# board for powder and carving



## walove (May 1, 2009)

jones flagship, smoking kt-22, venture odin, gnu temple,neversummer raptor or premier, ride highlife, burton supermodel, (not sure if they make it anymore they probably have something similar) these are all stiff big mountain boards with some powder specific shaping added.


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

I'm still a pro-camber kinda guy. For big mountain stuff, powder and carving on groomers, I like a stiff cambered board. I'm on a burton T7 but there are many options. Burton Custom X, Neversummer Raptor, Kessler Ride, Prior Freeride (can be made full camber too), I'm sure there are others...

Also if you are going to be doing large turns in either powder or groomed snow, a longer board will be beneficial. A few cm longer than what you typically ride will help with edge hold, float, and speed.

Some people say camber doesn't float as well as rocker. Just move your bindings back a couple inches if you're focused on a LOT of powder. Or if you're riding powder on a regular basis maybe a powder board is right for you, something that you can take on groomers but is most at home in the fluffy stuff.

Where are you going to be riding the most?


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## Irahi (May 19, 2011)

Sounds like you want a stiff, densely sintered, directional, camber/rocker/camber hybrid with some variety of grip tech. Center rocker gives you some lovely float in even the gnarliest pow, outer camber zones help with groomer control, and since you don't care about park anything, a directional stick would be preferred.

I'd suggest you start with looking at the Lib dark series, or maybe the NS raptor (though I'm not as familiar with it) and then go from there.

EDIT: C/R/C hybrids will definitely lean you towards powder, but will still carve a groomer pretty darn well. Pure camber will lean you towards groomers instead. So you'll have to decide which kind of performance envelope you really want.


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## kanny (Feb 5, 2011)

thanks for the replies! will search every single one


what about the lib tech phoenix lando?


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## grafta (Dec 21, 2009)

What skill level?


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## kanny (Feb 5, 2011)

high intermediate, can bomb every blue/red, comfortable to shred on blacks


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## Nivek (Jan 24, 2008)

Signal OG Flat, Flow Solitude, Ride Slackcountry, Salomon Mans Board, Bataleon Enemy, Nitro Blacklight Gullwing, or a Venture Zephyr R.

If it were me, OG Flat, but I own one and just love that board for everything, just a classic time proven shape and flex. I grab my 51 for everything park, then a 53 for all mountain fun, then a 55 for all mountain freeride. Otherwise probably either the Flow, Nitro, or Bataleon. None have "edge tech" but with boards this stiff I don't think you need. And to be honest things like MTX will slow you down and in a way take some of the edge control from you. They lock you into a turn more than other sidecuts and to me it feels like putting my turn into auto pilot. I don't want my board in control of me. Sidecuts like on the Flow grip very very well while remaing smooth and fast. Nitro is a more euro influenced brand which lends they're sidecuts to be much more carve focused. I've never ridden one of their decks that wasn't at home laying a trench, even their budget park decks like the Swindle can handle a hard turn. I've owned gullwing and its nimble. TBT. Well it's camber, so you get the edge hold and power in a turn from that, but the base shape makes the tips into a shape reminiscent of a boat hull so the float is as good as you'll get with camber. They roll up on edge very quickly and with your contact pts picked up your flat base speed is superb.


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

Nivek said:


> None have "edge tech" but with boards this stiff I don't think you need. And to be honest things like MTX will slow you down and in a way take some of the edge control from you.


I've said it once and I'll say it again. I agree with your statement 100%. Take a look at all the boards used by Olympic BXers and downhill racers. If any of those crazy edge techs or rocker profiles were so great, wouldn't they be making it onto the podiums? Do they not need edge hold more than we do?

For ultimate in speed and stability, a stiff, cambered, normal edge board is the only way to go.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

poutanen said:


> I've said it once and I'll say it again. I agree with your statement 100%. Take a look at all the boards used by Olympic BXers and downhill racers. If any of those crazy edge techs or rocker profiles were so great, wouldn't they be making it onto the podiums? Do they not need edge hold more than we do?
> 
> For ultimate in speed and stability, a stiff, cambered, normal edge board is the only way to go.


Im with you. Camber for the carving aspect, then give it a long nose with gentle up curve and a short tail and you have a board that will carve awesome and float like a proverbial butterfly.


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## linvillegorge (Jul 6, 2009)

poutanen said:


> I've said it once and I'll say it again. I agree with your statement 100%. Take a look at all the boards used by Olympic BXers and downhill racers. If any of those crazy edge techs or rocker profiles were so great, wouldn't they be making it onto the podiums? Do they not need edge hold more than we do?
> 
> For ultimate in speed and stability, a stiff, cambered, normal edge board is the only way to go.


I agree. For just balling out and hauling ass, it's tough to beat good old traditional camber.

Overall, I prefer a lot of the newer rocker cambers for most other things, but I still hang onto an old cambered NS Heritage for those days that I just want to bomb the shit out of everything.


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## otisdelarosa (Dec 29, 2011)

ETM said:


> Im with you. Camber for the carving aspect, then give it a long nose with gentle up curve and a short tail and you have a board that will carve awesome and float like a proverbial butterfly.


Nice suggest. I did this before. It really helps.


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## dreampow (Sep 26, 2011)

Cannot beat camber for carving and bombing. Pure camber is much harder work in deep powder though, even with a setback.
I know because I rode one for years here in Japan and I am loving having some rocker now.


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

dreampow said:


> Cannot beat camber for carving and bombing. Pure camber is much harder work in deep powder though, even with a setback.
> I know because I rode one for years here in Japan and I am loving having some rocker now.


Yeah but you live in a powder fairy tale world! I've seen the pics from Japan! Even living in the champagne powder region of North America, I'd say I'm still only having full on powder days maybe 5/30 days this year. And even then the runs get semi tracked out by noon. Now almost every day I can find powder somewhere, but it's the exception instead of the rule.

I think if I were riding a lot of cat/heli days then I'd get a powder specific board. As a one board quiver I like my setup!


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

When I designed my powder board I made it with 100mm setback, the camber goes from about 150mm behind my back foot to 150mm infront of my front foot, from there forward I have a very gradually up turned rocker nose, it looks more like a surfboard than a snowboard. I gave it 10mm taper and where the nose starts to lift up into rocker the board measures the same width as the tail so it will perform as though it has no taper when carving. Then I gave it a nice old swallowtail just to finish it off. Tail length is 100mm, nose length is 340mm from memory.


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## dreampow (Sep 26, 2011)

Yeah but ETM, most people are not powder lunatics willing to sleep in a car for 6 weeks to find the best powder in Hokkaido.

Not to mention invest the money and time to make their own board:cheeky4:.

@poutanen, I see what you are saying. I would choose camber for just bombing runs and hard carving. Just depends how much powder you will get to ride. Since Powder is probably 80% of my riding (silly deep) I really appreciate having some rocker.

If its just a once in a while thing maybe not needed. Still the OP specifically wants this deck for powder and carving.

I say get some rocker in there even if its just the nose and the rest is camber like a Bezerker or something.

Also think about how much powder versus carving groomed runs you will be doing. Ideally you want a different tool for both these activities, but there are plenty that will do both well. 

Which is the priority powder or carving?


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

dreampow said:


> I say get some rocker in there even if its just the nose and the rest is camber like a Bezerker or something.


This is why I think the Kessler Ride would be fantastic. It's got just a little bit of lifted tips or whatever they call it, but is primarily camber and based on a race proven BX board at that. I prefer to have metal in my core though and it's all wood. I'm not paying $1300 for a wood board!


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## bseracka (Nov 14, 2011)

I'm a little biased as I like Libs and Mervyn boards, but the 2012 La Nina and 2013 Matt Cummins use c1btx which is exactly what everyone is talking about. Rocker nose then camber through the tail.


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

dreampow said:


> Yeah but ETM, most people are not powder lunatics willing to sleep in a car for 6 weeks to find the best powder in Hokkaido.
> 
> Not to mention invest the money and time to make their own board:cheeky4:.


I realise that but thats not to say my theories on how to make a board carve well and also float well cant spill over into other peoples thought process when it comes to what actually makes a board carve and float in deep deep pow. Even though my actual design takes it to the extreme if I rounded off the tail, shortened the nose (ie. dumbed the board down) it would still have the same characteristics for carving, still float better than most boards I see being mentioned.
Especially the taper that is negated by the rocker nose, think about it. Taper in the deep stuff but when carving the front contact point is moved rearward due to the rocker so the board that is in contact with the snow has the same width front and back, perfect for carving.

Now back to the lab. lol


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## ETM (Aug 11, 2009)

dreampow said:


> Which is the priority powder or carving?


BOTH!!!!!!
This is typical resort riding, destroy the groomer to your fav pow stash = fun times


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## poutanen (Dec 22, 2011)

ETM said:


> BOTH!!!!!!
> This is typical resort riding, destroy the groomer to your fav pow stash = fun times


+10,000,000,000,000

My riding is probably 30% powder. Sometimes at Fernie I could do laps in the bowls where almost 100% of the runs were powder, but that's the exception. Most of the time it's blasting hard carves on the groomers in search of a powder stash!


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## dreampow (Sep 26, 2011)

ETM said:


> I realise that but thats not to say my theories on how to make a board carve well and also float well cant spill over into other peoples thought process when it comes to what actually makes a board carve and float in deep deep pow. Even though my actual design takes it to the extreme if I rounded off the tail, shortened the nose (ie. dumbed the board down) it would still have the same characteristics for carving, still float better than most boards I see being mentioned.
> Especially the taper that is negated by the rocker nose, think about it. Taper in the deep stuff but when carving the front contact point is moved rearward due to the rocker so the board that is in contact with the snow has the same width front and back, perfect for carving.
> 
> Now back to the lab. lol


I am looking forward to trying one of your boards out:thumbsup::thumbsup:.

Also looks like in general the industry is making more boards with this in mind.

Camber just has that feel when carving that nothing else gives you, yet we all like the extra float on those magical days when the white fluff is there to be slashed.

On less deep days though I do love to ride switch. One reason I bought a proto. 

It just feels better using my body evenly by sliding both ways.

By the way your swallowtail, does the tail flex a lot more than before the cut?

How much does that affect carving on a groomed run?


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