# Did I mess up really bad?



## theusername (Dec 15, 2010)

So last year I learned how to snowboard and I was told that to know if I'm goofy or regular I'll need to run and stop myself on one foot. If I stop with the right foot I'm goofy and if I stop with the left one I'm regular. So I learned all last year as regular because I thought that's how I am. But now I was playing around in the house kind of sliding on the floor and then I realized I've been running and landing on my right foot. No matter how many times I do it, the left foot feels just plain weird.

Could I really have learned it wrong all along? Should I keep doing it that way this year because I'm already kind of used to it, or should I start learning it goofy and forget everything? And also, could this maybe be a good thing? Like, learning switch should technically be a lot easier (I'm guessing). Any replies are helpful thank you!


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## labowsky (Sep 28, 2010)

that's just a theory, it isn't a 100% way to tell. its whatever you think is more comfortable.
why would you forget everything? just learn how to ride switch and your problem is solved, plus it will be better for tricks.


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## Qball (Jun 22, 2010)

Just keep going how you have been. If you are naturally goofy and learn to ride regular, your switch riding will be so much easier as you progress. Don't pay attention to the whole which foot you stop with thing, just ride which ever way feels most comfortable.


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## theusername (Dec 15, 2010)

ok thanks 
I'm actually hoping I learned the wrong way tbh, because that would mean learning switch wouldn't be so hard.


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## SAddiction (Feb 21, 2009)

User,
It's only going to help you ride switch in the long run, landing and starting tricks.

Another way to also determine if you're regular or goofy is put a pair of pants on and see what leg you put in first. Whichever leg goes in first is your dominant leg and should go forward in your stance.


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## xMeese (Dec 9, 2010)

I'm a righty in every single thing I do and ride regular and I always put my left leg in my jeans first


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## wrathfuldeity (Oct 5, 2007)

First 2 years my daughter (7-9 yrs old) learned and rode regular...then she discovered she is really goofy...she has no problems riding either way.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

That's funny, because I read that the "dominant foot" should be in the rear because it's the one you need "strength" to slash the tail arround and pressure it and the lead foot is for "balance" and doesn't need that much strength.

It's all an opinion that depends on how one snowboards vs. another. And all these "tests" aren't always guaranteed to bring out the "natural direction". I've found the slide on floor to be one of the best indicators, as it actually simulates the motion rather than stepping, etc. But some ppl just don't have a natural direction. And some ppl do. Sometimes it's so strong that switch is nearly impossible unless you really really force yourself to get beaten up like crazy to learn.

I bet I can make up one like "which side to you turn your head when sleeping? left = regular, right = goofy" ...and it would prolly have a comparible success rate to the others. Maybe if you average out ALL tests on a noob, you skew the conclusion in one direction.

And the truth is that not every child grew up with splinterless hardwood floors and this might be the first time ever they try to "slide".


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

I think you guys are making it too hard. I think one simple rule applies: right dominant = regular, left dominant= goofy.

Obviously there are exceptions, but in most cases that I've seen a right handed goofy rider was actually sort of confused as to what really their dominant side was. IOW ambidextrous to a certain degree. Like writes rightie, throws and kicks leftie. If you fall into that in between category I honestly don't think there is a certain rule that will always be right, just gotta go with what feels more natural.


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

Right dominate= Regular Left dominant= Goofy????

How in the world do you get that? I'm guessing you're refering to right handed vs left handed? Becuase a dominate right leg would typically make you goofy not regular. 

Thats still like making up the statement "Righties are stronger at frontside spins, Lefties backside."
because I've never found what hand you write with to ever be an indication of riding style. I'm definetly a right handed goofy rider as well as many of my other goofy riding friends..


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## HoboMaster (May 16, 2010)

Fact is you can learn to ride either way, and like has been stated if you currently ride opposite of what is "natural" for you it only makes you that much better at switch riding.

Just pick one and stick with it, once you start learning it doesn't matter that much.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Karasene, your post is in direct disagreement with rasmasyean's first point.

And no I tried to make it clear that I didn't mean right handed = regular, left handed = goofy. You can write rightie, but do most sports leftie, and IMO that person would probably be better goofy. Bottomline is, like I said, if there is any question about your dominance, just do whats most natural for you. I think most people that I have seen that 100% don't have a doubt in their mind they are right dominant, they ride regular. And the opposite for left dominant and goofy. JMHO


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

I understand his statement more along the lines of your _stronger_ leg would be your back leg.. not necessarily your dominate leg which makes a better lead. But again can't argue about it's all about what the rider feels comfortable. What we have to say doesn't mean much in the end.


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## fredericp64 (Jan 4, 2010)

That foot sliding test doesn't mean much, it's just an indicator to help you choose. 

I slide with my right foot in front with the socks floor test but ride regular. Although my switch riding is really not that bad, I feel more comfortable regular.


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## sook (Oct 25, 2009)

fredericp64 said:


> That foot sliding test doesn't mean much, it's just an indicator to help you choose.
> 
> I slide with my right foot in front with the socks floor test but ride regular. Although my switch riding is really not that bad, I feel more comfortable regular.


Truth. For some people, you might as well flip a coin to decide. I go right foot first when I do the Risky Business slide and feel more comfortable riding goofy. My right foot is also my dominant foot so does that make me an exception to the Right dominant = Regular rule. I don't know, I stopped caring halfway through this post.

OP, it doesn't matter which foot you learn with first. The good thing is that if your other foot is your "correct" foot to lead with, you can say that you can stomp switch tricks like a kid out in the rain.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

Well normally "dominant" equates "stronger". As to how this relates to snowboarding, perhaps it's the riding technique you're more comfortable with. For example, maybe it has something to do with the techniques your body naturally likes.

American "schools of thought" emphasize more "twisting your board with the front foot as the leading initiator of the turn". Therefore, it's better that your dominant foot is in front.

Everywhere else's "schools of thought" emphasize more upper body initiation (vs. lower like above). Therefore, when leaning into a turn and checking your speed, you shift a lot of weight to your tail. So it's better that your dominant foot is in the rear.

Yeah, it seems odd that there is no single book on how to snowboard. And both ways apparently work! Perhaps it has to do with the snow you get in the geography?


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## sook (Oct 25, 2009)

rasmasyean said:


> Well normally "dominant" equates "stronger". As to how this relates to snowboarding, perhaps it's the riding technique you're more comfortable with. For example, maybe it has something to do with the techniques your body naturally likes.


For me, that is exactly what it is. Even things like standing while riding the bus, I ride goofy


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## xMeese (Dec 9, 2010)

no dude.. right leg dominant makes you regular not goofy


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

xMeese said:


> no dude.. right leg dominant makes you regular not goofy


Agreed. I think I read a stat its like 70% like that. Its the norm, doesn't mean its 100% for everyone. 

I'm a kayaker also. I was always way more comfortable cartwheeling on my left side. When I talked with one 'expert' about it, he was sort of shocked because everything else I do is righty, as I'm extremely right dominant(this actually helped me in comeptitions). He then asked what type of hole I grew up throwing ends on. It of course was the left. I was forced to throw ends on my left learning and so thats where I always felt more comfortable. To this day I still throw way better on my left than right. I think snowboarding stance is similar. Some people will get pissed about this, but I think right dominant goofy riders just got used to what they were doing basically as a mistake. Doesn't mean they are any less of a rider now, but whatever thoughts/instruction they had originally were wrong and they basically just adjusted to it. JMHO


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

xMeese said:


> no dude.. right leg dominant makes you regular not goofy


^ you people are confusing.... how can you say he's wrong

right is my dominate I ride goofy. My left arm and leg have more strengh than my right... i'm right handed.


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## sook (Oct 25, 2009)

xMeese said:


> no dude.. right leg dominant makes you regular not goofy


In my normal stance, my right foot is first making me a goofy rider. It just so happens that my right foot is dominant/stronger. Crazy, huh?


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## sook (Oct 25, 2009)

Karasene said:


> ^ you people are confusing.... how can you say he's wrong
> 
> right is my dominate I ride goofy. My left arm and leg have more strengh than my right... i'm right handed.


I know, right. I'm starting to question my understanding of this whole sport.

For the record, my right hand is stronger, but thats for reasons completely apart from snowboarding...


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## HoboMaster (May 16, 2010)

Just fucking ride the snowboard please.


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

dksmith17 said:


> Agreed. I think I read a stat its like 70% like that. Its the norm, doesn't mean its 100% for everyone.
> 
> I'm a kayaker also. I was always way more comfortable cartwheeling on my left side. When I talked with one 'expert' about it, he was sort of shocked because everything else I do is righty, as I'm extremely right dominant(this actually helped me in comeptitions). He then asked what type of hole I grew up throwing ends on. It of course was the left. I was forced to throw ends on my left learning and so thats where I always felt more comfortable. To this day I still throw way better on my left than right. I think snowboarding stance is similar. Some people will get pissed about this, but I think right dominant goofy riders just got used to what they were doing basically as a mistake. Doesn't mean they are any less of a rider now, but whatever thoughts/instruction they had originally were wrong and they basically just adjusted to it. JMHO


Exactly. Great point. You learn, you adapt. There really is no pre-determined direction you should be riding. You're body will teach you what works best in the end.


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

HoboMaster said:


> Just fucking ride the snowboard please.


hahaha :thumbsup:


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Karasene said:


> ^ you people are confusing.... how can you say he's wrong
> 
> right is my dominate I ride goofy. My left arm and leg have more strengh than my right... i'm right handed.


I think you are a bit dominant confused if you are right handed but stronger on your left.


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

dksmith17 said:


> I think you are a bit dominant confused if you are right handed but stronger on your left.


So you think its unlikely to have more strengh in the side opposite of your writing hand. I only said strengh not function. I long board goofy too. Back leg just gets more exercise thats all. Makes sense. Can't steer nearly as well with my stronger leg as a lead.


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## notter123 (Nov 11, 2010)

okay so i think we have established that there is no real rules... except the one i was told, not sure if it was said, skipped the 2nd page was whatever foot you kick a ball with is your back foot, and thats what made sense to me, i wakeboard, snowboard, skateboard, surf (the one time i surfed and failed) all the same way, regular! left foot forward


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Karasene said:


> So you think its unlikely to have more strengh in the side opposite of your writing hand. I only said strengh not function. I long board goofy too. Back leg just gets more exercise thats all. Makes sense. Can't steer nearly as well with my stronger leg as a lead.


Unlikely isn't the wording I'd use. But does it go against the norm? I think so.
Somewhere around 70% of people in this world are completely right dominant. And it just so happens that right at around 70% of people ride regular IIRC. 10 % are left dominant and 20% are codominant. So while the norm is right dominant, mixed dominant people like you are actually fairly likely, arguably more likely than true lefty goofy riders.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

dksmith17 said:


> I think you are a bit dominant confused if you are right handed but stronger on your left.


He's prolly one of those clip board workers or something. You carry a big ass stack of paper with your left and write with your right. :cheeky4:


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

^:laugh:

The ratio for reg vs goofy is much more even than 70% / 30% 
as you saw in this thread. It's about 50% 50% maybe 60% 40% ... can't be too sure.

http://www.snowboardingforum.com/snowboarding-general-chat/24802-goofy-regular-2.html


So apparantly there must be a ton of confused people.


My point is being right or lefty has NOTHING to do with how you ride. End of story. Its whatever side the rider puts in the most amount of training. If you focus on one direction you'll be strong in that one direction. If you switch it up and put the same focus and time into the other direction you'll be strong in that one as well. There's no right way. Just as you said with your kayaking. You had more experience with your left side.. so that ended up being your strength. I hate when people use the righty / lefty comparison.


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## oneshot (Oct 8, 2010)

Did I mess up really bad?

YES!!!!



 i just wanted to say yes.. i'm a yes man kinda guy


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## theusername (Dec 15, 2010)

oh.

SO what you all are basically saying is that it's completely random basically/nobody knows? Thanks for replying though!

I guess I'll keep riding this way (regular) and find out how hard it'll be when I learn switch eventually.


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## sook (Oct 25, 2009)

theusername said:


> oh.
> 
> SO what you all are basically saying is that it's completely random basically/nobody knows? Thanks for replying though!
> 
> I guess I'll keep riding this way (regular) and find out how hard it'll be when I learn switch eventually.


There just coorelations between handedness/footedness and how one decides to ride. Its not completely random, but the point is, it doesn't matter. Unless you're a natural at board sports, riding switch is going to take some time no matter what foot you start with and you will most likely be more adept at one leading foot over the other.


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## Cavman (Mar 1, 2010)

Play "tug of war" with someone using a rope or even a broom stick handle. Whatever foot you put to the rear when you pull should be the foot you put at the back when you ride. It is the stance that your body feels the strongest and most stable.

Try it.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

I'll have to confirm for the record that I'm sure there is a "natural side" for some ppl. I'm regular and learned stuff really fast in that direction. Switch took a looong time comparatively. And anything I learn new regular takes at least 2x (maybe more) as long to learn switch to the same level.

This must be how it is to a degree for the pros too. Otherwise they wouldn't score "switch <insert trick here>" as increased difficulty.


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## HoboMaster (May 16, 2010)

rasmasyean said:


> I'll have to confirm for the record that I'm sure there is a "natural side" for some ppl. I'm regular and learned stuff really fast in that direction. Switch took a looong time comparatively. And anything I learn new regular takes at least 2x (maybe more) as long to learn switch to the same level.
> 
> This must be how it is to a degree for the pros too. Otherwise they wouldn't score "switch <insert trick here>" as increased difficulty.


Honestly that's just switch riding in general, you have to understand that your brain programs your muscles to remember everything while being in your regular stance. When you switch sides, everything is different and reverse, meaning your muscles have to learn all over again. Some people are better then others are switch sure, but no one just instantaneously starts ripping in switch after they have spent a long time riding in one direction. It requires new muscle memory built from practice, and lots of it.


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## thugit (Sep 29, 2009)

I learned Goofy, then switched to regular after a few years because I found it to be more natural.
However I surf and skate Goofy.
Write with right, fap with left sort of thing.
Who cares.


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## Lab (Nov 21, 2010)

I ride regular bug i slide on the floor goofy. Me and a few friends were messing around in the woods behind his house and we brought a little PVC pipe as a "rail". We started just sliding on it with our feet and it felt mroe natural to slide with my right foot in front, but i still ride regular


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

Snowolf said:


> What ever you are reading....please stop......:laugh:
> 
> Are you seriously advocating ruddering with the rear foot as good snowboarding technique.....:laugh:
> 
> ...


We’ve had this similar discussion like a year ago I think but what I got from it is that there is a place for both. And it appears some of the more “advanced” ppl find “ruddering” (or whatever you want to call it) much more effective and speedy, especially for more difficult terrain.

I know what you are talking about from videos like Video Professor’s clips and such and can see how it can be more efficient in certain environments. But I still see it as slow and pretty much something that is more ideal in a very open slope with practically no one else around you. This way you can cruise in a smooth ride in some planned path over the horizon and enjoy the scenery.

The reality is that this is not what snowboarding is about for many ppl, especially those who want to be more aggressive. Technically, you can say “carving” is more “efficient” than either extremes of “twist” and “ruddering”. So when you have favorable terrain to ride that board specific arc, you should be carving. And what happens when you need to quickly react? You rudder! Sometimes even with a counter-rotated maneuver to enhance the speed and power of that skid! Although it may not be “efficient” because it takes a degree of extra power, it sure beats flying down the hill at uncontrollable speeds or hitting a tree…which would take you out or make you rest for 5 minutes…very NET inefficient if you ask me! :laugh:

Ultimately, when I go snowboarding, I’m not there to relax and enjoy the wind while holding hands with the snow down memory lane. I’m there to challenge myself doing things that often require momentary feats of exertion. I believe you guys call it “*Tearing it up!*”


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

I think ruddering might be a poor choice or words. The goal is not to rudder, understood. Now, I'm an old skier so maybe jump turn is a foreign term to some but its one that is comparable in this instance. Obviously you don't jump like a skier would, but the turn initiation is somewhat similar in that you really have to lift the rear part of your board/ski quickly if the turn is going to be really quick and tight. And considering your rear foot will be doing the most of that lifting, I want my dominant/strongest foot back there. And wolf, the terrain in which was pictured (30+ foot wide) is not the terrrain in which I am talking about. Steep is important, but narrowness is more important in this instance.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Snowolf said:


> Now, the tail kick used in slash turns can be an appropriate braking maneuver, but again, we are talking about the initiation phase of the turn. You do not start the turn by kicking the tail around. In a slash turn, extra push is applied to the tail at the end of the turn.


Slash was the exact term Ras used that you jumped all over him for, and now here you are claiming it can be appropriate in turn initiation.
I think you and Ras both have valid points that are right to certain degrees. I don't see any point in throwing Ras under the bus so condescendingly. JMHO


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Looking at the vid Snowolf, very nice. I would argue that only a couple of those turns really involved hopping off both feet. Most involved just the rear(right) foot jumping, while the left was there for the ride. I think this vid is actually a great example of why you do want your dominant foot in the back.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

Here, if you want to see some slashing/ruddering whatever action on some steeps along with some counter-rotated flailing arms and "opened up toe-sides"...






:cheeky4:


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## elstinky (Jan 24, 2010)

Snowolf said:


> As for the this dominant versus stronger thing, it is utter BS as well


spot on.




> some people who have a definite stronger leg will ride with it in front while others ride with it in the rear.





> Unless you are a mutant freak, the strength differences between one leg and the other are negligible.


these two statements kinda contradict each other, and the second one is false one.
I'm regular (and not a mutant, lol) both for biking and boarding. This means when standing up on a bike my left foot is on the rear pedal, and since I spend several hours a week riding bmx it's the stronger one. And the difference is big enough to clearly notice, not only by eye, but also by the time fatigue kicks in: after several hours of boarding and having to take the J-Bar, I will mostly do this switch so I can lean on my left leg and spare the already tired right one.


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## Jeklund (Dec 14, 2009)

dksmith17 said:


> Slash was the exact term Ras used that you jumped all over him for, and now here you are claiming it can be appropriate in turn initiation.
> I think you and Ras both have valid points that are right to certain degrees. I don't see any point in throwing Ras under the bus so condescendingly. JMHO


I think you should reread the post he said that "Slashing" can be used as an effective braking technique not for turn initiation.



Snowolf said:


> This ruddering is absolutely NOT what you want to do on steep terrain. When you are dropping a 50 degree pitch, you want to get the edge set early and hold it all the way through your turns. If you try this "ruddering" it will induce a skid and a serious loss of control on serious pitches. What is key on a steep slope or for high speed advanced riding, is to work the top of the turn by getting on your new edge before the fall line and aggressively down unweighting at the edge change. In addition, proper fore-aft movement is also key. You start the turn with the weight forward and as the turn progresses, you shift the weight aft to help prevent the tail from skidding out beyond control. The entire time, you are maintaining a high edge angle to keep that entire effective edge dug in.


I'm having issues with this aspect of my riding, my problem has to do with part of the turn initiation. Once i get my edge set I seem to be able to hold it throughout the turn but it's during my edge change and getting that edge set is where the issues arise. It almost seems as if my rear leg rides really heavy(Not in the sense that I'm riding backseat) and struggles to come around. I think a better way of explaining it is that my read leg seems to take a larger than normal turning radius and does so very slow. It's not as much of a problem when I'm in an open area as i can just grind out the turn over a larger area. But when I'm in the trees is where it's really an issue as I just don't have as much room to complete my turn and require a quick edge to edge transition. I'm just more less wondering how i can bring that rear leg around quicker and set my edge to prevent slipping down the hill? I'm thinking it has something to down with unweighting but I'm having troubles understanding the whole concept and how to do it.


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## Qball (Jun 22, 2010)

Ruddering and slashing is a sure way to end up tumbling down the mountain. I know from first hand experience.


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

Jeklund said:


> I think you should reread the post he said that "Slashing" can be used as an effective braking technique not for turn initiation.
> 
> 
> 
> I'm having issues with this aspect of my riding, my problem has to do with part of the turn initiation. Once i get my edge set I seem to be able to hold it throughout the turn but it's during my edge change and getting that edge set is where the issues arise. It almost seems as if my rear leg rides really heavy(Not in the sense that I'm riding backseat) and struggles to come around. I think a better way of explaining it is that my read leg seems to take a larger than normal turning radius and does so very slow. It's not as much of a problem when I'm in an open area as i can just grind out the turn over a larger area. But when I'm in the trees is where it's really an issue as I just don't have as much room to complete my turn and require a quick edge to edge transition. I'm just more less wondering how i can bring that rear leg around quicker and set my edge to prevent slipping down the hill? I'm thinking it has something to down with unweighting but I'm having troubles understanding the whole concept and how to do it.


What you do is put your weight on the front foot, and lean foward aligned with the slope. This will unweigth the rear foot somewhat, and allow you to skid it easier without it going into a carve and shooting you into a tree. You can also use your arms/shoulders to do a twist in the OPPOSITE direction of the board rotation to make the turn much faster. Don't worry about someone thinking you look like a "dumb scarecrow" or something....because the oh so proper way to snowboard is to have your arms at your side or whatever clutching snowballs between your wrists and hips. The fact is that when you look up some killer mogul clips on youtube, you will see this jerky arm flailing counter-rotating slashing/ruddering movement. And tight moguls is similar to the situation you describe...except that trees block more view of the terrain ahead so you will require even QUICKER reactions. 

Anyone can say, "oh ya...according to such an such, you're supposed to avoid x and y because it's the *wrong technique*. If you anticipate 10 steps ahead and set up your edge pressure blah blah blah..." 

But in the end, look at who accomplishes the goal of killing the moguls...or that steep terrain in above video...or trees. I'll say this. It works...plain and simple! :laugh:


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Snowolf I think there is a difference between speaking strongly about what you believe and condescendingly saying another person is wrong. I think everyone realizes that in a perfect world everyone carves everywhere 100% of the time. But its not a perfect world. The worlds best are going to come across a hidden feature, or have someone wreck right in front of them, and they will need to rudder/slash whatever you want to call it to avoid injury. Its arguable that those moments are more important than any other. Aside of those times, I still think there is just naturally more work done on your rear leg. I think that for these times of safety, and the fact that you do more work with your rear leg anyways, your more coordinated (dominant) leg should be in the rear. If you don't believe that then I guess we shall agree to disagree.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

dksmith17 said:


> I think that for these times of safety, and the fact that you do more work with your rear leg anyways, your more coordinated (dominant) leg should be in the rear. If you don't believe that then I guess we shall agree to disagree.





Snowolf said:


> If you were not so intent on just arguing to argue, you would have gotten that from the thread.....it DOES NOT MATTER, it is all about PERSONAL PREFERENCE.



Apparently you just don't get it... I am agreeing to disagree. You are the one that is arguing to argue.


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

Awww snap.

Wolf's on the prowl. :laugh:

Great instructions btw :thumbsup: I never would have thought about how my body could achieve the weightless effect for a second till I started reading your post. Last year I loved mogal runs. Always made me feel good about my riding. Wish I could go out and apply the technique you talked about... All in good time.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Snowolf said:


> Nothing personal here, but you are in fact dead wrong on your points and as such, will be argued against because you are passing along incorrect advice that will create more problems for new riders.....


I never intended on giving advice. Just stating what I believe. If I come across something in real life that makes me change my belief that your dominant foot is better off in the rear then I will consider changing this belief. Until then I am not changing my belief based on your comments, especially considering your dominant foot is your rear foot.


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## snowjeeper (Nov 11, 2008)

I've been riding for a couple years and I still can't figure out which I should be riding, as I ride switch just as well as goofy as well as regular lol. I mean none of those are very good, but they're all at the same level for me.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

I thought I read where you said you were extremely right dominant in a different thread. I tried to find it, but sorting through 10K posts is sorta hard. Are you right handed?


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

Snowolf said:


> the "dominant" or "stronger" leg should always be the rear foot, as well as the opposite, is utter bullocks. There simply is no hard and fast rule that applies to everybody regarding stance....



This statement is exactly the message I was trying to make earlier in this thread. The fact that they think their way is the "right" way is ridiculous. Maybe its the way they want to ride but they can't argue that this should be the way of everyone, that this stance works for everyone and if you are telling beginners that this is the way they need to start riding you're off your rocker. You let them decide what stance is most comfortable for THEM to ride. Not you. Are we all in agreeance yet? 

If you and Ras ride like this. Cool. but this has nothing to do with setting up stance for a rider in their first or second year of riding.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Snowolf I think you are a bit dominant confused also, similar to Kerasene. And yes Kerasene we really aren't far off, I think we were mostly in agreement the whole time actually. Take a look at my very first post in this thread...



> I think one simple rule applies: right dominant = regular, left dominant= goofy.
> 
> Obviously there are exceptions, but in most cases that I've seen a right handed goofy rider was actually sort of confused as to what really their dominant side was. IOW ambidextrous to a certain degree. Like writes rightie, throws and kicks leftie. If you fall into that in between category I honestly don't think there is a certain rule that will always be right, just gotta go with what feels more natural.


This is still my stance... A fully right dominant rider will naturally gravitate towards regular IMO. Is it 100% correct? Of course not, nothing is. Like I said originally there are exceptions. And if you are codominant you just have to go with whats more natural.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Confused AKA Codominant

I obviously don't agree with what you claim is a widely accepted view of snowboarding. Perhaps if you provided proof of this from a 3rd party I would consider it.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

I didn't see anything that suggested or even mentioned that left dominant is a regular rider and right dominant is a goofy rider in those links.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Snowolf said:


> Just accept the fact that everyone is different and no rule you make up will encompass everyone...


I said from the get go there are always exceptions. I am not trying to pigeonhole anything, I am talking about generalities here. IMO you are lying to yourself if you don't think that there are certain trends in stance and dominance. But of course, like anything in life, nothing is 100%.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Snowolf said:


> Really????????
> 
> 
> What don`t you get about this:
> ...


The terms were never in question and aren't even part of the argument.

You claimed it was widely accepted that left dominant = regular and right dominant = goofy. I disagree with that.


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## theusername (Dec 15, 2010)

LMAO basically every rider has his or her own preferences in mind and there is no one general rule about it. Some people like it one way, some people like it another. But in the end it doesn't matter because you guys already learned it. If you're a new rider and the "rule" says to put your left foot forward but you feel better with your right foot forward, are you still going to follow that rule? From what I read here, it's entirely based on the rider's preferences and the rule is broken just as many times as it's followed. Basically it's random-ish.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

You said it in post 71


Snowolf said:


> This is exactly contrary to widely accepted views in snowboarding. It is exactly the opposite....*left dominant is a regular rider and right dominant is a goofy rider in most cases.*


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Again, if you find a 3rd party saying that it is widely accepted I would think about believing you. 

Considering that most people are right handed and most people ride regular, simple math would disagree with the notion it is truly 'widely accepted.'
The poll Karasene posted suggested that Goofy/Regular was closer to 50/50 than I originally thought. I still disagree with that. Just my personal view is that is is closer to like 70/30 Regular/goofy based on just what I have seen with my own eyes.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

All of my comments were based on my opinion from what I have seen in my personal life and I stated that from the get go. You were the one arguing for the general consensus of the snowboarding community. And thus, I don't feel the need to back my thoughts with a 3rd party as where you should. I find it funny that when I ask for you to present those claims you suddenly don't care? When before you were adamant about not backing down?

To each his own I guess...


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## snowjeeper (Nov 11, 2008)

lol this is fucking ridiculous. dksmith clearly you are someone who can't walk away from an e-argument, and you'll just keep at it until everyone else walks away. have fun with that.


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## Grizz (Nov 10, 2008)

I'm here to post in this important thread.....








What have I missed?


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

dksmith17 said:


> *All of my comments were based on my opinion from what I have seen in my personal life *and I stated that from the get go. You were the one arguing for the general consensus of the snowboarding community.





dksmith17 said:


> Considering that most people are right handed and most people ride regular, simple math would disagree with the notion it is truly 'widely accepted.'
> 
> The poll Karasene posted suggested that Goofy/Regular was closer to 50/50 than I originally thought. I still disagree with that. *Just my personal view is that is is closer to like 70/30 Regular/goofy based on just what I have seen with my own eyes*.



So.... census shows that... its different for everyone. There is NO "rule" and yet you are STILL stuck in your personal believes based off of what YOU'VE only SEEN WITH YOUR OWN EYES? That's just ignorant.

I live up in small town NH and I've only riden with one black guy.. he rode regular.... I guess that means most all African Americans in the sport ride regular based off of what "I've seen in my personal life" Of course there is always going to be exceptions.

Do you realize how ignorant you sound. I think Snowolf has a point. You need to show us what you have to back up any theory you've shared with us considering you're only giving people advice / opinions based off of very little research... most likely none. 

And I'm sorry but picking a debate with Snowolf about technique is one of the dumbest things I've seen on this forum yet. You do realize who you are argueing with don't you. Snowolf knows his shit. I don't care how good your riding is you've proven nothing based on your personal views. 

Now please tell us what your difinition of a "dominate leg" is... just out of curiousity. As wolfie said most people would argue that its the leg you feel most balanced on... yet you say put it in the back? Please explain. :laugh: This is so RIDICULOUS.


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## Deviant (Dec 22, 2009)

Want an idea of how stupid this thread has become? I'm stopping to go Christmas shopping. Honestly I'd rather go to the god forsaken mall with a bunch of homicidal soccer moms instead of reading the rest of this garbage.

:thumbsdown:

p.s. Snowolf is in the right from what I've read. Ruddering on steeps = crash, if you're ruddering on steeps it obviously isn't that steep and putting your damn pants on has nothing to do with what foot you ride forward!


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

dksmith17 said:


> Again, if you find a 3rd party saying that it is widely accepted I would think about believing you.
> 
> Considering that most people are right handed and most people ride regular, simple math would disagree with the notion it is truly 'widely accepted.'
> The poll Karasene posted suggested that Goofy/Regular was closer to 50/50 than I originally thought. I still disagree with that. Just my personal view is that is is closer to like 70/30 Regular/goofy based on just what I have seen with my own eyes.


I've seen stats that show more regular riders as well, so I don't know how reliable either stats are, but perhaps it has to do with maturity on the recreation. The origin on the words were actually from skateboarding where most righties prefer kicking with the strong right foot and then planting it on the rear of the board. Lefties would then look "goofy" riding reversed.

Well, since snowboarding is NOT really that close to skateboarding other than direction, maybe as time goes by, ppl don't carry over "skateboard theory" as much when learning snowboarding. You don't kick to move apart from a small duration during the lift. You don't press down on the tail to tack. You don't even ollie the same even though it's named the same.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

snowjeeper said:


> lol this is fucking ridiculous. dksmith clearly you are someone who can't walk away from an e-argument, and you'll just keep at it until everyone else walks away. have fun with that.


I do enjoy discussing an interesting topic like this calmly. I'm not the one claiming anothers view is completely wrong, cussing and shouting in all caps with multiple smilies and exclamation points.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

rasmasyean said:


> I've seen stats that show more regular riders as well, so I don't know how reliable either stats are, but perhaps it has to do with maturity on the recreation. The origin on the words were actually from skateboarding where most righties prefer kicking with the strong right foot and then planting it on the rear of the board. Lefties would then look "goofy" riding reversed.
> 
> Well, since snowboarding is NOT really that close to skateboarding other than direction, maybe as time goes by, ppl don't carry over "skateboard theory" as much when learning snowboarding. You don't kick to move apart from a small duration during the lift. You don't press down on the tail to tack. You don't even ollie the same even though it's named the same.


I think its possibly a trickle down effect from other sports. 
In baseball a righty puts their right foot in the rear to bat and a righty pitcher puts their right foot in the rear to throw.
Same with tennis, and football and golf. Even right handed swimmers and runners (most cases) start off with their right foot behind them. In archery a righty puts their right foot in the back also (usually). Arguably, in every sport that you line up on your side the right foot is in the rear if you are a right hander. Whether you are better off or not with your dominant in the rear for snowboarding it might carry over because of this.

At the end of the day, 70% of people are completely right dominant and the majority of people (I think we can all agree its at least 50+%) are regular. That speaks for itself...


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## DuncanShea (Feb 2, 2008)

dksmith17 said:


> I think its possibly a trickle down effect from other sports.
> In baseball a righty puts their right foot in the rear to bat and a righty pitcher puts their right foot in the rear to throw.
> Same with tennis, and football and golf. Even right handed swimmers and runners (most cases) start off with their rear foot behind them. In archery a righty puts their right foot in the back also (usually). Arguably, in every sport that you line up on your side the right foot is in the rear if you are a right hander. Whether you are better off or not with your dominant in the rear for snowboarding it might carry over because of this.
> 
> At the end of the day, 70% of people are completely right dominant and the majority of people (I think we can all agree its at least 50+%) are regular. That speaks for itself...


I think the above examples (of arm-related sports) have more to do with dominant arm and the required position for the rest of the body. A pitcher's posture is to maximize favorable geometry of the throwing arm. Same applies to tennis, football, etc.

For an arm-reliant board sport like wakeboarding (flame retardent suit ON), I think it makes more sense to ride based on dominant arm in front (this is actually why I ride goofy) given the geometery of forces from the pull line and requirement for frequently dropping the back arm. But here, again, the dominant arm may drive foot placement choice. 

For a board sport not really reliant on arm strength (like snowboarding, wakesurfing), what makes sense for me is to use your dominant leg where it is most needed for function. [Without regard to which is right or wrong...] If you are a front foot based rider (balance and steering predominantly through front foot), dominant foot front will probably work better for you. If you are a rear foot based rider (balance and steering predominantly through rear foot), dominant foot back will probably work better for you. I wonder if there is some (weak) correlation to rear/park and front/mountain riding but that is only a guess with no support. Does a park rider rely more on rear foot balance and fast adjustment thereby making rear foot dominant a better choice?

I have always suspected the regular footing bias to be a hold over from skateboarders using their dominant/stronger foot to push.

I mentioned above I started goofy because of arm strength and wakeboarding. One factor this thread brought up for me that I never considered is eye dominance. I am right eye dominant and I have always had a more comfortable head/neck position when riding goofy. I now wonder how much may be attributed to eye dominance?


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## rasmasyean (Jan 26, 2008)

DuncanShea said:


> I think the above examples (of arm-related sports) have more to do with dominant arm and the required position for the rest of the body. A pitcher's posture is to maximize favorable geometry of the throwing arm. Same applies to tennis, football, etc.
> 
> For an arm-reliant board sport like wakeboarding (flame retardent suit ON), I think it makes more sense to ride based on dominant arm in front (this is actually why I ride goofy) given the geometery of forces from the pull line and requirement for frequently dropping the back arm. But here, again, the dominant arm may drive foot placement choice.
> 
> ...


Actually, in those "arm sports", power is generated by the rear leg transfering energy from the ground. Otherwise the pitcher might as well just stand still and throw it. 

_Out of your power position, push off with your back foot, and pull forward with your front foot by pivoting from that 75 degree angle into a 90 degree angle. Ensure that you make this pivot BEFORE you swing open your upper body and pull your left arm towards first base. Pivoting early allows you to generate power with your hips, and create more of a whip action for your right arm. The most common mistake pitchers make is to open their arms before their hips, which removes the power generated from their legs, causing pitchers to have less velocity, and increase the stress applied to their arms. Your throwing elbow should be aligned with your shoulder's(horizontally of course) through this step.
http://www.wikihow.com/Pitch-a-Baseball_


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

rasmasyean said:


> Actually, in those "arm sports", power is generated by the rear leg transfering energy from the ground. Otherwise the pitcher might as well just stand still and throw it.


And it also encourages the point that most righties will have a natural right dominant leg because of what you mentioned.

Let me make it clear that I agree on the skateboarding point as well. 
I guess you could say I am going back past skateboarding as to why skateboarders would most commonly choose their right foot in the rear. I think other sports might of had a natural trickle down effect to skateboarding and also snowboarding as well.


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## DuncanShea (Feb 2, 2008)

rasmasyean said:


> Actually, in those "arm sports", power is generated by the rear leg transfering energy from the ground. Otherwise the pitcher might as well just stand still and throw it.


I agree power is generated by the back leg for those activities but I do not think anyone would argue that pitching handedness would in any way be chosen my leg dominance (other than indirectly through a correlation of arm dominance to leg dominance, if such exists). In other words, arm control seems like it would hold back a switch pitcher much more so than leg control.


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

DuncanShea said:


> One factor this thread brought up for me that I never considered is eye dominance. I am right eye dominant and I have always had a more comfortable head/neck position when riding goofy. I now wonder how much may be attributed to eye dominance?


I'm right eye dominate and goofy as well.. I think that is an interesting theory.


You guys can argue the relation to arm sports and snowboarding all you want. Next time you're on the hill try asking as many goofy riders you see what hand they write with and let us know your results. Then maybe you'd have debate... maybe. But I doubt it. Because majority of goofy's are righty.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

Karasene said:


> I'm right eye dominate and goofy as well.. I think that is an interesting theory.
> 
> 
> You guys can argue the relation to arm sports and snowboarding all you want. Next time you're on the hill try asking as many goofy riders you see what hand they write with and let us know your results. Then maybe you'd have debate... maybe. But I doubt it. Because majority of goofy's are righty.


Do you think the majority of leftys ride goofy?


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## theusername (Dec 15, 2010)

dksmith17 said:


> Even right handed swimmers and runners (most cases) start off with their *rear* foot behind them.


...Uhm......
Reread that.


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## Karasene (Oct 20, 2010)

I wouldn't know...

but given the statistics that only 10% of the world is lefty... and close to 50% of riders are goofy proves that majority of goofy riders are righty. Which throws out the theory that which hand you write with is a decent way to base which foot you ride with. Sorry. But its not.


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## dksmith17 (Oct 13, 2010)

corrected
thanx


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