# Burton Diode --- Broke the highback.



## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

Just got two new base plates due to cracks, and a new right high back due to ripped rubber, and new heel cup pads due to originals coming off, and new foot pads since the diodes pads collect ice like a freezer...... Hmmmmm. Damn, almost got new bindings one piece at a time. :icon_scratch:

So today, morning after best pow day of the year at bachelor, I drop the back side of the mnt off the summit (freaking great run by the way- open bowls to trees to chutes) and when I get back to the chair I unstrapped both feet to catch a breath (2mile run) and the top half of my highback fell off. :dunno:

So pissed. Mnt is packed and being tracked out by the second. Done. Had enough highback to ride back to lodge and get new bindings. A 2 hour ordeal after adjustment and decision making. 

Ended up with union chargers..... A bit heavier and a bit stiffer than the diode. They'll def kick your ass if your not on it. I fucking yard sailed on a cat track hard.....caught a front edge at low speed, while relaxing. :dizzy:

Union needs more time on my board , diode was such a nice binding in terms of ride. But fuck that shit. All those faults then leave me fucked on the best part of the day and no more. If that high back would have snapped lower down while I was higher up I'd have been fucked hiking for days if I didn't have to call for a sled due to deep snow. :thumbsdown::thumbsdown::thumbsdown:

Ill have a new set of diodes for sale shortly..... If anyone is interested let me know.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

:thumbsdown::thumbsdown:


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

:dizzy::dizzy::dizzy:


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

:icon_scratch::icon_scratch:


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

Bummer dude. 
Its truely love/hate with diodes isnt it lol. See if you can get the unions on the scales for me.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

ETM said:


> Bummer dude.
> Its truely love/hate with diodes isnt it lol. See if you can get the unions on the scales for me.


Ya will do. I know they are heavier but not by much. Hand to hand they felt pretty damn equal, but with both bolted on board I can tell w ease the board is heavier. 

As much as I want I don't think I'll give the diodes another shot. Even if I had extra parts to fix anything if I got caught in the terrain I was in today I'd be fucked anyways.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

Hmmmm.., thx. So much for telling burton I want two of everything. Lol


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

if you had a set of diodes with backup straps and highbacks i'll buy em off ya


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

ShredLife said:


> if you had a set of diodes with backup straps and highbacks i'll buy em off ya


This broken pair will be warrantied out so ill have a new set of bindings. At the least they'll refuse to send me a brand new pair and instead only send a new high back. In which case ill have new frames, highbacks right and left new heel cup pads, foot pads, etc. 

Ill let you know what I end up with


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

Yeah I'd be interested too... I'm of the "I like and haven't broken them yet" camp...


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

poutanen said:


> Yeah I'd be interested too... I'm of the "I like and haven't broken them yet" camp...




:laugh: that was me, until yesterday.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

You will get 1x highback from burton. My guy tried to get me a new set twice and it aint happening.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

Well considering all the parts they've sent me lately and the fact that I need to sell these to pay for the ones I had to buy while on vacation they might ship me new ones if I ship my old ones in.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

pdxrealtor said:


> Well considering all the parts they've sent me lately and the fact that I need to sell these to pay for the ones I had to buy while on vacation they might ship me new ones if I ship my old ones in.


No arguement here lol. Just in my experience they send out parts freely but getting a whole new set is out of the question. It takes me 3 weeks to a month to get my replacement parts delivered every time something breaks which is a total pain in the ass and costs them more in shipping to Australia than a whole new set would but they wont send me a new set. 
By sending me a whole new set I would have my own diode wrecking yard so I can fix my ow fkn parts on the spot when they break lol instead of the shitfight it is atm.


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## BigmountainVMD (Oct 9, 2011)

pdxrealtor said:


> :thumbsdown::thumbsdown:


That looks a lot like when someone doesn't fold their highbacks down before they get on the lift...


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

BigmountainVMD said:


> That looks a lot like when someone doesn't fold their highbacks down before they get on the lift...


Yeah but its generally not. I fold down religiously before I get on the lift and Ive broken 3 of the bastards.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

BigmountainVMD said:


> That looks a lot like when someone doesn't fold their highbacks down before they get on the lift...


Sounds like you're familiar with that..... 

:icon_scratch:


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

ETM said:


> No arguement here lol. Just in my experience they send out parts freely but getting a whole new set is out of the question. It takes me 3 weeks to a month to get my replacement parts delivered every time something breaks which is a total pain in the ass and costs them more in shipping to Australia than a whole new set would but they wont send me a new set.
> By sending me a whole new set I would have my own diode wrecking yard so I can fix my ow fkn parts on the spot when they break lol instead of the shitfight it is atm.


When I was talking to them about getting my new frames I asked them why they didn't just send me a new pair of bindings. Shit the heel cup stickers were still in the mail. They said they would but they'd need my old bindings first. I was headed to Utah and wasn't gonna risk shit not showing up in time.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

Snowolf said:


> Put a set of Rome Targa`s on that Billy Goat and never look back....


Yeah buck furton lol.


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## BigmountainVMD (Oct 9, 2011)

pdxrealtor said:


> Sounds like you're familiar with that.....
> 
> :icon_scratch:


Nope, I always fold mine down for that exact reason (L bindings = tall highbacks = fold that shizz down), but I've seen enough people complaining on this forum wondering why they couldn't get them warrantied after the fact. That really sucks it happened but you should be stoked they warrantied them since it DOES look like lift induced highback breakage.


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## jwelsh83 (Jan 9, 2013)

BigmountainVMD said:


> That looks a lot like when someone doesn't fold their highbacks down before they get on the lift...


I was thinking the same thing...I broke off a Forum highback this year from riding and it broke at the base from a sheared off screw that in turn broke the highback from the pressure. That's a high break point and confuses the shit out of me :dunno: I'll second the lift damage...


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

I got 3 highbacks with cracks at the same height ladies. I understand non diode owners think there must be some kind of foul play going on here but all the hard riding diode owners out there just know this shit can happen on any run on any day.
I would love to know how many replacement highbacks burton have sent out.


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

the highback on these things is so thin that if you had some forward lean engaged so that the top of the highback is contacting your boot but the lower section of the highback isn't (gap of air between boot/highback) a good heelside crank from a person 170+ should break them pretty well.

run-on sentance ftw.


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

how much you weigh ETM?

i'm only 150 or so, my only gripes with these bindings are the stupid cheapo foam they used....


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

6 foot 3 220lb. I set my forward lean to match the lean of the boot so it should be relatively even pressure along the whole length of the highback. They just break on me, rear highback every time but I snapped the chassis on the front one which I blame on the reflex discs, flex flex snap.

I rode customs for years with not a single breakage, rode flow nxt at for years too without a single breakage.


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## ShredLife (Feb 6, 2010)

ETM said:


> 6 foot 3 220lb.


oh forget it - you were doomed from the start! not a chance. 

the older cf highbacks you coulda done - the old salomons and burtons (as i imagine you know) had cf highbacks that were at least 2-3 times as thick as the diodes. only problem with those is for some people it'd hurt their shins. 


burton should refuse to sell these things to anyone 200+ , you big dudes will just destroy them.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

You are right. 
Or they could assume that every 5th person is going to be above 200lb and make a sturdier product in the first place. You know, market research and all that.


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

Actually I think some of you need to go on a diet!!! 

I'm a svelte 175 lb...


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

My chassis is too big to ever be 175lb lol. Im carrying a bit but Ill never be below 200lb


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

poutanen said:


> Actually I think some of you need to go on a diet!!!
> 
> I'm a svelte 175 lb...


Right now I'm a solid 215 lbs. 5'8 ..... Got some fat and got some muscle. Forward lean was set at 1 never did check the gap but I rode them at that setting since last year. 

I was riding some decent shit when it happened, not like I was cruising a groomer. I'm OCD , so there ain't no chance my highbacks get left up at the lift.


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## luigi636 (Mar 14, 2013)

what's the risk of leaving your high backs up on the lift? others hitting them or what?


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

Snowolf said:


> Put a set of Rome Targa`s on that Billy Goat and never look back....


Weren't you just telling me about the unions? The shop I was at didn't carry Rome, I asked. Otherwise I would have considered them. 

The stiffest highest end binding they had was the charger. I consider myself lucky they had a binding of that caliper in stock.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

luigi636 said:


> what's the risk of leaving your high backs up on the lift? others hitting them or what?


Pretty sure you risk the chair clipping it. I don't know for sure cause I always put mine down, and I've never seen anyone in front of me get clipped or leave a highback up.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

luigi636 said:


> what's the risk of leaving your high backs up on the lift? others hitting them or what?


If you leave the rear highback up it will eventually get mangled between the snow surface and the bottom of the chair lift.
Make it a habit to unstrap and kick the highback down.


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## luigi636 (Mar 14, 2013)

pdxrealtor said:


> Pretty sure you risk the chair clipping it. I don't know for sure cause I always put mine down, and I've never seen anyone in front of me get clipped or leave a highback up.





ETM said:


> If you leave the rear highback up it will eventually get mangled between the snow surface and the bottom of the chair lift.
> Make it a habit to unstrap and kick the highback down.


Right I've never noticed how little clearance there is between the chair and the ground.. Good to know, cheers.


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## Lamps (Sep 3, 2011)

Snowolf said:


> Put a set of Rome Targa`s on that Billy Goat and never look back....


I dunno, while there seem to be durability issues, I can't recall any negative feedback from a performance perspective.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

Snowolf said:


> Oh I am very happy with my Union Force I slapped on that F1 Premier. I am just saying that the Targa/Billy Goat combination is very sweet. I think once you dial in the feel of the stiffer Chargers and refine your technique to having a stiffer, more responsive binding, you will like it and find that at the end of the day, you aren't as tuckered out. The Diodes "mushed" out some of your inputs. It gave you a softer, more forgiving feel to the Billy Goat, but the downside to that is you had to use more brute strength to get the board performance you need. The Billy Goat is an aggressive board and needs a stiff binding to control properly. Give your Chargers some time, I think you will learn to appreciate what they will do for you....:thumbsup:


Everything you say is pretty spot on.

Had a day and half on these bidings and they are called chargers for a reason. They are a very very stiff binding, and very responsive. Dynamic tight carving at high speeds, jumps and drops is where these bindings shine. 

I like them in all areas but the tight trees. I found myself not being able to make toe side turns on a dime in the tighter trees. 

To me they felt like they took some turning ability away from the BG making it a less agile board. You need some flexibility in tight trees, and these bindings don't flex- period. 

Could I make them work, I don't know..... maybe more time would do it, maybe not. Some bindings just aren't made for certain things. 

I like the trees too much to give up the agility of the BG due to stiff bindings. 

I'm sending in my entire set, including all old and new parts, of Diodes to Burton and they are sending me a new set. Most likely this years model. 

Burton did tell me they made some adjustments to the highbacks for this year, to make them stronger. So hopefully there won't be anymore issues. The Diode Binding is a perfect match of support and response when you need it, but it's not so planted to the board that you can't be a bit playful with it. 

I'm thinking of grabbing the Union Atlas and riding them for a couple days. If they work for me I'll exchange the chargers for the Atlas and keep as a back up. 

Scott if you want to try the chargers let me know. I'd be curious to see what you think about them in the tight trees on your BG.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

Snowolf said:


> Can you make Meadows on Friday?


As of today, yes..... For sure.


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## blunted_nose (Apr 26, 2012)

Burton bindings are so great but the billy goat is the shit in pow. sucks to hear that happened, but i though nobacks were the shit for pow? hehe.....


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

Snowolf said:


> I may splitboard St Helens on Friday but if not I am planning on Meadows and Skibowl. Will bring the Billy Goat. What size binding? My Targa's are S/M I have small feet and they may not work for you.


8.5 boot, unions are m/l. 

Skibowl,,, maybe we could board on down to lake Trillium. :laugh:


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## Sick-Pow (May 5, 2008)

looks like the chairlift ripped them off. doubt that was rider induced.


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## hktrdr (Apr 3, 2012)

Sick-Pow said:


> looks like the chairlift ripped them off. doubt that was rider induced.


Reading comprehension issues? This is a well documented problem with Diodes and has nothing to do with damage from a lift (although it looks like something caused by one).


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

hktrdr said:


> Reading comprehension issues? This is a well documented problem with Diodes and has nothing to do with damage from a lift (although it looks like something caused by one).


:thumbsup: Thank you.


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## Leo (Nov 24, 2009)

pdxrealtor said:


> Pretty sure you risk the chair clipping it. I don't know for sure cause I always put mine down, and I've never seen anyone in front of me get clipped or leave a highback up.


It happened to me on my Rome 390 Bosses when I forgot to put them down. I didn't care about the highback as much as I did my strapped leg having to go with the flow of being stuck haha.

It wasn't bad, just twisted my front foot a bit, but no injury. Boss has flexy highbacks so no damage either. Damned if the paint didn't chip off though. You stare at these bindings and the paint falls off. :blink:


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

LEO- glad you didn't get hurt. That would not be a fun ride, albeit short. 

I guess there was a 10 year old who fell 25-30 ft. onto packed powder on Saturday at Bachelor. Heard he broke an arm, and another said no injuries at all. Out of all the places to get hurt on the mountain....... damn I'd hate for it to be the chair lift. :laugh:

Anyways........

I'm boxing up my diodes and when I got them out under our lighting I noticed another fracture down lower about 1/3 rd of the way in from the inside highback edge. 

And.... if that isn't enough to quiet the 'it was the chair lift' people- here's another thing- it was my front foot, you know..... the one that never comes unstrapped near the chair lift, ya that foot. 

Also....

Someone earlier in the thread mentioned there might be a more likely chance of a highback breaking if the forward lean was set too far forward leaving a gap between boot and highback towards the bottom. 

My Diodes are at F1, minimal forward lean. For kicks I strapped a boot in to see if by chance I had a gap. I didn't. Nice snug fit against the heel cup. 

Maybe it is rider weight related, which rolls full circle into weak/faulty highback.


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## seriouscat (Jan 23, 2012)

Interesting. Except the cracks, mine looks way more abused and it's still holding up. I set them up with full heel alignment and forward as my other bindings.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

seriouscat said:


> Interesting. Except the cracks, mine looks way more abused and it's still holding up. I set them up with full heel alignment and forward as my other bindings.
> 
> View attachment 18497
> 
> ...


Curious how much you weigh? 

It looks like you are using less forward lean than me also. See where the forward lean marks are gone on each each of our bindings? 

What do mean align with heel cup?


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## MarshallV82 (Apr 6, 2011)

pdxrealtor said:


> Just got two new base plates due to cracks, and a new right high back due to ripped rubber, and new heel cup pads due to originals coming off, and new foot pads since the diodes pads collect ice like a freezer...... Hmmmmm. Damn, almost got new bindings one piece at a time. :icon_scratch:
> 
> So today, morning after best pow day of the year at bachelor, I drop the back side of the mnt off the summit (freaking great run by the way- open bowls to trees to chutes) and when I get back to the chair I unstrapped both feet to catch a breath (2mile run) and the top half of my highback fell off. :dunno:
> 
> ...


You're quite the salesman. 

Just going by the luck I've had with my Burton Cartels, you'd think they would be better. 
Good luck with the new bindings!


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## seriouscat (Jan 23, 2012)

pdxrealtor said:


> Curious how much you weigh?
> 
> It looks like you are using less forward lean than me also. See where the forward lean marks are gone on each each of our bindings?
> 
> What do mean align with heel cup?


175lbs

I meant I align the high back to the heel edge exactly parallel. Forward lean is 1.5 on the markings.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

seriouscat said:


> 175lbs
> 
> I meant I align the high back to the heel edge exactly parallel. Forward lean is 1.5 on the markings.


Look at my last binding pictures. See what line on the high back circles is inline with the top of the heel cup? That is F-1, which stands for forward lean 1. 

The orange line, or on yours the blue line, is 0 forward lean. The circle above that, bullseye if you will, is negative forward lean. 

Based off my bindings circle lines rubbing off in the same way as yours it looks like you re at a negative .5 to -1. Hard to say though because none of your pics show the highback up in position. 

Also, the way you adjust forward lean is in part by highback rotation. You'd need to choose to dial in one or the other...... Forward lean or highback alignment with board edges. 

What are your stance angles?

:icon_scratch:


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## seriouscat (Jan 23, 2012)

Yes it is at f1.5 on the circle. This isn't the only pair of diodes I have. I can take a pic of the other one with the markings intact if you want.

And no you don't need to choose one or other. Dial in the parallel first and move both sides back together one click at a time to adjust the forward lean. It just isn't as precise/ easy to use as a normal adjuster.

It might be limiting if you have some huge angles though. I'm usually at 12/-9 (tried 15/12 as well) Around 22inch wide.

EDIT: I see what you mean. The remain part of the circle is there because the screws were loose one day in revy and it rubbed a lot the markings off. I didn't set it there lol.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

seriouscat said:


> Yes it is at f1.5 on the circle. This isn't the only pair of diodes I have. I can take a pic of the other one with the markings intact if you want.
> 
> And no you don't need to choose one or other. Dial in the parallel first and move both sides back together one click at a time to adjust the forward lean. It just isn't as precise/ easy to use as a normal adjuster.
> 
> It might be limiting if you have some huge angles though. I'm usually at 12/-9 (tried 15/12 as well) Around 22inch wide.


Oh no, I believe you, I was just trying to get it straight. I'm at +15 and -3 22" and I *couldnt* get the + 15 lined up with the edge at f1, a little closer on the -3 but not perfect. 

Forward lean of 1.5 for me was too much.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

Got replacement Diodes today, the 12/13 models. 

From looking here are the differences I noticed 

The base material is like the 11/12 prophecy base, almost a soft rubber like coating on it. I like it. 

The heel cup stickers are gone

The degrees are now on the disc, not on the base plate

The two small plastic pieces on the base plate towards the back, near 36*, are gone. These were prone to breaking

The highback seems to be shaped a bit differently, but I can't be sure on that

The foot cap seems to be of more durable foam material. 

They are lighter, 706 grams vs. 755 grams for the 11/12 model. 

I don't know if I'm going to keep them or not. A lot depends on how the Charger rides after proper adjustment. I keep reading about durability being one of Union's strong points, and that's important to me. 

While a couple of the problems might have been fixed on the newer Diodes I still had issues with the toe cap coming lose, Ice build up on the highback and foot pad, and the FWLA is a PITA.

Add to that it wouldn't make sense to keep a less responsive binding of almost the same weight and it's not looking good for the Diode. 

Both bindings just scream performance. I might just keep the Diodes to look at. :laugh:


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## Lamps (Sep 3, 2011)

pdxrealtor said:


> Both bindings just scream performance. I might just keep the Diodes to look at. :laugh:


Diodes are beautiful to look at. What size? I'd be interested if medium.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

They are mediums. Ill keep you posted if I decide to sell them. I can't see the unions having a catastrophic failure but I they did it would be nice to have a pair of diodes as a spare. 

Just don't know at this point.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

Warranty replacements are for sale. Not used, new in box. 250 + shipping

Black and white in color. 2012/13 models.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

Well burton have basically told me to get fucked today. They will mo longer replace the broken parts on my diodes. I am highly disappointed as I had nothing but trouble from day 1 with these poorly designed bindings and I know it wont be long until they break on me again.


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

ETM said:


> Well burton have basically told me to get fucked today. They will mo longer replace the broken parts on my diodes. I am highly disappointed as I had nothing but trouble from day 1 with these poorly designed bindings and I know it wont be long until they break on me again.


Lame. Ask them why I got a complete new set a model year newer and you're stuck getting the same faulty part over and over.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

They are claiming they are out of warranty now so no more replacements. They sent me footbeds (front section only) and they dont fit up to my heel sections as the widths are different. When i said the shit you gave me doesnt fit they started to brush me off


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## pdxrealtor (Jan 23, 2012)

What foot beds did they send you? 

Seems to me if they've been giving you replacement parts that have kept breaking since in warranty that would count now, even out of warranty. 

I've always been impressed with Burton's CS. They've never given me a problem. Sorry to hear your having them. 

Hell DC just sent me out new BOA laces and through in extras for the just in case moments. Can't beat that, and I've heard DC CS sucks. Maybe I'm just lucky.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

The 11/12 footbeds wont work with 12/13 ones and they sent me the wrong ones and then said too bad


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## Kevin137 (May 5, 2013)

Just gently remind them, that there is certainly a design issue, and with all the bad press these days hurting companies, would it not be a more sensible option to replace the whole unit with the redesigned 2012/13 model as there was clearly design faults with the 2011/12 model which you could easily prove down to the amount of people using forums that have had parts replaced...

Ask nicely and tell them that you will have no problem with posting on all the forums asking for more details from other users to use on court in necessary...

You have nothing to lose right about now as they are not going to replace anyway...


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

Meh, they wont give me heel pads to match the incorrect footbeds they gave me, I doubt they are going to give me a new pair of bindings.

I have been more than nice throughout the whole ordeal and have just been told NO MORE. 
Unless my good friend BurtonBindings wants to step up and sort me out it looks like my diodes will be heading to the scrap heap sooner rather than later.


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## Kevin137 (May 5, 2013)

Old fashioned post, addressed to the CEO, you might just be surprised...

No company likes bad feedback, especially with a product they clearly know is defective from a design standpoint or they wouldn't be giving away so many parts.

Just explain the bad taste it has left in your mouth and that you want HIM to do the right thing and correct this for you...

You have nothing to lose right now apart from the cost of a stamp...!!!

But i would be firm with them at the same time, that you know of numerous people that have had the same problem, that you would be willing to consider court action as a last resort against them, and that clearly in this economy, and with snowboarding as a business not exactly in good standing and loss of customer revenue, you would think that they would be looking to keep customers happy with a defective product...! 

I would even point them in the direction of the post here, so they can see for themselves the bad publicity this is already causing them...

I would not stand for it, but then we have credit card protection over here in Europe that doesn't allow this... If it is clearly a defective product, and not fit for purpose then you call the credit card and they deal with it.


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## ekb18c (Mar 11, 2013)

I would just go buy a set of Unions and call it a day....

I'm actually quite surprised as the Burton CS has been really good and responsive with all my dealings with them.


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## Kevin137 (May 5, 2013)

ekb18c said:


> I would just go buy a set of Unions and call it a day....
> 
> I'm actually quite surprised as the Burton CS has been really good and responsive with all my dealings with them.


You shouldn't have to have many dealings with them, that is the point, and when they badly design a product that keeps breaking, they need to address that.

Just sayin'


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