# Binding Suggestions for Endeavor Maverick, East Coast, Experienced Rider



## TheBigChill (Aug 29, 2013)

Holy Christ, there are so many options for gear these days it's unreal. Analysis Paralysis is real. Moving on, let's get some stats:

*Age*: 38
*Experience*: 25 years of consistent riding (LOL @ Rocker)
*Location*: East Coast
*Weight*: 155
*Style*: Fast / Bomber, Fluid Carving, Side Hits (grabs/tweaks) Very little freestyle (occasional jib or jump)
*Decks*: 2020 Endeavor Maverick, 2016 YES Standard, 2020 Nidecker Tracer (pending)
*Current Binding*: 2016 K2 Formula
*Boot*: DC Mora (a man in ladies boots...) Equal to men's Size 9

I got a great deal on the Endeavor ($250) but haven't ridden it yet. It's supposed to be like a more stiff-tailed Archetype. The Standard is pretty lively with carbon stringers and is a 'volume shifted' twin (this will become a Spring/rock board). I'm looking at grabbing a left-over Nidecker Tracer for dedicated carves. The idea here is to grab a binding that can go on at least the Maverick and Tracer and not suck. The "totally rad for every situation" marketing that exists today is kind of annoying; maybe I'm complicating things. I'd like to stick to $200 and under. If that means leftovers, then so be it.

*Binders in my hea*d:
-K2 Formula (forward lean adjustment kind of sucks) <$160
-K2 Lien AT (same ^) $185
-Now YES $175
-Now Pilot $$$
-Now IPO $135 !!
-Bent Metal Transfer (no gas pedal?) $190
-Burton Cartel ReFlex $190
-Flux XF (not enough cushion?) $225

I'll add that I have an aversion to Mini Discs; it's the Engineer in me. Call me out if you like, as I know many binders now use this hype. Also gonna pass on EST: 1995 called, and they want their baseless Preston bindings back.

What say you? I'm open to suggestions / belt lashings.

@Nivek @BurtonAvenger @smellysell @F1EA @NT.Thunder


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

All I know is I hate my Cartels on mine. 

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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

I have the Flux XF on my Tracer and I haven't been bothered by them. Then again, I seldom leave the ground.


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

Out of those options, I'd probably grab the Now Yes (or pilots if you can find cheap enough)

Sounds like the Engineer in you wants something sturdy and robust, so my overall suggestion is find a pair of last years Rome D.O.Ds on sale and call it good for all 3 boards. Tonnes of the right kind of adjustability, not gnar-stiff but certainly responsive enough to drive any of those boards, and bomber durability.


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## Surgeon (Apr 13, 2020)

TheBigChill said:


> Also gonna pass on EST: 1995 called, and they want their baseless Preston bindings back.
> 
> @Nivek @BurtonAvenger @smellysell @F1EA @NT.Thunder


Ha! That’s EXACTLY what I said when I first saw the concept. Of course there’s a lot more to them than there ever was on those aluminium horseshoes with straps but my reaction was yours verbatim.


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

K2 Lien AT are super versatile too- if you like the feel of the tripod frame. I personally love the feel of it, and I run Liens and Lineups on most of my boards. You can switch out the pods or add a heel block to change the response. Those options let you try out different feels in your bindings to see what you like the best. I went from super stiff bindings to a pretty soft set up most of the time.

I also run Flux on my hard charging board. You're right, they aren't damp at all. You feel everything with them, but they're responsive while allowing for some lateral flex too.


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

WigMar said:


> K2 Lien AT are super versatile too- if you like the feel of the tripod frame. I personally love the feel of it, and I run Liens and Lineups on most of my boards. You can switch out the pods or add a heel block to change the response. Those options let you try out different feels in your bindings to see what you like the best. I went from super stiff bindings to a pretty soft set up most of the time.
> 
> I also run Flux on my hard charging board. You're right, they aren't damp at all. You feel everything with them, but they're super responsive.


What's the benefit of liens over lineups? 

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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

Lineups don't come with the extra pods or the heelblock. They're on the softest mode all the time. Also, the Lien has a regular highback vs. the soft urathane highback on the Lineups. I use the Liens for more serious freeriding, but I usually keep the softer pods in anyway. As a skater, I appreciate the lateral flex. I think the lineups are a perfect pairing for party boards, and I'd be using them in the park if I did more of that.


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

smellysell said:


> All I know is I hate my Cartels on mine.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


Why?


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

Jkb818 said:


> Why?


Too soft

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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

smellysell said:


> Too soft
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


Interesting. I have been riding Cartels for a while. Any bindings that you'd suggest for a stiffer setup?


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

Jkb818 said:


> Interesting. I have been riding Cartels for a while. Any bindings that you'd suggest for a stiffer setup?


I'm far from an expert and have pretty limited experience with different bindings. Unfortunately, my Superforces I love on another board don't have discs that are binding compatible, so haven't been able to make an apples to apples comparison of different bindings on that board. I'm sure others will weigh in though, and a lot of it is just preference. 

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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

For that board it's a preference thing. 
I would put Genesis or Cartel EST. 

But overall, good choices are:
Rome Katana
Now Pilot, Jones Mercury or Apollo
Union Atlas or Force (these dont have mini disc)

Unions and Rome have the feel of a metal binding and adjustable heelcups.

Burton and Now have a fixed heel and a more relaxed feel.


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## TheBigChill (Aug 29, 2013)

F1EA said:


> For that board it's a preference thing.
> I would put Genesis or Cartel EST.
> 
> But overall, good choices are:
> ...


Not looking to ride EST, and almost all of those are well over $200. The Force might be an option. I rode Union Data's in 2007, but not sure what they're like these days.





WigMar said:


> Lineups don't come with the extra pods or the heelblock. They're on the softest mode all the time. Also, the Lien has a regular highback vs. the soft urathane highback on the Lineups. I use the Liens for more serious freeriding, but I usually keep the softer pods in anyway. As a skater, I appreciate the lateral flex. I think the lineups are a perfect pairing for party boards, and I'd be using them in the park if I did more of that.


I'm....leaning..towards the Lien AT, but am thrown by how the tripod/bushings and Mini Disc might affect response; maybe it's a non-issue. I'd likely run them with the heel-block in on everything all the time, so I question the value of having this option (just go Formula?) The Flux XF is tempting, but even though I like charging, I'm almost 40 and my knees would probably appreciate something a bit more damp. 




smellysell said:


> Too soft
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


This is interesting to me. I wonder if it's the Re:Flex plate doing that, or if -and please forgive me- you're not comfortable driving "stiffer" boards. I only says this because it's supposed to be a fairly responsive binding.


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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

TheBigChill said:


> I'm....leaning..towards the Lien AT, but am thrown by how the tripod/bushings and Mini Disc might affect response; maybe it's a non-issue. I'd likely run them with the heel-block in on everything all the time, so I question the value of having this option (just go Formula?) The Flux XF is tempting, but even though I like charging, I'm almost 40 and my knees would probably appreciate something a bit more damp.


Last season I used my XF on the Tracer and my Genesis X on my Pencil plus. The Pencil plus is murder on the knees, the Tracer not so much. So even if you might feel everything the board matters too. I'm 45 and out of shape and with a bad knee. I'm not saying "go buy the XF", but they are not so dramatic in my opinion.

If I could afford it I would buy the XV to go with my new untouched Bullet Train this season.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

TheBigChill said:


> Not looking to ride EST, and almost all of those are well over $200. The Force might be an option. I rode Union Data's in 2007, but not sure what they're like these days.
> 
> 
> This is interesting to me. I wonder if it's the Re:Flex plate doing that, or if -and please forgive me- you're not comfortable driving "stiffer" boards. I only says this because it's supposed to be a fairly responsive binding.


Yeah, not saying YOU get EST; I said _I_ would get EST. But for you... Cartel or Genesis in Reflex. Between EST and Reflex there is very little difference in the baseplate. But the EST are better because the hinge is awesome.

The overall feeling is mostly associated with whether you're used to metal bindings or plastic. Metal bindings feel different. And Union, even though the baseplate is not all metal, feels and responds like a metal baseplate.

I have ridden Cartels on B Dump Truck, Landlord and Panhandler. First 2 are pretty stiff (considerably stiffer and more aggressive than Maverick). PH is softer but wide so it's happy with responsive bindings too. Perfectly fine.


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## F1EA (Oct 25, 2013)

Snowdaddy said:


> Last season I used my XF on the Tracer and my Genesis X on my Pencil plus. The Pencil plus is murder on the knees, the Tracer not so much. So even if you might feel everything the board matters too. I'm 45 and out of shape and with a bad knee. I'm not saying "go buy the XF", but they are not so dramatic in my opinion.
> 
> If I could afford it I would buy the XV to go with my new untouched Bullet Train this season.


hahah I'm 43 with bad knees.

No Flux for me. I've had them and got rid of them. For me, they're soft powder bindings only.

Burton Genesis or Now bindings is what I need. And ibuprofen.


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

TheBigChill said:


> I'm....leaning..towards the Lien AT, but am thrown by how the tripod/bushings and Mini Disc might affect response; maybe it's a non-issue. I'd likely run them with the heel-block in on everything all the time, so I question the value of having this option (just go Formula?) The Flux XF is tempting, but even though I like charging, I'm almost 40 and my knees would probably appreciate something a bit more damp.


Liens are pretty damp from the tripod frame and pods. They have really good response toe to heel, but have adjustable amounts of lateral flex. Even with the heel block, they probably are more damp and have more lateral flex than Formulas. 

You've got to ask yourself what you want your board to ride and feel like. Are you looking to get surfy or be locked in? Bindings are pretty personal.


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

F1EA said:


> Yeah, not saying YOU get EST; I said _I_ would get EST. But for you... Cartel or Genesis in Reflex. Between EST and Reflex there is very little difference in the baseplate. But the EST are better because the hinge is awesome.
> 
> The overall feeling is mostly associated with whether you're used to metal bindings or plastic. Metal bindings feel different. And Union, even though the baseplate is not all metal, feels and responds like a metal baseplate.
> 
> I have ridden Cartels on B Dump Truck, Landlord and Panhandler. First 2 are pretty stiff (considerably stiffer and more aggressive than Maverick). PH is softer but wide so it's happy with responsive bindings too. Perfectly fine.


I think this might be the answer to why I don't like the Cartels. I have a couple different pair of Unions and a pair of Sparks that I love. Sounds like maybe I need to try some Bent Metal. 

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## Snowdaddy (Feb 2, 2018)

F1EA said:


> hahah I'm 43 with bad knees.
> 
> No Flux for me. I've had them and got rid of them. For me, they're soft powder bindings only.
> 
> Burton Genesis or Now bindings is what I need. And ibuprofen.


I thought ibuprofen was obligatory no matter which binding used 

I'm going to give the Photon Step On a go this season.


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

Snowdaddy said:


> I thought ibuprofen was obligatory no matter which binding used
> 
> I'm going to give the Photon Step On a go this season.


I've found herbal medicine works better. 

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## TheBigChill (Aug 29, 2013)

Like CBD creams. I'm sure you mean CBD creams...


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## TheBigChill (Aug 29, 2013)

Edit:


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## bob2356 (Jul 13, 2012)

I like the union STR. Simple and strong. I ride 100+ days east coast and they have held up fine. Easy to use and very rugged buckles. sells right around 200.


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## TheBigChill (Aug 29, 2013)

So I bought some Now x Yes binders from Evo for $175. If they suck, I'll try Drives next year.
The logic here is that I was eyeballing Pilots and then compared the glass fiber content of the Hangar, Post, and Plate for the Yes and Pilot, and they're identical. They also have the same hinge highback, so I'm not sure why the Yes is underrated.


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## MrDavey2Shoes (Mar 5, 2018)

kaaaaaaatana!


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## TheBigChill (Aug 29, 2013)

MrDavey2Shoes said:


> kaaaaaaatana!


Way too expensive for me. Lots of hype though..


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## ek9max (Apr 8, 2013)

TheBigChill said:


> Holy Christ, there are so many options for gear these days it's unreal. Analysis Paralysis is real. Moving on, let's get some stats:
> 
> *Age*: 38
> *Experience*: 25 years of consistent riding (LOL @ Rocker)
> ...



Why the aversion to Mini Disk? Just curious in hearing your reasoning.


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## TheBigChill (Aug 29, 2013)

This is going to be contentious, I can smell it!

I think the Mini Disc both increases stress via a longer moment arm, and concentrates that stress to a smaller area at the insert pack (or channel), all for little actual benefit. I think there's better under-binding tech available to facilitate 'truer board flex'. I think people confuse lateral movement in a binding as this sought after 'truer flex'.

Think about the dynamics of riding; you have torsional and longitudinal flex. When you're flexing the board longitudinally, the board is flexing primarily at the outer edges of the binding. In this case, something like the corner bushings that Union uses would permit 'truer flex'.

Torsionally, the outer most fore and aft areas of the binding are applying that torsional force in opposing directions. How effectively could you torsionally flex a board if your baseplate was the only bit of surface area and the rest of the binding raised .25" off the base (extreme example)?


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## Balinus (Mar 7, 2021)

TheBigChill said:


> So I bought some Now x Yes binders from Evo for $175. If they suck, I'll try Drives next year.
> The logic here is that I was eyeballing Pilots and then compared the glass fiber content of the Hangar, Post, and Plate for the Yes and Pilot, and they're identical. They also have the same hinge highback, so I'm not sure why the Yes is underrated.


Hello!

Did you had the chance to try the Now Yes (2021?)? I found a pair on sale and was wondering about your impression. I was also looking at the Pilot. Now Yes is rated softer no?

Cheers!
Edit- it is for a Salomon hps Taka 161 with Vans Infuse 9.5. Also east coast


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## CocaCola Kicker (Jan 30, 2019)

You are missing out by not going EST


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