# Jacket advice?



## PersyDonkers (Jan 2, 2020)

Looking to pick a new jacket and noticed theres some big savings on last years products but sizes and colors are limited l, Was looking to go with gore tex. Think I've narrowed it down to the Volcom L gore tex jacket and The Burton Vagabond jacket. Dont have experience in either, thoughts?


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## Donutz (May 12, 2010)

Price of course makes a difference. As a general rule, two items around the same price are going to be of approximately equal quality.

I own both Volcom and Burton jackets, and they're both quality products. For me it comes down to pockets. In general, I find Volcom has more and better pockets than Burton, but Burton has a slightly more relaxed fit.


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

Imo, the jacket, primarily the functional design has to meet your environmental and personal needs. In the PNW, you need a jacket that will keep you dry with excellent venting because its generally warm and wet. The intercontinental rockies, you are going to want something that will keep you warm and venting is less of an issue. There are also issues of pockets, sleeves/wrist for over or under gloves, pow considerations of skirts, mesh venting or not...various stuff. A jacket can be well made and bomber but if it doesn't have the functional design features needed its a fail.


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## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

I have a Vagabond from about 3 seasons ago. I have to say; I don´t like it that much. The fit is really weard. I have an XL (I usually wear a L but it was such a sweet deal that i jumped on it regardless). The jacket still fits pretty tight in the shoulder area (I have wide shoulders) and it´s really long, like a coat. Well the fit is personal preference of course but I´m also not the biggest fan of the quality of the construction. The fabric is really thick and firm - so not the most comfortable but it´s not the most waterresistant either - I´m talking about the outerfabric not the gore-tex membran that sits inside of course.
I then bought a ak swash jacket in a for me more appropriate size L. I have to say it is for sure a big step up in quality when you go to Burton´s ak product line. I would go for a ak jacket if you can/want to spend the money - it is worth it and you have a good quality gore-tex jacket.
I have no experience with Volcom outerwear but they are held high by many snowboarders as well in terms of quality...


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## Phedder (Sep 13, 2014)

Have you tried both of those jackets on, or are you shopping online? 
Where do you ride? What's the climate like? Do you actually need Gore-tex? If not, your options open up and prices can drop a fair bit too. 

Between those two brands you have nothing to worry about, they're both very well established and respected. Choosing between them for me would come down to features of the jacket, and which style you like the most. By features I mean does it have the pockets you want, how the hood fits, wrist gaiters vs no wrist gaiters etc.


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

Phedder said:


> wrist gaiters vs no wrist gaiters etc.


Probably sounds crazy to most of you, but this is the first thing I check. No wrist gaiters, zero percent chance I'm buying the jacket. Maybe because my long arms and tucking over or under never works?

Also, have never needed goretex where I ride as it's usually pretty cold, so echo the above about what conditions you ride dictating what you need to an extent. 

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## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

smellysell said:


> Probably sounds crazy to most of you, but this is the first thing I check. No wrist gaiters, zero percent chance I'm buying the jacket. Maybe because my long arms and tucking over or under never works?


Not really no. I have a few of those no-go-checkmarks for outerwear as well


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## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

It for sure depends on where and in which terrain you are riding if you really "need" gore-tex/a good quality jacket.
I just hate the word "need" in situations like this. Of course most uf us, who are not doing any high alpine touring, don´t really "need" high quality 3L gore-tex outerwear. But it surely is awesome if you have it!
I would put it like that: If you will only ride on groomers and in nice weather conditions you don´t need any high quality gear. If we are honest, you would even be fine in jeans and a softshell jacket in these conditions for that matter. As soon as you ride in any powder or you also hit the slopes in bad weather conditions (snowing/raining) though, you would want the best waterproofing you can possibly get your hands on.
I rode for 15+ years in "basic" 10k/10k outerwear in any conditions. I just couldn´t afford any high quality outerwear then and back in the days one also couldn´t get the sweet internetsales deals of today. It surely did the job but I would get soaked on occasion which just isn´t fun. So using high quality stuff is just really nice if you can afford it - even if it maybe is a bit overkill on most of the days. If a wet day comes around you will appreciate the better waterproofing for sure. Furthermore, a high quality jacket will last you way longer than a cheap/basic one.

In my opinion if you are a passionate snowboarder, I would definately invest at least in a good 2L gore-tex jacket/pants even if you are mostly riding on groomers.


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

fzst said:


> It for sure depends on where and in which terrain you are riding if you really "need" gore-tex/a good quality jacket.
> I just hate the word "need" in situations like this. Of course most uf us, who are not doing any high alpine touring, don´t really "need" high quality 3L gore-tex outerwear. But it sure is awesome if you have it!
> I would put it like that: If you will only ride on groomers and in nice weather conditions you surely don´t need any high quality gear. In these conditionions you would even be fine in jeans and a softshell jacket for that matter. But at soon as you ride in any powder or you also hit the slopes in bad weather conditions (snowing/raining), you will want the best waterproofing you can possibly get your hands on.
> I rode for 15+ years in "basic" 10k/10k outerwear in any conditions because I couldn´t afford high quality outerwear and back in the days and one also couldn´t get the sweet internetsales deals of today. It surely did the job but I would get soaked on occasion which just isn´t fun. So using high quality stuff is just really nice if you can afford it - even if it maybe is a bit overkill. Also; A high quality jacket will last you way longer than a cheap/basic one.


While I agree in principle, what I meant by "need" is that I've never gotten wet without goretex, and not through lack of riding powder. Snow here just isn't that wet generally. 

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## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

smellysell said:


> While I agree in principle, what I meant by "need" is that I've never gotten wet without goretex, and not through lack of riding powder. Snow here just isn't that wet generally.
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 3 XL using Tapatalk


Ah ok  Well we get a lot of wet powder conditons here so riding powder on these days without really good outerwear can really suck.

On a sidenote: the goretex-membrane itself isn`t even that important in my opinion. It´s the DWR-treatment and the outerfabric (that actually touches the snow), which determine how "waterrepellent" the jacke is - which is more important to me. It´s not really fun if your jacket is soaking wet on the outside but yeah: it didn´t let any water actually passt the gore tex-membrane-barrier.


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## Mike256 (Oct 13, 2013)

I love volcom zip tech, keeps the snow out of my crack. I have never owned a burton jacket so i cant compare there. As someone else said, wrist gaiters are needed but maybe your midlayer has them? I plan on buying an insulated jacket this year as im over thinking about which midlayer to take to the resort. Cold arsed days or warm days ill still use a shell though so i guess that depends on where you ride. The volcom jacket you mentioned comes in insulated and shell versions.


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## kimchijajonshim (Aug 19, 2007)

It's been a few years since I tried anything on, but my experience was always that Burton's outerwear is not very good outside the AK line. Heavy emphasis on fashion and trendiness over function. Basically mirrors @fzst's experience above.

I was pretty impressed trying on Volcom's higher end stuff (their Guch jacket feels really well built). That said, at a $280 pricepoint I'd be surprised if the Gore tex is up to the same caliber. I've avoided Volcom because they don't have lifetime warranties on their high-end outerwear, which is a dealbreaker for me-- although I'm not entirely clear if the Gore-tex brand "lifetime guarantee" supersedes the Volcom warranty. My impression was always they only guarantee the quality of laminate, but the language is unclear and I've never tested it.

In general I try to avoid outerwear from snowboarding companies outside the Burton AK line. I've blown up way too much allegedly high-end outerwear from snowboard companies-- catastrophic zipper issues, blown out seams, prematurely abraded face fabrics, etc. I've had much better experiences with more alpine-focused brands (e.g. Patagonia, Arcteryx, Outdoor Research, etc.). Stuff tends to be better built-- designed for much higher stakes activities without access to lifts or infrastructure -- and warranties are bulletproof (particularly Patagonia). Styles tend to be pretty technical and double-ice axe-y, but I've found some mellower pieces that dial that back.



smellysell said:


> Also, have never needed goretex where I ride as it's usually pretty cold, so echo the above about what conditions you ride dictating what you need to an extent.


My general sense is the gore-tex membrane is overhyped. I ride all conditions in relatively wet snowpack, so I benefit from the waterproofness, but it comes with the inherent tradeoff of breathability.

That said, I still aim for Gore-tex gear because Gore has convinced consumers that Gore = quality, so companies tend to put a lot more resources and effort into their gore-tex gear... better stitching, burlier face fabrics, lighter weight 3L construction, etc. If you look at the market for high-end outerwear (let's call it >$300 USD MSRP for a shell jacket), the overwhelming majority of options are Gore-tex or some competitor laminate like eVent. The marketing hype became a self-fulfilling prophecy.

I will say Gore-tex C-knit (stretch Gore-tex) is AWESOME. Lightweight, super comfortable, fabric just feels more supple and less "crunchy". Still not the most breathable, but that only ever really affects me when I'm touring or hiking (when I'm often not wearing a hardshell anyway). High-profile, low-profile, mechanical stretch in jackets is a gamechanger for me and I don't see myself ever going back to non-stretch jackets unless I'm expecting REALLY heavy duty conditions.


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## NT.Thunder (Jan 4, 2020)

I was close to grabbing a Volcom Jacket in Japan this season, unfortunately I misread the number of 0's and quickly worked out my Oakley would suffice another season, little did I know it wouldn't even see any snow this season 

So many options in outerwear - reckon I'll just wait until I see some decent mark-downs but I do like the look of the Volcom gear.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

NT.Thunder said:


> I was close to grabbing a Volcom Jacket in Japan this season, unfortunately I misread the number of 0's and quickly worked out my Oakley would suffice another season, little did I know it wouldn't even see any snow this season
> 
> So many options in outerwear - reckon I'll just wait until I see some decent mark-downs but I do like the look of the Volcom gear.


Every time I look at the prices in Japan they are astronomical compared with Aussie prices on sale. I always look online all over the World and find that our prices with EOS sales factored in are really good in Australia thanks to online shopping. Years ago I used to buy all my gear and import it in from the USA even when our $Au dollar was like $US1.08......, ah, the good old days. Now at like '$US0.72 it's still really affordable to buy high end gear in Australia on sale. This sort of does not make sense when you think of it in relation to the $$$$$ but goods in the capitalistic free market are sold on supply and demand as well as trying to corner the market. Good shit is not cheap but if you look around hard you'll always snap up some brilliant bargains.

In Australia GORE-TEX is the 100% go as our Temp hover around 0C and it snows and melts on you or just rains on you. The outer fabric needs to have a high level of DWR (always maintained) which prevents the outerwear from becoming wet out.

My recommendation is to buy a high end GORE-TEX jacket in a plain colour which will last you for years. Splash it up with some jazzy pants for the cool look factor. YKK zips at the front without storm flaps are heaps better. Cohaesive™ hood stoppers are so much better than regular slide locks. I'm not a big fan of pockets splashed everywhere as I generally always ride with a backpack. A pocket on chest and internal for keys are all I really need. [ak] gear is really good shit and worth all the extra coin. Burton are unreal with warranty as well. Saying that most well known brands have really good gear at equivalent price points.


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## PersyDonkers (Jan 2, 2020)

Man this forum is the best, the feedback is amazing . Truthfully I'm fairly new to the sport and looking to re up from the hand me downs I got . I'm out of Washington and seems like I've seen everything from snow,rain,sunny snow and ice.far from a pro. Im in construction so I've had good luck with gore tex boots so that's what pushed me that way.Just looking to get a solid purchase


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

I have loved my 686 jacket that has hydration built into it. Helps me to remember to drink water more often and I don't need a backpack. With that being said i couldnt help grabbing a Burton AK GoreTex jacket recently because it was a good price. I have a feeling i'm gonna miss having the hydration though.


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## mjayvee (Nov 18, 2015)

PersyDonkers said:


> Man this forum is the best, the feedback is amazing . Truthfully I'm fairly new to the sport and looking to re up from the hand me downs I got . I'm out of Washington and seems like I've seen everything from snow,rain,sunny snow and ice.far from a pro. Im in construction so I've had good luck with gore tex boots so that's what pushed me that way.Just looking to get a solid purchase


PNW/Cascades Rider here. I love the lifetime warranty and customer service of Burton.

Get Burton AK if you can find a good deal. I only have AK for my shells and I carry a collapsible water bottle in my front pocket(s) of my AK Swash jacket for hydration. 

Our PNW conditions need good waterproofing and a shell with proper layering is ideal for adjusting to our varying (wet & heavy) precipitation. Pick a proper shell and let your base layers & mid layers do the rest. From someone who has spent countless hours and several seasons dialing in my outerwear, I can attest to the value of good layering.


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

+1 on the collapsible water bottle for hydration. My friends are always trying to bum a sip of water off of me. 

Sounds like I'm spoiled riding in the Rockies. 15K is more than enough out here, and Gore Tex gets sweaty fast. I can't even imagine riding in the rain. It snows here in the summer. Definitely match your outerwear to the conditions you'll see.


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## Jkb818 (Sep 28, 2019)

What collapsible water bottles do you guys recommend


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## WigMar (Mar 17, 2019)

I've been using a Hydrapak for two seasons, and a Solomon bottle before that. 

https://www.amazon.com/Hydrapak-Stow-Collapsible-Bottle-Malibu/dp/B000QSZS8U/ref=sr_1_9?dchild=1&keywords=hydrapak&qid=1600702623&sr=8-9&th=1


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## smellysell (Oct 29, 2018)

WigMar said:


> +1 on the collapsible water bottle for hydration. My friends are always trying to bum a sip of water off of me.
> 
> Sounds like I'm spoiled riding in the Rockies. 15K is more than enough out here, and Gore Tex gets sweaty fast. I can't even imagine riding in the rain. It snows here in the summer. Definitely match your outerwear to the conditions you'll see.


Brother from another mother! [emoji119]

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## Tavaruapt (Jan 15, 2020)

Have you tried this Montec??? Much cheaper than Volcom annd Burton but very high quality, you will not find better quality price. Got my one last season and think will order another one this year.









Montecwear.com - Montec - All Weather Apparel


We are Montecwear, a snow brand created with and for the riders. View our latest 2020 snow wear collection.




www.montecwear.com


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## mjayvee (Nov 18, 2015)

Jkb818 said:


> What collapsible water bottles do you guys recommend


I have been using the Vapur brand for at least the past 5 seasons or so.


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## astralz (Dec 19, 2021)

Tavaruapt said:


> Have you tried this Montec??? Much cheaper than Volcom annd Burton but very high quality, you will not find better quality price. Got my one last season and think will order another one this year.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Montec/Dope are instagram/tiktok brands and nothing more.


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## SuperAtomic (Nov 19, 2019)

astralz said:


> Montec/Dope are instagram/tiktok brands and nothing more.


The specs don't look too bad, what's actually wrong with Montec? Not arguing, genuinely curious. Thanks.


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## astralz (Dec 19, 2021)

SuperAtomic said:


> The specs don't look too bad, what's actually wrong with Montec? Not arguing, genuinely curious. Thanks.


Here's a video from Angry: 37:00 minutes in.


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## SuperAtomic (Nov 19, 2019)

...that guy is entertaining AND informative.


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## MrDavey2Shoes (Mar 5, 2018)

I'm not familiar with either jacket but my advice would be Shells > insulation.


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## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

astralz said:


> Here's a video from Angry: 37:00 minutes in.


I didn't watch the whole video but to be fair; what do you expect from a snowboardpant for 160 bucks? I'd actually say it looked very good for that price. Of course it will not be a product of great quality... it simply can't be for such a low price. People nowadays expect too much from "value- products" but with outerwear you get what you pay for it's as simple as that.
Sure there is some "brand-name-charge" with some brands but still, generally the brand names in outerwear are brand names because they make quality products...


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## SuperAtomic (Nov 19, 2019)

fzst said:


> I didn't watch the whole video but to be fair; what do you expect from a snowboardpant for 160 bucks? I'd actually say it looked very good for that price. Of course it will not be a product of great quality... it simply can't be for such a low price. People nowadays expect too much from "value- products" but with outerwear you get what you pay for it's as simple as that.
> Sure there is some "brand-name-charge" with some brands but still, generally the brand names in outerwear are brand names because they make quality products...


And they have a renewed section as well where you get an even better discount.

Honestly, for someone who only rides a few times a season you can't beat it with a stick. 🤷‍♂️


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## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

fzst said:


> I didn't watch the whole video but to be fair; what do you expect from a snowboardpant for 160 bucks? I'd actually say it looked very good for that price. Of course it will not be a product of great quality... it simply can't be for such a low price. People nowadays expect too much from "value- products" but with outerwear you get what you pay for it's as simple as that.
> Sure there is some "brand-name-charge" with some brands but still, generally the brand names in outerwear are brand names because they make quality products...


And yet you can get better quality products; with better water resistance and breathability from brands that actually support snowboarding for less than either of these trash brands. So yeah even for someone that only goes a few times a year you should expect better for what those trash brands are charging.


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## SuperAtomic (Nov 19, 2019)

bseracka said:


> And yet you can get better quality products; with better water resistance and breathability from brands that actually support snowboarding for less than either of these trash brands. So yeah even for someone that only goes a few times a year you should expect better for what those trash brands are charging.


Better than 20k for less than $160? If you find that let me know I'm in the market for a new jacket. I don't think anyone's pretending it's top-shelf Gore-tex quality, but for what it is it's not a bad price is all.


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## eleveneightnate (4 mo ago)

SuperAtomic said:


> Better than 20k for less than $160? If you find that let me know I'm in the market for a new jacket. I don't think anyone's pretending it's top-shelf Gore-tex quality, but for what it is it's not a bad price is all.


You can find previous season stuff for that price that's way better and from brands that actually give a shit about snowboarding. A 3 sec google is showing:

Tactics and the House both selling last season's 686 GLCR Gore-Tex Core jacket for $167.
Backcountry, the House, Tactics, Evo, and Level Nine have the Volcom L Gore-Tex jacket for $171.
The House has the Burton Powline Gore-Tex for $163.
Quiksilver has their Mission Gore-Tex jacket for $119.
You can also find stuff on websites like Geartrade, Lone Pine Gear, and Locals Sale that put up slightly used stuff for super cheap. I got a new without tags 686 Thermagraph jacket on Locals Sale for $75 last season. They have AK jackets for $150 right now...

Stop peddling cheap garbage from companies that are just capitalizing on people that don't know any better for a quick buck.


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## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

Since dope doesn’t even offer a 20/20 jacket I’m not sure what you’re referring to. Most of their stuff is iron/tape on 15/15 waterproofing with little ability to breath even though the membrane is rated for both; the application is the issue. Again you can get a higher quality product from an actual snowboard company at 10/10, or 15/15 for the same price or less than what dope garbage is selling. If you move into their higher end jackets at 260 you’re topping out at 15/15, when you can get a 20/20 or better from a snowboard brand for a similar price. 
it’s really just a question of do you want to support an inferior fast fashion brand with questionable aesthetics, or a snowboard brand that supports snowboarding. At the end of the day, price is comparable between the two options for similar ratings but you have to ask yourself what you want your money to support.


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## Kevington (Feb 8, 2018)

I often buy used stuff on ebay and local sale sites. More sustainable and you can get the high end stuff like Patagonia, AK, etc that actually works well and is built to last, without spending a fortune. I wholeheartedly agree with those above that cheap stuff is just more plastic that will be in trash shortly after purchase.


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## SuperAtomic (Nov 19, 2019)

bseracka said:


> Since dope doesn’t even offer a 20/20 jacket I’m not sure what you’re referring to.


At the risk of angering eleveneightnate, at least one of their jackets I saw had 20/20. Now just for reference I'm not endorsing their stuff and I've never used it myself. I just don't get the elitist hate around it if it works good for the price.



eleveneightnate said:


> You can find previous season stuff for that price that's way better and from brands that actually give a shit about snowboarding. A 3 sec google is showing:
> 
> Tactics and the House both selling last season's 686 GLCR Gore-Tex Core jacket for $167.
> Backcountry, the House, Tactics, Evo, and Level Nine have the Volcom L Gore-Tex jacket for $171.
> ...


Stop accusing me "peddling garbage" when I'm just asking honest questions based on what I've read or seen in reviews. I totally see the point about shopping around and buying used (the latter of which I've done myself), but try being nice about it instead of jumping to conclusions.

I'm genuinely sorry if I hit a nerve but that's still no reason to get combative over it.


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## eleveneightnate (4 mo ago)

SuperAtomic said:


> At the risk of angering eleveneightnate, at least one of their jackets I saw had 20/20. Now just for reference I'm not endorsing their stuff and I've never used it myself. I just don't get the elitist hate around it if it works good for the price.
> 
> 
> Stop accusing me "peddling garbage" when I'm just asking honest questions based on what I've read or seen in reviews. I totally see the point about shopping around and buying used (the latter of which I've done myself), but try being nice about it instead of jumping to conclusions.
> ...


It's not "elitist hate" to suggest supporting snowboard brands instead of cheap instagram garbage. In fact, suggesting that people buy Dope/Montec is a big "fuck you" to the core snowboard industry, and yeah, that's something to get frustrated about unless you just want those brands to go out of business.

Did you even watch Angry's video? Even if the brand wasn't completely kooky (it is), it's made very poorly and you're still over here like "I've never used it, but it works good for the price" when he demonstrated it does not.


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## SuperAtomic (Nov 19, 2019)

eleveneightnate said:


> It's not "elitist hate" to suggest supporting snowboard brands instead of cheap instagram garbage. In fact, suggesting that people buy Dope/Montec is a big "fuck you" to the core snowboard industry, and yeah, that's something to get frustrated about unless you just want those brands to go out of business.
> 
> Did you even watch Angry's video? Even if the brand wasn't completely kooky (it is), it's made very poorly and you're still over here like "I've never used it, but it works good for the price" when he demonstrated it does not.


I'm not arguing about it. And I'm also not paying $50+ or more just to have a label, whether they "support snowboarding" or not.

Peace.


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## eleveneightnate (4 mo ago)

SuperAtomic said:


> I'm not arguing about it. And I'm also not paying $50+ or more just to have a label, whether they "support snowboarding" or not.
> 
> Peace.


It's not a "label", you're recommending demonstrably poorly made products from a brand that's in the same price range as quality products. Again, watch Angry's video on their weird/cheap plastic membrane fabric...

If you'd rather buy a Dope/Montec jacket for $160 instead of a Volcom L Gore-Tex for $170, more power to ya.


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## Craig64 (Jul 16, 2015)

Kevington said:


> I often buy used stuff on ebay and local sale sites. More sustainable and you can get the high end stuff like Patagonia, AK, etc that actually works well and is built to last, without spending a fortune. I wholeheartedly agree with those above that cheap stuff is just more plastic that will be in trash shortly after purchase.


Same in a way as I only buy high end models or generally [ak] line but always on EOS sales at 30/40% to sometimes 50% off. Ebay Au often has an extra 15 to 20% off gear on top of a stores already discounted price via that Stores Ebay site. This is a good time to strike. Stores always generally have min' 30% off every EOS sales and you buy from the store but pay through Ebay. I'm fortunate enough that I need men's XL/L and women's XS which are always last to sell each season. I grab a little bit of gear from Snowinn (ie hard to get items/tuning gear etc) every now and then and they often have super great prices but you have to factor in additional shipping $$ plus time into the equations which on lighter items isn't too bad. Amazon Au sometimes has gear for unbelievable prices but prices dramatically fluctuate around in there. I sort of relate Amazon to being a bit like a poker machine.

Another factor I put into equation is that [ak] gear always sells super quickly 2nd hand if its in good condition for reasonable prices so it's easy to update to later models for a much smaller outlay.

Unfortunately we live in a World where you pay for what you get. Often there is always a price for the brand but that comes with the benefits of a high quality item, superior tech' specs and superb warranty of their product. If you are wise you can considerably minimise this outlay by shopping smartly at the right time.


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## eleveneightnate (4 mo ago)

Craig64 said:


> Same in a way as I only buy high end models or generally [ak] line but always on EOS sales at 30/40% to sometimes 50% off. Ebay Au often has an extra 15 to 20% off gear on top of a stores already discounted price via that Stores Ebay site. This is a good time to strike. Stores always generally have min' 30% off every EOS sales and you buy from the store but pay through Ebay. I'm fortunate enough that I need men's XL/L and women's XS which are always last to sell each season. I grab a little bit of gear from Snowinn (ie hard to get items/tuning gear etc) every now and then and they often have super great prices but you have to factor in additional shipping $$ plus time into the equations which on lighter items isn't too bad. Amazon Au sometimes has gear for unbelievable prices but prices dramatically fluctuate around in there. I sort of relate Amazon to being a bit like a poker machine.
> 
> Another factor I put into equation is that [ak] gear always sells super quickly 2nd hand if its in good condition for reasonable prices so it's easy to update to later models for a much smaller outlay.
> 
> Unfortunately we live in a World where you pay for what you get. Often there is always a price for the brand but that comes with the benefits of a high quality item, superior tech' specs and superb warranty of their product. If you are wise you can considerably minimise this outlay by shopping smartly at the right time.


For sure. An AK jacket will last way longer than some cheap garbage like Dope/Montec. So, buy once cry once. Love my Cyclic!


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## Neily (3 mo ago)

Craig64 said:


> Same in a way as I only buy high end models or generally [ak] line but always on EOS sales at 30/40% to sometimes 50% off. Ebay Au often has an extra 15 to 20% off gear on top of a stores already discounted price via that Stores Ebay site. This is a good time to strike. Stores always generally have min' 30% off every EOS sales and you buy from the store but pay through Ebay. I'm fortunate enough that I need men's XL/L and women's XS which are always last to sell each season. I grab a little bit of gear from Snowinn (ie hard to get items/tuning gear etc) every now and then and they often have super great prices but you have to factor in additional shipping $$ plus time into the equations which on lighter items isn't too bad. Amazon Au sometimes has gear for unbelievable prices but prices dramatically fluctuate around in there. I sort of relate Amazon to being a bit like a poker machine.
> 
> Another factor I put into equation is that [ak] gear always sells super quickly 2nd hand if its in good condition for reasonable prices so it's easy to update to later models for a much smaller outlay.
> 
> ...


More like slots. You can check Amazon and see same stuff you bought on sale 3 times the price next day


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## fzst (Jan 3, 2019)

eleveneightnate said:


> For sure. An AK jacket will last way longer than some cheap garbage like Dope/Montec. So, buy once cry once. Love my Cyclic!


That's definately something to consider. I have had my Swash Jacket for 6 seasons now (I usually get around 30 days on snow some years a few more) and if I'm honest, I'm really searching for a reason to buy a new one but I can't really find one...  

It still looks pretty good just a few subtle signs of wear in form of a light abraison here and there but the waterproofing wasn't compromised in any way besides the very tips of the sleeves.
I even got it repaired last year; a seam inside the sleeve (between the liner layer and the handcuff) ripped. It wasn't anything major and didn't even compromise the functionality of the jacke t but it bugged me because sometimes snow would get iin there when I crashed and snow shut up my sleeves (I wear the sleeves over my gloves).
So I asked Burton if they could repair it and they said I should send it to them. I only had to pay the shipping to send it two them and everything else was completely free of charge even though the jacket was like 4 years old at this point. I have to say their service really impressed me, that's really rare here in Switzerland. I have to say though, I found it weard that I had to show them a receipt; I mean, shouldn't the ("lifetime") warranty be tied to the product itself and not the owner? Luckily I had a picture on my phone of the original receipt so they counted that.

I would really like to upgrade to a 3L jacket but I simply couldn't justify getting one since my Swash is still in such a good shape. A part of me hoped that Burton would say, that they cannot fix the jacket so I could justify getting a new one  Well maybe'll upgrade this year if I see an offer that I can't resist...


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