# Did i waste $400?



## kosmoz (Dec 27, 2013)

looks one size to small for me


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## 70'sskater (Mar 20, 2014)

> After 2-3 hours on the slope my toes hurt really badly. Like the middle and tips of my toes on both feet become super painful and by the afternoon i can barely ride.
> 
> Have tried them on 2 trips, same thing. Tried lacing them as tight as possible, no help.
> 
> Any suggestions on what to try?


You don't need the lower speed laces very tight. I barely tighten the lower laces on my Ion's at all. Try leaving the lower speed laces just barely snug.
Are you wearing thick socks? If so try try something thinner, Ive read downhill ski racers actually wear pantyhose cause their boots are so tight.
Clip your toe nails (I know this prob sounds funny).
Take your boots to a good boot fitter to see if they are the correct size or if they can make some adjustments.
Now if the boots are too big and your feet are moving around that could also be causing your toes to get crunched.
Good luck.


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## Lamps (Sep 3, 2011)

> 70'sskater said:
> 
> 
> > After 2-3 hours on the slope my toes hurt really badly. Like the middle and tips of my toes on both feet become super painful and by the afternoon i can barely ride.
> ...


This is good advice, esp about the lowers. 

When I first got my ions I would lace them too tight by mistake, which causes much pain, and even if you loosen then after a couple runs you still hurt.


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## kosmoz (Dec 27, 2013)

been there with my northwave decades, loosening lower part helped a lot, just barely snug ant good to go.


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## sheepstealer (Aug 19, 2009)

Hate to say it but this will require some experimentation. Like others have mentioned, don't pull the lowers too tight. Also, how many days do you have in the imperials? If memory serves, they're medium-stiff boot right? Which means they'll take some time breaking in. My 32 TM-Twos took several weeks before they felt "just right," and this was after having them heat molded twice, experimenting with aftermarket insoles and experimenting with tight/loose lace-up.

Your feet will swell when riding, keep that in mind. If your toes hurt it makes me think maybe they're not getting enough circulation.

Bottom line, everyone's feet are different. Remedying boot/feet issues are very difficult to pinpoint.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Hi Starlyght,

I am certain we can get you a definite answer with a bit more info.

1. Please remove the insert from the liner, stand on it (barefoot please - no socks) with your heel in the heel recess and take some photos of your foot on the insert. Please post those here.

2. Please measure your foot using this method:

Kick your heel (barefoot please, no socks) back against a wall. Mark the floor exactly at the tip of your toe (the one that sticks out furthest - which toe this is will vary by rider). Measure from the mark on the floor to the wall. That is your foot length and is the only measurement that you will want to use. Measure in centimeters if possible, but if not, take inches and multiply by 2.54 (example: an 11.25 inch foot x 2.54 = 28.57 centimeters).

3. Please measure the length of the insert.

4. Please let us know the size of the boot.


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## neni (Dec 24, 2012)

Wiredsport will guide you well considering the proper sizing, I'm positive.

But additionally, could you specify bit more on "*toes hurt really badly"? There are many ways _how_ feet can hurt (I know at least 5 different pains in my feet ) Do they get numb? Slowly or quickly? Do you feel relief when opening the boot? Pain when walking? When of frontside edge? Or on backside edge? Do you have pressure points? Nerve pain? Does the pain begin at the front of toes or at the foot sole or foot ball? 
Any foot issues you know of while not in those boots?


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## ThredJack (Mar 18, 2014)

I had a similar problem at the end of last year, Wiredsport really helped me big time. Listen to him. My boots were an entire size too BIG, because I used the "go one size down from your sneaker size" "rule." The guy at my shop was helpful, but kinda hard to help someone when they say they wear the wrong size. lol


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## ridinbend (Aug 2, 2012)

Just because you heat molded them does not mean they're gonna be plush out of the box. You still have to endure the discomfort for a minute and break them in.


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## Starlyght (Jul 6, 2015)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi Starlyght,
> 
> I am certain we can get you a definite answer with a bit more info.


Thanks so much for the help!



> 1. Please remove the insert from the liner, stand on it (barefoot please - no socks) with your heel in the heel recess and take some photos of your foot on the insert. Please post those here.


Gallery here - hope I did this right!

Imgur



> 2. Please measure your foot using this method:
> 
> Kick your heel (barefoot please, no socks) back against a wall. Mark the floor exactly at the tip of your toe (the one that sticks out furthest - which toe this is will vary by rider). Measure from the mark on the floor to the wall. That is your foot length and is the only measurement that you will want to use. Measure in centimeters if possible, but if not, take inches and multiply by 2.54 (example: an 11.25 inch foot x 2.54 = 28.57 centimeters).


Both feet are 26cm



> 3. Please measure the length of the insert.


28cm



> 4. Please let us know the size of the boot.


US 9.5


Thank you soo much!!


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Hi Starlyght,

Thanks for that info.

26 cm (260 mm) is a size 8 in snowboard boots (260 will be printed inside every size 8 boot). Your size 9.5 boots will have 27.5 or 275 printed inside. That is the foot length that the manufacturer designed that boot for.

Soooooo, we could assume that your boot is 1.5 sizes (1.5 cm) too large...but let's not do that .

Your photo is of your foot on top of the liner. What we need is your foot on top of the insert. The insert is the footbed which can be removed from the inside base of the liner. Kindly pull that out, stand on it and send over a few photos.

STOKED!


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## Starlyght (Jul 6, 2015)

Ahh, i'm a noob! Hah.

Updated with the insert this time:

Imgur

I included 2 photos to see if i am measuring correctly.

Foot: 26cm
Insert: 27cm

Thanks heaps!


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Got it. Here is what you have going on:

The insert of a snowboard boot is typically ~ 1 cm shorter that the boot size. That means that the designed foot length for any given boot size should exceed (overhang) the insert by ~ 1 cm. This insert overhang insures that you will have firm pressure into the compliant materials at the ends of the liner. That pressure is what holds your foot securely in place. 

Your size 9.5 snowboard boots are designed to fit a 27.5 cm foot length. Thus we would expect an insert length of ~ 26.5 cm. You measured an insert length of 27 which confirms that the boot is within the realm of what would commonly be expected.

Your images also show the excess length that we would expect to see.

So, why did you end up with too long a boot? From your photos it appears that you have a wide, blocky foot. Not to worry, that is still very sexy to some of us. Often what happens is a block foot tries on a boot that matches their foot length and say's, "no way". The width makes that length seem impossible. So...they upsize in length to accommodate their foot width (width increases along with length as boot size increases) but in the process they introduce excess length which allows foot movement. The end result is a boot that fits poorly on most levels.

Sadly, the answer is a shorter, wider model.

I know that if you opted for a Burton Ruler Wide or Salomon Dialogue Wide in size 8 or 8.5 you would be supported, comfortable and STOKED.


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## f00bar (Mar 6, 2014)

I think you may have over analyzed why things went wrong Wired and the shop was perhaps simply trying to push what they had left in stock. 

This is especially common towards the end of season and I know for a fact that I was a victim of this on my first boots that I bought.

Unfortunately I think this is more common than not properly sizing the boot.


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## Nito (Oct 16, 2007)

Hi Starlyght,
I was in your shoes with the foot volume problem. I think Wired analysis is correct and here was my work around. Note I have a size 8 foot and bought a size 9 Burton Sabbath.

1) Purchase a custom foot bed to help keep your feet from sliding forward. I bought Sole brand from REI.
2) Break the boots in by wearing thin socks and gradually increasing sock thickness. I initially wore sock liners and eventually wore Thorlo Snowboard socks. The boot liner will break in and expand foot volume.
3) Since you boot uses Speed Laces, they probably have dual zone. Tighten the lower box so the boot is snug but comfy. Tighten the leg zone tight, you can always loosen later.


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## Nito (Oct 16, 2007)

PS - You don't need to heat the Foot beds, just insert them into the boot and wear them. It will be uncomfortable at first but you need to get you boot warmed up to mold the inserts. I played a Wii game with my nephew to break them in.
PPS- You could also have custom have custom inserts made; no break in of the footbeds required but you still will need to break in the inserts.


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