# Driving a piece of sh*t in the snow??



## DiscoStu (Jul 2, 2009)

mine cost $1k...
Get winter tyres and don't drive like a retard, you'll be fine.
Oh and buy some gloves, steering wheels get cold


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## rvcasrfr (Apr 5, 2009)

Word. Anyone have any recommendations in that price range? How much are winter tires? Are they necessary or can I get by with just chains?

Rob


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## DiscoStu (Jul 2, 2009)

high speed replies here
We got winter tyres so we're not stopping and changing all the time. Chains are bad for your tyres too, apparently. And roads. But who cares about the roads, really.
We got second hand winter tyres for $340 (i'm in Canada, mind you) and they're freakin sweet, never have any problems with them except when there's massive dumps about.
I'm driving a 91 voyager, if that's any help. fits loads of ppl and boards in


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## rvcasrfr (Apr 5, 2009)

Eh, I'll only be using it for a couple months so I'll stick with the chains.


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2010)

first off what kind of car we talking? second heres a list of stuff to keep in the trunk. a couple two by fours, a cumalong *mechanical winch, sand or rock salt, have snow tires or chains and you should be good. Other than that should be good.


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## rvcasrfr (Apr 5, 2009)

Any kind of car for $1k to MAYBE $1500.


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## JeffreyCH (Nov 21, 2009)

Get a front wheel drive for sure, RWD's suck ass in the snow. Or get a beat up 4x4


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## romaniaK (Dec 30, 2009)

I drove a beat up 99 cougar in the snow for two years until I was finally able to buy my BMW ... It sucked at times, but I somehow managed. I remember that one day I parked my car in one of my school's parking lots which was downhill and my car started sliding down the hill, even though I had decent tires on it and stopped in a pole, and I had to run to class so it just sat there for an hour or two, it was so funny. Nobody noticed that my car was actually supporting on that pole ... I laughed. 

But if you do get a car, get 4X4 or at least a FWD .... you can get jeep cherokees for 1-2k and with good tires, that thing will do great in the snow. 

It's really all about the tires. My friend wrecked his EVO right in front of me while I was following him and ended up in the ditch (his skirts and front bumper got ripped off but other than that they were fine) .... and EVO ... which is kinda crazy cuz those things are ridiculous ... but shitty tires do that. 

tires FTW. and then make sure it's a car that will start in the cold, even if it's old and cheap. check the starter before you buy it since that is the number one problem of cars not starting in the snow. 

instead of buying chains, invest more money in some good tires that will last you longer and are going to be more helpful in any situation. chains also destroy tires, and you can't use chains in lighter snow/black ice and you will slide. 

another suggestion: go to impound lots and try to buy a car that nobody came to pick up and is offered for sale now ... they have really good deals on good cars sometimes.


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## romaniaK (Dec 30, 2009)

but you can't rely only on chains ... you NEED good tires in the snow with chains or not. You will use the good tires more than the chains. this depends on what kind of snow you have to drive in and how groomed the roads are. it's common sense


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## Willy36 (Dec 29, 2008)

I've heard of people picking up Jeep Cherokees with 4WD for $500 in running condition that lasted them years after. I'd look for one of them.

BTW I own a Jeep Cherokee and I can attest they are excellent in snow and ice even with shitty tires on them.


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

Get 4 snow tires, you'll be fine.

For that price you'll be lucky to find a decent 4x4 (at least I couldn't for that range in the NE). That being said, get a FWD if you have a steep driveway and don't know how to drive in snow. Otherwise I'd prefer a RWD due to having more control when you go sideways.



JeffreyCH said:


> Get a front wheel drive for sure, RWD's suck ass in the snow.


Only for those who have no clue how to drive in the snow. All I ever needed in all my years of owning a RWD truck was weight in the rear and 2 snow tires on the rear. I got through the snow better than anyone did in a FWD. Then again I grew up with snow being around usually 5-6 months a year.


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## rvcasrfr (Apr 5, 2009)

Well here's my scenario:

I'm REALLY tight on cash due to some unforeseen events and throwing a few hundred bucks on snow tires just for 2-3 months of use isn't really an option. My license has been suspended for the past year (NO, I'm not a dipsh*t DUI... I got it suspended for a MINOR IN POSSESSION OF ALCOHOL [2 months from turning 21] while at SDSU.. I walked out of a party with a beer and BOOM 1 year mandatory license suspension  .. But I digress) and I just got it back. So it's not that I don't know how to drive, not by any means.. But when I get this car it will be my first time driving in the snow, and my first time behind the wheel in about a year. The whole scenario is making me kinda nervous. I'm far from a retard driver (especially with how paranoid I will be), so do you guys think I will have potential problems with a $1k FWD with whatever tires come with it and just chains?

Thanks.

Rob


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## Tarzanman (Dec 20, 2008)

There's no way to tell. 

Depends on driving conditions (meaning weather, traffic, visibility, ice/snow/salt/sand on the road), depends on the car (weight, wheelbase, ride height, tires) and depends on how hilly it is where you plan to drive.

I would get in touch with locals wherever it is you plan to go and solicit advice. If most of the locals are rolling on snow tires during the season, then you might want to borrow a few bucks from the parentals (or from friends) and invest in tires and chains.

If the locals tell you that you should be ok if you take it easy, then you probably want to ease yourself into driving in wintry conditions.

I drove through snow for for the first time in a few years in Breck 2 weeks ago. Conditions weren't bad going in, but the fog was ri-$$#@@#-diculous on the way back out (couple this with patches of snow and ice on the road)

It a crap shoot!



rvcasrfr said:


> Well here's my scenario:
> 
> I'm REALLY tight on cash due to some unforeseen events and throwing a few hundred bucks on snow tires just for 2-3 months of use isn't really an option. My license has been suspended for the past year (NO, I'm not a dipsh*t DUI... I got it suspended for a MINOR IN POSSESSION OF ALCOHOL [2 months from turning 21] while at SDSU.. I walked out of a party with a beer and BOOM 1 year mandatory license suspension  .. But I digress) and I just got it back. So it's not that I don't know how to drive, not by any means.. But when I get this car it will be my first time driving in the snow, and my first time behind the wheel in about a year. The whole scenario is making me kinda nervous. I'm far from a retard driver (especially with how paranoid I will be), so do you guys think I will have potential problems with a $1k FWD with whatever tires come with it and just chains?
> 
> ...


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## 270 faceplant (Jan 11, 2010)

Side swipped my POS car with a gaurd rail coming back from the mountain in a snowstorm. Probably was going a little too fast when the car in front of me slammed on their brakes. Driving in snow sucks pretty bad with my car.


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2010)

Even really good drivers can lose control in a bad weather. You can total your car really easily in a bad weather and $200 winter tires will cost you a $1k car.


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

If you're getting a FWD or 4x4, you need 4 snow tires, look for used on craigslist at least.

For a RWD, you can get by with 2 on the rear.


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## rvcasrfr (Apr 5, 2009)

I won't be making treks any further than down the street to the slopes in bad weather conditions. Only times I'll venture down the mountain back to civilization will be on a clear day with clear roads.


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## rvcasrfr (Apr 5, 2009)

Vlaze said:


> If you're getting a FWD or 4x4, you need 4 snow tires, look for used on craigslist at least.
> 
> For a RWD, you can get by with 2 on the rear.


Hmm.. I've driven down the mountain at night in a snowstorm where we couldn't see a foot in front of us with a FWD Volvo with chains on the front. Am I missing something?

Not to mention, I'm gonna be in Big Bear, SoCal.. Not like Wisconsin or someplace with a true winter.


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

Well, thing is with a FWD vehicle, you already have power at the front wheel plus the engine weight and more than half the weight of the car on the front end so you already have more traction than the rear wheels. If you get snow tires, or chains just for the front it's making it a lot easier for the rear end to break loose on snow since now it will have even less traction contrast to the front although it already did initially. Once a FWD loses it, it's game over. 

With a RWD, once the back end kicks out you can control the slide and power out of it, not so for a FWD. This is why they recommend to get equal grip for the front and rear. So if you upgrade the front, it's best to upgrade the rear as well. I know some people don't and can do o.k. with it, but you better drive conservatively and carefully if you're gonna go that direction.


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## SMDSkata (Mar 4, 2009)

Willy36 said:


> I've heard of people picking up Jeep Cherokees with 4WD for $500 in running condition that lasted them years after. I'd look for one of them.
> 
> BTW I own a Jeep Cherokee and I can attest they are excellent in snow and ice even with shitty tires on them.


I drive a 99 GC XJ with 230,000mi on it. I have terrible tires, but it only slides when I make it slide. I have Wilderness LE's on my Jeep that are warn just short of the bars. Can't beat 20$ a piece last June.


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2010)

rvcasrfr said:


> Any kind of car for $1k to MAYBE $1500.


your question is kind of silly, don't you think? the answer depends on which kind of car we're talking about.

you can easily pick up a beater jeep or subaru with 4wd/awd for that kin of money in which case, as long as the tires are ok, you'll be in great shape.

alasdair


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## Grizz (Nov 10, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> over 1 million miles of accident free driving


I hope someone gave you a plaque.


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## SPAZ (May 2, 2009)

you could probably find a <98 subaru for 1500. other recommendations include vw golf/jetta, 96ish accord, stuff like that. if you want to buy domestic check out a bronco/explorer. STAY AWAY from chryslers/jeeps/etc. my moms bf has a 2001 cherokee and the turn signals/lights work when they feel like it and the mileage is 15 for a V6. if you dont want to bother with the steering wheel getting cold, you could also get an aftermarket leather cover for it at autozone for 30 (totally worth it). just ask if you got any more Q's!


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## rvcasrfr (Apr 5, 2009)

Good advice guys, thanks. I'd pry only be using it for the season, I mainly just want something RELIABLE that will put around for a couple miles safely in the snow.


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## SPAZ (May 2, 2009)

if you want relible just buy foreign and you will be fine. the outback would be a solid choice since you could fit a ton of shit in it and still make back most of your money when you sell it (they hold their value great!) check craigslist and put the limit on 2k because you could probably negotiate the price down a lot. don't be afraid of high miles on a subie as long as there are good maintanence records.


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## romaniaK (Dec 30, 2009)

Snowolf said:


> No shit...I said exactly that...get good tires. Trust me, I know about handling a rig in ice and snow and have put more miles on ice and snow driving in all 48 states and Canada than most people have total....
> 
> My point was that those people who say that chains destroy tires are incorrect; they simply are not using them correctly and good tires or not, when Cal Trans says "chains on all vehicles" you are`nt going to argue your way past the check point so you ought to have a set in the trunk.


I wasnt talking to you when I said that, I know u know what you are talking about, I was just making sure he understands that he needs good tires AND he might need chains also and that good tires are a must before having chains.


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## rvcasrfr (Apr 5, 2009)

I searched for Subaru in most of SoCal and didn't find much below $2k...


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## SMDSkata (Mar 4, 2009)

SnowboardSpaz said:


> STAY AWAY from chryslers/jeeps/etc. my moms bf has a 2001 cherokee and the turn signals/lights work when they feel like it and the mileage is 15 for a V6. if you dont want to bother with the steering wheel getting cold, you could also get an aftermarket leather cover for it at autozone for 30 (totally worth it). just ask if you got any more Q's!


Why can you say this about Jeeps from one expirence. Everyone that has had a Jeep, mostly the GC, has wanted another one. My grandma gave me the car with 227k, and I floor it when I ever feel like it and the pick up is great for a high millage v8. I heard of most Jeeps going over 300k no problem.


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## SPAZ (May 2, 2009)

well, just not one from the damlier "lets-build-chyslers-as-bad-as-we-can" era. a hundred points to the first person who can name the car magazine i'm quoting :laugh:


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## NYSnow (Nov 28, 2009)

A Jeep would be my first choice since they are very reliable and easy to perform routine maintenance on. I picked up a 2000 Jeep Wrangler with AT radials and it is almost unstoppable in very deep snow. It does well in icy conditions too as long as you drive slowly - no vehicle does great on ice.


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## romaniaK (Dec 30, 2009)

Vlaze said:


> If you're getting a FWD or 4x4, you need 4 snow tires, look for used on craigslist at least.
> 
> For a RWD, you can get by with 2 on the rear.


why the fuck would he get a RWD car for driving in snow?

*facepalm


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## SMDSkata (Mar 4, 2009)

NYSnow said:


> no vehicle does great on ice.


+1

10char


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

romaniaK said:


> why the fuck would he get a RWD car for driving in snow?
> 
> *facepalm


If you read what I wrote, I stated for those that know how to drive in snow. Otherwise, you won't know how to drive a RWD in those conditions and FWD is more favorable since you won't get as loose.

That being said, I'd take a RWD over a FWD in the snow. Why? Because you can control the slide when it's loose. With FWD, you cannot, the rear end is out there with a mind of its own once it comes around. It's a simple fact.


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## roremc (Oct 25, 2009)

I have a 91 dodge Caravan and its great. I have winter tyres on it already. It can go through anything with the right approach. As has been said it is really up to you. You can have the best car/tyres and if you drive like a douche you will end up in a ditch upside down. My car is old so i take it very very easy. Just go slow! cant say this enough. Snowolf has some very good points. 
dont buy anything RWD! I have driven FWD, RWD and 4X4. Obviously 4X4 is best but FWD when used properly is very good. RWD will have you in a ditch in no time. 
Good luck.


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2010)

Jeep Cherokee would be my choice, 91 and up since they got the better fuel injection setup in 91. MPG isn't the best, my 95 4x4 automatic gets about 18-19 mixed highway/city and I got 16 last time I was in the mountains. Mine is lifted with slightly larger tires so a stock one would do better. Cherokee's can be had for $500-1500 in good shape. Good amount of storage room inside plus you can put your boards on the roofrack if you need the extra room inside. Best thing about them is they are tough and parts are CHEAP. If you happen to smash the fender, door or something like that you can easily hunt around and find a replacement part.


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## Willy36 (Dec 29, 2008)

SnowboardSpaz said:


> you could probably find a <98 subaru for 1500. other recommendations include vw golf/jetta, 96ish accord, stuff like that. if you want to buy domestic check out a bronco/explorer. STAY AWAY from chryslers/jeeps/etc. my moms bf has a 2001 cherokee and the turn signals/lights work when they feel like it and the mileage is 15 for a V6. if you dont want to bother with the steering wheel getting cold, you could also get an aftermarket leather cover for it at autozone for 30 (totally worth it). just ask if you got any more Q's!




Don't listen to him. Because Jeep Cherokees only came with V6's between 84-86. All other years had an I6. To make this mistake you would have to know jack shit about cars. The I6 in Cherokees regularly lasts well past 300k even with shitty maintenance. The CHRYSLER electronics suck ass, but that is why you would want one between the years of 84-90 when most to all of the components were still AMC and thus...worked. Which would fit your price range far better anyways. :thumbsup:


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

roremc said:


> RWD will have you in a ditch in no time.
> Good luck.


 *sigh* the only people that say this are those who again, don't know how to use a RWD in the snow. Apparently there is a delusion that because the rear end comes around easier on a RWD it will end you in the ditch. Everyone I know who got a FWD and had it come loose in snow, wound up in the ditch or trashed it. Once they learned how to drive a RWD and control the slide they never had an issue. 

Take a FWD on a controlled course, and kick it loose trying to control the slide, then do it for a RWD. There is a reason FWD is not known for good use in drifting or racing on dirt; you cannot control the slide. That being said RWD is nothing easy either to pick up if your just getting the hang of driving in snow. 

To each their own.


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## Birk (Jan 28, 2009)

rvcasrfr said:


> Eh, I'll only be using it for a couple months so I'll stick with the chains.


you'll regret that, i'm just saying.
Putting on chains in cold weather sucks ass, and they break very fast if used frequently. It is meant as an emergency option, not a substitute for winter tires. Buy cheap tires with steal rims, and you wont have to worry about the chains while driving.
Also, the chains have a speedlimit of 40-50 mph, more than that will make them come off, or snap.

bottom line; winter tires is a smart investement


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

Overall the biggest problem I see for FWD and RWD, even 4x4 is people jam the brakes and enter panic mode. Braking does not allow you to steer the car because you are preventing the tires from rotating and thus removing and attempt as to aligning the car back up straight. I'd had to say the majority of why people get in a jam or go off the road is because of this regardless of what type of drive it is.


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## 209Cali (Jan 11, 2010)

I've only been driving myself to the mountain for only 4 years now, but i've had to throw cables on my nissan sentra (lol not a snow car at all but she gets the job done) plenty of times.

Just take your sweet time. Slow and steady wins the race, I had one close encounter where I almost rear-ended a minivan, like I was an inch away from his bumber because the idiot just stopped in the middle of the road. But that would have not even been close if I would have just chilled and kept a way bigger distance behind him.

I see 4x4 drivers get all cocky, speed and pass on double solid lines all the time! It's funny cause once I get up the hill about half of them are either crashed into the bank or putting on chains.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

I learned to drive on gravel roads...great for power slides and drifting and in nebraska feedlots...greasy mud with a rwd pu while pulling a cattle feeder...guaranteed if you can do that you can drive in snow.

My pos 91 volvo 740 wagon, rwd...loaded with kids...love it, only chained up 3x in 8 years with all-weather radials, did a slow hit into a snow bank once...dug out the bumper and on my way, never in the ditch (knocks wood). Back in the day had a 49 willy's, 72 cj5 and a scout...problem is once you get one of these stuck...you are fucked, they are also horrible on ice due to lack of weight to power ratio. 

I would hazard to say if you can't do it with some skills, a manual transmission and rwd; a awd is just going to get you in more trouble.


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## SPAZ (May 2, 2009)

Willy36 said:


> Don't listen to him. Because Jeep Cherokees only came with V6's between 84-86. All other years had an I6. To make this mistake you would have to know jack shit about cars. The I6 in Cherokees regularly lasts well past 300k even with shitty maintenance. The CHRYSLER electronics suck ass, but that is why you would want one between the years of 84-90 when most to all of the components were still AMC and thus...worked. Which would fit your price range far better anyways. :thumbsup:


legit, he has a V6. i'll get a pic of the emblem when I get home today. and i agree with you on the electronics.


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## DiscoStu (Jul 2, 2009)

He said he's never driven in snow before, so suggesting RWD seems pointless.

My advice, having only driven on the snow for maybe 50 days all up, spend $2-300 on winter tyres and spend less on the car. So glad i have good tyres, it'd be hells scary without em and chains are suuuuch a hassle, esp if you're only driving a few mins to the hill and back


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

Look for a 90's 4x4 toyota pickup or 4 runner. 
I have been on roads before the plow going thru 6 inches of fresh snow with my all seasons without a problem in my yota. Like people have said just drive slow and drive in control and you will be fine.

If your not going to get winter tires I think a 4x4 is your best bet. Seems like a place like Tahoe would would be on the plow as soon it snows anyway...I think you will be OK with anything and long as you are cautious.


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## romaniaK (Dec 30, 2009)

Vlaze said:


> If you read what I wrote, I stated for those that know how to drive in snow. Otherwise, you won't know how to drive a RWD in those conditions and FWD is more favorable since you won't get as loose.
> 
> That being said, I'd take a RWD over a FWD in the snow. Why? Because you can control the slide when it's loose. With FWD, you cannot, the rear end is out there with a mind of its own once it comes around. It's a simple fact.



good luck getting up a hill with rwd, or even starting to move. if you can't move it, you can't drive it. enjoy your RWD


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

romaniaK said:


> good luck getting up a hill with rwd, or even starting to move. if you can't move it, you can't drive it. enjoy your RWD


But a FWD will move every time? If you have bald tires and a steep enough grade your not going anywhere in the snow.


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

romaniaK said:


> good luck getting up a hill with rwd, or even starting to move. if you can't move it, you can't drive it. enjoy your RWD


Well considering I haven't had an issue in all my years driving RWD, I will enjoy it danke. Like I said all along, experience is everything. And you own a bimmer so I read, which are from what I recall are RWD for almost every model. 

I'm not going to say a RWD is great on hills, it's not. This is where you have to know how to drive them to get around situations like this. One is getting some good momentum to get up the hill then feathering the throttle to keep traction without spinning the tires. We have a steep hill right outside my parents house in the country side where I grew up with 5-6 months of it being covered with snow and I've had no issues back then or now when I visit getting up it yet. Very rarely was there a scenario or hill that was so steep it had me flooring the gas trying for every last inch of traction to make it up to the top.

Experience and proper tires are everything. 



freshy said:


> But a FWD will move every time? If you have bald tires and a steep enough grade your not going anywhere in the snow.


A FWD gets better bite on the power transmitting axle since the majority of the weight for most cars is on the front end thus aiding the bite for a FWD. This is why FWD is popular for people who live in very hilly areas. For a RWD you need to add weight to the rear via sandbags or something similar to aid in traction. Most vehicles these days have LSD, Limited Slip Differential to aid in poor road conditions such as snow. Of course with no snow tires both types of drives are going to suck.


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## Leo (Nov 24, 2009)

I don't care what configuration you have on your car, you're going to slide if you hit ice or make sudden turns and brakes. Not even great tires will help you on ice patches.

I consistently see SUVs and Pickup trucks crash and spin out the most in the snow. Why? Not because they are 4x4, but because people in 4x4 cars think they are invincible. Yes, you will get much better traction with a 4x4 on good winter tires, but once you hit that brake or ice patch, you are just as good as a brick sliding on ice.

Rule of thumb for everyone no matter your vehicle unless you are a rally car driver, drive slow and take it easy. Give yourself enough distance from the car in front you in case of a slide. If someone is tailgating you (like most "invincible" SUV drivers) slow way the fuck down so they pass you.

3 out of 4 spun out cars that I see during snow storms are 4x4 trucks and SUVs. The type of vehicle is irrelevant if you are a careless driver.

BTW, I've controlled my FWD car after fish tailing in snow before. It's called turning your wheel in the direction of the spin first then turning the wheel left to right, left to right while tapping the brakes and accelerator.

Get some good winter tires and drive like a grandma. Works for me.


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## romaniaK (Dec 30, 2009)

freshy said:


> But a FWD will move every time? If you have bald tires and a steep enough grade your not going anywhere in the snow.



lets compare how many times a FWD and how many times a RWD will move/go uphill in the snow with the same tires and everything. I think I already won the argument.

arguing the fact that a RWD is better in the snow is just stupid, especially with that post. trying to contradict me with a stupid comeback like that is just fail. even my AWD BMW X5 will not move in the snow/ice with bald tires. 

In some situations RWD might be better, but most of the time FWD wins. k thx bye


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

Leo said:


> I don't care what configuration you have on your car, you're going to slide if you hit ice or make sudden turns and brakes. Not even great tires will help you on ice patches.


Agreed



Leo said:


> BTW, I've controlled my FWD car after fish tailing in snow before. It's called turning your wheel in the direction of the spin first then turning the wheel left to right, left to right while tapping the brakes and accelerator.


That's not the same thing as controlling a slide. Dragging the rear wheels trying to align them up with the front end is not considered controlling a slide. Rather it's referred to as correcting which is exactly what you described and is typical for FWD without getting into technical details.




Leo said:


> Get some good winter tires and drive like a grandma. Works for me.


:thumbsup:


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

romaniaK said:


> In some situations RWD might be better, but most of the time FWD wins. k thx bye


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## romaniaK (Dec 30, 2009)

^^ snow situations that is ....don't roll your eyes at me mister! 

I drove a BMW Z4 M in the snow last winter with no problems because i know how to drive. 
But he needs to buy a shit car to drive up the mountain. we don't know his driving skills so I assume he is a regular everyday driver, not a car maniac like myself or others. So instead of learning how to drive a RWD in the snow, risking getting stuck more often etc without the need of driving a RWD ... I don't see why we are arguing RWD over FWD here. I am talking about OP's needs right now, and for his needs ... FWD or AWD/4x4 is def best. especially with his limited budget for tires.


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

^Now that, was a more mature response 

And you're right, the op should look into a FWD or 4x4 which again, is what I stated for those with improper experience in the snow 

We're not really arguing here, just most of us guys discussing technicalities and benefits of each drive. It's just your perception that makes it an argument  Afterall, I am a gear head. 



romaniaK said:


> ^^ snow situations that is ....don't roll your eyes at me mister!


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## Leo (Nov 24, 2009)

Vlaze said:


> That's not the same thing as controlling a slide. Dragging the rear wheels trying to align them up with the front end is not considered controlling a slide. Rather it's referred to as correcting which is exactly what you described and is typical for FWD without getting into technical details.


So are you talking about a wheel lock slide in one direction? My car did a 90 degree turn and I had to correct it before it went into a 180. It started off as a fish tail because I hit the side of the road where it was all grass (couldn't see where the road ended and grass started due to snow).

At any rate, any type of incident like this is scary lol.


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

Leo said:


> So are you talking about a wheel lock slide in one direction? My car did a 90 degree turn and I had to correct it before it went into a 180. It started off as a fish tail because I hit the side of the road where it was all grass (couldn't see where the road ended and grass started due to snow).
> 
> At any rate, any type of incident like this is scary lol.


Well technically speaking, a 4-wheel slide is one thing, and sideways is another. Most of the time we go sideways which usually refers to the rear end kicking loose aka oversteer. What you're stating tends to fit going sideways

A 4-wheel slide is a lot scarier position.


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## Leo (Nov 24, 2009)

Vlaze said:


> Well technically speaking, a 4-wheel slide is one thing, and sideways is another. Most of the time we go sideways which usually refers to the rear end kicking loose aka oversteer. What you're stating tends to fit going sideways
> 
> A 4-wheel slide is a lot scarier position.


Unless you 180 with oncoming traffic like this Jeep Cherokee behind me did last winter. She was following way too close to me and all I kept thinking was that she was going to be sorry if I have to brake. Low and behold, I broke and she panicked and 180'd into the middle of the freeway with a Semi headed towards her. Lucky for her, everyone else was driving super slow with at least 2 car lengths in front of them.


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

Leo said:


> Unless you 180 with oncoming traffic like this Jeep Cherokee behind me did last winter. She was following way too close to me and all I kept thinking was that she was going to be sorry if I have to brake. Low and behold, I broke and she panicked and 180'd into the middle of the freeway with a Semi headed towards her. Lucky for her, everyone else was driving super slow with at least 2 car lengths in front of them.


Indeed, I was mainly referring to the limits of controlling a car slide 

Panic braking like that is the major reason of the car crashes you see in winter time. First reaction is panic followed by swerving and lastly instinctively jamming the brakes and voila.


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## CaptT (Sep 23, 2009)

romaniaK said:


> .
> But he needs to buy a shit car to drive up the mountain.


Speaking of ......I am having to buy a 50.00 window hinge for my 250.00 shit car.....damn, damn...double damn.....


but on a good note she is about ready for some great times.........


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

CaptTenielle said:


> Speaking of ......I am having to buy a 50.00 window hinge for my 250.00 shit car.....damn, damn...double damn.....
> 
> 
> but on a good note she is about ready for some great times.........


Which is now your $300 shit car. Still sounds like a bargain...


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## CaptT (Sep 23, 2009)

We won't know for sure till we get her out on the hill.....but it is looking promising....lol.....funny thing is when I insured the little beaut they asked me if I wanted full coverage....and then told me it was only a 15.00 difference....now that was silly on their behalf.....


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

Ha! I love it! They said the same thing about my truck for which I was just going to carry liability. I said sure let's go ahead and put full coverage on it. Now if someone would just plow into or steal the sob...


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## freshy (Nov 18, 2009)

romaniaK said:


> lets compare how many times a FWD and how many times a RWD will move/go uphill in the snow with the same tires and everything. I *think* I already won the argument.
> 
> arguing the fact that a RWD is better in the snow is just stupid, especially with that post. trying to contradict me with a stupid comeback like that is just fail. even my AWD BMW X5 will not move in the snow/ice with bald tires.
> 
> In some situations RWD might be better, but most of the time FWD wins. k thx bye


Think being the keyword in that post.
I was responding to how you act like RWD will not move up a hill. Maybe if you stopped on a grade you would have some trouble getting going, but who would do that if they dident have to, and if you did stop like that it's ignorant to think it will never gain momentum again.
I do agree with you tho that FWD is better than RWD for most people.


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## romaniaK (Dec 30, 2009)

freshy said:


> Think being the keyword in that post.
> I was responding to how you act like RWD will not move up a hill. Maybe if you stopped on a grade you would have some trouble getting going, but who would do that if they dident have to, and if you did stop like that it's ignorant to think it will never gain momentum again.
> I do agree with you tho that FWD is better than RWD for most people.


lol I didnt say a RWD will not start 100% ... wtf ... i was comparing it with FWD ... you are so hopeless.


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2010)

Willy36 said:


> Don't listen to him. Because Jeep Cherokees only came with V6's between 84-86. All other years had an I6. To make this mistake you would have to know jack shit about cars. The I6 in Cherokees regularly lasts well past 300k even with shitty maintenance. The CHRYSLER electronics suck ass, but that is why you would want one between the years of 84-90 when most to all of the components were still AMC and thus...worked. Which would fit your price range far better anyways. :thumbsup:


i used to have a 1984 cherokee pioneer v6 which served me well through two tahoe winters. the 4wd was solid in the snow.

alasdair


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## Deviant (Dec 22, 2009)

> I don't care what configuration you have on your car, you're going to slide if you hit ice or make sudden turns and brakes. Not even great tires will help you on ice patches.
> 
> I consistently see SUVs and Pickup trucks crash and spin out the most in the snow. Why? Not because they are 4x4, but because people in 4x4 cars think they are invincible. Yes, you will get much better traction with a 4x4 on good winter tires, but once you hit that brake or ice patch, you are just as good as a brick sliding on ice.
> 
> ...


That's probably the best advice in the thread for the OP. NO CAR is invincible in the snow, and yeah the morons with 4WD SUVs are the biggest problem in the snow it seems. I don't know about out there but one thing we have to keep in mind here is going into town from town. Some towns/cities are better with road upkeep than others. Quick example.. 3 days ago I was driving back from the resort in a rather nice town, the second I got into the less-than-desirable town, the roads went from almost clear to totally snow covered, and they guy driving behind me almost lost it. Look ahead, way ahead. FWD, RWD, 4WD, you're still driving on the snow.

As far as reliable cars, got 208000 on my corolla, just a thought.


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## Willy36 (Dec 29, 2008)

SnowboardSpaz said:


> legit, he has a V6. i'll get a pic of the emblem when I get home today. and i agree with you on the electronics.


If it truly is a V6 and it truly is a 2001 Cherokee then I guarantee it's not factory and thus your point on someone buying a factory Cherokee is irrelevant. BTW get a picture of the engine and I will tell you if it truly is a V6, because people throw emblems on that aren't actually representative of what's in the car all the time.


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## romaniaK (Dec 30, 2009)

Snowolf said:


> If you have a RWD pickup like I have (2004 Ranger Edge...bought it in Phoenix where I had no need for 4X4...:laugh you need some weight in the back. What I do is put about 400 pounds of bricks right over the rear axle to make the back end of the truck about 200 pounds lighter than the front. This gives it similar traction as a FWD but still keeps the front of the truck heavier. Just like our snowboards, the heavy end goes down the hill fastest in a slide. So when going down a hill or breaking, the rear of the truck does not want to pass up the front. If you put too much weight back there, the rear will whip around a lot quicker. With that weight configuration and my good all season tires, I make it up the 7% grade to Timberline without chains all the time even when the sign says chains required.....:thumbsup:
> 
> Successful ice and snow driving is 80% skill and 20% setting up your equipment correctly.



this is IF you already have a RWD ... 

I don't understand why everybody keeps trying to explain shit to me about RWD like Im retarded or something ... OP needs to buy a FWD or 4x4x/AWD car and I dont understand why everybody is defending RWD when it's the opposite of what he needs.

I am done with this, it's just a pointless convo from now on so people can show how smart they are. If you go to a car dealership and you say you need an SUV and the guy starts telling you about coupes, you're gonna tell him to shut up. Well, it's almost the same shit here.


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## Vlaze (Nov 12, 2008)

romaniaK said:


> this is IF you already have a RWD ...
> 
> I don't understand why everybody keeps trying to explain shit to me about RWD like Im retarded or something ... OP needs to buy a FWD or 4x4x/AWD car and I dont understand why everybody is defending RWD when it's the opposite of what he needs.
> 
> I am done with this, it's just a pointless convo from now on so people can show how smart they are. If you go to a car dealership and you say you need an SUV and the guy starts telling you about coupes, you're gonna tell him to shut up. Well, it's almost the same shit here.


*edit* Just realized Snowolf's last reply summed up what I was going to say.

I think it's time for you to have a beer and relax


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## bassholic (Dec 22, 2009)

as people have stated nothing wrong with RWD


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## Nugggster (Sep 29, 2008)

If I had a preference on 2wd, it would be a front wheel drive or rear wheel as the power will be used to pull you along rather than push you.
Besides that just use common sense & drive responsibly. Follow your gut instinct & you should be fine. If you dont have a winter driving kit in your vehicle I suggest you put one together. If you hit the road in the winter enough, you will become stuck, stranded, etc and this stuff will come in handy. Your better off safe & having it than wishing you did when something does happen. 

If you do get stuck somewhere dont abandon your vehicle, stay with it. Your more likely to die in the weather looking for help than staying in your vehicle & waiting for help to get to you.

I have a winter driving kit for my truck which consists of
-sleeping bag
-hand warmers
-tow strap
-jumper cables
-matches & a candle inside a can
-granola bars & peanut butter crackers
-flashlight & headlamp
-2 jugs of fresh water
-ice scraper
-leather work gloves
-foldup camping shovel

Kept in a large rubbermaid watertight storage bin. When Im hitting the road, it goes in the back. If something happens, im prepared.


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## killclimbz (Aug 10, 2007)

You forgot to mention the blow up doll you have in your emergency kit. Don't forget that...


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## Leo (Nov 24, 2009)

bassholic said:


> as people have stated nothing wrong with RWD


Yet your picture depicts 90% AWD cars??? I don't get it :dunno:

Actually, can't tell from the pic, but the Infiniti and BMW might very well be the AWD models.

By the way, Jeep *Grand* Cherokees do have V6 models 2005-2010 and will have them for 2011.

Jeep Grand Cherokee - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Looks like the newer Jeep Cherokees have it too.

Jeep | Cherokee | Overview

2001 Jeep Cherokees were definitely I6 and not V6.


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## bassholic (Dec 22, 2009)

Leo said:


> Yet your picture depicts 90% AWD cars??? I don't get it :dunno:
> 
> Actually, can't tell from the pic, but the Infiniti and BMW might very well be the AWD models.


The majority of cars are 4wd because the drivers believe it helps them more, or because they need to carry more the 2 peoples equipment. The infiniti is a RWD car and pictured to show that 4wd is not necessary to make it to your destination. 
In bad weather that includes ice all cars will have an issue since the tired will not have traction.


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## Leo (Nov 24, 2009)

bassholic said:


> The majority of cars are 4wd because the drivers believe it helps them more, or because they need to carry more the 2 peoples equipment. The infiniti is a RWD car and pictured to show that 4wd is not necessary to make it to your destination.
> In bad weather that includes ice all cars will have an issue since the tired will not have traction.


Are you sure that is a RWD G35? 

Anyway, I was just pointing out that posting a pic with nearly all AWD cars doesn't back your claim of "nothing wrong with RWD" very well.

For the basic or new winter driver, I would never recommend a RWD.


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## Willy36 (Dec 29, 2008)

Leo said:


> By the way, Jeep *Grand* Cherokees do have V6 models 2005-2010 and will have them for 2011.
> 
> Jeep Grand Cherokee - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
> 
> ...


fucking thank you. lol. btw those "new" cherokees are only called cherokees in foreign markets. in the US they're called liberties and quite frankly they're an embarrassment to real cherokees.


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## SPAZ (May 2, 2009)

Willy36 said:


> If it truly is a V6 and it truly is a 2001 Cherokee then I guarantee it's not factory and thus your point on someone buying a factory Cherokee is irrelevant. BTW get a picture of the engine and I will tell you if it truly is a V6, because people throw emblems on that aren't actually representative of what's in the car all the time.


will do.


bassholic said:


> as people have stated nothing wrong with RWD


lol, you fail.


Willy36 said:


> fucking thank you. lol. btw those "new" cherokees are only called cherokees in foreign markets. in the US they're called liberties and quite frankly they're an embarrassment to real cherokees.


i see them- 16k pieces of garbage.


mpdsnowman said:


> Well I got my piece of shit back today and shes runnin great!!!
> 
> However this is her swan song season. My mech told me thats it! body is just about rotted out in the back. He says I should be able to make it to jay peak and back but come November get another van...


great. the van keeps rockin. my cousin is handing hers over to her son next year, lol :laugh:


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## Nugggster (Sep 29, 2008)

killclimbz said:


> You forgot to mention the blow up doll you have in your emergency kit. Don't forget that...


dammit!! cats out the box. Telegram, telephone, tell Killclimbz :laugh:


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## Leo (Nov 24, 2009)

Snowolf, more attractive pics next time please. Takes away from the humor *Pukes*


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## SB4L (Jan 12, 2009)

I bought a 97 cavalier off my aunt for like 500 and it lasted me 2 years, kicked ass in the snow even with all seasons I could do fine up the access road in Banff, AB to Sunshine Village. For the price I paid, only having to really do oil change and brakes and a few minor things, it was worth it - only thing is, recently rust killed it.

It was in Ontario, Canada for the first 10 years so got all rusted when I brought it out west, recently that caused my rear brake assembly to rust out, as well as gas tank at the same time so it was a write off - would have cost $1100 to repair. Anyways the cavaliers(/sunfire) of around that era are known for being pretty decent in snow, just watch out for the rust, check it out real good underneath the rear.


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