# Waxing questions



## campfortune (Apr 22, 2008)

I am wondering why do we still need to brush and then scotchbrite the snowboard AFTER we scrape of the wax? I have done my waxing a few times. I just scrape of the wax and that was it. I watched waxing videos on youtube,still not really understand why we need brushing and scotchbrite?

also, will those brushes intended for the kitchen work the same?


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## leif (Dec 10, 2009)

campfortune said:


> I am wondering why do we still need to brush and then scotchbrite the snowboard AFTER we scrape of the wax? I have done my waxing a few times. I just scrape of the wax and that was it. I watched waxing videos on youtube,still not really understand why we need brushing and scotchbrite?
> 
> also, will those brushes intended for the kitchen work the same?


The brushing is to make a fine texture in the wax to prevent suction against the snow. Just a few strokes in the running direction and you should be fine. The main goal of waxing is to wax, the brushing is just a secondary part of the process for extra speed. If you've been having great results without brushing then dont even bother.


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## sook (Oct 25, 2009)

I've never done it out of laziness or ignorance, take your pick. But I believe that people do it to define the mini channels that run the legnth of the board so water can flow underneath faster. This is something you want to do if you're looking to get a speed advantage.


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## john doe (Nov 6, 2009)

Your goal is to get all the wax off the board leaving the wax that is in the board. After scraping there will still be a good bit of wax left on the base that will make the board slower until it is worn off. Same goes for using a scothbrite after a brush.


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## Guest (Jan 23, 2010)

just use a bristle brush. i got a 6" wide one from lowes for 3 bucks and ive been using that. Its just the finishing touch that makes a difference. 
I wax boards for people in my dorm, so i want to get them the best i can....for 10 bucks that is haha


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## SchultzLS2 (Jan 10, 2010)

I never try to ride at my boards terminal velocity in a straight line, so therefore, I skip the brushing. My board is never perfectly smooth looking after I wax in the first place.


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## Guest (Jan 23, 2010)

SchultzLS2 said:


> I never try to ride at my boards terminal velocity in a straight line, so therefore, I skip the brushing. My board is never perfectly smooth looking after I wax in the first place.


its not smooth lol?

you need to get some base cleaner on there, or get your base ground. you would be surprised how much better itll ride when its really smooth.....


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## SchultzLS2 (Jan 10, 2010)

somebodyelse5 said:


> its not smooth lol?
> 
> you need to get some base cleaner on there, or get your base ground. you would be surprised how much better itll ride when its really smooth.....


Hahaha no no no don't get me wrong, the base is very smooth to the touch. What I meant was it has the very fine lines in it from scraping. It doesn't have a polished "like glass" look.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

I think the scothbright thing is a mixup that comes from rub-on wax techniques.

The scotchbright pad creates friction and heat that will melt the rub-on wax into the pores without an iron. Some ppl use a cork instead.

But the brush thing is to get into the groves of a structured base. The scrapper just makes it flat. But when it's completely flat, it creates suction...like 2 pieces of glass stuck together...and will reduce your speed. For example, there are metal brushes or machines that will make "crevices" in your base. Depending on conditions, there's an optimal "patern" like linear, criss-cross, whatever that racers apply before a competition. The nylon brush gets those crevices to reveal themselves after wax fills them up.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

SchultzLS2 said:


> Hahaha no no no don't get me wrong, the base is very smooth to the touch. What I meant was it has the very fine lines in it from scraping. It doesn't have a polished "like glass" look.


Base Structure Article
Ski Snowboard Base Structure Tips Tognar


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## campfortune (Apr 22, 2008)

oh, I think I finally understand why we need to brush. Thanks for all who replied.

but after each scraping, my board was never that smooth and glass like....so, I guess I don't need brushing and scotchbrite afterall...


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

campfortune said:


> oh, I think I finally understand why we need to brush. Thanks for all who replied.
> 
> but after each scraping, my board was never that smooth and glass like....so, I guess I don't need brushing and scotchbrite afterall...


According to this tool site:
Ski Snowboard Base Structure Structuring P-tex Tools

SCOTCHBRITE PADS
These 6" x 9" abrasive pads are handy for a variety of uses, although they're most popular for scrubbing unwanted p-tex "hairs" off of bases after they've been freshly flattened or structured. We also use them to clean off the warm tips of base repair irons and pistols, cleaning wax off ski and snowboard sidewalls after hot-waxing, etc. For most effective use, back these pads with a scotchbrite holder or sanding block to ensure even pressure. For most work, start with the medium (aluminum oxide) pads, followed up by the fine (silicon carbide) pads. Always wipe bases clean after any scotchbriting to remove any loose particles left behind by the pads.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

rasmasyean said:


> I think the scothbright thing is a mixup that comes from rub-on wax techniques.
> 
> The scotchbright pad creates friction and heat that will melt the rub-on wax into the pores without an iron. Some ppl use a cork instead.
> 
> But the brush thing is to get into the groves of a structured base. The scrapper just makes it flat. But when it's completely flat, it creates suction...like 2 pieces of glass stuck together...and will reduce your speed. For example, there are metal brushes or machines that will make "crevices" in your base. Depending on conditions, there's an optimal "patern" like linear, criss-cross, whatever that racers apply before a competition. The nylon brush gets those crevices to reveal themselves after wax fills them up.


Actually, a slight correction. You actually DON'T use a scrotchbright on the base after rub-on wax. It's a "nylon pad"...









_Wax Buffing Pad 
*These white nylon pads look similar to Scotchbrite, but are not abrasive.* Use them for buffing in a rub-on wax, removing old wax, or exposing base structure after you've hot-waxed and scraped ski or snowboard bases. 6"x 9" sheet._




I guess those white pads that come with the rub-on waxes aren't scotchbrites! lol


And here's a brush that can remove wax from different base structures.









_Tognar Combo Brush 
If you want one brush to handle most all your needs, this is the one to get. It's a combination of tampico and nylon bristles that is good for removing any excess wax (after scraping your hot wax) from any base structure. The thicker nylon bristles gently remove wax from any coarse structures, while the tampico bristles clean out fine structures. Measures 3" x 5"._ 


Wax tools here:
Ski Snowboard Wax Waxing Irons Tools Scrapers Brushes Tognar

Hope this helps.


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## kysnowboarder (Oct 28, 2009)

How much force should I use when scraping? I am having trouble getting all of the access wax off the board. I am using a plastic snowboard scraper. I am having a lot of problems getting the wax off the tip and the tail..

Also notice some rust on my edges at, at the side of the tip and side of tail, is this problematic? I have ridden the board four times this season.


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## MunkySpunk (Jan 7, 2009)

kysnowboarder said:


> How much force should I use when scraping? I am having trouble getting all of the access wax off the board. I am using a plastic snowboard scraper. I am having a lot of problems getting the wax off the tip and the tail..
> 
> Also notice some rust on my edges at, at the side of the tip and side of tail, is this problematic? I have ridden the board four times this season.


Scrape until you can't get any more wax off, within reason - don't kill yourself. If you put too much wax on when ironing, you just make more work for yourself when scraping.

The extreme tip and tail don't really matter, they don't touch the snow anyway. There's lots of wax build up on the tip and tail of my board. 

Rust at the tips doesn't matter, again because they don't touch the snow. Light rust generally isn't a problem anywhere on your edges.


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## fredericp64 (Jan 4, 2010)

rust comes off super easy with a scotch brite, those are like fckin magic!!


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

kysnowboarder said:


> How much force should I use when scraping? I am having trouble getting all of the access wax off the board. I am using a plastic snowboard scraper. I am having a lot of problems getting the wax off the tip and the tail..
> 
> Also notice some rust on my edges at, at the side of the tip and side of tail, is this problematic? I have ridden the board four times this season.


You can use a plexiglass sharpener if the scraper is dull.
Swix Plexi Sharpener: Akers Cross Country Ski Equipment

You can also use a nylon buffing pad listed in a previous post or a nylon brush to get into the groves.

You can use a stone to remove the rust...and also deburr your edges.
Tognar Ski Snowboard Edge Polishing Deburring Tips


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> After you scrape a board, there is still a thin layer of "surface wax" left and you cann feel this it kind of feels sticky to the touch. If you are riding in cold, dry powder, tthis will take a long time to wear off and will be noticeably slow.
> 
> A lot of people new to riding think that this slowness is an advantage since they don`t want to go fast. Actually, it makes riding more difficult for this slowness (which is caused by friction or drag) will not be an even force and the board becomes jerky making riding and maintaining balance more difficult. A well waxed, slippery board is easier even for beginners to ride.
> 
> ...


Check some of the links above in this post. It says the scotchbrite pad is "abrasive" and it used to remove fine hairs and such from the base to smooth out the structure BEFORE waxing. I think you got the scotchbrite confused with a nylon pad too, which is non-abrasive and won't scratch the surface of your base. If it has worked for you, it could be that you have a hard high MW sintered base? Maybe for those with extruded of softer ptex bases shouldn't use a scotchbrite pad? I wouldn't use it just in case.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> Not confused at all and I know full well what Scotch Brite pads can be used for without needing to follow those links. I have been waxing boards for years and the Scotch Brite pads are a main stay for polishing *AFTER* waxing....
> 
> Watch and learn....
> http://www.snowboardingforum.com/boards/7010-guides-waxing-tuning-board-repair.html#post65788


OK, well...I'm sure everyone has their own preferences but just because you've been doing it for years doesn't mean it's the best approach. lol 

The other guys are tuning technicians and that's all they do. So maybe it's taken to a little "World Cup" extreme even, but it's worth a note.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> I do what works and works well. The Scotch Brite pads are used in many shops by many shop technicians all over the world with great results. Unless a person is a complete moron putting their full force into it, the base is not going to be harmed by using it.
> 
> I think it is you who is "a little confused" Rub on wax is basically worthless and not what the original poster was asking about. You don`t use a Scotch Brite pad to "heat the wax so it melts into the base" Rub on wax only is a surface treatment and is basically gone after the first run. A hot wax is the proper way to get wax to penetrate into the Ptex material.
> 
> ...


Well then why didn’t you say do before that the instructions I dug up was referring to “industrial scotchbrite”? :dunno:

I did actually correct myself about the scotchbrite, anyway. But you CAN use a cork to “melt in” the rub on wax, if you don’t have an iron and all. 

Natural waxing Cork- large size 
Use a cork to rub in wax when you don't have a wax iron. After rubbing wax or fluoro additives on a base, tip the cork up on a long edge and rub hard using a healthy dose of elbow grease...this will create heat that melts wax on the p-tex base. Use the natural cork for hydrocarbon wax applications, or the more porous divinucell (synthetic) cork for fluorocarbon waxes or additives (including Cera F, Jetstream, Q, etc.). The cork measures 2.5” x 1.5” x 3.5”. 








Ski Snowboard Wax Waxing Irons Tools Scrapers Brushes Tognar


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## kysnowboarder (Oct 28, 2009)

MunkySpunk said:


> Scrape until you can't get any more wax off, within reason - don't kill yourself. If you put too much wax on when ironing, you just make more work for yourself when scraping.
> 
> The extreme tip and tail don't really matter, they don't touch the snow anyway. There's lots of wax build up on the tip and tail of my board.
> 
> Rust at the tips doesn't matter, again because they don't touch the snow. Light rust generally isn't a problem anywhere on your edges.


Defiantly used too much wax....I scraped and scraped...Funny because I read somewhere were you usually use too much wax the first time you do it, so I tried to be aware of it....:dunno: End results are in the pictures below. 




rasmasyean said:


> You can use a plexiglass sharpener if the scraper is dull.
> Swix Plexi Sharpener: Akers Cross Country Ski Equipment
> 
> You can also use a nylon buffing pad listed in a previous post or a nylon brush to get into the groves.
> ...


Check out the brush I used, the last picture...It is wall paper brush.


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## MunkySpunk (Jan 7, 2009)

kysnowboarder said:


> Defiantly used too much wax....I scraped and scraped...Funny because I read somewhere were you usually use too much wax the first time you do it, so I tried to be aware of it....:dunno: End results are in the pictures below.


People always use too much wax. You need a lot less than you think. 

Everything looks fine. I think you're WAY to worried about this. If you can put your own pants on in the morning, you can wax your board. It really IS that simple.


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## extra0 (Jan 16, 2010)

it's scotchbrite *then* brush...not the other way around. 

Sctotchbrite not only smoothes/melts the leftover wax around the on base, it shows you areas you may not have scraped thoroughly enough. 

Brushing (the last step) clears some of the last leftover little bits of wax from the base structure. It's optional, but I do it because I want the longest glide possible.


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## Guest (Jan 31, 2010)

without having read the whole thread.....

unless you're competing in boarder cross or GS/ slalom, the texturing/brushing/corking doesnt actually do fuck all.

i scrape off any excess quite casually, then let my next day's warm up runs take the rest off. it wont make a difference to playing around the mountain, and after only a few runs you'll have scraped off enough wax to return to optimum speed for when you need to lay it on thick for run ins to bigger kickers etc. 

shops here in australia, last time i checked, will gladly charge $60 for a hot wax, scraping, brushing and corking, as well as edge tune [no doubt using a $20 R.E.D. file guide]. fuck that. its called $15 for an iron from k-mart, buy your own wax, drip that shit on then scrape off and ride.


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## tschamp20 (Nov 2, 2009)

im no pro at this but can say that i've noticed a big differance since i started using scotchbrite. im getting thru those flatland sections that i used to have to unbuckle and skate through before. you can see the patches of wax left over from just scraping disappear. might not be absolutaly necessary but why not.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

tschamp20 said:


> im no pro at this but can say that i've noticed a big differance since i started using scotchbrite. im getting thru those flatland sections that i used to have to unbuckle and skate through before. you can see the patches of wax left over from just scraping disappear. might not be absolutaly necessary but why not.


The patches of wax might also have to do with your base needing a good grind tune. There shouldn't be any decent sized patches if you scraped well enough. And if your scraper is dull, you need a new one or a plexi sharpener.


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## kysnowboarder (Oct 28, 2009)

MunkySpunk said:


> People always use too much wax. You need a lot less than you think.
> 
> I think you're WAY to worried about this.


Apparently so..the board was great yesterday. Defiantly road really nice after the first couple of runs. First wax job is a success....


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## Guest (Feb 2, 2010)

Snowolf said:


> I do what works and works well. The Scotch Brite pads are used in many shops by many shop technicians all over the world with great results. Unless a person is a complete moron putting their full force into it, the base is not going to be harmed by using it.
> 
> I think it is you who is "a little confused" Rub on wax is basically worthless and not what the original poster was asking about. You don`t use a Scotch Brite pad to "heat the wax so it melts into the base" Rub on wax only is a surface treatment and is basically gone after the first run. A hot wax is the proper way to get wax to penetrate into the Ptex material.
> 
> ...


how much force is too much force? 

I stay consistent and go in the direction of the board, tip to tail. I go in even passes pushing pretty hard. good or bad thing lol?


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## Guest (Feb 2, 2010)

Just use a bristle brush. Its just the finishing touch that makes a difference.
I wax boards for people in my house, so i want to get them the best i can....for 15 bucks that is cool.


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## Mr. Polonia (Apr 5, 2009)

too much wax WIll slow u down. after u scrape all the excess, use the scotch brite pad to smooth out all inconsistancies causes by scraping. Use little force to buff out the wax. As your buffing, ur going to start seeing the longitudinal lines going lengthwise along your base, this is what you want because when the wax melts the snow, the water will travel along these grooves and therefore create less friction thus making you go faster.

If ur looking for that extra split second speed, then use a nylon brush followed by a felt brush. All your brushing and scraping methods should be done lengthwise along ur base. All these extra steps should take you no more than 5min after scraping. and its well worth it


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## Mr. Polonia (Apr 5, 2009)

rasmasyean said:


> Check some of the links above in this post. It says the scotchbrite pad is "abrasive" and it used to remove fine hairs and such from the base to smooth out the structure BEFORE waxing. I think you got the scotchbrite confused with a nylon pad too, which is non-abrasive and won't scratch the surface of your base. If it has worked for you, it could be that you have a hard high MW sintered base? Maybe for those with extruded of softer ptex bases shouldn't use a scotchbrite pad? I wouldn't use it just in case.


dude ur crazy...scotch brite WILL NOT do that...what ur talking about is either a brass brush or steel brush...u use those brushes before waxing to raise any loose P-TEX hairs so that way they will absorb more wax. Scotch brite pads come in different colors depending on their abrasiveness.
If you use a green, white or yellow one then u will not harm ur base.

Extruded or sintered bases have nothing to do with anything here. Wax will seep into the pores and a very thin cunt hair layer will stay on the base, and when u buff it out with the scoth brite, the base will not be harmed.

wherever youre getting your information from, u should delete it from your comp.


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