hannah-2004 said:


> so i have been snowboarding since the beginning of last year and my carving really sucks i cant lean back enoughand everything. i cant do rails or anything i can barley do boxes.
> i have been trying to improve my riding and carving skills but i still seem like im not getting any better? ??:-(
> 
> 
> ...


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

As long as you’re having fun who cares if you suck?


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## drblast (Feb 28, 2017)

Everyone naturally sucks at snowboarding.

I've been snowboarding for over 20 years off and on and nearly every other day during the season for the last seven years. I'm still not great at anything except going down choppy resort runs at breakneck speeds.


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## Hannah-2004 (Jan 1, 2020)

Jkb818 said:


> As long as you’re having fun who cares if you suck?


true but its fun to get better. Maybe eventually ill get a little better?


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

Of course you’ll get better. Just ride as much as you can.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

You shouldn't be leaning back carving......, need to have your weight forward engaging the front EE on toeside/heelside turns. Keep your stance (arms/shoulders) inline with the boards direction the best you can. Grab some lessons which could be a big plus for you. You can gain helpful skills that you can bring across from skateboarding/surfing/wakeboarding. Some people can pick it up fast and some it takes longer. I was a pretty good skateboarder and really solid competitive surfer (shortboard) so sliding these skills into snowboarding made progress extremely rapid as a novice.


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

I'm a holiday rider, so at the beginning it was 1 week a year for me. I picked up the basics pretty quickly but after that it took me about 5 years to get to point where I really started to enjoy myself and my riding became more instinct than concentration.

I'm now middle aged and snowboarding is one of the few things I'm still getting better at. There's always new things to try/learn.

Except rails.

Rails can go fuck themselves.


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## Paul_k_im (Dec 23, 2019)

Hannah-2004 said:


> so i have been snowboarding since the beginning of last year and my carving really sucks i cant lean back enoughand everything. i cant do rails or anything i can barley do boxes.
> i have been trying to improve my riding and carving skills but i still seem like im not getting any better? ??:-(
> 
> 
> ...


I have been snowboarding for 3 years this is my 4th year snowboarding I have yet to perfect my carving skills not even close to perfection. I can ride only a little on my left (I am a goofy). Don't worry, going into your 2nd- 3rd you will improve so much. When I was in my 1st year I actually slid down on my edge on the easiest course and still managed to fall and tumble don't worry you will get good soon.


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## Hannah-2004 (Jan 1, 2020)

Craig51 said:


> You shouldn't be leaning back carving......, need to have your weight forward engaging the front EE on toeside/heelside turns. Keep your stance (arms/shoulders) inline with the boards direction the best you can. Grab some lessons which could be a big plus for you. You can gain helpful skills that you can bring across from skateboarding/surfing/wakeboarding. Some people can pick it up fast and some it takes longer. I was a pretty good skateboarder and really solid competitive surfer (shortboard) so sliding these skills into snowboarding made progress extremely rapid as a novice.


Thanks so much for the tips ??


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## Hannah-2004 (Jan 1, 2020)

Paul_k_im said:


> I have been snowboarding for 3 years this is my 4th year snowboarding I have yet to perfect my carving skills not even close to perfection. I can't ride switch and can like barley turn on switch. Don't worry going into your 2nd- 3rd you will improve so much. When I was in my 1st year I actually slid down on my edge on the easiest course and still managed to fall and tumble don't worry you will get good soon.


❤


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

Snow Hound said:


> Except rails.
> 
> Rails can go fuck themselves.


???


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

Have you taken any lessons?


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

drblast said:


> ... I'm still not great at anything except going down choppy resort runs at breakneck speeds.


This would be me. It only took me 14 years to even become somewhat acquainted with some semblance of carving. It took years to even figure out basic movements...find the creepy basement vid.


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

Not having the right board makes everything so much harder.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Snow Hound said:


> I'm now middle aged and snowboarding is one of the few things I'm still getting better at. There's always new things to try/learn.
> 
> Except rails.
> 
> Rails can go fuck themselves.


Amen to that 


Hannah, I can relate to you. Fun is nice, but you're right that one can increase the fun factor if being better. I didn't love snowboarding until reaching a certain level. The early years sucked, as I sucked. (Well, in some parts, I still suck at snowboarding, as there are a thousand things I can't do, like I'm a total clown if it comes to switch riding, as I hardly ever exercise, and your rails and boxes would scare the shit out of me ).

But if I look back over the years, I see progression in the type of riding I like (freeriding). I can jump down a dropin and ride a narrow steep chute smoothly having yeeeeha fun where I tomahawked my way down few years back, or would have timidly sideslipped down the dropin (or a combination of both ?). So the fun factor definitely increases as skills increase.

Everyone has a different learning curve... Repetition will make you better, and challenges will make you better. Half of the riding is building up muscle memory, i.e. riding becoms second skin. For this, you need time on slope. Simple as that. The other half is a mind game. Overcoming timidity, overcoming bad habits. That's the basis for working on fine tuning of what you already learned.

With many things, one never stops to improve. Like carving. It took me more than a decade (hey Wrath, we're the same old slow learners, lol) till I would call what I did carving. And I'm still working at improving it. Lower, faster, smoother... there's always room for getting better.

What helped me to get over lag phases in the carving learning curve is a) riding with better riders and monitor them, b) take multiburst photos of them AND me doing moves, and go through them frame by frame, to check, how my body position is vs. theirs in any second of the carve. (Turned out that my mistake for years was hidden very early in the initiation, lol.)

Have fun! (And ride low, weight on front foot )

BTW: agree to the above posts about having the wrong board and taking lessons. Doing the same thing a thousand times the wrong way will only increase your risk to get a bad habit deep into your muscle memory. Thus, a lesson could help to boost your learning curve. And if you're on a ill fitting board for you and your aims, the curve gets shallower as well.


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

I loved snowboarding before I even strapped in


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## Scalpelman (Dec 5, 2017)

I rode intermittently for decades and was average at everything. 7 years ago my son and I went all in. I took a private lesson at the beginning and that helped my heelside carves. 

I learned immensely from reading other’s and posting my own on this forum in the past couple years. And a lot was gleaned from watching vids online. But my skills took off the moment I rid myself from my worn out soft Burton Moto boots and lifeless flat profile plank of a deck. The RCR profile allowed my carving and drop in skills immensely. Now I’m a bit of a board whore. Every deck has its niche and I know when to use them. 
The progression will end when I’m too old and weak to strap in.


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## BurtonAvenger (Aug 14, 2007)

I get paid to snowboard and I suck. Carving is like golf, it's easy to learn the basics but to get good takes a lot of time and practice. It's knowing the subtleties of when to engage your edge, how flexing your back knee in at certain points can change the edge control, it's understanding ankle steering, hip roll, when to put your hands down, how to manipulate a flex point. It does not come easy and most people will never get past the linking a transitional carve from toe to heel. The more you do it the more you proceed at getting better. 

Watch any of the Yearning for Turning, Moss Snow Stick, Gentem, Offshore Snow Shapes, Antti Autti, Yawgoons edits and you'll see the subtle complexities of it and it should visually give you a way of learning.


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

I started snowboarding 2 years ago (around 120 days on snow, would be 200 if I lived in the mountains) and progressed quickly to basic carving (like 10 days on snow) cos I took an instructor the first day, got my basics first, watched all the youtube vids on progression (Snowboard Addiction are the best imo) and, what is the most important, I got filmed myself every single time for the first 10 days or so. I thought I’m centered on the board and when I saw myself filmed I was wondering if it is a poor attempt of a tail press at turning.

If you are stoked on riding, reasonably fit and really want to progress you will do that. Post here a vid of yourself riding, there must be some basic mistakes that hamper your progress and it is very likely that once you get rid of them you will jump to basic carving in ~~10 days. It wont happen overnight but 2 weeks on snow with a proper plan and its implementation change a lot at the early stage.

Since I started I’ve introduced to this sport like 9 of my friends, half of them are carving/on the verge of carving after ~~25 days on snow. Their different progression pace is mostly down to how motivated they are to progress, not to just travel on a snowboard and have a mountain trip to the Alps. One of my friends spent the first 3 days on a bunny hill with kids dialing his basic turns while others were more into heelside leaf travels on red slopes (or blacks in the US) as soon as they could. Yeah, they had better photos on insta that first days but guess who can post better insta movies now 

Or take the example of my skier sister and my brother (yeah, working on converting them).
The sis has been a skier for the past 5 years or so, around 40 days on snow. My bro started 2 years ago, also around 40 days (only cos he has a kid now).
The difference is massive. My sis is a self learner with her friends, they all compliment each other on how quickly they’ve ‚progressed to blacks’ but they simply skid/plow around reds/blacks. My bro has taken lessons early, asked me to film him, fixed his hip alignment and other common problems and is skiing better than 90 % of the people you see on the weekends who call themselves advanced as they have been sk for 10 + years.
The first time I went to the mountains with the sis and her friends what they asked about after a warm up was where are reds/blacks as blues (what Knapton rides) are too nooby. Saw her plowing around, filmed it, showed it to her to compare it to my bro’s riding. She immidiately booked an instructor for her next trip.

The sad part is that the progress slows down immensely later on.


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## SEWiShred (Jan 19, 2019)

You need to find something you want to get good at and practice. Snowboarding is a sport, it rewards you with hard work and educating yourself on how to be better. There's all the info you need to get good on youtube and this forum. You just need to focus. You are trying to jib and carve, choose one you want to get good at and focus on it. 

I started with wanting to be able to carve, then I worked on jumps. After that, I worked towards the boardercross course because I can combine both skills there. I am getting confident there, so I got a jib board on sale at the end of last season. I've been a season pass holder at my little midwestern hill for 10 years, and I generally go two to three times a week for between 2 and 8 hours without much rest in the day.

I don't know how old you are, if you were actually born in 2004 you are starting a lot earlier than I did. I started as soon as I got out of college. You are very lucky and if you really are around 16 years old you have a lot of potential to train and get really good. Just don't hit your head and give yourself a concussion. Snowboarding seriously is a very fine line between pushing yourself hard and not hurting yourself. 

Everything you need to learn is on YouTube with good videos. Find one thing you want to get good at (to start with), and practice practice practice and study study study. You can go there and have fun on the greens and maybe blues and ride casually. Or you can take it seriously. But it's up to you if you want to spend your time chilling and riding easy or if you want to treat it more like training for a sport.


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## timmytard (Mar 19, 2009)

Snowdaddy said:


> I loved snowboarding before I even strapped in


Me to.
I had done it in my head so many times before I ever tried it.
I knew what needed to be done to snowboard.
Nobody told me about that front side toe catch though & I had never seen one on film.
That was a nasty surprise. haha


TT


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Yeahti87 said:


> ... and progressed quickly to basic carving (like 10 days on snow)


I'm pretty sure you talk about "turning" and not "carving". It's not the same. 
Carving is a specific type of turn. Every carve is a turn, but not every turn is a carve. 10d into snowboarding, nobody is carving, even if talented and instructor guided. Scarving, maybe.


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

neni said:


> I'm pretty sure you talk about "turning" and not "carving". It's not the same.
> Carving is a specific type of turn. Every carve is a turn, but not every turn is a carve. 10d into snowboarding, nobody is carving, even if talented and instructor guided. Scarving, maybe.


So very much this. With few exceptions (Hannah seems to be one), everyone thinks they're doing far better than they actually are. This is a specific example of Dunning-Kruger Syndrome. When you get more experience and actually start getting good, you begin to realize how far down the learning curve you actually are.


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

...although the fact that Yeahti87 got a lesson early probably puts them ahead of 90% of noobs.


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

My girlfriend has been riding for almost twenty years. I started last season. 

I think I got like 8-10 lessons snowboarding my first year and got 30ish days on snow. More if you count skiing which I tried for a month or two first (including around 8 lessons as well). I'm thirty and didn't want to learn by failing and hurting myself at first so I took lessons so I could get help that way. I still hurt myself pretty good at the end of the season but I think that was a bit of a freak thing... Though more experience would have really helped. 

Im comfortable riding most black terrain, can do moguls, some easier tree runs, blue runs riding switch, etc. I can finally start to carve a bit though I still get spooked and bail out when the edge fully engages sometimes lol. 

Now I'm starting to get into some more flatland stuff and wanting to learn how to do proper Ollie's, 180/360s, and really want to learn to do butters. 

That's my goal for this season:
-work on carving 
-work in riding switch
-work on ollies
-work on Ollie's to 180/360 and off side hits and features
-learn to do nose/tail rolls, presses, and butters
-maybe attempt to do tables and an easy rail, but this isn't really what I'm interested in at all right now. I don't want to break myself any more. 

Long goal is to do some split boarding stuff! 

Happy new year everyone!


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Donutz said:


> So very much this. With few exceptions (Hannah seems to be one), everyone thinks they're doing far better than they actually are. This is a specific example of Dunning-Kruger Syndrome. When you get more experience and actually start getting good, you begin to realize how far down the learning curve you actually are.


Problem is that lots of ppl don't use (don't know?) the term properly and just call any turn/curve a carve. Resently watched a REI instruction video with a title like "how to to carve" but the vid was just about turning, sliding through turns/scarves. Which is not bad, it's ok to slide tirns. But it's not carving.


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

What's a scarve? S carve or skidded carve /turn? 

I'm confused lol


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

I’m very well aware of what a turn, a scarve and a carve is. This is not to brag about how fast you progress, some progress quicker, some much slower, depending on the commitment, physical shape, guidance/training, gear etc. One of my friends who started this season is progressing quicker than me. He took lessons, is commited and has more experienced riders around every time he is on the slope.
My freestyle is progression is much slower and I know many who progress at that matter quicker. My focus has always been to turn well. And there will be always something to improve there as I’m not a guy from the Korua or Slice and Dice series. This season is on freestyle to bring my game up there.

Day 1 (even the jacket is borrowed from a friend)


http://imgur.com/a/KzJOo84


Day 2 (my friend who was filming is regular and I started to learn like this, it was easier to mimick him, then realised that due to 2 accidents to my right knee my left leg is stronger and in a long run it will be better to ride goofy)


http://imgur.com/a/BUjX2P6


Day 7-8 (mellow run, could turn on a crowded slope, if it was a red slope all the bad habits were back)


http://imgur.com/a/yR6wuMx


Day 10-12 (yes, there is scarving involved but I was already able to put the board on the edge at the apex of the carve and make some thin lines in between the scarves. That’s why I said ‚basic carving’.


http://imgur.com/a/QxILq2T


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## MCrides (Feb 25, 2019)

Yeahti87 said:


> The difference is massive. My sis is a self learner with her friends, they all compliment each other on how quickly they’ve ‚progressed to blacks’ but they simply skid/plow around reds/blacks. My bro has taken lessons early, asked me to film him, fixed his hip alignment and other common problems and is skiing better than 90 % of the people you see on the weekends who call themselves advanced as they have been sk for 10 + years.


Such an important point right here, Hannah. If you want to cap out your skills looking like 9/10 snowboarders you can see from the lift--skidding around willy nilly, never riding their edges, can't really go straight, scared of bumps, etc--then just keep riding without a plan. If you want to be a _good_ snowboarder, you need to be intentional about your progression. There's nothing wrong with either route, but IMO you're missing out on most of the fun snowboarding has to offer if you limit yourself that way.


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

neni said:


> I'm pretty sure you talk about "turning" and not "carving". It's not the same.
> Carving is a specific type of turn. Every carve is a turn, but not every turn is a carve. 10d into snowboarding, nobody is carving, even if talented and instructor guided. Scarving, maybe.





Donutz said:


> So very much this. With few exceptions (Hannah seems to be one), everyone thinks they're doing far better than they actually are. This is a specific example of Dunning-Kruger Syndrome. When you get more experience and actually start getting good, you begin to realize how far down the learning curve you actually are.


I'm sorry guys but you'll have to take my word for it. By day 5 I was putting the board on edge and following the sidecut, transferring to the opposite edge and repeating. No skidding or sliding whatsoever. I had no idea what I was doing but I can picture the sensation like it was yesterday, even though it was 15 years ago. Mellow and uniform blue runs only but it was definitely happening.


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

Snow Hound said:


> I'm sorry guys but you'll have to take my word for it. By day 5 I was putting the board on edge and following the sidecut, transferring to the opposite edge and repeating. No skidding or sliding whatsoever. I had no idea what I was doing but I can picture the sensation like it was yesterday, even though it was 15 years ago. Mellow and uniform blue runs only but it was definitely happening.


I had basic beginner carves down the first week as well. I'm not pretending to be an advanced rider in any way but it's a bit about having something to aim for. Before my first week of riding I had watched a lot of Knapton, Korua and other snowboarding movies and knew what I had to accomplish my first season 

I also remember that feeling when I was suddenly actually riding along the edge.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

ridethecliche said:


> What's a scarve? S carve or skidded carve /turn?
> 
> I'm confused lol


Skidded turn


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Cool

but the video are turning not carving 

by the way compliment for your fast learning 


the main Point for make progress is to understand what we are doing wrong and why?

if you are not able to do yourself ask to someone with more experience more tecnichs or take lesson that it could be better 

and do not forget that like every other speed sport you will hit yourself trying that 

it is normal it is part the job


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

Snow Hound said:


> I'm sorry guys but you'll have to take my word for it. By day 5 I was putting the board on edge and following the sidecut, transferring to the opposite edge and repeating. No skidding or sliding whatsoever. I had no idea what I was doing but I can picture the sensation like it was yesterday, even though it was 15 years ago. Mellow and uniform blue runs only but it was definitely happening.


Oh, I believe you. It's not a stretch, especially if that was what you were concentrating on. But that's only a small part of being a good snowboarder. I was throwing carves by the end of my first season too, but by no stretch of the imagination was I at the level I am now in general terms. And I'm _still _only an intermediate snowboarder.

It's not the stuff that you know you don't know that'll kill you, it's the stuff you don't even know you don't know.


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## ridethecliche (Feb 27, 2019)

Snowdaddy said:


> I had basic beginner carves down the first week as well. I'm not pretending to be an advanced rider in any way but it's a bit about having something to aim for. Before my first week of riding I had watched a lot of Knapton, Korua and other snowboarding movies and knew what I had to accomplish my first season
> 
> I also remember that feeling when I was suddenly actually riding along the edge.


I remember too. I almost fell off because all of a sudden I realized how leaned over I was and got spooked. 

I managed to do hop turns when I was up at jay with the instructor. That was awesome!


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

I think snowboarding is different for everyone. There is no set rules to define what is considered a good snowboarder. If you judge Jeremy Jones based on his freestyle ability, it's equally silly to judge Mark McMorries based on his freeride ability.
I think the best part of snowboarding is riding at your own pace and be excited about riding.
As for your progression, not bad for 5 days. Just like anything, it's easy to get going but will take a long time to perfect it.


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

Looking back I also sucked for a long time but it was mostly because I had to rent and could only afford 1 or 2 days a season. I still loved it tho. 
Once I finally got my first board I still could barely get lift tickets and spent way more time hiking sledding hills and building jumps with my brother I almost always landed on my ass. If I could ollie up a hay bail and 180 off I felt like a total pro. It was always such a big deal if I ever made it up to one of the shitty little local hills. 
But then one year the planets lined up and I got a job at a ski hill and moved up there. I finally began sucking a little less. Riding with my friends and trying just to keep up was probably what got me out of suckdom. After months of riding I was finally at the point of realizing stuff like if I wanted to carve better I'd need stiffer boots, few years later I could finally afford higher end bindings. In my mind at the time I didn't suck but I still would have thought skidding turns was how your supposed to do it. 
So just don't sweat it, it will take quite a bit of time, like years realistically. If you love it and put in the time it will all eventually fall into place.


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

Snow Hound said:


> I'm sorry guys but you'll have to take my word for it. By day 5 I was putting the board on edge and following the sidecut, transferring to the opposite edge and repeating. No skidding or sliding whatsoever. I had no idea what I was doing but I can picture the sensation like it was yesterday, even though it was 15 years ago. Mellow and uniform blue runs only but it was definitely happening.


I think I need to add to this that 15 years later, with an upcoming trip all I can think about is working on my carving.

I'm now a decent holiday rider which is all I could ever hope for. A little better than the guy who convinced me to go on that first trip, which is a source of much amusement.


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

Noone said here that the first very imperfect carves make you a carver, let alone an advanced snowboarder as some of the replies would suggest. 100 days on snow after that and I still have a lot to improve even though I carve much much better.

The thing that lets you improve is that you are aware of your shortcomings and compare your riding to the experts. Does it make you better than 90 % of the people you see on the weekends? Yes, among them you are ‚an expert’, they are capped at lower intermediate level forever, much like many people who have been snowboarding without the proper mindset to improve for decades.

It was only a reply to the statement that you cannot START making basic carves around 10 day on snow. Someone having a solid longboarding background, riding perfect conditions and having an instructor for more than 2 hours the first day can START to carve quickly. And that person will be still progressing and fine tuning it for hundreds of hundreds days on snow if they still maintain their awareness that their carving is imperfect.


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Hannah-2004 said:


> how many years did it take yall to be a decent carver?


I figured out what actually laying an edge down was at like day 15-20, would say I was "carving" at day 25-30, then i left my little Midwest bunny hills, bought an epic pass, figured out the wonders of wide boards and have been carving low ever since, probably could have learned faster if I took lessons, but I just bought a season pass and just practiced on my own, absolutely no replacement for putting in endless laps on Brecks super wide blue groomer runs! If you can do at least 20-30 days a year, it should come to you eventually, good luck!


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

You are what you ride...thus terrain and conditions are a huge factor in suckage. Waay back I would watch yt vids of folks on a big open groomer or bowl ripping nice turns and go wtf. The reason for wtf was because at my little hill there were no nice big open, perfectly sloped manicured groomers...every thing was narrow, steep, with minimal grooming. If I were in my early 20's I'd have a different game plan; but at 61 its just live to ride another day. Thus my style is still shit, haphazard geezer stayin alive. So yes, still suck, don't give a fuck...am in my happy place. Ride for your soul!


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

@16gkid is that you in the clip? What angles are you running? Currently playing price drop chicken on a 19/20 SP. Third year running now but I'm ready.


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

I hope that It will not became a race about it 

Who is the best or who is not on carving

snowboard is a hard sport if you want to improve your skill, and it takes time, long time.

laydown the harm it is something  cool but it is an exercise of stylish nothing more
And in Carving this is wrong 

it is call Eurocarving or Extracarving And it is like the Telemark for the sky an exercise of stylish

put the harm down and progression go down with th speed it is fun but it is not carving 

for carving, ti have to push and pull constantly


the carve it is mean for generate speed out of the apex and be fast in the track, and again put the harm down will make you more slow 

anyway it is cool and I like too to do

Again no one is enough talented to became a carver with out pratique and some powerful fall of on the ice for many season 
;-)


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Snow Hound said:


> @16gkid is that you in the clip? What angles are you running? Currently playing price drop chicken on a 19/20 SP. Third year running now but I'm ready.


Yes sir, 18/-12 is my usual, I can't recommend the SP enough, it carves, it chunders, and it pows! Got 6 boards but the SP easily gets the most play


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Olivetta said:


> I hope that It will not became a race about it
> 
> Who is the best or who is not on carving
> 
> ...


I bet this guy hardboots


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

16gkid said:


> I bet this guy hardboots


What do you mean?


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Olivetta said:


> What do you mean?


Hardbooters love showing up in carving threads and try to tell people the "rules" and "laws" of carving not realizing it's 2019 and their old school perception of it is not how the majority of people now think of it


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Every single category has a technique

carving request some techniques Eurocavring other 

for sure you will have fan to do it but again carving on the apex it is something different that put yourself donw on the ground like you was a compass 

sorry if I gave a bad impression that I am judge someone 

I am only tell you that what you are doing is eruocarving and not carving 

just for be clear I am a bigfun of Eurocarving I love Eurocarving and I use a soft-boats 

but if someone ask for carving 

does not make sense to show off regular Turn or Euorocarve


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

Olivetta said:


> Every single category has a technique
> 
> carving request some techniques Eurocavring other
> 
> ...


To start Eurocarving you need to have what you call ‚a true carve’ at a decent level already.


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

Check out the official NZ instructor guide. My Bible last season. Go to the section ‚Advanced Carving’.



https://www.nzsia.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/SBINZ_Manual_2017.pdf


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Olivetta said:


> I am only tell you that what you are doing is eruocarving and not carving


And are you the carving police? I would never describe what I do as eurocarve so already we have a problem, and again more judging that was unasked for


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

16gkid said:


> And are you the carving police? I would never describe what I do as eurocarve so already we have a problem, and again more judging that was unasked for


Well, there is a decent Eurocarve on the toeside edge. It can be improved, it’s not the Korua guys level but come on, let’s call a spade a spade lol.


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Yeahti87 said:


> Well, there is a decent Eurocarve on the toeside edge. It can be improved, it’s not the Korua guys level but come on, let’s call a spade a spade lol.


Yeah I'm not quite at your level yet


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

16gkid said:


> Yeah I'm not quite at your level yet


Did I say that I’m doing it any better than you? That was a thumb up to your vid lol.


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Yeahti87 said:


> Check out the official NZ instructor guide. My Bible last season. Go to the section ‚Advanced Carving’.
> 
> 
> 
> https://www.nzsia.org/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/SBINZ_Manual_2017.pdf


 Thanks for the link 

I will looking it


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

16gkid said:


> And are you the carving police? I would never describe what I do as eurocarve so already we have a problem, and again more judging that was unasked for


there is a reason why you feeling that I am against you?

and why are you attaching me?


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Hannah-2004 said:


> so i have been snowboarding since the beginning of last year and my carving really sucks i cant lean back enoughand everything. i cant do rails or anything i can barley do boxes.
> i have been trying to improve my riding and carving skills but i still seem like im not getting any better? ??:-(
> 
> 
> ...


the carving is beautiful but it is about to put an amount of weight in a specific point of the table

for do it you need to have a good balance of the table

many people at the beginning use the forse to make turn and in the carving this is wrong

I do not if this is could be your case

a good exercise is the balance board

the balance board at home will be helpful for you to understand where you put your weight on the board


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

After that we know that you have a good balance on the board we can start to make the right path for start to carving


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

16gkid said:


> And are you the carving police? I would never describe what I do as eurocarve so already we have a problem, and again more judging that was unasked for


Wow, 16gkid, I just watched your vid. Awesome progression! That's some sweet (euro)carving you're doing there. 
I too would call it euro, too, as you're nicely stretched out; if you want to call that judging, then it's a positive judging as IMO, it's harder to do a stretched out eurocarve than carve; lot of core stability needed. I usually fail to hold them. Have you used Knapton's vids to exersise or taken lessons? As nobody in my pack does that type of carving, I can't monitor them, but Knaptons vids - as nice they are to watch - fail to be informative enough to me to help me to progress.


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

neni said:


> Wow, 16gkid, I just watched your vid. Awesome progression! That's some sweet (euro)carving you're doing there.
> I too would call it euro, too, as you're nicely stretched out; if you want to call that judging, then it's a positive judging as IMO, it's harder to do a stretched out eurocarve than carve; lot of core stability needed. I usually fail to hold them. Have you used Knapton's vids to exersise or taken lessons? As nobody in my pack does that type of carving, I can't monitor them, but Knaptons vids - as nice they are to watch - fail to be informative enough to me to help me to progress.


can you explain what is the problem that you feeling?

or maybe you can open an other discussion

normally the big comone mistake n Eurocarve it to use
the three step for Carving 

instead to use the

the four step for euro carving


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

neni said:


> Wow, 16gkid, I just watched your vid. Awesome progression! That's some sweet (euro)carving you're doing there.
> I too would call it euro, too, as you're nicely stretched out; if you want to call that judging, then it's a positive judging as IMO, it's harder to do a stretched out eurocarve than carve; lot of core stability needed. I usually fail to hold them. Have you used Knapton's vids to exersise or taken lessons? As nobody in my pack does that type of carving, I can't monitor them, but Knaptons vids - as nice they are to watch - fail to be informative enough to me to help me to progress.


While I don’t strech out as much as this guy during a Eurocarve yet I can tell you that your core is probably strong enough to handle it. What I found to be the obstacle to progress in my case was this combination of the board angulation and the fore-aft movement during the carve.
My ankles, especially the front foot one, were too unstable to hold the board like that. Like the board starts to wiggle/chatter a lot and you freak out and stop the carve.


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

If you feel unstable on one feet 

probably you did not charge it correctly on the step before

but for laydown the harm we have to stop to speak about balance on the board

and we have to start to speak about three contact point on the ground and how we are able to arrive on that position and how we will be able to take of from


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Olivetta said:


> can you explain what is the problem that you feeling?


I don't find the momentum/strength/right moment+right move (?) to get back up.

In a normal/basic/butt-out/non-stretched/non-euro carve like in first pics, there's angulation in hip n knees, so there's motion range to push through apex and accelerate, fun and works fine going fast or slow, varying radius works fine, too.

But going stretched out and on the arm, I'm like a helpless beetle, I don't find the way to get up again and usyally finish the carve flat on my belly, like in second pic, where I ate a lot of snow .


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

neni said:


> I don't find the momentum/strength/right moment+right move (?) to get back up.
> 
> In a normal/basic/butt-out/non-stretched/non-euro carve like in first pics, there's angulation in hip n knees, so there's motion range to push through apex and accelerate, fun and works fine going fast or slow, varying radius works fine, too.
> 
> But going stretched out and on the arm, I'm like a helpless beetle, I don't find the way to get up again and usyally finish the carve flat on my belly, like in second pic, where I ate a lot of snow .


Make sense 

before everything can I ask your boots size your angle and the wist width of your board?For eurocarving we need
a wide board or 
small feet or 
high inclination binding


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

Can we use the term eurosliding too? I feel like that's a better description in most cases.


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

by the way

like you know

in carving there is three main poin in the corner:

entrance
apex
Exit

and for every single of this step we have to move in one way

because if we move
we create the right pressione for curve hour board.

Inded we can tell that:

Entance = push your knee
apex = you are at the low moment of your pushing and you will start to pull the knee 
Exit = you are pulling your knee and you are looking forward for the new corner and starting to pull again 

but in Eurocarve or euro slide this system does not work

in eurocarving you have to adopt a 4 step system


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

edit


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Olivetta said:


> muse why not
> 
> We n the end is exactly like you said


why not?

I agree


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Olivetta said:


> muse why not
> 
> We n the end is exactly like you said



one question how i can modify the message, when I wrote something wrong?


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Olivetta said:


> Make sense
> 
> before everything can I ask your boots size your angle and the wist width of your board?For eurocarving we need
> a wide board or
> ...


Boot size is mondo 24.5 (euro 38); angles are +24/-6, stance width 58cm, (formerly I had fwd angles abt +27/+12, but with the anatomical twist in my knee/shin/ankle, I found a mild duck stance less strainful on my knees). 

All my boards are wide enough for those angles and stance width so I don't boot out, even if board is tilted to 45° on firm ground. I only boot out in soft snow sinking in deep as toe strap catches snow.

Stats of current decks:

Never Summer Lady West 156, waist 24.1, radius 7.5, effective edge 120
Custom made trad. camber 156, ww 23.9, r 7.5, ee 121
Jones Flagship 154, ww 24.3, r 7.7, ee 116
Jones Hovercraft 150, ww 24.7, r 7.9, ee 118

(Hovy is for sale, tho. It kills my feet putting it on edge as it is too wide; I have Morton's Neuroma in feet, so there's only that much pressure I can endure to get leverage)

Boots n bindings are the stiffest/most responsive of women's gear to find. 32 XLT and NOW Conda.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Olivetta said:


> one question how i can modify the message, when I wrote something wrong?


Use the Edit function behind the three dots


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## Paxford (Jan 7, 2019)

What is this nonsense. ESL is one thing, but this is jibberish. Oli look in to a better translator before posting. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

in the Eurocarving,

you have to make FOUR step:

essenzialy you have to ad one step and shift the others

Pre-entrance= put you board perpendicular on the slop and starting to push down your knee until you will arrive at minimum that you can do

your board is flat

Entrance=you are at the low moment of your pushing down and you will start to pull up the knee and contemporany turn your shulders, and your turning is starting.
Looking forward to the exit corner and start to put down the harm

Apex= Your legs are completley extended and you are sliding on the ground all time that your speed is able to give you, like a compass

Exit= you are pushing the knee and you are looking forward for the new corner
In this moment you will be able to came out of the corner by the centrifuge-Power that the corner will be able to give to you


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

neni said:


> Use the Edit function behind the three dots


Thanks


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Sorry i


Paxford said:


> What is this nonsense. ESL is one thing, but this is jibberish. Oli look in to a better translator before posting.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It was my iPhone 

but you are right

again sorry


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

neni said:


> Boot size is mondo 24.5 (euro 38); angles are +24/-6, stance width 58cm, (formerly I had fwd angles abt +27/+12, but with the anatomical twist in my knee/shin/ankle, I found a mild duck stance less strainful on my knees).
> 
> All my boards are wide enough for those angles and stance width so I don't boot out, even if board is tilted to 45° on firm ground. I only boot out in soft snow sinking in deep as toe strap catches snow.
> 
> ...


I have 26cm mondosize with +15 and -15 duck
My board, Wolkl squad Prime 156W, has a waist 26,5cm
In Front sometime the board touch and in the back i can not go down more than certen angle otherwise i will touch

Esenzialy you have half centimeter less than me that it mens that it could be touch in the extreme angle


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

I think we've sidetracked here. For some reason I missed this or it hasn't been posted. I suspect it will help much more than pictures of crazy eurocarves as I think the issue deeper than just carving and gets down to proper basics.


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Yep this thread has been officially hardbooted out!


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## Snow Hound (Jul 21, 2012)

Derailed! The exact opposite of a proper carve.


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

f00bar said:


> I think we've sidetracked here. For some reason I missed this or it hasn't been posted. I suspect it will help much more than pictures of crazy eurocarves as I think the issue deeper than just carving and gets down to proper basics.


I agree


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Thank God for all these carving teachers


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

By the way for who want to go better In carving I suggest an interesting exercise for understand if we are central or not on the snowboard

sometime we do not realise that we are not in the Center And that why sometimes we are not able to make a good carve

you have to take a stick and put it on your shoulder and ride with that

looking for put in the same line the shoulder and the snowboard

There is a video that maybe it will be more clear

It Is made by hour Italian team of border cross


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## 2by2handsofblue (Mar 7, 2017)

Everyone sucks at. But some folks are just better at it. 

Sent from my SM-G965U1 using Tapatalk


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

I agree


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## speedjason (May 2, 2013)

You are only as good as the effort you put in.


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## kieloa (Sep 20, 2019)

The wise understand by themselves; fools follow the reports of others.


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## Hannah-2004 (Jan 1, 2020)

BurtonAvenger said:


> I get paid to snowboard and I suck. Carving is like golf, it's easy to learn the basics but to get good takes a lot of time and practice. It's knowing the subtleties of when to engage your edge, how flexing your back knee in at certain points can change the edge control, it's understanding ankle steering, hip roll, when to put your hands down, how to manipulate a flex point. It does not come easy and most people will never get past the linking a transitional carve from toe to heel. The more you do it the more you proceed at getting better.
> 
> Watch any of the Yearning for Turning, Moss Snow Stick, Gentem, Offshore Snow Shapes, Antti Autti, Yawgoons edits and you'll see the subtle complexities of it and it should visually give you a way of learning.


 thanks i definitely will watch them ?


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## Hannah-2004 (Jan 1, 2020)

neni said:


> Amen to that
> 
> 
> Hannah, I can relate to you. Fun is nice, but you're right that one can increase the fun factor if being better. I didn't love snowboarding until reaching a certain level. The early years sucked, as I sucked. (Well, in some parts, I still suck at snowboarding, as there are a thousand things I can't do, like I'm a total clown if it comes to switch riding, as I hardly ever exercise, and your rails and boxes would scare the shit out of me ).
> ...


Thanks so much for all the help


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## Hannah-2004 (Jan 1, 2020)

timmytard said:


> Me to.
> I had done it in my head so many times before I ever tried it.
> I knew what needed to be done to snowboard.
> Nobody told me about that front side toe catch though & I had never seen one on film.
> ...


First time I thought I was gonna go straight down the hill didn’t even think about stopping.firsttime actually going I couldn’t even stand up on the board??


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## Rip154 (Sep 23, 2017)

Those poor boardercrossers with sticks on their necks! It's not enough having to wear matching outfits?


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

I was hoping to see a yardsale!


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Well if in the end you will win an Olympic gold 

why not


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Rip154 said:


> Those poor boardercrossers with sticks on their necks! It's not enough having to wear matching outfits?


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

I took a full day lesson at Whistler today (I'm in significant pain right now, thanks for asking). I've been riding for ten years now, getting at least 25-30 days per season, and I've taken at least one lesson every season. The instructor today _still _found issues with my riding that I could improve on. And not platitudes, either--stuff that I could feel right away worked better.

Mind you, it's more subtle things these days, rather than "board points downhill, stupid" kind of stuff. But the point is that you'll always have room to improve. "Sucking" just means you aren't satisfied with where you are.


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

There's probably always going to be a gap between where I want to be and where my abilities actually are. That gap is where progression lives. It's an alright place to hang out.


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Olivetta said:


> Well if in the end you will win an Olympic gold
> 
> why not


I cant tell if this guy has been trolling us the whole time


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## Paxford (Jan 7, 2019)

kieloa said:


> The wise understand by themselves; fools follow the reports of others.


Exactly. This includes following the advice of some instructors. You have to be mindful.


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Paxford said:


> Exactly. This includes following the advice of some instructors. You have to be mindful.


Same with this website, lots of people giving riding and board advice, you look through their history and they've been riding for like 2 years


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## Paxford (Jan 7, 2019)

Yep, I came here for some technical board advice and found out right quick most people don’t know wtf they are talking about. It’s a sad state. You can’t blame them though. Snowboarding companies defined the sport and people bought in to it, so people’s advice is through that lens. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

16gkid said:


> Same with this website, lots of people giving riding and board advice, you look through their history and they've been riding for like 2 years


I appreciate you’ve found time to dig into the history but all the info you had to Sherlock was clearly stated here in the discussion from the get go. You should start reading the posts with comprehension.

Find a post where I’ve given any piece of advice on how to spin 360 (did it maybe 1-2 times in a shitty form) or jib (I don’t do it at all). 
I’ve owned 14~~ widely acclaimed boards for the past 2 years or better 120 days on-snow so far with the constant strive to progress. I even call it myself ‚can’t comment on how it carves yet’ if there were no conditions to let ME evaluate it and compare it to
the ~~ 24 boards I’ve ridden for at least a day.

This is MY experience with the gear and because of other people sharing THEIR experience here I’ve snagged some great boards that turned out to be exactly what they’ve reported (e.g. the Archetype testimonies from F1EA, Craig51 and others here that gave me the idea that it is more on the freeride side than a pow stick, Phedder’s vid showed the playfullness of it etc). And many other posters here who have helped me to make a rational decision and back up my knowledge about the boards what initially comes from the reviewers.

You should refer to the content and bash it with logic if it’s wrong. This forum is to discuss and if you call something a bullshit call it a bullshit but provide the rationale behind it.

And yeah, it is a funny forum. 
When a native speaker snowflakes on a straightforward compliment to him and pulls up a ‚don’t be so judgmental’ drama on others you’d think they are a very fragile little soul that needs appreciation and some love in this world. But then you look through their recent history and you find them calling the unarguably friendly SPC ‚fuckin kooks’ just because they think that they are jumping on the hate bandwagon and then, the bandwagon gets derailed by Angry as TJ is his friend and they get hushed makes you laugh.

If not for the vid I’d say it must be a 14-year-old girl with a borderline personality ??


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Yeahti87 said:


> I appreciate you’ve found time to dig into the history but all the info you had to Sherlock was clearly stated here in the discussion from the get go. You should start reading the posts with comprehension.
> 
> Find a post where I’ve given any piece of advice on how to spin 360 (did it maybe 1-2 times in a shitty form) or jib (I don’t do it at all).
> I’ve owned 14~~ widely acclaimed boards for the past 2 years or better 120 days on-snow so far with the constant strive to progress. I even call it myself ‚can’t comment on how it carves yet’ if there were no conditions to let ME evaluate it and compare it to
> ...


I suggest do not lose your time

you can not fill a full bottle 


by the way I printed the NZ book and I am startingt to read

quite interesting (the first chapter are about how make a link with the client, quite boring)

thanks for the link


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## Yeahti87 (Jan 17, 2019)

Olivetta said:


> by the way I printed the NZ book and I am startingt to read
> 
> quite interesting (the first chapter are about how make a link with the client, quite boring)
> 
> thanks for the link


Surprise, surprise I found it on this forum a year ago or so. Some ‚carving teacher’ must have linked it. I don’t know if he was the author but the content is useful for any progression step.


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## 16gkid (Dec 5, 2012)

Yeahti87 said:


> I appreciate you’ve found time to dig into the history but all the info you had to Sherlock was clearly stated here in the discussion from the get go. You should start reading the posts with comprehension.
> 
> Find a post where I’ve given any piece of advice on how to spin 360 (did it maybe 1-2 times in a shitty form) or jib (I don’t do it at all).
> I’ve owned 14~~ widely acclaimed boards for the past 2 years or better 120 days on-snow so far with the constant strive to progress. I even call it myself ‚can’t comment on how it carves yet’ if there were no conditions to let ME evaluate it and compare it to
> ...


Youre the man!


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Guys, how I can charge video?


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

edit


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## Olivetta (Dec 27, 2019)

Well 

todya I tryed the burton S Binding instead of my classic binding M and essentially they did not let me Eurocarving 

at the maximum angle my front foot touch the ground and I use to feel off 

this is could be your problem. Too


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