# Flow Hylite heel lock 2016 model



## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

I have been wearing flow Hylite for over 6 years. This year I moved from a 2015 model size 9.5 to a 2016 model size 9
The reason for moving down. Was a little heel lift and room after about 10 days of riding.
I am able to get boot on and off and my big toe touches liner.
So now the problem... My feet go numb and my arch is in pain after 1 short run. It feels like flow narrowed the width on this boot. Will heat molding help this?


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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

Boot size isn't gonna be your problem with heel lift so much as how wide or narrow your heel is and the heel hold features your specific boot has. I'm not so familiar with Flow boots so can't give my two cents there, but to address your more immediate issue, yes heat molding could help, but if your feet are exactly size 9.5 you might be cramping yourself. At the same time, few boots are gonna be comfortable right out of the gate. For now, I'd heat mold them with a toe capped sock to make sure your toe box is packed out as much as possible. If they don't break in after a few more days out, you might need to stick with the 9.5s and get a heel hold kit. I use the 32 heel hold rings in all my boots and they work great. If your liners don't have pockets, you can get stick on J bars too. I assume you've done your homework with foot measuring?


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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Bataleon85 said:


> Boot size has little to do with heel lift, but to address your more immediate issue, yes heat molding could help, yes, but if your feet are exactly size 9.5 you might be cramping yourself. At the same time, few boots are gonna be comfortable right out of the gate. For now, I'd heat mold them with a toe capped sock to make sure your toe box is packed out as much as possible. If they don't break in after a few more days out, you might need to stick with the 9.5s and get a heel hold kit. I use the 32 heel hold rings in all my boots and they work great. If your liners don't have pockets, you can get stick on J bars too. I assume you've done your homework with foot measuring?


I tried to do as much homework as I can. Based on my knowledge of the older model.as well as placing my feet over stock insole both of the 2 insole sizes are same width and my feet overhang the side by same amount. My foot size comes closer to a 9 than 9.5 but my toe area is wider

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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

larrytbull said:


> I tried to do as much homework as I can. Based on my knowledge of the older model.as well as placing my feet over stock insole both of the 2 insole sizes are same width and my feet overhang the side by same amount. My foot size comes closer to a 9 than 9.5 but my toe area is wider
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


A lot of people try to compensate for a wide foot by getting a longer boot but this is usually a mistake because the more effective solution is a wide boot in their correct size. Note for next time. For now, try what I said since I doubt you wanna go out and get new boots already. 

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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Bataleon85 said:


> A lot of people try to compensate for a wide foot by getting a longer boot but this is usually a mistake because the more effective solution is a wide boot in their correct size. Note for next time. For now, try what I said since I doubt you wanna go out and get new boots already.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk


Prob with wide boots is I want dual boa. The wide's all seem to be tie boots

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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

larrytbull said:


> Prob with wide boots is I want dual boa. The wide's all seem to be tie boots
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


Do you have an exact idea of how wide your feet are? If they're just borderline and not ridiculously wide, you might wanna check out 32 boots next time. Most of their boots are on the midwide side by default. 

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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Bataleon85 said:


> Do you have an exact idea of how wide your feet are? If they're just borderline and not ridiculously wide, you might wanna check out 32 boots next time. Most of their boots are on the midwide side by default.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk


They are borderline. I could.measure

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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

larrytbull said:


> They are borderline. I could.measure
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


That would be helpful. I'm also a size 9/9.5 so if I have your foot width I could probably give you some more recommendations based on what I've worn in the past. 

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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Bataleon85 said:


> That would be helpful. I'm also a size 9/9.5 so if I have your foot width I could probably give you some more recommendations based on what I've worn in the past.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk


A hair over 26 cm long and 10 cm wide at widest portion

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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

Welp, I'm 10.5 wide and 26.5 long and I'm fine in regular width 9.5s. Our feet are pretty normal size actually so I think you'll be fine in the 9 since it *is* your correct size. You're probably just spoiled by the extra wiggle room you've been wearing up til now. Again, try heat molding them. I think you'll be happy with them once you break them in. 

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## SGboarder (Jun 24, 2012)

larrytbull said:


> A hair over 26 cm long and 10 cm wide at widest portion
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk





Bataleon85 said:


> Welp, I'm 10.5 wide and 26.5 long and I'm fine in regular width 9.5s. Our feet are pretty normal size actually so I think you'll be fine in the 9 since it *is* your correct size. You're probably just spoiled by the extra wiggle room you've been wearing up til now. Again, try heat molding them. I think you'll be happy with them once you break them in.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk


You guys are bot in HUGE boots, no wonder that you have heel lift issues or use crutches/fixes for heel hold.
26cm is size US8 and US8.5 should be an easy fit if you're a few mm over.
26.5 is either US8.5 or maybe a US9.


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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

SGboarder said:


> You guys are bot in HUGE boots, no wonder that you have heel lift issues or use crutches/fixes for heel hold.
> 26cm is size US8 and US8.5 should be an easy fit if you're a few mm over.
> 26.5 is either US8.5 or maybe a US9.


I'm actually closer to 27 but I'm on the cusp. I own both 9 and 9.5 boots and my ski boots are 265. Really depends on the stiffness and what type of riding I'm doing. And I don't have heel lift. Never have, just use the 32s for a little extra grab because I have skinny heels. 

Edit: and for the record, I've been over the foot sizing discussion a billion times. I can't comfortably ride 8.5s. Tried like hell but not for me. Too painful. Chalk it up to weird feet. ?


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Bataleon85 said:


> I'm actually closer to 27 but I'm on the cusp. I own both 9 and 9.5 boots and my ski boots are 265. Really depends on the stiffness and what type of riding I'm doing. And I don't have heel lift. Never have, just use the 32s for a little extra grab because I have skinny heels.
> 
> Edit: and for the record, I've been over the foot sizing discussion a billion times. I can't comfortably ride 8.5s. Tried like hell but not for me. Too painful. Chalk it up to weird feet. ?


Hi Bataleon,

I would be interested to see images of your Barefoot Length and Width measurements. The above info is not lining up.


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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

I've been to this party before. I know what I should be on paper but it just isn't comfortable. I did my best to struggle through a season each on heat molded 8s and 8.5s and the pain became unbearable. 

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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Bataleon85 said:


> I've been to this party before. I know what I should be on paper but it just isn't comfortable. I did my best to struggle through a season each on heat molded 8s and 8.5s and the pain became unbearable.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk


Did we get a look at your measurements (width and length)? We should do that.

It would be more than odd that you are happy in 8.5 (Mondo 265) ski boots but need 9.5 (275) in snowboard boots. Something is not lining up. If you would like some input feel free to post up your images.

STOKED!


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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

Wiredsport said:


> Did we get a look at your measurements (width and length)? We should do that.
> 
> It would be more than odd that you are happy in 8.5 (Mondo 265) ski boots but need 9.5 (275) in snowboard boots. Something is not lining up. If you would like some input feel free to post up your images.
> 
> STOKED!


I did all of that based on your stickies years ago. I dunno what the issue is. It varies by boot. I get in an 8.5 K2 darko with reasonable comfort, but I gotta run 9 or 9.5 with most other brands I've tried. 

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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Bataleon85 said:


> I did all of that based on your stickies years ago. I dunno what the issue is. It varies by boot. I get in an 8.5 K2 darko with reasonable comfort, but I gotta run 9 or 9.5 with most other brands I've tried.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk


After talking a wired I'm not taking a quick run up to the Burton store to try some Burton ruler wides 9 and 8.5 and see if how they feel then I'll post back what the difference is 

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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

larrytbull said:


> After talking a wired I'm not taking a quick run up to the Burton store to try some Burton ruler wides 9 and 8.5 and see if how they feel then I'll post back what the difference is
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


Sounds like a plan. Wasn't trying to mislead you man, just sounds like you got similar toe troubles to me haha. I have problematic feet so I feel your pain. It could very well be that a different brand is all you need. There's a standard for sizing, but there really isn't a guaranteed standard in how one boot is gonna feel compared to another. 

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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

An interesting note on this topic is that I had a similar experience with ski boots. I figure I'd go with my snowboard boot size in some full tilts but they felt awful. Got in a half size smaller Nordica and they felt amazing, so ski boots are also afflicted by inconsistencies... 

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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Bataleon85 said:


> An interesting note on this topic is that I had a similar experience with ski boots. I figure I'd go with my snowboard boot size in some full tilts but they felt awful. Got in a half size smaller Nordica and they felt amazing, so ski boots are also afflicted by inconsistencies...
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk


Hi,

Many ski boots models are built in a variety of widths for any given Mondo size and are are labeled (although inconsistently...and oddly) for the design width. This is only the case for four models in snowboard boots. I would strongly suggest that you post up your images. Width may very well be your issue as it was for Larry. We won't know until we check. Silencing myself now - I won't push it if you are not interested.


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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi,
> 
> Many ski boots models are built in a variety of widths for any given Mondo size and are are labeled (although inconsistently...and oddly) for the design width. This is only the case for four models in snowboard boots. I would strongly suggest that you post up your images. Width may very well be your issue as it was for Larry. We won't know until we check. Silencing myself now - I won't push it if you are not interested.


Tried the ruler wide's. 8.5. No way couldn't even get feet in boot 9 fit felt a bit tight but not crazy scrunch. But hated the boot it was a noodle. Also tried photon but to get right fit it was size 9.5 aaaaaaggh totally bummed

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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Bataleon85 said:


> Welp, I'm 10.5 wide and 26.5 long and I'm fine in regular width 9.5s. Our feet are pretty normal size actually so I think you'll be fine in the 9 since it *is* your correct size. You're probably just spoiled by the extra wiggle room you've been wearing up til now. Again, try heat molding them. I think you'll be happy with them once you break them in.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G935T using Tapatalk


Hi Bataleon,

Hi,

26.5 is Mondo 265 or size 8.5 in snowboard boots. 10.5 cm is an EE width at size 8.5. Only the Burton Ruler Wide is designed for widths above E. Your "standard" D width boots are two width sizes smaller than this. This leads to you upsizing to a size that more closely matches your foot width. The problem is that once you do so, heel lift and poorly aligned boot structures/foot structures typically follow.


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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

larrytbull said:


> Tried the ruler wide's. 8.5. No way couldn't even get feet in boot 9 fit felt a bit tight but not crazy scrunch. But hated the boot it was a noodle. Also tried photon but to get right fit it was size 9.5 aaaaaaggh totally bummed
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


Hi Larry,

Are you sure you had a Wide? You are an mid range Mondo 265 (8.5) and a EE (not maxing out the boot any dimension).


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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi Larry,
> 
> Are you sure you had a Wide? You are an mid range Mondo 265 (8.5) and a EE (not maxing out the boot any dimension).


I actually checked the label on it and had him check the boxes as well

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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi Larry,
> 
> Are you sure you had a Wide? You are an mid range Mondo 265 (8.5) and a EE (not maxing out the boot any dimension).


Also boot fitter use the Burton tool to fit my foot and it showed a bigger than at 8.5 I think I have a picture









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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

larrytbull said:


> Also boot fitter use the Burton tool to fit my foot and it showed a bigger than at 8.5 I think I have a picture
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Looks like 275 to me 

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## t21 (Dec 29, 2010)

That sure looks 275 to me too. Anyways,I bought a 2015/2016 flow hylite(the one with the blue vibram sole) size 9 after reading Larrytbull insight on his boots. I wore a Salomon Synapse sz.9 wide last season or two i think.. in accordance with Wiredsports table i am size 9 wide(just a hair), but i missed my focus boa style boots so i started seaching for wide boots besides Salomon and Burton. After reading larrytbulls post about his boots and they run wide i purchased one. I have worn mine 5x already (no heat mold yet) and they feel good and snug,no heel lift yet(hopefully not).


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## Bataleon85 (Apr 29, 2017)

t21 said:


> That sure looks 275 to me too. Anyways,I bought a 2015/2016 flow hylite(the one with the blue vibram sole) size 9 after reading Larrytbull insight on his boots. I wore a Salomon Synapse sz.9 wide last season or two i think.. in accordance with Wiredsports table i am size 9 wide(just a hair), but i missed my focus boa style boots so i started seaching for wide boots besides Salomon and Burton. After reading larrytbulls post about his boots and they run wide i purchased one. I have worn mine 5x already (no heat mold yet) and they feel good and snug,no heel lift yet(hopefully not).


That's how I am with my 9.5 32 Chris Bradshaws. I've never heat molded them and they were comfortable but snug out of the gate. Have about 15 days on them so far including a couple big mountain days and they're like a dream now. No heel lift or weird pressure points. It's also worth noting that I wear thicker socks in these. My early season/spring boots are a lower profile size 9 boot that I wear thin socks with. I know on paper I should really stick to one size, but living in the northeast, we really get the whole gamut of weather conditions, so it's good to have a boot and sock quiver. 

Anyway, wired, per your suggestion, I did just resize myself for shiggles using two different methods, the ink foot on cardboard method and the wall method with my girlfriend's assistance so I could focus on my stance. It seems my original measurements were a bit short and wide. I'm not a hair over 265 by 10.5 wide. I'm exactly 27 by a little over 9.5 wide so I'm actually borderline narrow footed for a size 9 male. Seems I'm in the right boots after all. 

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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

larrytbull said:


> Also boot fitter use the Burton tool to fit my foot and it showed a bigger than at 8.5 I think I have a picture


Hi Larry,

If your actual length measurement is 27.5 cm that will certainly change things. The image you had PMed (below) was showing 26.5. The Burton tool also is measuring your actual foot length in cm (there is no conversion). Socks are not suggested but would not skew the #'s that significantly. Possibly the tape in the image below had shifted forward under your foot. We should justify that measurement discrepancy.


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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi Larry,
> 
> If your actual length measurement is 27.5 cm that will certainly change things. The image you had PMed (below) was showing 26.5. The Burton tool also is measuring your actual foot length in cm (there is no conversion). Socks are not suggested but would not skew the #'s that significantly. Possibly the tape in the image below had shifted forward under your foot. We should justify that measurement discrepancy.


I think the tape might have been off a little bit but I don't have a straight ruler to work with but at the Burton store also they seem to measure me around the size nine and a half. Trying to work with flow now to see if they have any more nine and a half hours left in the older style they said they look around the warehouse their customer service is so super good

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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

Bataleon85 said:


> I'm exactly 27 by a little over 9.5 wide so I'm actually borderline narrow footed for a size 9 male. Seems I'm in the right boots after all.


Hi Bat,

Yes, 27 cm at 9.5 is Mondo 270 or size 9 at a "standard" D width. At those corrected measurements you have a huge selection to choose from. 

Larry is not going to be so lucky.  He is definitely a Wide size. _How_ wide will depend on his actual length when we get that justified. 

STOKED!


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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

Wiredsport said:


> Hi Bat,
> 
> Yes, 27 cm at 9.5 is Mondo 270 or size 9 at a "standard" D width. At those corrected measurements you have a huge selection to choose from.
> 
> ...


Yes definitely a wide foot no discrepancy there

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## larrytbull (Oct 30, 2013)

larrytbull said:


> Yes definitely a wide foot no discrepancy there
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


Boot fitter that I went to locally actually has about the same foot size as mine and the same width and that he's going to lend me his photons that he used their size 9 that he kind of tweaked a little bit and he's going to let me judge whether that will work for me

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## Wiredsport (Sep 16, 2009)

larrytbull said:


> Yes definitely a wide foot no discrepancy there
> 
> Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk


I am with you there. 27.5 cm would be Mondo 275 or size 9.5 in snowboard boots. Your width of 10.4 cm (that is what I am seeing) is E width at size 9.5. If that measurement proves correct then that opens up the Salomon Wide models which are designed for E width. The Dialogue Wide and Synapse Wide are both really nice boots.


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